I have a healthy distrust of tech - so I make sure I have solutions available if things go wrong. It’s like sailing, there are limited maneuvers a boat can make - it’s how you react when something goes wrong that makes you seaworthy!
Agreed. Most of my gigs could be done with the MP10ii -- however, some time after this video's creation I picked up a used SD633 and while it has less inputs, it has a lot more flexibility and capabilities as well as the dual-card write, which gives me a lot less anxiety with data loss than the MP10's single-SD write and USB backup write. The 633 has become my preferred machine for most doc, sit-down, and low-input count programs. At some point I'll step up to the 8-series... in time... Thanks for watching!
The distro is from PSC, distributes the signal from the Betso antennas into my receivers. The IFB is a Lectro LT in B band with a battery eliminator so I can power it off my power distribution and I use RMas for receivers. I also have some Comteks if I need a an additional separate feed in which case I use my SD633 for that scenario as the MP10ii is limited with outputs.
Thanks for this video. I'm interested in knowing which specific model of the KSTGMIX Stingray you are using. I believe the one you have may be a great fit for my new Zoom F8n Pro along with other accessories.
I am using the KSTGJRX the Jr-X bag made for the 833 or 633 in this video. Recently I swapped out the MixPre10ii for a 633 and it works much better. This would work fine for an F8n Pro - however it may be a bit big for the Zoom - you may consider an Orca bag instead for the Zoom so you aren't carry extra bag weight for no reason. Or perhaps there's a Stingray that is smaller that will fit the F8n better!
Thanks for sharing your setup. That's a nice bag! I'm curious about your antenna distribution setup. I noticed you have the B-A sma connections looped on your Lectros. How well does that work for you? And follow up, if that's working, leaving only two open sma for antennas, what roll does the distro play?
I have found the distro does give me stronger reception with less drops and more range. Maybe another 30% range. The trade-off is the cumbersome antenna paddles and cabling and extra drain on battery as it is powered. So, it depends on the gig and what distance situations you might be faced with. Arguably this distro is better for a set-up with more RX than I have in this bag, as the distro itself is bulky and hard to really hide on/in the bag, and has multiple sma for many RXs. I’d say it’s more-suited to narrative scenarios than run-and-gun only because of the squirrelly nature of run-and-gun doc-style shoots. But I have used them on doc-style shoots and just have to be quick to move them around and out of the way in tight quarters situations. The distro allows me to have multiple receivers receiving off the two of batwing antenna instead of multiple whip antennas, that’s its main purpose. It is powered and for sure powered on it gives a more robust connection to my TXs. But using just whips is much lighter, much freer, and less battery drain. Hope that answers your question!?
Very informative video. Do any productions rely primarily on audio recorders with lavs on the talent with or without a wireless transmitter back to a wireless receiver in an audio bag like yours ?...or is wireless recording like your setup the defacto gold standard for every type of production all the way up to Hollywood movie sets ?
There’s no “it’s this way all the time” in audio because every show is different and has different requirements. Some productions might be framed to where you can boom most or all of it. Some might be framed where wireless lavs are what you hear all the time. Some scenes might need lav but be too far away for wireless so they record to SD card and sync with timecode. But the vast majority of modern productions now lav everyone and boom as well for as much coverage as possible. Every show is different and every scene might require a different approach. Thanks for watching!
PSC RF Multi SMA, which, honestly is a touch cumbersome and many more channels than I have on board but good for building into over time. Perhaps a smaller distro would be better but it’s what I have for now!
What about sound equipment used in a motion picture/film? Is the gear in your sound bag used in that also or does a commercial motion picture film crew film crew use different equipment ?
You “could” record a major film with a 6 or 8-channel mixer, and I’ve worked some narrative projects with this bag setup - however many mixers on feature movies use bigger machines with more options, off a cart. It’s really just a matter of how many inputs and outputs you need, and how close to set you can get. Many feature film mixers use Dante networks, antenna arrays, and mixers that have between 8 and 32 inputs that can handle 1-2 wireless booms, multiple wireless lavs, timecode, Dante, and tons of outputs to accommodate IFB, earwigs, VOG speakers, playback (musicals), and all sorts of comms and talkback for boom ops and such… basically ready for any and all sorts of situations. Usually all that runs off a cart. The benefits of Dante and antenna masts are that the cart can be much further from set. Some folks use Sound Devices 8-series or Scorpio, some use Zaxcom systems, some use Aaton Cantar. My sound bag has some gear in it that can definitely be reconfigured for that type of work - my wireless transmitters and receivers, my IFB, antennas, power distro - it’s really that I’d want a mixer with more inputs and outputs and routing options like a 688 or 888 or Scorpio in the Sound Devices systems. Thanks for watching!
