My uncle (Grandmas Brother) was on the SS Bradley when it sank. Floyd A MacDougall. You can see him at 10:21. Obviously, I never got to meet him since he passed long before I was born. But it is still interesting to be watching a video and see someone that you are related too.
Thank you for making this video, its nice to see somebody keeping the memories alive and telling the story. My uncle Alfred Pilarski (2nd cook) went down on this ship (thankfully his was one of the recovered bodies) and one of the 2 survivors is an extended family member Frank Mayes. The other survivor Elmer Flemming was a close family friend. My mother (Alfreds sister) will talk about it like it was yesterday when asked, which is quite an accomplishment since she just turned 92. She still has quite a few memorial items that she's held onto. I also have 2 other extended relatives that went down on the Great lakes. Alfreds brother Clarence once told me on a visit to the memorial in Rogers City that the Great Lakes are an unforgiving mistress, and he was so right.
The Great Lakes should always be treated with respect. The lakes can get as rough as an ocean and just as deadly. Much respect to all those who make their livings on them. Thank you, Simon for doing a video about The Bradley.
One winter day my uncle, Bud Ladd, invited my father and I to visit a boat he was working on down at Jones Island. He was a welder for US Steel and was working on the keel. Milwaukee didn't have a dry dock so the whole ship had been pulled up on shore and braced. We climbed up wooden stairs and scaffolding then through a huge hole that had been cut in the side for engine work. We went through an open hatch into the enormous hold to another hatch which eventually led to the keel. My uncle said this ship and it's sister were the worst built boats on the lakes and explained there should be " keelsons" welded to the keel but this area was filled with scrap steel and rust. He showed us the crack in the keel he was plating over and said it was the third time he'd had to do it and said the ship would only last a few more years and would probably sink and take eveyone with it. It was the Fitzgerald. There' s all this speculation about why it sank but I think it just fell apart. I can't help but wonder how many other lake boats that went down suffered from poor construction or maintenance.
Unfortunately vessels of the great lakes have a reputation for being overloaded, or loaded poorly, most people dont know that the loading of vessels is a science in itself, and doing it wrong will cause hard to detect damage.. when loading a vessel bending moment (bm) torsion moment (tm) and shear force (sf) should be taken into account most seagoing vessels use loading computers to calculate the loading conditions.. setting out with a bm, tm or sf over the safe limit (referred to as 100% or redline) will cause the hull to degrade, it's very unusual that this will cause an accident the first time.. but over time it will cause a vessels hull to degrade to such an extend that failure becomes more and more likely.. hogging in itself is not much of an issue unless it exceeds the limit, same for sagging..
Thank you. I like reading little snippets like this of a personal history that touches other larger events. Every person that passes on we lose so many of these little snippets.
For what it's worth, after the sinking of the Fitz the union my uncle belonged to brought up hundreds of substandard repairs and working conditions on the lakers and presented it to the Coast Gaurd. It was summarily dismissed on objections from the companies that the report was biased and one sided. The Coast gaurd shares a lot blame for inspecting and signing off on the repairs and inspections.
I grew up right on the shore of Lake Michigan; dad was a maritime photographer and historian. I heard plenty of tales of shipwrecks, and travelled all over the Lakes visiting different ports and passages in my youth. Few people today realize just how important Great Lakes shipping is to the US and Canadian economies.
I grew up in a house across the road from Lake Ontario, watching storms between the houses from my bedroom was always awe inspiring. I still remember a bolt of lightning travelling skyward from the lake surface, and meeting up with another descending from the sky, my sister and I looked at each other with a “wtf? You saw that, too??” look. I still live a few blocks away from the lake. When I go see some family members on the far east side of Toronto, I always catch a glimpse of at least one freighter in the docks.
I live in Oshawa, which is a port on lake Ontario. It doesn't get a lot of traffic, but there is usually at least one ship unloading road salt or building materials in the harbour.
#sideprojects I grew up in Rogers City my whole life. I live only two blocks away from the Carl d Bradley museum. There has been a lot of local books and biographies made on this. It is really flattering seeing you using your platform to give a little bit of light on this horrific story. People don't realize that the Carl d Bradley was only one of I believe five ships that were stationed out of port calcite. The last one from that fleet is still in operation today and it is known as the Munson. People don't realize that the last survivor Frank Mays was called a liar when he told everybody that he saw the ship splitting to. It took them years I believe all the way up until 1996 I believe when they actually found out for sure when they did a dive on the shipwreck itself. Cuz you have to realize insurance companies at that time if it was caused by nature of the sinking of the ship then they didn't have to pay out as much to the families on if it was from neglect from the company.
@@hauptmann6 I am distantly related to the darga's in Posen. It's a pretty small county but those guys would be very distant relation. My mom and my dad's mom are both from posen
My grandfather was a Merchant Marine on the Great Lakes. We used to go fossil hunting in Roger City, and spend summers on Lake Superior near Whitefish Point. The year the Fitzgerald sank Grandpa ran to the shore ahead of us to make sure no bodies has washed up. He had a serious respect for the lakes.
My Great Grandfather was Captain of the SS Spartan and SS Badger. He said that storms on Lake Michigan would kick up with very little notice and could be extremely violent.
Most of my family is from the Ludington area. My brother worked on the Badger and recalled waves in a storm reaching windows two stories above the waterline. I wouldn’t be surprised if my grandparents had waved at your great grandpa leaving Pere Marquette more than a few times.
Simon, born Michigander here and you are honestly handling most of these pronunciations much better than the average person in any of our neighboring states. Bravo! They can be tough for a lot of people because they’re mostly either French or Native American really.
Simon, thank you for making this video. This means the world to me. The Bradley does not get the recognition she deserves as the queen of the lakes and massive tragedy it was. Rogers city had widows on every street. 53 children lost their fathers. One of the two survivors, Frank Mays wrote a book called “If we make it till daylight”. I live in the area, we remember her and those who were lost. Rest In Peace Bernard Schefke.
