Great video, great points, well made! :) :D I'm a 5'8" bloke with a 30" inside leg and I have NEVER had a bike I could "flat foot". As you say, we've never known any different, so, just buy/ride the bike you want to ride!! I've even had bikes I had to get off the seat on one side and stand on one leg with the other leg resting on top of the seat. Just don't stop much!! ;) :D The main thing I think is to plan your stops/parking. ALWAYS park "uphill", "with the camber, try and find a spot where you can ride out forwards, and don't bother obsessing with reversing into a spot, I usually just go in forwards, and reverse out when leaving (and pushing out from being off the bike if need be - who cares what anyone else thinks!! :) ). I also always try and use slopes/cambers to help me go backwards (a bit like having a reverse gear). The leg dangle/swappie thing I too have always had to do, so it's just "normal" for me. Keep up the great work!! :) :D :D P.S. DON'T be temped to put a lowering kit on any bike, ESPECIALLY a sports bike as they usually destroy the handling (depending on your weight though (which is likely to be very low ;) :) ), you might need to soften off the stock suspension on bigger bikes, as they will be setup for a heavier "average" rider, most likely). Also, finally, I don't think ANYONE can actually hold up a "big bike", however tall/strong they are, we ALL are just balancing them, so don't stress over that, either!!
Good points, from a fellow short legged person, I’m 5’2 and about a 26’ inseam. I don’t think you need to flat foot, it’s more about being able to have enough leg to stabilise the bike if you’re caught out and being able to take the weight to stop a tip. And I think people who haven’t experienced not being able to do anything about that when it happens, don’t quite get it. I don’t and haven’t ever flat footed, I learnt on a Honda CB650 and once I was on was okay, and I loved riding it, the only issue I have is road cambers, which I have to be careful with, as a few times I’ve gone to put a foot down, and no ground, and if the weight went past a point I couldn’t hold it up. Pegs were always in my way and I had some fantastic bruises 😂 Absolutely no chance of me waddling a bike, so I always manual handle, and I did a lot of practicing of it. Learning to pick a bike up safely has also been a big one for me too! I have a Harley Nightster, which I love, the centre of gravity is really low and makes it much easier for me. Once I’m more comfortable and experienced I really do want to do some off roading, and I want to try a Pan am, Africa twin or Himalayan 😊
Yeah it's definitely more about how much weight you can hold up! I think like all of us at the start I had some shaky stops where the bike was leaning on one leg more than I would like. Only ever dropped it once from not being able to hold all the weight, and that was in my roundabout accident video 🙂
Definitely, I certainly had a few of those when I was learning, not easing off the brake caused a few nervous foot moments, and I honestly have mastered the tip over elegantly as I’ve had a few. I’ll check that vid out 😊
As a five foot something woman yeah, almost all bikes are "too tall" for me. but i don't care!😝 i decided to ride the bike i want and just learn some extra techniques. i've got a 2002 Klr 650, i can't even put two feet down, but i love that thing and i'm comfortable on it 😄.
Well said, at 5"1' I'm a tiptoe biker too. Had a Grom to learn on last year, never able to flat foot that either. I do the one foot down with a bum wiggle to come to a stop. I hardly ever swing my leg over the seat now and usually just stand on the foot peg to mount and dismount. Jocelyn Snow is our height and rides big BMW RS 1250's.
Hey! All excellent points well made, I'm 5'10 with a 29" inseam and only ride tall bikes (900mm and 865mm). It's totally a non problem and people who claim it is just have no clue! One disadvantage you may have as a lighter rider also means you don't compress the suspension, so having the rear shock resprung for your weight is a really useful option too. This is basically the proper way to adjust the suspension rather than winding the preload all the way in to "lower" it or putting lowering links on. Also paddling the bike around sat on it is for people who don't know how to handle a bike when stood beside it, that's real confidence being able to move one around at speed!
Hi loving the channel, I'm 5'4" and I was tip toeing my first, second and third bike starting with a honda NSF 125r then a Kawasaki gpz305 then a Kawasaki gpz500 now I have a honda shadow areo VT 750 and yeah I can flat foot it but it never bothered me on any of the other bikes, I found backing the others up i always did before getting on problem solved x
Same here re the inside leg being just under 29inch I’d say an issue can also be the width of a seat pushing legs out wider, a bit of seat sculpting on a bigger bike can help too !
Excellent video. I am 5ft 3 and have short legs. For me it’s not just a hight of the seat, it is also how wide the seat is. I can get my feet almost flat footed on my z400 and I am the exact same on my Monkey bike because the seat is really wide. 😂 But you are also correct when I first got the z400 after such a long layoff (20 years ago) from riding, it did feel heavy, but three years later it feels very light. I think for shorter riders it’s the hight, the seat width and weight that makes a difference to how a bike feels I don’t have the confidence now of the 25 year old that passed her test and bought a super sports bike as a first bike without test riding it and just assumed it would be fine, and it was. 😂
@@TipToeBikers if you want to see what I look like on my z400, I put a 20 second video of me on it two years ago on my channel. It is the most boring channel so I definitely do not recommend you subscribe to it. 🤣 This is the video of my bike ruclips.net/video/NXBPLC66qJw/видео.htmlsi=KfAnpMKY_WMgXMpB
Well done for posting! You've got a proper handle on this subject. I've got a little collection of bikes. One of my favourites is my Aprilia Tuareg 600 ADV. with a 34 inch seat height. I'm nearly 60 and I have a 31 inch inseam. I wear regular boots. I'm quite happy to ride my 660 an have long since worked out the safe way to deal with the bike. I learned in the 1980s to "One Foot Down." it has worked for me for the last 40 odd years! Plus, I have a Moto Guzzi V7 850 special with a really low seat height. I can flat foot that with no boots on at all. That didn't stop me stalling it on the gravel in the drive this morning! 🤣.