Hi, I would love to see a comparison between the MixPre 6 II vs Zoom F8n Pro, I am not certain on which to buy. I do know that the F8 has a lot more features and is well suited for a larger variety of work, while the Sound Devices is like getting a grail watch, more fancy and high end creme de la creme, but isn't as versatile as a workhorse chronograph watch like a Seiko. So basically, I want to know what I'm getting myself into for each. Also, do you have a boom pole video for K Tek Avalon aluminum series? I see no one on RUclips review this, everyone does the high end Mighty Boom review or whate3ver high end boom pole brand, but we can't all afford it, so the Avalon lineup seems to be a great starting ground. Sorry for the long chat man. Cheers! - 🐧
Thanks for watching! I'd have to acquire a MP6ii in order to do a proper comparison - but just looking at the specs I can tell you a few of the things that stand out. The MP-line, I find, to be much more user friendly for setting gain and bouncing between gain and fader. The Zoom series is a bit clunky for getting between gain and fader adjustments. And the Zoom's pots are very small. However the two main drawbacks of the MP6 is that it only records to a single SD card, which will bite you at some point - and that it does not have a good external power option vs the Zoom records to 2 SDs and has a hirose port so you can power from a power hub. I'd have to dig a bit on whether the MP6 can take both external Timecode as well as output its own and how well that would interface via that little USB port - the main problem being I don't know how many TC lockit boxes have cables to interface with that port. Worth looking into if the MP6ii can generate TC and have a lockit on board to send TC out to camera lockits. It all depends on the sort of audio work you are doing and how long your days are, how many batts you go through, if you need timecode, how many outs you need, and your threshold for sd card failure and only having 1 recording like on the MP6ii. As a production machine, I'd choose the Zoom over the MP6ii and use the MP6 as more of a bag-drop or similar situations where a really small recorder with less channels is needed. The Zoom has the 8 channels - but, be real: how often are you running a boom or 2 and 6-7 lavs? Most bag mixers are running 1 boom and 2-3 lavs so those other channels may not get used. If you are doing music, they are both good but the Zoom will give you more channels and music often needs that. After I made this video I bought a Sound Devices 633 used and my world changed. It has nearly all that you need for most productions that are 1 boom and 5 lavs or 2 booms and 4 lavs - which is the vast majority of films out there. It's rock-solid, has TC in and out, has dual card recording, accurate TC, big faders, and 6 outputs, which is really important on certain jobs that need all sorts of output options. And Sound Devices will service a 633 -- Zoom, well, the cost to repair might be better spent to buy another one new. I did one gig with the 633 recently where the director needed their own IFB mix, then a separate Comtex mix for 15 clients in another room with video village, plus a VOG speaker in play, and running it all out to another (Zoom F8) as an I/O for a Zoom-teleconference livestream, plus MP3 recording, plus camera hops. So I had all my outputs going for that one! Not something I could do with the Zoom F8n or MixPre series. That's 633 and above territory. Now, I find I prefer my 633 for 99% of the audio-for-film work I do - and I use my MP10ii for musical things. --- I'll look and see what KTek boom I have - my main pole is an Ambient 14ft pole. Thanks the chat and I hope some of these thoughts help!
