A couple of months ago you mentioned the INEOS hull shape with waves, and today their hull shape paid off. Great analysis mate, and looking forward to tomorrow!!
To finish first, first you have to finish. This is about engineering as much as sailing. It's not luck, it's a package. Both amazing teams, great racing.
It seems people lose sight of this in favor of their bias. LR is a great team and I thought that they where going to run away with the win, however, LR are now in significant danger of losing the LVC because INEOS have the advantage in reliability. That's not a subjective statement, that's objective.
@@WaiWill Indeed. I've been thinking this was a possible vulnerability almost from that first instance in the preliminary series when they gifted a race to TeamNZ. It's a real shame, because they're generally better than that, and it certainly has not been a pattern in former events.
@@Gottenhimfella It's been a while and I completely forgot about the issue LR had in the preliminary race against NZ. So, that makes *four* race-ending incidents. Geez...
@@jamesaron1967 They certainly need to lift that part of their game even if they do get lucky against GB (which is still eminently possible). The kiwis took the lessons of 2003 very much to heart, and a few of those veterans are still in high positions on the team.
Exactly, coming to this from endurance motorsport I can't help but think "to finish first, first you have to finish". Reliability is part of the game, and it isn't luck...
The components that failed TWICE on LR (the arm system) is provided to all teams by the same provider (chosen by ETNZ). And yet it only failed on LR . TWICE
Thank you for your analysis and engagement. As a non-sailor (well, I was lucky enough to go sailing one time in the San Francisco bay... and when they were kind enough to let me have a hand at the till I steered us directly into the dead spot behind Alcatraz and they had to bring out the outboard, lol) this type of data analysis and commentary helps me understand what is going on at such a deeper level. That experience on the SFBay though was one of the greatest experiences... when the spinnaker came out and ballooned out on the way back to the dock (the wind came back to us right when they finally got the outboard setup... sheepish me saved by kismet) it was quite exhilarating.
Excellent insights to give some explanation of the differences in both tactics and equipment on these new boats. I personally love this technology and you add so much to the enjoyment along with Planet Sail to give us so much to enjoy.
As an Italian, I must compliment you for being objective: the two boat were so close in performance, at least with this sea and wind, that there was very little between them. The difference was made by the general superiority of Team INEOS at the start, over LR, and we saw that, with these boats and with good wind, when you get ahead you almost always win the race. I still think the KIWIs will eat anyone of these two teams for breakfast, having shown a comfortable superiority in match making over anyone else they met, and a very fast boat, too, but I'd rather see the most competent team fighting as close as possible in the AC, and so far the Brits shown to be superior to the Italian where skill count.
As a Kiwi, providing the ozzy gobshite doesn't win, then I don't care. Sorry LR. However, a week ago, I thought LR had the edge over Ineos but the Brits seem to have polished up to make them evens with LR. It's fantastic racing either way.
If Ineos do make it through (we're British, so we may well still find a way to lose!) we'd have to hope that the impressive improvements they've made since the prelims will make it a competitive match. Because as you say, at that stage ETNZ were a different class. Also Ineos have been enjoying tough racing, which is surely better training than Te Rehutai sailing around on her own. You're probably right, but Ineos has exceeded many people's expectations against LR, so it's not unthinkable that she may surprise the Kiwis too...
I am Italian as well and I fully agree with the compliments to Mozzy Sails as well as the general overview you gave. It's shame that some Italian sailing channels cannot have the bigger picture that you are having. INEOS is fantastic team but this would have ended sooner in favor of LR without the crazy amount of small and big mistakes that they made since the comeback of American Magic. I also want to highlight that while all the other teams improved their performances, LR is the only one that stayed at the same level (which was high) as at the beginning of the series. That's not how you win the AC and they deserve to lose. INEOS is just a different boat compared to 45 days ago. Well done, INEOS!
@@peter_peter_pumpkin_eater He's toned down his attitude, maybe just a bit of age, maybe he's been told not to? Either way he seems much less irritating than he has been in the past!
Ima Canadaian, but couldn’t agree more. I thank the Italians and Brits for this great racing series. If the Kiwis are as strong as being said, the next series will be an exercise in boredom. Kiwis by a landslide is not good for the spectators, or the sport.
Thanks Mozzie for your great technical analysis. I have to say that your input added to some unbelievable racing and of course the very insightful Inside Tack show have made this series truly enjoyable
I'm a NZ'r and avid America's Cup follower since 1987 Dixon vs Conner. I've learned alot from your analysis which is unbiased and clear. Hope Brits win LV, so race on in A'cup. Thank you.
Great coverage. Love it and it comes from a LR fan. As some have already mentioned, not much is being offered from the official channels, so you are closing an important gap in a great way.
The coverage of this AC is not great. Very little media, no podcasts or significant daily content (outside of Inside Tack) so a big thanks to Mozzy for putting out these videos and providing the best post-race analysis out there.
Thanks for all your analysis. Your to humble towards the Brittish crew. The British crew did a great job. Trottle down when needed. Push at the good moment. Their recovery from the rudder ventitation was impressive. I am an independed viewer from The Netherlands.
Hi Mossi, I know nothing about sailing but am loving the cup racing. For me it is quite clear that the Italians have a brittle boat, you don’t turn up to the cup with a boat that keeps breaking down As for luck everyone seems to forget the race in light winds GB would of won and the penalty before yesterday race. Any one who thinks it is luck should see our Bens medals…Go GB
The Brits have one of the most reliable yachts in this AC compared to the other challengers. Everyone else has had issues going back to the preliminaries. Some people believe that if LR didn't suffer all those failures they'd be ahead in this series. Maybe, maybe not. The fact is we cannot know the events of an alternate timeline. If anything, today proved GB can score points without a DSQ. This is a yacht design competition. Designing a yacht that is not only fast but reliable is part of the game. You may have a rocketship but if your boat keeps breaking down you're going nowhere fast. Another point, _Britannia_ appears to handle a wild sea state better. I was impressed by how she kept on pushing through the waves almost undeterred. That may prove to be an advantage in such days if INEOS faces ETNZ.
A lot of people have sneered at that bustle, calling Britannia a bus and the like. But given the quality of the design team, I suspected that it was designed for tricky seas, as we saw today. And it does seem to bounce them back onto the foils with minimum losses.
@@tullochgorum6323 Yes, exactly what I was thinking watching both races. INEOS designed a yacht specifically for this venue and from the looks if it has succeeded with that design objective.
The conditions for the Cup Match itself will be interesting. There seems to be an abrupt change in the weather patterns in early October, but whether that occurs this year or it happens a few weeks later will be important.
Hey mate, what jumped out at me from the charts is the big difference in TWS between the boats. This is either due to measurement bias (hopefully not, as then everything has error) or INEOS doing a much better job of putting the boat in the right place. As you know, if they've managed to sail in 2-3knots more pressure on average, then the VMG numbers are going to be much better (and probably why they appear to be lower and faster upwind). Anyway, just saying that I don't think you can draw many conclusions on the performance due to design without normalising for TWS. Great job from them for being in more pressure, and great job from you for presenting all this stuff. Keep it up!
Love this series and the technology on show. As a big F1 fan for years I appreciate how advanced this all is. In looking at this from an F1 perspective then mechanical issues are just a part of the game. LR might have cut corners or taken decisions that have given them speed but at the risk of unreliability. Could be they gambled on lighter wind conditions and the recent weather has caused them issues. Old adage is “to finish first, first you have to finish”. My sense is that Brittania looks like it’s more difficult to handle but with bigger rewards if they get it right.
great commentary and explanation. I don't think there is any luck involved. if something breaks it is due to poor manufacture choices or maintenance. If you touch down and shade off speed it's sailing skill. I am so enjoying this race. such fine margins.
As always. Great analysis & insight. I do think the design weaknesses on the deck configuration around the mast on LR point to advantages in that area for INEOS.
Shout out to sponsor Allen Bros for the detailed info they have on their fittings on their website. In an age where we buy so much sailing hardware online, it's great to have dimensioned drawings to scale to make sure parts will fit before buying. They're ahead of all the competition on the front.