Our family took a trip on the ore freighter William Clay Ford. The bow would be at the top of a wave as the rear was at the bottom. Tremendous noise while loading. Unloaded we played baseball in the empty ore hold. Amazing trip from Ford Rouge plant to Rogers City Michigan
Lake superior is crazy and can change its mind quickly. I live in lower Michigan and one weekend I was watching the news and they showed 12 foot plus waves on the lake. Looking to get some pictures I loaded up my camera and drove 6 hours to the area shown on the news. When I got there the lake was smooth as glass not a wave in sight. It was beautiful and eerie at the same time.
a lot can change in six hours, I also live in Michigan and am in awe of the great lakes and fascinated with shipwreck lore, it almost feels like the lakes are supernatural, I have been on erie, huron, michigan and superior and they are all truly amazing
I grew up along the detriot river and saw freighters almost daily in the summer. But now living in Charlevoix it's terrifying how powerful Lake Michigan is. There's sudden fog, random storms and it just comes out of nowhere it's terrifying.
As someone from Michigan, (and someone who had a family friend from the Ojibwa Indian reservation in Canada who would take me on a boat as a kid and jump the wake of freighters as they passed by), I really appreciate the fact that these stories and places are getting such a well researched and prominent video to tell the stories of the local history.
When I was a kid, my uncle was the captain of a Great Lakes freighter, the S. S. Manitoba. When he was about to enter the St. Clair river at Port Huron, he would let my mother know and we would drive over and wave as his ship went by. He would sound the ship's whistle and wave back from the ship's bridge. We thought that was so cool at the time. By the way, The St. Clair River flows into Lake St. Clair which ends up draining into the Detroit River (which is actually a strait) and it is the Detroit River that flows into Lake Erie, not the St. Clair River.
@@mta4562 I Love that book. I learned all about the geography of the Great lakes from it as a kid. Since that time I've spent most of my life in locations overlooking Lake Ontario and Lake Superior.
I watch the memorial for the Edmund Fitzgerald every year. I didn't have any physical connection to the ship. It's a Michigan thing. I have to offer a little help in pronunciation. First Charlevoix is Shar-la-voy. The other is little harder. It's Huron, pronounced Here-on. I really like watching videos about our beautiful state. You do great work. Thank you!!!
Tragic story, well done as always. I grew up in Charleroix, with the Sundew nestled in Round Lake. To all correcting Simon’s pronunciation, give it a rest. It’s a challenging mouthful of vowels and consonants, heartening to hear it mentioned no matter how.
your one of my favorite history guys and thank you for covering some of the Michigan ship wrecks!!! I am a life long Michigander and love seeing our stories told. Thank you
There's a video up on RUclips called Shipwrecks of the Great Lakes, where they cover multiple wrecks, including the Bradley. One of the guys interviewed was telling a story about how there was a speaker at some sort of ship related meeting, and he was discussing ships that had been overworked and poorly maintained, and the ship he used as his example, was the Carl D. Bradley. And this was roughly 10 years before the Bradley tore in half.
@@Bewolf He sure did. Nobody told him it is the Upper Peninsula not the up Peninsula. Though I sometimes wonder if Simon make errors on purpose just so wise asses like me write a comment to correct him. Must be hard to deal with the Native American names. Funny to hear uniformed people try to pronounce Wayzata and many others.
Well he did better than Alexi in pronouncing Charlevoix. But I think his pronunciation of 'Manitowoc' was a syllable short. At least he didn't say 'Mack-i-nack' lol
My Great Uncle was on the Bradley. He didn't make it, but fortunately, his body was recovered and brought home. This was absolutely devastating to such a small area. Everyone lost a brother, father, uncle or son.
Folks have NO idea how big these lakes really are... They contain 20 percent of the world's surface fresh water and 90 percent of North America's surface fresh water. If the water were evenly distributed over the entire continent's land area, it would reach a depth of 5 feet (1.5 meters). This is enough water to cover the 48 contiguous U.S. states to a uniform depth of 9.5 feet (2.9 m). Think about that!!!
I had to look it up in Loyd's and cross reference the vessel in Jane's. The vessel description is a rocking, rolling, bucket of rusty razor blades. Seamen have a marvelously descriptive way of describing things.
I knew Dr. Ratigan who wrote a somewhat definitive book on the subjects, "Great Lakes Shipwrecks and Survivors". Covered this an many other Great Lake disasters.
I grew up on Lake Michigan and live close to Lake Erie, just out of flood. I respect those lakes. Too many ships have gone down and the waves are tremendous during a storm. I love my state and the lakes. Respect!
Great vlog as always! How about the story of flight NW2501 from LGA-MSP? The DC-4 crashed during a thunderstorm in to Lake Michigan. To this day the aircraft has not been found…
Really interesting- as a 70s Canadian kid with a dad who liked Gordon Lightfoot [I've grown partial to him as well], I certainly heard about the Edmund Fitzgerald, and I occasionally tune in to yet another documentary or article on that loss. I had not been aware of the Carl D. Bradley. Yet another casualty of November weather on the lakes and another 33 men lost. A tragedy too for Rogers City- so often in seafaring, whole towns are dedicated to some enterprise that sends men out, and whole communities can be shattered on one night. Nothing good about it, but it puts those people in good company with every merchant or fishing port in the world at one time or another.
I spent a fair amount of my youth on Lake St. Clair fish with my Dad. The Great Lakes freighters were usually seen while fishing the American side of the lake. When fishing close to the shipping channel, I was intimidated by the immense 600 foot size of these freighters. The majority of the modern Great Lakes freighters now exceed 1,000 feet. Port Huron, Michigan is a good place to watch the comings and goings of these massive freighters.
I grew up in St Clair mi on the St Clair river near Port Huron and the blue water bridge seeing these freighters pass between Michigan and Canada my whole childhood. Us local kids jumped off the dock a swam and loved the waves these things caused especially right at the dock.
