Damn, the guy who still had the presence of mind while ON FIRE to think of an escape plan that wouldn't kill him outright was a true pimp. Good for him.
@@unusualbydefault agreed. in my head i always think 'great the person survived' but then i consider how utterly devastating it can be to a person's life when dealing with major injury and trauma... i hope the quick thinking worker has made it through the horror.
"Florida law does not require state or local governments to provide public employees with safety training, or to comply with OSHA safety standards." Ok so Florida is basically saying that public employees are expendable. Nice.
They made themselves expendable by not using common sense. You are responsible for all your actions when governed by the laws of physics. One sniff of that tank should have told them all they needed to know. Never assume anything...
I'm a HVAC technician and the state of Florida is aware of the effect of corrosion on condenser AC coils due to salt in the air. No excuse that the flame arrester should not be prone to corrosion also. This job was death waiting to happen.
Most of these accident can be linked to those who claim to be in charge. Management seldom knows anything about work being done. They only think in dollars.
Oh, they know more than you think. They just don't have an invested interest in the consequences, because 1) it's not profitable to do so, and 2) they are not the ones rolling the dice with their lives and health.
yup..I lived there for a while, everything is about the $$$, do it as cheap as possible, fast as possible and thats all the project managers worry about. So the contractors underbid jobs, cut corners to save money and cost worker and civilian lives on many, many occasions.
@@ZelosZelo Yep. It doesn't matter if it's business or government; money makes the world go round. The state has just as much reason to cheap out on safety - the less they spend on 'boring' stuff like that, the more they can spend on cool new shiny toys, or just siphon out for themselves. Politicians aren't corrupt just for the hell of it!
@Lazys The Dank Engineer ... Their job is to investigate and report. The reports are there to inform the public AND our elected officials. The problem is our public is too apathetic to care and our politicians are too corrupt to do anything about it. Any “power” the work of the CSB that can be brought to bare, is in our hands. They are an invaluable source of discovery and information.
Defunding The Chemical Safety Board Is A Bad Idea And Likely To Increase Chemical DisastersUnfortunately, the 2019 budget proposed by the Trump administration zeros out funding for the USCSB. Its requested fiscal-year funding, $12 million, is modest for a government agency. Likewise, the 2018 budget also proposed to defund the USCSB. This sustained effort reflects an ongoing de-emphasis on chemical safety - as a second example, Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Scott Pruitt has indefinitely delayed bans on the use of three hazardous chemicals, shown to be toxic to human health. Chemical production is an essential component of modern society. This does not mean that there is not room to improve practices in manufacturing, storing, and shipping chemicals, and in ensuring the safety of those who work in or live near chemical plants. The vantage of an independent group is crucial for identifying those aspects that can and should be improved. Defunding the USCSB, which provides this indispensable independent perspective, is likely to hinder efforts to identify the causes of chemical accidents - especially in low-regulation locales. Moreover, it is also likely to worsen our ability to respond in previously unforeseen events, such as the heavy flooding of Harvey, that may be exacerbated by climate change. Finally, it is likely to cost lives in future incidents.
@@johnballs1352 web.archive.org/web/20191020213008/www.safetyandhealthmagazine.com/articles/16670-csb-harwood-grants-back-on-the-chopping-block-in-trumps-fy-2019-budget-proposal google is your friend 🙃
Which other sitting president is currently trying to remove regulatory boards at the behest of the industry? I only know of one President at the moment, but I suppose there could be more.
And what did Florida do in the wake of such a deadly accident? They ignored the CSB's recommendations and still offer no legal protection to it's public workers. This just goes to show you that what's good for the goose is not good for the gander.
They were using a torch above a RACING FUEL TANK. How does one ignore maintenance on something called a "flame arrestor"? They used PVC pipe. I'm at a loss for words.
It's interesting that they knew enough to install a flame arrestor, but not enough to realize that the aluminum flame arrestor was incompatible with the methanol. It's like well-intentioned people who use galvanized pipe for propane, because they're not aware that propane attacks zinc.
@superdrummergaming: A couple of years a go a huge fire started at a chemical company (ChemiePack) in Moerdijk, The Netherlands after someone had gotten the task of "defrosting" a pump used to pump over a highly flammable chemical with a gas torch. That day the torch ignited the fuel and caused a small fire that soon spreaded to storage containers containing much more of the same liquid and other liquids that (again, against safety regulations) were stored at an open space of the terrain instead of in specially assigned storage spaces with oxygen-removing fire-suppressing systems that could be activated in case of a fire. Investigation later turned out the "defrosting" process had grown to be common practice (against all safety regulations) at the company, but it was mainly the storage of the same very flammable chemical on the open space that caused the fire to get out of hand quickly. When the first employee reported the fire at the fire department she was clearly not informed well enough and only mentioned there was a fire at their company, which, according to the reaction of person on the telephone at the fire department was perceived to be a small fire. A second employee who called maybe just a minute later (when security camera footage synchronized with the calls showing the fire already getting totally out of control) was able to mention the location on the terrain of the company where the fire was at that time, but was (because of not following safety regulations) unable to tell the fire department what they stored there (and thus, if they could use water or not, which it turned out they should not have used because the chemical was lighter than water and floated on top of it, either washing away unburned or burning on top of the water). Some small waterways around the facility turned an awful kind of red in the following days after the accident, indicating some chemicals had leaked into the surface water. There are mistakes being made everywhere as soon as regulations are being ignored, unfortunately.
@@Dutch3DMaster I was there that day. Working in the steel recycling company across the road. That was the biggest campfire I've ever seen! The next day all the little canals in the industrial area were all kind of colors. Unbelievable how stupid some people can be. Chemiepack was known to don't care about safety rules.
Every person who ever advocates for rollback of regulations or elects someone who advocates removal of regulations needs to be strapped in and forced to watch the entire USCSB playlist clockwork-orange style.
Do you really think that requiring a certain amount of parking spots per allowable restaurant square footage despite the presence of a firelane or the need for a permit to install a sign on the outside increases safety? How about the need to aquire a permit to practice interior design?