Yup - very difficult to understand from such an experienced team. With a penalty pretty much losing you the race with such closely matched packages, why on earth did they cut things so fine??
Luna Rosa are a class team but the boat handling errors have lead to losses, not just equipment failures. Ineos have raced more conservatively but more consistently
You highlight the bustle on bRITAannia. The IMOCA 60's have started to change the shape of the bustle by adding a flared area at the bottom of the bow, achieved by modifying the bow's bottom section to stop the bow digging in. It might even allow the bow to "ski". It will be interesting if it actually improves the performance of the boats with it and to see if it spins off to the AC boats in years to come.
Surely a scow bow that is designed primarily to avoid slamming into the waves in a following sea in the Southern Ocean in what can only be described as the half-foiling that the current Imocas are capable of must have limited relevance for these fully foiling in-port match racers?
with my very rudimentary skills , the diagrams were incomprehensible to me, but the excellence of the explanations I can grasp have me a fan of the best analysis I have found.
The British boat is a lot quicker down wind. About a third of the way through the first round Rob series, I noticed that the British boat had a lot more power in their rig. You can see that when they go downhill, they just have so much more power and can pull away.
As an Italian INEOS deserves to be ahead due to their consistency and better starts. LR consistently starts poorly and committed more mistakes (and more equipment failures which should not happen this late in the series). The boats are very close as you say so it boils down to a better crew. The Ainslie/Fletcher combo is performing better than Spithill/Bruni who are very experienced but too old (especially Bruni) and no longer at their peak to manage boats manoeuvring at 30+ knots. LR should have fielded Tita/Gradoni who are superb.
Go Ineos Brittania! Always been a admirer of Sir Ben. 👍😎🇦🇺💪 I had a great feeling about their chances before it started when I heard they were going in a different direction with the foils than the other teams.
@mozzy I agree, GB won both starts today and managed the conditions really well. Totally deserved wins. I must say I had expected more agression from LR overall, esp. in starts, based in previous cups, but somehow that hasn't come about. Maybe there's less confidence / more risk aversion? But they have to go hard now, expect some fireworks!! Very exciting for sure.
I agree. In kind I commented on RUclips 4 years ago when Team NZ successfully defended in Auckland. I said that TNZ's boat had a flatter hull which gave them more/easier hull lift just like the "ground effect" technology used in the Soviet Ekranoplan.
Thanks for the great coverage! The AC75s seem to have an F1 problem... race is frequently over by the start, win the start, win the race. While this is largely true in any match race, it seems very pronounced in these big boats. The one AC40 match race wasnt enough data to compare, but racing seemed more competitive in the 40s.
Good review. Think you perhaps forget that while LR has "gifted" a couple of wins to IB, IB have also lost a race due to lower wind limit/time out...and IB penalty for skidding out of bounds...instant 75m ...so all is fair in love and war...
Both boats were affected equally by the time limit/low wind. IB made an unforced error and sailed out of bounds. Luna Rosa had two mechanical issues. Not really the same thing.
@@thegibbonisrealit appears you are forgetting that Luna Rossa also made an unforced error with their flight control and lost control of the boat pitching her nose into the water at 46knots and blowing the jib sheet tackle. Second - at the time the race was limited out, IB was half a leg (on the final leg) ahead of Luna Rossa. Yes both boats were limited out, but only one lost the potential win-and that wasn’t Luna Rossa who would have gone down to defeat. The series would be done and dusted by now and LR would be going home. Luck has certainly played a part in her survival too.
@@andrealeone4784clearly not. 7 of the races have been sailed at the upper limit of the LV race rules- conditions which are almost universally acknowledged to favour LR, yet it is IB (which is better suited to moderate wind speeds (in the middle of the range) which is 2 races ahead. And let’s not get too critical of the very experienced Luna Rossa crew who are a match for anyone out there and Jimmy Spithill is a legend.
I was curious to see and compare the decks of both L.R. and INEOS, particularly after some of the decking came up on L.R. in their little whoopsie - notably flimsy, backed up by the multiple "NO STEP" signs, despite seeing at least on crew member stand on the broken area while they were scrabbling to patch things up. Looking at INEOS' deck in this latest race, it looks super clean, as well as a very different 'clew adjustment system' (not sure that is what it is but the cables exiting the deck on both port and starboard and seemingly entering the base of the mast). No "NO STEP" signs to be seen either. Just makes me think the INEOS team put significant effort into getting all the details 'well polished'. In saying that, both boats are obviously very competitive.
I don't know. A no step area arount the jib track doesn't seem like a big deal to me. It's not an area where you should walk anyway. And note that some of the no step signs were actually _under_ the fairings. Quite possible that the other boats have the same there. Had the British boat nosedived, it might also have popped a few cosmetic/aerodynamic coverings. That said, it didn't because they were the better sailors, as much as it pains me to say
Mozzy, Thanks for you great work. It's amazing how a guy in his study can do a better job of analysis than the professional commentators in Barcelona. Question: Colin Chapman the famous Formula 1 designer with Lotus said that you should make it lighter until it breaks and then you will know the limits. Do you think that Luna Rossa is built a little too light and that is what things keep breaking?
Great analysis as usual so thanks. Cant help but think LR is more like an Italian performance car, great to look at and fast when it works but....not so reliable for long distance runs ;-)
Mozzy complete newb here, but the design of the hulls, Luna is much more sculptured with rolling curves.. what my newb eye sees you can correct me if I am totally off base but INEOS has midship and on the front cutouts in the design that mimic the cant of the main sail and spinnaker. Do you think because of the sailing height of these foiled yachts that that scoop cutout would be catching extra wind and adding a slight speed boost in higher winds? Or is my theory rubbish? Keep up the great work.. we appreciate your efforts!
Interesting analysis of the depth of the Ineos main down low, not sure however if this photo was taken just after a tack and they were powered up to accelerate. It’s interesting to look at the jib. See how flat the Ineos jib is down low compared to LRPP. The sails on Luna Rossa look perfectly balanced between jib and main!
Told you I'd come to see your analysis, perfect as usual! Been half british and half italian I can also look at it from the "outside", in a race, reliability plays the main role, not luck, as in any sport, if a race car breaks, it'll loose, if pushed over its limits, it'll break and loose, if they make mistakes it'll loose. we heard too many times Checco shouting take the out off, coz the arm wouldn't go down, so reliability played the main role, not luck, the only "unlucky thing" probably was the gust of wind that got in the mainsail sandwich broke the batten and punched the sail (but was she been towed too fast/slow???? human mistake?..) LR has probably too many Jibs to choose from (15 and 6 mainsails) INEOS work and make the best of, with what they've got, chose to work with, changing all the time doesn't give you an advantage, on the contrary, Luck has little to do with this.. only probably a gust of wind could be lucky nothing else, but just that doesn't make a winner.
I don’t agree about using luck as a reason at this level. Perfect preparation and being more cautious on how INEOS use their boat , and Prada’s problems. As Tiger Woods said once about luck; “the more I train and practice, the luckier I get.
Il problema che i kiwi sono affidabili e veloci senza bisogno di trovare compromessi. Sono convinto che Luna Rossa avrebbe avuto più possibilità di ineos. Peccato.
Both teams have won 4 races each fairly. Largely due to making fewer mistakes than the other. Ineos are 2 ahead thanks to reliability. Therefore I think to even suggest luck is why Ineos are ahead is totally unfounded. They are (to this date) the more rounded team.
I think when people say "luck" they mean that INEOS had some unexpected breaks in this series, not that it's an inferior team in any way to have reached this point _only_ out of luck. Sailing skills and sound design have enabled INEOS to be a dominant team as much as any other reason if not more.
If you wanted to be nasty about it luna Rosa is very lucky that the wind died and ineos couldn’t finish and have this wrapped up now….. that’s just racing…..
Just saw an analysis of the LR sail failure by a rigger on one of the other teams. He says it's almost certainly down to an error by the sailing team - so that's not bad luck, it's bad judgement.
2:46 I might add the fact that the jury was postponing the start since the beginning, and only when Italy was struggling they didn't postpone anything and even right after giving the win to Britain they continued to postpone the second race
Great analysis as always Tom, thank you. It’s great racing and could go either way. But agree, it’s not luck. The only part of Ineos that still troubles me is the wide route and time spent getting around the windward mark. LR look compact around the mark and speeds are c. equal, but the tracks are wildly different. Can we understand why? Leeward is honours even in my view. LR being unlucky on one wave.
