I had the privilege to see both bikes in person and I may never had believed until I saw that RE has passed triumph in build quality and I really hope that's the case in performance too.
The new water cooled Sherpa engine in the Himalayan 450 offers interesting possibilities for future models. A Scram 450 with 19”/17” wheels is an obvious replacement for the Scram 411. A roadster with 17”/17” wheels using the same engine would also be a possibility. Shortening the engine stroke from 81.5mm to 54mm would create a 300cc engine that would be 27.5mm shorter and produce about 27bhp. This could be used to update the 350 models and put them on a par with the Honda 300s while being more affordable and making them better able to cope on fast roads. From there RE could make a 600cc twin with about 54bhp, or offer a restricted version for A2 riders, and update the Interceptor/Super Meteor/Continental GT models.
Just bought my first bike - a used 2020 Royal Enfield Himalayan, with lots of accessories and aluminium bags + topcase. The overall condition is great, it looks new to me. Also the price (4k€) was appealing, for the package + the very trustworthy person who sold it to me. Now, with the release of the Himalayan 450 (a week after my purchase), I dont know how to feel about it... I am still very happy with my choice, I guess. Maybe in a couple of years, after riding the 411 long enough, I could move on and get a full evolved 450...
Bike models get updated all the time, which means that the prices asked of the outgoing model will (probably) be lower. Its not rocket science. And I have a 411 Himalayan.
@@longjonwhite Yes, if feels like that... I think the most important aspect doing so, is to find someone who is fair, trustworthy and offering something well maintained. I think the communication, the meeting and agreement in the end - this can't be surpassed so quickly. I am just in love with the bike as well and cannot wait for spring. Thx for the comment, have a good night.
The Himalayan 411 is a beast. It's a really good and solid bike, with what i personally feel a more posh design for a tourer. Sad to see it discontinued, but it's great that you got one.
Been emailing BSA for months with no reply. Due to your video the other week I decided to take the plunge and Went to the show this week with a view to ordering one, wow what an experience! Guys in the BSA Tee shirts all stood around chatting and blatantly ignored me. Finally got the attention of a south African lady (judging by her accent) She was very arrogant and irritable, obviously thought she was too good to talk to a possible customer. They act like they have the best product in the world but its an unproven slightly awkward revamp in a very competitive market! will be ordering an Interceptor this week end! They actually act like they dont want to sell any bikes!
Definitely interesting times. I’ve bought two new REs on the basis that they were small capacity bikes that whilst not sporting premium parts or modes were built at a fair price and worked well. Whilst I think it’s good that RE are producing something premium now I hope that they don’t stop selling reasonably priced models. I’ll look forward to seeing your new channel bike and thank you for another honest observation
I.m trading my 350classic in for bsa tomorrow. 350classic lovely bike but i have 500 trials and 350 matchless. So i thought bsa would give me more variety obviously being a larger bike. Local dealer had it at 5495 new in red and chrome. . I think maybe the quiet stand for bsa was mainly due to there being only one model? Nothing new. Quite a lot of negatively around the bikes but not usually from owners. It was the same with the interceptor. Another prob is price. 6700/7000 is a bit much when looking at competition. But 5495 i am happy with.
The more often I see the new Himalayan the less ugly it gets........ Thank you for sharing your thoughts about the built quality details of both bikes.
They are both good looking bikes. I want a small capacity bike that still has the power to overtake on the motorway when required. I would not be doing any serious off-road. With a great service interval, good power and economy the triumph ticks all of my boxes. The Enfield is gorgeous and if the price is right I will seriously consider it. It is nice to have some choices in the lower capacity bikes sector. As you mentioned both look like good bikes so I would probably be chuffed with either.
I've been looking at buying a smaller capacity bike. Took a serious look at the 350 Hunter...viewed a really good second hand one a few months ago.....but then the Triumph arrived on the scene. l haven't viewed one yet, but it looks as if it will float my boat. Stu's views are interesting regarding some of the finishing.....it's a bit of a dilemma now..!
@@brianperry I have also thought about the hunter but I want to be able to do motorway miles comfortably. That is the only thing that puts me off the hunter. As he mentions in the video the triumph is not a bad bike. But it sounds like there are obvious areas of cost cutting. As long as they don't effect the longevity or performance of the bike then I can forgive that sort of thing. Especially for a competitive price. But it is a dilemma. Still it is nice to have this much choice at the lower end of the bike market.
I’d like to swap to one of these but I think I’ll wait for the bugs to be ironed out first. I bought a first edition Triumph Street twin and had loads of problems which I assumed have now been fixed now on the later models. Triumph bikes are great until problems arise then it’s an uphill battle. I wouldn’t know about Royal Enfield.
My W800 has flawless fit and finish. When you get up close to all these bikes you see the little things. Not sure if I like the Himalayan's looks, but interesting to hear that you preferred the build quality over the Triumph. Price point is a tricky thing. What's wild is that my 1972 Honda had a really nice fit and finish compare to some bikes today hahaha. Cheers from NYC.
Aside: Honda's an interesting company that's taken chances, made intriguing bikes that were ahead of their time that sadly didn't capture an audience and you can now get for a lark (if you're patient)... and time has proven several of these models right.
Thank you Stuart. This is the story that I have waited for YOU to tell as I am hoping to add one of these two to my stable to join my Conti 650 and ‘04 Thruxton. Now I know how to proceed. Great job ! Vermont.
Thank you Stu. I am off to the NEC Friday and your insight will be useful. As regards the BSA, I have riden one, and it was an enjoyable experience. I found it on par with my Interceptor in many ways, but top end performance, 70mph +, it struggled. This of course may not be of any importance to potential buyers, but is noticeable to Interceptor owners. Ride safe & free.
I would only consider the Triumph if it was in the low 4000 pound price range say about £4295 and no more. RE motorcycle quality far exceeds Triumph in every way. What i would like to see is the RE water cooled engine in the Meteor range, maybe even the Hunter.
nicely put together Stuart - I'm not interested in either bike but still good viewing to see where the respective manufacturers are heading for future reference - there is one thing to be sure of though, the lady in the pink doc martens really liked the Triumph 😂
My Son and I will be visiting the NEC on Saturday to specially view the bikes featured here. Interesting observations and you are quite correct in saying that the devil is in the detail. From your footage and description, the Himalayan will be where we head first…….after a bacon sandwich ! An excellent video, as always.
@stuartfillingham The shocks manufacturer for the Triumph is a company called Endurance. They are based in India and make really good suspension. Not Showa level good but almost there.