@@onseteducation921 Holy cow man! Thank you for you well detailed and long response to my queries! = D Well regarding having a MP6ii or MP10ii vs. Z8n Pro, both are nearly identical. It's more off MPii series vs Zoom F8n Pro, so a comparison can be made in a video essay like that. I've been doing various different video and film work for a couple years now, I have a Blackmagic and a couple vintage and cine lenses. So I was wonderings where I should start with my first pro field recorder. Generally, MP does better than Zoom with the features that it has, but for every other feature it doesn't have then Zoom is the way to go and more future proof for a wider variety of work while MP would be less versatile, even if it would have a slight edge in its sound quality and amplifiers, analogue limiters etc. Thanks again for your well detailed insights! I guess if I can live with one SD card slot, then I can get the better quality MP6ii. I was thinking of just buying an Angel Bird SD card then that should resolve the possibility of an SD card failing. Ahh yess Ambient boom pole, that's what I mean. All I see on RUclips are people talking about the high end lineup of KTek and Ambient boom poles (among other expensive brands), I'm just wondering about the mid range of KTek, which seems to be is there Avalon lineup, I don't see Ambient having anything mid ranged priced, like not over $400 for around 12f not internally cabled. This is because the Avalon series uses aluminum and not any composite material but it maxes out at 12f, specifically I've found the KE144 - K-Tek Avalon. Yes there are some talks on forum posts or reddit, but those are sparse, not detailed, and not as good as a RUclips video. Oh yes that chat has been wonderfully helpful and your thoughts do help! Thank you for your time! Unfortunately it seems your channel is not yet a RUclips partner with 1K subscribers so I can't send a SuperThanks alongside this comment. Still, I appreciate it. Cheers! - 🐧
The mixer is the audio distributor. It can be configured a number of ways. In my case I feed reference audio from the X1/X2 out port to a transmitter to send sound to camera(s) wirelessly. And I also have a transmitter on the front of the bag to send sound to IFB via one of the main Outs. All configurable in the mixer.
The pockets left and right, the built-in antenna mounts, the molle-esque straps, the kick stand, and smaller overall size - and also lighter weight than the Orca while being thinner in depth, which is good for lav’ing on the fly with the bag on. Thanks for watching!
I'm so happy for you! That sounds dreamy. All bags are a work-in-progress. My bag has even evolved from the time I recorded this video. Have a great day!
Not many soundbags have a Distro, well done 🤌🏼👌🏽 Question: What do the editors think about delivering all the tracks, some muted, some not, to keep order? Do they ask you that? And wouldn't that be a lot of unnecessary file storage, unnecessary extra gigs?
Thanks! I had the opportunity to sit with post folks at a network and I asked them what would be most helpful to them. They said the most important organizational thing is consistency - if Boom is on channel 1 (track 3) that it stays there for the whole day. If talent Cindy is on channel 5 (track 7) that she stays there even if it’s muted in scenes she’s not in that day. If it’s jumping around tracks because tracks are being armed/disarmed, that gets confusing for them. The sound report is helpful but if things are consistent it makes it much easier to decipher on complex shoots. But, the very best thing is to get Post’s preference ahead of time in case there are any new things they want. I have found this isn’t always easy or in some cases like doc, they haven’t hired post yet, so I tend to stay with what is the least confusing in post as the default, which is to keep tracks consistent even if it means delivering more. If it’s a muted track, I can’t imagine it’s adding that much more data to the mix - and sound files are much smaller than camera files anyhow. When in doubt - if possible - ask the line producer to be connected to post to ask their preference.
I'm glad to hear this. I always hate disarming tracks I'm not using for fear that I might forget to re-arm it for a later scene where i need that input. These are the small but influential reasons I would have loved to have a mentor slip me this bit of knowledge one day on set. @@onseteducation921
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You're way too professional with this bag AND your backup bag. Thanks for having a RUclips channel to show the way.
I have a healthy distrust of tech - so I make sure I have solutions available if things go wrong. It’s like sailing, there are limited maneuvers a boat can make - it’s how you react when something goes wrong that makes you seaworthy!
The coiled cable for boom is genius. I run a 4ft and it's a pain sometimes.
Good setup. I have been using a Mixpre10 for the last 2 years, and its great for about 90% of the jobs I do.
Agreed. Most of my gigs could be done with the MP10ii -- however, some time after this video's creation I picked up a used SD633 and while it has less inputs, it has a lot more flexibility and capabilities as well as the dual-card write, which gives me a lot less anxiety with data loss than the MP10's single-SD write and USB backup write. The 633 has become my preferred machine for most doc, sit-down, and low-input count programs. At some point I'll step up to the 8-series... in time... Thanks for watching!
nice video. i had the dadm 226 under the mixer - plug and forget . now using sound devices 833 with sl2 - love th video =)
Worlds first superduper Tactical audio bag, looks awesome, keep it coming :-)
Thanks for watching Anders!
wow yes that was great tell me more about your antenna distribution and how that gear to the front of the bag and your ifb ?
