Firearms Facts Episode 3: 7.62x54r
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
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Great cartridge even for today's standards. It's been in service since 1891 and shows no sign of slowing down. What's not to like? I'd go as far as to say that it's my favorite general rifle cartridge.
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Recipe for one fun weekend:
1. Find a gunstore that lets you pick your Mosin out of a crate.
2. Buy it, take it home, clean it, research it, and get the headspace checked.
3. Go out plinking with some surplus 7.62x54r ammo.
4. Watch "Enemy at the Gates" while you clean your rifle.
I almost did that. I bought my Mosin, took it out of the packaging and watched Enemy at the Gates while cleaning it.
Defiance is a great one too.
keithschricker I'll check that one out. Thanks!!!
keithschricker I don't remember Mosins in Defiance.
John Pryce They're definitely in there. Check out the terrific website imfdb.com (internet movie firearms database). You can look up a movie and it tells you what guns were seen in it. My favorite entry is the one for the movie "Commando". There are several continuity errors and the site points a bunch of them out. Enjoy!
it packs a punch for sure. My buddy was hit in his level IV plate in Ramadi by a sniper using a Dragonov. Hit him so hard that despite the plate taking it, he still suffered from a collapsed lung.
+dialn911 Damn!
Getting hit with nearly 2800 foot pounds of force I’m sure he did
dialn911 I hope his alright!
54r steel cores can go through level 3 armor
He was lucky hope he got at least a purple heart for his troubles.
Mosin Nagant = a ton of fun
It's the gun I take the most to the range.
I love you guys' respect for the Mosin type rifles and the 7.62x54r. Too many people dismiss them as crap because of their price, so it's nice to see them getting the respect they deserve!
Love this cartridge. It is more or less the equal of the 30-06 albeit with slightly less case capacity. There is a reason it is still in service, and that is simply because it works very well.
RIP Barry, def one of my favorites... Still love the Chad and Eric vids.
Cool vid, Great cartridge, I can see why it's your favorite
I have 3 Mosins...two originals and one i sporterized. All shoot like a dream..and are a ton of fun. Love using the surplus ammo....and never ever have an issue finding or getting more ammo.
Love the bond you and Barry had! He’s missed! Eric you have taught me so much through your videos thank you and god bless!!
i feel sad watching these old videos
rip Barry
At least he was around long enough to create and feature in loads of these fun and informative videos! They will make sure his memory lives on for years to come. RIP Barry.
7.62x54r: First shot dislocates your shoulder, the second can be used to put it back.
Gingy the man someone make a double barrel side by side break action 762x54r rifle I know it's impractical but it would be awesome
Gingy the man , I just burst out laughing, but it stopped quickly, because I'm still nursing a dislocated shoulder from firing that beast lol
I still want one And it must have two Marlin skulls in place of bayonets
Mosin dosent even kick that hard wtf
Gingy the man It doesn't kick all that hard IMHO. Then again, I'm used to shooting slugs out of my 12 gauge pretty regularly so there's that.
Barry I miss you bro.
Edwin Acevedo I think the same thing every time I watch or rewatch these videos.
+Edwin Acevedo Word. RIP, brotha.
+Chris P only in the flesh. His spirit lives on.
RIP Barry
@@chattifactory Look up "Gun Gripes 85"
Seems like Barry was grooming Eric. Good that he taught Eric alot before he left. RIP
Oh the older guy is no longer with us? :(
@@Bagheera2 Barry's been dead about 5 years
@@bobsmith-ru7xp Yeah i found out a few weeks after posting this. It sucked. He seems like he was one of those cool old codgers you just wanted to learn from and listen to at the gun store. They dont make those old timers no more. Bless him.
"This was the sniper rifle of the gee-hahd"
Actually, that rifle is short-stroke and his is long-stroke.
It's the action in an L85 or G36
It packs a real wallop without a doubt, you can really appreciate the recoil in the short barrelled m44. You can turn those surplus rounds into good hunting ammo with the addition of a 180gn sp.