Excellent review, has Royal Enfield come out with a King killer? The king of course would be the venerable KLR 650, virtually unchanged for the past 37 years. It would be great to do a side by side review of the KLR vs the new RE Himalayan. God Bless
Good Morning Stu , I have to agree i think your spot on with Triumph vs Royal Enfield in the terms of fit & finish , strange about the BSA stand with hardly any one there , i was hoping to go myself to the NEC but none of my mates could get the time off , so take care & as always ride safe
Since Triumph 400 is made by Bajaj, it's suspension is most probably made by Endurance. Emdurance is a major Indian component manufacturer. They have a technical tie up with WP suspension systems (KTM AG), to manufactuer high end WP USD suspensions and mono shocks.
I'm anxiously awaiting the arrival of the new Himalayan in the US. I completely agree with what you showed and said that it looks more like Triumph is banking on their brand in selling the 400 over that of the Himalayan or similar more offerings. Here in the US the starting price of the Scrambler 400 X is $5595. I am hoping that the Himalayan 450 comes in close to that price being that the jury is still out on reliability since this is version 1.0 of that platform for RE. Considering what you would seem to be getting over the 400, I dare to say I'd be willing to go around $6k. We shall see. RE has a real chance to showcase where they are headed in terms of quality to price/performance with the Himalayan 450 in my honest opinion from what I have seen and heard thus far.
2023 Himmy MSRP at the local dealer in Ohio is $5450 plus all the taxes and fees. So I doubt the MSRP of the new base model will be under $6500. The Summit model may be near $7000 plus taxes and fees which will be $8000+ before it's out the door.
Hoping to see a road version with the 450 motor in it,maybe a cafe racer like the old GT 535 with a polished engine that would look good & a smaller 450 Interceptor.I was looking at the Truimph but i will wait to see what Royal enfield bring out next year with the 450cc engine.
yea...once this Himmy came out I feel for BSA cos theyve stagnated! And yes Triumph is fully utilising Bajajs capabilities with cheap build and I thought the same when I saw the 400 here in India...that this just makes a big deal from the badging...the bike itself is very average Indian commuter quality and in that sense feels too expensive for the kit it has!
also would like to add that the Triumph scrambler just feels like a design exploration of the street bike, whereas the Himmy looks properly badass because it's built to a purpose!
Morning Uncle Stu. First off, the BSA saga. Like many other vloggers, I have ridden the Goldstar, a couple of times. One short winter ride in horrible conditions, and then a much longer ride in sunshine and dry roads. I still can’t figure out what I think of it. Would I have one, yes…..maybe…..err….I don’t know ! That’s how it has me feeling. It’s not a bad bike, in fact in certain areas it’s very good, but……there is that niggling BUT, and I don’t know why. I didn’t go to the show, was the much awaited BSA Scrambler there, like last year ? I haven’t seen or heard it being mentioned again. As for the new Himalayan vs Triumph 400, I do look forward to having the opportunity to take these out for a bimble at some point. I haven’t seen either in the flesh yet, but like you, those levers on the Triumph would definitely put me off. You have to hope the finished bikes were not like that 🤔. Thanks for putting this together.
Great and fair review of both bikes. Totally agree with your views there. RE have definitely upped their game. Shame about the BSA stand. Not sure what market they’re hoping to tap into though?
Another great video and wish I could have been there on a School Day to say Hi! So pleased I’m not the only person to have observed these details…the new Royal Enfield Himalayan not only looks superior but has surpassed any of the other Motorcycle brands in the extensive terrain rides actually through the Himalayans before going on sale! If I could own 1 more bike as well as my current Interceptor, it would definitely be this magnificent multi purpose beast 👊
Thanks sincerely! Great impressions! In my humble opinion, this Yank loves them both, but at 6’5” and 18 stone, I’ll need something in the 650cc+ class!
@@imwatchingyou6113 Yes, something like that. In 2006, I rode my 2004 XR650R to South America. My friend , Dave, rode his f650 Dakar!. I had no problems except for the final drive chain. I had no Cush Drive, eventually. I flew back to the U.S., and rode my 2001 R1150 GS (with a Ural sidecar) .back to Santiago de Chile.
Great to window shop all the new retro bikes. Still can't justify buying a new bike after comparing my old Kawasaki W650 in price, HP, weight, engine quality and simple air cooling. Same HP as W800.
BSA have only the one model, just in different colours. Although I am still tempted by it, a lack of local dealers holds me back. True and pertinent comments concerning the new Royal Enfield Himalayan verses the Triumph 400 Scrambler, for me it is the price that we will be asked to pay here in the UK for these models that will decern whether we are getting value for money.
Hay Stu', I've just read Markrigg7032. Makes me think that a colab with Nathan the Postman might be just the thing for you. I know he has a Trumpet scrambler on order and I doubt it will be long before he has 450 RE on the fleet. Not only could you do a detailed comparison but, he could take you on some gentle green lanes to evaluate them off road, head to head.
I'm off to Motorcyclelive tomorrow and will see all the bikes there. The Himalayan is the main interest though, looks quality. Liking RE more and more, real world value in this crazy world. Great videos Stuart.
You made my day . I started driving Royal Enfield back in mid 70s and spent a life time driving it in the hill state Iim western Himalayas . Now watching this bike making making a name for itself in countries I never imagined it ever will …is a pleasant and heady feeling . Hard work 😓 and commitment of the company has started making handsome dividends .
Very different bikes and I would imagine they are aimed at different segments of the market despite being of similar capacities. Personally, I haven't seen either close up and I don't for one moment dispute that the RE may have the edge in terms of quality, fit and finish. However, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and I think the Triumphs are much more visually appealing when it comes to the aesthetics. That alone will make a big impact in terms of sales. We all want to own/ride a bike that looks good and for my money the RE looks a bit weird whereas the Triumph is pretty.
I think the speed 400 looks very good for the money. They had to cut corners somewhere or they would have been 5.5 and 6k bikes. And that would have made them less appealing than the competition. I'm impressed by the Himalayan though.
Well Stuart, I managed to appear in your video but didn't spot you or I would have said 'hello'. Agree with your comments on the new Himalayan, just have to wait and see how RE decide to price it!
I was only there for a couple of hours monday, looking at completely different stuff to you🤣. I went to look for potential trade partners and to look at how people were interacting on the stands and general interest of products. It's been a long time since I went to one of these, but it does feel a lot smaller than the past, I also didn't quite get the logic of selling sofas there -but demographics.... I also noted that on some stands the staff were allergic to conversation, which was kind of odd too. I did a bit of a cursory dive for figures, and didn't find everything but the scales are interesting. The UK's top selling bike over 125cc was the meteor with 1350 units sold in a year. Royal Enfield sells 69000 a month in India and 79,000 globally . Bajaj produce 6.9 million units a year of all vehicle types. Although the UK has shown growth, it's still tiny volumes for these guys. That monster Suzuki outboard motor was something else as well....