TBH I rarely have both feet down cus I'm always covering the back brake, you make some great points for someone who is relatively early in your biking journey. 👍👏👏
Hi, Good to hear there are other short bikers out there getting their voice heard. Don't take any nonsense from the predominantly (Male) tall bikers who tend to drown out the voices of us shorties. I see there are already quite few of those in the comments below. I'm the opposite end of the scale in terms of experience having ridden for 49years now. Also the opposite in terms of body shape due to my Scottish heritage, so even shorter legs, but longer torso. I do have the advantage of upper body strength though with age (and Osteoporosis) even that becomes less so. I currently ride a new BSA which is a fairly heavy bike and a challenge when manoeuvring at a standstill. It's often a case of planning well in advance for things like adverse Camber. I HAVE lowered bikes before and with the type of bike I ride, that can IMPROVE handle IF you fit better quality shocks with adjustable damping and with spring rates to match your body weight. Main point however is Don't take the macho bike crap that is often chucked around, usually by people who are inadequate themselves. And finally, I'd be delighted if you took a look at my channel.😄
Hi, I'm a tall guy at 6'1" and I exclusively ride tall bikes (ADV and MX). Not once have I been able to flat floot a bike I've owned with both feet, nor have I ever needed to. Something I've taught some of the shorter ladies (and even tall blokes) in my life to do when riding is to never put both feet down, an okay tripod is much more stable than a flimsly quadrupod. As long as you can get one foot firimly planted on the floor, you're golden. If you can only put both feet down on tip toes you're always going to be struggling to find balance, tipping from one side to the other. Plus, it lets you keep your right foot on the rear brake to stop you rolling down hill and you can put your left foot down before you stop whilst still braking. The best way to get one foot fimrly one the floor is to get one or more cheeks off the seat. Scoot over to your left and you've instantly gained several inches more reach with your leg. Scoot over some more whilst only resting your thing on the seat and I can even pick things up from the floor.
Im 5'4 with a 28" inseam. Rode Tzr250 back in the day fine. Low bike. Come back to riding and started filtering bikes based on seat height. Very small selection. However as you said its not all a oit height. Width is very important. I ended up buying a CBR650R which was 810mm which i had ruled out until i happened to sit on one. About 2 weeks after getting it i also purchased some Daytona Max Sports boots that add 6cm of height. It was ok before but with the new boots i can just about walk it back and feel more confident on any type of camber. So there are options to help without lowering a bike. Great video and well delivered. 👍.
For the 'bars and tail manual handling technique, if you put the bike in 1st gear (engine off) you can use the clutch like a brake. Hold the clutch in when moving and release it when you need to stop. Another technique involves standing in front of the bike and pushing it backwards with the bars, handy on inclines, though less stable side-to-side.
love you video i am 5ft2 27inch leg male and tbh i watch a lot of videos from woman riders for short riders and they are amazing. don't seem to get many male videos about it, only from 5ft6 and above trying to explain it 😂 😂 your right its just practice practice practice, for everything you do on a bike. even when you can do stuff, like uturns etc keep up the videos kind regards kev
I’m a tip toe biker too - 5ft 5inch, 29” inseam male. I can’t walk my bike backwards either, gsx-8s. I went to a bikers cafe and everyone was walking their bikes back to park them, but I had to get off and push mine, bit embarrassing but oh well. Thanks for the vid! Inspiring 👍
I'm the exact opposite I struggle to find a bike big enough, I'm 6' 3" 37" inside leg and 20 stone. I got a transalp 650 for my first bike and it still isn't tall enough. I struggle with the foot peg to seat distance and feel quite cramped with my knees high up. My CBT was hilarious and it felt like i was on a toy and almost crashed when I slipped turning on a tram line in the town centre🤣 I was straight on a 600cc the lesson after my CBT and it felt much better as the bike weight helped with me being on the large side and passed my direct access on the second attempt. I haven't had the chance to ride my Transalp yet as waiting for a gate and security posts for my driveway, hopefully out and about in a week or so.
I'm 6'4 22 stone and have a triumph street triple with a lowering kit fitted from the previous owner. I had a kawasaki z650 before that, which was even smaller. 😂😂 I did my test on an old Honda which I couldn't physically bend enough to work the rear brake. Didn't make the mod1 any easier
Thank you so much for this 😊 I have to do my CBT on a 50cc moped because it's the only thing that is light enough that I can flat foot. I was on the balls of my feet on the Grom. I want to get a Grom but my particular instructor was quite negative and said I'd have to get it lowered. Now I feel much more confident about it. I didn't finish my CBT as I didnt feel safe with him, he was on his phone most of the time, so I refused to go out on the road. I will go back next month and do Element E with another instructor on the moped. I will get a Grom but without lowering it and I will practise as you suggested, then I will do the gear conversion half day on a Grom. I will never give up. This has been so helpful 🙏
Sounds like you had a terrible instructor, sorry you had that experience, but good on you for not giving up. Balls of your feet on a Grom is fine, especially if that's both at the same time. I did my CBT on a bike that I could just about get my toe tips on the ground with if I tried both feet at the same time, but I could get one foot solidly on the ball or even flat if I tipped the bike a little, as this video shows. I then got a Honda CB125R, which is a similar height for me and I use one foot at a time, like in the video. I'd say consider trying your CBT on a geared bike with a better instructor rather than a moped and then needing to do a geared conversion, as it sounds like you want a geared bike like a Grom anyway. A good instructor should get you happy with manual handling the bike leaned against you and then resting the weight on one foot when you are sat on it. Best wishes whichever approach you decide to take. You can do it!
