Engineer says OceanGate CEO ignored her submersible warnings: 'Someone is going to be killed'
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- Опубликовано: 25 июн 2023
- A local deep sea engineer out of Alameda says OceanGate's CEO ignored their early warning signs that the submersible's material wasn't safe. STORY: abc7ne.ws/44aNS3W
#titanic #submersible #oceangate #abc7news
Of course he ignored her warnings. Just like he ignored all the other warnings he received. He had a criminal disregard for safety.
Of course he ignored the other experts, because he had his own experts and engineers and they claim the material was safe to use......
Peter Zieve from ElectroImpact was the culprit. I think he moved from SF to Seattle also because of him. Peter was a major investor in OceanGate, he was obligated to listen to him
Investors as engineers! Ahhhhhh!
Ultimately it would lead to him killing 4 people, but he would be swiftly served a just death sentence just the same.. Captain went down with the ship, and there's something to be said there.. cause he could have stayed behind, survived, and dealt with litigation and lawsuits like most other CEO's would have done..
@@seanjackson4228he sacked one engineer for saying the can isn't safe. There's an interview recently. They took him to court etc
It’s always dangerous to go with someone who thinks they know everything.
"People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do"!🙃
Yep I Avoid those people like the plague
Legend has it that they used a window of washing machine and that they were supplying themselves with Wish and Aliexpress ...
Only I can fix it! DJT
Now he knows that what he didn't or refused to know is what killed him. 😢
She nailed it when she said this tragedy resulted from Rush’s “hubris, complacency and greed”.
you can see that in all his interviews...
I wouldn’t say greed if he went down as well and died.
It wasn't complacency...
...It was INCOMPETENCY.
@@jeffmcelroy5364it's actually both. They could have done more trials before sending lives. It's stated, there's no second sub...
I respect Rush for the fact that he put his own life at risk.
As an engineer I can’t tell you how many times I have told a supervisor or other person what they were doing was unsafe I was dismissed and people were injured. There is nothing you can say that can change the mind of a business owner.
And that's why "ignored warnings that what happen would happen" should immediately exacerbate any and all court proceedings/settlements.
Same here. All they think about is money and that they must be right.
This is true. I work in construction. On one site a person was injured because he asked his boss if he could remove the safety harness he had on and the boss said yes. (it's mandatory to wear them if you are going ovre 10 feet in height where I am. Anyways, the guy removed the harness so he could ge to whatever he was doing ad as he went to do what he was doing slipped and fell 13 feet. He was lucky there was some wood to break his fall. As it was he landed on his back.
Within 2 weeks this same boss who was operating a crane, had an incident with another crane that cause both to be shut down to wait for a complete inspection. The safety officer forced him off of the crnes and WorkSafe required him to fill out some paperworl or pay a fine.
Lol ive told engineers what they have done is unsafe and they got someone killed.
@@0annonymous , I mean the guy responsible is currently scattered into pieces at the bottom of the ocean. That's as harsh of a punishment as you gonna get.
Consults experts, rejects experts advise. Solid plan.
Rush knew more than them and he wanted to make a lot of money….build an Empire by using paying customers as test subjects. The guy should have been placed in a straight jacket and taken to a facility where he could get some help. I think it’s obvious now that the man was a few cans short of a six pack.
Sounds like a lot of my architectural clients.
Musk fan.
The Frenchman who also died HP was a world renowned oceanographer it seems so why did he go along with SR's crazy plan to take tourists down to the Titanic gravesite in this un seaworthy submersible> What was in it for him?
Advice is noun. Advise is verb
Rush didn't care about anyone but his own ego.
Don’t forget profit…money. He wanted to build an empire.
Money
And not hiring old White men......f him, another woke cuck!
@@Plutogalaxyfound the triggered snowflake!!! Shouldnt you be out in a pride parade somewhere? 😂😂😂😂
@@laurenurban3942worse he want to be immortalized by dieing next to it
OceanGate's last dive included a surprise meet and greet with the original Titanic crew.
This is why I still feel bad for at least the 19 y/o and it pisses me off that ppl blame him just bc he signed the waiver. That kid no doubt had no real idea the danger he was getting in, even if Stockton told him, he wouldn't have been completely honest...
He was supposedly terrified to go according to his family, however, he felt compelled to because it was Father’s Day and his dad really wanted to go.
Nah, he signed the waiver because apparently he also wanted to break a world record by solving a Rubix cube on a titanic.
I would of read everything online before getting into this sealed coffin - that open letter was a red flag in plain site.
@@benginaldclocker2891 Guess you might as well do something while you're down there to take your mind off of the fact you're inhaling everyone's farts and probably going to die.
It sounds like there are a few different engineers who knew before this tragedy, that the sub was *likely* to fail at some point even though they couldn't guarantee it'd fail or predict how quickly or slowly it'd fail.
That guy was reaking of arrogance and self centeredness. These types of people are just plain dangerous.
But oh how people are drawn to these types.
He was probably popular in high school and it gave him a distorted view that he’s so awesome 😎
Well, now he's dead. Unfortunately he managed to take a few with him, including a barely legal adult 19 year old.
Just like the arrogant and foolish Titanic people.
@@ramencurry6672probably the contrary.
‘Hubris, complacency, and greed’. She summarizes it perfectly
She forgot stupidity. But other than that, yep...
'Ignored' thats an understatement. Discarded and dismissed.
"Hubris, complacency and greed." She nailed it.
The evidence that the CEO was a negligent idiot, keeps mounting.
Its only going to get worse as more comes out
In his own quote, I just remembered him for the rules he broke. He was the kind of "graduated but not educated" guy, knowing how to build things mathematically like a technician but is quite a few galaxies from knowing how to oversee perhaps even a simple engineering project, let alone this one.
Literally every new clip I see of him, he says something so stupid, makes me mad that he went instantly cuz he’ll never know the real dangers he caused
The people knew the risk and they took it. Enough said. Let's move on.
it's controlled by a dream cast controller ....
