I like your style of tutorial/overview. The diagrams really speak to me better than other RUclipsrs doing Eurorack. I really appreciate the comparison of these modules. Often i am comparing several modules to make the best choice for my needs, and you have just made it very easy to do some of that reserach, Thanks and keep it up!!
Great video, I like the way you go through things quickly yet in detail. I had a Quadigy and while I loved its functionality I found it to be too fiddly for how I like to work, and I ended up with a Quadrax for my workhorse 4-channel AR/ASR/LFO needs. There's just so much it can do and I found it quite easy to get around once I got used to a few button combos. CV routing is a little wonky and I wish it had more CV ins, but it's so good I'm considering another. Zadar is simply too menu-based and fiddly for what I like with modular (tried it at Perfect Circuit a while back).
Quadrax is the only one of these 3 modules I own, so I have an inherent bias. However, I want to mention a few things that folks might like to know about one of my desert island modules that the video didn’t seem to have time to get into: -Quadrax in LFO mode will go very well into audio rate and tracks 1v/oct. Combined with all the wave shapes available, you essentially have 4 powerful Wavetable oscillators on hand! However, tuning these oscillators is a well known shortcoming for Quadrax. The Rise knob controls oscillator frequency, and only the final quarter of the knob’s range covers the audio rate frequencies. Tuning can be difficult, as you imagine, but it’s not impossible. -Like any AD envelopes, mixing multiple envelopes can give you an ADSR shape. For example, make 2 Quadrax channels trigger with the same gate input. 1 channel is AD, the other is AHR. Feed both their outputs into say, the IntelliJel Quad VCA, mix and attenuate the signals to taste, and presto, ADSR envelope. Of course, using 2 channels for one envelope is a lot resource wise. But for folks like me that use simple AD envelopes most of the time, it works.
Desert Island Module?? I havent heard that before haha. A common term used for feature packed modules that you would choose if you could only choose one..
I found Zadar to fit my small rack very well and I like its shapes selection, but I have not used quad envelope generators enough to decide whether it is best for me. So far so good.
Excellent review thanks. Another option for a space friendly quad envelope is the Make Noise Pons Asinorum. It also has an LFO option per channel and is super user friendly in a live setting as the navigation and LED colours make it easy even in the dark.
I had Zadar for awhile, but found it too fussy to be fun….felt like I had to search a little too much for the right shape… right now am using Tangrams, both Verbos Env modules, Falistri, Comtour 1. But Ive been wanting something more….something snappy & eclectic. The Quadrax & Quadigy seem very interesting, but I wonder about lack of immediacy with Quadigy’s menus and button combos with Quadrax….
I’ve had quadrax for maybe 4 years now as my main EG. I also value immediacy a lot. Most of the time I have my mod matrix set to the same familiar settings, and it works well for me. I probably go into the mod matrix like once every few months. Maybe before a show or if there’s something specific I know i want to do.
Agree on the Zadar! Its great for small systems, but once you have the space for more immediate envelopes, it loses its appeal. Like Gladstone says, the Quadrax stays immediate if you dont need to change CV assignments much. The Quadigy is not as immediate if you switch between screens or envelope 1 - 4 much. I normally fine-tune one envelope at a time for which it strikes a good balance between immediacy and features to tweak. If you are in need to change multiple values on multiple envelopes, it will take a bit more time.
I wonder how you rate the Falistri? I have had my eye on it and its been on top of my list for so long. Mainly due to it's ability to maintain cycle duration when changing the shape of the stages (unlike maths, contour 1, and most other FGs). What surprised you the most about falistri and what disappoints you most about it?