@@neilp1885 thank you. Both of us failed to complete, so it was definitely him. The other lad I was with got so nervous, he forgot to do up his helmet and got yelled at. I'm sure I'll get it next time as I was good enough for the road, just not safe with him.🙂
@@CornishMotorcycleDiaries thanks buddy 😊 They are aware. Another instructor had to step in twice. I have been there before and the other instructor knows what I am like usually, no fear. So kind of you to offer to help. When I get the Grom, it will be from Bridge, so I'll let you know 😁
Excelent video. I'm a 5"8' man with a 30" inseam. I could fkst foot my first bike. But I had always been taught by my instructor to only put one foot down. So I was really surprised when I later realised I could get both feet down. I still carried on using one foot after that.
As long as you can flat foot and hold the rear brake, there's no problem. And as far as people saying you should be able to walk it back while on it, if that was the case, it would be a part of mod1.
Thank crunchy....finally a woman same height (and yes more importantly!) Same inseam as me! Its refreshing to hear someone confirming to the RUclips natiion all the truths about being a shorty rider . And just say, I tip toe on a grom as the seat isn't narrow! Great video!
Hi Ella. Very interesting video and very helpful. My 125 is a Keeway rkf naked which I can flat foot both sides as I'm 5 ft 8, so this was the sort of height im comfortable with. I've already got my big bike ready to do my test and that has a seat height the same so I know I'm in total control of the bike. Stay safe - Lucy.
HI Great vid i have a Africa twin but a inside leg of 29ins but don't fit many bikes flat footed I use all the methods you do I walk her back into parking spaces but use the rack way nothing wrong with either way as you say practice and you should be able to ride almost any bike you want to tc ride safe
Now that you have passed your test, get used to stopping with front brake and putting your right foot down...... they teach u this if u decide to get advanced training, it means you don't have to be swapping feet to change gear and pull away.. Also one of my vertically challenged friends has found boots with a bit heel that helps😊
I'm tiptoeing my CB500X, just got it last week, the last 2 times I hard to park it up publicly and had to manual-handle it I've had people run up to help me, feeling rather embarrassed about that lol but I'm so happy with it, still having to reality check myself that I actually own a bike now
I've been "too short" all my life. I will ride, fly, drive anything i want to and if i want it then i'll find a way. I've been told sports bikes arent very well suited for vertically challenged people and to go for a touring or cruiser style but i like sports bikes. I want a ninja 300, it's been the only bike ive ever wanted and ive still yet to sit on one but if i do get one i'll make it work
I’m only 5ft3 so tiptoe. I also watch Jocelyn snow as that is the ultimate short rider to get tips from. I just ride and keep an eye on cambers to prevent a drop…. Just get out and ride….
Hi I'm 5'8 but only got a 29 leg I wanted a bike but I'm 59 and was more comfy on an adventure bike so got myself a v strom 650 835 seat height so when I out my legs down they don't quote reach .I'm on my tip toes so ye I use the same method as you because of my bike choice.Love the channel keep up the good work always look forward to another video.
Don't be tempted to go with a lowered suspension model they don't handle the same, the lower seat is the way to go and don't exclude a bike without checking for a low seat in the options 👍
I'll definitely get the seat lowered before I start looking at suspension, but tbh I'll probably need to use a combination of the two. I've spoken to some other ladies who have lowered zx6r's and although the handling does change, I won't be able to ride the bike with standard suspension so I won't know the difference if that makes sense
I sort of agree. I am 5'7" with a 26" inside seam. I am not slim, so I lose at least an inch because of that (I am being kind to myself there). Slim folks, like you two, effectively get extra leg length. Sport bikes also tend to be narrow and have narrow seats, also aiding that effect. On a ZX10R, I could get just one toe down (after lowering the suspension) by sliding across on the seat a bit just as I came to a stop. If I came to a stop where the road surface is not flat, it was easy for me go over. A lighter bike also helps. I averaged about once per 1000-2000 miles. On my custom Harley bobber, I can get both feet down. So, the ZX10R has gone. It was fun, lunatic TBH, but, I hated coming to a stop. To get on the bike, I either parked next to a kerb, or got on to the footpeg and lifted myself up. The things we do ...
Yeah I haven't sat on enough bikes to see myself, but apparently the ninjas have thinner seats than the zx's. So I shouldn't have a problem with the ninja 650, but my dream zx6 might be a different story 😅
You don't need to flat foot your bike , and you can always get off to push it bike . In over 45 years of riding this has never been a problem for me . I only got a 29 inch inside leg . One foot is good enough .
If I ever see you out in the wild I will let you try sitting on my NC21 vfr400 It's really low haha. For me it feels like I'm riding quite cramped up but comfy as it was designed solely for the Japanese market and I think mines been lowered a little. I love your ninja I'm tempted by one for a new commuter.
@@TipToeBikers Yeah they look great, I love the cold wheels you did on yours too! Im trying to decide between the 250 and an Er-6F, the 250 appeals to me for fuel mileage but the ER-6F will handle cheap fuel better so it's a hard decision, both are very comfy though.