Others might have covered the same stuff but I, and I am sure your other viewers, value your unique perspective (welcome the OCD part). As a rider of a 12-year-old Classic500, I am in the market for a new bike and your thoughts on the Himalayan vs the Triumph are pretty interesting.
The more I see the new Himalayan the more I like it! It look like a proper Adventure Bike & you can see the DNA from the Himalayan 411! I also just noticed stu on close up that the exhaust is by Arrow Quality in my opinion! Looking forward to the price announcement from you soon! Good video! PS I to am surprised that BSA haven’t attracted more of a crowed? Is it because at the moment they only offer the Gold Star?
Great video. Thank you. Three small capacity bikes of interest to me - 452 Himalayan; Triumph Scrambler 400; CFMoto 450MT. Looking forward to spring 2024 😀
The Scrambler 400 looks cool. Not sure I can say the same about the Himalayan, as its proportions seem somewhat off. I imagine both bikes will represent pretty good bang for your buck though
I agree, the Himalayan looks like it is just aping the GS. I already have a GS and I´m looking for a small capacity bike so the last thing I want is something that´s trying to look like a GS.
@RobVespa Seems like an extremely biased comment. Triumph sales are continuing to increase, their bikes continue to collect awards, and they're continuing to expand into new segments with these 400s, the new MX bikes and a new 660 sport bike. With their ambitious future plans, RE and Triumph both strike me as brands that are anything but tired
I was at the show on Monday, I have great interest in the 400-500cc scrambler market ,.. I checked out the Fantic Caballero 500 after seeing both the RE and Triumph 400 x. The Fantic was head and shoulders above the rest in all departments. Hopefully I test ride will confirm my findings. 👍
I agree uncle Stu, if they are both the same price then definitely prefer Himalayan. If the Himi price is above £6k (and I suspect it will) it will need much further thought. You could say that RE parts and service is cheaper than Triumph so ownership will be cheaper in the long run. But then again the 400X is using subpremium parts so parts price might be ok. Lets wait for the RE price and see.
Thanks Stu for your insights on both the bikes manufactured from India . Himalayan is keenly awaited by adventure seeking biking afficianodes in india and its price would be reveled shortly . RE have spared no efforts to make it an international product
Hey, you must watch the U tube podcast interaction by Siddhartha Lal , the boss of Royal Enfield to get an insight about making of Himalayan and also watch the reviews of U Tubers particularly by Big bear Customs , Sugar Sheldekar ,Anubhav Bhatt ......
Hi stu, great vid as usual. Did you get a good look at the new RE bullet 350 while you were there? Im hovering between getting the classic 350 or the new bullet. 😬
I’d say there are bikes for all tastes, up to everyone to pick up the one that suits best. I’ve passed the age when I struggled to assess who was stronger, Hulk or the Thing 😆✌️
My thoughts are the same as yours Stuart, I've Had a 2010 Bonneville SE 865 and then a Street Triple 675 quality bikes, 400 is definitely built to a budget as you say in September I purchased a new Himalayan 411 after riding one back in 19, I love the 411 not being too far from Hitchcocks also for parts it's easier on the pocket for servicing... OK not the same ride but a more relaxed ride which I can fit my bags on the frames and tent and go. Nice Review Stuart.I definitely will be looking at adding the 452 later. Amazing job from RE
I definitely had my pocketbook READY to purchase the New Triumph! I hadn’t seen 1 in person yet ( USA ) but I’m exactly like you Stuart… Attention to detail over the top for me also. Thanks 4 the TRUTH… Cheers from Montana
I have an Himalayan 411. I really like the idea of a bit more power but the tank of the new one looks so ugly in the pictures. Does it look any better in real life?
I'm the spring i will now make the effort to make it to one of the RE ride events. The green or blue 350 and Himalayan are on the list as well as the intercepter.
To my eyes BSA shot their bolt way to soon with over hyping the Gold Star and then failing to bring it to market at the time their said (That's what put me off getting one). Over a year late to market and lets face it, it should be called the B33. The original Gold Star was always the competition ready model, not a bog standard road bike! Also it's great to have some honest opinions on the Triumph 400. So many RUclips channels just bleat on like some over excited child at Christmas.
I've had my GoldStar since 1st March, of course its a road bike and a very good one, it's 650 single engine is a peach, totally different to a twin for character
I suggest using the term sub-par wholly vanilla generic motorcycle leveraging a brand and nostalgia to make money - or the easy to remember acronym of sorts, SWVGMLBNMM.
Never been a BMW fan but their stand was amazing, got to sit on the new GS start it up rev it, throw it on the floor and pick it up to see how 'light' it is :) Sat on the BSA, its comfy and well made. Was quite surprised what you can get for 6.5k these days.
Just seen a vlog on the new Himalayan engine built bt Sherpa, incredible motor,dry sump,water coolers,11-1 compression,6 speed,airbox mounted high up under tank.."induction noise"the frame is unit construction so lighter,I can't wait for you to road test one&get your opinion..Ian
So glad to hear from someone who shares my lack of enthusiasm for blacked-out motorcycles! Chrome and stainless are so much easier to maintain in good nick than paint, and more expensive to produce as well. Besides, don't we want to be visible to other drivers on the road??
welds are decent enough I would be happy turning out that quality. potential issue with the Triumph though, it looks like they have had to grind them back before painting.
OK, Stuart, wasn't the BSA Scrambler on display this year? I remember a prototype being there last year it looked impressive apart from the horrible wrapped exhaust, I've never liked wrapped exhausts, they look to me like they are trying to hide something underneath the wrapping. A black ceramic coating would be far nicer on that BSA Scrambler i.m.h.o.
The RE and Triumph stands have a much bigger range of bikes to view than BSA with really no new bikes other than the blacked out GoldStar. It's price is now undercutting the Interceptor but I agree with you the black one isn't as nice as my black/chrome one is but that was £800 dearer, your choice. My bike has been nothing but a joy and i just love its character, its a keeper.