12:30 "Too little, too late" not just for the Bradley, but for the Daniel J Morrell also. Though I believe the 1968 recommendation was a consequence of the Morrell sinking. It's so tragically unnecessary.
Steep Rock Iron Mine, near Atikokan, Ontario was a joint effort between Canada and USA to provide USA with high-grade iron ore during WWII. The project itself was unparalleled at the time (6ocean dredges working in the middle of the continent through all seasons), and produced technological advancements as well as millions of tonnes of iron that eventually helped fuel the Detroit auto revolution. I really wish you would tackle this on one of your million channels Simon!
Since we're on the topic of ship sinkings, how about a video on the sinking of the Pamir? It pretty much marked the end of the use of sailing ships for cargo.
Born and raised in Port Huron, Michigan where Lake Huron empties into the Saint Clair River. Great Lakes Shipping and Shipwatching was a big deal especially in the 50's and 60's.
I have done a lot of wild things in my seventy plus years and jumped from hundreds of planes but this (death in the water) was my greatest fear. I don’t know why but it’s just always been like this. This story really got me. I’ve been only aircraft carriers and I was probably that guy who was the most uncomfortable. I wish you all the very best
When i was younger, my dad worked at one of the big steel mills in Chicago. For a number of years he'd make a trip every summer on one of the big cargo ships carrying iron ore down from Lake Superior to Chicago. I thought that sounded so exciting as a kid, never realizing it was actually so dangerous!
no watertight bulkheads on Bradley. just a collision bulkhead forward. right at the beginning of the spar deck. the massive cargo holds only had metal mesh or screen bulkheads to save weight. interesting side note: deck watchman Gary Strzlecki (sp?) was on the raft until early morning when he decided to swim away due to hypothermia. about an hour later the two survivors were rescued. a freighter called the Transontario picked him up and he still had a weak pulse. they radioed the coast guard for a doctor and the only one they could find was an 80 y/o doctor who they were going to lower from a helicopter onto the heaving deck of the ship. the doctor got on the chopper and suited up and while hovering over the Transontario, they radioed that he died. so, the plan was cancelled.
The picture of the family at 9:35 is my Mom’s Uncle’s family. My mom’s Uncle, Joseph Krawczak, was among those who lost their lives when the Bradley went down.
I live just a few hours from the home port and I’ve never heard this story! Also it’s funny to me to hear Simon say Charlevoix like “char-le-voi” instead of us Michiganders who say SHAR LA VOY! Lolol
I’m from Sturgeon Bay, Wi. You could have a LOT of fun going thru it’s history of ship yards. The canal as a project. Also you’d enjoy going over the contested history page f the freight shipping containers and how it was invented in sturgeon bay but most people attribute the invention to patent thieves.
Having grown up in Marquette MI, I an familiar with the ferocity of those storms which so many people discount relative to ocean storms. Sinking in those waters would be horrifying, but I suppose mercifully short lived.
I remember the song The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald when it was first on the radio. I thought the wreck was years ago, it was years before I found out it happened shortly before the song was released.
VERY interesting that the Carl D. Bradley was equipped with internal watertight bulkheads. The Edmond Fitzgerald had no such bulkheads. Incredibly, the entire cargo hold of the Fitzgerald was one gigantic open space, and it is theorized that had the Fitzgerald been equipped with watertight bulkheads separating its hold into compartments it likely would not have sunk as it did. The Fitzgerald was built 30 years after the Bradley. It is surprising to learn that it was built to less safe standards than its predecessor.
Actually the Fitz had 3 seperate holds, but they were not watertight, only seperated by metal "screens" as were all of the freighters back then and even today. The biggest difference was that most all of the other freighters had 5 or more holds. This may have significantly been a cause of the Fitz sinking as her cargo of taconite could more freely roll forward, causing her to nosedive and be unable to recover.
So i know this maybe a little random but I've been watching Simon for years and subbed to Almost every single channel he hosts. Maybe I don't pay attention too much, but I just noticed how much he speaks with his hands. Lol , You'd think he has some Italian in his gene's with how much he speaks with his hands 😆
I live on the Wisconsin "coast" of Lake Michigan, just a few miles north of Milwaukee. Within 100 miles, both North and South, there have been MANY ship wrecks... with HUNDREDS of deaths: - The Phoenix - 200 lives lost (1847) Sheboygan, Wisconsin - The Lady Elgin - Over 300 lives lost (1860) Winnetka, Illinois - The S.S. Eastland - 844 lives lost (1915) Chicago, Illinois (There is much written about all 3 of the above. As you can imagine, there was MUCH PATHOS and MUCH IRONY with these disasters. And that includes not only with the ship wrecks, themselves, but with the stories associated with the voyage's back grounds. You may want to consider one or ALL of them for a future program?) Those were just the worst. There have been many more with varying loss of life. I have one ship wreck I can paddle to in my kayak, about a mile from my house. And regarding weather: Two days ago the Lake was placid. Yesterday we had 5 foot waves and Coast Guard Warnings to stay away from the shore line.
He guessed at a “full French” pronunciation. I can give him a break as he’s not local and doesn’t get the weird bastardizations of French English and Native American names we have around here. That and earlier this week I saw a video about the “most haunted places in Michigan” and the listening to the pronunciations there was actually painful.
I know this is 2 months ago and you probably won’t see this. But Charlevoix is pronounced “Shar-le-voy “. I know you pronounced it the French way but as someone who grew up in Michigan, it bugged me, lol great video though 💛
2 questions. 1. If you can, could you do a video on the SS Daniel J Morrell 2. Can you do a video on the AAA class lake freighters. If you head to Wikipedia of the Arthur M Anderson and go to history it says the names of the 8 ships of the class (including Anderson)
@@Bald_Cat2007 No, I worked at a shipyard. There was a guy on our crew who had been on the Fitzgerald, he decided to stay on land. He knew every guy on that ship. No work was done the day after at that shipyard.
It's a callback to the old days. Even with just a few channels, he'd claim to put a link in the description but then forget, or it'd be a rickroll or something.