I have several 5 foot an under female riders in my family an was about that tall when I started, but I am 5'10 now so take my opinion for what thats worth. There is no bike that someone will never be able to ride because its to tall for them. I have seen little people riding bikes they cant even see over. But for a new rider, riding a bike you cant flat foot is going to be much harder an cause you to learn slower. You shouldn't start out on a bike that you cant flat foot unless you have no other option, which is rare. You also should not start out on a bike that you cant afford to drop. Both cause the same problem in new riders, extra fear. The person that buys a beater they can flat foot as their first bike will be a better rider in 6 months than the person getting the bike they want as their first bike. That usually means starting out on a small, older cruiser like a 250 rebel, but its worth it. You will ride more an learn much harder skills sooner because you are trying them sooner. Save the tall, fragile skinned nice bike for your second bike, well after you have dropped that first boke over an over mastering U-turns. Lowering a bike is fine. If you lower both the front and the back the same, the geometry doesn't change. At least not any more than it changes by having a heavier rider. You just loose some up travel in your suspension. If you are just lowering the rear as most people do, that does change things like the rake an trail. But it will still be in the range of other bikes that sold next to it on the showroom floor. You are adding rake an trail, the geomitry that makes a bike want to stand up an ride straight. Crusers have more an need more rider input to lean them in to a corner. Sport bikes have less an almost fall in to a corner if you nudge the bars. Lowering the rear on a sport bike, you are pushing it slightly in the direction of crusers handling, very slightly. For someone dragging knee around a track, they will notice. A new rider on the street, not so much. The way you have chose to push your bike is great. But the way you said you didn't like doing it, an why, you were doing wrong. Your right hand on the back of the bike an left hand on the bars, that should be done with the bike off, in first gear, an you pulling the clutch. The bike will not roll in gear unless the clutch is pulled. So by having it in gear, the clutch becomes your brakes. Pull it in to roll, let it out to stop. That gives you the control you were missing. But it still might not be the better way for you.
I agree that if you can, flatfooting a bike to start will definitely help with confidence. But for me at my CBT, it wasn't an option so it helped to get used to tiptoeing from the start. Also interesting to hear about the manual handling, yes as I've always held both handlebars I didn't realise you actually use the clutch to stop 😂 that makes sense, although as you said I'd still feel safer doing it the way I currently do. Thanks for watching!
Nice video. For me a road with camber sloping down to the left is the most problematic, because generally you want to come to rest on the back brake, not the front for obvious reasons. But with a steep camber to the left I often find putting the left foot down is scary because there is nothing there. So I need to plan ahead and stop carefully with the FRONT brake so I can put the RIGHT foot down. Does this make sense? I suppose the best way to solve this is to come to a rest on the back brake then swap feet. What do you think?
Yes having the road slope away on the left side is the most difficult. With this bike I've not had a situation where I've needed to stop with my right foot down first, but it might be something I look at for taller bikes :) A good practice would probably be to use the front brake *very* gently when you can see you need to use your right foot, and use the rear brake as much as you can until the last second when you need to put your foot down :)
How do you park your bike if the parking spot is perpendicular to the road and has a sharp incline towards the end? do you get off and walk it back or do you tiptoe? How would you back up a bike into a garage that has a threshold (a 2,5cm metal lip in my case)?
I guess it varies on the situation, if a space has an incline I will definitely use the motor to get it in, so ride it forwards into the space. But I wouldn't like to put myself in a situation where I'm then walking the bike backwards out of the spot and onto a main road, so I'd maybe park it on the pavement if there's space. As for the garage, again I'd ride it in and use some momentum to walk/ tiptoe it backwards out of the space - that's what I do with my garage which has an incline towards the back :)
I'm a little limited to the bikes that fit me... I would love to have a smaller bike that weighs practically nothing and is as easy to throw around as a bmx, and in theory that is something like a GSX250R, but they are too small and my legs get stuck under the wings on the fuel tank, so I can't push my toes down, or get my toes under the levers to pull up on them. because for the toes to go down the heel must come up, and the knees come up with the heel. but they are unable to because of the wings on the tank... It's a shame, because a small bike that looks like a big bike, would make this 6' 1 1/2" tall person look about 6'7" foot tall, and nobody likes to mess with my little brother who is actually that tall!
I am 156cm (5.1 ft) with a 76cm (29.9 in) inseam. have a Kawasaki ninja 650, with a an OEM low seat, that you can order from Kawasaki. It reduces the seat heigh by 2cm. If you need details, about the seat, or reach, I can provide.
I don't get this flat foot thing. At a red light (for example) i have one foot down, the other on the rear brake. When am i supposed to be putting both down?
Any video tips doing a turn in the road ie U turn as I’m a tiptoe biker 5”1’ riding 600 and above and dropped my bike a couple of times trying to do a tight turn. I’ve been told it’s because I grab my front brake when turning . any other tips you might know of
Yes if you need to use brakes at all with slow maneuvers, Rear is best! But for a u turn, if you're dropping it it's probably because you're going too slow. If the bike is travelling, it'll want to stay upright. Take a deep breath, commit to the turn and look where you want to go!
heyy im a fellow tip toe biker, my dad hadd as a triumph street triple 675cc do you recon that would be ok the practice the side to side when stationary x
Who believes this flatfoot BS?,just look at Jocelin Snow to realise you don't need to flatfoot a bike. I'm 5'5" and all of my bikes have been kept standard. CBR600 CBR1100XX Super Blackbird. CBR1000RR. Gen1 ZZR1400 Gen2 ZZR1400 Performance Sport. 2018 H2 SX.
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Great video, great points, well made! :) :D I'm a 5'8" bloke with a 30" inside leg and I have NEVER had a bike I could "flat foot". As you say, we've never known any different, so, just buy/ride the bike you want to ride!! I've even had bikes I had to get off the seat on one side and stand on one leg with the other leg resting on top of the seat. Just don't stop much!! ;) :D The main thing I think is to plan your stops/parking. ALWAYS park "uphill", "with the camber, try and find a spot where you can ride out forwards, and don't bother obsessing with reversing into a spot, I usually just go in forwards, and reverse out when leaving (and pushing out from being off the bike if need be - who cares what anyone else thinks!! :) ). I also always try and use slopes/cambers to help me go backwards (a bit like having a reverse gear). The leg dangle/swappie thing I too have always had to do, so it's just "normal" for me. Keep up the great work!! :) :D :D P.S. DON'T be temped to put a lowering kit on any bike, ESPECIALLY a sports bike as they usually destroy the handling (depending on your weight though (which is likely to be very low ;) :) ), you might need to soften off the stock suspension on bigger bikes, as they will be setup for a heavier "average" rider, most likely). Also, finally, I don't think ANYONE can actually hold up a "big bike", however tall/strong they are, we ALL are just balancing them, so don't stress over that, either!!