Mmmmmm uncle Stu, have you (you have) upset the triumph fan boys with the truth? For some one who says he not a fan of black bikes and that includes me, I get the impression your Bobber customisation is a work of art as much as love for the bike which makes the criticism of the 400 in this reveal very real. Price will be interesting and pivotal for RE, but here in Australia from my experience, the RE dealers and service are way way in front. Bike price and dealer support go together.👍
Good video& thoughts... realise you've bikes from both brands so your comparison on quality etc is understandable. But I wonder if we're just caught in what the marketeers want in talking about them, when these bikes are apples and oranges to each other. I haven't seen a single reference on line to a 150kg 40hp scrambler that's been out for a few years now, Scrambler version vs Triumph and a high travel suspension version vs the Himalayan. I test rode a Fantic Caballero 500 scrambler a few weeks ago, it's build quality is better than 411 RE's and better than what you describe of the Triumph, and some really nice machined parts. Looks like a good bike, not without its flaws, it won't 'off road' to the extent of the RE or perhaps have the pub/coffee shop 'brand appeal' of the Triumph. However, in its two guises it's more of a natural competitor of use to both bikes. Against the RE there is also the CFMoto 450MT which is due. Seems a shame that a good 150kg, 40bhp bikes gets overlooked by brand comparison. Hopefully buyers will see through brand hype & look for bikes that meet their riding objectives. Looking forward to seeing all these bikes in the flesh at the show later in the week!
Great review from Stu, so far I've only seen marketing videos disguised as reviews of these bikes. There's way too much 'associate' stuff on YT, it's hard to know what to believe. Those levers on the Triumph are really bad and securing the clutch lever hinge with black painted Philips screw is shoddy. Tells me the baby Triumph won't be durable, while RE have taken a big step up in quality.
I noticed the gold wheel RE model had tubed spoke wheels while the other with black wheels were tubeless spokes. I wonder if the latter is an upgrade. I indeed hope it's offered. Too bad if not. I'm more concerned about that than matching levers but I appreciate your keen observations and concur regarding fit and finish of the 2 models.
BSA failed miserably in their marketing. They showed off their new model, with loads of hype and then nothing happened for over a year, and then it was a trickle. I've still never seen one on the road. All the hype died. All the people who would have bought one bought something else. They missed the boat. The triumph are competing with the 350 enfields. The himalayan is in a different sector really. The decision whether to buy a 350 for the price or 400 for the performance is a difficult one, but the himalayan isn't a looker and not the style of bike I'm after, so is irrelevant. I'm also suspicious that they're going to set the price too high...
BSA are suffering from only one bike in their range. Triumph looks better in my eyes than the RE but I’m not ready to down grade from a 1200 yet but when I’am I would consider both.
Wow.... This certainly is food for thought buddy. I was all set to trade my Tiger 800 for a 400X (I still have a 1000S Multi for motorway) but I gotta take a look and consider a pivot here.
Hi there Stuart. Yes I believe everything you say. You have proven that all your opinions up to now are correct. BUT in the pictures and videos this new Himalayan looks ugly, while the triumph looks beautiful. People usually want their bikes to look good. I have the hunter 350 and want to buy a classic 350 but I would never buy the new Himalayan, I see would buy the Scram if I wanted a dual purpose or I would look somewhere else. But looks are just a personal opinion. I could be wrong.
I'll stick with my 22 Himmy. With the bike being discontinued, they made it an instant classic. That's fine with me :-) Build quality of the 450 seems to be really impressive, but it's too modern for my taste. And it has a couple lines i don't like at all. The Triumph looks a tad bit toy- ish to me. I wish both companies good success with their new models.
The greatest challenge for brand BSA has always been the ‘it’s just a badge, init, bought by some new start-up’ reflection. As fine and as good looking as the Gold Star is, beezer haven’t done themselves any favours by not bringing anything new to the party - have they run out of ideas? Have they run out of R&D budget? Does this outfit have legs? Reasonable questions any potential tyre kicker may ask. I’ll not be attending this year’s show so thanks for the roundup, but last year BSA had a decent looking scrambler concept, they could at least have followed through with a prototype…
Hello Stuart, perhaps with time BSA will gain more public interest/confidence? I guess they are still seen as the new kid on the block and need to prove themselves over time. RE have a large well established dealer network which may reassure buyers.
How does some one keep interest In a bike ( BSA 650 ) THAT YOU CANT GET. Like the Honda nt1100 I wanted so bad and now still hasn't come to the USA. They can sell all they want over there now but even though I had a Yamaha sr 500 I wouldn't have one.
Great review, tbh and this is my personal opinion, Triumph and especially BSA are just re-ashed imitations and their company's just cashing in on a brand name. Royal Enfield however, are a well established motorcycle manufacturer, their motorcycles are put together with heart and sole with a massive cult following The new Himalayan certainly ticks my boxes
I had the privilege to see both bikes in person and I may never had believed until I saw that RE has passed triumph in build quality and I really hope that's the case in performance too.
😊😊
It isn’t case in build quality as well
The weight difference will impair the RE against the Triumph. +17kg to the Scrambler and +28 to the Speed 400.
I struggle to see how you can say the RE has better build quality
LOL@@murraymarshall5865
The new water cooled Sherpa engine in the Himalayan 450 offers interesting possibilities for future models. A Scram 450 with 19”/17” wheels is an obvious replacement for the Scram 411. A roadster with 17”/17” wheels using the same engine would also be a possibility.
Shortening the engine stroke from 81.5mm to 54mm would create a 300cc engine that would be 27.5mm shorter and produce about 27bhp. This could be used to update the 350 models and put them on a par with the Honda 300s while being more affordable and making them better able to cope on fast roads.
From there RE could make a 600cc twin with about 54bhp, or offer a restricted version for A2 riders, and update the Interceptor/Super Meteor/Continental GT models.
Previous generations of KTM 125/200 &250/390 shared engines.
Just bought my first bike - a used 2020 Royal Enfield Himalayan, with lots of accessories and aluminium bags + topcase. The overall condition is great, it looks new to me. Also the price (4k€) was appealing, for the package + the very trustworthy person who sold it to me.
Now, with the release of the Himalayan 450 (a week after my purchase), I dont know how to feel about it... I am still very happy with my choice, I guess. Maybe in a couple of years, after riding the 411 long enough, I could move on and get a full evolved 450...
Bike models get updated all the time, which means that the prices asked of the outgoing model will (probably) be lower. Its not rocket science. And I have a 411 Himalayan.
@@longjonwhite Yes, if feels like that... I think the most important aspect doing so, is to find someone who is fair, trustworthy and offering something well maintained. I think the communication, the meeting and agreement in the end - this can't be surpassed so quickly. I am just in love with the bike as well and cannot wait for spring. Thx for the comment, have a good night.
The Himalayan 411 is a beast. It's a really good and solid bike, with what i personally feel a more posh design for a tourer. Sad to see it discontinued, but it's great that you got one.