Hi! Havent tested the Falistri yet! I think Frap Tools makes great modules and I owned some of their modules over the years (e.g. the USTA). However, if you only use your modular infrequently (which happens to me at times) I always end up forgetting what each module can do, due to their minimalistic visual design! I ended up selling most modules with hidden functions or confusing layouts (incl. Frap Tools) as a means to streamline my workflow. (which is no knock on the quality of Frap Tools modules)
Well produced comparison! I have all three of these modules in my rack. I own a Quadrax, Quadigy and the Zadar is a friends'. All three of these modulators are different. For excellent classic styled ADSR EGs, you cannot beat Quadigy. For a Buchla styled function generator, the Quadrax is amazing! The Zadar is something I am glad I didn't buy. I find the navigation of various vector shapes kinda bleh. But I did like your demo of using it as a 3osc; gonna have to try that one. However, I still believe one of, if not the best modulator in eurorack is the old Mutable Instruments Stages. Highly flexible, especially given you can expand it by chaining multiple modules. I have four chained in my system, and it is fucking awesome. 24 LFOs, 12 ARs, 6 ADSRs, 4 six-stage EGs, or one 24-stage step sequencer; and every possible combination of the afore-mentioned at the same time. The multiple Stages is close to what I would love to see as a smaller module. A multi-segment envelope generator, MSEG, similar to what is found in the Zebra2 or other u-He VSTs. Basically like a Zadar but you draw in the vector shape. Ideal.
Thank you for your comment! Mutable Instruments was clearly in a different league when it comes to re-thinking and re-designing all kinds of standard synthesis functions. I also have a MI Stages, but sadly only one, so it didn't make it into the video.
The Zadar can realtime warp each waveform along time and amplitude, mirror along the time axis and you can freely adjust the timing from audio rate to half an hour. Also you can freely adjust the amplitude from 0 to 10V. And with the NIN expander you have CV control over 2 parameters per channel (while I seldomly use more than one). It is unquestionably less direct than the other modules. Its handling can be a little tedious, but it is intuitive nonetheless and it provides by far the most variety and most complex waveshapes in all frequency ranges, especially when you use cross-modulation. I think, it is the best envelope generator for complex sound design, generative patches and ambient pads. I also have the Quadigy, but I confess, I haven't ever considered CVing it, yet. It is my go to ADSR+ envelope. I should spend more time on making use of more of its features. The Quadrax sounds very interesting, but I'm good with what I have.
Thanks for sharing! I agree that the Zadar is capable of the most complex waveshapes and the most extreme time intervals, whereas the other two modules are more straightforward but also more limited. Kinda fun that they each carve out their own ideal use-cases!
The Rampage is a really intriguing module, too! I find that the Rampage and Maths are the main 2-channel contenders to quad envelopes, as they come with some nifty additionaly functions, like logic operations.
I have QARV which could've fit in a video line this. (I'm not going to pretend to be outraged they you didn't include it, as amusing as that could've been.) I make techno and noisy ambient. I've rarely wanted an ADSR but it's easy enough to get QARV to do that by patching adjacent channels, one as AD the other as AHR, then you use the level control on the latter to set sustain. Getting the envelope itself out is requires another mixer but if you're using it to control amplitude, the built in VCA and mixer means you're done. Main downside is the cramped UI and lack of an EOC, but it does a very lot including v/oct tracking for VCO purposes, plus all the function generator goodness.
@@TheSoundConvergence I'm sure there are many others you could've put in as well but the point isn't to be exhaustive, but to get to the why of things. I really enjoyed your video for that: what makes one tool different from another, and how do those differences impact the musician?
Interesting opinion that Zadar doesn't work as well for large systems. To me it's the best MSEG generator out there. The only comparable module I'm aware of is Control Forge, which is much bigger, more expensive, and only does one modulation shape at a time.
Thanks for sharing! For highly complex envelopes, the Zadar is definitely king. For me, I found my composition workflow runs best with ADSR-type envelope modules that are fast to program. That being said, Zadar definitely offers functionality that is hard to come by with other modules!
@@TheSoundConvergence I'm thinking of the hidden modes and button combinations and such like. It has heritage in the west coast, but their UI decisions were very, very different.
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I like your style of tutorial/overview. The diagrams really speak to me better than other RUclipsrs doing Eurorack. I really appreciate the comparison of these modules. Often i am comparing several modules to make the best choice for my needs, and you have just made it very easy to do some of that reserach, Thanks and keep it up!!