The distro is from PSC, distributes the signal from the Betso antennas into my receivers. The IFB is a Lectro LT in B band with a battery eliminator so I can power it off my power distribution and I use RMas for receivers. I also have some Comteks if I need a an additional separate feed in which case I use my SD633 for that scenario as the MP10ii is limited with outputs.
Awesome video and awesome kit!
Thanks for watching!
Thanks for this video. I'm interested in knowing which specific model of the KSTGMIX Stingray you are using. I believe the one you have may be a great fit for my new Zoom F8n Pro along with other accessories.
I am using the KSTGJRX the Jr-X bag made for the 833 or 633 in this video. Recently I swapped out the MixPre10ii for a 633 and it works much better. This would work fine for an F8n Pro - however it may be a bit big for the Zoom - you may consider an Orca bag instead for the Zoom so you aren't carry extra bag weight for no reason. Or perhaps there's a Stingray that is smaller that will fit the F8n better!
Thanks for sharing your setup. That's a nice bag! I'm curious about your antenna distribution setup. I noticed you have the B-A sma connections looped on your Lectros. How well does that work for you? And follow up, if that's working, leaving only two open sma for antennas, what roll does the distro play?
I have found the distro does give me stronger reception with less drops and more range. Maybe another 30% range. The trade-off is the cumbersome antenna paddles and cabling and extra drain on battery as it is powered. So, it depends on the gig and what distance situations you might be faced with. Arguably this distro is better for a set-up with more RX than I have in this bag, as the distro itself is bulky and hard to really hide on/in the bag, and has multiple sma for many RXs. I’d say it’s more-suited to narrative scenarios than run-and-gun only because of the squirrelly nature of run-and-gun doc-style shoots. But I have used them on doc-style shoots and just have to be quick to move them around and out of the way in tight quarters situations. The distro allows me to have multiple receivers receiving off the two of batwing antenna instead of multiple whip antennas, that’s its main purpose. It is powered and for sure powered on it gives a more robust connection to my TXs. But using just whips is much lighter, much freer, and less battery drain. Hope that answers your question!?
Very informative video. Do any productions rely primarily on audio recorders with lavs on the talent with or without a wireless transmitter back to a wireless receiver in an audio bag like yours ?...or is wireless recording like your setup the defacto gold standard for every type of production all the way up to Hollywood movie sets ?
There’s no “it’s this way all the time” in audio because every show is different and has different requirements. Some productions might be framed to where you can boom most or all of it. Some might be framed where wireless lavs are what you hear all the time. Some scenes might need lav but be too far away for wireless so they record to SD card and sync with timecode. But the vast majority of modern productions now lav everyone and boom as well for as much coverage as possible. Every show is different and every scene might require a different approach. Thanks for watching!
Great video. Thank you! Would love to hear more about your Lectrosonics setup and also a deeper dive into the Zoom vs the Sound Devices! Thank you!
Awesome Kit ;)
That was very interesting
Thanks for watching!
Cool video! whats the antenna distro you use ?
PSC RF Multi SMA, which, honestly is a touch cumbersome and many more channels than I have on board but good for building into over time. Perhaps a smaller distro would be better but it’s what I have for now!
What about sound equipment used in a motion picture/film? Is the gear in your sound bag used in that also or does a commercial motion picture film crew film crew use different equipment ?
You “could” record a major film with a 6 or 8-channel mixer, and I’ve worked some narrative projects with this bag setup - however many mixers on feature movies use bigger machines with more options, off a cart. It’s really just a matter of how many inputs and outputs you need, and how close to set you can get. Many feature film mixers use Dante networks, antenna arrays, and mixers that have between 8 and 32 inputs that can handle 1-2 wireless booms, multiple wireless lavs, timecode, Dante, and tons of outputs to accommodate IFB, earwigs, VOG speakers, playback (musicals), and all sorts of comms and talkback for boom ops and such… basically ready for any and all sorts of situations. Usually all that runs off a cart. The benefits of Dante and antenna masts are that the cart can be much further from set. Some folks use Sound Devices 8-series or Scorpio, some use Zaxcom systems, some use
Aaton Cantar. My sound bag has some gear in it that can definitely be reconfigured for that type of work - my wireless transmitters and receivers, my IFB, antennas, power distro - it’s really that I’d want a mixer with more inputs and outputs and routing options like a 688 or 888 or Scorpio in the Sound Devices systems. Thanks for watching!
