Low level stunts are rediculous. I have been doing aerobatics for almost 40 years, always over 3,000ft. Airshows bring unneccessary risk and should be banned.
He didn't mention it in the video, but in Germany airshows are indeed very severely restricted since the Ramstein disaster, with military aerobatics teams being banned almost completely (only exception is at the ILA in Berlin, but with heavy restriction on the types of maneuvers allowed), no maneuvers where aircraft cross paths, no flying over or towards the spectators etc., basically they can do little more than flybys and a few rolls these days.
Hoover gives some of the best, if not THE best descriptions of aircraft accidents on this platform. No BS, no music, just facts. Keep up the great work!
The older brother of a massive bully I grew up with was at the Ramstein AFB when the crash happened there. He was in the Airforce and had stopped off to watch the airshow. He remembered the crash and rescuing several people out of harm's way, then as he was carrying a child out he suddenly woke up in a hospital bed. He'd been on fire the entire time and didn't even realize it. He was just so focused on getting people out that he didn't notice his clothes were on fire. He was a big guy and I can imagine the poor kids, scared and alone, and here comes a burning giant to save them. He got the highest award you can get in peace time, but his injuries forced him out of the military. His little brother was a massive asshole, but he was amazing. I was really shocked when I heard what had happened to him.
I saw a guy with the same kind of action, albeit in a car accident. All of us present when it happened saw a VW beetle turn a corner and come to an abrupt stop, and the next second, huge flames erupted from the engine. Everybody in the car got out safe and was just standing there when a little girl suddenly said that Lisa was still in there. All of us turned pale. The car had flames coming out of the doors at that point. Then a 40ish man sprinted to the car, simply climped into the flames and searched for "Lisa." He came out shortly after with a pretty badly burned doll in his hand, and most of his clothes on fire. And he didn't scream in pain or anything. All he could think about was "Thank God. It's a doll. Not a girl." That's when just about all of us were on him like a ton of bricks with jackets and sweaters and whatever else we had to put out the flames in his clothes. And that is when he started screaming in pain. But he still could only think about that girl luckily not being in there. He survived and had to undergo several skin grafts as I understand it before he could resume life and work. But to this day, he is still the most selfless and brave man I have ever met or seen. Right up there with that friend of yours who performed so extraordinary and brave.
@@Jens-Viper-NobelWow. A really brave man. But on the other hand... all of this because a child made him believe there was an actual person still in the car.
Growing up as a child of a naval aviator, I loved air shows. My father, being a friend of many Blue Angel pilots, we were always right up front. I was once asked to hold the small dog of a lady who was having her picture taken with the Blue Angels. Years later, my parents told me that the lady was Jane Mansfield. The dog was nice.
The entertainment vs risk ratio doesnt seem remotely worth it at these airshows. It's like watching a target shooting contest, but the stands are behind the targets
I know a guy at the local community center who told me he was at the Reno airshow/race in 2011. He said a metal fragment whizzed past his head when the plane hit the ground and disintegrated. There were no visible remains of the pilot and two of the spectators were unidentifiable. The plane engine was running full throttle when it hit and the momentum from the moving engine parts was transferred into the spray of metal debris that struck people hundreds of feet from the impact point. He said there were identifiable engine fragments on the ground almost 1/4 mile away.
Regarding the Nimrod crash at Toronto in 1995, I would like to point out that the photo of the crew (and Army personnel) your displaying is that of Nimrod XV230 which crashed in Afghanistan in September 2006, through no fault of their own. The Cave-Haddon report exposed a long standing design issue, coupled with lack of due diligence on behalf of the relevant Engineering and Design Authorities, which resulted in a catastrophic in flight fire.
Thank you for the info. It would be only fair, that the hack Video creator made a personal thank to you and an apology to all involved. I fear this uploader is much more interested in the clicks, rather than the lives and families, who are affected by a crash. Getting the information correctly can affect many. Instead of arrows in his thumb nails, he should slow down and be sure that the info is correct. Cheers from Canada
The English Hunter pilot should have gone to jail. It wasn't the first time he violated the safety limits. There's another airshow in England where his display got interrupted by the safety manager on the ground due to violating the safety limits. This individual had a history of overestimating his abilities and endangering the spectators. He should have gone to jail for his ignorance.
Thanks for the video. A little surprised not to see Bud Holland's infamous B-52 crash from 1994 included - I know the accident flight was only a practice flight for an upcoming airshow, but he is surely worth a mention every time as to how NOT to fly a plane. Personally think it would be well worth its own piece looking at his dangerous temperament + the associated failures in command that allowed Holland to kill himself along with three other unfortunates.
If you read Andy Browns “warnings unheeded” it explains this in great detail, brown was an Air Force security policeman who stopped a mass shooter at Fairchild AFB days before the b-52 crash and he wrote a book about both incidents. His book is very well researched and it includes how Holland had been reckless for years and numerous commanders has wanted to remove him from flight duties
The B-52 is a notably poor choice for an aerobatic aircraft as it lacks ailerons, using spoilers instead. Spoilers depend upon reducing the lift of one of the wings to roll the aircraft in that direction. Ailerons, OTOH, both reduce lift on one wing and increase lift on the other. Video of the accident shows the up-wing spoilers fully deployed, but the plane stopped responding as the wing was already stalled (not producing lift). ruclips.net/video/Lbcsfqqqe7Q/видео.html Holland was trying to make such an aggressive turn to avoid over-flying a restricted area (nuclear weapons storage facility). Poor flight planning resulted in this situation developing. Holland was a loose cannon who had multiple safety violations, but only received verbal reprimands. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1994_Fairchild_Air_Force_Base_B-52_crash
I do not dare as well, On my first airshow, Harald Strößenreuther performed an aerobatic show that was miles beyond all others. I was looking forward seeing him again next year. Shortly before the show he crashed while instructing. Then I was at an airshow, where (again) Mark Hannah demonstrated a P-51 Mustang better than any other of the displays, Great, next year ... He crashed before that in a HA-1112, a spanish license built Bf 109 with a Rolls-Royce Merlin engine. On another airshow someone came with a replicia of the Spirit of St. Louis. Disintegrated in the air some months later. An acquaintance took me up in a Slingsby T-28, an open-side-by-side british glider. Great experience, it was totally peaceful up there, no wind, no noise, you could hear the birds singing on the ground. Some months later he went to a fly-in in eastern Europe, and there he died of a burst appendix.
I am not superstitious, and people die when flying, but in the meantime I gave up. I do not want to risk other people's lives anymore.
I watched Bob Hover at the Lincoln airshow in 1972, flew the mustang and a Rockwell twin. Bob flew the pants off that twin, top of a large loop shutdown both engines, did a high speed pass over the runway at about 300 feet, then pulled into a loop at the runway end landing with both engines off. He was simply a amazing guy.
Everyone that died at the Shoreham airshow was on the A27 dual carrageway waiting at traffic lights. I was there, my elderly dad and I were at the north end of Shoreham airport and what we saw was truly horrific. We tried to help people before emergency services arrived but there was little we could do.
I was at the Toronto Air Show the day the Nimrod crashed. It stunned the crowd. I too was stunned and it remains the only plane crash I have ever witnessed personally - and that was one too many.
Considering the immense number of fatalities injuries end loss of aircraft you would think air shows would become a thing of the past. I was at Flugtag in '88, an EC130 flight engineer, on static display and saw it first hand, I felt the heat of the explosions.And wreckage skidded past our aircraft, I've had nightmares ever since, and i've never gone to another air show.
The astonishing thing about the Farnborough air crash was that, after the dead and injured had been taken away, the air show carried on as if nothing had happened. Different times.
I was at Shoreham, if i close my eyes i can still see it to this day. I was amazed that thousands of people all stood dead quiet as we watched the smoke and flames.
Several Air Force personnel that I knew during my time in the service (and later as a Contractor) were at the Ramstein Air Show that day. One guy was working the air show while his wife and one of his kids were watching the air show. His family was close enough to the crash that the wife sustained minor burns and his daughter had some cuts from a piece of metal that hit her on the legs. The others were more fortunate and escaped without injuries being in another section away from the crash site. One of those NCO's (and his family) who witnessed that Ramstein incident was unfortunate to experience a similar incident several years later in 1994, while he was helping to shut down the B-52 Air Wing at Fairchild AFB in Washington. He witnessed the crash of the infamous "Czar 52" B-52 being flown by a known high-risk flier (Lt Col Bud Holland) that killed everyone on board and almost hit the Weapons Storage Area as well as the Control Tower. To compound a bad week at Fairchild, earlier that week his wife was working at the Base Hospital (she was a volunteer) when a gunman shot the several people in the same building before, he was finally stopped by a Security Policeman (who made an incredible 75-yard head shot with a Beretta handgun). She wasn't hurt, but between that incident, the B-52 crash, and Ramstein Air Show, these tragedies convinced them it was time for him to retire from the Air Force.
I was in the Army stationed at Pirmasans, about an hour from Ramstein AB, at that time. One of our soldiers wife was at the air show and she was killed.
I was at that Toronto Air Show one and was a young kid. Lucky for us, this was the first year they decided to move the show away from crowds and decided to have everything flown over the water. RIP to those who passed that day.
My grandma lived in Farnborough and witnessed John Derry's crash. Her vivid recollection was seeing a decapitated body remain upright for several seconds before collapsing to the ground. A horrific accident.
A builder I used to work for was an RAF fireman at Farnborough at the time of this crash. A nasty job for them clearing up the various bits and pieces.
In WW2, during an attack on an American carrier, two crewmen were running to battle stations, when one crewman was beheaded by flying debris. Witnesses say his headless body took four more running steps before it collapsed.
My dad worked at Kaiserslautern Army Base with US Army and he was at the Rammstein show. Due to what he saw during the crash, he has never been to an airshow since. So sad
@@nathanielalgernon975 Since the lost of an starfighter formation in 1962 in Nörvenich, with 4 dead pilots, all demo teams has been stopped by the german air force. However, the german navy had an F104 demo team, but only with low risk, normal flight shows.
My old roommate was on the Nimrod. I am pretty sure that the newspaper picture you have included in the video is actually the crew of the Nimrod that went down in Afghanistan. There was a similar shot the day after the Canadian crash. Blue skies Bernie.
@pilot-debrief It was a long time ago, but the crash does still haunt me. Somewhere, there is a film made by someone in Canada who had been following the crew, which included a video of them boarding the aircraft. To see him alive as I remembered him was a real jolt. Bernie and I shared a room at RAF Brawdy for about 18 months, and we got along pretty well. Before going Aircrew, he was a flight simulation engineer. Whenever I see the crash, I hear his voice clearly in my mind. The only real comfort is that they would not have felt a thing, though they would have known it was coming. I witnessed the same display routine at Fairford a short time earlier, and the display looked a bit dodgy to several of us working there. We all held our breath but figured they must know what they're doing. Too many crews away from home try to make their displays a bit punchy to impress other crews. Still, great video, keep them coming. Much more informative than the usual offerings on here.