The VEPR is a long stroke, similar to AK platform. The Dragunov used a short stroke piston with adjustable gas block. The guns, though having similar external ergonomic appearances, are as different as apples and oranges.
had the same issue on my new one at the range....put some motor oil from the dipstick of my car on the bolt and no issues after that (I cleaned the crap out of it and polished the bolt and chamber before taking it to the range the first time)....just forgot to lube it up. Now I'm running a synthetic lube on it and it is smooth as butter! all my sticking was after it was fired
No chance of surplus 54R drying up. Oh how I wish that were true. It's extremely difficult to find in large quantities now.
Amen
+I SSMDad Must be where you are at. I just bought two 54R tins for $140(70 a pop), and they had four more.
Probably so but I haven't even seen much bulk cans on the websites that usually carry it either. It's available at gun shows but for much more $ than it was a year or two ago.
+I SSMDad True, i notice more and more people are buying Mosin Nagants. The round has gained a lot of popularity since its cheap(price) and the ammo is as well.
Yeah. Glad the gun is enjoyed but miss the super cheap ammo days. haha
A buddy of mine had an old kevlar helmet on his acreage and we used handgun and rifle rounds to see which would penetrate. Only the 7.62x54R punched clean through it. Magnificent cartridge. I have a VEPR but it is chambered in 7.62x39 - wish I had also gotten one in 54R before the guns dried up. Oh well, at least I got my hands on a VEPR. Awesome rifle, it's my favorite.
the dragunov Tigr (Tiger) is Russian made. The Chinese variant is called NDM-86. Great video guys. I love your stuff
Excellent video. I hope that you guys turn out a few more caliber educational videos like this, discussing history and case design and the advantages of such nuances. Lots of people don't know that the 5.56x45mm is a very straight-cased cartridge and what that means for feeding and extracting, or what the rim of the 7.62x54r means to the shooter and design in practical terms. I for one would like to see you guys continue this and spread interest and awareness in caliber design and history.
Agreed. If anyone is curious how to slug the bore, just take a pellet of buckshot and with a wooden dowel drive it through the bore with a bit of gun lube. You can then use calipers to measure it. All of my Mosins, even the Finnish M39, are right at .311.
I got to say, you put out some worth while videos that are very educational as well as inspiring to me.
Good video guys,...this cartridge deserves its own episode. Definetly one of my favorite surplus "gun/ammo" options. Every sportsman should own at least one 91/30 M-N, a classic warhorse bargain for $100.
We miss you Barry thanks for all the knowledge you passed to us all thru the years. Thank You
I own one of those Veprs, I love it.
We captured a few of these in Iraq in 2004 and 2005. They’ll be in use for decades to come.
Here is a reason why the 7.62x54r cartridge is still in service with the Russians today was the priority after the Soviets had assumed full control by the 20's, weapons and cartridge designs took a back seat as all the funding and effort was to bring the country into the 20th century. The Poliburo wanted to increase mass production on essentials such as tractors to plow the fields and develop more land into better living space, not to mention updating old fashioned factories on a shoe string budget. The Worker's Peasant's Army wasn't too focused on developing any new technology unless there was a need for it. They saw the Mosin Nagant as a tough rifle that could be cheap enough to make, and they had a stock pile of 7.62x54r made during WWI and was used up between the Reds and the Whites. It was a rifle design that stood up to abuse without care or cleaning if need be in a time of war, but any inter-war army of the time after a drill in the mud you as the soldier had to keep his weapon spotless and functional, as they couldn't dream to replace rifles that were already made before the revolution and after. They were forced to keep every weapon in operating condition until it was far too gone to rebuild. Forced to use what was then a somewhat outdated rifle design, they continued to make more of the 7.62x54r as a caliber change would complicate matters at this point, and the tension in the day was beginning to brew another world war. So in the end the Red Army designed weapons around the cartridge, and from that time period it was known that the 7.62x54r round was to be the mainstay of the USSR until the SKS and AK series had finally took it out of front line service. Fearing a third world war would happen in the near future, they stock piled Mosins and kept making the cartridge because they had the capability to procure them cheaply and quickly into the millions. WWIII never happened and the wall fell, and the Russian military was looking at millions of Mosins and its cartridge that sat idle in warehouses, and they had no idea how to get rid of them. I'm sure they contemplated destroying its stock of rifles and ammunition, but this would cost MONEY to do and is wasteful. Hence why its still used today, because they have to get rid of it somehow, no matter how many spam cans they give us they'll be using that stuff for three or even four decades from now. They don't have a choice today, nor did the early Soviet regime had a choice to change anything either. Your surprised that a rimmed cartridge survived this long. Its understandable why, but it doesn't make it surprising given the circumstances the Russians had to face in the 20th century. Cheers
Saku19 I heard a whisper in the air, it must be nothing important I guess.