@@onseteducation921 Thank you for the response. Very helpful
😊@@onseteducation921
Hi Jeff, what microphone did you use for the video very nice sound ?
Thank you! I use a Sennheiser MKH50 overhead and I also wear a Sanken COS11d lav mic in case I need it. Thanks for watching!
some day I have the cos 11d but will buy the mkh 50 some day not cheap but wroth it.🤣
Hi, I would love to see a comparison between the MixPre 6 II vs Zoom F8n Pro, I am not certain on which to buy. I do know that the F8 has a lot more features and is well suited for a larger variety of work, while the Sound Devices is like getting a grail watch, more fancy and high end creme de la creme, but isn't as versatile as a workhorse chronograph watch like a Seiko.
So basically, I want to know what I'm getting myself into for each. Also, do you have a boom pole video for K Tek Avalon aluminum series? I see no one on RUclips review this, everyone does the high end Mighty Boom review or whate3ver high end boom pole brand, but we can't all afford it, so the Avalon lineup seems to be a great starting ground.
Sorry for the long chat man.
Cheers!
- 🐧
Thanks for watching! I'd have to acquire a MP6ii in order to do a proper comparison - but just looking at the specs I can tell you a few of the things that stand out. The MP-line, I find, to be much more user friendly for setting gain and bouncing between gain and fader. The Zoom series is a bit clunky for getting between gain and fader adjustments. And the Zoom's pots are very small. However the two main drawbacks of the MP6 is that it only records to a single SD card, which will bite you at some point - and that it does not have a good external power option vs the Zoom records to 2 SDs and has a hirose port so you can power from a power hub. I'd have to dig a bit on whether the MP6 can take both external Timecode as well as output its own and how well that would interface via that little USB port - the main problem being I don't know how many TC lockit boxes have cables to interface with that port. Worth looking into if the MP6ii can generate TC and have a lockit on board to send TC out to camera lockits. It all depends on the sort of audio work you are doing and how long your days are, how many batts you go through, if you need timecode, how many outs you need, and your threshold for sd card failure and only having 1 recording like on the MP6ii. As a production machine, I'd choose the Zoom over the MP6ii and use the MP6 as more of a bag-drop or similar situations where a really small recorder with less channels is needed. The Zoom has the 8 channels - but, be real: how often are you running a boom or 2 and 6-7 lavs? Most bag mixers are running 1 boom and 2-3 lavs so those other channels may not get used. If you are doing music, they are both good but the Zoom will give you more channels and music often needs that. After I made this video I bought a Sound Devices 633 used and my world changed. It has nearly all that you need for most productions that are 1 boom and 5 lavs or 2 booms and 4 lavs - which is the vast majority of films out there. It's rock-solid, has TC in and out, has dual card recording, accurate TC, big faders, and 6 outputs, which is really important on certain jobs that need all sorts of output options. And Sound Devices will service a 633 -- Zoom, well, the cost to repair might be better spent to buy another one new. I did one gig with the 633 recently where the director needed their own IFB mix, then a separate Comtex mix for 15 clients in another room with video village, plus a VOG speaker in play, and running it all out to another (Zoom F8) as an I/O for a Zoom-teleconference livestream, plus MP3 recording, plus camera hops. So I had all my outputs going for that one! Not something I could do with the Zoom F8n or MixPre series. That's 633 and above territory. Now, I find I prefer my 633 for 99% of the audio-for-film work I do - and I use my MP10ii for musical things. --- I'll look and see what KTek boom I have - my main pole is an Ambient 14ft pole. Thanks the chat and I hope some of these thoughts help!
@@onseteducation921 Holy cow man! Thank you for you well detailed and long response to my queries!