Yeah, the picture was the Afghan crash crew. I used to sub-aqua dive with Gary "Q" Quilliam (top row, third from right) God bless you mate. Til we buddy up again...
As always, a concise examination of events, presented so an average, non aviator can understand yet with enough detail that those more aviation oriented can gain a better understanding. Well done, sir !
@@pilot-debriefthey guy who crashed at the Shoreham show also displayed at the Bray airshow in ireland only about 2 weeks earlier which i attended and i thought he was reckless then aswell
@@pilot-debriefthe tragic thing about Ramstien is if pony ten (after realising he messed up) had continued on the trajectory he was on and NOT pulled up to correct his mistake he would have fllown under the 2 formations safley
I watched the Frecce Tricolori display at the 1986 International Air Tattoo here in the UK. When they performed this manoeuvre with the singleton heading straight at me I couldn't believe it was allowed, and I instinctively threw myself to the ground, much to the bemusement of spectators around me. When I saw the Ramstein footage for the first time it was like having a premonition tragically realised.
I was there at Ramstein from 1985 through 1987. I always filmed at show center. I had one of them “Reggie Vision” camcorders with the little VCR on a strap! I rotated back to the states in early 1988 so I never saw that show with the accident. I may have been a casualty if I went that year. Karma was in my favor that time.
A sombre subject, but an excellent, well-made and informative video, with no histrionics, silly music or doom-laden commentary. Thank you from England.
It was a refrigeration trailer, we called reffers when I was at Ramstein. I never heard what was stored in the trailer. The plane was leaning against the trailer and stayed there for few days during the investigation Ihe refueled UH 60s evacuating casualties to Lansthul Army hospital, I refueled some of the Aerimacchi 339 that flew that day.
It was full of ice cream. It was sitting perpendicular to the runway, with the audience on the other side. That trailer stopped the plane from sliding into the majority of the 300,000 spectators. The crash and the aftermath were so horrific, makes me sick to think about. Never went to another airshow.
Very well done on these, well reported and described. Thank you. Very sad days for so many in the air show disasters and RIP to the dear souls that perished.
You could have have mentioned the Mannheim disaster of 1982, when 46 people died when a Chinook crashed on the autobahn. I always think of that when I pass the Mannheim/Heidelberg junction, as I do frequently. I would have gone to Ramstein in 1988, but fortunately we failed to organize transport. That same year, just before Christmas I was on a British Airways flight to Edinburgh at exactly the same time as the PanAm 747 came down on Lockerbie. Both planes had taken off from Heathrow, within minutes of each other.
@@Erikr-ex9dj Yes, it was an airshow to commemorate the founding of the city of Mannheim 300 years earlier. The parachutists were mainlly civilians from Canada and Wales, and they were atempting to beat a world record.
The Nimrod had been at an airshow here in my city the week before. I met and chatted with crew, even bought a few patches etc. When I heard that they had crashed and all the crew were killed, I cried. 😢
I am station at ramstein and work in the passenger terminal, there’s a couple articles posted around the terminal talking about the incident and something’s you might not know is that the only ambulance for the event was destroyed by one of the aircraft’s that crashed. Because of that they called for german ambulances but they got stuck at the main gate trying to get on the base which ended up costing lives.
Yeah, I noticed, he didnt mention that. Its well known here in Europe, that the German ambulances and medical personnel were significantly delayed, coz the American guards kept refusing to let them in. Another thing, that cost lives, was the Americans just chucking ppl untreated on various trucks, pickups etc and driving to hospitals, some as much as 45 min away, while the German protocol was to assess and do initial treatment b4 taking them to the hospital. It also made it quite hard to get the number of dead and wounded and identify them, as I recall, that took several days, coz the Americans didnt even have any idea, how many they had taken from the airfield and to which hospitals. Unfortunately, several ppl died due to the delay in treatment, both through the Germans being denied access for an extended lengths of time and through being thrown on random vehicles completely untreated and taken on long drives.
@@dfuher968 I read in newspaper next day doctors in hospital scolded americans for handling injured people like wounded soldiers on battlefield under fire…
The Sacramento crash was a perfect example of a very dangerous, but well known, handling issue with the F-86 and it's Canadian cousins. Many USAF pilots crashed in training due to the tendency of the F-86 to over rotate on takeoff if rotation was initiated early. If the pilot had received any transition training he would have known better.
My family went to an airshow when I was a kid (Indiana, early 1980s). I don’t remember the pilot's name, but the announcer said he had one arm. His plane crashed, and he was killed. I remember the plane diving into the ground, and a cloud of smoke coming from the area in the distance. It was kind of traumatizing. I have looked for more information about the pilot and incident but haven't found anything.
I was one of the Jordanian Team members during the Ostend Airshow crash in 1997. Omar started his sequence from a steep dive going into a rolling loop parallel with the display line after which he transitioned to an outside rolling circle - rolling left but turning right towards the crowd. The x-wind was high pushing Omar towards the crowds. during the rolling circle. after 270 deg of turn Omar was on top of the crowds (100 metres inside the prohibited crowd line) when he transitioned from a rolling circle while inverted into a tumble (Flip-flop) manoeuvre at less than 300 feet when he should have been at least 800 feet if he were to recover by 300! He & the poor spectators were doomed the moment he executed the tumble at less than 300 feet while on top of the crowd. He was most likely unaware of his situation due to his strong desire to impress & win an unofficial & illegal competition in an official Airshow setting. Patrick Steen the Display Director who was supposed to be supervising flight safety from the Tower never gave the “Termination” call which should have been called on display frequency at least 60 seconds before the tumble when Omar had clearly crossed inside the minimum display line of 150 metres from the crowds! It was a terribly sad & tragic day for All who were present. What was supposed to be a day of pleasure & happiness turned into a nightmare for ALL. 🥲
One British man would like to say that I see Jordan as a shining light in The Middle East, and I honour Jordan's strong links to Britain's armed forces. With all the focus on Arabs now known as "Palestinians", most people are unaware that within one year of the start of the British Mandate of Palestine, Britain created the Arab country of Transjordan, with it's monarchy, and that Jordanians have made a success of both country and monarchy. Quite an achievement, since Jordan is surrounded by turbulent events! Most also do not know that in 1970 and 1971, Jordan had a serious internal war with Palestinians, who were usurping Jordan's authority. I am also aware of the greening of the desert, led by Queen Rania, and hope that the whole Middle East can learn from each other's achievements, particularly in the better use of water. Looking to the future, the Middle East faces great challenges, and I feel sure that Jordan will play it's part in creating a better future for all. /
My dad worked for the Civil Aeronautics Board (CAB) as an accident investigator. He ended up being the one that studied the flight reorder data from accidents. This was while the data was being recorded on metal tape. The CAB was actually changed into the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) and not into the FAA. Just thought I would share this.
The CAB existed until 1985 when it was finally dismantled following the deregulation of commercial airlines in 1978. Many of the air traffic control and air safety responsibilities of the CAB were transferred to the FAA when it was created in 1958. The accident investigation responsibilities of the FAA were then transferred to the NTSB when it was created in 1967, and it became fully independent in 1975. The CAB, FAA, and NTSB were all separate agencies from 1967 to 1978.
Ironically, I saw the Frecce Tricolori at the 1997 RAF Mildenhall airshow in their first show since the Ramstein accident outside Italy, in addition to watching the Jordanians that that would have their accident in the very next airshow, Belgium. By the way, the Frecci Tricolori was, by far, the best aerobatics team of the seven (!) that displayed that weekend.
At about that time (I don't remember where) I saw the Frecce Tricolori display their aircraft and it was the best display I had seen. They were highly impressive.
In my youth 5 crewmembers and 39 parachutist from US, France, Germany, England and Canada lost their lives at an airshow by a Chinook helicopter crash in 1982 in Mannheim, Germany. One rotorblade disintegrated after a few minutes from start and caused the crash. Please research. This airshow-accident is not so well known and never list anywhere though it was horrible.
My Aunt and Uncle were at the Farnborough air show. My mother told me when they came home they were still in shock and covered in other people's blood. They never spoke about it with me (way to young), but my uncle who was one of the most enthusiastic aviation nuts I've known, and never flew on any kind of plane for over 40 years.
I was at work about 2 miles from the Farrells Ice Cream Parlor disaster (The F86 crash). I was a recently licensed PPL and would have been at the airshow if not working. I saw the black smoke from the crash and was horrified at what must have happened. The aviation community was stunned at the magnitude of the disaster. The pilot didn't know what he didn't know until it's too late.
The Nimrod almost crashed in Shearwater, NS the week before. He went into a sharp bank and the plane literally slipped sideway down. From my vantage point, i would guess he loss at least 100ft altitude. I commented to my buddy that he had almost lost the aircraft. Unfortunately, I was not surprised to hear about the crash in Toronto. It was a sad event as we had met all the crew and toured the aircraft at the Shearwater airshow.
Hoover, as a retired MSgt USAF (supply/maint) your knowledge and explanation is excellent. We had a unit pilot eject from his A-7 (wedding) from NV to PA into a hotel front door.
I was 1988 in the German Army and one of those paramedics who rushed to the Ramstein-Airfield after that incident. It was a total chaos. Things happened which even a movie-regisseur couldnt imagine. F.e. there was a group of victims who where layed down in a normal bus of the USAF. The driver was told to reach the hospital asap. He needed about two hours than he asked German locals for help to find his destination. Or these lot of ppl, who had nearly no skin any more, but felt nothing, just looking on us. Those pictures I'll never forget. There is just one thing I want to mention: Don't use these machines for entertainment. I know esp. in the U.S. they are used in every situation, f.e. in NFL games and so on. but if you would have seen what I saw, you would decide to say "no" to that. And the story of the pilot who caused this was a bit more: As I was told, he was one of the pilots who forced down the plane with the hostage-takers of the "Achille Lauro" - case of 1985. So I was told that the fact that he climbed too high was in truth the result of a manipulation of his machine, carried out by the Libyan secret service just before that day. So, it is all a bit dusty, but the story is a bit bigger than "just" a crash.
@@sjb3460 It became known at the time - and quickly dropped again at the bottom of the table - that the machine's altimeter had been manipulated so that it showed an altitude that was too low. As a result, the plane flew too high - which triggered the disaster.
@@drau331you would think that if you were trying to cause a crash by manipulating the altimeter, wouldnt you want it to read too *high*, so the plane would fly closer to the ground?
I live near Wichita, KS and I remember growing up in the early 70's people were always talking about a KC135 Tanker that had crashed in a local neighborhood in Wichita back in 1965. McConnel Air Force Base is in Wichita and is a tanker plane hub. The plane had like 30K gallons of aviation fuel and somehow lost control and crashed, killing all the crew members and several people (25 - 30) on the ground. I've driven by the crash site in later years and there's some type of small park there. I've also heard that after that crash, the tankers that fly in and out of McConnel now carry a nonflammable liquid when doing test flights.
