Listen your instruction has more sense than any instructor or online video I've ever seen. Don't listen to any hater and keep doing you. Your helping us struggling
Praise be, your teaching video is so clear. Bowling jargon, often confusing to me, is kept to a minimum. Plenty of varied examples isolate and develop your point. The question of cupping/coiling and flattening/uncoiling the wrist seems so fundamental to bowling that it’s surprising that it’s received such short shrift on RUclips. Kudos to the Bald Brothers for devoting this and other videos to this one subject.
Love your videos. Definately one of the top 3 go to bowling sites on youtube! Your teaching is excellent. You make understanding and implementing exercises vs the “pros” videos which assume we all can do what they do! ….dont stop. Great work. We know everyones different…..your input os extremely valuable!!!
Honestly your original video is what helped me get the first step into allowing me to hook a ball with a thumb in the ball. I was struggling for a long time, not understanding the concept. It's definitely a good starting point for anyone wanting to learn how to get a hook on the ball for one hand, thumb in.
I believe it's very important for new bowlers to understand that if you are "cupping" in a forced way and you notice pain in the wrist that's bad. As you analyze these pros you will see most of them are flat wrist on the back swing. The cup happens naturally because if you "hang" for a second at your apex the ball will start to fall before your arm which will cup the wrist naturally then following behind it with a slight elbow bend keeps you more naturally cupped without any force of "picking the ball up to cup it" then you collapse the elbow and your wrist at release. There should be NO PAIN. If there is you should wait longer for the ball to fall naturally from your apex. I struggled with pain for many months learning the pro release because some coaches were teaching the "cup" method and it's wrong if it hurts. The ball weight and fall from apex creates a cup. Hope this helps someone as it did me. I just want to make sure if anyone is struggling with wrist pain from cupping, do your push away, get to the apex and pause. Now you won't be able to hold the ball up in that position. The weight of the ball will cup your wrist as it starts to fall to the ground before your arm does. At this point you just hang behind it until release. All the weight is gone coming down and you are cupped without any force. It's a fantastic moment to realize how it works. A bit of thumb squeeze will help too until you can get use to it to start to relax your thumb pressure more. Just hold your arm up in the air and watch how your wrist will fall into a cupped position. This happens during your apex as long as you wait for the ball to fall and don't pull down. As soon as you pull down you won't get behind the ball or cup without hurting your wrist.
That is a great analysis. One thing I say is that many who feel pain are trying to "curl" the ball to make the cup. They are typically doing two things wrong with that. One is that they may not have a proper fitting thumb, so they squeeze, and create that "curl" motion. They are essentially straining their wrist using muscles to get that shape. The other is that they aren't using gravity and the "weightless" moments, which is similar to what you are talking about. I appreciate you adding your analysis as that's a great way to look at that. Thank you.
@@baldbrothersbowling thank you! I love your content. And I love seeing bowling becoming more popular. Keep up the great work sir, I have learned a lot from you and I appreciate your time with your audience!
Love your videos, your previous ones on the yoyo and spiral with your over exaggerations have actually helped me. So thank you. Quick tip if you were not aware of this on youtube, (and for future videos), when you are doing videos like this trying to. show frame by frame stuff, when the video is paused, if you press the period button . or the comma button , , it will actually move the video by frame.
Thanks for watching and the comments. Coaches C and Adam are good guys. I so appreciate that they reached out to me. I love talking bowling, and they know their stuff.
Thank you for all the videos of tips. I learned a lot from you. I've been trying to improve my release by watching your videos. I am fortunate to bowl in a league with many pros, and I watch them as well.
The thing that impresses me so much about Prather is the fact that his release is so damn smooth you don't even hear the ball hit the lane. Zero loft, zero noise, it's like butter!
Thanks. My buddy who has a wrist support is bringing to the first night of league so I can borrow it. Will probably record that sometime next week. Thanks for hanging in there.