Good points, from a fellow short legged person, I’m 5’2 and about a 26’ inseam.
I don’t think you need to flat foot, it’s more about being able to have enough leg to stabilise the bike if you’re caught out and being able to take the weight to stop a tip.
And I think people who haven’t experienced not being able to do anything about that when it happens, don’t quite get it.
I don’t and haven’t ever flat footed, I learnt on a Honda CB650 and once I was on was okay, and I loved riding it, the only issue I have is road cambers, which I have to be careful with, as a few times I’ve gone to put a foot down, and no ground, and if the weight went past a point I couldn’t hold it up.
Pegs were always in my way and I had some fantastic bruises 😂
Absolutely no chance of me waddling a bike, so I always manual handle, and I did a lot of practicing of it.
Learning to pick a bike up safely has also been a big one for me too!
I have a Harley Nightster, which I love, the centre of gravity is really low and makes it much easier for me.
Once I’m more comfortable and experienced I really do want to do some off roading, and I want to try a Pan am, Africa twin or Himalayan 😊
Yeah it's definitely more about how much weight you can hold up! I think like all of us at the start I had some shaky stops where the bike was leaning on one leg more than I would like. Only ever dropped it once from not being able to hold all the weight, and that was in my roundabout accident video 🙂
Definitely, I certainly had a few of those when I was learning, not easing off the brake caused a few nervous foot moments, and I honestly have mastered the tip over elegantly as I’ve had a few.
I’ll check that vid out 😊
As a five foot something woman yeah, almost all bikes are "too tall" for me. but i don't care!😝
i decided to ride the bike i want and just learn some extra techniques. i've got a 2002 Klr 650, i can't even put two feet down, but i love that thing and i'm comfortable on it 😄.
Love it!!
Well said, at 5"1' I'm a tiptoe biker too. Had a Grom to learn on last year, never able to flat foot that either. I do the one foot down with a bum wiggle to come to a stop. I hardly ever swing my leg over the seat now and usually just stand on the foot peg to mount and dismount. Jocelyn Snow is our height and rides big BMW RS 1250's.
Haha I might try and use that foot peg trick. Might save me from scratching the fairings with my boots occasionally 😂
Hey! All excellent points well made, I'm 5'10 with a 29" inseam and only ride tall bikes (900mm and 865mm). It's totally a non problem and people who claim it is just have no clue! One disadvantage you may have as a lighter rider also means you don't compress the suspension, so having the rear shock resprung for your weight is a really useful option too. This is basically the proper way to adjust the suspension rather than winding the preload all the way in to "lower" it or putting lowering links on. Also paddling the bike around sat on it is for people who don't know how to handle a bike when stood beside it, that's real confidence being able to move one around at speed!
Yeah I think I need to get the suspension adjusted because I'm guessing it's set up for the standard rider 😆
Hi loving the channel, I'm 5'4" and I was tip toeing my first, second and third bike starting with a honda NSF 125r then a Kawasaki gpz305 then a Kawasaki gpz500 now I have a honda shadow areo VT 750 and yeah I can flat foot it but it never bothered me on any of the other bikes, I found backing the others up i always did before getting on problem solved x
Same here re the inside leg being just under 29inch I’d say an issue can also be the width of a seat pushing legs out wider, a bit of seat sculpting on a bigger bike can help too !
Excellent video. I am 5ft 3 and have short legs. For me it’s not just a hight of the seat, it is also how wide the seat is. I can get my feet almost flat footed on my z400 and I am the exact same on my Monkey bike because the seat is really wide. 😂
But you are also correct when I first got the z400 after such a long layoff (20 years ago) from riding, it did feel heavy, but three years later it feels very light.
I think for shorter riders it’s the hight, the seat width and weight that makes a difference to how a bike feels
I don’t have the confidence now of the 25 year old that passed her test and bought a super sports bike as a first bike without test riding it and just assumed it would be fine, and it was. 😂
Yeah width of seat is definitely a key part! It's probably another reason why I like the sport bikes 😂
@@TipToeBikers if you want to see what I look like on my z400, I put a 20 second video of me on it two years ago on my channel. It is the most boring channel so I definitely do not recommend you subscribe to it. 🤣
This is the video of my bike
ruclips.net/video/NXBPLC66qJw/видео.htmlsi=KfAnpMKY_WMgXMpB
Well done for posting! You've got a proper handle on this subject. I've got a little collection of bikes. One of my favourites is my Aprilia Tuareg 600 ADV. with a 34 inch seat height. I'm nearly 60 and I have a 31 inch inseam. I wear regular boots. I'm quite happy to ride my 660 an have long since worked out the safe way to deal with the bike. I learned in the 1980s to "One Foot Down." it has worked for me for the last 40 odd years! Plus, I have a Moto Guzzi V7 850 special with a really low seat height. I can flat foot that with no boots on at all. That didn't stop me stalling it on the gravel in the drive this morning! 🤣.
Thank you!
TBH I rarely have both feet down cus I'm always covering the back brake, you make some great points for someone who is relatively early in your biking journey. 👍👏👏
Hi, Good to hear there are other short bikers out there getting their voice heard. Don't take any nonsense from the predominantly (Male) tall bikers who tend to drown out the voices of us shorties. I see there are already quite few of those in the comments below. I'm the opposite end of the scale in terms of experience having ridden for 49years now. Also the opposite in terms of body shape due to my Scottish heritage, so even shorter legs, but longer torso. I do have the advantage of upper body strength though with age (and Osteoporosis) even that becomes less so. I currently ride a new BSA which is a fairly heavy bike and a challenge when manoeuvring at a standstill. It's often a case of planning well in advance for things like adverse Camber. I HAVE lowered bikes before and with the type of bike I ride, that can IMPROVE handle IF you fit better quality shocks with adjustable damping and with spring rates to match your body weight. Main point however is Don't take the macho bike crap that is often chucked around, usually by people who are inadequate themselves. And finally, I'd be delighted if you took a look at my channel.😄
Hi, I'm a tall guy at 6'1" and I exclusively ride tall bikes (ADV and MX). Not once have I been able to flat floot a bike I've owned with both feet, nor have I ever needed to.