I agree with you but in race 10 they seemed to have improved the roundings. Maybe my imagination. In my amateur view point one rounding cost Ineos the race earlier.
Interesting as usual Tom Your observations on the main look right but seems to me INEOS have a flatter jib and LR fuller jib. I assume the deeper main on INEOS perhaps moves the CE down and the combo is presumably impacts the balance of the boat and perhaps adds to rudder size. It was said in the inside tack that the rudder in the water is like a laser ! Point being I don’t think you can look at the main in isolation but as a package with jib, foils and rudder the amount of power headed in to the rudder is bonkers and so far INEOS design seems to lose the rudder less often. PS when talking about the luck and lost races score don’t forget INEOS had a race in the bag and flied longer before it was timed out.
Hi Mozzy. Could you please explian more regarding the "rudder load" that you, Glen Ashby, Philippe Presti were mentioning, especially during the R9 when LR had a smaller jib. What the teams are aiming in terms of the rudder load and how does it affect the boat behaviour?
Btw Glean Ashby was saying that because LR had a smaller jib, it did't allow them to have more load on the rudder... I would think the opposite, the more balance is towards the mainsail the more load we have on the rudder.
Wow, enjoyed your thoughts & analysis for the last couple of years (since I came across your brilliant channel at the last ac) - regarding foil design, the, prototyping, design advantages - hydro & aerodynamics and all :-) - offcause including your talks w the boys. - thought that now it was back to ‘’only’’ enjoy the racing & official channel/ broadcasting. - but these racing rapports & analysis of the different teams, the boats & rigs incl tactics an all is on pair with the former :-)
Mozzy help! Just seen umpires baffling press conference. If a boat with rights has to alter course to safely avoid a collision, surely there’s been an infringement? Was that not the case for all cases they covered except the first? And what about the extremely late announcement of their movement of the windward mark on Wednesday? I haven’t seen any detailed analysis of the luff up on Wednesday, but one commentator seemed to suggest, while justifying no penalty, only the bowsprit of IB was overlapped. Do bowsprits no longer count as part of the boat? Finally, it looks like the boat with rights is being forced to sail dangerously to get a decision - do you think this is the fault of the rules themselves or the umpires’ interpretation? Thank you for your great coverage
My takeaway from the last 2 days ( windy then wavy) has been the need to balance jib and main. Whoever gets this nailed can deal with the dynamic conditions much more easily. I felt that early on all the teams pushed for small jibs to lower overall drag, chasing a "theoretical" better performance. But the rudders are so small in immersion that as soon as they have bobble from sea state you are taking skittish boats into not just knife edge control but scalpel type analogies. LRPP have undoubtedly had issues, but better race craft. IB have better reliability, possibly a better design package, certainly a better team in terms of learning from their mistakes and setting the boat up. Their race craft is more conservative and less flair. Everything else is "ifs, buts and maybes......" Cracking series. Whoever wins will give a formidable challenge to NZ, who may be training hard, but are much less battle hardened.
Regarding the rudders, I think if the AC75 class is retained for AC38 one of the rule revisions should be a more substantial rudder design compared to the skimpy rudders the yachts have now. I've lost count of how many times the teams lost or nearly lost control of their rudders sometimes causing them to fall off their foils. They need to be made more effective with greater surface area the way the foils were enlarged even if it costs some speed.
@jamesaron1967 I'm a big fan for keeping the class. But I don't personally feel that they should be easier to sail with more conservative geometry or sizing. If they weren't on the knife edge, where would the passing opportunities come from? Time to lose the vestigial bow sprit, and push the SA up and Overall Mass down..... Take all the handbrakes off!
@@Si-jk4iy Curious, in what way do you think they should increase SA? Reducing mass might be difficult if it cannot be accomplished without diminishing reliability. They cannot reduce the crew unless they go the AC40 route and make the yachts more automated. I'd prefer it if they didn't do that.
@jamesaron1967 Simplest route would be to allow taller masts with subsequent increase in both heads ails and mainsail sizes. Also wonder if multiple forestay points could be used to allow either further forward tack points for larger #1's and further back to allow the code 4 & 5's to be small yet higher aspect? Currently their vertical span is so stumpy at the smallest size as to give relatively little alignment flow to the mainsail behind them...... I agree on maintaining some semblance of human provided power rather than full automation. It would be an interesting set of interviews to get the designers takes on how to up the performance....... Cavitation is the glass ceiling, but early take-off and light air performance is crucial for staying TV friendly....... Especially if the circus stays in the Mediterranean. Which it would if LRPP win. How much more mass could be shed is a good question. The media package and comms system must be a considerable input.
Initially I thought INEOS would be quick in higher end conditions, but I can now see that the characterisation of the conditions that each boat favours are remarkably different. Bravo to both teams, will this 2 boat series provide clues as to beating ETNZ? - of that I am currently not sure...
Ineos have risen from earlier weakness to be a real contender. Both, Prada and Ineos are sailing beautifully. Just how will they compare to NZ. I am sure that Team NZ know. How exiting is this.
Enjoyable and informative as always. You could argue Ineos have benefited from Luna Rossa’s mistakes and to certain extent that is true. But it’s also true to say LR have benefited from Ineos’s mistakes. This is a game of perfection and you generally come second if you make an error. Those errors can be crew induced, poor design induced but more often than not weather/sea state induced. The team that makes the least number of errors wins.
Great content as usual. I am impressed by the TWS data for both races. You did not talk about that but the difference is huge : is there some measurements biais or that is just the advantage of being forward and able to control the race (wind shades to the trailing boat, chosing the side...) ?
Another first rate video Tom and interesting analysis. Your thoughts on the mainsail shape are interesting and I’d agree looks like too much belly on INEOs. But on just about all sailing boats that’s generally easy to flatten the sail with the out haul. Don’t really understand why they cannot?
Potentially two things: 1) out of travel on the outhaul (clew board) so cannot flatten further indicating sail is out of it's range. 2) not enough power in mainsheet ram due to structural limits... again boat sailing at top end of design They could recut the sail but adding structure or leverage to the ram will be more difficult
Well done Britannia!! For a few races now it seems as if GBR has gained on ITL when on starboard but loose ground on port. Is there any analysis on the helms? Is there any way to compare Ben, Dylan, Jimmy & Kecko?
You're the best Mozzy! I'm not a sailor but always follow the America's Cup. First clocked your great race analysis at the last AC in Auckland, and been coming back regularly. As a Kiwi living in England for over 30 years I'm really hoping Britannia nails the LVC on Friday. Then it'll be a dilemma of who to support in the AC lol! 😂 On balance, if Ineos make it to the AC, since NZ have had a good run of wins in recent decades, I'll be quietly hoping the Brits finally get to bring the America's Cup home after more than 175 years. But as we've seen plenty of times, it could all go tits up at any moment with these highly strung AC75s, so first things first and get the LVC done lads 🤞
As a Kiwi living in the UK since '96, I have no divided loyalties whatsoever - ETNZ all the way. INEOS Britannia is funded by a single individual, which might be a long-term financial vulnerability but is a short-term funding advantage - they don't have to generate revenue, they're purely a cost centre. Just as the UK has 340,00 registered rugby players to NZ's 146,00 and the England RFU's revenues are £221m to the NZ RFU's $NZ268m (£126m). Fundamentally, as in Rugby, by all metrics except skill & experience, ETNZ are the underdogs.