I'm no deep sea engineer but I'd say "not imploding" should be pretty high up on the list of things you want your new submersible to accomplish.
Exactly. Maybe he should have used what Titanic used. 111-years and it still hasn’t imploded to the pressure yet.
They all implode. No way around it.
@@HarpazoReady2022 They should raise the Titanic, disassemble it and use the steel to build a submersible to visit the site where the Titanic used to sit.
@@joesmith6972 There ya go!! 👍🏼
@@joesmith6972 Actually, its well known that the steel used in the Titanic was substandard, and possibly the reason why it sank. The steel was more brittle than it should have been, which caused large fractures instead of bending when it grazed the iceberg.
Imagine putting your life in the hands of a guy named "Stockton".
You get Stockton Crushed in his submersible
It's been said that they didn't know what hit them, and I hope that's true. Stockton Rush gambled and lost and took four other lives with him--one of whom was a young man who had his whole life ahead of him. How sad! My condolences to all the families!
That 19 year old had his whole life ahead of him. As the son of a billionaire, it was gonna be a good life too. What a complete and utter shame.
I can promise you they went from living to dead faster then the nerves could have sent signals to the brain. They felt nothing they just popped out of existence. Honestly the best way to die if you had too.
@@christianterrill3503from a physical perspective you're likely correct, but what's unknown is how long or intensely the sub was creaking while the carbon fiber fell apart. If they had warning signs the implosion was imminent, they would've been terrified knowing what was to come and being powerless to do anything about it. Not painful maybe, but it's its own kind of torture.
@@christianterrill3503there would likely have been some sounds for a moment before
@@mj.ray0898the hull was made out of carbon fiber. The structure would have failed instantaneously unlike metal which would given out slowly over time (creaking, bending inward, etc)
Seems that a lot of the top people in this industry expressed their concerns about this submersible, yet they were all ignored. Makes me think of the expression: "Everybody can't be wrong."
He called them in the box and he was out of the box. Well sometimes when you step out of the box you fall off a cliff and die !
@@LeesTexan I just wish he went alone and not taking 4 people with him. 😢
Everybody can be wrong. Everybody can't be wrong. Both are possible.
In this case, maybe something known as metal fatigue must have happened. However, I am not sure if the body was made of metal.
The vessel or vehicle could go to the depths and come back safely. But then, what it required for a complete checking and replacement of wornout parts after every journey.
@@Cy93yeah ! he wanted someone to pay for that death trip hence those billionaires on board.
This is just a classic case of wealth outweighing education. Stockton had plenty of money, but lacked plenty of education when it came to designing this thing.
There is only one positive to this tragedy. Stocktons rampant disregard for safety cannot kill anyone else.
I would say that the positive is that a woke executive who discriminated against 50-year-old white guys - got what he deserved.
@@perfectsplit5515 Having been around 50 year old white guys, I can confirm that they're usually incompetent. And angry. Don't know what's wrong with that generation of men, but they ain't right. As for that supposed statement, you can clearly see that everyone speaking on behavior of the company is white. And 30.
You say this as if he wasn't a old white man over 50 himself. Regardless of how ignorant his comment was, he suffered for it. But it's really telling you are only focused on the "woke" part, and not his blatant disrespect and disregard for regulation and actual expertise. Grow up.
@@belias360 "it's really telling you are only focused on the "woke" part, and not his blatant disrespect and disregard for regulation and actual expertise."
I was stating the positive of the tragedy. There is nothing positive about his disregard for regulation and expertise. The fact that I am stating a positive does not mean that I am not focused on his engineering bad judgment. Do not put words in my mouth. Get your head out of your @$$.
Isn’t that the truth
He was warned by multiple people, I feel sorry for the people that died but especially the poor kid that only went to please his father
The guy looked so full of himself. Whenever I see such people, I step back and watch things unfold. Nothing is as destructive as pride
@@soulreaper9453 0:32 He looked like Beaker from the Muppets. RIP. Rest in Pieces.
OceanGate has ignored safety warnings since their inception from internal safety engineers to pretty much everyone in the deep depth submersible community. They even had warnings from engineers and folks in the composites industry and communities. All this was done way back when they first showed the schematics for their sub back in 2017. Carbon fiber is a fantastic material but it can't withstand cyclical compression/decompression because it is so rigid and the layup for such a thick part would have needed to be completely X-rayed everytime in order to make sure there were no voids in the laps or cracks from the a fore mentioned cycles. The company was cutting corners from the start because the CEO was following the very dangerous Silicon Valley mentality in an area where that just does not belong.
He said he did want to be known by the rules he broke. He got his wish.
😄😄😄😄
'rules' he broke, not 'hulls' he broke!
@@edwardgiovannelli5191 hull broke as a result of the rules he broke. Sad way to get his wish.
EXACTLY!
Looks like the rules broke him literally!
Arrogance+ignorance+narcissism+desperation+greed = disaster
Those that do not learn from history are destined to repeat it.. This time, they shortened the name of the ship by "ic"..
Subtract desperation from that equation and add ruthless to greed = psychopath
Yep but those qualities will never cease to exist, since this is what women are most attracted to
@@dragorn3212 that is an excellent point
Recklessness
"Hubris, complacency and greed..." - I'm glad somebody finally called out what he was full of.
The main issue with carbonfiber as a material is, that it is great for pulling forces, but not good for pushing / pressure forces. That`s why you weave it, overlap it and put it into a matrix (usually a polymer) to get at least a part of the forces pulling.
Very difficult for a vehicle that faces 500bar pressure. 10m of seawater add one bar of pressure, so down there you face 400, 500 bar.
You also have issues in the different expansion coefficients, the polymer and the carbonfiber itself are not the same.
The cylindrical design also comes with peak loads - you simply have spots where the forces peak due to the design.
Big companies like Boeing and Airbus have issues to ensure the quality of their carbon fiber parts, it`s not easy to detect if everything is proper laminated and baked through.