How the fuck is liking cartoons or anything like that make one gay?
Are all children and people who still watch those shows gay?
Does that mean you used to be gay?
Furfag
well your analysis is not fully up to the mark .. 7.62*54r is slightly superior in ballistics as compared to NATO 7.62*51....which is the west main caliber along with 5.56*45..and that is the biggest reason why the russian government has not phased this cartridge out of the service...if 7.62*51 is phased out even today than the russian 7.62*54r might get upgrades and still will not be phased out since this design has a great capacity and room for further improvements in the future.
Most sporting good stores have them , but wait for them to go on sale, and I see them at every gun show I go to. They are everywhere.
I have 4 Mosin Nagant rifles. Considering the price of ammo today, the surplus ammo is by far cheaper to shoot than a 9mm pistol. You can get 440 rounds in a spam can at gun shows for around $85. Basically it`s about 17 cents per shot, just clean your rifle after shooting because the surplus ammo is corrosive. The velocity is right at 2800 FPS. It will blow right through 3/8th`s steel plate at 50 yards with no problems at all. The stuff is awesome!
The stripper clips actually work! No dumped rounds. Excellent round I have good results with 182 gr Mil Spec in my Tokarevs and my FPK.Thanks for the information.
It's my favorite cartridge as well, when you want easy range cleanup this makes just about anything disappear! Rocks, clay tile pipe...fill a tide bottle with water and this will open it like a spam can!
@CCCT1997. No, it is a centerfire, rimmed cartridge. What this means is that it has a rim on the primer end that usually makes you pay attention to how it is loaded in a firearm. If you put the rim of the top cartridge behind the cartridge below it you will have feed issues. The rim also comes into play with the bolt and extractor. Other than those points, it is just the same as any other centerfire cartridge in its class.
Took my mosin out yesterday for the first time and I love it. Cant beat the price and still an accurate rifle.
I absolutely love my m44. Deer slayer with the 203 gr.
Mosins are easily one of my favourite rifles and i would kill for a VEPR if we could own them up here! Really diggin this series, keep it up!
I love my 1940 mosin I can put holes in old engine components and home appliances all day with it, just a good looking gun with a great feeling round very accurate.
I love the mosin
bobbafett704 - I got a an M44 last Saturday and when I took it to the range I became an addict.
Thanks guys, outstanding vid. Although the 30.06 is my favorite [for sentimental reasons] the 7.62x54r is a real close second and I shoot that cartridge by far more than any other round except the .22lr. And even that would be a close race. Love the round and the guns that are chambered for it. Thanks again.
The Tiger (Тигр) was a Russian made SVD sporting a shorter barrel usually chambered in 7.62x54r manufactured for commercial export. The Chinese SVD (which sported the proper length barrel) goes by the model name NDM-86 and came chambered in both 7.62x54r and .308.
the 54r is a great cartridge and im glad you did this video. if you know how to pick out a barrel you can find mosins that are more than capable of slinging lead out to 650m+ on irons with surplus ball. truly impressive round and rifle
THAT'S what I want to see. A suppressed 91/30. Next project Eric?
Vepr has different gas system than SVD (Dragunov Sniper Rifle).
That Vepr has AK gas system, and only 2 similar things with SVD - stock style and caliber.