Yes, but... Budgets aren't everything. There's also the factor of public passion and commitment, which can make up for smaller amounts invested in purely money terms. As we both know, in NZ rugby and sailing are national obsessions! There's blanket media coverage of both sports when they're in a competition phase, and even when not. The stars are household names and hero worshipped. Many youngsters are inspired to take up the sports by this passionate public love and knowledge of them. In the UK, rugby and sailing are quite well down the list of sports popularity - especially sailing. Maybe a decent number of people know who Ben Ainslie is from his Olympic record, but I guarantee probably only 1% or fewer will know the names of Dylan Fletcher and the other members of the Ineos Brittania crew. In NZ, ALL the ETNZ boys will be known about. This lack of public interest and engagement is reflected in the scant media coverage there's been in the UK of the Louis Vuitton Cup. I've had to really go looking for articles in the mainstream press on the campaign so far. Contrast that with the NZ press and TV coverage, which has been constant and in depth. Up to this point I'd wager that probably over half the UK population have no idea the America's Cup is on at all, let alone that Britain has an entrant. That will change somewhat now Ineos is in the actual AC proper, and certainly grow if they do well, but we both know there's a huge difference between NZ and UK in public perception and support of the AC. My point is that in NZ there's a real CULTURE of sailing, and that's translated into the world's best boat design/building infrastructure, acknowledged by everyone in the sailing world. And not just that: the level of sailing skill with these advanced boats has been world beating for many decades - which is why many overseas syndicates have hired Kiwi skippers, grinders, trimmers over the years. Just look at the impressive but notorious record of Russell Coutts and Brad Butterworth: Kiwi AC heroes who jumped ship (literally!) and 'stole' the Cup back from us... So yes: Ineos Brittania might have a bigger budget for their campaign, but ETNZ are definitely the overdogs in terms of experience, technical expertise (the AC75 is their design, after all), and above all national passion and support. Overcoming that formidable overall package is a daunting task and likely to fail. You only need to see the bookies odds to see that Ineos are the underdogs: m.topsport.com.au/Sport/Yacht_Racing/Americas_Cup_2024/Futures
Hey Mozzy, are you going to bring Rob and Tom in again for any analysis videos? Loved those from the last cup as well as your solo stuff! Thanks for the awesome content
What about the gimme to Luna Rossa when the race was abandoned with Ineos 600 metres ahead on the final leg. The penalty incurred for boundary violation which gave Luna Rossa the race? They have both had issues.
AC isn't about old men in white suits saluting each other and the Queen as they sail past a jetty anymore. We are living in the 21st century and these are 21st century craft. Depends how you look at it and how you use the English language and understand highest level sports and rules: What is considered "luck" by one can be considered "fate" by another. There are rules and both sides are competing to and within those rules which are the same for all. SKILL is the word 🙂 As said. Other crews - even if sailing Ineos - would have most probably wiped out badly on several occasions. Great team sailing for GB. Wishing them ALL the best.
Lots of commentary from Sir Ben about the need to constantly develop. Based on the video and pictures Ineos have added more buttons and some sort of LED light gauge in the helms cockpits. Also, more comms about traveler between ben and Dylan can be heard. What do we think this development is?
Fantastic analysis, as ever, Mozzy. Thank you. Am I right in thinking that where the data shows one boat faster, it doesn't reveal if this comes from putting the boat in a windier part of the course, rather than from a naturally faster boat?
I believe the TWS (True wind) should cover that, and it looks clear IB had an advantage (meaning as leader they read the wind well). However that wasn't highlighted so not too sure about that analysis.
Mozzy can you please explain the AC jib selection and how that effects pointing, balance, speed etc. in different conditions (or have you already covered that in another video ?)
I would like to see Luna Rossa win, but I have to say that I don't see Spithil's legendary starts anymore, Ineos starts better than us, even if only slightly, but they are more aggressive, at the first tack they are almost always ahead. Bruni's high style that characterized the last Prada Cup is no longer seen. In short, if they don't change something in their attitude it will be tough... But Ineos deserves what they have!
LR slightly slower and more difficult to sail in the extreme sea state. Really as simple as that. Glen Ashby commented on the fact that LR's foil arms look draggier when temporarily immersed in wave peaks and there's something to that. Hard to tell but from video it seemed LR had sharper vertical accelerations than Ineos. This requires higher lift peaks and generates higher drag peaks. With a bit less wave LR is very competitive.
That's an Aire bus wing on the Silver bullet 😊 hence the Lunar Rose 🌹 Love you Mozzy Sail's 🌎 we don't know weather to barbeque you on the sun Witt joy, oar drown you at Time's 🌠 kinda lik'a Storm 🐳
At this level, it’s really the entire team, design, build, training, knowledge, skill, effort, learning, adapting, and above all minimizing mistakes. Great racing, as I was convinced that Luna Rosa had the whole package dialed, better than Britannia. But tiny margins make the difference, and Britannia seems to have the margins.
Mozzy, thank you so much, your analysis has been an added bonus to this most gripping of sporting events. May l most humbly add that we are somewhat in the dark with regard to the human element...let me give you an example...the enigma that is Sir Ben Ainslie. Capable of skippering a machine around the course that could be described as so futuristic to the general public as to be unbelievable, then to be hit with boundary penalties not once but say, half a dozen times, leaves me speechless. Ten year old beginners would surely understand the boundary rule and the 'over early' rule and never need to be reminded again. Let's be honest, whenever INEOS even head in the general direction of the boundary l start with a mild panic and end up with a Jaisus not again.
I think the last boundary breach was caused by going through the wake of LR which threw the bow of Ineos up and made the boat difficult to control. The AC boats are far more difficult to control than an F1 car, the guys are incredible in the circumstances.
Ineos last two starts were critical but they still had to complete 8 legs without error. This error free sailing is likely why Ben said it wasn't luck.
I know very little about sailing. I've become fascinated by this because it looks like 'F1 on water'. One observation I have is that Britannia isn't necessarily faster, but it travels less distance (less steep diagonals) than Luna Rossa and wins on that basis?
I think you're being a bit generous saying Luna Rossa would be 7-1 up if things had gone their way. One race they didnt make the start line so it could have gone either way, and another they came off foils before the start but were already behind Ineos at that point. They definitely could have had a healthy lead though. Thanks for your coverage
Your entire coverage and insight has been top notch mate. Cheers...
I bet the tactical teams of INEOS and LR’s first action after one of your vids drop is to watch it from start to finish! Well done and thank you😊
It’s far more informative than anything off the Americas cup coverage.
Agreed. Great analysis and very informative . Thanks.
Early on in the regatta lunna Rossa won by getting most of the wind shifts, by luck.
Your anysis has added so much to the enjoyment of the racing, thank you!
Glad to hear it!
A couple of months ago you mentioned the INEOS hull shape with waves, and today their hull shape paid off. Great analysis mate, and looking forward to tomorrow!!
To finish first, first you have to finish. This is about engineering as much as sailing. It's not luck, it's a package. Both amazing teams, great racing.
It seems people lose sight of this in favor of their bias. LR is a great team and I thought that they where going to run away with the win, however, LR are now in significant danger of losing the LVC because INEOS have the advantage in reliability. That's not a subjective statement, that's objective.
Mercedes F1 reliability and fabrication against Ferrari reliability and fabrication. I know which team I'd be backing!
@@WaiWill Indeed. I've been thinking this was a possible vulnerability almost from that first instance in the preliminary series when they gifted a race to TeamNZ. It's a real shame, because they're generally better than that, and it certainly has not been a pattern in former events.
@@Gottenhimfella It's been a while and I completely forgot about the issue LR had in the preliminary race against NZ. So, that makes *four* race-ending incidents. Geez...
@@jamesaron1967 They certainly need to lift that part of their game even if they do get lucky against GB (which is still eminently possible). The kiwis took the lessons of 2003 very much to heart, and a few of those veterans are still in high positions on the team.
It's the whole package that counts and a failure of any one of those components in that package at this level is showing to be very costly.
Exactly, coming to this from endurance motorsport I can't help but think "to finish first, first you have to finish". Reliability is part of the game, and it isn't luck...
The components that failed TWICE on LR (the arm system) is provided to all teams by the same provider (chosen by ETNZ).
And yet it only failed on LR . TWICE
Thank you for your analysis and engagement. As a non-sailor (well, I was lucky enough to go sailing one time in the San Francisco bay... and when they were kind enough to let me have a hand at the till I steered us directly into the dead spot behind Alcatraz and they had to bring out the outboard, lol) this type of data analysis and commentary helps me understand what is going on at such a deeper level.
That experience on the SFBay though was one of the greatest experiences... when the spinnaker came out and ballooned out on the way back to the dock (the wind came back to us right when they finally got the outboard setup... sheepish me saved by kismet) it was quite exhilarating.