Yeah youre doing good man…keep it coming. I never really understood why people come to a channel to teach the teacher. Seems to me if they know then they would go elsewhere. Maybe thats just me. Keep the content coming man💪🏾💪🏾💪🏾
Great video and info. I'm from the old school, was yelled at don't break you wrist when you release ball. Man times have changed, now I just say yoyo release.😀
Thank you. Yes, I have such an extreme cup for that exact reason. I am almost 50 and we were taught to not break the wrist. Ideally, if you cannot do a yoyo release, maintaining a flat wrist is better than breaking it back, but if you can get the timing of rolling it off your hand with that change in the wrist, it will increase the Rev rate (if that's what you are going for).
@@baldbrothersbowling 73 years young here, still average in high 180's. Just got out of a bad slump, bowl on wood lanes destroyed my mental game. Not happening this year, still have speed for my age 12 to 14 mph.
Good video and looking forward to the wrist support one. I use one, and cup my wrist, but I tend to turn the ball inwards towards my hip to prevent the ball from rolling over the thumb (high track bowler). Just recently started the yo-yo release. I've been working through a bowling injury and looks like I have radial tunnel issues and carpal tunnel. I've been using 12 lb balls, but just started buying 14 lb after a PSO forced me into a 13 lb and I realized that I can handle the weight (with the wrist support). I'm looking forward to getting them drilled and seeing what I've been missing from the fancy cores.
This type of release has been around since the 70's I believe. Don Johnson had a bowling video that taught this release. I think he referred to it as a yo yo release also, but also described it like throwing a frisbee. Anyway, I've tried it in the past but I just can't do it. I would need practice and possibly take a bowling season off just to learn this release. I don't think I want to do that. I know I don't want to do that! I'm 61 years old and I'm quite happy with my firm wrist release.
Love this. I agree that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. I know some want to learn this so that is why I show it, but definitely be happy with what you do.
First of all, great content and explanation of technique so no need to apologize. Although there is not one way, there are definitely commonalities among the pros and HOF bowlers so these common traits have stood the test of time. You hit on many of them but there is one more which may be the key factor in "effortless" production of revs and it's the 3rd element of not only the yo yo but any pro release. So, cupped goes to uncapped and then to re-cupped. Re-cupped is the rev producer, makes the ball go longer and hook more where it should. The evidence is in the direction of the pro follow thru (which facilitates this slight counter clock wise hand motion) when measured from release to completion. If you did just this, even without cupping, uncupping, and or bent elbow, your revs have to increase due to the increased "pressure" this produces on the finger pads at release. Every bowler you used as an example had a follow thru that started lets say right ear to left ear. None follow thru down or right of the target line.
Appreciate that. I talk about the follow thru in my other video and wanted this one to focus on the cupping since some told me "never cup.". You are absolutely right that the follow thru is also key. I appreciate the watch and comment
Good one. How about some lefty perspectives? like Packy, Jesper, Ryan Ciminelli, Parker Bohn III... cupping the wrist isn't necessary, but rev rate = power and power = more pin carry. Higher pin carry = higher scores and who doesn't want higher scores? 😊
Haven't you heard? The left is walled. Just throw it out there and you will strike. Lol. Just kidding. Yes, I should have included some left videos. You will see similar bend with Packy and Jesper as you do with the right handed 2-handers. I haven't watched a slow motion of Ryan Ciminelli, but pretty sure he cups and then uncups at the end. Bohn is more of a stroker and probably doesn't bend as much. I will have to watch some and maybe do a lefty only video. Thanks for the comment.
Question: In order to cup the wrist, does it in turn cause to squeeze the ball? I'm trying to have as free an arm swing as possible while still getting my fingers under the ball. I assume as the ball is at the top of the swing, the ball is weightless and that is when the ball is starting to be cupped at that slight delay on your down swing.
It will cause some people to squeeze, but it is important to not do that. Squeezing and cupping can cause wrist pain. You need to have a snug thumb, hinge at the base of the thumb, and pull back with the thumb to get that cup. Check out our video on the importance of the thumb, part 1. It highlights it here. Let me know if that helps.