Molot factory uses RPK (Kalashnikov Machine Gun) receivers for all their AK-style guns, that is the reason why it's heavier.
IZHMASH uses AK-47 receiver in their Saiga guns.
Agreed, this is an outstanding cartridge. Have had much enjoyment firing this round in my Mosins.
Out in my workshop loading up 7.62 x 54R and 30-40 Krag, watching videos, and generally enjoying myself for the Holidays. Thank you guys for so many ideas, information, and entertainment in general. Thanks for the videos and please keep them up, merry Christmas to Mr. Moss, Eric and the crew, and merry Christmas to you Barry wherever you are.
Got a 1943 Mosin "Izzy". Its fantastic for a hunting rifle! I love mine. I also reload for it.
Exactly. And my first gun was a Marlin 3030, then the 1911, ak-47. THEN I bought myself a mosin and enfield same day. Mosin still wins :)
I know this is an old video but I must've missed this one. Always great videos, love the channel.
love the 7.62x54r!!!!My first centerfire rifle was a mosin 91/59!!!
if your having trouble with the bolt disassemble the rifle and use heavy duty brake cleaner to remove the cosomiline from the chamber then grease the rifle and reassemble and use bore solovont to clean it after every use unless you reload your own rounds
Well I meant more on the lines of it's cheap, cheap to shoot, and overlooked so many times, yet it is such a freakin powerhouse with soooo much history and the longest servicing cartridge in the world.
@ 3:12. this is one gun that i have had immense interest in ever since i seen one a a gun show a few years back. it was a little pricey but it did come with an ACOG-style scope. i still regret to this day not buying it.
the tigr is a hunting rifle. In the U.S they are now legal to import because they have a 5 round mag, no flash hider, and a less "scary omg i shit my pants" thumb hole stock, as opposed to the skeletal awesome stock.
I just got a case of 7.62x54r 7n1 today. Also Chinese make the type 86 SVD clone, the tiger is the paratrooper SVD with a different stock, no flash hider , and no adjustable gas system. I got a tiger last week.
Yes, it was intended to do so, but for the roles that "snipers" played at the time of its conception. There were even "snipers" back in the Revolutionary War, if I'm not mistaken. The roles of snipers have changed, and so, too, have the guns used by them. I really don't know how to put it any more simply than that. The Dragunov WAS made to be a sniper rifle at the time it was created, and it DID fit into the sniper's role at the time it was designed.
Well holy shit, I never even thought of that lol. Learn something new everyday.
That would explain the longer bullets retained on the 7.62x39mm and the 5.45x39mm
(Cont) Though there are some things to consider. A: Rifles chambered in .303 Enfield can easily be converted...the Enfield SMLE rifles simply need a replacement barrel. B: Finland's Tkiv rifle uses old Mosin receivers to produce ridiculously accurate rifles.The biggest reasons US Mosins have such a bad reputation for accuracy is C: most have fried barrels and/or are wartime with garbage tolerances, D: cheap, steel cased ammo and/or surplus ammo is -not- made for accuracy, but for volume.
Many hate this round but. This is excellent ammo.
Not every Tigr has a shorter barrel than SVD, but many of the (like mine) has a 620 mm barrel, with long flash supressor.
My Tigr, came from factory with 620mm barrle, military hanguards and buttstock, as well as two postion gas regulator.
My tigr is almost identical to an SVD, with the exception of the bayonet lug.
I meant that the videos that Eric makes focus on military surplus, that's his area of interest as far as the hobby goes. Yes the shop carries modern arms too. Search his video's, I'm fairly sure they have what you are looking for as far as modern weapons go.
AR-15: Can hit sub MOA all day
AK-47: Can only hit the broad side of a barn from inside it
Mosin Nagant: Can hit the farm from two counties over
I used to have an NDM-86 in 7.62x54R, and it is almost identical to an issue SVD...except for the barrel length and the rather cheesy phosphate finish. The 308 is much more common though. I miss mine, but I sold it to make a down payment on my new house:)
Yes I've read much the same and plan on doing all that is necessary to fit the stock. I'm just hoping I don't get one of the really twisted ones as that will be sent back. Thanks for the heads up anyway AcidicHB!
