Hey man, love the video and especially love hearing your thought process as you try to work through plays. I'm going to try to keep it full water and I appreciate your efforts to do water as well, even though starfrost seems better. Keep up the guides, I'm soaking it in!
As I'm playing with the world chalice engine and the starfrost engine, while they definitely increase the ceiling of the deck, they also reduce the consistency and especially with starfrost atlanteans, trying to find tht sweet spot has been difficult. Pure water still has a nice ceiling and is alot more consistent and ill be revisiting pure water when harpooner comes out
@hikaruonline I'll be releasing some updated profiles hopfully today and tomorrow as well as will be recording feature matches from locals this weekend
Good afternoon! First of all, thank you very much for all the work you are doing to improve this deck, which has been one of my favorites for many years despite the lack of support cards, and you're making it really fun and enjoyable to play! I wanted to ask you a question. I've also tested various mixes of your list extensively and wanted to know what you think about including Testudo Erat Numen or Water Barrier Statue at the end of the combo because I realized it puts opponents in a lot of difficulty! In this meta, a bit of lockdown is always necessary... What do you think? And also pot of Avarice, also if is a brick, could not be the solution if you finish the dragoons e restore the deck/extradeck?
Appreciate the love! Means alot! So when it comes to the water lock stuff, It's just never really been my preferred play style and in the icejade ran + dragoons combo, i always preffered getting barone, chengying, + moulin over puttig my opponent on the marincess statue water lock cus u leave ur self wide open to a single imperm. Tht being said I can't deny the power of the barrier statue marincess lock tht I have started to play with and putting my opponent on "better have it". Tht would be the route I go most likely, but if I was to play with Numen, I would be playing the toad package. As for avarice, I prayed for this card to get unlimited and once finally playing I have come to the conclusion tht avarice is a strong card and in a slower format I belive it may be an option, but currently water is a glass cannon combo deck tht needs 3-4 cards to combo in there opening hand. With non engine slots already limited, removing a hand trap or board breaker for an avarice just seems like ur even more so giving up games going second. I also belive it is a win more card in a sense where avarice isn't typically live until uve gone full combo so in tht sense if u went full combo u should already been winning anyways. U get ashed on diva with avarice in hand u pass, u get ashed with nib, talents, cross out, or super poly in hand u still have a chance.
@@deepseaygo250 Thank you very much for your response, and you've been very clear. You're definitely a much more experienced player than me, and you've perfectly clarified every doubt! The new banlist has come out, and let's see what can be done in the future! If I remember correctly, Tidal was in an old version of the deck... I look forward to your update! For now, have a great day, and thanks again for everything!
After watching the first few mins. To awnser the teus question im with you and dont like running pike. I never did. Gunde however is okay. My personal favourite though is abyss mander ;) he is so underrated if you know what I all I did with him in the past. Going into rank8 with teus and mouling is just so satisfying. I used to search for a 3rd time off dragoons thanks to a combo line involving mermail abyssmander. Or handloop for 4-5 back when that master rule 4? was in effect. Long story short. Try to see if you can do something with abyssmander. Although I suspect it wont do you any good beyond summing a rank8. This will also result in that combo line needing to open with mermailabyssteus and not Rahn. The one you showed last night. Eitherway it cant hurt to try :D I still believe the mermail times have gone. But I want to try and see if we can pull something off with mermails still :D before burying them until new mermail support comes out (if ever).
Yeah I think even gunde feels like a bad card and if I was to play teus, I don't even think I would have a search target and tht point he is most likely just cut. U can do the rank 7 combo without him it just won't provide the same amount of value I feel
@@deepseaygo250 True I totally get running teus without even a target. how nuts it may sound :D or cutting teus alltogether. if you can get that rank 7 combo opened enough with lets say fenrir, Rahn and 1 megalo? goodluck figuring that out.
Against snake eyes honestly im currently not a meta player just a water specialist. So I havent been able to take a look at snake eyes very much. Ideas are rank8 nr1 buzz king to hit their fusion? attach their grave pieces to this card, the water statue or errat numen soft sp lock, shaddoll winda, abyss dweller? Triple tactic talents, a well timed imperm, super poly, enig packbit, summon limit, we can play anti spell fragrance since we play a lot of monsters. If going for dweller you might wanne boost his attack with crossheep or mistarboy or the mermail link2.