@@paulmvn5431 You'd think "what a bunch of maroons, requiring permits to install a sign" until a 1200 pound signs over a parking lot comes crashing down on a windy day on YOUR car (or your kids), because the installer didn't bother with engineering on the supports.
Funny how this year (2021) EXACTLY this same accident involving the same sort of tank filled with methanol at a waste water treatment plant happened in the UK 🇬🇧. Amazing how industries don't learn from each others mistakes.
I don't know where you get these ideas? Methanol is like Isopropanol and Ethanol. One is used on cuts and abrasions and the other is what is in Vodka. Methanol is not highly toxic as long as you don't drink it. We used it in Aviation for several things, it's not even really that volatile compared to other flammable liquids such as MEK or Acetone. People are getting this stuff confused with Nitro Methane which is for "top fuel" dragsters.
@@peterolsen269 Incorrect. Methanol is toxic by skin exposure and vapor inhalation. The NIOSH exposure limit is about 1/5th of a teaspoon skin exposure. It also forms explosive mixtures with air at room temperature. Nitromethane is more poisonous and chemically reactive, but that doesn't make methanol safe (also nitromethane is actually harder to ignite and explosive in a narrower range of mixtures with air). It's also true that methanol flames are very difficult to see, as it burns a very pale blue and generates no smoke.
@@adrianhenle1) Methanol is a nondrinking type of alcohol (also known as wood alcohol and methyl alcohol) which is mostly used to create fuel, solvents and antifreeze. A colorless liquid, it is volatile, flammable, and unlike ethanol, poisonous for human CONSUMPTION. 2) Methanol can also degrease the skin, which may cause dermatitis. Symptoms of ACUTE methanol exposure may include headache, weakness, drowsiness, nausea, difficult breathing, drunkenness, eye irritation, blurred vision, loss of consciousness, and possibly death. Notice how I NEVER said it was SAFE. Notice how it says "Consumption" not "Contact". Notice how the warning says ACUTE. Don't misquote me and then argue with yourself. I've been in more toxic environments than you can imagine. Try being in a booth when shooting catalyzed paint and vaporized high risk solvents like Acetone. Try having high temperature, high pressure, vaporized Phosphate Ester based hydraulic fluid suddenly filling a closed work environment. I'm just saying, all this hyperbole is getting to be exhausting. The main point is know your environment and what the required measures are to safeguard yourself. Good day Adrian Chemist.
Damn, we have a Waste Water Treatment facility in our Fire District, when I was a Firefighter I always cringed when we got a call for there. Thankfully nothin too serious the Managers and Workers do a good job of mitigating any big accidents. NFPA is basically a guideline but....you ever go to Court concerning NFPA those guidelines hold up as laws.
This videos are interesting and informative in how to avoid an accident at work thanks to the brave men and women that have made some mistakes that show others how not to do it and remember that safety is number one priority
Section (3)(5) of the Occupational Safety and Health Act of 1970 specifically excludes Federal OSHA's authority over employees of State and local government.
So the material that the flame arrestor plate above the tank is made out of readily corrodes to the chemical they were storing inside the tank... Bro what.
Once again, we see how equipment for handling highly dangerous materials has been designed, operated and maintained by brain dead mickey mouse amateurs. Wouldn't a professional welder want to know what's in a tank that he's going to be showering with sparks? Is there anyone on the property who's bright enough to ask the question, "What would happen if...?" The CSB has produced hundreds of accident reports during its 20 year history. They present the results and conclusions flatly, with absolutely no sense of shock or mockery. But you've got to imagine the meetings they've attended in which highly trained investigators are falling out of their chairs at the stupidity of chemical industry workers who cause these spectacular accidents. I'd LOVE to attend just one meeting for the entertainment.
You assume that the guy operating the cutting torch is an AWS certified, trained, professional welder. Most likely he was someone with enough general knowledge to know how to run a cutting torch. Frankly, I'm befuddled about why they were chopping the roof up with a torch. Most sheet metal roofs are attached by screws. If they were just replacing the roof, it would have been trivial to dismantle it with a battery drill motor, no torch required.
I had no idea that an aluminum flame arrestor was incompatible with methanol so I probably could have made that mistake. I think I would have known not to weld over it though
This is how the convo should go: Boss: "I want you to go cutting steel above these tanks." Worker: "Okay, what's in the tanks?" Boss: "Methanol." Worker: "Okay. Both tanks are drained and inerted?" Boss: "No, one is full." Worker: "..." Worker: "..." Worker: "..." Worker: "Well, they'd better get drained and inerted first." Boss: "No can do." Worker: "I have a short list of recreational anatomical impossibilities you might enjoy." Boss: "Well, if you don't like your job ..." Worker: "Money's no good to me unless I live to spend it, so I'm not taking a torch to God's own Molotov cocktail. Get those tanks drained and inerted, or at least fully air-flushed -- or else job upshove arsewise. I've got my FU money put aside, so I'm good either way." Boss: "..."
I lived in Florida for several years. Florida government is not very good around Ft. Lauderdale, miami, broward and beyond. Things there are done in the cheapest way possible. They put up a big front, making things seem to be on the up n up. Blasting the news about improvement and how things are so good, but behind the scenes, the companies they hire to do most of the work cut every corner possible. They do this because they underbid a job, which was the only way to get it. And cutting the corners is the only way to make any profit. A perfect example; there was a walkway over hwy 141 that collapsed before it was even finished because the contractor used a cheaper concrete, skimped out on some of the steel reinforcements that go into the concrete, and rushed the job so much there was an alignment issue getting the ends to meet up in the right place. The walkway took 10x longer then it was supposed to and It ended up costing some lives when it collapsed. ... so no, it dont surprise me 1 bit. and oversight is not on purpose, oversight caused by trying to be as cheap as possible is on purpose, and the results are a direct reaction to the people in charge trying to save a buck. IOW the workers had no choice, nobody cared about safety, just getting the job done, on time and as CHEAP as possible.
Safety training,routine inspection and maintenance = lives! I hate that it takes someone to lose their life for new regulations to take place but these poor men punched the time card expecting to go home and to their families. Simple oversights are wicked and merciless!!!
