The dirty tricks will always be "used" even if the roll fails. The reason is the roll is made in the declare. It's confusing because they talk about the roll in both abilities. But in the passive it's just giving you an overall explanation of what the dirty tricks are. The dirty tricks themselves are the abilities. Notice how the passive doesn't have the dirty tricks keyword. So because "using" the ability requires you to declare and THEN roll as part of the declare step, regardless of whether the roll is successful or not, the ability is used. The EFFECT only applies if you succeed the roll. It's a bit tricky, but it's worded properly and it's pretty clear once you get it.
Hey Mark, thanks for the comment. Maybe I’m reading your comment wrong, but if I’m not mistaken that’s also what I said in the video right? That if you try it and fail then it still becomes harder to go off the next time?
@@ryanburruss sorry ya I might have come on strong, but at the very beginning when you first talk about it, it seems like you implied that it wouldn't count and you went back and forth, kind of getting confused. So I was just clearing it up.
I'm so stoked for the updates. I loved KB, but the army was so static and dull. Buff, Castle, then shoot till you win or lose. Now you have teleports every turn, and big decisions to make every turn. Super exciting.
Kragnos will be able to use battle traits. In nighthaunt faction focus they specified that the ethereal ability afects all nighthaunt "except Nagash". We can assume every trait without a specific exception will work on them.
Orukks always came in two Flavahz..... Gorkerz aka IronJawz, and Morkerz aka KruelBoyz I like the change feels more inline with classic fluff Orukk types.
Nice video once again. My 2 cents on Kruleboyz as I do have them as an army: The new tricks are more interesting and useful all game long than the old one so that's the biggest highlight. Having access to a potential teleport is probably the most interesting thing about them (although I'm guessing it'll be used on 6 boltboyz most of the time and I don't know if they risk dying right after it). The strike last also certainly can be good. Gobbsprak, I'm not sure his damage profile truly is better, it might depend what he's attacking. The whole mount (beak as well) used to trigger MWs on 6s and that was most of his damage output normally (extra damage if fighting near a sludgeraker) and he lost that but gained 2 more attacks and +1 rend if fighting a wizard so maybe it's about even or better vs low save wizards and worse vs other things. The spell to reduce the amount of attacks is (in my opinion) the best Kruleboyz spell. It used to also prevent run and would affect a bunch of units from much further away. The old version is probably better in general but good catch about it affecting shooting profiles as well. Having a debuff vs a unit that needs to be "wholly within" seems a bit odd to me, I'm not sure I remember seeing any of those lately. The Waaagh was strong because you could cripple the opponent's army from range with boltboyz and then once they finally got into melee, you could activate your Sludgeraker general (usually) + 2 other units to all strike at once so it was like a trap to finish them off. Overall, it's very difficult to tell as we haven't seen all of the rules and warscrolls yet and the Sludgerakers+boltboyz are generally the biggest part of the dmg this army has but my feeling is that it will still struggle to do well until they get extra models to complete the range. Here's why I think so: -We used to get the poison ability for free 100% guaranteed with every shaman. Now it's a dirty trick on a 2+ that can only affect 1 unit and more restricted than before (but no longer relies on the slow shaman is nice). The army is pretty much a glass canon army. If that's still the case (which seems to be likely with the warscrolls we've seen), that poison dirty trick might be almost mandatory every round. You also need to pick it first. So this means that, in most scenarios, your other tricks will be on a 3+ and 4+ which aren't bad but you can't rely and plan around it reliably 100% (fun but maybe a bit rough competitively). -We don't know if boltboyz are losing the MWs on crits, if that's the case, it's a big dmg nerf (and only one group could be buffed at once). So it might still be a glass canon army but that no longer dishes out insane amounts of MWs (maybe healither for the game but Kruleboyz would need something big to compensate as they were already struggling) -People were already playing with the subfaction to not be visible outside of 12" but now, you also need to stay near terrain for that. Overall, it seems like an interesting start but a big issue Kruleboyz have right now is that if you look at their unit list, they have a ton of heroes and very few actual unit options which might be why it's difficult to balance (they have gutrippaz, boltboyz and the hobgrots, that's about it. The other things are like 1 off models like the troll with grots and the anti-monster artillery). Maybe the monster subfaction will allow to field a lot of the smaller mounted heroes (the troll with an orc on it and the other one that was shown here).