I just realized how weird it is to hear people actually pronounce the Rogers and City as two separate words haha, we locally just kind of call it "rogercity"
One contributor to a string about the Edmund Fitzgerald said he went aboard the Fitz when it was undergoing maintenence. His uncle was doing welding work deep inside the vessel and invited the young man down to see its "insides". The uncle told him that the Fitz had so many rusty members it would "probably not last long". Bottom Line: It could be that MANY of the Lake cargo vessels had the same corrosion problems. And they were problems that were "just accepted" until, of course, the ships sank for "unknown reasons"?
They are lakes only in name, they are the same size as some inland seas. I grew up on a larger lake (nowhere near the size of the great lakes.) and people would still die on it. The reason for this was that lakes get confused sea syndrome rapidly. On the ocean you can jog on waves, they are parabolic, ride up and down. On lakes those waves hit you from all sides and beat the crap out of you. I remember our lake being perfectly flat and calm and in less than 30 minutes we had whitecaps between 5 and 10' rolling around. Watching 30-40' boats getting tossed and people struggling to make it to dock. With the great lakes those confused seas have 30' waves or larger and it is common during november storms its a nightmare and not to be taken lightly. Anyone who comforts themselves saying its just a lake isn't giving the lakes enough respect.
I find it interesting that you can dive the Carl D Bradley, the Daniel J Morell, and many others in the Great Lakes where lives were lost, but not the Edmund Fitzgerald. Like the Fitz, the Bradley and the Morell must still have family members alive that knew the lost crewmen. I'm not advocating for opening up the Fitz for divers (it's depth makes it too dangerous for almost everyone), I'm just curious what the difference is.
@@thomasdye6424 There is that difference, but wreck dives are quite common in Canadian waters as well. Just doing a quick search I found a ship called Eastcliffe Hall that sank in the St Lawrence Seaway in 1970 with a loss of 9 lives. There's no restriction for diving there. The only thing I can guess as to why the Fitz is off limits is because it's so famous.
Big business as usual not taking responsibility for their actions. They lied, together with the CG, and denied what the survivors claimed. The ship was in two but at least they didnt have to properly compensate the families
LESSSSSSGOOOOOO shoutout michigang and my 989 bois especially💯 edit also scrolling this comment section reads like a lakeside campfire at midnight in mid july. if you know, you know.
They're huge, to go from say Toronto Ontario around the lakes to go out west takes about an 19 hour drive, it also takes about 19 hours to get from Ontario to Nova Scotia
Charleviox is pronounced "Shar-luh-voy". Much like Ft Michilimackinac, or the Mackinac bridge,or Mackinaw City (pronounced the same way), it's not pronounced like the French would have said it. "Mack-in-aww"
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My uncle (Grandmas Brother) was on the SS Bradley when it sank. Floyd A MacDougall. You can see him at 10:21. Obviously, I never got to meet him since he passed long before I was born. But it is still interesting to be watching a video and see someone that you are related too.
Thank you for making this video, its nice to see somebody keeping the memories alive and telling the story. My uncle Alfred Pilarski (2nd cook) went down on this ship (thankfully his was one of the recovered bodies) and one of the 2 survivors is an extended family member Frank Mayes. The other survivor Elmer Flemming was a close family friend. My mother (Alfreds sister) will talk about it like it was yesterday when asked, which is quite an accomplishment since she just turned 92. She still has quite a few memorial items that she's held onto. I also have 2 other extended relatives that went down on the Great lakes. Alfreds brother Clarence once told me on a visit to the memorial in Rogers City that the Great Lakes are an unforgiving mistress, and he was so right.
The Great Lakes should always be treated with respect. The lakes can get as rough as an ocean and just as deadly. Much respect to all those who make their livings on them. Thank you, Simon for doing a video about The Bradley.
One winter day my uncle, Bud Ladd, invited my father and I to visit a boat he was working on down at Jones Island. He was a welder for US Steel and was working on the keel. Milwaukee didn't have a dry dock so the whole ship had been pulled up on shore and braced. We climbed up wooden stairs and scaffolding then through a huge hole that had been cut in the side for engine work. We went through an open hatch into the enormous hold to another hatch which eventually led to the keel. My uncle said this ship and it's sister were the worst built boats on the lakes and explained there should be " keelsons" welded to the keel but this area was filled with scrap steel and rust. He showed us the crack in the keel he was plating over and said it was the third time he'd had to do it and said the ship would only last a few more years and would probably sink and take eveyone with it. It was the Fitzgerald. There' s all this speculation about why it sank but I think it just fell apart. I can't help but wonder how many other lake boats that went down suffered from poor construction or maintenance.
9999.9 99.9 p
Unfortunately vessels of the great lakes have a reputation for being overloaded, or loaded poorly, most people dont know that the loading of vessels is a science in itself, and doing it wrong will cause hard to detect damage.. when loading a vessel bending moment (bm) torsion moment (tm) and shear force (sf) should be taken into account most seagoing vessels use loading computers to calculate the loading conditions.. setting out with a bm, tm or sf over the safe limit (referred to as 100% or redline) will cause the hull to degrade, it's very unusual that this will cause an accident the first time.. but over time it will cause a vessels hull to degrade to such an extend that failure becomes more and more likely.. hogging in itself is not much of an issue unless it exceeds the limit, same for sagging..
Thank you. I like reading little snippets like this of a personal history that touches other larger events. Every person that passes on we lose so many of these little snippets.
It infuriates me that these companies are so willfully negligent as to keep endangering their crews like that simply for the sake of profit.
For what it's worth, after the sinking of the Fitz the union my uncle belonged to brought up hundreds of substandard repairs and working conditions on the lakers and presented it to the Coast Gaurd. It was summarily dismissed on objections from the companies that the report was biased and one sided. The Coast gaurd shares a lot blame for inspecting and signing off on the repairs and inspections.