I was in the stands at the air show in Toronto when the nimrod went down. It was a huge plane. It's hard to imagine the size when we heard the dimensions before the performance. When the plane hit the water everyone in the stands stood, said "oooo", and then absolute silence. The only other time I've heard absolute silence in my 70 years was when I parachuted. It's eerie. There was no announcement - nothing. Then after 5 minutes the announcement told us to stay in the stands. It was another 30 minutes before they told us to leave in an orderly fashion. It is something I'll never forget. Also, one last thing, thank you for explaining what caused the crash. At first we were told the plane was too low and when the pilot tried to bank and pull up the one wing-tip hit the water. That's exactly what it looked like. But after the investigation the pilot was to blame. Well, the pilots are always the scapegoats so I didn't pay attention after that. Boy, was I surprised today to find out that it was the pilot's error this time. Lake Ontario is very cold and quite deep in the harbour. I don't remember if they ever recovered the plane and, especially the bodies. If and when you ever have time could you tell me? Many thanks. p.s. The day after the Snow Birds flew the "Missing Man Formation" to honour the crew who lost their lives. I could see it from my balcony and it made me cry. Thanks again.
As someone who was a Crew Chief on the Nimrod, though not on that occasion I can confirm that the bodies and the wreckage were recovered. Also the picture of the crew is not from that incident but from XV230 in Afghanistan.
@@willxv226 Thank you for letting me know. It's very much appreciated. My Dad was in the Canadian army and I worked for the British Army here in Canada. I have to say that the air force has much more exciting machinery than the army, though. 😉
My father, his brother and their parents were at the Farnborough Air Show in 1952 and were in the crowd between the two impact points (the majority of injuries occurred behind them). Only found out when going through my fathers effects and his description of the accident was on a scrap of paper.
An historic document indeed! Life is a tenuous thread that is so easily severed, yet he survived, and you have life. Your ancestors and mine were close neighbours, where many lives were lost in turbulent times, as I am reseaching at the moment. /
We lived on a mountain off base and saw the smoke and fire of a plane crash. Our father was a corpsman and we knew he was on the flight line that day. When he returned home that evening, we asked him what happened. He paused for a moment and said "Blood, guts, and feathers, but no brains." I never forgot those words when I was learning to fly.
I was at the Shoreham 2015 airshow in person with one of my closest friends who invited me to go with him i can't believe it's already been 8 years from the crash. Around a week later I went to my local Clacton airshow and there was a moment of silence for those lost then followed by a round of applause from the spectators it brought a few tears to my eyes.😢 And the fact that Andy hill was found not guilty makes me sick to the stomach. 😠
You personally witnessed the 2015 Shoreham crash, and a week later you go to another airshow???? I'm not sure what to think about that. I know personally, there would be no way in hell I would be going to another airshow for quite some time after that.
@@M_SCNot exactly, i was there when dan fillers mig23 went down in michigan, and a few weeks later i was in cali watching the Miramar airshow. Life goes on. Edit. Just realized i technically saw the last Mig23 flight in america, damn
I was there too and i remember saying to my partner.. ‘he’s too low” when he started the loop, I was interviewed on a couple of radio stations and the bbc. It looked dodgy from the start to me .
I was hoping you would mention the B52 crash at Fairchild, which was a practice session for the next day's airshow. Maybe you could do a video on that incident, and the responsible arrogant pilot with a long history dangerous stunts. Thanks, love the channel
In my time working at an airbase, there were two fatal air-show accidents. The first occurred during an air show and the second was while practicing for one.
There were four of us at the air show in Ramstein. Our driver told us to run to the car so we wouldn't get caught in the traffic jam at the end of the air show. And we hadn't even been walking for five minutes when the accident happened. I think we had a guardian angel or something.
AIRSHOWS in the United States follow very stringent rules and no aerobatic energy can be directed at the spectators. In fact different crowd liine distances must be maintained with piston engine or turbine engine aircraft . Comparing the Reno Air Races with a U S Airshow is Apples and Oranges.
Living on my sailboat at Ontario Place, I saw the 1995 Nimrod crash, and later watched the salvage operation at close quarters. Thorough review. I had watched the Nimrod in previous years, one of the better displays with a spectacular wing-over by the big plane at the end. Quite a shock when it happened. Eerily, I was at that time reading a book about British military air disasters, mostly at air shows and the like, including the 1956 crash at Heathrow of the RAF's first Vulcan, which had flown over my school in New Zealand and left me with an impression for life.
@Pilot Debrief - I was a little kid when the crash into the Ice Cream shop in Sacramento happened. My family was supposed to be there to meet my Grandma for her birthday. My dad had our boat in tow, and there wasn't anywhere to park with the boat, so we went somewhere else. I was a little kid
Great debrief Hoover! Thank you for a no nonsense & accurate breakdown of the issues. I have worked as an Airboss and main talker for many Airshows since starting in ATC back in 1981. The main difference between day to day ATC and an airshow is as an ATC we separate the aircraft but at an Airshow we segregate the traffic and as per the brief keep up the movement of the acts so it doesn’t become boring for the crowd. If any of the acts require pilots to visually separate themselves from an act it is fully briefed on the ground and the segregation is kept in place until the pilot accepts responsibility for visual separation. In over 100 Airshows the team I work with has never had an incident or injury. Thank you for your channel. Shane.
@17:26 you can clearly see that trim tab hanging... I was maintenance on a Formula-1 in the 1980's. I can't understand why that crew would not have checked the other trim tab after repairing the other one.
I was supposed to go to Rammstein but I got a sore throat. The friends I went with were about as close to the accident as you could get without getting injured.
On the Reno Air Race, 75 is pretty old to be racing anything. Having grown up in a family of racers, dirt bikes, jet boats, street bike racers, they all have one thing in common. They stepped down what they raced or how they played as they got older. For example, motocross to enduro to dirt biking for fun to mountain bikes for fun. Jet boat racing to sailboat racing to e-bike for fun. 75 is not 45 and reactions are not the same. I still believe age played a role in that accident.
I was actually at the Shoreham Airshow when WV372 went down. I've only been to one airshow since, and I was practically wetting myself every time a plane went even marginally close to the ground.
I was at the Shoreham air show and if I remember correctly the Hawker Hunter flew along the runway prior to starting the loop. He climbed then inverted while rounding the top of the loop before coming back down. He seemed to not be able to pull up soon enough… I don’t know if it was due to insufficient airspeed over the control surfaces that he was unable to pull out of the dive. I couldn’t believe what I was watching at first but then after a few seconds I realised he’d crashed on the road and was totally stunned as were all the other spectators. I didn’t attend every year as I live in the area and regularly saw the planes flying over my house but the last 2 shows I went to there were crashes - this and a WW2 Hawker Hurricane previously when the plane malfunctioned and the brave pilot was able to guide it to an area on a hill away from the airport where it nose dived into the ground. I still feel sad for the 12 men who lost their lives in both of these incidents. My parents had also traveled from their home in Kent for both shows, unfortunate they both ended with sad memories for them
My dad and brother were at the Ramstein Air Show. My dad took my brother to see the show for his birthday. They left immediately upon the disaster. My dad, a wounded combat veteran, knew he needed to get my brother out of that environment. My brother, who has always loved all things aviation, is now an Aeronautical & Mechanical engineer who worked for NASA. He also retired from the Air Force, where he worked as a BlackHawk Crew Chief.
11:05 that is almost the view that I had on that accident at that day, august 28, 1988... ☹️ Will never forget the sound of the sirens, the steady sound of the arriving and departing rescue helicopters and the chaos around us...
You did a wonderful job of narration, nice and easy to listen to without stuttering, urrrring and ahhhing and waffling like some of the other wannabe commentators, well done bud. The package was interesting and I actually watched it to the end which is something I don't usually bother with. Keep up the great work. Kind regards Ray. Rotorua NZ
I was at the Paris Airshow that day & watched incredulous as the Tu-144 crashed. I didn't see the Mirage but you can imagine how a desperate manoeuvre to avoid hitting it could have caused the break-up. Ten years later I saw the Italian aerobatic team perform just above the point where Lake Geneva narrows into the Rhone river - way too small an area to prevent spectators being hit in the event of an accident. A stunning performance but man, risky.
I was at the airshow in Sacramento I was in fourth grade. We were supposed to go to Farrell‘s ice cream parlor, but we wanted to stay and watch the jet takeoff as it was the only military plane there I was with another family and when my mom heard the news, she didn’t know if we were at the parlor or not till we got home, remember to this day the jet going down the runway with the front landing gear off the ground, disappearing behind the hanger and then seeing the fire ball at the end of the runway
Attended a lunch with that Nimrod crew the Friday before the crash. Good bunch of guys. Took a while to process watching them hit the water before the weekend was out.
In 2008 or so, I saw the aftermath of the Ukrainian accident on RUclips. I was only 13. It was absolutely horrific, bodies were torn apart and strewn everywhere. I am happy that RUclips changed their policy since then because that video was very traumatizing.
arnborough accident from 1952 brings back on my mind to several old Pathé movies of what used to be SBAC (Society of British Aircraft Constructors) in late '40s and early '50s. It seems that there was an immense pressure on those Test Pilots performing in front of potential purchasers of their novelties placed on the VIP's balcony. New jet aircraft flew right over spectators at incredibly low altitudes performing highly demanding manouvers, on cutting edges of their flight envelopments. I remember seeing a prototype of the Canberra making a very tight turn far lower than a hundred feet right over the camera and the observers and no-one said anything. In other videos I saw a prototype of the Handley Page Victor landing meters away from reporters with their cameras and children playing, without any visible security guard or protection. The accident you mention was of the DeHavilland DH 110; a novel aircraft competing with Glosters for a RAF requeriment for a Night/All-Weather fighter, competition later won by the Gloster GA.5, lately known as The Javelin. The DH.110 later gave birth to the embarked naval fighter named the Sea Vixen. The accident ocurred when the second prototypem an elegantly black painted bird, experienced engine failures in early morning, forcing John Derry and Tony Richards, De Havviland's crew, to fly back to Hatfield, North of London, on the company's Dragon Rapide, to bring the only other existing DH.110, the all-silver first prototype. That plane wasn't scheduled to fly that day and De Havilland administration had to improvise. During part of earlier flights they were testing the application of a large wing fence right on mid span in both wings to avoid early airflow separation from wing upper surface. Those fences were retired lately to continue testing without them. In those later flights it wasn't thought to make hard-G manouvers. Sadly those fences (also applied to the second black prototype), conferred strenght to wing integrity as last days flights demonstrated. No-one thought in that detail. So, when John Derry pulled a very tight turn to make a second low fast subsonic pass over Farnborough after the first supersonic one, the hich-G load on the wings were too much and both outer wings broke more or less at the same moment desintegrating the plane in the air. The cockpits with Derry and Richards made a dive right in front of people and crashed just meters away from the rope that held people from flight operations terrain. Except for both pilots who died there, no-one was injured by the cockpits and nose fall. The rear fuselage, containing the inner segments of the wings, both tail booms and both vertical fins plus the stabilizator and the rear part of the fuselage fell performing a slow plain spin over a solitary portion of the field But sadly both Avon engines detached from the rear fuselage and were released like a pair of bombs that made a parabollic fall towards a small hill where large numbers of nosy people gathered to see the airshow from right outsider the airfield. One of the engines with its blades still running anf fiery hot, fell on the crowd killing twenty-nine people and injuring about sixty. Most of the people were not executives from aircraft companies or representatives of foreign governments. That hill was chosen by families to see the show and that was the tragic end of the DH.110 show. However (which is unthinkable today), Hawkers test pilot who had to fly after DeHavilland, to show the second Hawker P.1067, prototype of the Hawker Hunter, had to postpone his flight... just about an hour, to let ambulances and emergency teams to do their job. After that, show had to go on and he was cleared to take off and continue the Airshow. It is unbelievable today. Things have changed a lot and, I believe, for the better.