I think Gutrippaz might feel better in the new edition. Just the lack of battleshock is huge for the army as a whole and the reduced rend across the board essentially buffs their armour. Also they can benefit from the new dirty tricks.
"never pulled this off"... Must be insane or haven't played much. Most Kruleboyz generals understood that you either get this done or get destroyed in melee. Personally, only didn't get full value from this once in 3rd edition. The Waagh ability was a serious focus.
Yeah, I think maybe you’re missing the context here, but all good. There are very few people who played Kruleboyz in the training-for-worlds meta, and most of the ones that did were playing a long range shooting focus build, not melee. But yes, you’re right that I didn’t have to play against Kruleboyz much because they’ve been having a really rough time in the competitive meta for a long time. I totally believe that there are players out there that got this off every time, but that’s just not the world I’ve experienced!
So they cut down ogors MW and make slaneesh only have crit mortals on a spell but these guys get mortals on a 6 or 5 with two attacks a piece… Man slaneesh and ogors got boned
Wanna bet that they suddenly get amazing warscrolls and do surprisingly well? I have my doubts about ogors, but Slaanesh might surprise us, haha. But yeah, it's been salt in the wound ever since the ogor reveal, hasn't it? :S
Gobsprakk is a he for all we know. But I haven't found out what the situation with orks is in AoS, are they shoorms like in 40k? Are there females? Are they something else? We don't know, so a he for now but I assume he wouldn't care.
Nice review. I only have to disagree on the Kruleboyz Waaagh. It was game winning and will be missed severely. But we can make opponents fight last, which might function as some kind of replacement.
@@strategoi but you guys did an excellent review. Most people didn’t really realize that most abilities were severely nerfed and just said: oh this is nice… that is nice. You really went in-depth and compared. Thx for all the work. I really enjoy your faction focuses.
The dirty tricks will always be "used" even if the roll fails. The reason is the roll is made in the declare. It's confusing because they talk about the roll in both abilities. But in the passive it's just giving you an overall explanation of what the dirty tricks are. The dirty tricks themselves are the abilities. Notice how the passive doesn't have the dirty tricks keyword.
So because "using" the ability requires you to declare and THEN roll as part of the declare step, regardless of whether the roll is successful or not, the ability is used. The EFFECT only applies if you succeed the roll.
It's a bit tricky, but it's worded properly and it's pretty clear once you get it.
Hey Mark, thanks for the comment. Maybe I’m reading your comment wrong, but if I’m not mistaken that’s also what I said in the video right? That if you try it and fail then it still becomes harder to go off the next time?
@@ryanburruss sorry ya I might have come on strong, but at the very beginning when you first talk about it, it seems like you implied that it wouldn't count and you went back and forth, kind of getting confused. So I was just clearing it up.
I'm really happy with the new mechanics. Dirty tricks works completely in a new way! It seems like good and necessary changes..
I'm so stoked for the updates. I loved KB, but the army was so static and dull. Buff, Castle, then shoot till you win or lose.
Now you have teleports every turn, and big decisions to make every turn. Super exciting.
I love their tricks mechanic. So interactive! Totally with you on this one.
Kruelboyz branching out from Ironjawz was surprising. I like their dirty tricks traits.
Kragnos will be able to use battle traits. In nighthaunt faction focus they specified that the ethereal ability afects all nighthaunt "except Nagash". We can assume every trait without a specific exception will work on them.
Agreed!
Monsta-Killaz will most likely have the infantry keyword to benefit from sneaky sneakin’
Orukks always came in two Flavahz..... Gorkerz aka IronJawz, and Morkerz aka KruelBoyz I like the change feels more inline with classic fluff Orukk types.
I’m digging them. Will be fun for us “Johnny” kb players
What a glow-up
Nice video once again. My 2 cents on Kruleboyz as I do have them as an army:
The new tricks are more interesting and useful all game long than the old one so that's the biggest highlight. Having access to a potential teleport is probably the most interesting thing about them (although I'm guessing it'll be used on 6 boltboyz most of the time and I don't know if they risk dying right after it). The strike last also certainly can be good.
Gobbsprak, I'm not sure his damage profile truly is better, it might depend what he's attacking. The whole mount (beak as well) used to trigger MWs on 6s and that was most of his damage output normally (extra damage if fighting near a sludgeraker) and he lost that but gained 2 more attacks and +1 rend if fighting a wizard so maybe it's about even or better vs low save wizards and worse vs other things.