I grew up right on the shore of Lake Michigan; dad was a maritime photographer and historian. I heard plenty of tales of shipwrecks, and travelled all over the Lakes visiting different ports and passages in my youth. Few people today realize just how important Great Lakes shipping is to the US and Canadian economies.
That's awesome. I live in Michigan, and I've always been fascinated by our maritime history.
I grew up in a house across the road from Lake Ontario, watching storms between the houses from my bedroom was always awe inspiring. I still remember a bolt of lightning travelling skyward from the lake surface, and meeting up with another descending from the sky, my sister and I looked at each other with a “wtf? You saw that, too??” look. I still live a few blocks away from the lake.
When I go see some family members on the far east side of Toronto, I always catch a glimpse of at least one freighter in the docks.
I have always lived in Ontario, surrounded by 3 of the lakes and now live and see the st Lawrence everday. Its a massive system
I used to live in Superior, WI and spent most of my free time on, in or extremely near the lake. I remain amazed just how immense the system is.
I live in Oshawa, which is a port on lake Ontario. It doesn't get a lot of traffic, but there is usually at least one ship unloading road salt or building materials in the harbour.
#sideprojects I grew up in Rogers City my whole life. I live only two blocks away from the Carl d Bradley museum. There has been a lot of local books and biographies made on this. It is really flattering seeing you using your platform to give a little bit of light on this horrific story. People don't realize that the Carl d Bradley was only one of I believe five ships that were stationed out of port calcite. The last one from that fleet is still in operation today and it is known as the Munson. People don't realize that the last survivor Frank Mays was called a liar when he told everybody that he saw the ship splitting to. It took them years I believe all the way up until 1996 I believe when they actually found out for sure when they did a dive on the shipwreck itself. Cuz you have to realize insurance companies at that time if it was caused by nature of the sinking of the ship then they didn't have to pay out as much to the families on if it was from neglect from the company.
Hi Tom! There's a last name I haven't heard of in a while. My step grandma was a Darga from Posen.
@@hauptmann6 I am distantly related to the darga's in Posen. It's a pretty small county but those guys would be very distant relation. My mom and my dad's mom are both from posen
My grandfather was a Merchant Marine on the Great Lakes. We used to go fossil hunting in Roger City, and spend summers on Lake Superior near Whitefish Point. The year the Fitzgerald sank Grandpa ran to the shore ahead of us to make sure no bodies has washed up. He had a serious respect for the lakes.
My Great Grandfather was Captain of the SS Spartan and SS Badger. He said that storms on Lake Michigan would kick up with very little notice and could be extremely violent.
Most of my family is from the Ludington area. My brother worked on the Badger and recalled waves in a storm reaching windows two stories above the waterline. I wouldn’t be surprised if my grandparents had waved at your great grandpa leaving Pere Marquette more than a few times.
Simon, born Michigander here and you are honestly handling most of these pronunciations much better than the average person in any of our neighboring states. Bravo! They can be tough for a lot of people because they’re mostly either French or Native American really.
I'm a fellow michigander too my ancestors are French Canadian
Simon, thank you for making this video. This means the world to me. The Bradley does not get the recognition she deserves as the queen of the lakes and massive tragedy it was. Rogers city had widows on every street. 53 children lost their fathers. One of the two survivors, Frank Mays wrote a book called “If we make it till daylight”. I live in the area, we remember her and those who were lost.
Rest In Peace Bernard Schefke.
Our family took a trip on the ore freighter William Clay Ford. The bow would be at the top of a wave as the rear was at the bottom. Tremendous noise while loading. Unloaded we played baseball in the empty ore hold. Amazing trip from Ford Rouge plant to Rogers City Michigan
Lake superior is crazy and can change its mind quickly. I live in lower Michigan and one weekend I was watching the news and they showed 12 foot plus waves on the lake. Looking to get some pictures I loaded up my camera and drove 6 hours to the area shown on the news. When I got there the lake was smooth as glass not a wave in sight. It was beautiful and eerie at the same time.
Amazing.
It is because of the fury that smooth surface hides.
a lot can change in six hours, I also live in Michigan and am in awe of the great lakes and fascinated with shipwreck lore, it almost feels like the lakes are supernatural, I have been on erie, huron, michigan and superior and they are all truly amazing
Superior never gives up her dead
I grew up along the detriot river and saw freighters almost daily in the summer. But now living in Charlevoix it's terrifying how powerful Lake Michigan is. There's sudden fog, random storms and it just comes out of nowhere it's terrifying.
As someone from Michigan, (and someone who had a family friend from the Ojibwa Indian reservation in Canada who would take me on a boat as a kid and jump the wake of freighters as they passed by), I really appreciate the fact that these stories and places are getting such a well researched and prominent video to tell the stories of the local history.
I was live in Elberta, Michigan listening to an old E.M. shortwave military radio the night she went down.
When I was a kid, my uncle was the captain of a Great Lakes freighter, the S. S. Manitoba. When he was about to enter the St. Clair river at Port Huron, he would let my mother know and we would drive over and wave as his ship went by. He would sound the ship's whistle and wave back from the ship's bridge. We thought that was so cool at the time.
By the way, The St. Clair River flows into Lake St. Clair which ends up draining into the Detroit River (which is actually a strait) and it is the Detroit River that flows into Lake Erie, not the St. Clair River.
I know that, I read "Paddle to the sea".
@@mta4562 I Love that book. I learned all about the geography of the Great lakes from it as a kid. Since that time I've spent most of my life in locations overlooking Lake Ontario and Lake Superior.
I watch the memorial for the Edmund Fitzgerald every year. I didn't have any physical connection to the ship. It's a Michigan thing. I have to offer a little help in pronunciation. First Charlevoix is Shar-la-voy. The other is little harder. It's Huron, pronounced Here-on. I really like watching videos about our beautiful state. You do great work. Thank you!!!