Something I've taught some of the shorter ladies (and even tall blokes) in my life to do when riding is to never put both feet down, an okay tripod is much more stable than a flimsly quadrupod. As long as you can get one foot firimly planted on the floor, you're golden. If you can only put both feet down on tip toes you're always going to be struggling to find balance, tipping from one side to the other. Plus, it lets you keep your right foot on the rear brake to stop you rolling down hill and you can put your left foot down before you stop whilst still braking.
The best way to get one foot fimrly one the floor is to get one or more cheeks off the seat. Scoot over to your left and you've instantly gained several inches more reach with your leg. Scoot over some more whilst only resting your thing on the seat and I can even pick things up from the floor.
Im 5'4 with a 28" inseam. Rode Tzr250 back in the day fine. Low bike. Come back to riding and started filtering bikes based on seat height. Very small selection. However as you said its not all a oit height. Width is very important. I ended up buying a CBR650R which was 810mm which i had ruled out until i happened to sit on one.
About 2 weeks after getting it i also purchased some Daytona Max Sports boots that add 6cm of height. It was ok before but with the new boots i can just about walk it back and feel more confident on any type of camber.
So there are options to help without lowering a bike.
Great video and well delivered. 👍.
I've heard good things about those boots. I'll take a look as my current ones are rather battered 😂
@@TipToeBikersThe only downside is the £350 price tag. But I think they are great and will last years.
For the 'bars and tail manual handling technique, if you put the bike in 1st gear (engine off) you can use the clutch like a brake. Hold the clutch in when moving and release it when you need to stop. Another technique involves standing in front of the bike and pushing it backwards with the bars, handy on inclines, though less stable side-to-side.
love you video i am 5ft2 27inch leg male and tbh i watch a lot of videos from woman riders for short riders and they are amazing.
don't seem to get many male videos about it, only from 5ft6 and above trying to explain it 😂 😂
your right its just practice practice practice, for everything you do on a bike. even when you can do stuff, like uturns etc
keep up the videos
kind regards
kev
I’m a tip toe biker too - 5ft 5inch, 29” inseam male. I can’t walk my bike backwards either, gsx-8s. I went to a bikers cafe and everyone was walking their bikes back to park them, but I had to get off and push mine, bit embarrassing but oh well. Thanks for the vid! Inspiring 👍
Why is getting off and pushing it backwards embarrassing?
@@MikeTheBike58 I just felt like, being short, I couldn't back peddle like everyone else.
I'm the exact opposite I struggle to find a bike big enough, I'm 6' 3" 37" inside leg and 20 stone. I got a transalp 650 for my first bike and it still isn't tall enough. I struggle with the foot peg to seat distance and feel quite cramped with my knees high up.
My CBT was hilarious and it felt like i was on a toy and almost crashed when I slipped turning on a tram line in the town centre🤣 I was straight on a 600cc the lesson after my CBT and it felt much better as the bike weight helped with me being on the large side and passed my direct access on the second attempt. I haven't had the chance to ride my Transalp yet as waiting for a gate and security posts for my driveway, hopefully out and about in a week or so.
I'm 6'4 22 stone and have a triumph street triple with a lowering kit fitted from the previous owner.
I had a kawasaki z650 before that, which was even smaller. 😂😂
I did my test on an old Honda which I couldn't physically bend enough to work the rear brake. Didn't make the mod1 any easier
@@101steel4 I passed on a Yamaha FZ6, I ached all over after a day on it
Holy crap. I'm 6'2 and ride a gsxr comfortably.
Thank you so much for this 😊 I have to do my CBT on a 50cc moped because it's the only thing that is light enough that I can flat foot. I was on the balls of my feet on the Grom. I want to get a Grom but my particular instructor was quite negative and said I'd have to get it lowered. Now I feel much more confident about it.
I didn't finish my CBT as I didnt feel safe with him, he was on his phone most of the time, so I refused to go out on the road. I will go back next month and do Element E with another instructor on the moped. I will get a Grom but without lowering it and I will practise as you suggested, then I will do the gear conversion half day on a Grom. I will never give up.
This has been so helpful 🙏
To hear you you have more confidence makes me SO happy. You can do this!!
Sounds like you had a terrible instructor, sorry you had that experience, but good on you for not giving up.
Balls of your feet on a Grom is fine, especially if that's both at the same time. I did my CBT on a bike that I could just about get my toe tips on the ground with if I tried both feet at the same time, but I could get one foot solidly on the ball or even flat if I tipped the bike a little, as this video shows. I then got a Honda CB125R, which is a similar height for me and I use one foot at a time, like in the video. I'd say consider trying your CBT on a geared bike with a better instructor rather than a moped and then needing to do a geared conversion, as it sounds like you want a geared bike like a Grom anyway. A good instructor should get you happy with manual handling the bike leaned against you and then resting the weight on one foot when you are sat on it. Best wishes whichever approach you decide to take. You can do it!
@@neilp1885 thank you. Both of us failed to complete, so it was definitely him. The other lad I was with got so nervous, he forgot to do up his helmet and got yelled at. I'm sure I'll get it next time as I was good enough for the road, just not safe with him.🙂
That's bad Lily. you should report him. anything I can do to help?