I once heard a saying from long ago: "Kill a man, hire a man. Kill a mule buy a mule". Meaning, people are cheap and expendable because there will always be those who need a job lined up ready to take that mans place. You need to spend money to buy/replace a mule, so do everything you can to protect them from injury or death. I've never forgotten that quote.
Scary, cannot even blame the workers for not smelling the gas. In another video in this channel, one of the cause of accident is workers only using their sense of smell in detecting gas presence, little did they know that smelling the same gas everyday make their smell desensitized to that gas odor.
Patrick B yeah... Scary to see that they were "not aware of the need to inspect..." and hadn't since the installation 13 years earlier... horrible injuries and deaths, entirely preventable... :(
When budgets get tight safety is always the first program cut. How about CDM, a premier wastewater engineering firm's design? Nice work, ended in deaths. But it brought the project in on budget.
What is so upsetting about this disaster is that the people responsible , all went home and slept in their owns and never were made to pay for the lives lost to their negligence and oversight ! It's really not rocket science that alchochol of any kind will create a fire with flames ! Everyone involved in the building not the tanks to management of the facility should have been prosecuted and either served time in prison or be put on probation with a criminal record ! Murder / homicide should be punished , period ! Stop making excuses for people who don't care and out other people's lives in danger !
@@jordanbell4736 You don't know me, I think you should take your own advise and show more respect for others. My remark (which is not a judgement) is based on experience.
What is an OSHA-Approved State Plan? The Occupational Safety and Health (OSH) Act covers most private sector employers and their workers, in addition to some state and local government employers and their workers in the 50 states and certain territories and jurisdictions under federal authority. Those jurisdictions include the District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, the Virgin Islands, American Samoa, Guam, Northern Mariana Islands, Wake Island, Johnston Island, and the Outer Continental Shelf Lands as defined in the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act. Private Sector Workers OSHA covers most private sector employers and workers in all 50 states, the District of Columbia, and the other United States (U.S.) jurisdictions - either directly through OSHA or through an OSHA-approved State Plan. State Plans are OSHA-approved job safety and health programs operated by individual states rather than federal OSHA. Section 18 of the OSH Act encourages states to develop and operate their own job safety and health programs and precludes state enforcement of OSHA standards unless the state has an OSHA-approved State Plan. OSHA approves and monitors all State Plans and provides as much as 50 percent of the funding for each program. State-run safety and health programs must be at least as effective (ALAE) as the federal OSHA program. OSHA provides coverage to certain workers specifically excluded from a State Plan (for example, those in some states who work in maritime industries or on military bases). To find the contact information of the OSHA or State Plan office nearest to you, call 1-800-321-OSHA or go to www.osha.gov. The following 22 states or territories have OSHA-approved State Plans that cover both private and state and local government workers: Alaska Arizona California Hawaii Indiana Iowa Kentucky Maryland Michigan Minnesota Nevada New Mexico North Carolina Oregon Puerto Rico South Carolina Tennessee Utah Vermont Virginia Washington Wyoming State and Local Government Workers Workers at state and local government agencies are not covered by OSHA, but have OSH Act protections if they work in states that have an OSHA-approved State Plan. OSHA rules also permit states and territories to develop plans that cover state and local government workers only. In these cases, private sector workers and employers remain under federal OSHA jurisdiction. Five additional states and one U.S. territory (Virgin Islands) have OSHA-approved State Plans that cover state and local government workers only: Connecticut Illinois Maine New Jersey New York Virgin Island
When regulations aren't enforced this sort of thing is bound to happen. I can't help but think lobby groups for the companies involved are to blame, forcing the states to not enforce "costly" saftey standards and regulations.
Man I feel bad for the crane operator, the fires directly shot at him from the tank. Any other place he could have stopped and he'd have been at least somewhat more safe and could've survived...
Jesuskeyrist. No one is looking over the other guys shoulder to make sure all is well. No systems engineer checking things out. No one with an eye to safety first. Sad.
don't really think using PVC pipe is a mistake here. First, it is always more important to prevent the fire. Secondly, is it certain that using steel pipe will be mitigating the consequence? The pressure is definitely high, steel pipe may transfer it to somewhere downstream where can be even more dangerous.
Completely inept management and beyond stupid workers. Sounds like the government. I knew somebody who managed the parks maintenance department in a large city. The number of employees who got a job there because their dad, uncle, brother, sister, etc worked there was staggering. Some of them were great employees, some were completely incompetent, its extremely hard to fire government workers because of civil service protection rules. Not saying that's what happened here with this accident, but it wouldn't surprise me if these workers(RIP) got a job working for the city due to a family connection and not based on actual merit.
its not a particularly skilled job, you do not need any merit here... just common sense, &/or proper management will do. ANYONE can be taught this job with the right overall attitude.
I would NOT have been oxyacetaline cutting over that tank with the damn vent RIGHT THERE... And thousands of gallons of shit inside... Nope you show me that the tank is empty of liquid and vapors and purged with an enert gas FIRST..... There where no safety protocols followed hear.
There is just so much wrong with this incident. It's understandable why so many workers die on the job as management is so complacent with their safety.
If I may... The "Training" people receive is Half Ass'd and Severely Inadequate for Life/Safety Purposes! Enforcement is Key in these issues and Needs to be Strictly Enforced. And this includes anything between OSHA Guidelines to Personal health risk and Safety.
That is a staggering series of bad decisions. All involved were responsible. Welders are taught the dangers in trade school. There would have been a repair order from management, there should have been a supervisor and then the workers themselves should all have known the danger methanol (a petrochemical fuel) poses.
@@Sashazur I know, that's precisely the problem. If you don't know what's inside the giant bomb with PVC pipe sticking out of the side of it, maybe ask someone if they could potentially explode if they try to weld in that particular area, which happened to be, in this case, above a giant bomb. These are details you really need to get hammered out before the welding/cutting process begins.
*When I hear "HOT WORK" I think of really buff big tall hard body builder guys muscles bulging covered in sweat looking hot doing manly manual labor. Sexy hot bodies doing hot work*
Ahh. Florida. The great Jeb Bush. We don't need industry to be required to provide safety training around dangerous situations in their work. Same Jeb Bush signed into law the elimination of motorcycle helmet law. Same Jeb Bush signed into law elimination of vehicle pollution inspections (smog noxious exhaust).