@@vibhupande Jaha, I got one! Was riding today (dry and sunny day in Berlin) - I have a really good feeling, no regrets :p
Been emailing BSA for months with no reply. Due to your video the other week I decided to take the plunge and Went to the show this week with a view to ordering one, wow what an experience! Guys in the BSA Tee shirts all stood around chatting and blatantly ignored me. Finally got the attention of a south African lady (judging by her accent) She was very arrogant and irritable, obviously thought she was too good to talk to a possible customer. They act like they have the best product in the world but its an unproven slightly awkward revamp in a very competitive market! will be ordering an Interceptor this week end!
They actually act like they dont want to sell any bikes!
Definitely interesting times. I’ve bought two new REs on the basis that they were small capacity bikes that whilst not sporting premium parts or modes were built at a fair price and worked well. Whilst I think it’s good that RE are producing something premium now I hope that they don’t stop selling reasonably priced models.
I’ll look forward to seeing your new channel bike and thank you for another honest observation
I would choose Himalayan for only 2 thing. Google map integration with your phone. Game changer. Even a GS 1300 doesn't provide that. Well done RE
I.m trading my 350classic in for bsa tomorrow. 350classic lovely bike but i have 500 trials and 350 matchless. So i thought bsa would give me more variety obviously being a larger bike. Local dealer had it at 5495 new in red and chrome. . I think maybe the quiet stand for bsa was mainly due to there being only one model? Nothing new. Quite a lot of negatively around the bikes but not usually from owners. It was the same with the interceptor. Another prob is price. 6700/7000 is a bit much when looking at competition. But 5495 i am happy with.
Here in India himalayan is launched at price range from ₹269000 to ₹284000, so in UK i will retail around £5.5k-6.5k max
The more often I see the new Himalayan the less ugly it gets........ Thank you for sharing your thoughts about the built quality details of both bikes.
Its best angle is from on top. The black one looks smashing
They are both good looking bikes. I want a small capacity bike that still has the power to overtake on the motorway when required. I would not be doing any serious off-road. With a great service interval, good power and economy the triumph ticks all of my boxes. The Enfield is gorgeous and if the price is right I will seriously consider it. It is nice to have some choices in the lower capacity bikes sector. As you mentioned both look like good bikes so I would probably be chuffed with either.
I've been looking at buying a smaller capacity bike. Took a serious look at the 350 Hunter...viewed a really good second hand one a few months ago.....but then the Triumph arrived on the scene. l haven't viewed one yet, but it looks as if it will float my boat. Stu's views are interesting regarding some of the finishing.....it's a bit of a dilemma now..!
@@brianperry I have also thought about the hunter but I want to be able to do motorway miles comfortably. That is the only thing that puts me off the hunter. As he mentions in the video the triumph is not a bad bike. But it sounds like there are obvious areas of cost cutting. As long as they don't effect the longevity or performance of the bike then I can forgive that sort of thing. Especially for a competitive price. But it is a dilemma. Still it is nice to have this much choice at the lower end of the bike market.
I’d like to swap to one of these but I think I’ll wait for the bugs to be ironed out first. I bought a first edition Triumph Street twin and had loads of problems which I assumed have now been fixed now on the later models. Triumph bikes are great until problems arise then it’s an uphill battle. I wouldn’t know about Royal Enfield.
Have you considered a "scooter"?
@@brianperrytriumph 400 has vibration issue when it reaches 90 kmph 😢
Next bike for the channel needs to be Himalayan, maybe you could take us off on some trips down some of the Yorkshire back lanes 👍
My W800 has flawless fit and finish. When you get up close to all these bikes you see the little things. Not sure if I like the Himalayan's looks, but interesting to hear that you preferred the build quality over the Triumph. Price point is a tricky thing. What's wild is that my 1972 Honda had a really nice fit and finish compare to some bikes today hahaha. Cheers from NYC.
Aside: Honda's an interesting company that's taken chances, made intriguing bikes that were ahead of their time that sadly didn't capture an audience and you can now get for a lark (if you're patient)... and time has proven several of these models right.
Thank you Stuart. This is the story that I have waited for YOU to tell as I am hoping to add one of these two to my stable to join my Conti 650 and ‘04 Thruxton. Now I know how to proceed. Great job !
Vermont.
Thank you Stu. I am off to the NEC Friday and your insight will be useful. As regards the BSA, I have riden one, and it was an enjoyable experience. I found it on par with my Interceptor in many ways, but top end performance, 70mph +, it struggled. This of course may not be of any importance to potential buyers, but is noticeable to Interceptor owners. Ride safe & free.
I would only consider the Triumph if it was in the low 4000 pound price range say about £4295 and no more. RE motorcycle quality far exceeds Triumph in every way. What i would like to see is the RE water cooled engine in the Meteor range, maybe even the Hunter.
I think your Hunter wish is already in development!
nicely put together Stuart - I'm not interested in either bike but still good viewing to see where the respective manufacturers are heading for future reference - there is one thing to be sure of though, the lady in the pink doc martens really liked the Triumph 😂
Thank you Stu for a general comparison. It will be good when test rides are available
My Son and I will be visiting the NEC on Saturday to specially view the bikes featured here. Interesting observations and you are quite correct in saying that the devil is in the detail.
From your footage and description, the Himalayan will be where we head first…….after a bacon sandwich !
An excellent video, as always.
Hey Stu, will we get another Christmas ghost story this year? The last one was really good.
Im not sure if i have another in me!
Blimey, it doesn’t seem like a year has passed since I read that spooky story.
@stuartfillingham
The shocks manufacturer for the Triumph is a company called Endurance. They are based in India and make really good suspension. Not Showa level good but almost there.
I had trouble focusing on the motorcycles because of all the hotties in the background.
Excellent review, has Royal Enfield come out with a King killer? The king of course would be the venerable KLR 650, virtually unchanged for the past 37 years.
It would be great to do a side by side review of the KLR vs the new RE Himalayan.
God Bless
I think the also venerable DR650 would stand tall over either.
Good Morning Stu , I have to agree i think your spot on with Triumph vs Royal Enfield in the terms of fit & finish , strange about the BSA stand with hardly any one there , i was hoping to go myself to the NEC but none of my mates could get the time off , so take care & as always ride safe
Since Triumph 400 is made by Bajaj, it's suspension is most probably made by Endurance. Emdurance is a major Indian component manufacturer. They have a technical tie up with WP suspension systems (KTM AG), to manufactuer high end WP USD suspensions and mono shocks.