Tragic story, well done as always. I grew up in Charleroix, with the Sundew nestled in Round Lake. To all correcting Simon’s pronunciation, give it a rest. It’s a challenging mouthful of vowels and consonants, heartening to hear it mentioned no matter how.
your one of my favorite history guys and thank you for covering some of the Michigan ship wrecks!!! I am a life long Michigander and love seeing our stories told. Thank you
There's a video up on RUclips called Shipwrecks of the Great Lakes, where they cover multiple wrecks, including the Bradley. One of the guys interviewed was telling a story about how there was a speaker at some sort of ship related meeting, and he was discussing ships that had been overworked and poorly maintained, and the ship he used as his example, was the Carl D. Bradley. And this was roughly 10 years before the Bradley tore in half.
5:36 has me dyyyying 😂 hailing from MN, I hadn’t really realized how different & difficult some city names really are in the midwest 🤪
Did he say the "up" peninsula? 😂
I came here because of that 😂
He did pretty well on manitowoc. Would love to hear him try Oconomowoc...
@@Bewolf
He sure did. Nobody told him it is the Upper Peninsula not the up Peninsula.
Though I sometimes wonder if Simon make errors on purpose just so wise asses like me write a comment to correct him. Must be hard to deal with the Native American names. Funny to hear uniformed people try to pronounce Wayzata and many others.
Well he did better than Alexi in pronouncing Charlevoix. But I think his pronunciation of 'Manitowoc' was a syllable short. At least he didn't say 'Mack-i-nack' lol
I live in Manistique, MI and our town has a small memorial at a roadside park for the Carl D Bradley since it sank off the coast of our town.
My Great Uncle was on the Bradley. He didn't make it, but fortunately, his body was recovered and brought home. This was absolutely devastating to such a small area. Everyone lost a brother, father, uncle or son.
I live just a few minutes south of Rogers City, its weird to hear our little towns mentioned on a channel this size.
Folks have NO idea how big these lakes really are...
They contain 20 percent of the world's surface fresh water and 90 percent of North America's surface fresh water.
If the water were evenly distributed over the entire continent's land area, it would reach a depth of 5 feet (1.5 meters). This is enough water to cover the 48 contiguous U.S. states to a uniform depth of 9.5 feet (2.9 m).
Think about that!!!
Sounds damp
I had to look it up in Loyd's and cross reference the vessel in Jane's. The vessel description is a rocking, rolling, bucket of rusty razor blades. Seamen have a marvelously descriptive way of describing things.
I knew Dr. Ratigan who wrote a somewhat definitive book on the subjects, "Great Lakes Shipwrecks and Survivors". Covered this an many other Great Lake disasters.
I grew up on Lake Michigan and live close to Lake Erie, just out of flood. I respect those lakes. Too many ships have gone down and the waves are tremendous during a storm. I love my state and the lakes. Respect!
This was great to hear you cover a ship based out of calcite in RC. I grew up in the area.
Can we get a Podcast feed of all your videos in audio form?! So many to cover. All awesome.
Great vlog as always! How about the story of flight NW2501 from LGA-MSP? The DC-4 crashed during a thunderstorm in to Lake Michigan. To this day the aircraft has not been found…
One of the 2 survivors, Frank Mays, wrote a very good book about the event
Simon talking about shipwrecks is the thing I need in my life.
Really interesting- as a 70s Canadian kid with a dad who liked Gordon Lightfoot [I've grown partial to him as well], I certainly heard about the Edmund Fitzgerald, and I occasionally tune in to yet another documentary or article on that loss. I had not been aware of the Carl D. Bradley. Yet another casualty of November weather on the lakes and another 33 men lost. A tragedy too for Rogers City- so often in seafaring, whole towns are dedicated to some enterprise that sends men out, and whole communities can be shattered on one night. Nothing good about it, but it puts those people in good company with every merchant or fishing port in the world at one time or another.
Thank you for sharing. I had never heard of the Bradley.
I spent a fair amount of my youth on Lake St. Clair fish with my Dad. The Great Lakes freighters were usually seen while fishing the American side of the lake. When fishing close to the shipping channel, I was intimidated by the immense 600 foot size of these freighters. The majority of the modern Great Lakes freighters now exceed 1,000 feet. Port Huron, Michigan is a good place to watch the comings and goings of these massive freighters.
I grew up in St Clair mi on the St Clair river near Port Huron and the blue water bridge seeing these freighters pass between Michigan and Canada my whole childhood. Us local kids jumped off the dock a swam and loved the waves these things caused especially right at the dock.
12:30 "Too little, too late" not just for the Bradley, but for the Daniel J Morrell also. Though I believe the 1968 recommendation was a consequence of the Morrell sinking. It's so tragically unnecessary.
Steep Rock Iron Mine, near Atikokan, Ontario was a joint effort between Canada and USA to provide USA with high-grade iron ore during WWII. The project itself was unparalleled at the time (6ocean dredges working in the middle of the continent through all seasons), and produced technological advancements as well as millions of tonnes of iron that eventually helped fuel the Detroit auto revolution. I really wish you would tackle this on one of your million channels Simon!
Perhaps that cement manufacturer in Gary, Indiana was U.S. Steel's, Universal Atlas Cement.
Since we're on the topic of ship sinkings, how about a video on the sinking of the Pamir? It pretty much marked the end of the use of sailing ships for cargo.
Born and raised in Port Huron, Michigan where Lake Huron empties into the Saint Clair River. Great Lakes Shipping and Shipwatching was a big deal especially in the 50's and 60's.
Another trip back home. Thanks Simon.
EDIT: Charlevoix is pronounced "Shar-Lee-Voy". Damn French-Canadian words.
Always love stories from The Great Lakes. We pronounce the town like voyage; Char-le-voix (SHÄR-lə-VOI), by the way.
Great discussion. But we born here pronounce it 'Char-le-voi' with 3 clear syllables. My folks remember the Bradley disaster and the Sundew going out.