Mozzie, you have provided that essential additional information throughout these campaigns, unmissable. Thank you
Excellent insights to give some explanation of the differences in both tactics and equipment on these new boats. I personally love this technology and you add so much to the enjoyment along with Planet Sail to give us so much to enjoy.
As an Italian, I must compliment you for being objective: the two boat were so close in performance, at least with this sea and wind, that there was very little between them.
The difference was made by the general superiority of Team INEOS at the start, over LR, and we saw that, with these boats and with good wind, when you get ahead you almost always win the race.
I still think the KIWIs will eat anyone of these two teams for breakfast, having shown a comfortable superiority in match making over anyone else they met, and a very fast boat, too, but I'd rather see the most competent team fighting as close as possible in the AC, and so far the Brits shown to be superior to the Italian where skill count.
As a Kiwi, providing the ozzy gobshite doesn't win, then I don't care. Sorry LR. However, a week ago, I thought LR had the edge over Ineos but the Brits seem to have polished up to make them evens with LR. It's fantastic racing either way.
If Ineos do make it through (we're British, so we may well still find a way to lose!) we'd have to hope that the impressive improvements they've made since the prelims will make it a competitive match. Because as you say, at that stage ETNZ were a different class. Also Ineos have been enjoying tough racing, which is surely better training than Te Rehutai sailing around on her own. You're probably right, but Ineos has exceeded many people's expectations against LR, so it's not unthinkable that she may surprise the Kiwis too...
I am Italian as well and I fully agree with the compliments to Mozzy Sails as well as the general overview you gave. It's shame that some Italian sailing channels cannot have the bigger picture that you are having. INEOS is fantastic team but this would have ended sooner in favor of LR without the crazy amount of small and big mistakes that they made since the comeback of American Magic. I also want to highlight that while all the other teams improved their performances, LR is the only one that stayed at the same level (which was high) as at the beginning of the series. That's not how you win the AC and they deserve to lose. INEOS is just a different boat compared to 45 days ago. Well done, INEOS!
@@peter_peter_pumpkin_eater He's toned down his attitude, maybe just a bit of age, maybe he's been told not to? Either way he seems much less irritating than he has been in the past!
Ima Canadaian, but couldn’t agree more. I thank the Italians and Brits for this great racing series. If the Kiwis are as strong as being said, the next series will be an exercise in boredom. Kiwis by a landslide is not good for the spectators, or the sport.
Thanks Mozzie for your great technical analysis. I have to say that your input added to some unbelievable racing and of course the very insightful Inside Tack show have made this series truly enjoyable
I'm a NZ'r and avid America's Cup follower since 1987 Dixon vs Conner.
I've learned alot from your analysis which is unbiased and clear.
Hope Brits win LV, so race on in A'cup.
Thank you.
Great coverage. Love it and it comes from a LR fan. As some have already mentioned, not much is being offered from the official channels, so you are closing an important gap in a great way.
The coverage of this AC is not great. Very little media, no podcasts or significant daily content (outside of Inside Tack) so a big thanks to Mozzy for putting out these videos and providing the best post-race analysis out there.
It is sad, because this AC has the potential with the tech and speeds to be the new NASCAR for the masses.
Thanks for all your analysis. Your to humble towards the Brittish crew. The British crew did a great job. Trottle down when needed. Push at the good moment. Their recovery from the rudder ventitation was impressive. I am an independed viewer from The Netherlands.
Hi Mossi, I know nothing about sailing but am loving the cup racing. For me it is quite clear that the Italians have a brittle boat, you don’t turn up to the cup with a boat that keeps breaking down As for luck everyone seems to forget the race in light winds GB would of won and the penalty before yesterday race. Any one who thinks it is luck should see our Bens medals…Go GB
Much more informative than the RUclips commentators. Thx 🙏🏻
The Brits have one of the most reliable yachts in this AC compared to the other challengers. Everyone else has had issues going back to the preliminaries. Some people believe that if LR didn't suffer all those failures they'd be ahead in this series. Maybe, maybe not. The fact is we cannot know the events of an alternate timeline. If anything, today proved GB can score points without a DSQ. This is a yacht design competition. Designing a yacht that is not only fast but reliable is part of the game. You may have a rocketship but if your boat keeps breaking down you're going nowhere fast. Another point, _Britannia_ appears to handle a wild sea state better. I was impressed by how she kept on pushing through the waves almost undeterred. That may prove to be an advantage in such days if INEOS faces ETNZ.
A lot of people have sneered at that bustle, calling Britannia a bus and the like. But given the quality of the design team, I suspected that it was designed for tricky seas, as we saw today. And it does seem to bounce them back onto the foils with minimum losses.
@@tullochgorum6323 Yes, exactly what I was thinking watching both races. INEOS designed a yacht specifically for this venue and from the looks if it has succeeded with that design objective.
@@jamesaron1967 its a brick but its OUR brick. britannia my beloved
The conditions for the Cup Match itself will be interesting. There seems to be an abrupt change in the weather patterns in early October, but whether that occurs this year or it happens a few weeks later will be important.
Great work, shame the Americas cup channel doesn’t use it.
Hey mate, what jumped out at me from the charts is the big difference in TWS between the boats. This is either due to measurement bias (hopefully not, as then everything has error) or INEOS doing a much better job of putting the boat in the right place. As you know, if they've managed to sail in 2-3knots more pressure on average, then the VMG numbers are going to be much better (and probably why they appear to be lower and faster upwind).
Anyway, just saying that I don't think you can draw many conclusions on the performance due to design without normalising for TWS.
Great job from them for being in more pressure, and great job from you for presenting all this stuff. Keep it up!
Love this series and the technology on show. As a big F1 fan for years I appreciate how advanced this all is. In looking at this from an F1 perspective then mechanical issues are just a part of the game. LR might have cut corners or taken decisions that have given them speed but at the risk of unreliability. Could be they gambled on lighter wind conditions and the recent weather has caused them issues. Old adage is “to finish first, first you have to finish”. My sense is that Brittania looks like it’s more difficult to handle but with bigger rewards if they get it right.
Esatto ma per portare via la coppa serviva la velocità di Luna Rossa
great commentary and explanation. I don't think there is any luck involved. if something breaks it is due to poor manufacture choices or maintenance. If you touch down and shade off speed it's sailing skill. I am so enjoying this race. such fine margins.
Great stuff. Well explained. Incredible deep dive knowledge. I very much appreciate your content. Thanks for your videos.
My pleasure!
As always. Great analysis & insight. I do think the design weaknesses on the deck configuration around the mast on LR point to advantages in that area for INEOS.
Shout out to sponsor Allen Bros for the detailed info they have on their fittings on their website. In an age where we buy so much sailing hardware online, it's great to have dimensioned drawings to scale to make sure parts will fit before buying. They're ahead of all the competition on the front.
Such wonderful analysis in lickety split time!
Good to listen to someone with insight and the prober sailing knowledge for a change
Great analysis. Also a couple of unforced start errors for IEOS - early entry & boundary penalty
Yup - very difficult to understand from such an experienced team. With a penalty pretty much losing you the race with such closely matched packages, why on earth did they cut things so fine??
Luna Rosa are a class team but the boat handling errors have lead to losses, not just equipment failures.
Ineos have raced more conservatively but more consistently
True, thoughIneos made quite a few tactical/helm mistakes throughout the campaign, nobody is perfect.
Hai ragione, ma non andando in finale la barca più veloce temo che la vecchia brocca starà in Nuova Zelanda altri 4 anni.
You highlight the bustle on bRITAannia.
The IMOCA 60's have started to change the shape of the bustle by adding a flared area at the bottom of the bow, achieved by modifying the bow's bottom section to stop the bow digging in. It might even allow the bow to "ski". It will be interesting if it actually improves the performance of the boats with it and to see if it spins off to the AC boats in years to come.
Surely a scow bow that is designed primarily to avoid slamming into the waves in a following sea in the Southern Ocean in what can only be described as the half-foiling that the current Imocas are capable of must have limited relevance for these fully foiling in-port match racers?
with my very rudimentary skills , the diagrams were incomprehensible to me, but the excellence of the explanations I can grasp have me a fan of the best analysis I have found.