But neither have the reputation of SHOWA
I'm anxiously awaiting the arrival of the new Himalayan in the US. I completely agree with what you showed and said that it looks more like Triumph is banking on their brand in selling the 400 over that of the Himalayan or similar more offerings. Here in the US the starting price of the Scrambler 400 X is $5595. I am hoping that the Himalayan 450 comes in close to that price being that the jury is still out on reliability since this is version 1.0 of that platform for RE. Considering what you would seem to be getting over the 400, I dare to say I'd be willing to go around $6k. We shall see. RE has a real chance to showcase where they are headed in terms of quality to price/performance with the Himalayan 450 in my honest opinion from what I have seen and heard thus far.
2023 Himmy MSRP at the local dealer in Ohio is $5450 plus all the taxes and fees. So I doubt the MSRP of the new base model will be under $6500. The Summit model may be near $7000 plus taxes and fees which will be $8000+ before it's out the door.
Hoping to see a road version with the 450 motor in it,maybe a cafe racer like the old GT 535 with a polished engine that would look good & a smaller 450 Interceptor.I was looking at the Truimph but i will wait to see what Royal enfield bring out next year with the 450cc engine.
I would like to see a 452 SCRAM!!! 19" tubeless tyres and I'm set...
My local dealer, Baxter Cycle in Marne, Iowa sells both Triumph and Royal Enfield - Win Win ! !
yea...once this Himmy came out I feel for BSA cos theyve stagnated! And yes Triumph is fully utilising Bajajs capabilities with cheap build and I thought the same when I saw the 400 here in India...that this just makes a big deal from the badging...the bike itself is very average Indian commuter quality and in that sense feels too expensive for the kit it has!
also would like to add that the Triumph scrambler just feels like a design exploration of the street bike, whereas the Himmy looks properly badass because it's built to a purpose!
@@romeldiaswell said Sir 👍🤔
Morning Uncle Stu. First off, the BSA saga. Like many other vloggers, I have ridden the Goldstar, a couple of times. One short winter ride in horrible conditions, and then a much longer ride in sunshine and dry roads. I still can’t figure out what I think of it. Would I have one, yes…..maybe…..err….I don’t know ! That’s how it has me feeling. It’s not a bad bike, in fact in certain areas it’s very good, but……there is that niggling BUT, and I don’t know why. I didn’t go to the show, was the much awaited BSA Scrambler there, like last year ? I haven’t seen or heard it being mentioned again. As for the new Himalayan vs Triumph 400, I do look forward to having the opportunity to take these out for a bimble at some point. I haven’t seen either in the flesh yet, but like you, those levers on the Triumph would definitely put me off. You have to hope the finished bikes were not like that 🤔. Thanks for putting this together.
Great and fair review of both bikes. Totally agree with your views there. RE have definitely upped their game.
Shame about the BSA stand. Not sure what market they’re hoping to tap into though?
I've put my name down on the Himalayan. Had a really good chat with one of the design team.
Another great video and wish I could have been there on a School Day to say Hi!
So pleased I’m not the only person to have observed these details…the new Royal Enfield Himalayan not only looks superior but has surpassed any of the other Motorcycle brands in the extensive terrain rides actually through the Himalayans before going on sale!
If I could own 1 more bike as well as my current Interceptor, it would definitely be this magnificent multi purpose beast 👊
I did toy with the idea of the Triumph, but now that I've seen the new Himmy, my Scram's ultimate replacement will be another Enfield.
Thank you Stuart. I was considering one of these two as my next bike. I think the Himalayan may be it.
If it's just down to these two for whatever reason, the RE is the wiser choice.
Thanks sincerely! Great impressions!
In my humble opinion, this Yank loves them both, but at 6’5” and 18 stone, I’ll need something in the 650cc+ class!
So you will be going for a royal Enfield 650cc Interceptor then 🤔
@@imwatchingyou6113 Yes, something like that.
In 2006, I rode my 2004 XR650R to South America. My friend , Dave, rode his f650 Dakar!. I had no problems except for the final drive chain. I had no Cush Drive, eventually. I flew back to the U.S., and rode my 2001 R1150 GS (with a Ural sidecar) .back to Santiago de Chile.
😮At my age (69 years), I’m happy to do the limit, but I’m too old now :-(
I loop
Great to window shop all the new retro bikes. Still can't justify buying a new bike after comparing my old Kawasaki W650 in price, HP, weight, engine quality and simple air cooling. Same HP as W800.
BSA have only the one model, just in different colours. Although I am still tempted by it, a lack of local dealers holds me back. True and pertinent comments concerning the new Royal Enfield Himalayan verses the Triumph 400 Scrambler, for me it is the price that we will be asked to pay here in the UK for these models that will decern whether we are getting value for money.
Great job, thanks for sharing.
Hay Stu', I've just read Markrigg7032. Makes me think that a colab with Nathan the Postman might be just the thing for you. I know he has a Trumpet scrambler on order and I doubt it will be long before he has 450 RE on the fleet. Not only could you do a detailed comparison but, he could take you on some gentle green lanes to evaluate them off road, head to head.
Thanks SF. Great job. Good info. God bless.
HAPPY TRAILS
I'm off to Motorcyclelive tomorrow and will see all the bikes there. The Himalayan is the main interest though, looks quality. Liking RE more and more, real world value in this crazy world. Great videos Stuart.
Brilliant video as always Stuart and I think a Himalayan is due in your garage - soon 😃👍🏻
You made my day . I started driving Royal Enfield back in mid 70s and spent a life time driving it in the hill state Iim western Himalayas . Now watching this bike making making a name for itself in countries I never imagined it ever will …is a pleasant and heady feeling . Hard work 😓 and commitment of the company has started making handsome dividends .
Very different bikes and I would imagine they are aimed at different segments of the market despite being of similar capacities. Personally, I haven't seen either close up and I don't for one moment dispute that the RE may have the edge in terms of quality, fit and finish. However, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and I think the Triumphs are much more visually appealing when it comes to the aesthetics. That alone will make a big impact in terms of sales. We all want to own/ride a bike that looks good and for my money the RE looks a bit weird whereas the Triumph is pretty.
I think the speed 400 looks very good for the money. They had to cut corners somewhere or they would have been 5.5 and 6k bikes.
And that would have made them less appealing than the competition.
I'm impressed by the Himalayan though.
Well Stuart, I managed to appear in your video but didn't spot you or I would have said 'hello'. Agree with your comments on the new Himalayan, just have to wait and see how RE decide to price it!