The spell to reduce the amount of attacks is (in my opinion) the best Kruleboyz spell. It used to also prevent run and would affect a bunch of units from much further away. The old version is probably better in general but good catch about it affecting shooting profiles as well. Having a debuff vs a unit that needs to be "wholly within" seems a bit odd to me, I'm not sure I remember seeing any of those lately.
The Waaagh was strong because you could cripple the opponent's army from range with boltboyz and then once they finally got into melee, you could activate your Sludgeraker general (usually) + 2 other units to all strike at once so it was like a trap to finish them off.
Overall, it's very difficult to tell as we haven't seen all of the rules and warscrolls yet and the Sludgerakers+boltboyz are generally the biggest part of the dmg this army has but my feeling is that it will still struggle to do well until they get extra models to complete the range. Here's why I think so:
-We used to get the poison ability for free 100% guaranteed with every shaman. Now it's a dirty trick on a 2+ that can only affect 1 unit and more restricted than before (but no longer relies on the slow shaman is nice). The army is pretty much a glass canon army. If that's still the case (which seems to be likely with the warscrolls we've seen), that poison dirty trick might be almost mandatory every round. You also need to pick it first. So this means that, in most scenarios, your other tricks will be on a 3+ and 4+ which aren't bad but you can't rely and plan around it reliably 100% (fun but maybe a bit rough competitively).
-We don't know if boltboyz are losing the MWs on crits, if that's the case, it's a big dmg nerf (and only one group could be buffed at once). So it might still be a glass canon army but that no longer dishes out insane amounts of MWs (maybe healither for the game but Kruleboyz would need something big to compensate as they were already struggling)
-People were already playing with the subfaction to not be visible outside of 12" but now, you also need to stay near terrain for that.
Overall, it seems like an interesting start but a big issue Kruleboyz have right now is that if you look at their unit list, they have a ton of heroes and very few actual unit options which might be why it's difficult to balance (they have gutrippaz, boltboyz and the hobgrots, that's about it. The other things are like 1 off models like the troll with grots and the anti-monster artillery). Maybe the monster subfaction will allow to field a lot of the smaller mounted heroes (the troll with an orc on it and the other one that was shown here).
Fantastisch write-up. Thanks for your insights and realistic approach to analysing the army.
I think Gutrippaz might feel better in the new edition. Just the lack of battleshock is huge for the army as a whole and the reduced rend across the board essentially buffs their armour. Also they can benefit from the new dirty tricks.
These guys look awesome! I am excited to play them…After seeing how Slaanesh buffs the opponent, nobody else can complain about Traits lol
That was fast!
"never pulled this off"... Must be insane or haven't played much. Most Kruleboyz generals understood that you either get this done or get destroyed in melee. Personally, only didn't get full value from this once in 3rd edition. The Waagh ability was a serious focus.
Yeah, I think maybe you’re missing the context here, but all good. There are very few people who played Kruleboyz in the training-for-worlds meta, and most of the ones that did were playing a long range shooting focus build, not melee. But yes, you’re right that I didn’t have to play against Kruleboyz much because they’ve been having a really rough time in the competitive meta for a long time.
I totally believe that there are players out there that got this off every time, but that’s just not the world I’ve experienced!
So they cut down ogors MW and make slaneesh only have crit mortals on a spell but these guys get mortals on a 6 or 5 with two attacks a piece…
Man slaneesh and ogors got boned
Wanna bet that they suddenly get amazing warscrolls and do surprisingly well? I have my doubts about ogors, but Slaanesh might surprise us, haha. But yeah, it's been salt in the wound ever since the ogor reveal, hasn't it? :S
Gobsprakk is a he for all we know. But I haven't found out what the situation with orks is in AoS, are they shoorms like in 40k? Are there females? Are they something else? We don't know, so a he for now but I assume he wouldn't care.
Nice review. I only have to disagree on the Kruleboyz Waaagh. It was game winning and will be missed severely. But we can make opponents fight last, which might function as some kind of replacement.
I bet there's a command trait for it available.
That would make sense!
@@strategoi but you guys did an excellent review. Most people didn’t really realize that most abilities were severely nerfed and just said: oh this is nice… that is nice. You really went in-depth and compared. Thx for all the work. I really enjoy your faction focuses.