I have done a lot of wild things in my seventy plus years and jumped from hundreds of planes but this (death in the water) was my greatest fear. I don’t know why but it’s just always been like this. This story really got me. I’ve been only aircraft carriers and I was probably that guy who was the most uncomfortable. I wish you all the very best
When i was younger, my dad worked at one of the big steel mills in Chicago. For a number of years he'd make a trip every summer on one of the big cargo ships carrying iron ore down from Lake Superior to Chicago. I thought that sounded so exciting as a kid, never realizing it was actually so dangerous!
I learned something today!
Broncos vs Titans today. 2 things, also your name is cool.
If you can, and haven't dond one already. A video on the Daniel J. Morrel would be awesome!
no watertight bulkheads on Bradley. just a collision bulkhead forward. right at the beginning of the spar deck. the massive cargo holds only had metal mesh or screen bulkheads to save weight. interesting side note: deck watchman Gary Strzlecki (sp?) was on the raft until early morning when he decided to swim away due to hypothermia. about an hour later the two survivors were rescued. a freighter called the Transontario picked him up and he still had a weak pulse. they radioed the coast guard for a doctor and the only one they could find was an 80 y/o doctor who they were going to lower from a helicopter onto the heaving deck of the ship. the doctor got on the chopper and suited up and while hovering over the Transontario, they radioed that he died. so, the plan was cancelled.
The picture of the family at 9:35 is my Mom’s Uncle’s family. My mom’s Uncle, Joseph Krawczak, was among those who lost their lives when the Bradley went down.
Simon is so good at fixing blame.
That… is one hell of an interesting way to pronounce Manitowoc (Man-eih-tow-woc)
🤣
You've got to use your best Midwestern accent. Plug your nose and say Maaahn-it-ta-waaak. This works with Wisconsin: Wis-caahn-sin.
Manitowoc is properly pronounced.. "MAN-ih-Toh-waak". You got Mackinac right! :) "MAK-In-aw".
I live just a few hours from the home port and I’ve never heard this story! Also it’s funny to me to hear Simon say Charlevoix like “char-le-voi” instead of us Michiganders who say SHAR LA VOY! Lolol
1:20 - Chapter 1 - Background
4:00 - Chapter 2 - Previous incidents
5:20 - Chapter 3 - Final voyage
8:40 - Chapter 4 - Search and rescue
10:30 - Chapter 5 - Investigations & recommendations
12:55 - Chapter 6 - Settlement
13:30 - Chapter 7 - Legacy
Brilliantly told story (and surprisingly precisely mirroring the source ;) )
I’m from Sturgeon Bay, Wi. You could have a LOT of fun going thru it’s history of ship yards. The canal as a project. Also you’d enjoy going over the contested history page f the freight shipping containers and how it was invented in sturgeon bay but most people attribute the invention to patent thieves.
Good video 👍
I grew up a 15min ride from lake superior in the U.P. of Michigan. Beautiful and I miss it, but not the winters lol
Also, man-it-toe-wok. 😆
HEY YA U PER!
20 yoopers on a pontoon boat
Fishing for Moby Dick
Da wife she tinks I'm working
Da boss he tinks I'm sick
Say ya to da UP eh. I miss pastys
Hopefully you still live in Michigan. From a troll.
The st clair river is actually between lake huron and lake st clair. The detroit river is from lake st clair to lake erie
So many great places to take Ship wreck tours on the Great Lakes. I commened you on the pronunciations even people who live here get it wrong.
Daniel J Morrell next please. And her sister who broke up while being towed and sank 400 miles south of newfoundland. (Aka the Titanics neighborhood)
Never heard of this. Thanks
Having grown up in Marquette MI, I an familiar with the ferocity of those storms which so many people discount relative to ocean storms. Sinking in those waters would be horrifying, but I suppose mercifully short lived.
Have pasty for me.
Thank you
I remember the song The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald when it was first on the radio. I thought the wreck was years ago, it was years before I found out it happened shortly before the song was released.
VERY interesting that the Carl D. Bradley was equipped with internal watertight bulkheads. The Edmond Fitzgerald had no such bulkheads. Incredibly, the entire cargo hold of the Fitzgerald was one gigantic open space, and it is theorized that had the Fitzgerald been equipped with watertight bulkheads separating its hold into compartments it likely would not have sunk as it did. The Fitzgerald was built 30 years after the Bradley. It is surprising to learn that it was built to less safe standards than its predecessor.
Actually the Fitz had 3 seperate holds, but they were not watertight, only seperated by metal "screens" as were all of the freighters back then and even today.
The biggest difference was that most all of the other freighters had 5 or more holds.
This may have significantly been a cause of the Fitz sinking as her cargo of taconite could more freely roll forward, causing her to nosedive and be unable to recover.
So i know this maybe a little random but I've been watching Simon for years and subbed to Almost every single channel he hosts. Maybe I don't pay attention too much, but I just noticed how much he speaks with his hands. Lol , You'd think he has some Italian in his gene's with how much he speaks with his hands 😆
Well, you did the Bradly and the Fitz, now do the Morrell and the Cedarville.
You've covered the Bradley and the Fitz, now you aught to cover the Daniel J. Morell
Yes!
Last time I was this early it was still around
The golden Gate killer would be a good one for ur other videos and the titan ship missing would be cool to hear about
I live on the Wisconsin "coast" of Lake Michigan, just a few miles north of Milwaukee. Within 100 miles, both North and South, there have been MANY ship wrecks... with HUNDREDS of deaths:
- The Phoenix - 200 lives lost (1847) Sheboygan, Wisconsin
- The Lady Elgin - Over 300 lives lost (1860) Winnetka, Illinois
- The S.S. Eastland - 844 lives lost (1915) Chicago, Illinois
(There is much written about all 3 of the above. As you can imagine, there was MUCH PATHOS and MUCH IRONY with these disasters. And that includes not only with the ship wrecks, themselves, but with the stories associated with the voyage's back grounds. You may want to consider one or ALL of them for a future program?)
Those were just the worst. There have been many more with varying loss of life. I have one ship wreck I can paddle to in my kayak, about a mile from my house. And regarding weather: Two days ago the Lake was placid. Yesterday we had 5 foot waves and Coast Guard Warnings to stay away from the shore line.