When you look at the catalogue of crashes in WW2, I guess there was a "gung ho! attitude that persisted for many years. Your post is probably the best description of the DH 110 crash I have ever read! Thank you! /
I've been to one airshow in my life, back in the 1960's I think. I was nervous about how near the aircraft flew to the spectators, and concerned about how close the planes flew to each other in high speed group maneuvers, enough so that I never attended another and have no plans ever to do so.
why watch people showing off demonic weapons? they brainwashed us as children to see soldiers and war as heroic, manly, and exciting. I'm glad that the hottest war now is one for hearts and minds. We are evolving as a species. war is mostly unnecessary but it's big business. I really do believe we will move past it. I grew up on USAF bases so I may be biased🤣
The Nimrod in the run up to the Nimrod MR2 crash was a very different Mark. It’s a Nimrod R1 of 51 Sqn. RAF. No MAD boom is visible and it has significantly more antennas visible. This is a SIGINT/ELINT aircraft - not Maritime Reconnaissance.
I get chills thinking about the Ramstein disaster because one year prior, my family and I stood in the exact spot the crash occurred. When I saw the video, after returning to the States, my blood ran cold.
Contributing to the fatalities at the Ramstein disaster was the lack of common technical standards regarding the medical emergency equipment, when ambulances of the US air base (US standards) brought patients into the German hospitals. Additionally, back then no training for large scale disasters existed, no common command post for organizing the efforts, etc.
I was present at Flugtag 1988 while stationed at Sembach AB Germany and captured the disaster on video. This was the scariest moment of my life as my family and I were located where the plane came into the crowd just an hour before the accident.
Interesting that the last report explained the rules of that airshow, which over time had the rules relaxed, with aircraft flying over the crowd from behind and from the front and got down to 150’ or less. In recent years, due to accidents, it’s gone back to the original 1951 rules.
I still remember the first time I watched the footage of the Ukraine crash. I watched it here on RUclips years ago. It has since been taken down. It was put up again a few years later, and then taken down again. I'm figuring its still down. At least I hope it is. It's one of those videos you wish you could unsee. Because the horrific aftermath burns into your soul, and you can't forget what you had just seen. The footage is taken by 2 or 3 amateur camera men. Likely spectators with camcorders, who ran up to the wreckage. As they run up to the crash site, you begin to see debris from the crash all over the place. Lumps of unidentified pieces of plane. That is until you realize that many of those are not pieces of the plane at all, but they're pieces of people. A torso with no head or legs. A leg or arm here and there. Some you can't really tell what body parts your looking at other than you recognizing a hand or shoe in the mess. It was horrific. I'm an ex firefighter and medic, who worked for a large city for many years. I've seen ghastly injuries and unthinkable horrors. And I got used to seeing things like that. But I've never witnessed carnage on that scale before. And its something that you don't ever get used to.
Thank You ... late 50's at an Edwards AFB Airshow I was very young but can recall a helicopter (possibly a Bell H13) falling from the sky during a demonstration right in front the crowd/bleachers (which is where I and the family were sitting) ... completely engulfed by fire ... one fatality ... at the time my Dad worked for Hughes Aircraft Co at Edwards and the was the test RIO for the Convair F-106 which had an MA-1 radar weapon system. Decades later my sister and I worked in the Hughes F-14 (A/D) program office. The Airshows at Edwards AFB and Point Mugu NAS are lifetime memories...last but never least once saw Bob Hoover (RIP) fly the Shrike Commander at the Torrance (CA) Municipal Airport show ... Thank You Keith Chicago IL
You know, I think I’m going to do some research into how many airshows there are vs number of accidents…..seems like a pretty common thing for such a safety oriented field
Interesting video thanks. I have a story about air show that thankfully had no fatalities but was a spectacular incident. It was August 12 1973. At the Abbotsford international airshow. A demonstration of 4 Canadian CF -101B Voodoos based at the time at CFB Comox, B.C. 409 sqd. Nighthawks were doing their very entertaining display. The F-101B Voodoo is such an elegant aircraft. Anyways the display ends with each jet flying down the showline individually, then doing a max. after burner climb out to about 20,000 ft. Well on this day CF-101B number 101019 pulled up and climb up when at or near the top of its climb the aircraft explodes and disintegrates. Thankfully both of the crew ejected safely though I recall they did suffer burns. I was just a kid. It was a beautiful clear August day. At first I recall saying ," Wow cool." But seconds later I see the smoke and parts falling along with both parachutes. I then knew that something went wrong. The bulk of the plane's parts fell thankfully safely in a corn field near the airport. Again thankfully nobody died. I still remember it 50 years later like it happened yesterday. 🤔
A friend of mine survived the crash in Sacramento (he was in the ice cream parlor at a kids' party). The trauma was so severe that he didn't relate his hospitalization to the Sabre crash until much later...
My dad was in the US army and stationed at Ramstein at the time, and unfortunately he was part of the “cleanup crew” and it kind of f*cked him up for the rest of his life. Incredibly tragic, rip to all lives lost in any accident.
with the Tupolev crash, in an interview, one of the crew who was an auxiliary pilot that day (briefed but not flying unless one of the main crew declares unfit for duty), claims that, after seeing concord preform, to improve performance capabilities, engineers had connected a new stabilization system, that was under testing but not yet flight-worthy. this was supposed to make the performance closer to that of the concord through augmenting controls by automated front winglet configuration changes, to enable the plane to move around a point much closer to the optimal CG (and therefore be much more stable at subsonic speeds)... it also meant that the plane did not preform in a manner the pilots were used to or trained to, but the head of the team ordered them to fly anyway (to which the purported captain's response was something like, "F#&%k it, at least we'll die together") the original investigations probable cause was "Jammed Controls, possibly by a hand-held filming device", but this guy believed the pilots did not manage to figure out what the airplane was doing under the new regime, since it was reacting to their inputs far too sharply resulting in overcontrol... note, the original strange attitude was an impossibly steep go-around just after being unable to slow down enough in the flare... it is possible, that under this new mode, the airplane climbed instead of flaring as they expected it to. just a theory... but one that's based on what seemed quite an earnest interview with probably the closest person alive to that cockpit...
That makes historical sense in terms of what the USSR was always doing with science and technology, the (unfit) politicians were in charge rather than data-led decisions
Low level stunts are rediculous. I have been doing aerobatics for almost 40 years, always over 3,000ft. Airshows bring unneccessary risk and should be banned.
He didn't mention it in the video, but in Germany airshows are indeed very severely restricted since the Ramstein disaster, with military aerobatics teams being banned almost completely (only exception is at the ILA in Berlin, but with heavy restriction on the types of maneuvers allowed), no maneuvers where aircraft cross paths, no flying over or towards the spectators etc., basically they can do little more than flybys and a few rolls these days.
Did SAR for many shows in South TX and I agree.
Right on! After all those tragedies I’m surprised that they still go on. If people want excitment they can go swimming with sharks…I know I wont!
Hoover gives some of the best, if not THE best descriptions of aircraft accidents on this platform. No BS, no music, just facts. Keep up the great work!
Precisely!
The older brother of a massive bully I grew up with was at the Ramstein AFB when the crash happened there. He was in the Airforce and had stopped off to watch the airshow. He remembered the crash and rescuing several people out of harm's way, then as he was carrying a child out he suddenly woke up in a hospital bed. He'd been on fire the entire time and didn't even realize it. He was just so focused on getting people out that he didn't notice his clothes were on fire.
He was a big guy and I can imagine the poor kids, scared and alone, and here comes a burning giant to save them.
He got the highest award you can get in peace time, but his injuries forced him out of the military.
His little brother was a massive asshole, but he was amazing. I was really shocked when I heard what had happened to him.
I saw a guy with the same kind of action, albeit in a car accident. All of us present when it happened saw a VW beetle turn a corner and come to an abrupt stop, and the next second, huge flames erupted from the engine. Everybody in the car got out safe and was just standing there when a little girl suddenly said that Lisa was still in there. All of us turned pale. The car had flames coming out of the doors at that point.
Then a 40ish man sprinted to the car, simply climped into the flames and searched for "Lisa." He came out shortly after with a pretty badly burned doll in his hand, and most of his clothes on fire. And he didn't scream in pain or anything. All he could think about was "Thank God. It's a doll. Not a girl." That's when just about all of us were on him like a ton of bricks with jackets and sweaters and whatever else we had to put out the flames in his clothes. And that is when he started screaming in pain. But he still could only think about that girl luckily not being in there. He survived and had to undergo several skin grafts as I understand it before he could resume life and work. But to this day, he is still the most selfless and brave man I have ever met or seen. Right up there with that friend of yours who performed so extraordinary and brave.
@@Jens-Viper-NobelWow. A really brave man. But on the other hand... all of this because a child made him believe there was an actual person still in the car.
Frecci italian stunt team cheers einst
Sounds like a hero not bully. Maybe ur brother was just a bad person who needed some bullying
@@raggamuffin2682you need to learn how to read buddy 😂
Growing up as a child of a naval aviator, I loved air shows. My father, being a friend of many Blue Angel pilots, we were always right up front. I was once asked to hold the small dog of a lady who was having her picture taken with the Blue Angels. Years later, my parents told me that the lady was Jane Mansfield. The dog was nice.
Andy Hill must have known a good lawyer or had connections in the court system, his negligence and ego killed people
A huge travesty of justice
Andy Hill in my family is a name of the devil, his family I have sympathy but he, he is the devil
Disgusting, he survived but destroyed a classic aeroplane!😢
I hope he's proud of himself!
Andy had no carrier any more .l don’t worry about him fooling around.
Perhaps this is a Hack Job on the pilot?
I learned that it's best to watch airshows on RUclips.
In an underground bunker :-)
The entertainment vs risk ratio doesnt seem remotely worth it at these airshows. It's like watching a target shooting contest, but the stands are behind the targets
@@Heathcoatman Risk doesn't factor into it when it comes to parading the tools of the military industrial complex, and it never will.