I'm actually playing with a go second water deck tht mains board wipes, poly, tactic and droplet. Playing water with tht 6th card seems to make a big difference. I've also made alot of head way with starfrost atlanteans, it feel really consistent right now and plays 3 fenrir, 3 tactic, 3 droplet for non engine. Going second into snake eyes it might not be enough but against other strategies and going first it might have potential
I picked max rarity water before prince dropped when it was dirt and never got rid of. Then I started playing again last October and picked up mannadium as meta deck of choice tht I used to get my invite and luckily alot of the extra cards carried over to water. I also pulled a little knight in my entry so I got lucky there
6:30 prince send dragoons; 16:20 you could've use tremora to special duo and then aria to search diva, so then you could've gone into donna; 40:28 can't use donna since there aren't opponent's banished cards. No big deal, just practice more :) Although, I admit I don't very like this version of the deck. I mean, I'm happy to see Mermail and yes, when it can start it goes hard, but there's too little non-engine and the quantity of bricks you have to play are just too much (water already plays some bricks, playing even more is just too risky) Instead, regarding the Starfrost combo is just so frickin cool that now I need to test with it, maybe playing more water engine and less of mannadium!
Tht not sending dragoons was yikes, yes i could special duo there but lose to hand traps harder, and used little knight to banish a card tht moulin sent to make Donna live. As for where the deck is, the non engine space is rough and idk wht I wanna do about it. I do think there r to many one of's and maybe some of them rnt necessary
@@deepseaygo250 don't know whachu mean with 'of' but if I get it right you mean the level 7's. If that's right then yeah, there are simply too many that aren't necessary
Also when harpooner gets released what if we remove teus and co alltogether but instead bring back one copy of mermail abyssmegalo? Summoning him off tremora or harpooner. Essentially costing you one in hand as well. The upside: no bricky hands also great card going 2nd. It could be a niche addition to the deck. But it probably isn't a good idea. seeing we need our dragoon searchers for something else. also we need anti-hand trap ways before summoning our diva/prince like the combo you showed last night. and/or be less diva reliant. I think there are great water times ahead of us and we are in the pre-building phase I Kind of love that. Think I will finally start to create and upload some videos as well to better show you guys what I've got cooking and join forces. Ps. Opening that seaserpent in hand can be fixed with running one atlantean infantry or use tremora/harpooner sp effect. Running one infantry fixes more things btw. 1)anwser to floodgates, 2)prince can go off again in the grind game. 3) fix opening double diva. The cradle play with draccosack is correct. Its the same reason why detaching mouling from a rank8 wont require you to skip your next battle phase. Well spot!
The megalo thought with harpooner is interesting. We will need to see wht the banlist gives us and how r deck adapts with harpooner but it'll be worth testing. Ur probbs right on the infantry just so sick of having to play dead ones of's but ur point about being able to summon infantry off tremora ans harpoon to then normal diva again is 100% valid. I'll be playing with infantry again for sure. I would love to see someone besides me post content for water. I have hit a brick wall and don't wht I want to do. I need deck building theories and game play to validate it. One thing I get super stuck in is like I'm pretending tht I need to prepare for fire like I can actually win tht match up but this deck just doesn't have the resources to truly contend I feel. Or at least I haven't discovered tht formula yet
hmm I see. competing against fire I wouldnt know apart from summoning the water statue turn 1 off Donna. Which would require to use a different combo line for the diva/prince in the duel. a different one than you are accustomed too. which i do happen to have :) I can show you once the setup gear for my phone arrives in the mailbox. so I can record some videos. Also once icebarries release we will have some more answers. as in lockdown and handtrap protection. I think the rank7 play is cool. cant believe I didnt figurue it out myself seeing I did play around for a little while with draccosacks tokens and the burning abyss link but I couldnt find a good lv3 target to send at the time. Didnt have the patience :D About Infantry some people forget how much little things it does for our deck but reviewing your deck I realize I was thinking too much with my own. I thought opening Guitar Duo would work by sp summoning infantry off diva. but guitar duo needs to be special summoned for its banishing effect. also you dont run the ahashima play so thats minus another good use for infantry. It might be okay if you dont run it. I get that brick wall there are so many options but we will get there.