I don't really know what I'm doing yet. Yesterday, i bowled using your "pull back with thumb" to keep my wrist from breaking to the top of the ball. But since it was my first try on the lanes, I'm not sure how well I was doing. But I did go from like zero revs to significantly more but still way too low. I'm not ready to try any yoyo stuff yet i don't think. Too many moving parts as a beginner to try to incorporate yet. Yesterday was just trying to focus on the thumb pull back. This Thursday I'm going to try to add some more revs and see how that feels. Right now my leg hurts so bad that I'm just standing at the line and throwing. So I'm lacking a bit in power and don't want to muscle the ball because people say not to do that.
Great to hear you saw something improve. You are right in that it's a lot of moving parts, and we always coach that people to focus on 1 thing at a time. Starting with the thumb thing is great. I would suggest thinking about the underhand football spiral for more of a beginner move. Especially if you have a hurt leg. It's a great way you can practice the motion at home. Even if you don't have someone to throw it to, do it in the backyard, or into a wall. If you can spiral the football tightly with a slight angle to the ball (nose not pointed straight ahead, but a little to the right so you have more of a 45-degree angle of the ball), then work on spiraling it tighter. If you can get that down, then try to take that technique to the bowling ball. I know the bowling ball is much heavier, and the thumb technique helps alleviate some of that, but if you think about what you did to spiral that football and get that same feel in the bowling ball, that might help. I wish I could be there in person to help you out, but hopefully these videos and notes help you work on these on your own. Good luck.
@@baldbrothersbowling I'm all the way in Warren Michigan. About the "football spiral"... I thought people turn their hand and lift up with their fingers? Or is that basically the same thing as the spiral with the football? I'll be practicing Thursday, so I'll try the spiral.
Mechanically it seems achievable and without a ball in my hand it feels like I can do it. The problem is as soon as I add some load, I can’t keep my wrist cupped in the swing or before release. Do you have any advice, guidance or recommendations on how to build up the strength? Is it just a case of hitting the gym and working on forearm/wrist strength exercises to build up the muscle strength? I really don’t know what else I could do.
Thank you for your question. While a stronger person does have an easier time with it (which is also why there are different weight balls), it's not really that much about strength. It COULD be an issue with your thumb fit (assuming you use your thumb). I have another video on my channel for "The Importance of the Thumb; Part 1." In this video, I talk about how you can tell if you have a proper fitting thumb, and how you hinge at the base knuckle of your thumb. This keeps you from grabbing the ball. Additionally, instead of "curling" your wrist as if your doing wrist curls in a gym, when the thumb is fit proper and you hinge proper, you actually pull back with the thumb to create the cup. This technique makes it feel like the ball is much less heavy. This is the reason you can find many smaller women and skinny guys still be able to do this. They aren't really using muscle, they are using technique. It's harder to explain here, but if you watch THAT video, it might give you some tips to try that will make it easier. If you STILL struggle with it, it COULD be that the ball is to heavy, but in all likelihood, it's more a thumb fit/hinge technique that is the culprit. Let me know how that goes.
Are you a 1 or 2-hander? If 2-handed, I'm all for it. You will see a mix, even among the pros, where some are resting on the forearm the whole way, some are not on the forearm at all, and some start NOT on the forearm, but they move to the forearm during the swing. I believe that getting it onto your forearm is a great way to get further under the ball, as long as you are properly releasing the wrist and rolling the ball off the hand vs. coming all the way around and over the top of the ball. If you are 1-handed without a thumb, you pretty much have to rest it on your forearm (a-la Tom Daugherty). If you are 1-handed WITH your thumb, it is much more difficult to get the ball onto your forearm unless you rotate your wrist into an extremely loaded position (kind of like Butturf). If you do this, you have to be very careful to make sure you uncoil the wrist at release, otherwise being in THAT loaded of a position, you do run the risk of spinning the ball. So bottom line is, I think without the thumb, it's a good idea, but if you use the thumb, I would try to accomplish the release without going quite to the extreme of getting the ball to the forearm. I hope that helps.