To build a cylindrical adhesive carbon fiber hull was a crime against sanity, as basically the pressure forces de-laminate your construction.
Don`t get me wrong, carbon fiber is a great material, but it`s good when you put it under pressure from the inside and pull forces - as you do with an airplane fuselage - not when you have huge pressure from the outside.
The wonder is not that it imploded, the wonder is that it made it the first 4 times.
I can`t believe these guys really did build that, it`s just to stupid. Every engineer that knows his stuff can explain you why it`s a stupid idea.
Stockton Rush made a strong run for the 2023 darwin award.
I've worked with executives like Rush. They'll drop a lot of $$ on outside experts like McKinsey not because they want their expertise but because they want these outside experts to validate their own foregone conclusions. If they don't, the consulting projects die quiet deaths but the initiatives themselves carry on. This is exactly what Rush did with outside experts
you are on point
And I am brought in to advise the Big 4 when they are trying to validate the ideation stage for the project
Rush was a real life mad scientist who's invention destroyed them and made them into a super villain. In this case, he is just dead.
Ah, yes, McKinsey, the "experts" who at the height of metaverse hype forecast it would be worth a trillion dollars in a few years. 😁
@@batarasiagian9635 Yes, and that fits in with my point -- McKinsey and other firms of their ilk were often brought in just to be expensive "Yes men". Nice work if one can get it!
Frankly I'm amazed the thing didn't implode the FIRST time it was taken to that depth.
Even at that depth, carbon fibre was able to withstand that pressure but not for long. But it’s a good question. He shouldn’t have used carbon fibre but why on this dive ? Not the last one or the previous one.. I am curious
@surajrajwani8773 the sub has been rebuilt multiple times.
A submarine expert tested it in the Bahamas with him and heard louds creaking noises in the hull, he told rush the pressure hull was starting to give, and rush rebuilt it the exact same way.
Guy was absolutely insane.
i agree. it really cracked loudly as it descended. no rov crackles but this one. parts are moving if there is a cracking sound. so many many warning were given by rov itself. this fool ignored reality and chased down his prey.
@@surajrajwani8773From my understanding of what the maritime experts are saying, carbon fiber can probably withstand 1-2 dives. But with each dive, it gets weaker.
On subsequent dives the imperfections become more pronounced. Might hold once, twice, five times. But as soon as one point of weakness becomes too much- instant implosion. As biproduct of material that isn’t steel or Titian
Titanic : "unsinkable"
Titan: "unbreakable"
Obviously he didn't do the math for long term strength and durability (and maybe maintenance if that even applies). Unfortunately there are MANY examples of engineering failures where this has been ignored. He had the forethought to ask an expert but he failed at the most important lesson and that is to listen. It caused his own death and that of 4 other people. Hopefully the marine submersible community will be able to gather enough information from the wreckage that will help this to never happen again.
Who needs math when he has the law of attraction, positive thinking bring positive results. Engineer criticism was negative, so he had to fire him to stay positive. Problem is physics says "I do not understand what you are thinking"
It didn't need to happen this time. We have decades of experience of using the right designs (spheres), the right materials (steel, titanium), etc. Window certified to 1300m, used at 3800m. Titanium end caps 'glued' onto carbon fibre cylinder - great for internal pressure, where fibres are in tension - how good is a length of rope in compression? Also fibres wound parallel, reliant on brittle resin to hold it together. 3 tons per square inch!! You don't even need to be a professional engineer to see the flaws.
@@BillDavies-ej6ye Yep. But someone believed he was the next Elon Musk, and tried to use hardware store materials, expired fiber carbon from Boeing, to outperform nuclear submarines going 10 times deeper.
They said "we partnered with Boeing" but what they did was to buy the expired carbon fiber that was garbage for Boeing. So if you make a cake and you buy ingredients at Walmart, then you are in partnership with Walmart?
If you see the process of construction, you saw a guy leaning on the walls of the sub. Using one hand to grab the carbon fiber wall and the other passing glue. If hand oil pollutes the surface, glue may not stick to it.
However my hypothesis is that pressure may bend the carbon fiber cylinder, but what failed was the epoxic glue. The titanium ring was not deformed and it had no remnants of glue, which suggests me that epoxic glue failed to have some grip on the titanium ring. I would glue PVC pipes using epoxic glue, but not a titanium ring. Even with crazy glue I would have doubts.
As per my hypothesis the same failure of the ringed design of SRB of shuttle Challenger happened here.
@@josepablolunasanchez1283 HAHAHA ELON MUSK IS WORSE THAN THIS PISSIE, HAHAH BOTH ARE PSYCHOPATHS THO, DO YOU THINK ELON MUSK CREATED TESLA? HAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAH HE STOLE IT FROM THE FOUNDERS. "NEXT ELON MUSK" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHAH
After hearing the many reports about the man, he was on a quest for glory as much money. Sounds like he fancied himself an intrepid businessman and explorer, and throwing caution to the wind is what the true greats did. Sadly it’s one thing to be reckless with yourself and another thing entirely to put other people at risk. He’s going to be remembered alright but not the way he’d intended
Sounds like every top politician..bound for glory at the expense of their own country
He was leaning too hard on the 'my ancestors signed the declaration of independence...that makes me better than you' angle. Never understood why people trip over being related to x-y-z. Those individuals accomplished something which should be applauded and hopefully respected. Applaud it but don't let it go to your head. That's the tragedy...This guy let his genetic makeup allow him to become arrogant. He talked a good game. He had B or C level skills but because of his wealthy background and connection to 2 founding fathers, he was able to hoodwink a lot of people into giving him money and following him in that sub. : (
And all that would be fine, if he hadn't been putting unsuspecting people in danger. It was still an experimental craft. It should have been unmanned altogether; but if he wanted to go down in it and risk his own life alone, as you said, that would have been his prerogative.
Money protects against starvation, not physics.
@@theninjacat7200 To be fair, the other people onboard were billionaires for whom I cannot spare any sympathy because:
1)One does not become a billionaire without exploiting people and/or the system.