@@CornishMotorcycleDiaries thanks buddy 😊 They are aware. Another instructor had to step in twice. I have been there before and the other instructor knows what I am like usually, no fear.
So kind of you to offer to help. When I get the Grom, it will be from Bridge, so I'll let you know 😁
Excelent video. I'm a 5"8' man with a 30" inseam. I could fkst foot my first bike. But I had always been taught by my instructor to only put one foot down. So I was really surprised when I later realised I could get both feet down. I still carried on using one foot after that.
As long as you can flat foot and hold the rear brake, there's no problem. And as far as people saying you should be able to walk it back while on it, if that was the case, it would be a part of mod1.
Thank crunchy....finally a woman same height (and yes more importantly!) Same inseam as me! Its refreshing to hear someone confirming to the RUclips natiion all the truths about being a shorty rider . And just say, I tip toe on a grom as the seat isn't narrow! Great video!
Hi Ella. Very interesting video and very helpful. My 125 is a Keeway rkf naked which I can flat foot both sides as I'm 5 ft 8, so this was the sort of height im comfortable with. I've already got my big bike ready to do my test and that has a seat height the same so I know I'm in total control of the bike.
Stay safe - Lucy.
Thanks for watching Lucy!
HI Great vid i have a Africa twin but a inside leg of 29ins but don't fit many bikes flat footed
I use all the methods you do I walk her back into parking spaces but use the rack way nothing wrong with either way as you say practice and you should be able to ride almost any bike you want to tc ride safe
Thanks for watching!
Now that you have passed your test, get used to stopping with front brake and putting your right foot down...... they teach u this if u decide to get advanced training, it means you don't have to be swapping feet to change gear and pull away.. Also one of my vertically challenged friends has found boots with a bit heel that helps😊
I'm tiptoeing my CB500X, just got it last week, the last 2 times I hard to park it up publicly and had to manual-handle it I've had people run up to help me, feeling rather embarrassed about that lol
but I'm so happy with it, still having to reality check myself that I actually own a bike now
Haha tbh I'm surprised I've not had similar but people have just let me get on with it 😂
I've been "too short" all my life. I will ride, fly, drive anything i want to and if i want it then i'll find a way. I've been told sports bikes arent very well suited for vertically challenged people and to go for a touring or cruiser style but i like sports bikes. I want a ninja 300, it's been the only bike ive ever wanted and ive still yet to sit on one but if i do get one i'll make it work
I've sat on a ninja 300, I would ride it without needing to adjust as it was very similar to my 250! Go for it 😊
I’m only 5ft3 so tiptoe. I also watch Jocelyn snow as that is the ultimate short rider to get tips from. I just ride and keep an eye on cambers to prevent a drop…. Just get out and ride….
Will have to check out her channel!
Hi I'm 5'8 but only got a 29 leg I wanted a bike but I'm 59 and was more comfy on an adventure bike so got myself a v strom 650 835 seat height so when I out my legs down they don't quote reach .I'm on my tip toes so ye I use the same method as you because of my bike choice.Love the channel keep up the good work always look forward to another video.
Thanks for watching!
Don't be tempted to go with a lowered suspension model they don't handle the same, the lower seat is the way to go and don't exclude a bike without checking for a low seat in the options 👍
I'll definitely get the seat lowered before I start looking at suspension, but tbh I'll probably need to use a combination of the two. I've spoken to some other ladies who have lowered zx6r's and although the handling does change, I won't be able to ride the bike with standard suspension so I won't know the difference if that makes sense
I had a street triple 765 r low and it was great getting my feet down but was harsh and bouncy compared to the standard version 👍
I sort of agree. I am 5'7" with a 26" inside seam. I am not slim, so I lose at least an inch because of that (I am being kind to myself there). Slim folks, like you two, effectively get extra leg length. Sport bikes also tend to be narrow and have narrow seats, also aiding that effect. On a ZX10R, I could get just one toe down (after lowering the suspension) by sliding across on the seat a bit just as I came to a stop. If I came to a stop where the road surface is not flat, it was easy for me go over. A lighter bike also helps. I averaged about once per 1000-2000 miles. On my custom Harley bobber, I can get both feet down. So, the ZX10R has gone. It was fun, lunatic TBH, but, I hated coming to a stop. To get on the bike, I either parked next to a kerb, or got on to the footpeg and lifted myself up. The things we do ...
Yeah I haven't sat on enough bikes to see myself, but apparently the ninjas have thinner seats than the zx's. So I shouldn't have a problem with the ninja 650, but my dream zx6 might be a different story 😅
@@TipToeBikers The ninja 650 and z650 didn’t feel much different to my z400. Kawasaki do seem to make great bikes for shorter riders
You don't need to flat foot your bike , and you can always get off to push it bike . In over 45 years of riding this has never been a problem for me . I only got a 29 inch inside leg . One foot is good enough .
If I ever see you out in the wild I will let you try sitting on my NC21 vfr400
It's really low haha. For me it feels like I'm riding quite cramped up but comfy as it was designed solely for the Japanese market and I think mines been lowered a little.
I love your ninja I'm tempted by one for a new commuter.
The little ninja is a great commuter!
@@TipToeBikers Yeah they look great, I love the cold wheels you did on yours too!
Im trying to decide between the 250 and an Er-6F, the 250 appeals to me for fuel mileage but the ER-6F will handle cheap fuel better so it's a hard decision, both are very comfy though.