Great video, I like the way you go through things quickly yet in detail. I had a Quadigy and while I loved its functionality I found it to be too fiddly for how I like to work, and I ended up with a Quadrax for my workhorse 4-channel AR/ASR/LFO needs. There's just so much it can do and I found it quite easy to get around once I got used to a few button combos. CV routing is a little wonky and I wish it had more CV ins, but it's so good I'm considering another. Zadar is simply too menu-based and fiddly for what I like with modular (tried it at Perfect Circuit a while back).
Quadrax is the only one of these 3 modules I own, so I have an inherent bias. However, I want to mention a few things that folks might like to know about one of my desert island modules that the video didn’t seem to have time to get into:
-Quadrax in LFO mode will go very well into audio rate and tracks 1v/oct. Combined with all the wave shapes available, you essentially have 4 powerful Wavetable oscillators on hand! However, tuning these oscillators is a well known shortcoming for Quadrax. The Rise knob controls oscillator frequency, and only the final quarter of the knob’s range covers the audio rate frequencies. Tuning can be difficult, as you imagine, but it’s not impossible.
-Like any AD envelopes, mixing multiple envelopes can give you an ADSR shape. For example, make 2 Quadrax channels trigger with the same gate input. 1 channel is AD, the other is AHR. Feed both their outputs into say, the IntelliJel Quad VCA, mix and attenuate the signals to taste, and presto, ADSR envelope. Of course, using 2 channels for one envelope is a lot resource wise. But for folks like me that use simple AD envelopes most of the time, it works.
Great ADSR tip! Thanks! Got any more like that? haha.
Desert Island Module?? I havent heard that before haha. A common term used for feature packed modules that you would choose if you could only choose one..
I found Zadar to fit my small rack very well and I like its shapes selection, but I have not used quad envelope generators enough to decide whether it is best for me. So far so good.
Excellent review thanks. Another option for a space friendly quad envelope is the Make Noise Pons Asinorum. It also has an LFO option per channel and is super user friendly in a live setting as the navigation and LED colours make it easy even in the dark.
Great suggestion! I didn't know about this quad envelope and now I'm impressed by how they got all 4 envelopes into 6HP!
I had Zadar for awhile, but found it too fussy to be fun….felt like I had to search a little too much for the right shape… right now am using Tangrams, both Verbos Env modules, Falistri, Comtour 1. But Ive been wanting something more….something snappy & eclectic. The Quadrax & Quadigy seem very interesting, but I wonder about lack of immediacy with Quadigy’s menus and button combos with Quadrax….
I’ve had quadrax for maybe 4 years now as my main EG. I also value immediacy a lot. Most of the time I have my mod matrix set to the same familiar settings, and it works well for me. I probably go into the mod matrix like once every few months. Maybe before a show or if there’s something specific I know i want to do.
Agree on the Zadar! Its great for small systems, but once you have the space for more immediate envelopes, it loses its appeal.
Like Gladstone says, the Quadrax stays immediate if you dont need to change CV assignments much. The Quadigy is not as immediate if you switch between screens or envelope 1 - 4 much. I normally fine-tune one envelope at a time for which it strikes a good balance between immediacy and features to tweak. If you are in need to change multiple values on multiple envelopes, it will take a bit more time.
I wonder how you rate the Falistri? I have had my eye on it and its been on top of my list for so long. Mainly due to it's ability to maintain cycle duration when changing the shape of the stages (unlike maths, contour 1, and most other FGs).
What surprised you the most about falistri and what disappoints you most about it?
Hi! Havent tested the Falistri yet! I think Frap Tools makes great modules and I owned some of their modules over the years (e.g. the USTA). However, if you only use your modular infrequently (which happens to me at times) I always end up forgetting what each module can do, due to their minimalistic visual design! I ended up selling most modules with hidden functions or confusing layouts (incl. Frap Tools) as a means to streamline my workflow. (which is no knock on the quality of Frap Tools modules)
Well produced comparison!
I have all three of these modules in my rack. I own a Quadrax, Quadigy and the Zadar is a friends'. All three of these modulators are different. For excellent classic styled ADSR EGs, you cannot beat Quadigy. For a Buchla styled function generator, the Quadrax is amazing! The Zadar is something I am glad I didn't buy. I find the navigation of various vector shapes kinda bleh. But I did like your demo of using it as a 3osc; gonna have to try that one.