I know a guy at the local community center who told me he was at the Reno airshow/race in 2011. He said a metal fragment whizzed past his head when the plane hit the ground and disintegrated. There were no visible remains of the pilot and two of the spectators were unidentifiable. The plane engine was running full throttle when it hit and the momentum from the moving engine parts was transferred into the spray of metal debris that struck people hundreds of feet from the impact point. He said there were identifiable engine fragments on the ground almost 1/4 mile away.
😂😂😂 lmao . In all seriousness.
I’m definitely staying away from anything ice cream related if there’s an air show nearby
Avoid the airshow
Exactly my thoughts.
Right!
All that ice cream melted, just makes it worse. 🍨🍧🍦
If I was booking an airshow, rule number one is NO ICE CREAM!
Regarding the Nimrod crash at Toronto in 1995, I would like to point out that the photo of the crew (and Army personnel) your displaying is that of Nimrod XV230 which crashed in Afghanistan in September 2006, through no fault of their own. The Cave-Haddon report exposed a long standing design issue, coupled with lack of due diligence on behalf of the relevant Engineering and Design Authorities, which resulted in a catastrophic in flight fire.
Thank you, I came here to say this.
Thank you for the info. It would be only fair, that the hack Video creator made a personal thank to you and an apology to all involved.
I fear this uploader is much more interested in the clicks, rather than the lives and families, who are affected by a crash.
Getting the information correctly can affect many.
Instead of arrows in his thumb nails, he should slow down and be sure that the info is correct.
Cheers from Canada
He even says Toronto 1995 and the photo shows 2006. That's pretty lame 👎
I appreciate you mentioning which disasters were not caused by pilot error.
Yes he did a good job of explaining everything in a way which could be understood.
The English Hunter pilot should have gone to jail. It wasn't the first time he violated the safety limits. There's another airshow in England where his display got interrupted by the safety manager on the ground due to violating the safety limits. This individual had a history of overestimating his abilities and endangering the spectators. He should have gone to jail for his ignorance.
Thanks for the video. A little surprised not to see Bud Holland's infamous B-52 crash from 1994 included - I know the accident flight was only a practice flight for an upcoming airshow, but he is surely worth a mention every time as to how NOT to fly a plane. Personally think it would be well worth its own piece looking at his dangerous temperament + the associated failures in command that allowed Holland to kill himself along with three other unfortunates.
"10 DEADLIEST Air Show Disasters In History (Explained)"
If you read Andy Browns “warnings unheeded” it explains this in great detail, brown was an Air Force security policeman who stopped a mass shooter at Fairchild AFB days before the b-52 crash and he wrote a book about both incidents. His book is very well researched and it includes how Holland had been reckless for years and numerous commanders has wanted to remove him from flight duties
I agree with this
The B-52 is a notably poor choice for an aerobatic aircraft as it lacks ailerons, using spoilers instead. Spoilers depend upon reducing the lift of one of the wings to roll the aircraft in that direction. Ailerons, OTOH, both reduce lift on one wing and increase lift on the other. Video of the accident shows the up-wing spoilers fully deployed, but the plane stopped responding as the wing was already stalled (not producing lift).
ruclips.net/video/Lbcsfqqqe7Q/видео.html
Holland was trying to make such an aggressive turn to avoid over-flying a restricted area (nuclear weapons storage facility). Poor flight planning resulted in this situation developing. Holland was a loose cannon who had multiple safety violations, but only received verbal reprimands.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1994_Fairchild_Air_Force_Base_B-52_crash
@@rapidthrash1964 The video of crash is shown in flight training in all of the military branch .
i like that he does not sensationalize or yell the entire video at me lol
I have heard of all these terrible accidents. In 1993 at the El Toro Air Show I witnessed the F-86 Sabre crash. I have not been to an airshow since.
I do not dare as well, On my first airshow, Harald Strößenreuther performed an aerobatic show that was miles beyond all others.
I was looking forward seeing him again next year. Shortly before the show he crashed while instructing.
Then I was at an airshow, where (again) Mark Hannah demonstrated a P-51 Mustang better than any other of the displays,
Great, next year ... He crashed before that in a HA-1112, a spanish license built Bf 109 with a Rolls-Royce Merlin engine.
On another airshow someone came with a replicia of the Spirit of St. Louis. Disintegrated in the air some months later.
An acquaintance took me up in a Slingsby T-28, an open-side-by-side british glider. Great experience, it was totally peaceful up there, no wind, no noise, you could hear the birds singing on the ground.
Some months later he went to a fly-in in eastern Europe, and there he died of a burst appendix.
I am not superstitious, and people die when flying, but in the meantime I gave up. I do not want to risk other people's lives anymore.
I was at the El Toro show too. Crazy stuff!
I watched Bob Hover at the Lincoln airshow in 1972, flew the mustang and a Rockwell twin. Bob flew the pants off that twin, top of a large loop shutdown both engines, did a high speed pass over the runway at about 300 feet, then pulled into a loop at the runway end landing with both engines off. He was simply a amazing guy.
I saw him too
I saw that at Reno and Mojave.
So was Bob a helicopter pilot?
he had ratings in fixed and rotary wing, what a stupid question.@@markwallis7199
I've learnt something from this video: Don't go to an airshow.
They are way too crowded----so you staying away gives more room for others that love air shows. I'm one of them.
I find them ridiculous tbh and I love Aviation so much but I agree.....or watch from 20 miles away at least
Everyone that died at the Shoreham airshow was on the A27 dual carrageway waiting at traffic lights. I was there, my elderly dad and I were at the north end of Shoreham airport and what we saw was truly horrific. We tried to help people before emergency services arrived but there was little we could do.
Do not stay at home, it is provided is the most dangerous place.
Don't go to baseball games either, never know when a foul ball might kill you
Each of these are horrific tragedies. Thank you for your commentary and analysis Hoover.
And some, probably a drunk driving incident.
Why are all pilots revered as perfect human beings, but they sure do cras a lot.
I was at the Toronto Air Show the day the Nimrod crashed. It stunned the crowd. I too was stunned and it remains the only plane crash I have ever witnessed personally - and that was one too many.
Considering the immense number of fatalities injuries end loss of aircraft you would think air shows would become a thing of the past. I was at Flugtag in '88, an EC130 flight engineer, on static display and saw it first hand, I felt the heat of the explosions.And wreckage skidded past our aircraft, I've had nightmares ever since, and i've never gone to another air show.
The astonishing thing about the Farnborough air crash was that, after the dead and injured had been taken away, the air show carried on as if nothing had happened. Different times.
The show must go on!
WW2 spirit.
Now there would be wails of horror
on damaged nail polish
on men ....
/
They were made of tough stuff. How many had counselling after the wars?😅
Same thing with the Le Man motor racing disaster which killed 70 people.
Not just different times but worse times
I was at Shoreham, if i close my eyes i can still see it to this day. I was amazed that thousands of people all stood dead quiet as we watched the smoke and flames.
Two guys I went to school with died in it, I was out with my friends on Hollingbury hill and we saw the explosion.
Several Air Force personnel that I knew during my time in the service (and later as a Contractor) were at the Ramstein Air Show that day. One guy was working the air show while his wife and one of his kids were watching the air show. His family was close enough to the crash that the wife sustained minor burns and his daughter had some cuts from a piece of metal that hit her on the legs. The others were more fortunate and escaped without injuries being in another section away from the crash site. One of those NCO's (and his family) who witnessed that Ramstein incident was unfortunate to experience a similar incident several years later in 1994, while he was helping to shut down the B-52 Air Wing at Fairchild AFB in Washington. He witnessed the crash of the infamous "Czar 52" B-52 being flown by a known high-risk flier (Lt Col Bud Holland) that killed everyone on board and almost hit the Weapons Storage Area as well as the Control Tower. To compound a bad week at Fairchild, earlier that week his wife was working at the Base Hospital (she was a volunteer) when a gunman shot the several people in the same building before, he was finally stopped by a Security Policeman (who made an incredible 75-yard head shot with a Beretta handgun). She wasn't hurt, but between that incident, the B-52 crash, and Ramstein Air Show, these tragedies convinced them it was time for him to retire from the Air Force.
I was in the Army stationed at Pirmasans, about an hour from Ramstein AB, at that time. One of our soldiers wife was at the air show and she was killed.
I’d hope thtd wake up the self preservation attitude to run somewhere other. How many huge hints u need? 😅red flags everywhere, time 2 go bye
I am sure that was a Beretta M9A that he used to make that headshot! Love that pistol!
Richard should be in jail for life
@@hubriswonk lucky shot, even with training and practice.
I was at that Toronto Air Show one and was a young kid. Lucky for us, this was the first year they decided to move the show away from crowds and decided to have everything flown over the water. RIP to those who passed that day.
My grandma lived in Farnborough and witnessed John Derry's crash. Her vivid recollection was seeing a decapitated body remain upright for several seconds before collapsing to the ground. A horrific accident.
My uncle was there and witnessed the crash too. He recently had us show him the stuff on YT and the whole thing came flooding back to him.
Nah, that's just her meds messing with her mind
@@PedroConejo1939sure pal, sure 😂
A builder I used to work for was an RAF fireman at Farnborough at the time of this crash. A nasty job for them clearing up the various bits and pieces.
In WW2, during an attack on an American carrier, two crewmen were running to battle stations, when one crewman was beheaded by flying debris. Witnesses say his headless body took four more running steps before it collapsed.
My dad worked at Kaiserslautern Army Base with US Army and he was at the Rammstein show. Due to what he saw during the crash, he has never been to an airshow since. So sad
That makes me sad for him on many levels but glad he wasn’t one of the casualties ❤
they should stop those shows, too dangerous
@@nathanielalgernon975 Since the lost of an starfighter formation in 1962 in Nörvenich, with 4 dead pilots, all demo teams has been stopped by the german air force. However, the german navy had an F104 demo team, but only with low risk, normal flight shows.
My old roommate was on the Nimrod. I am pretty sure that the newspaper picture you have included in the video is actually the crew of the Nimrod that went down in Afghanistan. There was a similar shot the day after the Canadian crash.
Blue skies Bernie.
I’m very sorry for your loss. You are right though regarding the image. This was a minor oversight and I apologize for the mistake.
@pilot-debrief It was a long time ago, but the crash does still haunt me. Somewhere, there is a film made by someone in Canada who had been following the crew, which included a video of them boarding the aircraft. To see him alive as I remembered him was a real jolt.
Bernie and I shared a room at RAF Brawdy for about 18 months, and we got along pretty well. Before going Aircrew, he was a flight simulation engineer.
Whenever I see the crash, I hear his voice clearly in my mind. The only real comfort is that they would not have felt a thing, though they would have known it was coming.