I have several 5 foot an under female riders in my family an was about that tall when I started, but I am 5'10 now so take my opinion for what thats worth. There is no bike that someone will never be able to ride because its to tall for them. I have seen little people riding bikes they cant even see over. But for a new rider, riding a bike you cant flat foot is going to be much harder an cause you to learn slower. You shouldn't start out on a bike that you cant flat foot unless you have no other option, which is rare. You also should not start out on a bike that you cant afford to drop. Both cause the same problem in new riders, extra fear. The person that buys a beater they can flat foot as their first bike will be a better rider in 6 months than the person getting the bike they want as their first bike. That usually means starting out on a small, older cruiser like a 250 rebel, but its worth it. You will ride more an learn much harder skills sooner because you are trying them sooner. Save the tall, fragile skinned nice bike for your second bike, well after you have dropped that first boke over an over mastering U-turns.
Lowering a bike is fine. If you lower both the front and the back the same, the geometry doesn't change. At least not any more than it changes by having a heavier rider. You just loose some up travel in your suspension. If you are just lowering the rear as most people do, that does change things like the rake an trail. But it will still be in the range of other bikes that sold next to it on the showroom floor. You are adding rake an trail, the geomitry that makes a bike want to stand up an ride straight. Crusers have more an need more rider input to lean them in to a corner. Sport bikes have less an almost fall in to a corner if you nudge the bars. Lowering the rear on a sport bike, you are pushing it slightly in the direction of crusers handling, very slightly. For someone dragging knee around a track, they will notice. A new rider on the street, not so much.
The way you have chose to push your bike is great. But the way you said you didn't like doing it, an why, you were doing wrong. Your right hand on the back of the bike an left hand on the bars, that should be done with the bike off, in first gear, an you pulling the clutch. The bike will not roll in gear unless the clutch is pulled. So by having it in gear, the clutch becomes your brakes. Pull it in to roll, let it out to stop. That gives you the control you were missing. But it still might not be the better way for you.
I agree that if you can, flatfooting a bike to start will definitely help with confidence. But for me at my CBT, it wasn't an option so it helped to get used to tiptoeing from the start. Also interesting to hear about the manual handling, yes as I've always held both handlebars I didn't realise you actually use the clutch to stop 😂 that makes sense, although as you said I'd still feel safer doing it the way I currently do. Thanks for watching!
Nice video. For me a road with camber sloping down to the left is the most problematic, because generally you want to come to rest on the back brake, not the front for obvious reasons. But with a steep camber to the left I often find putting the left foot down is scary because there is nothing there. So I need to plan ahead and stop carefully with the FRONT brake so I can put the RIGHT foot down. Does this make sense? I suppose the best way to solve this is to come to a rest on the back brake then swap feet. What do you think?
Yes having the road slope away on the left side is the most difficult. With this bike I've not had a situation where I've needed to stop with my right foot down first, but it might be something I look at for taller bikes :) A good practice would probably be to use the front brake *very* gently when you can see you need to use your right foot, and use the rear brake as much as you can until the last second when you need to put your foot down :)
How do you park your bike if the parking spot is perpendicular to the road and has a sharp incline towards the end? do you get off and walk it back or do you tiptoe? How would you back up a bike into a garage that has a threshold (a 2,5cm metal lip in my case)?
I guess it varies on the situation, if a space has an incline I will definitely use the motor to get it in, so ride it forwards into the space. But I wouldn't like to put myself in a situation where I'm then walking the bike backwards out of the spot and onto a main road, so I'd maybe park it on the pavement if there's space. As for the garage, again I'd ride it in and use some momentum to walk/ tiptoe it backwards out of the space - that's what I do with my garage which has an incline towards the back :)
I'm a little limited to the bikes that fit me... I would love to have a smaller bike that weighs practically nothing and is as easy to throw around as a bmx, and in theory that is something like a GSX250R, but they are too small and my legs get stuck under the wings on the fuel tank, so I can't push my toes down, or get my toes under the levers to pull up on them. because for the toes to go down the heel must come up, and the knees come up with the heel. but they are unable to because of the wings on the tank...
It's a shame, because a small bike that looks like a big bike, would make this 6' 1 1/2" tall person look about 6'7" foot tall, and nobody likes to mess with my little brother who is actually that tall!
I am 156cm (5.1 ft) with a 76cm (29.9 in) inseam. have a Kawasaki ninja 650, with a an OEM low seat, that you can order from Kawasaki. It reduces the seat heigh by 2cm. If you need details, about the seat, or reach, I can provide.
I don't get this flat foot thing. At a red light (for example) i have one foot down, the other on the rear brake. When am i supposed to be putting both down?
Have you thought of using different ‘dog bones’ to lower Noxie slightly, then can replace the originals when you sell her? X
I don't feel the need to lower Noxie, but for future bikes I probably will 😊
Any video tips doing a turn in the road ie U turn as I’m a tiptoe biker 5”1’ riding 600 and above and dropped my bike a couple of times trying to do a tight turn. I’ve been told it’s because I grab my front brake when turning . any other tips you might know of
Yes if you need to use brakes at all with slow maneuvers, Rear is best! But for a u turn, if you're dropping it it's probably because you're going too slow. If the bike is travelling, it'll want to stay upright. Take a deep breath, commit to the turn and look where you want to go!
Thank you for this info ill put your advice in to practice
heyy im a fellow tip toe biker, my dad hadd as a triumph street triple 675cc do you recon that would be ok the practice the side to side when stationary x
Yeah as long as he knows haha 😆
6'4 but I'm just here to listen to your struggles as I eat cake. Toodaloo
😂😂😂
😂
Well done ask for help of a stronger taller man keep up the good vids 👍
I have boots that raise me by 2 inches.
Who believes this flatfoot BS?,just look at Jocelin Snow to realise you don't need to flatfoot a bike.
I'm 5'5" and all of my bikes have been kept standard.
CBR600
CBR1100XX Super Blackbird.
CBR1000RR.
Gen1 ZZR1400
Gen2 ZZR1400 Performance Sport.
2018 H2 SX.
That's a great list of bikes 😍
@@TipToeBikersThanks 😊