Very kind, thank you
The British boat is a lot quicker down wind. About a third of the way through the first round Rob series, I noticed that the British boat had a lot more power in their rig. You can see that when they go downhill, they just have so much more power and can pull away.
Thanks for these great videos Mozzy. Really appreciate your insights.
As an Italian INEOS deserves to be ahead due to their consistency and better starts. LR consistently starts poorly and committed more mistakes (and more equipment failures which should not happen this late in the series). The boats are very close as you say so it boils down to a better crew. The Ainslie/Fletcher combo is performing better than Spithill/Bruni who are very experienced but too old (especially Bruni) and no longer at their peak to manage boats manoeuvring at 30+ knots. LR should have fielded Tita/Gradoni who are superb.
Go Ineos Brittania! Always been a admirer of Sir Ben. 👍😎🇦🇺💪 I had a great feeling about their chances before it started when I heard they were going in a different direction with the foils than the other teams.
I enjoy your posts. Thank you.
@mozzy I agree, GB won both starts today and managed the conditions really well. Totally deserved wins. I must say I had expected more agression from LR overall, esp. in starts, based in previous cups, but somehow that hasn't come about. Maybe there's less confidence / more risk aversion? But they have to go hard now, expect some fireworks!! Very exciting for sure.
Their boat is proving a bit fragile. Maybe they have to nurse her in the wilder conditions?
@@tullochgorum6323 Thrice bitten, fourth time shy. They're probably backing off a little out of concern.
I think the double tunnel on INEOS adds overall lift so there is less induced drag on the foils.
I agree. In kind I commented on RUclips 4 years ago when Team NZ successfully defended in Auckland. I said that TNZ's boat had a flatter hull which gave them more/easier hull lift just like the "ground effect" technology used in the Soviet Ekranoplan.
Fantastic roundup you are the goat.
Thanks for the great coverage! The AC75s seem to have an F1 problem... race is frequently over by the start, win the start, win the race. While this is largely true in any match race, it seems very pronounced in these big boats. The one AC40 match race wasnt enough data to compare, but racing seemed more competitive in the 40s.
They both look good right now. Will be interesting to see how the winner goes against the Kiwis.
Good review. Think you perhaps forget that while LR has "gifted" a couple of wins to IB, IB have also lost a race due to lower wind limit/time out...and IB penalty for skidding out of bounds...instant 75m ...so all is fair in love and war...
these were my thoughts exactly! if teh argument is IB have been lucky, LR have also been lucky by exactly the same logic
Both boats were affected equally by the time limit/low wind.
IB made an unforced error and sailed out of bounds.
Luna Rosa had two mechanical issues.
Not really the same thing.
Luna rossa è più veloce, è mancata affidabilità e timonieri italiani della nuova generazione
@@thegibbonisrealit appears you are forgetting that Luna Rossa also made an unforced error with their flight control and lost control of the boat pitching her nose into the water at 46knots and blowing the jib sheet tackle. Second - at the time the race was limited out, IB was half a leg (on the final leg) ahead of Luna Rossa. Yes both boats were limited out, but only one lost the potential win-and that wasn’t Luna Rossa who would have gone down to defeat. The series would be done and dusted by now and LR would be going home. Luck has certainly played a part in her survival too.
@@andrealeone4784clearly not. 7 of the races have been sailed at the upper limit of the LV race rules- conditions which are almost universally acknowledged to favour LR, yet it is IB (which is better suited to moderate wind speeds (in the middle of the range) which is 2 races ahead. And let’s not get too critical of the very experienced Luna Rossa crew who are a match for anyone out there and Jimmy Spithill is a legend.
I was curious to see and compare the decks of both L.R. and INEOS, particularly after some of the decking came up on L.R. in their little whoopsie - notably flimsy, backed up by the multiple "NO STEP" signs, despite seeing at least on crew member stand on the broken area while they were scrabbling to patch things up. Looking at INEOS' deck in this latest race, it looks super clean, as well as a very different 'clew adjustment system' (not sure that is what it is but the cables exiting the deck on both port and starboard and seemingly entering the base of the mast). No "NO STEP" signs to be seen either. Just makes me think the INEOS team put significant effort into getting all the details 'well polished'. In saying that, both boats are obviously very competitive.
I don't know. A no step area arount the jib track doesn't seem like a big deal to me. It's not an area where you should walk anyway. And note that some of the no step signs were actually _under_ the fairings. Quite possible that the other boats have the same there. Had the British boat nosedived, it might also have popped a few cosmetic/aerodynamic coverings. That said, it didn't because they were the better sailors, as much as it pains me to say
Mozzy, Thanks for you great work. It's amazing how a guy in his study can do a better job of analysis than the professional commentators in Barcelona.
Question: Colin Chapman the famous Formula 1 designer with Lotus said that you should make it lighter until it breaks and then you will know the limits. Do you think that Luna Rossa is built a little too light and that is what things keep breaking?
Great analysis as usual so thanks. Cant help but think LR is more like an Italian performance car, great to look at and fast when it works but....not so reliable for long distance runs ;-)
Mozzy complete newb here, but the design of the hulls, Luna is much more sculptured with rolling curves.. what my newb eye sees you can correct me if I am totally off base but INEOS has midship and on the front cutouts in the design that mimic the cant of the main sail and spinnaker. Do you think because of the sailing height of these foiled yachts that that scoop cutout would be catching extra wind and adding a slight speed boost in higher winds? Or is my theory rubbish? Keep up the great work.. we appreciate your efforts!
Awesome analysis.... game on tonight!
Interesting analysis of the depth of the Ineos main down low, not sure however if this photo was taken just after a tack and they were powered up to accelerate. It’s interesting to look at the jib. See how flat the Ineos jib is down low compared to LRPP. The sails on Luna Rossa look perfectly balanced between jib and main!
Told you I'd come to see your analysis, perfect as usual! Been half british and half italian I can also look at it from the "outside", in a race, reliability plays the main role, not luck, as in any sport, if a race car breaks, it'll loose, if pushed over its limits, it'll break and loose, if they make mistakes it'll loose. we heard too many times Checco shouting take the out off, coz the arm wouldn't go down, so reliability played the main role, not luck, the only "unlucky thing" probably was the gust of wind that got in the mainsail sandwich broke the batten and punched the sail (but was she been towed too fast/slow???? human mistake?..) LR has probably too many Jibs to choose from (15 and 6 mainsails) INEOS work and make the best of, with what they've got, chose to work with, changing all the time doesn't give you an advantage, on the contrary, Luck has little to do with this.. only probably a gust of wind could be lucky nothing else, but just that doesn't make a winner.
Ti dò ragione, ma per vincere contro i kiwi sarebbe stato meglio che in finale fosse andata la barca più veloce
I don’t agree about using luck as a reason at this level. Perfect preparation and being more cautious on how INEOS use their boat , and Prada’s problems. As Tiger Woods said once about luck; “the more I train and practice, the luckier I get.
Il problema che i kiwi sono affidabili e veloci senza bisogno di trovare compromessi. Sono convinto che Luna Rossa avrebbe avuto più possibilità di ineos. Peccato.
Both teams have won 4 races each fairly. Largely due to making fewer mistakes than the other.
Ineos are 2 ahead thanks to reliability. Therefore I think to even suggest luck is why Ineos are ahead is totally unfounded.
They are (to this date) the more rounded team.
Very true. Good engineering and fabrication and maintenance has nothing to do with luck!
I think when people say "luck" they mean that INEOS had some unexpected breaks in this series, not that it's an inferior team in any way to have reached this point _only_ out of luck. Sailing skills and sound design have enabled INEOS to be a dominant team as much as any other reason if not more.
If you wanted to be nasty about it luna Rosa is very lucky that the wind died and ineos couldn’t finish and have this wrapped up now….. that’s just racing…..
Peter Burling said this Cup would come down to the Sailors..I think we are seeing this
Just saw an analysis of the LR sail failure by a rigger on one of the other teams. He says it's almost certainly down to an error by the sailing team - so that's not bad luck, it's bad judgement.