I witnessed the same display routine at Fairford a short time earlier, and the display looked a bit dodgy to several of us working there. We all held our breath but figured they must know what they're doing. Too many crews away from home try to make their displays a bit punchy to impress other crews.
Still, great video, keep them coming.
Much more informative than the usual offerings on here.
Yeah, the picture was the Afghan crash crew. I used to sub-aqua dive with Gary "Q" Quilliam (top row, third from right) God bless you mate. Til we buddy up again...
As always, a concise examination of events, presented so an average, non aviator can understand yet with enough detail that those more aviation oriented can gain a better understanding. Well done, sir !
Thank you very much!
@@pilot-debriefthey guy who crashed at the Shoreham show also displayed at the Bray airshow in ireland only about 2 weeks earlier which i attended and i thought he was reckless then aswell
@@pilot-debriefthe tragic thing about Ramstien is if pony ten (after realising he messed up) had continued on the trajectory he was on and NOT pulled up to correct his mistake he would have fllown under the 2 formations safley
I watched the Frecce Tricolori display at the 1986 International Air Tattoo here in the UK. When they performed this manoeuvre with the singleton heading straight at me I couldn't believe it was allowed, and I instinctively threw myself to the ground, much to the bemusement of spectators around me. When I saw the Ramstein footage for the first time it was like having a premonition tragically realised.
I was there at Ramstein from 1985 through 1987. I always filmed at show center. I had one of them “Reggie Vision” camcorders with the little VCR on a strap! I rotated back to the states in early 1988 so I never saw that show with the accident. I may have been a casualty if I went that year. Karma was in my favor that time.
Man I’m the same way I don’t dive too the ground but I have to turn my back if it happens don’t let me see when I go kinda mentality
I was at the Ramstein air show when it happened. I received 3rd degree burns on my right arm. I’m actually in one of the still photos in this video.
No it wasn't
@@aviatortrucker6285sure pal 😂
A sombre subject, but an excellent, well-made and informative video, with no histrionics, silly music or doom-laden commentary. Thank you from England.
If I ever run an ice cream business, it won't be near an airport.
It was a refrigeration trailer, we called reffers when I was at Ramstein. I never heard what was stored in the trailer. The plane was leaning against the trailer and stayed there for few days during the investigation Ihe refueled UH 60s evacuating casualties to Lansthul Army hospital, I refueled some of the Aerimacchi 339 that flew that day.
It was full of ice cream. It was sitting perpendicular to the runway, with the audience on the other side. That trailer stopped the plane from sliding into the majority of the 300,000 spectators. The crash and the aftermath were so horrific, makes me sick to think about. Never went to another airshow.
Incredible footage and an excellent commentary. Thank you. RIP to the victims of these disasters.
I have heard of some of these accidents but not all. It's nice to have the reasons explained. Now I understand. Thanks.
I was at the Show when Jimmy died in the P51, I literally met him a few hours before his death as well. Super sad that happened, RIP legend
Very well done on these, well reported and described. Thank you.
Very sad days for so many in the air show disasters and RIP to the dear souls that perished.
You could have have mentioned the Mannheim disaster of 1982, when 46 people died when a Chinook crashed on the autobahn. I always think of that when I pass the Mannheim/Heidelberg junction, as I do frequently.
I would have gone to Ramstein in 1988, but fortunately we failed to organize transport.
That same year, just before Christmas I was on a British Airways flight to Edinburgh at exactly the same time as the PanAm 747 came down on Lockerbie. Both planes had taken off from Heathrow, within minutes of each other.
Was it during an airshow ?
@@Erikr-ex9dj Yes, it was an airshow to commemorate the founding of the city of Mannheim 300 years earlier. The parachutists were mainlly civilians from Canada and Wales, and they were atempting to beat a world record.
The Nimrod had been at an airshow here in my city the week before. I met and chatted with crew, even bought a few patches etc. When I heard that they had crashed and all the crew were killed, I cried. 😢
Your videos are excellent and you are well spoken and it’s so nice to hear properly pronounced and grammatically correct english!
I am station at ramstein and work in the passenger terminal, there’s a couple articles posted around the terminal talking about the incident and something’s you might not know is that the only ambulance for the event was destroyed by one of the aircraft’s that crashed. Because of that they called for german ambulances but they got stuck at the main gate trying to get on the base which ended up costing lives.
Yeah, I noticed, he didnt mention that. Its well known here in Europe, that the German ambulances and medical personnel were significantly delayed, coz the American guards kept refusing to let them in.
Another thing, that cost lives, was the Americans just chucking ppl untreated on various trucks, pickups etc and driving to hospitals, some as much as 45 min away, while the German protocol was to assess and do initial treatment b4 taking them to the hospital. It also made it quite hard to get the number of dead and wounded and identify them, as I recall, that took several days, coz the Americans didnt even have any idea, how many they had taken from the airfield and to which hospitals. Unfortunately, several ppl died due to the delay in treatment, both through the Germans being denied access for an extended lengths of time and through being thrown on random vehicles completely untreated and taken on long drives.
@@dfuher968don't like Americans much, do you?
@@dfuher968 I read in newspaper next day doctors in hospital scolded americans for handling injured people like wounded soldiers on battlefield under fire…
The Sacramento crash was a perfect example of a very dangerous, but well known, handling issue with the F-86 and it's Canadian cousins. Many USAF pilots crashed in training due to the tendency of the F-86 to over rotate on takeoff if rotation was initiated early. If the pilot had received any transition training he would have known better.
Yes.. he attempted two rotations before he realized he should have aborted it earlier.
My family went to an airshow when I was a kid (Indiana, early 1980s). I don’t remember the pilot's name, but the announcer said he had one arm. His plane crashed, and he was killed. I remember the plane diving into the ground, and a cloud of smoke coming from the area in the distance. It was kind of traumatizing. I have looked for more information about the pilot and incident but haven't found anything.
I was one of the Jordanian Team members during the Ostend Airshow crash in 1997. Omar started his sequence from a steep dive going into a rolling loop parallel with the display line after which he transitioned to an outside rolling circle - rolling left but turning right towards the crowd. The
x-wind was high pushing Omar towards the crowds. during the rolling circle. after 270 deg of turn Omar was on top of the crowds (100 metres inside the prohibited crowd line) when he transitioned from a rolling circle while inverted into a tumble (Flip-flop) manoeuvre at less than 300 feet when he should have been at least 800 feet if he were to recover by 300! He & the poor spectators were doomed the moment he executed the tumble at less than 300 feet while on top of the crowd. He was most likely unaware of his situation due to his strong desire to impress & win an unofficial & illegal competition in an official Airshow setting. Patrick Steen the Display Director who was supposed to be supervising flight safety from the Tower never gave the “Termination” call which should have been called on display frequency at least 60 seconds before the tumble when Omar had clearly crossed inside the minimum display line of 150 metres from the crowds!
It was a terribly sad & tragic day for All who were present. What was supposed to be a day of pleasure & happiness turned into a nightmare for ALL. 🥲
One British man
would like to say
that I see Jordan as a shining light in The Middle East,
and I honour Jordan's strong links to Britain's armed forces.
With all the focus on Arabs now known as "Palestinians",
most people are unaware
that within one year
of the start of the British Mandate of Palestine,
Britain created the Arab country of Transjordan,
with it's monarchy,
and that Jordanians
have made a success of both country and monarchy.
Quite an achievement,
since Jordan is surrounded by turbulent events!
Most also do not know
that in 1970 and 1971,
Jordan had a serious internal war with Palestinians,
who were usurping Jordan's authority.
I am also aware of the greening of the desert,
led by Queen Rania,
and hope that the whole Middle East
can learn from each other's achievements,
particularly in the better use of water.
Looking to the future,
the Middle East faces great challenges,
and I feel sure that Jordan will play it's part
in creating a better future for all.
/
My dad worked for the Civil Aeronautics Board (CAB) as an accident investigator. He ended up being the one that studied the flight reorder data from accidents. This was while the data was being recorded on metal tape. The CAB was actually changed into the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) and not into the FAA. Just thought I would share this.
The CAB existed until 1985 when it was finally dismantled following the deregulation of commercial airlines in 1978. Many of the air traffic control and air safety responsibilities of the CAB were transferred to the FAA when it was created in 1958. The accident investigation responsibilities of the FAA were then transferred to the NTSB when it was created in 1967, and it became fully independent in 1975. The CAB, FAA, and NTSB were all separate agencies from 1967 to 1978.
We weren’t born with wings. But we earn them. Prayers to everyone involved in all these accidents. 😢
Ironically, I saw the Frecce Tricolori at the 1997 RAF Mildenhall airshow in their first show since the Ramstein accident outside Italy, in addition to watching the Jordanians that that would have their accident in the very next airshow, Belgium. By the way, the Frecci Tricolori was, by far, the best aerobatics team of the seven (!) that displayed that weekend.
At about that time (I don't remember where) I saw the Frecce Tricolori display their aircraft and it was the best display I had seen. They were highly impressive.
In my youth 5 crewmembers and 39 parachutist from US, France, Germany, England and Canada lost their lives at an airshow by a Chinook helicopter crash in 1982 in Mannheim, Germany. One rotorblade disintegrated after a few minutes from start and caused the crash. Please research. This airshow-accident is not so well known and never list anywhere though it was horrible.
My Aunt and Uncle were at the Farnborough air show. My mother told me when they came home they were still in shock and covered in other people's blood. They never spoke about it with me (way to young), but my uncle who was one of the most enthusiastic aviation nuts I've known, and never flew on any kind of plane for over 40 years.
I was at work about 2 miles from the Farrells Ice Cream Parlor disaster (The F86 crash). I was a recently licensed PPL and would have been at the airshow if not
working. I saw the black smoke from the crash and was horrified at what must have happened. The aviation community was stunned at the magnitude
of the disaster. The pilot didn't know what he didn't know until it's too late.
Do you know if that pilot ever faced justice? I can't find any info online.
I can’t believe he survived
@@Felix-ix7icim also wondering this
The Nimrod almost crashed in Shearwater, NS the week before. He went into a sharp bank and the plane literally slipped sideway down. From my vantage point, i would guess he loss at least 100ft altitude. I commented to my buddy that he had almost lost the aircraft. Unfortunately, I was not surprised to hear about the crash in Toronto. It was a sad event as we had met all the crew and toured the aircraft at the Shearwater airshow.
Hoover, as a retired MSgt USAF (supply/maint) your knowledge and explanation is excellent. We had a unit pilot eject from his A-7 (wedding) from NV to PA into a hotel front door.
I don't understand anything after the word "eject". Please explain. Thank you.
@@markforster6457you hit the eject in the plane and you are ejected from the plane. Google it
I was 1988 in the German Army and one of those paramedics who rushed to the Ramstein-Airfield after that incident. It was a total chaos. Things happened which even a movie-regisseur couldnt imagine. F.e. there was a group of victims who where layed down in a normal bus of the USAF. The driver was told to reach the hospital asap. He needed about two hours than he asked German locals for help to find his destination. Or these lot of ppl, who had nearly no skin any more, but felt nothing, just looking on us. Those pictures I'll never forget.