@@deepseaygo250 as for the direction for your deck between the ib, rank7 combp and the starfrost. Ask yourself what they all bring to the table and what they require to run. Cross reference that with what the water deck needs. 1. The ibs what do they bring? A play to go through incase your diva gets negated when you have the rahn token on the field. (Meh it is better to prevent that from happening in the first place then to poor resources into that seeing you need to run two cards in the main deck you dont wanne see in your opening hand) 2. The rank7 wombo combo. Hej they do help your deck against handtraps ensuring your combo. Not against imperm or nib though. But if they used it earlier then still mission accomplished. It only really requires you to run sea archiver and perhaps 1 megalo alongside fenrir. See it as a bonus. If it comes it comes. So you wont invest too much of your deck into it. There are more ways to prevent handtraps from ruining your diva plays. This combo requires more testing. It does take up a lot from the extra deck stuff you dont run for other combos within the deck. Let see 3. Starfrost. Hej great this increases your end board strenght and you managed to cut the engine down going to starfrost solely off water. That is the spirit!!! In conclusion I would in your case run the rank7 combo without teus in your main deck and not the ib package. Test around with its consistency before bringing it to any tournament though maybe it does require teus for now. About the other two combos Ill leave those to you as im not familiar enough myself with them.
Tidal is a solid addition. Somewhat limited on how much we can try to do with tidal still only being limited but can be a starter paired with dragoons as well as constant follow up
Yo i was thinking about Moray Of Avarice to draw some card in the deck maybe that will help a bit or even bait ash for more push idk if this the way but i think ppl are sleeping on that card imo
Card is definitely slept on. Honeslty it's not a bad option cus I gues u can even banish ran tokens as well which is pretty nice. Losing a monster is tough but the pots do not mesh well in this deck and moray might be r best bet or at least main contender to talents
Hey man, love the video and especially love hearing your thought process as you try to work through plays. I'm going to try to keep it full water and I appreciate your efforts to do water as well, even though starfrost seems better. Keep up the guides, I'm soaking it in!
As I'm playing with the world chalice engine and the starfrost engine, while they definitely increase the ceiling of the deck, they also reduce the consistency and especially with starfrost atlanteans, trying to find tht sweet spot has been difficult. Pure water still has a nice ceiling and is alot more consistent and ill be revisiting pure water when harpooner comes out
@@deepseaygo250 Trying to get a whiff of that good stuff from the kitchen. Hope it's pure water with Tidal and Harpooner 🤞
@hikaruonline I'll be releasing some updated profiles hopfully today and tomorrow as well as will be recording feature matches from locals this weekend
Lets gooo bro lets see the list with Tidal back
On the process, we r cooking 🍳
We patiently waiting bro
In the works, I'm prepping for the Rosemont regional at the end of the month with harpooner legal
Good afternoon! First of all, thank you very much for all the work you are doing to improve this deck, which has been one of my favorites for many years despite the lack of support cards, and you're making it really fun and enjoyable to play!
I wanted to ask you a question. I've also tested various mixes of your list extensively and wanted to know what you think about including Testudo Erat Numen or Water Barrier Statue at the end of the combo because I realized it puts opponents in a lot of difficulty! In this meta, a bit of lockdown is always necessary... What do you think? And also pot of Avarice, also if is a brick, could not be the solution if you finish the dragoons e restore the deck/extradeck?
Appreciate the love! Means alot! So when it comes to the water lock stuff, It's just never really been my preferred play style and in the icejade ran + dragoons combo, i always preffered getting barone, chengying, + moulin over puttig my opponent on the marincess statue water lock cus u leave ur self wide open to a single imperm. Tht being said I can't deny the power of the barrier statue marincess lock tht I have started to play with and putting my opponent on "better have it". Tht would be the route I go most likely, but if I was to play with Numen, I would be playing the toad package. As for avarice, I prayed for this card to get unlimited and once finally playing I have come to the conclusion tht avarice is a strong card and in a slower format I belive it may be an option, but currently water is a glass cannon combo deck tht needs 3-4 cards to combo in there opening hand. With non engine slots already limited, removing a hand trap or board breaker for an avarice just seems like ur even more so giving up games going second. I also belive it is a win more card in a sense where avarice isn't typically live until uve gone full combo so in tht sense if u went full combo u should already been winning anyways. U get ashed on diva with avarice in hand u pass, u get ashed with nib, talents, cross out, or super poly in hand u still have a chance.
@@deepseaygo250 Thank you very much for your response, and you've been very clear. You're definitely a much more experienced player than me, and you've perfectly clarified every doubt! The new banlist has come out, and let's see what can be done in the future! If I remember correctly, Tidal was in an old version of the deck... I look forward to your update! For now, have a great day, and thanks again for everything!
After watching the first few mins. To awnser the teus question im with you and dont like running pike. I never did. Gunde however is okay.