2:46 I might add the fact that the jury was postponing the start since the beginning, and only when Italy was struggling they didn't postpone anything and even right after giving the win to Britain they continued to postpone the second race
The racing has been exciting. Thanks for the great insights
Great analysis as always Tom, thank you.
It’s great racing and could go either way. But agree, it’s not luck.
The only part of Ineos that still troubles me is the wide route and time spent getting around the windward mark. LR look compact around the mark and speeds are c.
equal, but the tracks are wildly different. Can we understand why?
Leeward is honours even in my view. LR being unlucky on one wave.
I agree with you but in race 10 they seemed to have improved the roundings. Maybe my imagination. In my amateur view point one rounding cost Ineos the race earlier.
Remember the Race which was abandoned also. Ineos realistically were v.unlucky there.
@americascup - you need to get Mozzy on a plane to Barcelona and in front of a camera - ideally for next week!
Thx for another interesting analysis
great comments Mozzy, the american cup without you woudn't be the same
Interesting as usual Tom
Your observations on the main look right but seems to me INEOS have a flatter jib and LR fuller jib. I assume the deeper main on INEOS perhaps moves the CE down and the combo is presumably impacts the balance of the boat and perhaps adds to rudder size. It was said in the inside tack that the rudder in the water is like a laser ! Point being I don’t think you can look at the main in isolation but as a package with jib, foils and rudder the amount of power headed in to the rudder is bonkers and so far INEOS design seems to lose the rudder less often.
PS when talking about the luck and lost races score don’t forget INEOS had a race in the bag and flied longer before it was timed out.
Hi Mozzy. Could you please explian more regarding the "rudder load" that you, Glen Ashby, Philippe Presti were mentioning, especially during the R9 when LR had a smaller jib. What the teams are aiming in terms of the rudder load and how does it affect the boat behaviour?
Btw Glean Ashby was saying that because LR had a smaller jib, it did't allow them to have more load on the rudder... I would think the opposite, the more balance is towards the mainsail the more load we have on the rudder.
Wow, enjoyed your thoughts & analysis for the last couple of years (since I came across your brilliant channel at the last ac) - regarding foil design, the, prototyping, design advantages - hydro & aerodynamics and all :-) - offcause including your talks w the boys.
- thought that now it was back to ‘’only’’ enjoy the racing & official channel/ broadcasting.
- but these racing rapports & analysis of the different teams, the boats & rigs incl tactics an all is on pair with the former :-)
Mozzy help! Just seen umpires baffling press conference. If a boat with rights has to alter course to safely avoid a collision, surely there’s been an infringement? Was that not the case for all cases they covered except the first? And what about the extremely late announcement of their movement of the windward mark on Wednesday? I haven’t seen any detailed analysis of the luff up on Wednesday, but one commentator seemed to suggest, while justifying no penalty, only the bowsprit of IB was overlapped. Do bowsprits no longer count as part of the boat? Finally, it looks like the boat with rights is being forced to sail dangerously to get a decision - do you think this is the fault of the rules themselves or the umpires’ interpretation? Thank you for your great coverage
My takeaway from the last 2 days ( windy then wavy) has been the need to balance jib and main. Whoever gets this nailed can deal with the dynamic conditions much more easily. I felt that early on all the teams pushed for small jibs to lower overall drag, chasing a "theoretical" better performance. But the rudders are so small in immersion that as soon as they have bobble from sea state you are taking skittish boats into not just knife edge control but scalpel type analogies. LRPP have undoubtedly had issues, but better race craft. IB have better reliability, possibly a better design package, certainly a better team in terms of learning from their mistakes and setting the boat up. Their race craft is more conservative and less flair.
Everything else is "ifs, buts and maybes......"
Cracking series. Whoever wins will give a formidable challenge to NZ, who may be training hard, but are much less battle hardened.
Regarding the rudders, I think if the AC75 class is retained for AC38 one of the rule revisions should be a more substantial rudder design compared to the skimpy rudders the yachts have now. I've lost count of how many times the teams lost or nearly lost control of their rudders sometimes causing them to fall off their foils. They need to be made more effective with greater surface area the way the foils were enlarged even if it costs some speed.
@jamesaron1967 I'm a big fan for keeping the class. But I don't personally feel that they should be easier to sail with more conservative geometry or sizing.
If they weren't on the knife edge, where would the passing opportunities come from?
Time to lose the vestigial bow sprit, and push the SA up and Overall Mass down..... Take all the handbrakes off!
@@Si-jk4iy Curious, in what way do you think they should increase SA? Reducing mass might be difficult if it cannot be accomplished without diminishing reliability. They cannot reduce the crew unless they go the AC40 route and make the yachts more automated. I'd prefer it if they didn't do that.
@jamesaron1967 Simplest route would be to allow taller masts with subsequent increase in both heads ails and mainsail sizes. Also wonder if multiple forestay points could be used to allow either further forward tack points for larger #1's and further back to allow the code 4 & 5's to be small yet higher aspect?
Currently their vertical span is so stumpy at the smallest size as to give relatively little alignment flow to the mainsail behind them......
I agree on maintaining some semblance of human provided power rather than full automation.
It would be an interesting set of interviews to get the designers takes on how to up the performance.......
Cavitation is the glass ceiling, but early take-off and light air performance is crucial for staying TV friendly....... Especially if the circus stays in the Mediterranean. Which it would if LRPP win.
How much more mass could be shed is a good question.
The media package and comms system must be a considerable input.
Initially I thought INEOS would be quick in higher end conditions, but I can now see that the characterisation of the conditions that each boat favours are remarkably different. Bravo to both teams, will this 2 boat series provide clues as to beating ETNZ? - of that I am currently not sure...
Avoiding material failures is an important part of winning this competition so not so much about being lucky or not
Awesome content, perfect to fill in the gap from the tv commentating.
Ineos have risen from earlier weakness to be a real contender. Both, Prada and Ineos are sailing beautifully. Just how will they compare to NZ.
I am sure that Team NZ know. How exiting is this.
That is the beauty of the Cup...the mystery & the anticipation!
Excellent and fair review. SV Skoiern IV
Enjoyable and informative as always.
You could argue Ineos have benefited from Luna Rossa’s mistakes and to certain extent that is true. But it’s also true to say LR have benefited from Ineos’s mistakes. This is a game of perfection and you generally come second if you make an error. Those errors can be crew induced, poor design induced but more often than not weather/sea state induced. The team that makes the least number of errors wins.
Great content as usual. I am impressed by the TWS data for both races. You did not talk about that but the difference is huge : is there some measurements biais or that is just the advantage of being forward and able to control the race (wind shades to the trailing boat, chosing the side...) ?
The measurement is often out so I don't tend to talk about it
Great vid as always!!!
Prada Challenge V America One LV cup (5-4) in 2000 was this century
yeah, good shout that, just enjoyed 10 minutes watching highlights
That was an awesome series.
"He's sailing below proper course!!!!!" I bet Paul just randomly yells this still to this day.
🤣
@@MozzySails 2007 Cup Final Alinghi v ETNZ - very closely contested.
Remember it was 3-3 in the America’s Cup proper last time so close racing is pretty normal at this stage.
Another first rate video Tom and interesting analysis. Your thoughts on the mainsail shape are interesting and I’d agree looks like too much belly on INEOs. But on just about all sailing boats that’s generally easy to flatten the sail with the out haul. Don’t really understand why they cannot?
Potentially two things: 1) out of travel on the outhaul (clew board) so cannot flatten further indicating sail is out of it's range.
2) not enough power in mainsheet ram due to structural limits... again boat sailing at top end of design
They could recut the sail but adding structure or leverage to the ram will be more difficult
Well done Britannia!!
For a few races now it seems as if GBR has gained on ITL when on starboard but loose ground on port. Is there any analysis on the helms? Is there any way to compare Ben, Dylan, Jimmy & Kecko?
Great insights! Thanks.
Can Allen deliver to Fiji! 😂
Go Ben and the Team!
You're the best Mozzy! I'm not a sailor but always follow the America's Cup. First clocked your great race analysis at the last AC in Auckland, and been coming back regularly.