Is there no way to check for presence of fumes that does not involve open flame? It's like checking for landmines by stomping on the ground... Reminds me of the Buggs Bunny cartoon working in a WW2 shell factory as a 'tester' by hitting each shell fuse with a hammer.
It is bad enough to get private companies to follow safety guidelines. Wouldn't be too hard getting City and State government to follow such guidelines some they are normally the enforcer rather being enforced.
I hear of welders causing a lot of stuff and I would think a qualified worker properly informed when learning how to weld would be wiser .people cause these problems it seems like laws heaped on top of laws and regulations any layers deep give a false sense of security when a little common sense and an true concern for your job and fellow workers would do more good for safety
Yeah I can't think clearly but using a torch over a big tank with a flammable dot diamond on it? Not a wise idea, but who is to blame probably is the guys boss.
Surprised thathe fumes in the tank did not prevent combustion by displacing air containing O2. Surprised they even had a flame arrester where one would never expecthere to be flames.
Hey guys, today we are going to get an oxy-acetaline torch set and then climb up on top of a 50,000 gallon methyl-alcohol tank and spark up the torch. No thanks.
"Florida law does not require state or local governments to provide public employees with safety training, or to comply with OSHA safety standards" aka Republicans
I wish it was that simple. I worked in the public sector in ultra-democratic Illinois, and you would be stunned by the safety violations that occurred. In one case a supervisor was trying to urge people to enter a confined space without any backup or emergency gear. In another case, management tried to blame a Union operator for his own injury, that was caused by a contractor.
Haha. Hard to believe that, given that in FL even a certified sparky cant install a 120 VAC 15 A in his own home, rather he has to get an outside certified electrician.
You're assuming that anybody even told them what was in the tank they were working over. Unless you're familiar with the smell of methanol (which is frankly a little sweet and does not smell at all like something that would explode), they'd have no way of knowing.
@@mikecromaticm2896 did they know there was a tank in the building... I do not think they could see it (they might have assumed it was empty, or known nothing about it till it exploded)
Damn, the guy who still had the presence of mind while ON FIRE to think of an escape plan that wouldn't kill him outright was a true pimp. Good for him.
not sure if he'd do the same again after what awaited him in hospital
I cant even imagine wtf he went through bro
IMAGINE THE SMELL sdorry caps
@@13orrax you couldn't hit the back key on your keyboard? It was easier to write sorry? Dummy!!!
@@unusualbydefault agreed. in my head i always think 'great the person survived' but then i consider how utterly devastating it can be to a person's life when dealing with major injury and trauma... i hope the quick thinking worker has made it through the horror.
Even with a good flame arrestor the PVC and hot work can be a real problem. All it takes is one hot chunk to land on the PVC pipe.
"Florida law does not require state or local governments to provide public employees with safety training, or to comply with OSHA safety standards." Ok so Florida is basically saying that public employees are expendable. Nice.
That was Jeb Bush fulfilling his promise to reduce the cost of government, by skimping on training and safety for public employees.
They made themselves expendable by not using common sense.
You are responsible for all your actions when governed by the laws of physics.
One sniff of that tank should have told them all they needed to know.
Never assume anything...
Thanks Republicans, for smaller governments.
Thanks to the republicans, Florida is a bit of a third world shithole
@@blackhawkorg common sense can only be applied with proper knowledge of your work environment
I'm a HVAC technician and the state of Florida is aware of the effect of corrosion on condenser AC coils due to salt in the air. No excuse that the flame arrester should not be prone to corrosion also. This job was death waiting to happen.
Most of these accident can be linked to those who claim to be in charge. Management seldom knows anything about work being done. They only think in dollars.
this was the government.
@@GigsVT even worse, they don't think about anything
Oh, they know more than you think. They just don't have an invested interest in the consequences, because 1) it's not profitable to do so, and 2) they are not the ones rolling the dice with their lives and health.
yup..I lived there for a while, everything is about the $$$, do it as cheap as possible, fast as possible and thats all the project managers worry about. So the contractors underbid jobs, cut corners to save money and cost worker and civilian lives on many, many occasions.
@@ZelosZelo Yep. It doesn't matter if it's business or government; money makes the world go round. The state has just as much reason to cheap out on safety - the less they spend on 'boring' stuff like that, the more they can spend on cool new shiny toys, or just siphon out for themselves. Politicians aren't corrupt just for the hell of it!
What they should have told you: "Methanol burns with a clear flame, but is colored orange here for illustration."
Kudos to CSB. At least there is one agency that does its job transparently and well.
Shit. 11 years ago? Are you still alive?
Lol
@@iorfidaskye Shit. Arbitrary amount of time. Are you still alive?
@@johnballs1352 Shit. Interminable passage of circumstances. Are you still alive?
@Lazys The Dank Engineer ... Their job is to investigate and report. The reports are there to inform the public AND our elected officials. The problem is our public is too apathetic to care and our politicians are too corrupt to do anything about it. Any “power” the work of the CSB that can be brought to bare, is in our hands. They are an invaluable source of discovery and information.
This is just like a final destination scene. Quite scary...
Most of the stuff CSB produces is.
It was FNL dd ! 😌😔😣😫😵😵😵🥶
Defunding The Chemical Safety Board Is A Bad Idea And Likely To Increase Chemical DisastersUnfortunately, the 2019 budget proposed by the Trump administration zeros out funding
for the USCSB. Its requested fiscal-year funding, $12 million, is
modest for a government agency. Likewise, the 2018 budget also proposed to defund the USCSB.
This sustained effort reflects an ongoing de-emphasis on chemical
safety - as a second example, Environmental Protection Agency
Administrator Scott Pruitt has indefinitely delayed bans on the use of three hazardous chemicals, shown to be toxic to human health.
Chemical production is an essential component of modern society. This
does not mean that there is not room to improve practices in
manufacturing, storing, and shipping chemicals, and in ensuring the
safety of those who work in or live near chemical plants. The vantage of
an independent group is crucial for identifying those aspects that can
and should be improved.