2) They knew about the risks involved when they signed the liability waiver.
As someone who actively designs pressure vessels it is absolutely astounding that someone would select carbon fiber as the base material for a submarine. The amount of external pressure on the cylindrical surface of the vessel is astounding. The amount of force exerted on a convex surface compared to a concave surface is a lot more difficult to manage from a design standpoint. Not even factoring in the repeated cyclical stresses (Pressure/temperature) that the sub will see during its trips to the bottom of the ocean. It was a disaster waiting to happen.
poor shape and poor choice of material for the pressure chamber.....an empty aluminum can is pure evidence that a cylindrical structure is easily compromised
Another one who actively designs pressure vessels here. Depending on their manufacturing method, the longitudinal stress on the carbon composite could be an issue. But I doubt they really made an obvious mistake like that, esp when failure occurred in a very low operation cycle. I'm more concerned about the joint b/w the composite and the titanium ring.
You don't design pressure vessels. If you do it's a hobby on a notebook. Explain how their vessel was concave? It was cylindrical but how was it concave?
I don't think you know what you are talking about
@@thoraerodid you see the footage of them joining the titanium end caps to the CF tube? I have zero engineering knowledge, about as much as an orangutan, but my jaw dropped seeing that video.
It was just a bunch of guys standing around an open air warehouse in jeans and hoodies. Manually lowering the end caps with a crane. Folks were up on ladders, maskless and chatting merrily, while using plastic grout scrapers to apply the bonding agent. Then they just fitted it together like an IKEA bookshelf.
I had assumed ALL of the construction, especially with the epoxy/adhesive, would have taken place in like an extremely controlled environment, a super strict clean room with air filters, full PPE/cleansuits. Using laser measurements to ensure even application/thickness/secure housing. But they just had dudes on ladders slapping on glue by hand
@@jjmcwill1881 The surface at which the force is being exerted on the vessel (from the outside) is a convex surface. Most cylindrical components are designed to contain pressure from the inside, hence a concave surface. The calculated surface stresses are much higher on a convex surface compared to a concave surface.
Convex: having an outline or surface curved like the exterior of a circle or sphere
Concave: having an outline or surface that curves inward like the interior of a circle or sphere
Stockton Rush capitalized on the fact that everyone nowadays takes for granted that when you enter into a vehicle, be it plane, sub or whatever, that it's safe. Stockton even told clients that his vehicle was as safe as a helicopter.
I also wrote a letter to OceanGate as I am an engineer and saw so many critical problems with the submersible. I know at least a dozen independent people with expert knowledge tried to tell this bozo not to proceed but he was too arrogant to consider that he might be wrong.
If you want to test a new application of a material you don't put people at risk. Not only is carbon fibre a poor material for a deep-sea pressure vessel, he bought EXPIRED carbon fibre for it! If it's not safe for Boeing to use in aircraft it's sure not safe for deep-sea tourism. If you want a proper vehicle with which to visit the Titanic, use an Alvin design. It's been proven safe for fifty years and is still in service. It's the Soyuz of ocean exploring.
The ceo was on it
SAOS did you see a problem with the computer monitors being mounted to the hull? In some photos you can see the mount bracket screwed into the hull. Isn't that like sticking a pin in a balloon ?
its bad when u name ur company in homage to watergate 😂
@@jamesnguyen_1Was it?
@@rael5469 That's most likely not a problem. It doesn't go all the way through the hull but just the inner shell. If it did go through the hull completely it could still be watertight if sealed properly.
It's not perfectly equivalent but on the International Space Station the mechanisms for the sun shields on the cupola module require a hole through the hull for each one. They also have to be able to spin. Two rubber O-rings provide a sufficient seal. Engineering for a vacuum and for the deep sea are similar.
As a physicist, materials specialist and subsea engineer, that stepped carbon fiber cylinder to titanium hemisphere adhesive lap joint transition is something straight out of my worst nightmares. I cannot believe he did that or was even allowed to do that. The videos of those utter fools working on it gives me horror chills.
What's your view on using carbon fibre per se as a pressure hull? My understanding is that it's stronger than steel under tensile loads but like a noodle under compression - so it gets its strength purely from the epoxy matrix (which can be subject to voids).
never underestimate the power of a group of incompetent people enjoying themselves.
@@graememorrison333 I'm thinking about the millions of air bubbles trapped in that hull. Not a dense material. I think the Triest was made from steel and nickel. Very dense and not filled with millions of air bubbles.
@@TheBandit7613 I'm thinking about how the material was already deteriorating before it was even shaped into the pressure chamber; Stockton Rush bragged that he bought the Carbon Fibre secondhand from Boeing at reduced cost since it had passed its shelf-life without being used; and Boeing's applications of CF (aerospace) play into its strengths, while OceanGate's submersible played to its weaknesses.
@@legoferrari14osh, what a fool he was and the company needs to be investigated and all its employees need to go to jail for criminal negligence for one, not reporting him and drinking the koolaid, which led all those 4 others onboard to die.
Love when it all goes wrong everyone says they tried to warn or didn’t agree but all sat there smile on face and taking the accolades.
Not taking the advice from your engineers is like taking medical advice from Dr. Seuss.
I listened to an interview with James Cameron, and he was saying the unsuitability of Carbon fiber had been established, along with the fact that these machines can only be used a very limited number of times. In other words, OceanGate really beat the odds to have returned as many times as they did. According to JC, this wasn't an accident; it was hubris.
Carbon fibre expands and contracts and eventually delaminates. Steel can be used many times over as its expansion rate is minimal. Oceangate was the only one using carbon and its been shown now why not to.
@@3800TURBO Cameron says he retired his steel subersible after only a couple of uses. OceanGate would have gotten away with Carbon fiber, had they followed suit.
I’m an engineer and I can promise you that there isn’t an engineer on the planet that is surprised that this imploded. I predict we will learn that he surrounded himself with yes men and wouldn’t take no for an answer.