One of my favorite cartridges as well, sadly I sold most of my Mosin Nagant rifles many years ago like an idiot. They aren't as common north of the 49th as they once were!
Hey I have used both of those powders in 7.62x54r loads! I have found that you can use almost any rifle powder in it and still maintain good accuracy! I make all kinds of loads for that round with powders left over from other rifle loads. I don't mix the powders of coarse but you get what I mean.
After looking it up I had no idea that the SVT-40 fired that caliber, I assumed it was the same as the SKS and AK style rounds, but now realize that they are later era weapons. Russians made brilliant firearms!
I load my 7.62x54r cartridges with Hornady .312 diameter bullets. They shoot very well.
They are usually .310-.312. Slugging the bore is a good idea if you want to reload. Finnish Mosins will often have a tighter bore, usually .309 or so.
Given the weakness of the 5.56 NATO at range, and given the type of engagement most common in Afghanistan, the British Army are now implementing the 7.62 x 51 L129A1 at squad level in much the same role as the Dragunov you mentioned.
Big boom! Heavy recoil. And, with the bayonet attached you have a spear. Impress your friends and others at the rifle range by having the loudest rifle on the range.
Unless someone else has a .220 Swift.. I've heard those things are earsplitters if they're really cranked up.
Moon clips aren't used exclusively for non-rimmed cartridges; they're also a means for quick reloading and are far less bulky than speed loaders. 1 moon clip or two half-moon clips VS 5 or 6 individual cartridges.
Yes.. The VEPR is an RPK type rifle with a long action ROMAK3 is the same, the SVD has a much shorter action.
Veprs are under 1k on average, most are 7-900.
PSL's are fast going up in price with most running north of 1100 on Gunbroker I sold one of mine recently for 1400 the day it was listed.
Blackhorse is making a stamped receiver drag, I have one on pre-order and that was 2500.
I laughed so hard when he said something about it being the round favored by snipers of the Jihad.
It is indeed a surplus ammunition, most notable rifle I think would be the FN FAL though, right arm of the free world.
The other notable ones being the PKM (belt fed soviet machine gun) and the SVD of course, AK-47 uses the 7.62x39 though.
Another fantastic rifle that uses the 54r is the SV-98, still in service in many countries (though it does also fire the 51 nato)
my fav cartridge and 303 brit for sure
I heard from a reliable source that the ATI stocks can need some serious modding to make the Mosins fit so they're accurate. He said the barrel fit really snugly in the stock (meaning it's not a floated barrel [less accuracy as the gun heats up]). He had to carve out the stock in places to get a good fit.
they did, don't know if they still do. The Winchester 1895 was made in 7.62x54R, I don't know how easy one is to find but they were made
I recall watching Hichcock "explaining" the ballistics of the rifle before he even squeezed the trigger. "Not as powerful as a .308 or 30-06 of course..."
Yah, I'm going the surplus ammo route myself. Mosin first, start saving for the Vepr, then build or buy a 5.45X39 AK74. I might talk my dad out of his Swiss 1911 rifle as well. It has surplus non corrosive ammo but at about twice the cost of 7.62X54r surplus.
I have a mosin. I use Hershers (spelling may be wrong) steel plated ammo. A mosin is a great rifle. Its recoil is fairly easy to handle :)
Who knows. A lot of those magnum rounds have some very high pressures, especially ones like the 500 and the 460, so I imagine whatever principles of sturdiness were applied to accommodate those would just be applied to a proportional degree with the 7.62x54r revolver rifle. I have no doubt that the finished product would look very impressive to say the least!
I shot some surplus from the 80’s. Only time in my life I’ve seen an empty copper jacket get stuck sideways in my target with the lead core gone. I haven’t shot the surplus since then lol
Without even reading the comments I KNEW this would turn into a "PSL is not a Dragunov" pissing and moaning fest. Yes we know it's not. The comparison was made in that it is also a designated marksman weapon that uses the 7.62x54r round. Design wise the Dragunov probably shares more styling and design elements with an SKS than a PSL or AK. I own and love my PSL. I think it's a great weapon and one of the least expensive 7.62mm SASS systems you can buy. (for now anyway). Great Vid Guys!!