Defunding the USCSB, which provides this indispensable independent
perspective, is likely to hinder efforts to identify the causes of
chemical accidents - especially in low-regulation locales.
Moreover, it is also likely to worsen our ability to respond in
previously unforeseen events, such as the heavy flooding of Harvey, that
may be exacerbated by climate change. Finally, it is likely to cost lives in future incidents.
Good.
Nice fantasy.
@@johnballs1352 web.archive.org/web/20191020213008/www.safetyandhealthmagazine.com/articles/16670-csb-harwood-grants-back-on-the-chopping-block-in-trumps-fy-2019-budget-proposal
google is your friend 🙃
3 years deep and its all Trumps fault. Go fuck yourself, dude.
Which other sitting president is currently trying to remove regulatory boards at the behest of the industry? I only know of one President at the moment, but I suppose there could be more.
And what did Florida do in the wake of such a deadly accident? They ignored the CSB's recommendations and still offer no legal protection to it's public workers. This just goes to show you that what's good for the goose is not good for the gander.
Wait they don't have to comply with OSHA? Well thank god I know that now. I wont be working or living in any of those states
In heaven:
"I died of methanol."
"Have you drank it?"
"No, it ignited....."
They were using a torch above a RACING FUEL TANK. How does one ignore maintenance on something called a "flame arrestor"? They used PVC pipe. I'm at a loss for words.
The flame arrestor was rotten and basically wasn't there
It's interesting that they knew enough to install a flame arrestor, but not enough to realize that the aluminum flame arrestor was incompatible with the methanol. It's like well-intentioned people who use galvanized pipe for propane, because they're not aware that propane attacks zinc.
@superdrummergaming: A couple of years a go a huge fire started at a chemical company (ChemiePack) in Moerdijk, The Netherlands after someone had gotten the task of "defrosting" a pump used to pump over a highly flammable chemical with a gas torch.
That day the torch ignited the fuel and caused a small fire that soon spreaded to storage containers containing much more of the same liquid and other liquids that (again, against safety regulations) were stored at an open space of the terrain instead of in specially assigned storage spaces with oxygen-removing fire-suppressing systems that could be activated in case of a fire.
Investigation later turned out the "defrosting" process had grown to be common practice (against all safety regulations) at the company, but it was mainly the storage of the same very flammable chemical on the open space that caused the fire to get out of hand quickly.
When the first employee reported the fire at the fire department she was clearly not informed well enough and only mentioned there was a fire at their company, which, according to the reaction of person on the telephone at the fire department was perceived to be a small fire.
A second employee who called maybe just a minute later (when security camera footage synchronized with the calls showing the fire already getting totally out of control) was able to mention the location on the terrain of the company where the fire was at that time, but was (because of not following safety regulations) unable to tell the fire department what they stored there (and thus, if they could use water or not, which it turned out they should not have used because the chemical was lighter than water and floated on top of it, either washing away unburned or burning on top of the water).
Some small waterways around the facility turned an awful kind of red in the following days after the accident, indicating some chemicals had leaked into the surface water.
There are mistakes being made everywhere as soon as regulations are being ignored, unfortunately.
@@Dutch3DMaster what are your recommendations?
@@Dutch3DMaster I was there that day. Working in the steel recycling company across the road. That was the biggest campfire I've ever seen! The next day all the little canals in the industrial area were all kind of colors. Unbelievable how stupid some people can be. Chemiepack was known to don't care about safety rules.
Every person who ever advocates for rollback of regulations or elects someone who advocates removal of regulations needs to be strapped in and forced to watch the entire USCSB playlist clockwork-orange style.
Do you really think that requiring a certain amount of parking spots per allowable restaurant square footage despite the presence of a firelane or the need for a permit to install a sign on the outside increases safety? How about the need to aquire a permit to practice interior design?
@@paulmvn5431 You'd think "what a bunch of maroons, requiring permits to install a sign" until a 1200 pound signs over a parking lot comes crashing down on a windy day on YOUR car (or your kids), because the installer didn't bother with engineering on the supports.
The sign isn't checked for safety. The permit is there for money and so the city doesn't get "overcrowded" with signs.
@@paulmvn5431 you lost, bug boi
Shitlib
Funny how this year (2021) EXACTLY this same accident involving the same sort of tank filled with methanol at a waste water treatment plant happened in the UK 🇬🇧.
Amazing how industries don't learn from each others mistakes.
Well that escalated quickly! R.I.P. to those who died that day and I wish well to any whom survived that tragedy that could have been avoided
I'm having a hard time believing, that the City didn't know about the tanks, needing to be inspected regularly.
What is the scariest thing about methonol not only is it highly toxic but burns with clear flame.
I don't know where you get these ideas? Methanol is like Isopropanol and Ethanol. One is used on cuts and abrasions and the other is what is in Vodka. Methanol is not highly toxic as long as you don't drink it. We used it in Aviation for several things, it's not even really that volatile compared to other flammable liquids such as MEK or Acetone. People are getting this stuff confused with Nitro Methane which is for "top fuel" dragsters.
@@peterolsen269 Incorrect. Methanol is toxic by skin exposure and vapor inhalation. The NIOSH exposure limit is about 1/5th of a teaspoon skin exposure. It also forms explosive mixtures with air at room temperature. Nitromethane is more poisonous and chemically reactive, but that doesn't make methanol safe (also nitromethane is actually harder to ignite and explosive in a narrower range of mixtures with air). It's also true that methanol flames are very difficult to see, as it burns a very pale blue and generates no smoke.