@@3800TURBO No it doesn't. Carbon fibre itself is non-compressible, the clever science is in the resin used.
@@brentgreen8209you don’t have to predict. There are interviews of Stockton bragging that he went against the advice of experts.
When you hear a man says, Safety is pure waste, then walk away. They want a Titanic experience and Stock Rush arrogance not kidding to provide a real Titanic experience including himself. RIP. They should leave Titanic alone and let those poor souls in Rest In Peace.
Good point. I spent years of my career working in petroleum refineries and other heavy industrial processes.
YUP 👍
Walk away, yes...but don't turn your back to such people. Keep your eyes on them at all times.
They got a Titanic experience
I bet he won't say it again
This story reminds me of the engineer, Roger Boisjoly, who was trying to stop the Challenger space shuttle from launching in 1986. Same tragic ending when we ignore science and those trained in it.
Managers always think they know better.
This woman is the voice of reason.
wait until she has her monthly period... ^_^
For a submarine, you want it over-engineered and tested before you use it, or else you will be the experiment.
I can only imagine the pressure this CEO would be dealing with if he wasn't among those dead people.
He's under a lot more pressure now!
@@kulr3924💀
It's like they say, if you engineer a bad bridge, make sure you are under it when it fails.
At least 4 counts of manslaughter. Possibly murder.
Just about any engineer could tell you that that was not designed and would not withstand the depths that they were wanting to go with it... It's very sad that he took 4 other people to their death with him. It's really sad that they all perished. I don't like talking about someone after they have passed. But the CEO was clearly an idiot. Poor people, poor poor people.😢
Lesson for everybody , and note to myself : if you are going down to the bottom of the ocean in a sub , or up into space on a rocket , actually read very carefully the documents they hand you to sign off on before boarding the offered vehicle to do so . When and if the documents boldly state that the company behind the trip says no one can sue them in the event of death or injury then do not get on board the vehicle,. Okay , got it.
Sad to say but this is proof that wealth doesn’t correlate to one intelligence at all as well as common sense smh.
Really? You can refer to this well-designed study, with a sample size of…..1 ….to extrapolate this theory?
You do know Rush was an Engineer too, right?
@@Neria-EluI know somebody he was that intelligent in physics and so delusional he eventually got sectioned.
@Neria-Gioia the implication of the comment was he was just some uneducated rich dude.
He was an engineer, confident in his, and his teams, engineering. So much so that he was consistently on the Titan when people were taken down.
Actually, him being an engineer…that is exactly what it means…he wasn’t “stupid.” People like to convince themselves that only a “stupid” or “unintelligent” person could take irresponsible risks. Risk taking is tied to personality… not intelligence.
Educated, smart, intelligent, empathetic, compassionate people sometimes make bad decisions. The point is, we are ALL capable of doing so.
He was already enamored with being a “rebel” maverick. The more experts advise him, the more he will do the exact opposite
Well, he got his way. Rest in peace to him.
He was going to use carbon fiber specifically because everyone told him not to use it. He had psychological issues when being told no, probably never was told no growing up. Spoiled entitled narcissist.
@@gabriellechung356 Bingo! That's exactly!
This type of thinking is pervasive in modern politics too. We've developed a kind of zeitgeist for "rebels" and anti-expert thinking that it's nauseating. Mostly spurred by a lot of conservative thinking. It's populism at its worst.
He talked a big game but in the end the pressure got to him.
She made an excellent point about building in pairs and no secondary rescue option
Although I hope the other members of the party never knew what hit them, I kind of wish that Stockton Rush had at least a few seconds to KNOW how wrong he was and to realize that his arrogance cost him not only his own life, but the lives of four other people, including a young man barely into adulthood.
I think he knew they were in trouble. There's evidence that he had started dropping weights to surface and they hadn't reached the site yet. He could have heard it cracking....
He would have blamed somebody else...that's how narcissists do.
Apparently they had sensors installed into the hull so they could be prewarned as to wether the hull was starting to give up. Not that would help if your 2 miles down but he most likely knew a few seconds before it happened.
Yeah but unfortunately if he knew what was about to happen the others probably had a heads up too...
@@kymo6343 if you were him would you tell the others if they didn't already know anything or would you go with the 'ignorance is bliss' way?
“Ignoring all warnings, he carried on” the synchronicity between how the titanic sunk and the fact that they were GOING to the titanic literally gives me chills. I’ll forever wonder if it was some crazy suicide trip for him or really just a narcissistic ego
I have wondered if it was a suicide trip too but maybe it was just arrogance.
Obviously the latter right? Narcissists love themselves too much for that. His skewed love of money and total disregard to safety led them this fate sadly. This company is criminally negligent. Families of deceased should sue them, they would very likely win as it’s easy to prove their gross negligence. No amount of any wavers would cover criminal negligence.
Narcissist. You cannot change their mind. They will die on their hill, literally.
Hubris caught up to the man. This wasn't his first dive. He'd been on several with this vessel. It was only a matter of time for the pressure to build up stress fractures and eventually lead to this disaster.
He had no idea this would be his final trip. He was too self-absorbed in thinking he made a brilliant innovation and cash cow.
The look on his face was bizarre and the way he tossed that remote control was also strange behavior. He may very well have been suicidal and wanted to have company. I am feeling that......he could not have been that ignorant !
Someone once commented that the people speaking out about the design "should have spoken out before" this tragedy, but from what I've read and seen in news articles and videos, all kinds of people were trying to warn him about this dangers of the submersible years prior, including former employees. The warning went unheeded
There were a lot of people speaking BEFORE and warning that guy, more than once.
Long time this tragedy happened. Ever since he started going under.
We just did not "see" them, until now.
Yeah lots spoke out before, he even took some people to court over it to try to silence them.
The problem is its in international waters - there's no laws out there. So it doesn't matter how many people said something, ultimately the responsibility to question it was down to the people he was selling it to. Nobody else had the right to stop him.