Love my Mosins, and I love this round. Lots of power. A real reach out round.
The VEPR rifles and shotguns are actually of ukrainian origin, made by Molot. The chinese Norinco NDM-86 is one of the truly copies of the Dragunov. The Tiger (or Tigr) is a civilian version of the Dragunov made by the same factory (Izhmash), you can order it from the factory in several configurations (calibers, stocks, barrel length, flash hiders), the only differences with the military ones is that they lack of an adjustable gas system and the rear sight is marked up to 300 meters only.
Hey Iraqveteran8888 glad to see that you cycle your mosin from the shoulder. It's one of my pet peeves when people always drop the gun down to hip level and cycle.
yeah if you hand load you should totally load for it. I use PRVI PARTIZAN Bullets and then reload the brass. if you don't have a loader get the Lee hand held press and you can load some with that fairly easily.
Best cartridge and weapon to stockpile and shoot for the money.
totally agree! Out of my 4 guns, my family's like, 6 or 7. and all of my friends guns, my 1923 Hex is still my favorite! :D
If you have not tried that brand of ammo, I would suggest you try it an see if the problem remains. If it does, you will have to do a bit of sanding inside of the receiver where the bolt tends to snag. Hope this helps!
I have all the Military SVD parts on my Tiger, except the 1200 meter sight and adjustable gas reg. 20 inch barrel, same as SVDS but shorter than the 24 inch SVD barrel
I remember the first time I shot my 91/30. It was in an indoor range, and most of the other guys had AR-15 type rifles, not very loud. So I load 5 rounds, pull the trigger, and BOOM! 5 guys turn to look at me. It was a good day
A DMR is a rifle designed for precision, portability, and rate of fire. It is more 'elastic' that the dedicated sniper rifle. While the dedicated sniper rifle is capable of greater precision and accuracy at longer ranges, it's usually heavier, more cumbersome, and quite useless for anything except sniping. DMRs however are lighter, allowing for more mobility, and provide a greater rate of fire (most of them are semi-auto and feed from removable magazines).
The vepr is an rpk (heavy receiver ak) chambered in many calibers. It is not a dragunov. The psl is not based on the dragunov except in purpose of use as it is also a big ak. Dragunov was a russian precision rifle maker that was hired by the government to come up with a designated marksman rifle. It is a short stroke piston gas system like the sks and the vz58. They gave it ak looking controls to make training easier. Anyways...
I find the fact that its a rimmed cartridge and still being used......and the fact that it has been kept as a the CommBlock medium round (whereas we went from the 30-06 to the .308)
The cylinder would be pretty hefty and would probably top out at a 5-round capacity with moon clips (or half-moon clips, for that matter). I could never imagine something like that being a pistol, though, otherwise you would see broken wrists everywhere, haha! I was thinking of something like the Taurus CIRCUIT Judge - a revolver rifle.
If someone were to make a reliable semi-auto rifle chambered in 7.62x54r with high quality magazines that were 20+ capacity, they'd make a fortune.
i have a mosin and i am saving up for a SVT40. around they go for around $1500 on gunbroker or my local gun shows. plus i have a thing for WWII rifles
I agree with your favorite rifle cartridge, but for myself it is the 6.5x55mm.
The Tiger isn't just sporterized with a shorter barrel/muzzle, it also lacks the gas adjustment. Granted; the gas adjustment on the SVD is just about useless other than opening up the system a little more when it gets dirty but it's still an important thing to note. It is -not- a good idea to try and use the gas adjustment to make an SVD fire heavy slugs just like with the PSL (since the PSL is actually a FAR stronger mechanism), though the Vepr has been said to be capable due to it's strength.
another great thing about the 7.62x54r... belt fed semi auto pkm's.... I know they exist... but good luck finding one..