My personal favourite though is abyss mander ;) he is so underrated if you know what I all I did with him in the past.
Going into rank8 with teus and mouling is just so satisfying.
I used to search for a 3rd time off dragoons thanks to a combo line involving mermail abyssmander. Or handloop for 4-5 back when that master rule 4? was in effect.
Long story short. Try to see if you can do something with abyssmander.
Although I suspect it wont do you any good beyond summing a rank8. This will also result in that combo line needing to open with mermailabyssteus and not Rahn. The one you showed last night.
Eitherway it cant hurt to try :D
I still believe the mermail times have gone. But I want to try and see if we can pull something off with mermails still :D before burying them until new mermail support comes out (if ever).
We are in the new era of water Ghoti/fish. And I too have slowly departed from mermails.
Yeah I think even gunde feels like a bad card and if I was to play teus, I don't even think I would have a search target and tht point he is most likely just cut. U can do the rank 7 combo without him it just won't provide the same amount of value I feel
@@deepseaygo250 True I totally get running teus without even a target. how nuts it may sound :D or cutting teus alltogether. if you can get that rank 7 combo opened enough with lets say fenrir, Rahn and 1 megalo?
goodluck figuring that out.
Against snake eyes honestly im currently not a meta player just a water specialist. So I havent been able to take a look at snake eyes very much. Ideas are rank8 nr1 buzz king to hit their fusion? attach their grave pieces to this card, the water statue or errat numen soft sp lock, shaddoll winda, abyss dweller? Triple tactic talents, a well timed imperm, super poly, enig packbit, summon limit, we can play anti spell fragrance since we play a lot of monsters. If going for dweller you might wanne boost his attack with crossheep or mistarboy or the mermail link2.
I'm actually playing with a go second water deck tht mains board wipes, poly, tactic and droplet. Playing water with tht 6th card seems to make a big difference. I've also made alot of head way with starfrost atlanteans, it feel really consistent right now and plays 3 fenrir, 3 tactic, 3 droplet for non engine. Going second into snake eyes it might not be enough but against other strategies and going first it might have potential
how do you have all these expensive cards from other decks
I picked max rarity water before prince dropped when it was dirt and never got rid of. Then I started playing again last October and picked up mannadium as meta deck of choice tht I used to get my invite and luckily alot of the extra cards carried over to water. I also pulled a little knight in my entry so I got lucky there
6:30 prince send dragoons;
16:20 you could've use tremora to special duo and then aria to search diva, so then you could've gone into donna;
40:28 can't use donna since there aren't opponent's banished cards.
No big deal, just practice more :)
Although, I admit I don't very like this version of the deck. I mean, I'm happy to see Mermail and yes, when it can start it goes hard, but there's too little non-engine and the quantity of bricks you have to play are just too much (water already plays some bricks, playing even more is just too risky)
Instead, regarding the Starfrost combo is just so frickin cool that now I need to test with it, maybe playing more water engine and less of mannadium!
Tht not sending dragoons was yikes, yes i could special duo there but lose to hand traps harder, and used little knight to banish a card tht moulin sent to make Donna live.
As for where the deck is, the non engine space is rough and idk wht I wanna do about it. I do think there r to many one of's and maybe some of them rnt necessary
I agree 💯%
That starfrost engine is busted. I was thinking of adding more tear as water support. Suggestions?
@@deepseaygo250 don't know whachu mean with 'of' but if I get it right you mean the level 7's. If that's right then yeah, there are simply too many that aren't necessary
@@Mr_Robot0101honestly never thought about putting tear, also don't think they'll synergizes well, bt I'll test with them if you want.
@@Mr_Robot0101 I realised Kitkallos is banned. Forget what I said abt testing.
Also when harpooner gets released what if we remove teus and co alltogether but instead bring back one copy of mermail abyssmegalo?
Summoning him off tremora or harpooner. Essentially costing you one in hand as well.
The upside: no bricky hands also great card going 2nd.
It could be a niche addition to the deck.
But it probably isn't a good idea. seeing we need our dragoon searchers for something else.
also we need anti-hand trap ways before summoning our diva/prince like the combo you showed last night.
and/or be less diva reliant.
I think there are great water times ahead of us and we are in the pre-building phase I Kind of love that.
Think I will finally start to create and upload some videos as well to better show you guys what I've got cooking and join forces.