I refuse to believe she's the only person who told him no
yeah some employees of Oceangate were fired after voicing concerns over safety issues, oceangate then sued them for defamation, it’s so messed up.
Wow, he'll certainly go down in history, but not in the way he might have hoped. What an arrogant person. I do hope the company is shuttered, and any remaining assets are given to the four individuals' families that lost their loved ones.
*So they did find them?*
He did go down. Literally.
he may take down the whole deep sea industry like the Hindenburg did for zeppelins
They’re already millionaires and billionaires they don’t need anymore money, would be much better of going to charity
@@shortfilmtrendingThe people?
Suleiman Dawood was about the same age as my son. He barely started collage and had a whole life ahead of him. Not to mention that his dad was a billionaire so he was secured for life. It's beyond sad for him to die so young. RIP to Sulaiman, his dad, and all the rest who perished with him.
This really opened my mind, I was about to build a spaceship out of aluminum foil, tissue papers, and clay, feeling confident in my abilities, but this clip changed me.
1. I had never heard about this OceanGate company
2. The more I hear about this extremely unfortunate tragedy, the more things that media is uncovering and the more I look into OceanGate, I can't help myself to think that Rush was a narcissist, arrogant individual who experimented dangerously behind his "credentials" without any regard to human lives. To me this is straight criminal and should be treated as such
The first step to Death is Greed And Pride. Amen.
And arrogance.
Yup, they doomed themselves from the minute they finished that water coffin.
And the first step to pride and greed was the rebellion of men against God.
Essentially, man wanted to rule himself and decide for himself between good and evil.
And then we have every consequence known to man throughout the ages.
The world seeking Glory, Meaning, and Purpose outside of God
@@Jackjack1978. And now, thanks to these ‘trans freaks’ we have man PLAYING God.
@bjackmorris
@ b m been that way all through history but there is a Way out of mans Wickedness, Jesus gives
Us the Will to choose Good over Evil. AMEN
But the time is getting shorter every day a person waits to seek Forgiveness.
Ocean Gate installed microphones so they could listen to the sub destroying itself. It was making crunching sounds in the carbon fiber every time it went into deep water. Loud enough for the passengers to hear. This was a - one and done - sub. If it was even that. Stockton Rush was a suicidal maniac.
Oof
It’s just nuts how this ever got approved to take anyone in this submersible.
it didn’t get approved by anyone and it was in international waters working off a foreign ship. so no country had jurisdiction.
@@mshepard2264 ok that makes sense. Thanks for the info because I just like there no reason agency that should have approved that.
"I have to tell you, Mr. Rush, this material is substandard"
"Great, that's exactly what I want for a sub!"
"A man very committed to safety." This man single handly destroyed the submersible community and future interest from people to go down to the unexplored depths of the ocean
Hopefully he only destroyed misplaced trust in authority figures. Due diligence is a real thing. Ultimately, we are responsible for our own safety and the calculated risks that we choose to take.
@@Sherman62Yes, you are correct. A PlayStation controller for steering should have been a big tell that the sub was unsafe and those people should have looked online for the safety ratings of the company and sub. It was at the tip of there fingers and they failed to look it up.
@@Sherman62 Usually only a handful of people are qualified to evaluate the risks for themselves. The real question is WHICH authority figures to trust. It might have helped if all these letters and warnings were public, but that would have subjected honest people to legal risks. That being said, trusting one man and ignoring the scientific community is not wise.
@@mando686you know the military uses Xbox controllers, right? Actually the biggest issue was using the Bluetooth connection vs. Wired. That's more scary than the controller itself
@@mando686 Way to regurgitate the same Ret@rded "Opinion" of the Ret@rded MSM; it was premeditated by the Controller to Imploded the Sub!🤡💩
Thank you! Greed and ego murdered 4 people. Plain and simple. He knew and decided he was smarter than everyone else. That company needs to be sued, what a sad tragic story, my heart breaks for the families who lost their loved ones because of this outlandish and abrasive man.
Any idiot would know that's a suicide mission
It looks like an elaborate suicide to me.
He’s like that guy from the movie alien covenant
This is a very interesting case. This company cannot be sue nor held responsible. The persons sign documents stating that anything could happened. And knowledge it. It’s really sad. Paying $250,000 for this adventure trip. And dying.
@@evarodriguezalequin5705 people were hypnotized by Stockton Rush manipulation and gaslighting. He is a selfish, arrogant narcissist who is indeed master in manipulation and sweet words to convince other people. Narcissist always wear a mask. You never know their true face except you live with him in one roof
When hiring engineers the CEO made sure to check all but the competency box.
It’s funny how all of a sudden everyone is like “I tried to warn him”
The statement she made, “There was no way of stopping him”. I’m really surprised the two older men got in that death trap? Those two should have known better but they must have trusted that guy? Terrible mistake.
Well you have to give credit to the Mr Rush. He put his money where his mouth is. He was so convinced of its safety that he went down each time with it. Have a feeling he wanted to die there and kept taking risks. Who knows
@@ranjha4008 Yeah, I think that's what ultimately convinced the other folks to go along. I mean, it's pretty compelling to tell people "Look, I'm going to be sitting right next to you the whole time".
Wasn't the 1 guy HP a well known oceanographer too, so he should have known this thing wasn't a safe submersible but yet he too went and helped SR to get unsuspecting "tourists" t dive deep under the ocean to the Titanic in this contraption. Did anyone who worked for this guy have any clear thought process of what could happen and to try and stop him or change the design? They all could have quit on him but no money talks I guess. Crazy! They all have blood on their hands too now. JMO
@@MissX905I believe there was a worker who told him to not do it and was fired for it
@@MissX905 yes so really the only novice were the father and son. The other 3 were well experienced people. That's probably why the father and son tagged along
We have scientific proof now: carbon fiber is not appropriate for submarines.