@@adrianhenle1) Methanol is a nondrinking type of alcohol (also known as wood alcohol and methyl alcohol) which is mostly used to create fuel, solvents and antifreeze. A colorless liquid, it is volatile, flammable, and unlike ethanol, poisonous for human CONSUMPTION. 2) Methanol can also degrease the skin, which may cause dermatitis. Symptoms of ACUTE methanol exposure may include headache, weakness, drowsiness, nausea, difficult breathing, drunkenness, eye irritation, blurred vision, loss of consciousness, and possibly death. Notice how I NEVER said it was SAFE. Notice how it says "Consumption" not "Contact". Notice how the warning says ACUTE. Don't misquote me and then argue with yourself. I've been in more toxic environments than you can imagine. Try being in a booth when shooting catalyzed paint and vaporized high risk solvents like Acetone. Try having high temperature, high pressure, vaporized Phosphate Ester based hydraulic fluid suddenly filling a closed work environment. I'm just saying, all this hyperbole is getting to be exhausting. The main point is know your environment and what the required measures are to safeguard yourself. Good day Adrian Chemist.
Waste water and exploding are two things I never wanted to see in the same sentence
Yet that is the reality in which my toilet exists every day.
Damn, we have a Waste Water Treatment facility in our Fire District, when I was a Firefighter I always cringed when we got a call for there. Thankfully nothin too serious the Managers and Workers do a good job of mitigating any big accidents. NFPA is basically a guideline but....you ever go to Court concerning NFPA those guidelines hold up as laws.
This videos are interesting and informative in how to avoid an accident at work thanks to the brave men and women that have made some mistakes that show others how not to do it and remember that safety is number one priority
From what I've just seen her the State of Florida is guilty of negligent homicide I'm not covering state workers under OSHA guidelines
"Florida law does not require [...] to comply with OSHA safety standards."
Is...is that optional...?
Section (3)(5) of the Occupational Safety and Health Act of 1970 specifically excludes Federal OSHA's authority over employees of State and local government.
So the material that the flame arrestor plate above the tank is made out of readily corrodes to the chemical they were storing inside the tank...
Bro what.
Respect to the guy who survived
And RIP to the two who didn't.
Yeah bad way to die
Quick thinking saved his life
Once again, we see how equipment for handling highly dangerous materials has been designed, operated and maintained by brain dead mickey mouse amateurs. Wouldn't a professional welder want to know what's in a tank that he's going to be showering with sparks? Is there anyone on the property who's bright enough to ask the question, "What would happen if...?"
The CSB has produced hundreds of accident reports during its 20 year history. They present the results and conclusions flatly, with absolutely no sense of shock or mockery. But you've got to imagine the meetings they've attended in which highly trained investigators are falling out of their chairs at the stupidity of chemical industry workers who cause these spectacular accidents. I'd LOVE to attend just one meeting for the entertainment.
You assume that the guy operating the cutting torch is an AWS certified, trained, professional welder. Most likely he was someone with enough general knowledge to know how to run a cutting torch. Frankly, I'm befuddled about why they were chopping the roof up with a torch. Most sheet metal roofs are attached by screws. If they were just replacing the roof, it would have been trivial to dismantle it with a battery drill motor, no torch required.
@MrPLC999 let me guess, if you had been in the Grenfell tower fire, you would've simply left the building, eh? asshole.
I had no idea that an aluminum flame arrestor was incompatible with methanol so I probably could have made that mistake. I think I would have known not to weld over it though
This is how the convo should go:
Boss: "I want you to go cutting steel above these tanks."
Worker: "Okay, what's in the tanks?"
Boss: "Methanol."
Worker: "Okay. Both tanks are drained and inerted?"
Boss: "No, one is full."
Worker: "..."
Worker: "..."
Worker: "..."
Worker: "Well, they'd better get drained and inerted first."
Boss: "No can do."
Worker: "I have a short list of recreational anatomical impossibilities you might enjoy."
Boss: "Well, if you don't like your job ..."
Worker: "Money's no good to me unless I live to spend it, so I'm not taking a torch to God's own Molotov cocktail. Get those tanks drained and inerted, or at least fully air-flushed -- or else job upshove arsewise. I've got my FU money put aside, so I'm good either way."
Boss: "..."
That’s the problem. Most people don’t have any FU money put aside. Most can’t afford to lose a job.
I lived in Florida for several years. Florida government is not very good around Ft. Lauderdale, miami, broward and beyond. Things there are done in the cheapest way possible. They put up a big front, making things seem to be on the up n up. Blasting the news about improvement and how things are so good, but behind the scenes, the companies they hire to do most of the work cut every corner possible. They do this because they underbid a job, which was the only way to get it. And cutting the corners is the only way to make any profit.
A perfect example; there was a walkway over hwy 141 that collapsed before it was even finished because the contractor used a cheaper concrete, skimped out on some of the steel reinforcements that go into the concrete, and rushed the job so much there was an alignment issue getting the ends to meet up in the right place. The walkway took 10x longer then it was supposed to and It ended up costing some lives when it collapsed. ... so no, it dont surprise me 1 bit. and oversight is not on purpose, oversight caused by trying to be as cheap as possible is on purpose, and the results are a direct reaction to the people in charge trying to save a buck. IOW the workers had no choice, nobody cared about safety, just getting the job done, on time and as CHEAP as possible.
Safety training,routine inspection and maintenance = lives! I hate that it takes someone to lose their life for new regulations to take place but these poor men punched the time card expecting to go home and to their families. Simple oversights are wicked and merciless!!!
This is where the saying comes from of:
"Safety rules are written in blood of the injured and the dead"
I once heard a saying from long ago: "Kill a man, hire a man. Kill a mule buy a mule". Meaning, people are cheap and expendable because there will always be those who need a job lined up ready to take that mans place. You need to spend money to buy/replace a mule, so do everything you can to protect them from injury or death.
I've never forgotten that quote.
I love watching thease videos you can learn so much my heart does go out to the ones who lost their lives
Thank you USCSB for educating us all!
Scary, cannot even blame the workers for not smelling the gas. In another video in this channel, one of the cause of accident is workers only using their sense of smell in detecting gas presence, little did they know that smelling the same gas everyday make their smell desensitized to that gas odor.
Good God, no HWP or pre job safety planning. I guess City maintenance people just weren't aware of that kind of safety culture.
Patrick B yeah... Scary to see that they were "not aware of the need to inspect..." and hadn't since the installation 13 years earlier...
horrible injuries and deaths, entirely preventable...
:(
When budgets get tight safety is always the first program cut. How about CDM, a premier wastewater engineering firm's design? Nice work, ended in deaths. But it brought the project in on budget.