However, I still believe one of, if not the best modulator in eurorack is the old Mutable Instruments Stages. Highly flexible, especially given you can expand it by chaining multiple modules. I have four chained in my system, and it is fucking awesome. 24 LFOs, 12 ARs, 6 ADSRs, 4 six-stage EGs, or one 24-stage step sequencer; and every possible combination of the afore-mentioned at the same time.
The multiple Stages is close to what I would love to see as a smaller module. A multi-segment envelope generator, MSEG, similar to what is found in the Zebra2 or other u-He VSTs. Basically like a Zadar but you draw in the vector shape. Ideal.
Thank you for your comment! Mutable Instruments was clearly in a different league when it comes to re-thinking and re-designing all kinds of standard synthesis functions. I also have a MI Stages, but sadly only one, so it didn't make it into the video.
The Zadar can realtime warp each waveform along time and amplitude, mirror along the time axis and you can freely adjust the timing from audio rate to half an hour. Also you can freely adjust the amplitude from 0 to 10V. And with the NIN expander you have CV control over 2 parameters per channel (while I seldomly use more than one). It is unquestionably less direct than the other modules. Its handling can be a little tedious, but it is intuitive nonetheless and it provides by far the most variety and most complex waveshapes in all frequency ranges, especially when you use cross-modulation. I think, it is the best envelope generator for complex sound design, generative patches and ambient pads.
I also have the Quadigy, but I confess, I haven't ever considered CVing it, yet. It is my go to ADSR+ envelope. I should spend more time on making use of more of its features.
The Quadrax sounds very interesting, but I'm good with what I have.
Thanks for sharing! I agree that the Zadar is capable of the most complex waveshapes and the most extreme time intervals, whereas the other two modules are more straightforward but also more limited. Kinda fun that they each carve out their own ideal use-cases!
Great Video!
I have the Befaco Rampage and love it. It's very basic but super hands on with no menu diving. Also it's not quad, but 2 channels.
The Rampage is a really intriguing module, too! I find that the Rampage and Maths are the main 2-channel contenders to quad envelopes, as they come with some nifty additionaly functions, like logic operations.
@@TheSoundConvergence I think the Frankinktides from Tesseract Modular (mashup of Mutable clones) is a cool option :)
I have QARV which could've fit in a video line this. (I'm not going to pretend to be outraged they you didn't include it, as amusing as that could've been.) I make techno and noisy ambient. I've rarely wanted an ADSR but it's easy enough to get QARV to do that by patching adjacent channels, one as AD the other as AHR, then you use the level control on the latter to set sustain. Getting the envelope itself out is requires another mixer but if you're using it to control amplitude, the built in VCA and mixer means you're done.
Main downside is the cramped UI and lack of an EOC, but it does a very lot including v/oct tracking for VCO purposes, plus all the function generator goodness.
This basically. QARV gives me so much for what it tells up
Thanks for the comment! I didn't leave it out on purpose, I just didn't know this module exists. Looks quite intruigung as well!
@@TheSoundConvergence I'm sure there are many others you could've put in as well but the point isn't to be exhaustive, but to get to the why of things. I really enjoyed your video for that: what makes one tool different from another, and how do those differences impact the musician?
Interesting opinion that Zadar doesn't work as well for large systems. To me it's the best MSEG generator out there. The only comparable module I'm aware of is Control Forge, which is much bigger, more expensive, and only does one modulation shape at a time.
Thanks for sharing! For highly complex envelopes, the Zadar is definitely king. For me, I found my composition workflow runs best with ADSR-type envelope modules that are fast to program. That being said, Zadar definitely offers functionality that is hard to come by with other modules!
Maybe a bit hyperbolic, but Quadrax takes a much inspiration from Peaks as Buchla
Fair! Both are interesting envelopes with nifty extra functions.
@@TheSoundConvergence I'm thinking of the hidden modes and button combinations and such like. It has heritage in the west coast, but their UI decisions were very, very different.
Niceeee