As a Kiwi living in England for over 30 years I'm really hoping Britannia nails the LVC on Friday. Then it'll be a dilemma of who to support in the AC lol! 😂 On balance, if Ineos make it to the AC, since NZ have had a good run of wins in recent decades, I'll be quietly hoping the Brits finally get to bring the America's Cup home after more than 175 years.
But as we've seen plenty of times, it could all go tits up at any moment with these highly strung AC75s, so first things first and get the LVC done lads 🤞
As a Kiwi living in the UK since '96, I have no divided loyalties whatsoever - ETNZ all the way.
INEOS Britannia is funded by a single individual, which might be a long-term financial vulnerability but is a short-term funding advantage - they don't have to generate revenue, they're purely a cost centre.
Just as the UK has 340,00 registered rugby players to NZ's 146,00 and the England RFU's revenues are £221m to the NZ RFU's $NZ268m (£126m).
Fundamentally, as in Rugby, by all metrics except skill & experience, ETNZ are the underdogs.
Yes, but... Budgets aren't everything. There's also the factor of public passion and commitment, which can make up for smaller amounts invested in purely money terms.
As we both know, in NZ rugby and sailing are national obsessions! There's blanket media coverage of both sports when they're in a competition phase, and even when not. The stars are household names and hero worshipped. Many youngsters are inspired to take up the sports by this passionate public love and knowledge of them.
In the UK, rugby and sailing are quite well down the list of sports popularity - especially sailing. Maybe a decent number of people know who Ben Ainslie is from his Olympic record, but I guarantee probably only 1% or fewer will know the names of Dylan Fletcher and the other members of the Ineos Brittania crew. In NZ, ALL the ETNZ boys will be known about.
This lack of public interest and engagement is reflected in the scant media coverage there's been in the UK of the Louis Vuitton Cup. I've had to really go looking for articles in the mainstream press on the campaign so far. Contrast that with the NZ press and TV coverage, which has been constant and in depth. Up to this point I'd wager that probably over half the UK population have no idea the America's Cup is on at all, let alone that Britain has an entrant. That will change somewhat now Ineos is in the actual AC proper, and certainly grow if they do well, but we both know there's a huge difference between NZ and UK in public perception and support of the AC.
My point is that in NZ there's a real CULTURE of sailing, and that's translated into the world's best boat design/building infrastructure, acknowledged by everyone in the sailing world. And not just that: the level of sailing skill with these advanced boats has been world beating for many decades - which is why many overseas syndicates have hired Kiwi skippers, grinders, trimmers over the years. Just look at the impressive but notorious record of Russell Coutts and Brad Butterworth: Kiwi AC heroes who jumped ship (literally!) and 'stole' the Cup back from us...
So yes: Ineos Brittania might have a bigger budget for their campaign, but ETNZ are definitely the overdogs in terms of experience, technical expertise (the AC75 is their design, after all), and above all national passion and support. Overcoming that formidable overall package is a daunting task and likely to fail.
You only need to see the bookies odds to see that Ineos are the underdogs:
m.topsport.com.au/Sport/Yacht_Racing/Americas_Cup_2024/Futures
Luna Rossa got another lesson in boat handling
I dont get why LR, in 2nd race today in leg 5, when they were only about 50m behind and faster, tacked to go immediately in the dirty air of Ineos.
Hey Mozzy, are you going to bring Rob and Tom in again for any analysis videos? Loved those from the last cup as well as your solo stuff! Thanks for the awesome content
What about the gimme to Luna Rossa when the race was abandoned with Ineos 600 metres ahead on the final leg. The penalty incurred for boundary violation which gave Luna Rossa the race? They have both had issues.
AC isn't about old men in white suits saluting each other and the Queen as they sail past a jetty anymore. We are living in the 21st century and these are 21st century craft.
Depends how you look at it and how you use the English language and understand highest level sports and rules: What is considered "luck" by one can be considered "fate" by another.
There are rules and both sides are competing to and within those rules which are the same for all.
SKILL is the word 🙂 As said. Other crews - even if sailing Ineos - would have most probably wiped out badly on several occasions. Great team sailing for GB.
Wishing them ALL the best.
Lots of commentary from Sir Ben about the need to constantly develop. Based on the video and pictures Ineos have added more buttons and some sort of LED light gauge in the helms cockpits. Also, more comms about traveler between ben and Dylan can be heard.
What do we think this development is?
Fantastic analysis, as ever, Mozzy. Thank you. Am I right in thinking that where the data shows one boat faster, it doesn't reveal if this comes from putting the boat in a windier part of the course, rather than from a naturally faster boat?
I believe the TWS (True wind) should cover that, and it looks clear IB had an advantage (meaning as leader they read the wind well). However that wasn't highlighted so not too sure about that analysis.
Mozzy can you please explain the AC jib selection and how that effects pointing, balance, speed etc. in different conditions (or have you already covered that in another video ?)
this video may help from the last Cup ruclips.net/video/oN1uJwQczmc/видео.html
Great analysis mate, out of interest which team do you think would give ETNZ the biggest challenge. Cheers Dave
I would like to see Luna Rossa win, but I have to say that I don't see Spithil's legendary starts anymore, Ineos starts better than us, even if only slightly, but they are more aggressive, at the first tack they are almost always ahead. Bruni's high style that characterized the last Prada Cup is no longer seen. In short, if they don't change something in their attitude it will be tough... But Ineos deserves what they have!
The camber on Ineos main, I actually agree with considering the sea state where you need to balance the acceleration vs top speed
Great stuff! Hoping for a daily rundown once we’re in the cup 🤞
LR slightly slower and more difficult to sail in the extreme sea state. Really as simple as that. Glen Ashby commented on the fact that LR's foil arms look draggier when temporarily immersed in wave peaks and there's something to that. Hard to tell but from video it seemed LR had sharper vertical accelerations than Ineos. This requires higher lift peaks and generates higher drag peaks. With a bit less wave LR is very competitive.
That's an Aire bus wing on the Silver bullet 😊 hence the Lunar Rose 🌹 Love you Mozzy Sail's 🌎 we don't know weather to barbeque you on the sun Witt joy, oar drown you at Time's 🌠 kinda lik'a Storm 🐳
The more you practice, the luckier you get! !!
Go Ineos, see you in the big dance 😁
The Start! The Start! Please - no stupid mistakes. No unforced errors. Get LR on port after the second tack and sit on them. Pure match racing.
At this level, it’s really the entire team, design, build, training, knowledge, skill, effort, learning, adapting, and above all minimizing mistakes. Great racing, as I was convinced that Luna Rosa had the whole package dialed, better than Britannia. But tiny margins make the difference, and Britannia seems to have the margins.
Mozzy, are you concerned about TNZ foil and sail changes?
Speaking of luck what about when the wind died when Ineos were comfortably in the lead?
Mozzy, thank you so much, your analysis has been an added bonus to this most gripping of sporting events. May l most humbly add that we are somewhat in the dark with regard to the human element...let me give you an example...the enigma that is Sir Ben Ainslie. Capable of skippering a machine around the course that could be described as so futuristic to the general public as to be unbelievable, then to be hit with boundary penalties not once but say, half a dozen times, leaves me speechless. Ten year old beginners would surely understand the boundary rule and the 'over early' rule and never need to be reminded again. Let's be honest, whenever INEOS even head in the general direction of the boundary l start with a mild panic and end up with a Jaisus not again.
I think the last boundary breach was caused by going through the wake of LR which threw the bow of Ineos up and made the boat difficult to control. The AC boats are far more difficult to control than an F1 car, the guys are incredible in the circumstances.
Ineos last two starts were critical but they still had to complete 8 legs without error. This error free sailing is likely why Ben said it wasn't luck.
I know very little about sailing. I've become fascinated by this because it looks like 'F1 on water'. One observation I have is that Britannia isn't necessarily faster, but it travels less distance (less steep diagonals) than Luna Rossa and wins on that basis?
I think you're being a bit generous saying Luna Rossa would be 7-1 up if things had gone their way.
One race they didnt make the start line so it could have gone either way, and another they came off foils before the start but were already behind Ineos at that point. They definitely could have had a healthy lead though.
Thanks for your coverage
Wind is looking light for Friday.