What is so upsetting about this disaster is that the people responsible , all went home and slept in their owns and never were made to pay for the lives lost to their negligence and oversight ! It's really not rocket science that alchochol of any kind will create a fire with flames ! Everyone involved in the building not the tanks to management of the facility should have been prosecuted and either served time in prison or be put on probation with a criminal record ! Murder / homicide should be punished , period ! Stop making excuses for people who don't care and out other people's lives in danger !
That one lady sounds just like Roseanne Barr.
05:00 steel is obviously stronger than PVC, but not strong enough to prevent it from breaking in case of an explosion such as this one.
They specifically say it would likely have remained intact. What is your judgment based on? Be more humble.
@@jordanbell4736 You don't know me, I think you should take your own advise and show more respect for others. My remark (which is not a judgement) is based on experience.
I can only hope the worker and the family of the dead were paid justly. I doubt it.
Was any one held responsible and punished for this tragedy,?
Nobody is held responsible for any of these things.
The place was called Buffoon point?
Um, no. It was Bethune Point.
Anyone got the list of the 25 states they referred to at 5:58?
What is an OSHA-Approved State Plan?
The Occupational Safety and Health (OSH) Act covers most private sector employers and their workers, in addition to some state and local government employers and their workers in the 50 states and certain territories and jurisdictions under federal authority. Those jurisdictions include the District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, the Virgin Islands, American Samoa, Guam, Northern Mariana Islands, Wake Island, Johnston Island, and the Outer Continental Shelf Lands as defined in the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act.
Private Sector Workers
OSHA covers most private sector employers and workers in all 50 states, the District of Columbia, and the other United States (U.S.) jurisdictions - either directly through OSHA or through an OSHA-approved State Plan. State Plans are OSHA-approved job safety and health programs operated by individual states rather than federal OSHA. Section 18 of the OSH Act encourages states to develop and operate their own job safety and health programs and precludes state enforcement of OSHA standards unless the state has an OSHA-approved State Plan.
OSHA approves and monitors all State Plans and provides as much as 50 percent of the funding for each program. State-run safety and health programs must be at least as effective (ALAE) as the federal OSHA program. OSHA provides coverage to certain workers specifically excluded from a State Plan (for example, those in some states who work in maritime industries or on military bases). To find the contact information of the OSHA or State Plan office nearest to you, call 1-800-321-OSHA or go to www.osha.gov.
The following 22 states or territories have OSHA-approved State Plans that cover both private and state and local government workers:
Alaska
Arizona
California
Hawaii
Indiana
Iowa
Kentucky
Maryland
Michigan
Minnesota
Nevada
New Mexico
North Carolina
Oregon
Puerto Rico
South Carolina
Tennessee
Utah
Vermont
Virginia
Washington
Wyoming
State and Local Government Workers
Workers at state and local government agencies are not covered by OSHA, but have OSH Act protections if they work in states that have an OSHA-approved State Plan. OSHA rules also permit states and territories to develop plans that cover state and local government workers only. In these cases, private sector workers and employers remain under federal OSHA jurisdiction.
Five additional states and one U.S. territory (Virgin Islands) have OSHA-approved State Plans that cover state and local government workers only:
Connecticut
Illinois
Maine
New Jersey
New York
Virgin Island
When regulations aren't enforced this sort of thing is bound to happen. I can't help but think lobby groups for the companies involved are to blame, forcing the states to not enforce "costly" saftey standards and regulations.
Jesus, even without a hot work program you would think most people would hesitate to shower a tank like that in sparks.
amazing that the tank itself was essentially intact. that would’ve been gnarly shrapnel
The cheapest thing to do is always nothing....with the rollback of regulations this type of incident will become routine!
Man I feel bad for the crane operator, the fires directly shot at him from the tank. Any other place he could have stopped and he'd have been at least somewhat more safe and could've survived...
Using a torch or welder on top of a tank of flammable liquid is asking for death.
Didn't people consider that welding near a tank that was venting flammable chemicals AS DESIGNED might be a bad idea??
When meth cooks have better safety protocols than you.
Jesuskeyrist.
No one is looking over the other guys shoulder to make sure all is well.
No systems engineer checking things out.
No one with an eye to safety first.
Sad.
don't really think using PVC pipe is a mistake here. First, it is always more important to prevent the fire. Secondly, is it certain that using steel pipe will be mitigating the consequence? The pressure is definitely high, steel pipe may transfer it to somewhere downstream where can be even more dangerous.
I does not work remotely about chemical plant. But it is so exciting to watch the CSB accident animation.
U and me both!!!
11yrs later. You still watch csb? Just wondering...
@@cheechmarin4812 sometimes
Completely inept management and beyond stupid workers. Sounds like the government. I knew somebody who managed the parks maintenance department in a large city. The number of employees who got a job there because their dad, uncle, brother, sister, etc worked there was staggering. Some of them were great employees, some were completely incompetent, its extremely hard to fire government workers because of civil service protection rules.
Not saying that's what happened here with this accident, but it wouldn't surprise me if these workers(RIP) got a job working for the city due to a family connection and not based on actual merit.
its not a particularly skilled job, you do not need any merit here... just common sense, &/or proper management will do.
ANYONE can be taught this job with the right overall attitude.
Why is methanol used in wastewater treatment?
www.methanol.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Methanol-Denitrification-Why-Do-Some-Wastewater-Treatment-Plants-Need-To-Remove-Nitrogen.pdf
What an absolute clusterfuck :(
CSB should’ve recommended to not die in Florida.
✔ Home Office work
❌ Shipyard worker
❌ Farm worker
MAGA: "We don't need no... REG U LATIONS..."
Reality:
I would NOT have been oxyacetaline cutting over that tank with the damn vent RIGHT THERE... And thousands of gallons of shit inside... Nope you show me that the tank is empty of liquid and vapors and purged with an enert gas FIRST.....
There where no safety protocols followed hear.
y'know.......a short section (20cm.) of stainless pipe with a roll of stainless mesh (18cm.) inside would have a better flame barrier.