= D
Well regarding having a MP6ii or MP10ii vs. Z8n Pro, both are nearly identical. It's more off MPii series vs Zoom F8n Pro, so a comparison can be made in a video essay like that. I've been doing various different video and film work for a couple years now, I have a Blackmagic and a couple vintage and cine lenses. So I was wonderings where I should start with my first pro field recorder. Generally, MP does better than Zoom with the features that it has, but for every other feature it doesn't have then Zoom is the way to go and more future proof for a wider variety of work while MP would be less versatile, even if it would have a slight edge in its sound quality and amplifiers, analogue limiters etc.
Thanks again for your well detailed insights! I guess if I can live with one SD card slot, then I can get the better quality MP6ii. I was thinking of just buying an Angel Bird SD card then that should resolve the possibility of an SD card failing.
Ahh yess Ambient boom pole, that's what I mean. All I see on RUclips are people talking about the high end lineup of KTek and Ambient boom poles (among other expensive brands), I'm just wondering about the mid range of KTek, which seems to be is there Avalon lineup, I don't see Ambient having anything mid ranged priced, like not over $400 for around 12f not internally cabled. This is because the Avalon series uses aluminum and not any composite material but it maxes out at 12f, specifically I've found the KE144 - K-Tek Avalon. Yes there are some talks on forum posts or reddit, but those are sparse, not detailed, and not as good as a RUclips video.
Oh yes that chat has been wonderfully helpful and your thoughts do help! Thank you for your time!
Unfortunately it seems your channel is not yet a RUclips partner with 1K subscribers so I can't send a SuperThanks alongside this comment. Still, I appreciate it.
Cheers!
- 🐧
helo, Nice video. Can you name your antenna Distro please . thanks
In this video, I’m using a PSC sma distro to Betso antennas.
How do you feed all the outputs ? Do use any audio distribution system?
The mixer is the audio distributor. It can be configured a number of ways. In my case I feed reference audio from the X1/X2 out port to a transmitter to send sound to camera(s) wirelessly. And I also have a transmitter on the front of the bag to send sound to IFB via one of the main Outs. All configurable in the mixer.
How much total cost roughly is that bag with all it's contents? Curious.
With 4 channels of transmitters and IFB, about $15k. But that’s new - you can find a lot used these days. Thanks for watching!
What do you mean more streamlined when comparing k-tek and orca? just curious about what you find better in k-tek.
The pockets left and right, the built-in antenna mounts, the molle-esque straps, the kick stand, and smaller overall size - and also lighter weight than the Orca while being thinner in depth, which is good for lav’ing on the fly with the bag on. Thanks for watching!
The side access is far better on Ktek bags as well. The side frame on orca bags are so wide it can block ports on some recorders
My setup with 8 wireless transmitter and receivers weights less than this bag empty.
I'm so happy for you! That sounds dreamy. All bags are a work-in-progress. My bag has even evolved from the time I recorded this video. Have a great day!
Honestly, that kit is unnecessarily oversized for what it offers and also very messy...
Thanks for watching!
Not many soundbags have a Distro, well done 🤌🏼👌🏽
Question: What do the editors think about delivering all the tracks, some muted, some not, to keep order? Do they ask you that? And wouldn't that be a lot of unnecessary file storage, unnecessary extra gigs?
Thanks! I had the opportunity to sit with post folks at a network and I asked them what would be most helpful to them. They said the most important organizational thing is consistency - if Boom is on channel 1 (track 3) that it stays there for the whole day. If talent Cindy is on channel 5 (track 7) that she stays there even if it’s muted in scenes she’s not in that day. If it’s jumping around tracks because tracks are being armed/disarmed, that gets confusing for them. The sound report is helpful but if things are consistent it makes it much easier to decipher on complex shoots. But, the very best thing is to get Post’s preference ahead of time in case there are any new things they want. I have found this isn’t always easy or in some cases like doc, they haven’t hired post yet, so I tend to stay with what is the least confusing in post as the default, which is to keep tracks consistent even if it means delivering more. If it’s a muted track, I can’t imagine it’s adding that much more data to the mix - and sound files are much smaller than camera files anyhow. When in doubt - if possible - ask the line producer to be connected to post to ask their preference.
I'm glad to hear this. I always hate disarming tracks I'm not using for fear that I might forget to re-arm it for a later scene where i need that input. These are the small but influential reasons I would have loved to have a mentor slip me this bit of knowledge one day on set. @@onseteducation921