Nobody could convince him of that and he ignored suggestions to have it tested and certified. HE should have been certified and placed in a straight jacket.
yup leave the carbon stuff for like monitor holders inside , never use that as a tube to protect from extreme pressures of the deep sea will snap that
that is not true, the sub was sabotaged by haters
@@vemaraju Stop it. Thats probably something Rush would say if he was alive. His ego and arrogance got him and those poor people killed.
@@roycekillz2404 you are one to draw conclusion without even a investigation
I can’t imagine the embarrassment on oceangate’s part, to have the forethought of having an extra sub made, only for it to also implode while trying to rescue titan.
Never realised how many submarine experts there where
All falling out the woodwork 😂😂😂😂
I mean the first people to build a deep dive sub were told the same thing... It's kind of required that people push the boundaries and the sub had successfully done the depth a number of times. The material used was clearly capable they just didn't to proper checks and maintenance to catch fatigue damage and that would have happened with steel or any other material just the same. Negligence in maintenance was the crime here, not making a sub from something new.
So the total lack of any safety or rescue equipment was just fine?
The fact that he didn't consider fatigue on carbon fiber with repeated dives is astounding. That seems like something a person who knows what they are doing ought to consider. But, I digress....
Peter Zieve from ElectroImpact was advising him and advised him otherwise..
Yes, it seems almost purposely.
In another news report when he was doing the first dives with the sub, apparently he himself literally heard cracking from the hull as it went deeper
@@gqqggq7127Steel hulls pop, crack & creak as well. But they have the structural integrity and elasticity to return to an unpressureized equilibrium on the surface, at sea level.
At least the captain went down with the ship...stand behind your product
I can't imagine what's going through people's heads, who previously went down in this thing, and lived,
Would hope someone would interview them
They were interviewed in several channels. Sky News (Britain), BBC (Britain), DW ( Germany,) France 24 (France), CBS (US), ABC (US)... forgetting the name with the new station that has Elizabeth Vargas in it..., others...
@@pdkrace they have been on TV non stop.
I would expect it to be something along the lines of, "WHEW! 😳"
@@pdkrace Is there any sleb who wasn't invited down there?
You know things are bad when even your AA hires are blowing the whistle.
Bro why did I just have this image of them all in the afterlife watching this.
Thank god she opens up about her private discussion with him. Hopefully those families will get justice they truly deserve
She shoulda said something to the Authorities long ago.
they won't.
@@tindog999 there's nothing the authorities can do. The deep dives were in international waters.
She probably felt more open to talk since he's dead. I think he had the practice of intimidating naysayers with lawsuits.
The Manned Technology Society wrote him a letter. I wonder how fast he shredded it...
Let me get this straight, Mr. Rush basically thought: "Carbon Fiber is that really nice expensive materials they put in exotic cars right? So that proves it IS better than any other material.... Let's go with that."
and planes and spaceships
I worked with carbon fiber material a few years ago at my old job you have to weave it like cotton and it does not like to expand or shrink once it matures or else it’ll break!!
@@Kurisu91 I never worked with it, but to me it really looks like a reinforcement of the glue that holds it together. So we have a glue substance that is reinforced by the carbon fiber. well, in a way. And it was cracking loudly on descend. But our "hero" will hold it all from inside by his "holy spirit" of "innovator"! ... Mr Steve Jobs of Submarines...
@@wololo10Atleast spaceX used carbon fiber on 2 rockets and they both blew up
@@DanOneOne loud cracking? that's a new one.. never heard anything about noises that could be heard before the implosion.. only the acoustic anamoly they Navy picked up.. and I'm sure the OceanGate surface ship had to have picked up as well.. Chances are the crack was there from the moment they got in the sub at the surface and it was a matter of pressure that exposed it's weakness..
On a side note, I've had my Carbon Fiber hood stored safely in my storage room so if I have people helping me work on my car in the garage, nothing accidentally happens to it.. like someone stepping on it, cause it would crack for sure; and those cracks compromise integrity.. carbon fiber may be pliable, but it's not pliable enough for this application.. and I'm not sure I want to be on a sub where the pliability can support 400 atmospheres of pressure.. probably be crushed anyways..
He was diving in international waters because the submersible does not meet the USA requirements for passenger submarine operations. A passenger vessel submarine must meet ASME PVHO & ABS standards before the USCG will certify if for operations in the USA. The OceanGate submersible did not meet either of those standards.
I love how people think you needed an engineer to tell you this.
She is so dang smart and well spoken in a technical way. Love women pilots and engineers. They combine heart and brains.
“Heat” ?
@@BanjoPixelSnack Heart
Her LinkedIn profile doesn't look like an engineer's one.
Rush reminds me of my attitude/mindset during a manic episode and it genuinely is terrifying to think a normal, sane person thinks like that. Horrible. Genuine nightmare fuel.
Thank you for sharing your insight into Rush. I’m sorry for your suffering, but heartened by your self awareness.
Mental conditions are a spectrum and he for sure was on some end, makes sense to assume he must have been on some manic episode to brush off the well placed criticism on him, a healthy individual certainly does not act as he did. The mistake was his project remained unregulated for some reason, hopefully this leads to some changes in the industry with strict evaluations and measures to prevent a man on a power trip put more lives at risk.
Now everybody’s coming out of the wood works saying “I told you so” 😆
He ignored warnings from many qualified people. He was reckless and irresponsible. Why anyone agreed to go down with him is a mystery. His submersible was the only one going that deep that was not certified. That should have been a red flag to anyone who valued their life.
The concept of this sub was meant to be taken for 1 dive then put out of service. The fact that it survived more after that is a miracle itself
Is that true? I have not seen anything indicating that it was intended for only one dive.
@NotchaBiznesshe designed and made it himself..just bought some used and new parts for it .
The Deepsea Challenger was carbon fiber and built a whole lot better than this. It was made to go three times deeper than the Titan. It was rated for only one dive. I dont think there is a company out there that would have rated the Titan acceptable for even one dive. Every dive was a gamble. It imploded on its 14th total dive in less than 3 years.