I was only there for a couple of hours monday, looking at completely different stuff to you🤣. I went to look for potential trade partners and to look at how people were interacting on the stands and general interest of products. It's been a long time since I went to one of these, but it does feel a lot smaller than the past, I also didn't quite get the logic of selling sofas there -but demographics.... I also noted that on some stands the staff were allergic to conversation, which was kind of odd too. I did a bit of a cursory dive for figures, and didn't find everything but the scales are interesting. The UK's top selling bike over 125cc was the meteor with 1350 units sold in a year. Royal Enfield sells 69000 a month in India and 79,000 globally . Bajaj produce 6.9 million units a year of all vehicle types. Although the UK has shown growth, it's still tiny volumes for these guys. That monster Suzuki outboard motor was something else as well....
Others might have covered the same stuff but I, and I am sure your other viewers, value your unique perspective (welcome the OCD part). As a rider of a 12-year-old Classic500, I am in the market for a new bike and your thoughts on the Himalayan vs the Triumph are pretty interesting.
The more I see the new Himalayan the more I like it! It look like a proper Adventure Bike & you can see the DNA from the Himalayan 411! I also just noticed stu on close up that the exhaust is by Arrow Quality in my opinion! Looking forward to the price announcement from you soon! Good video!
PS I to am surprised that BSA haven’t attracted more of a crowed? Is it because at the moment they only offer the Gold Star?
I think that exhaust is non standard.
Great video. Thank you. Three small capacity bikes of interest to me - 452 Himalayan; Triumph Scrambler 400; CFMoto 450MT. Looking forward to spring 2024 😀
The Scrambler 400 looks cool. Not sure I can say the same about the Himalayan, as its proportions seem somewhat off.
I imagine both bikes will represent pretty good bang for your buck though
I agree, the Himalayan looks like it is just aping the GS. I already have a GS and I´m looking for a small capacity bike so the last thing I want is something that´s trying to look like a GS.
One of them will. A decent percentage of the cost for the other is for the increasingly tired brand which comes with a free set of corporate luggage.
@RobVespa Seems like an extremely biased comment. Triumph sales are continuing to increase, their bikes continue to collect awards, and they're continuing to expand into new segments with these 400s, the new MX bikes and a new 660 sport bike.
With their ambitious future plans, RE and Triumph both strike me as brands that are anything but tired
I was at the show on Monday, I have great interest in the 400-500cc scrambler market ,.. I checked out the Fantic Caballero 500 after seeing both the RE and Triumph 400 x. The Fantic was head and shoulders above the rest in all departments. Hopefully I test ride will confirm my findings. 👍
I’ve been watching many reviews of the 400X, but never heard all those details. Thanks for your sharp look at it 👍😉
I agree uncle Stu, if they are both the same price then definitely prefer Himalayan. If the Himi price is above £6k (and I suspect it will) it will need much further thought. You could say that RE parts and service is cheaper than Triumph so ownership will be cheaper in the long run. But then again the 400X is using subpremium parts so parts price might be ok. Lets wait for the RE price and see.
Thanks Stu for your insights on both the bikes manufactured from India . Himalayan is keenly awaited by adventure seeking biking afficianodes in india and its price would be reveled shortly . RE have spared no efforts to make it an international product
Hey, you must watch the U tube podcast interaction by Siddhartha Lal , the boss of Royal Enfield to get an insight about making of Himalayan and also watch the reviews of U Tubers particularly by Big bear Customs , Sugar Sheldekar ,Anubhav Bhatt ......
s.certainly. Himalyan 450 outshines Triuimp 400x in all fronts
Hi stu, great vid as usual. Did you get a good look at the new RE bullet 350 while you were there? Im hovering between getting the classic 350 or the new bullet. 😬
I’d say there are bikes for all tastes, up to everyone to pick up the one that suits best. I’ve passed the age when I struggled to assess who was stronger, Hulk or the Thing 😆✌️
Very informative , I’m definitely holding off on that 400x now
Thinking of downsizing from 1200 gs and both of these look appealing
My thoughts are the same as yours Stuart, I've Had a 2010 Bonneville SE 865 and then a Street Triple 675 quality bikes, 400 is definitely built to a budget as you say in September I purchased a new Himalayan 411 after riding one back in 19, I love the 411 not being too far from Hitchcocks also for parts it's easier on the pocket for servicing... OK not the same ride but a more relaxed ride which I can fit my bags on the frames and tent and go. Nice Review Stuart.I definitely will be looking at adding the 452 later. Amazing job from RE
I definitely had my pocketbook READY to purchase the New Triumph!
I hadn’t seen 1 in person yet ( USA ) but I’m exactly like you Stuart… Attention to detail over the top for me also.
Thanks 4 the TRUTH…
Cheers from Montana
Hello young man ...what did you think of the new green colour on the bullet with the new very comfortable seat..thanks..👍
I have an Himalayan 411. I really like the idea of a bit more power but the tank of the new one looks so ugly in the pictures. Does it look any better in real life?
I'm the spring i will now make the effort to make it to one of the RE ride events. The green or blue 350 and Himalayan are on the list as well as the intercepter.
To my eyes BSA shot their bolt way to soon with over hyping the Gold Star and then failing to bring it to market at the time their said (That's what put me off getting one). Over a year late to market and lets face it, it should be called the B33. The original Gold Star was always the competition ready model, not a bog standard road bike! Also it's great to have some honest opinions on the Triumph 400. So many RUclips channels just bleat on like some over excited child at Christmas.
I've had my GoldStar since 1st March, of course its a road bike and a very good one, it's 650 single engine is a peach, totally different to a twin for character
I suggest using the term sub-par wholly vanilla generic motorcycle leveraging a brand and nostalgia to make money - or the easy to remember acronym of sorts, SWVGMLBNMM.
Never been a BMW fan but their stand was amazing, got to sit on the new GS start it up rev it, throw it on the floor and pick it up to see how 'light' it is :)
Sat on the BSA, its comfy and well made. Was quite surprised what you can get for 6.5k these days.
Nice one Stuart, never been interested in the old Himalayan but the new model has really peaked my interest....
Just seen a vlog on the new Himalayan engine built bt Sherpa, incredible motor,dry sump,water coolers,11-1 compression,6 speed,airbox mounted high up under tank.."induction noise"the frame is unit construction so lighter,I can't wait for you to road test one&get your opinion..Ian
$3,827.78 new Himalayan price announced in India at today's exchange rate.
Nice video .
Thanks
That triumph looks smart!
I hope you'll fell better Stu 🙏 I can hear you're sick 🤒
Well spotted, I thought that was a fair review. Thanks
So glad to hear from someone who shares my lack of enthusiasm for blacked-out motorcycles! Chrome and stainless are so much easier to maintain in good nick than paint, and more expensive to produce as well. Besides, don't we want to be visible to other drivers on the road??
Thankyou stu. Ive never been able to gell with the hinkley triumph company, ive no idea why.