There is just one thing I want to mention: Don't use these machines for entertainment. I know esp. in the U.S. they are used in every situation, f.e. in NFL games and so on. but if you would have seen what I saw, you would decide to say "no" to that.
And the story of the pilot who caused this was a bit more: As I was told, he was one of the pilots who forced down the plane with the hostage-takers of the "Achille Lauro" - case of 1985. So I was told that the fact that he climbed too high was in truth the result of a manipulation of his machine, carried out by the Libyan secret service just before that day.
So, it is all a bit dusty, but the story is a bit bigger than "just" a crash.
I work at the passenger terminal on base. Did you and the other medical responders have trouble getting onto the base as everything was happening?
please explain what you mean by "manipulation of his machine". Thanks.
@@sjb3460 It became known at the time - and quickly dropped again at the bottom of the table - that the machine's altimeter had been manipulated so that it showed an altitude that was too low.
As a result, the plane flew too high - which triggered the disaster.
@@drau331 thanks for the information
@@drau331you would think that if you were trying to cause a crash by manipulating the altimeter, wouldnt you want it to read too *high*, so the plane would fly closer to the ground?
I live near Wichita, KS and I remember growing up in the early 70's people were always talking about a KC135 Tanker that had crashed in a local neighborhood in Wichita back in 1965. McConnel Air Force Base is in Wichita and is a tanker plane hub. The plane had like 30K gallons of aviation fuel and somehow lost control and crashed, killing all the crew members and several people (25 - 30) on the ground. I've driven by the crash site in later years and there's some type of small park there. I've also heard that after that crash, the tankers that fly in and out of McConnel now carry a nonflammable liquid when doing test flights.
I was in the stands at the air show in Toronto when the nimrod went down. It was a huge plane. It's hard to imagine the size when we heard the dimensions before the performance. When the plane hit the water everyone in the stands stood, said "oooo", and then absolute silence. The only other time I've heard absolute silence in my 70 years was when I parachuted. It's eerie. There was no announcement - nothing. Then after 5 minutes the announcement told us to stay in the stands. It was another 30 minutes before they told us to leave in an orderly fashion. It is something I'll never forget.
Also, one last thing, thank you for explaining what caused the crash. At first we were told the plane was too low and when the pilot tried to bank and pull up the one wing-tip hit the water. That's exactly what it looked like. But after the investigation the pilot was to blame. Well, the pilots are always the scapegoats so I didn't pay attention after that. Boy, was I surprised today to find out that it was the pilot's error this time.
Lake Ontario is very cold and quite deep in the harbour. I don't remember if they ever recovered the plane and, especially the bodies. If and when you ever have time could you tell me? Many thanks.
p.s. The day after the Snow Birds flew the "Missing Man Formation" to honour the crew who lost their lives. I could see it from my balcony and it made me cry.
Thanks again.
As someone who was a Crew Chief on the Nimrod, though not on that occasion I can confirm that the bodies and the wreckage were recovered. Also the picture of the crew is not from that incident but from XV230 in Afghanistan.
@@willxv226 Thank you for letting me know. It's very much appreciated.
My Dad was in the Canadian army and I worked for the British Army here in Canada. I have to say that the air force has much more exciting machinery than the army, though. 😉
Excellent debrief as usual .. Thank you Hoover ..
6:48 also has sadly impacted the British classic jet demonstrations, as a hawker hunter hasn’t flown at an air show since
My father, his brother and their parents were at the Farnborough Air Show in 1952 and were in the crowd between the two impact points (the majority of injuries occurred behind them). Only found out when going through my fathers effects and his description of the accident was on a scrap of paper.
An historic document indeed!
Life is a tenuous thread
that is so easily severed,
yet he survived,
and you have life.
Your ancestors and mine
were close neighbours,
where many lives were lost in turbulent times,
as I am reseaching at the moment.
/
We lived on a mountain off base and saw the smoke and fire of a plane crash. Our father was a corpsman and we knew he was on the flight line that day. When he returned home that evening, we asked him what happened. He paused for a moment and said "Blood, guts, and feathers, but no brains." I never forgot those words when I was learning to fly.
I was at the Shoreham 2015 airshow in person with one of my closest friends who invited me to go with him i can't believe it's already been 8 years from the crash.
Around a week later I went to my local Clacton airshow and there was a moment of silence for those lost then followed by a round of applause from the spectators it brought a few tears to my eyes.😢
And the fact that Andy hill was found not guilty makes me sick to the stomach. 😠
You personally witnessed the 2015 Shoreham crash, and a week later you go to another airshow???? I'm not sure what to think about that. I know personally, there would be no way in hell I would be going to another airshow for quite some time after that.
That’s so odd of you
I went to Bournemouth the next day to see the Vulcan for the last time.
@@M_SCNot exactly, i was there when dan fillers mig23 went down in michigan, and a few weeks later i was in cali watching the Miramar airshow. Life goes on.
Edit. Just realized i technically saw the last Mig23 flight in america, damn
I was there too and i remember saying to my partner.. ‘he’s too low” when he started the loop, I was interviewed on a couple of radio stations and the bbc. It looked dodgy from the start to me .
I was hoping you would mention the B52 crash at Fairchild, which was a practice session for the next day's airshow.
Maybe you could do a video on that incident, and the responsible arrogant pilot with a long history dangerous stunts.
Thanks, love the channel
In my time working at an airbase, there were two fatal air-show accidents. The first occurred during an air show and the second was while practicing for one.
There were four of us at the air show in Ramstein. Our driver told us to run to the car so we wouldn't get caught in the traffic jam at the end of the air show. And we hadn't even been walking for five minutes when the accident happened. I think we had a guardian angel or something.
AIRSHOWS in the United States follow very stringent rules and no aerobatic energy can be directed at the spectators. In fact different crowd liine distances must be maintained with piston engine or turbine engine aircraft .
Comparing the Reno Air Races with a U S Airshow is Apples and Oranges.
Living on my sailboat at Ontario Place, I saw the 1995 Nimrod crash, and later watched the salvage operation at close quarters. Thorough review. I had watched the Nimrod in previous years, one of the better displays with a spectacular wing-over by the big plane at the end. Quite a shock when it happened. Eerily, I was at that time reading a book about British military air disasters, mostly at air shows and the like, including the 1956 crash at Heathrow of the RAF's first Vulcan, which had flown over my school in New Zealand and left me with an impression for life.
@Pilot Debrief - I was a little kid when the crash into the Ice Cream shop in Sacramento happened. My family was supposed to be there to meet my Grandma for her birthday. My dad had our boat in tow, and there wasn't anywhere to park with the boat, so we went somewhere else. I was a little kid
What happened to your grandma?
Great debrief Hoover! Thank you for a no nonsense & accurate breakdown of the issues.
I have worked as an Airboss and main talker for many Airshows since starting in ATC back in 1981.
The main difference between day to day ATC and an airshow is as an ATC we separate the aircraft but at an Airshow we segregate the traffic and as per the brief keep up the movement of the acts so it doesn’t become boring for the crowd.
If any of the acts require pilots to visually separate themselves from an act it is fully briefed on the ground and the segregation is kept in place until the pilot accepts responsibility for visual separation.
In over 100 Airshows the team I work with has never had an incident or injury.
Thank you for your channel.
Shane.
@17:26 you can clearly see that trim tab hanging... I was maintenance on a Formula-1 in the 1980's. I can't understand why that crew would not have checked the other trim tab after repairing the other one.
I was supposed to go to Rammstein but I got a sore throat. The friends I went with were about as close to the accident as you could get without getting injured.
this reminds me of the seth mcfarlane story, where I believe he was late for his flight and missed it, this plane crashed into the twin towers
On the Reno Air Race, 75 is pretty old to be racing anything. Having grown up in a family of racers, dirt bikes, jet boats, street bike racers, they all have one thing in common. They stepped down what they raced or how they played as they got older. For example, motocross to enduro to dirt biking for fun to mountain bikes for fun. Jet boat racing to sailboat racing to e-bike for fun. 75 is not 45 and reactions are not the same. I still believe age played a role in that accident.
I was actually at the Shoreham Airshow when WV372 went down. I've only been to one airshow since, and I was practically wetting myself every time a plane went even marginally close to the ground.
Grow up
@@joeds3775most average Internet troll
I was at the Shoreham air show and if I remember correctly the Hawker Hunter flew along the runway prior to starting the loop. He climbed then inverted while rounding the top of the loop before coming back down. He seemed to not be able to pull up soon enough… I don’t know if it was due to insufficient airspeed over the control surfaces that he was unable to pull out of the dive. I couldn’t believe what I was watching at first but then after a few seconds I realised he’d crashed on the road and was totally stunned as were all the other spectators. I didn’t attend every year as I live in the area and regularly saw the planes flying over my house but the last 2 shows I went to there were crashes - this and a WW2 Hawker Hurricane previously when the plane malfunctioned and the brave pilot was able to guide it to an area on a hill away from the airport where it nose dived into the ground. I still feel sad for the 12 men who lost their lives in both of these incidents. My parents had also traveled from their home in Kent for both shows, unfortunate they both ended with sad memories for them
He flew in line with the main road so the risk of crashing on the road were maximised.
My dad and brother were at the Ramstein Air Show. My dad took my brother to see the show for his birthday. They left immediately upon the disaster. My dad, a wounded combat veteran, knew he needed to get my brother out of that environment.
My brother, who has always loved all things aviation, is now an Aeronautical & Mechanical engineer who worked for NASA. He also retired from the Air Force, where he worked as a BlackHawk Crew Chief.
11:05 that is almost the view that I had on that accident at that day, august 28, 1988... ☹️
Will never forget the sound of the sirens, the steady sound of the arriving and departing rescue helicopters and the chaos around us...
The P-51 maintenance issue where a fault is found and the mirror side not checked is negligence. If you find a low tire, you check the other tires.
Great job getting these compilations. I’m so sorry for everyone who paid the ultimate price just to show or watch what an aircraft is capable of:(
You did a wonderful job of narration, nice and easy to listen to without stuttering, urrrring and ahhhing and waffling like some of the other wannabe commentators, well done bud.
The package was interesting and I actually watched it to the end which is something I don't usually bother with.
Keep up the great work.
Kind regards
Ray. Rotorua NZ
I was at the Paris Airshow that day & watched incredulous as the Tu-144 crashed. I didn't see the Mirage but you can imagine how a desperate manoeuvre to avoid hitting it could have caused the break-up.
Ten years later I saw the Italian aerobatic team perform just above the point where Lake Geneva narrows into the Rhone river - way too small an area to prevent spectators being hit in the event of an accident. A stunning performance but man, risky.
There is the Mirage on the 8mm footage on RUclips. Right after the crash it is apperaed down from the cloud layer.
My dorm neighbor in the USAF at Tyndall, was at the Ramstein disaster. Bob would always leave for the weekend, when we had an air show on the base.