@@hks956the one that went to the Mariana Trench was not made from carbon fiber. Richard Branson had one designed to do something like that but it was scrapped.
@@hks956 14 times in 3 years?
And he was planning new dives in 2024.......
Unbelievable!
Did he ever think to reinvest in a new one, at least?
Or make a new, better reinforced carbon fire thing? AT LEAST???
He would have been a moron to even go 3 times underwater, with that thing.
But, 14 times??? Man... Do I need to do the math how moron of him?
Wow, she just came out and said it at the end there. No tiptoeing. And I think pretty much everyone agrees with her.
Yes, I appreciate her honesty.
Curiosity killed the cat, ego killed the billions 😂😂
We do the same thing in construction.. dissimilar materials in certain areas will always fail. We made drywall access panels that taped into the existing drywall. Metal panels are horrid over time. Dissimilar materials never mix well with humidity especially
Watching videos of numerous people telling this man how dangerous and unsafe this is while he disregards any concerns and screams "no!!!!" like a child is infuriating. And the way he was selling this to others who are naive or just as airheaded as him as 'safe' is beyond me.
people with no engineering background have no way of knowing.
I agree. I think undersea explorations to Titanic had just reached a point like Challenger in space. They were becoming so routine in the public eye that the ordinary person just assumed that they could get there and back like others had done.
I think rush was just sending out messages to any rich person he knew just to earn some money to continue this dangerous act which was very greedy of him to do. he could've died it the right way and earned what he needed without anyone dying but to bring down 4 other people with you over greed is insane.
Truley a breathtaking experience for the thrill seekers that received the ultimate Titanic experience
Sounds like he was too confident and eager to try this thing out that he didn’t need anybody else’s validation but his own.
I think Stockton Rush, had a death wish. And he secretly wanted to die, near the wreck of the Titanic.
He could have had his wish without needlessly killing others.
The company I work for specializes in steel pressure vessels and in cross wound carbon fiber and resin pressure vessels. Apart from the way this guy wound/laid his fiber like it was a roll of paper towels…he didn’t use vacuum degassing to get the bubbles out of his tube. A block of Swiss cheese came to mind when I saw his build video. With the cross wound carbon fiber process you also have to build in a humidity controlled environment. The list of other things to be aware of is very long. We test and test and accelerated cycle test for 30 days and take our test vessels to destruction before we can apply for certification. This guy was dangerous and paid the ultimate price for recklessness and became fish food as a result.
I saw a video of them gluing the titanium end-cap to the carbon fiber tube and was thinking a similar thing. Seeminly no degassing of the adhesive, it was just done in a warehouse and not a dust free or temperature/humidity controlled environment. Just seemed really hokey.
I don’t know how much how much of a problem on how the carbon fibers were laid, as they seemed to work for some dives, but I believe it was the extreme enormous pressures on the epoxy or the glue they used, after repeated dives this epoxy separated from the carbon fiber.
@@brians2808 Yeah, that didn’t help either. Their ignorance showed throughout the video. I run into guys like them on a weekly basis. “I’ve been working on these for 30 years…” My reply is, “no you haven’t because we haven’t been making this product for 30 years…” Those are the most dangerous type of people that I run into.
@@A-FrameWedge Scott manley dug up a research paper on using carbon for submarines, how well it is laid makes an incredibly huge difference.
I noticed that when I watched the video of them wrapping the tube in carbon fiber you could see the bubbles and they tried to sand them down afterwards.
He wanted her insight, but ignored her very prophetic advice, because she didn't say what he wanted to hear!
Funny how there are so many experts after a tragedy.
So true, but sadly not funny though. A damning indictment of the times we live in. No shortage of sub experts in the comment sections either.
What angers me most about this is taking a teenager along. If you are arrogant and reckless, don’t bring others down with you.
It makes me seriously furious how avoidable this could have been! This story continues to captivate me like no other!
Unfortunately it’s just a typical story of a Narcissist.. be it Stockton Rush or Elizabeth Holmes.
@@globalcitizennalso a greed story he wanted the most profit with the least amount of spending, also i wonder if it was a suicide mission and he was just waiting for it to implode eventually
The story is still one sided. Let us hear the other side.
@@globalcitizenn not to Forget the intergalactic expedition etc.
@@ObeyCity01 yes..going to the galactic is a no no.. can't cash out, plus not enough fundings. Plus competition from belon mars and that virgin galactit has prospect clients already... so competition is high....not worth going up. Too many space cowboy..
So for quick cash in, it is cheaper to go down, using a concept design or sardine in a tomato can, combined with a banana boat .. design
With DIY materials..and epoxy.. since the price of steels or other solid metals for the last fifteen years has skyrocketed..
A high school project.
Is what happens when you think you know it all.
My older brother has always thought he knows everything about everything and at times I'm surprised he is still living.
They always say "oh we knew there was something wrong" never do enough to prevent it from happening
“Lost all communications before later imploding”
No, they imploded at the exact moment they lost communications.
This is the kind of job I imagine has been done when people on the internet say, "I've done my research."
she nailed it when she said "greed" soon as you monetise anything everything about it is compromised in some way, profit over safety, money over commonsense, if you have ever seen how a pressure vessel is made you realise that saving money was not part of the design process. they are incredibly well made of very thick high-quality steels and metals of pure content, everything about them is of the highest possible standards, internal bulkheads 6 inches thick made from the purest stainless steels that can be made, I've seen deep sea vessels and even the surface pressure vessels that are used to decompress divers are amazingly well made, so a vessel made out of plastic, scaffold poles and car parts cant compare and the fact that self-rescue was built into it like it is with other vessels amazes everyone except the people in it, the authorities should have stopped this from leaving the dockside, all dockside ships etc are under the jurisdiction of the port authorities so how did they not slap a "DO NO LEAVE PORT" certificate on it ?
Stockton Rush has said that safety is a waste. Stockton Rush has always been arrogant and unfortunately his arrogance caused five people including himself their lives.
"Hubrus, complacency and greed" summed this up very well.