They built a super fun skatepark right next to this
There is just so much wrong with this incident. It's understandable why so many workers die on the job as management is so complacent with their safety.
Can't teach common sense.
Common sense ain't.
If tank was empty before the hot work, then would be no boom.
Plus the valve should be installed on the top to prevent methanol escape from the vent.
Only if it was then purged. Othwise gases might still be present
@@EvanDent
But gases could escape compare to liquids...
Is it still true that 25 states don't follow osha?
If I may... The "Training" people receive is Half Ass'd and Severely Inadequate for Life/Safety Purposes! Enforcement is Key in these issues and Needs to be Strictly Enforced. And this includes anything between OSHA Guidelines to Personal health risk and Safety.
0:45 Who is this enchantress? Ursula from the Little Mermaid
Thats mean. LOL.
You must be a big hit at parties, Austin.
Terrible experience of lift operator, he was cooked alive 🔥🔥🔥. No OSHA because you work for public?! Crazy
If you know there's a tank of methanol underneath, you don't spark up an oxyacetaline cutter. Did they not know? It would have been labelled surely?
You'd think that some of these accidents could've been prevented with just some common sense, but apparently not....
That is a staggering series of bad decisions. All involved were responsible. Welders are taught the dangers in trade school. There would have been a repair order from management, there should have been a supervisor and then the workers themselves should all have known the danger methanol (a petrochemical fuel) poses.
there is no way that i would weld and let sparks fall down anywhere near a tank filled with a highly flammable chemical... you cannot fire me! i QUIT!
Are these people on tranquilizers narrating this story? literally every guest on video sounds like they've had half a bottle of tranq's.
Nobody should handle a torch near tanks, empty or filled. Poor management, and bad teaching of those poor victims.
money makes the day and the goverment reacts only a litle bit. because chaning savety messuremants costs more than pay a few survivers.
No regulations that require mandatory anything is another way of saying “we don’t care.”
I see they activated Robot Hall for this investigation
They keep calling the place "Buffoon Point" on the video. LOL makes sense
Must be a nickname for the city or something
I work at a waste water treatment plant. This is spooky
How do you not know that methanol is flammable?
I doubt the welders even knew *what* was in the tanks, let alone whether it was flammable or not.
@@Sashazur I know, that's precisely the problem. If you don't know what's inside the giant bomb with PVC pipe sticking out of the side of it, maybe ask someone if they could potentially explode if they try to weld in that particular area, which happened to be, in this case, above a giant bomb. These are details you really need to get hammered out before the welding/cutting process begins.
I hate how these people read everything from a board, you can see they are not focused on the camera.
I don’t know why I watch these at weird times in the morning high as fuck, But they bizarrely interesting
*When I hear "HOT WORK" I think of really buff big tall hard body builder guys muscles bulging covered in sweat looking hot doing manly manual labor. Sexy hot bodies doing hot work*
Ahh. Florida.
The great Jeb Bush.
We don't need industry to be required to provide safety training around dangerous situations in their work.
Same Jeb Bush signed into law the elimination of motorcycle helmet law.
Same Jeb Bush signed into law elimination of vehicle pollution inspections (smog noxious exhaust).
Air shears would have been safer
cordless shears with brushless motors are just as safe
Is there no way to check for presence of fumes that does not involve open flame? It's like checking for landmines by stomping on the ground... Reminds me of the Buggs Bunny cartoon working in a WW2 shell factory as a 'tester' by hitting each shell fuse with a hammer.
Do we need laws for common sense❓
We do need training to enhance common sense.
It is bad enough to get private companies to follow safety guidelines. Wouldn't be too hard getting City and State government to follow such guidelines some they are normally the enforcer rather being enforced.
Nobody on site knows that methanol is flammable? Everybody should know this kind of basic chemistry in modern society. protect themselves and others.
I hear of welders causing a lot of stuff and I would think a qualified worker properly informed when learning how to weld would be wiser .people cause these problems it seems like laws heaped on top of laws and regulations any layers deep give a false sense of security when a little common sense and an true concern for your job and fellow workers would do more good for safety
Yeah I can't think clearly but using a torch over a big tank with a flammable dot diamond on it? Not a wise idea, but who is to blame probably is the guys boss.
Laws *need* to be in place to make a company/corporations follow safety regulations!!
Surprised thathe fumes in the tank did not prevent combustion by displacing air containing O2.
Surprised they even had a flame arrester where one would never expecthere to be flames.
Why were the tanks not purged prior? Oh nevermind.
How do cities get away w this? We had to give burn permits at caterpillar even if they were outside and over a 1/4. Mile from anything that would burn
Hey guys, today we are going to get an oxy-acetaline torch set and then climb up on top of a 50,000 gallon methyl-alcohol tank and spark up the torch. No thanks.
"Florida law does not require state or local governments to provide public employees with safety training, or to comply with OSHA safety standards"
aka Republicans
I wish it was that simple. I worked in the public sector in ultra-democratic Illinois, and you would be stunned by the safety violations that occurred. In one case a supervisor was trying to urge people to enter a confined space without any backup or emergency gear. In another case, management tried to blame a Union operator for his own injury, that was caused by a contractor.
hallerd those pesky regulations and safety get in the way of profits! Smh
Yeah, that was mind blowing to me....even for civil service employees.
Killing children in the womb is legal.
aka Democrats
Haha. Hard to believe that, given that in FL even a certified sparky cant install a 120 VAC 15 A in his own home, rather he has to get an outside certified electrician.
Ok lets do welding work directly above a storage tank containing highly flammable methanol, pretty dumb !!
We should of ask the worker that survive. What was he considering? The tank was empty? Or fumes will come out?
You're assuming that anybody even told them what was in the tank they were working over. Unless you're familiar with the smell of methanol (which is frankly a little sweet and does not smell at all like something that would explode), they'd have no way of knowing.
@@artgoat yeah. I just think doing welding over a big tank that is not water would mean something.
@@mikecromaticm2896 did they know there was a tank in the building... I do not think they could see it (they might have assumed it was empty, or known nothing about it till it exploded)
Only 11 employees? Less than one person per million gallons of water treated daily. No wonder it wasn't checked