I was at the airshow in Sacramento I was in fourth grade. We were supposed to go to Farrell‘s ice cream parlor, but we wanted to stay and watch the jet takeoff as it was the only military plane there I was with another family and when my mom heard the news, she didn’t know if we were at the parlor or not till we got home, remember to this day the jet going down the runway with the front landing gear off the ground, disappearing behind the hanger and then seeing the fire ball at the end of the runway
Attended a lunch with that Nimrod crew the Friday before the crash. Good bunch of guys. Took a while to process watching them hit the water before the weekend was out.
In 2008 or so, I saw the aftermath of the Ukrainian accident on RUclips. I was only 13. It was absolutely horrific, bodies were torn apart and strewn everywhere. I am happy that RUclips changed their policy since then because that video was very traumatizing.
arnborough accident from 1952 brings back on my mind to several old Pathé movies of what used to be SBAC (Society of British Aircraft Constructors) in late '40s and early '50s. It seems that there was an immense pressure on those Test Pilots performing in front of potential purchasers of their novelties placed on the VIP's balcony.
New jet aircraft flew right over spectators at incredibly low altitudes performing highly demanding manouvers, on cutting edges of their flight envelopments.
I remember seeing a prototype of the Canberra making a very tight turn far lower than a hundred feet right over the camera and the observers and no-one said anything.
In other videos I saw a prototype of the Handley Page Victor landing meters away from reporters with their cameras and children playing, without any visible security guard or protection.
The accident you mention was of the DeHavilland DH 110; a novel aircraft competing with Glosters for a RAF requeriment for a Night/All-Weather fighter, competition later won by the Gloster GA.5, lately known as The Javelin. The DH.110 later gave birth to the embarked naval fighter named the Sea Vixen.
The accident ocurred when the second prototypem an elegantly black painted bird, experienced engine failures in early morning, forcing John Derry and Tony Richards, De Havviland's crew, to fly back to Hatfield, North of London, on the company's Dragon Rapide, to bring the only other existing DH.110, the all-silver first prototype.
That plane wasn't scheduled to fly that day and De Havilland administration had to improvise.
During part of earlier flights they were testing the application of a large wing fence right on mid span in both wings to avoid early airflow separation from wing upper surface.
Those fences were retired lately to continue testing without them. In those later flights it wasn't thought to make hard-G manouvers. Sadly those fences (also applied to the second black prototype), conferred strenght to wing integrity as last days flights demonstrated.
No-one thought in that detail. So, when John Derry pulled a very tight turn to make a second low fast subsonic pass over Farnborough after the first supersonic one, the hich-G load on the wings were too much and both outer wings broke more or less at the same moment desintegrating the plane in the air. The cockpits with Derry and Richards made a dive right in front of people and crashed just meters away from the rope that held people from flight operations terrain. Except for both pilots who died there, no-one was injured by the cockpits and nose fall.
The rear fuselage, containing the inner segments of the wings, both tail booms and both vertical fins plus the stabilizator and the rear part of the fuselage fell performing a slow plain spin over a solitary portion of the field But sadly both Avon engines detached from the rear fuselage and were released like a pair of bombs that made a parabollic fall towards a small hill where large numbers of nosy people gathered to see the airshow from right outsider the airfield. One of the engines with its blades still running anf fiery hot, fell on the crowd killing twenty-nine people and injuring about sixty. Most of the people were not executives from aircraft companies or representatives of foreign governments. That hill was chosen by families to see the show and that was the tragic end of the DH.110 show.
However (which is unthinkable today), Hawkers test pilot who had to fly after DeHavilland, to show the second Hawker P.1067, prototype of the Hawker Hunter, had to postpone his flight... just about an hour, to let ambulances and emergency teams to do their job. After that, show had to go on and he was cleared to take off and continue the Airshow. It is unbelievable today. Things have changed a lot and, I believe, for the better.
P😊😊😊
When you look at the catalogue of crashes in WW2,
I guess there was a "gung ho! attitude
that persisted for many years.
Your post
is probably the best description of the DH 110 crash
I have ever read!
Thank you!
/
An excellent presentation, Hoover. Thanks so much !
I've been to one airshow in my life, back in the 1960's I think. I was nervous about how near the aircraft flew to the spectators, and concerned about how close the planes flew to each other in high speed group maneuvers, enough so that I never attended another and have no plans ever to do so.
why watch people showing off demonic weapons? they brainwashed us as children to see soldiers and war as heroic, manly, and exciting. I'm glad that the hottest war now is one for hearts and minds. We are evolving as a species. war is mostly unnecessary but it's big business. I really do believe we will move past it. I grew up on USAF bases so I may be biased🤣
The Nimrod in the run up to the Nimrod MR2 crash was a very different Mark. It’s a Nimrod R1 of 51 Sqn. RAF. No MAD boom is visible and it has significantly more antennas visible. This is a SIGINT/ELINT aircraft - not Maritime Reconnaissance.
I get chills thinking about the Ramstein disaster because one year prior, my family and I stood in the exact spot the crash occurred. When I saw the video, after returning to the States, my blood ran cold.
EXCELLENT AND PROFESSIONAL - Thank you Sir
Contributing to the fatalities at the Ramstein disaster was the lack of common technical standards regarding the medical emergency equipment, when ambulances of the US air base (US standards) brought patients into the German hospitals. Additionally, back then no training for large scale disasters existed, no common command post for organizing the efforts, etc.
No ice cream at air shows. Got it.
I remember being excited to see air shows when we moved to Landstuhl/Ramstein only to learn that they don’t have any due to what happened in 1988.
I was present at Flugtag 1988 while stationed at Sembach AB Germany and captured the disaster on video. This was the scariest moment of my life as my family and I were located where the plane came into the crowd just an hour before the accident.
What I learned: At an airshow the most dangerous place to be is near an ice-cream vendor... Truck or store, doesn't matter...
Interesting that the last report explained the rules of that airshow, which over time had the rules relaxed, with aircraft flying over the crowd from behind and from the front and got down to 150’ or less. In recent years, due to accidents, it’s gone back to the original 1951 rules.
Hoover: no bs, just an honest debrief. Kudos to you
I still remember the first time I watched the footage of the Ukraine crash. I watched it here on RUclips years ago. It has since been taken down. It was put up again a few years later, and then taken down again. I'm figuring its still down. At least I hope it is. It's one of those videos you wish you could unsee. Because the horrific aftermath burns into your soul, and you can't forget what you had just seen. The footage is taken by 2 or 3 amateur camera men. Likely spectators with camcorders, who ran up to the wreckage. As they run up to the crash site, you begin to see debris from the crash all over the place. Lumps of unidentified pieces of plane. That is until you realize that many of those are not pieces of the plane at all, but they're pieces of people. A torso with no head or legs. A leg or arm here and there. Some you can't really tell what body parts your looking at other than you recognizing a hand or shoe in the mess. It was horrific. I'm an ex firefighter and medic, who worked for a large city for many years. I've seen ghastly injuries and unthinkable horrors. And I got used to seeing things like that. But I've never witnessed carnage on that scale before. And its something that you don't ever get used to.
Thank You ... late 50's at an Edwards AFB Airshow I was very young but can recall a helicopter (possibly a Bell H13) falling from the sky during a demonstration right in front the crowd/bleachers (which is where I and the family were sitting) ... completely engulfed by fire ... one fatality ... at the time my Dad worked for Hughes Aircraft Co at Edwards and the was the test RIO for the Convair F-106 which had an MA-1 radar weapon system. Decades later my sister and I worked in the Hughes F-14 (A/D) program office. The Airshows at Edwards AFB and Point Mugu NAS are lifetime memories...last but never least once saw Bob Hoover (RIP) fly the Shrike Commander at the Torrance (CA) Municipal Airport show ... Thank You Keith Chicago IL
You know, I think I’m going to do some research into how many airshows there are vs number of accidents…..seems like a pretty common thing for such a safety oriented field
A+ to the camra man that cought those engines flying through the air
Interesting video thanks.
I have a story about air show that thankfully had no fatalities but was a spectacular incident.
It was August 12 1973. At the Abbotsford international airshow. A demonstration of 4 Canadian CF -101B Voodoos based at the time at CFB Comox, B.C. 409 sqd. Nighthawks were doing their very entertaining display. The F-101B Voodoo is such an elegant aircraft.
Anyways the display ends with each jet flying down the showline individually, then doing a max. after burner climb out to about 20,000 ft. Well on this day CF-101B number 101019 pulled up and climb up when at or near the top of its climb the aircraft explodes and disintegrates. Thankfully both of the crew ejected safely though I recall they did suffer burns.
I was just a kid. It was a beautiful clear August day. At first I recall saying ," Wow cool." But seconds later I see the smoke and parts falling along with both parachutes. I then knew that something went wrong.
The bulk of the plane's parts fell thankfully safely in a corn field near the airport. Again thankfully nobody died.
I still remember it 50 years later like it happened yesterday. 🤔
A friend of mine survived the crash in Sacramento (he was in the ice cream parlor at a kids' party). The trauma was so severe that he didn't relate his hospitalization to the Sabre crash until much later...
My dad was in the US army and stationed at Ramstein at the time, and unfortunately he was part of the “cleanup crew” and it kind of f*cked him up for the rest of his life. Incredibly tragic, rip to all lives lost in any accident.
I can understand that. I saw a man ride a bicycle into the running propeller of a C-124 65 years ago. Some things can never be unseen.
Might there be a correlation between airshow accidents and ice-cream????
with the Tupolev crash, in an interview, one of the crew who was an auxiliary pilot that day (briefed but not flying unless one of the main crew declares unfit for duty), claims that, after seeing concord preform, to improve performance capabilities, engineers had connected a new stabilization system, that was under testing but not yet flight-worthy. this was supposed to make the performance closer to that of the concord through augmenting controls by automated front winglet configuration changes, to enable the plane to move around a point much closer to the optimal CG (and therefore be much more stable at subsonic speeds)... it also meant that the plane did not preform in a manner the pilots were used to or trained to, but the head of the team ordered them to fly anyway (to which the purported captain's response was something like, "F#&%k it, at least we'll die together")
the original investigations probable cause was "Jammed Controls, possibly by a hand-held filming device", but this guy believed the pilots did not manage to figure out what the airplane was doing under the new regime, since it was reacting to their inputs far too sharply resulting in overcontrol... note, the original strange attitude was an impossibly steep go-around just after being unable to slow down enough in the flare... it is possible, that under this new mode, the airplane climbed instead of flaring as they expected it to.
just a theory... but one that's based on what seemed quite an earnest interview with probably the closest person alive to that cockpit...
That makes historical sense in terms of what the USSR was always doing with science and technology, the (unfit) politicians were in charge rather than data-led decisions
@@M_SC At that time the USA did the same
I heard that the pilot said "Hold my Beer" just before the maneuver.
Sounds realistic