How would you judge the weld quality on the 450 frame as they had , not so nice looking welds in some if thier older products ..
welds are decent enough I would be happy turning out that quality. potential issue with the Triumph though, it looks like they have had to grind them back before painting.
OK, Stuart, wasn't the BSA Scrambler on display this year? I remember a prototype being there last year it looked impressive apart from the horrible wrapped exhaust, I've never liked wrapped exhausts, they look to me like they are trying to hide something underneath the wrapping. A black ceramic coating would be far nicer on that BSA Scrambler i.m.h.o.
It was just a one off custom project. not a prototype im afraid.
Hey stew, did you get a chance to try out the meteor 350 ? The new colors look great on the bike.
I did cover it here
Is there any mention of service intervals for the Sherpa engine?
The RE and Triumph stands have a much bigger range of bikes to view than BSA with really no new bikes other than the blacked out GoldStar. It's price is now undercutting the Interceptor but I agree with you the black one isn't as nice as my black/chrome one is but that was £800 dearer, your choice. My bike has been nothing but a joy and i just love its character, its a keeper.
Mmmmmm uncle Stu, have you (you have) upset the triumph fan boys with the truth? For some one who says he not a fan of black bikes and that includes me, I get the impression your Bobber customisation is a work of art as much as love for the bike which makes the criticism of the 400 in this reveal very real. Price will be interesting and pivotal for RE, but here in Australia from my experience, the RE dealers and service are way way in front. Bike price and dealer support go together.👍
Good video& thoughts... realise you've bikes from both brands so your comparison on quality etc is understandable. But I wonder if we're just caught in what the marketeers want in talking about them, when these bikes are apples and oranges to each other.
I haven't seen a single reference on line to a 150kg 40hp scrambler that's been out for a few years now, Scrambler version vs Triumph and a high travel suspension version vs the Himalayan.
I test rode a Fantic Caballero 500 scrambler a few weeks ago, it's build quality is better than 411 RE's and better than what you describe of the Triumph, and some really nice machined parts.
Looks like a good bike, not without its flaws, it won't 'off road' to the extent of the RE or perhaps have the pub/coffee shop 'brand appeal' of the Triumph. However, in its two guises it's more of a natural competitor of use to both bikes.
Against the RE there is also the CFMoto 450MT which is due.
Seems a shame that a good 150kg, 40bhp bikes gets overlooked by brand comparison.
Hopefully buyers will see through brand hype & look for bikes that meet their riding objectives.
Looking forward to seeing all these bikes in the flesh at the show later in the week!
Great review from Stu, so far I've only seen marketing videos disguised as reviews of these bikes. There's way too much 'associate' stuff on YT, it's hard to know what to believe. Those levers on the Triumph are really bad and securing the clutch lever hinge with black painted Philips screw is shoddy. Tells me the baby Triumph won't be durable, while RE have taken a big step up in quality.
I noticed the gold wheel RE model had tubed spoke wheels while the other with black wheels were tubeless spokes. I wonder if the latter is an upgrade. I indeed hope it's offered. Too bad if not. I'm more concerned about that than matching levers but I appreciate your keen observations and concur regarding fit and finish of the 2 models.
namaste uncle stuart 🙏 RE just officially released price for new himalayan and for UK its 5750/-
BSA failed miserably in their marketing. They showed off their new model, with loads of hype and then nothing happened for over a year, and then it was a trickle. I've still never seen one on the road. All the hype died. All the people who would have bought one bought something else. They missed the boat.
The triumph are competing with the 350 enfields. The himalayan is in a different sector really. The decision whether to buy a 350 for the price or 400 for the performance is a difficult one, but the himalayan isn't a looker and not the style of bike I'm after, so is irrelevant. I'm also suspicious that they're going to set the price too high...
Calling their new bike a Goldstar was the first mistake.
If I remember well, the BSA engine is a good old mono Rotax, already seen on many motorbikes. Very few R&D costs. Am I right or not ?
Is the triumph a pre production bike?
thanks Stuart, I like the utility and hardiness of the Himalayan, you've called it right I believe this will be a seller
The test will be 10k miles . Which bike won't break or leak or have cluth issues , stem issues etc. .
Or gearbox failure!
BSA are suffering from only one bike in their range. Triumph looks better in my eyes than the RE but I’m not ready to down grade from a 1200 yet but when I’am I would consider both.
Wow.... This certainly is food for thought buddy. I was all set to trade my Tiger 800 for a 400X (I still have a 1000S Multi for motorway) but I gotta take a look and consider a pivot here.
Hi there Stuart. Yes I believe everything you say. You have proven that all your opinions up to now are correct. BUT in the pictures and videos this new Himalayan looks ugly, while the triumph looks beautiful. People usually want their bikes to look good. I have the hunter 350 and want to buy a classic 350 but I would never buy the new Himalayan, I see would buy the Scram if I wanted a dual purpose or I would look somewhere else. But looks are just a personal opinion. I could be wrong.
I'll stick with my 22 Himmy. With the bike being discontinued, they made it an instant classic. That's fine with me :-)
Build quality of the 450 seems to be really impressive, but it's too modern for my taste. And it has a couple lines i don't like at all. The Triumph looks a tad bit toy- ish to me.
I wish both companies good success with their new models.
The greatest challenge for brand BSA has always been the ‘it’s just a badge, init, bought by some new start-up’ reflection. As fine and as good looking as the Gold Star is, beezer haven’t done themselves any favours by not bringing anything new to the party - have they run out of ideas? Have they run out of R&D budget? Does this outfit have legs? Reasonable questions any potential tyre kicker may ask. I’ll not be attending this year’s show so thanks for the roundup, but last year BSA had a decent looking scrambler concept, they could at least have followed through with a prototype…
Hello Stuart, perhaps with time BSA will gain more public interest/confidence? I guess they are still seen as the new kid on the block and need to prove themselves over time. RE have a large well established dealer network which may reassure buyers.
Thanks for that Stuart.
How does some one keep interest In a bike ( BSA 650 ) THAT YOU CANT GET. Like the Honda nt1100 I wanted so bad and now still hasn't come to the USA. They can sell all they want over there now but even though I had a Yamaha sr 500 I wouldn't have one.
Great review, tbh and this is my personal opinion, Triumph and especially BSA are just re-ashed imitations and their company's just cashing in on a brand name.
Royal Enfield however, are a well established motorcycle manufacturer, their motorcycles are put together with heart and sole with a massive cult following
The new Himalayan certainly ticks my boxes
Naah ! Triumph 400 is made by Bajaj and it's a really good company TBF
u forgot mention the coolant box in horrible place in Triumph