So the largest loss in the title means financial loss?
I was so proud of your pronunciation of Mackinac, Simon...but then it took me a second (and the name on the screen) to recognize Manitowoc. 🤣
Lmao love that pronunciation of Manitowoc. Gatta give weyauwega or Oconomowoc a try!
I love Simon's pronunciation of Charlevoix. It sounds so fancy and pretentious.
I’m dying! 🤣😄🤣😄
He guessed at a “full French” pronunciation. I can give him a break as he’s not local and doesn’t get the weird bastardizations of French English and Native American names we have around here. That and earlier this week I saw a video about the “most haunted places in Michigan” and the listening to the pronunciations there was actually painful.
I know this is 2 months ago and you probably won’t see this. But Charlevoix is pronounced “Shar-le-voy “. I know you pronounced it the French way but as someone who grew up in Michigan, it bugged me, lol great video though 💛
Keep er movin!
2 questions.
1. If you can, could you do a video on the SS Daniel J Morrell
2. Can you do a video on the AAA class lake freighters. If you head to Wikipedia of the Arthur M Anderson and go to history it says the names of the 8 ships of the class (including Anderson)
I was a boilermaker / pipefitter at Fraser Shipyards in the 1970's. The Anderson was the first ship I ever worked on.
@@66block84 that's cool were you on her the night the fitz went down
@@Bald_Cat2007 No, I worked at a shipyard. There was a guy on our crew who had been on the Fitzgerald, he decided to stay on land. He knew every guy on that ship. No work was done the day after at that shipyard.
@@66block84 oh sorry I misunderstood 😅
Great video. The city names being spoken incorrectly caused issues, but other than that. Great video
ive lived in lorain ohio my whole life ,, shipbuilding is in our blood.
Experts - "This needs serious work, it will sink."
US Steel - "Nah, it's fiiiiiine, nothing to see here!!!"
**ship sinks**
Experts - "Told you so!!!"
US Steel- "No one could have predicted this terrible accident!"
Simon, How come you mention links on the screen, but the links are never for the video's you are talking about?
It's a callback to the old days. Even with just a few channels, he'd claim to put a link in the description but then forget, or it'd be a rickroll or something.
I just realized how weird it is to hear people actually pronounce the Rogers and City as two separate words haha, we locally just kind of call it "rogercity"
One contributor to a string about the Edmund Fitzgerald said he went aboard the Fitz when it was undergoing maintenence. His uncle was doing welding work deep inside the vessel and invited the young man down to see its "insides". The uncle told him that the Fitz had so many rusty members it would "probably not last long". Bottom Line: It could be that MANY of the Lake cargo vessels had the same corrosion problems. And they were problems that were "just accepted" until, of course, the ships sank for "unknown reasons"?
As a lifelong michigander was he trying to say Charlevoix?
Took me a minute too
@@stevenessenberg992 you weren't joking about how bad he slaughtered these names
The UP is not pronounced as a word, you say the letters, U P. Folks who live there are called Yoopers
Great video as always. Only issue is pronunciation of man-it-o-woc, WI. WI resident here
They may only be lakes but they are dangerous.
They are lakes only in name, they are the same size as some inland seas. I grew up on a larger lake (nowhere near the size of the great lakes.) and people would still die on it. The reason for this was that lakes get confused sea syndrome rapidly. On the ocean you can jog on waves, they are parabolic, ride up and down. On lakes those waves hit you from all sides and beat the crap out of you. I remember our lake being perfectly flat and calm and in less than 30 minutes we had whitecaps between 5 and 10' rolling around. Watching 30-40' boats getting tossed and people struggling to make it to dock.
With the great lakes those confused seas have 30' waves or larger and it is common during november storms its a nightmare and not to be taken lightly. Anyone who comforts themselves saying its just a lake isn't giving the lakes enough respect.
Where’s the song about this ship…?!
I find it interesting that you can dive the Carl D Bradley, the Daniel J Morell, and many others in the Great Lakes where lives were lost, but not the Edmund Fitzgerald. Like the Fitz, the Bradley and the Morell must still have family members alive that knew the lost crewmen. I'm not advocating for opening up the Fitz for divers (it's depth makes it too dangerous for almost everyone), I'm just curious what the difference is.
The Fitzgerald is in Canadian waters. could that be why no dives are allowed?
@@thomasdye6424 There is that difference, but wreck dives are quite common in Canadian waters as well. Just doing a quick search I found a ship called Eastcliffe Hall that sank in the St Lawrence Seaway in 1970 with a loss of 9 lives. There's no restriction for diving there. The only thing I can guess as to why the Fitz is off limits is because it's so famous.
That does it. It's fate was sealed. The Bradley hosted CORPORATE EVENTS WITH WELL-APPOINTED STATEROOMS!!! Game over.
now do the Edmond Fitzgerald! lol as a Canadian its such a good story
They did one in April. :)
What’s with the “lol”? Nothing even remotely humorous about ships sinking and sailors dying.
Now do the Daniel j Morrell next
Big business as usual not taking responsibility for their actions. They lied, together with the CG, and denied what the survivors claimed. The ship was in two but at least they didnt have to properly compensate the families
LESSSSSSGOOOOOO shoutout michigang and my 989 bois especially💯
edit also scrolling this comment section reads like a lakeside campfire at midnight in mid july. if you know, you know.
List the names of tunes you use plz! There's one I need to know
The lakes travel at 246,000km/s? That's quite fast for an area ;)
They're huge, to go from say Toronto Ontario around the lakes to go out west takes about an 19 hour drive, it also takes about 19 hours to get from Ontario to Nova Scotia
you know when you say your going to link to another video it sure would be nice that you actually do it/
Charleviox is pronounced "Shar-luh-voy". Much like Ft Michilimackinac, or the Mackinac bridge,or Mackinaw City (pronounced the same way), it's not pronounced like the French would have said it. "Mack-in-aww"