Ps. Opening that seaserpent in hand can be fixed with running one atlantean infantry or use tremora/harpooner sp effect. Running one infantry fixes more things btw. 1)anwser to floodgates, 2)prince can go off again in the grind game. 3) fix opening double diva.
The cradle play with draccosack is correct. Its the same reason why detaching mouling from a rank8 wont require you to skip your next battle phase. Well spot!
The megalo thought with harpooner is interesting. We will need to see wht the banlist gives us and how r deck adapts with harpooner but it'll be worth testing. Ur probbs right on the infantry just so sick of having to play dead ones of's but ur point about being able to summon infantry off tremora ans harpoon to then normal diva again is 100% valid. I'll be playing with infantry again for sure. I would love to see someone besides me post content for water. I have hit a brick wall and don't wht I want to do. I need deck building theories and game play to validate it. One thing I get super stuck in is like I'm pretending tht I need to prepare for fire like I can actually win tht match up but this deck just doesn't have the resources to truly contend I feel. Or at least I haven't discovered tht formula yet
hmm I see. competing against fire I wouldnt know apart from summoning the water statue turn 1 off Donna. Which would require to use a different combo line for the diva/prince in the duel. a different one than you are accustomed too. which i do happen to have :) I can show you once the setup gear for my phone arrives in the mailbox. so I can record some videos.
Also once icebarries release we will have some more answers. as in lockdown and handtrap protection.
I think the rank7 play is cool. cant believe I didnt figurue it out myself seeing I did play around for a little while with draccosacks tokens and the burning abyss link but I couldnt find a good lv3 target to send at the time. Didnt have the patience :D
About Infantry some people forget how much little things it does for our deck but reviewing your deck I realize I was thinking too much with my own.
I thought opening Guitar Duo would work by sp summoning infantry off diva. but guitar duo needs to be special summoned for its banishing effect. also you dont run the ahashima play so thats minus another good use for infantry. It might be okay if you dont run it. I get that brick wall there are so many options but we will get there.
@@deepseaygo250 as for the direction for your deck between the ib, rank7 combp and the starfrost.
Ask yourself what they all bring to the table and what they require to run. Cross reference that with what the water deck needs.
1. The ibs what do they bring? A play to go through incase your diva gets negated when you have the rahn token on the field. (Meh it is better to prevent that from happening in the first place then to poor resources into that seeing you need to run two cards in the main deck you dont wanne see in your opening hand)
2. The rank7 wombo combo.
Hej they do help your deck against handtraps ensuring your combo.
Not against imperm or nib though. But if they used it earlier then still mission accomplished. It only really requires you to run sea archiver and perhaps 1 megalo alongside fenrir. See it as a bonus. If it comes it comes. So you wont invest too much of your deck into it. There are more ways to prevent handtraps from ruining your diva plays. This combo requires more testing. It does take up a lot from the extra deck stuff you dont run for other combos within the deck. Let see
3. Starfrost. Hej great this increases your end board strenght and you managed to cut the engine down going to starfrost solely off water.
That is the spirit!!!
In conclusion I would in your case run the rank7 combo without teus in your main deck and not the ib package. Test around with its consistency before bringing it to any tournament though maybe it does require teus for now.
About the other two combos Ill leave those to you as im not familiar enough myself with them.
Thoughts on tidal?
Tidal is a solid addition. Somewhat limited on how much we can try to do with tidal still only being limited but can be a starter paired with dragoons as well as constant follow up
@deepseaygo250 I've been testing 2 stream 1 tidal and it feels pretty good ngl
New list? :0
Check rank 7 combo video I had just posted
where tf are you man I need the Tidal goo please
Apologies on the delay, I went to locals yesterday and got some content. I just need to upload them. More to come!
6:30 you missed played. You’re suppose to not only add dragoon but also send dragoon to grave 😅
😂😵 I have no way of defending this...
@@deepseaygo250 no problem :D shit happens.
@@deepseaygo250 no problem :D shit happens.
You 4got 2 send dragoon during ur seconds test hand
😂🫣
I think everyone called em out on it.
@@Mr_Robot0101 demoralized 🤣
Yo i was thinking about Moray Of Avarice to draw some card in the deck maybe that will help a bit or even bait ash for more push idk if this the way but i think ppl are sleeping on that card imo
Card is definitely slept on. Honeslty it's not a bad option cus I gues u can even banish ran tokens as well which is pretty nice. Losing a monster is tough but the pots do not mesh well in this deck and moray might be r best bet or at least main contender to talents