@ This helps a ton thank you so much!!!! I’m 2 handed and have been back in forth on doing it and not doing it. I just need to learn the proper uncoil position
There is a distinction (IMO) between cupped and cocked that is subtle but enough to make the two releases different. BJ Moore and Wes Malott's releases gravitate more toward the cocked to uncocked whereas a Mitch Hupe is pure cupped to uncupped. One is a frizzbee release (cocked to uncocked) and the other the YoYo (cupped to uncupped. Of course, in between the above mentioned examples, there are as many combinations of cocked/cupped as there are pro bowlers. (You cannot throw a fizzbee by cupping and uncupping further illustrating the difference nor work a yo yo by cocking uncocking) So, is there 3 releases? Cocked Cupped Hybrid of both?
You are 100% correct. In some of the other videos I have done, I discuss that distinction. Cupping helps you get below the equator or under the ball, while cocking helps get your fingers on the inside portion of the ball. Ideally, you will have a hybrid of both to some degree as that can maximize the rev rate and get you in good tilt and angle of rotation. When someone does both well, I like to consider that a "coiled" release. So instead of just cocking and uncocking or cupping and uncupping, I like motion that is coiled to uncoiled. As you said, there are degrees of how much someone will do each, thus creating the differences we see in many styles. It is also good for those that can control each to make minor hand position adjustments. For example, if you cup, but your cocking is minimal, and you stay behind the ball, you will be more forward in your roll and/or have less tilt. If you cock it more, you will come around it more and increase your angle of rotation, and possibly increase tilt. These changes can change how your ball reacts which in tournament situations on sport shots is sometimes better than moving or switching balls. All that said, I like a release that incorporates both to some degree, if done properly without creating strain. One of my favorite 2-handers to watch is the young Ryan Barnes. Most 2-handers cup their wrist and actually lay the ball on their forearm a little. He also cocks his wrist better than most I have seen, and I think it helps him create such a powerful roll. His dad is also a king of the cocked wrist to get inside the ball. I like that cocking motion to get inside the ball because I see too many people who try to get inside the ball with their entire hand. While some pros are good at this, many amateurs who do this end up wrapping all the way around the ball and spinning it, where cocking the wrist and then uncoiling it I feel is easier to control. That is a great observation on your part. Thank you for the comment.
The start of the yo yo release starts after the push away.... When using a yo yo, remember the yo yo will always return to you with the same speed you released it with, your back swing is like releasing the yo yo to the floor, your down swing and release are pulling the yo yo back to your hand, and as with a yo yo, you can't force the yo yo or yank the yo yo, you have to relax your fingers and follow thru all the way... People are confused when you say yo yo release, with a real yo yo you start by releasing the yo yo by flexing your wrist towards the floor to start, the yo yo release taught for bowling only shows the down swing and in yo yo terms "bringing the yo yo back to you" I broke my arm swing down and this is the simplest way I can explain it... Hope this helps someone understand 🙏🏿💪🏾🙏🏿
The push away is important, but the yo yo release in bowling is really referring to what your hand and wrist do right at the release only. When you release the yo yo, you straighten your arm and uncoil the wrist. Same with the downswing and release in bowling. The push away is really irrelevant to accomplishing a bowling yo yo release.
@Baldbrothers: What would be great is if a bowler, as much as they try, cannot get their elbow to bend or wrist to cup at the release point, then how can they create a release with more power?
I will be putting out a video using a wrist brace to prevent the wrist chip and will address that there. Hopefully will record that in the next week or two.
@@baldbrothersbowling that's great what about a bowler like myself who's pretty good but can't get into the bent elbow position and I don't need to use a wrist brace how can I get more power with a better release.
@@JSBowling2011 Without seeing a video of you, it will be hard to pinpoint, but if you are a pretty good bowler as is, my guess is your timing is probably pretty decent. Even if you don't need to use a wrist brace, if you have some issues cupping at least a little bit at the wrist, it MIGHT be a trick with your thumb. If you watch my "The importance of the thumb, part 1" video, I talk about how to ensure you have a proper fitting thumb, and how to hinge at the base of the thumb. You may already do this, but what you can do with that is by hinging at the base and pulling back (late in the video), you can create some cup without using any real muscle to do so. What I would then do is practice at the line with no-step or 1-step, short back swing, just focus on cupping by pulling with the thumb, and at the release point, release the thumb and roll it off your hand, thumb first, fingers second. It may not rev a lot with a short swing, but by feeling that roll off the hand, as you swing harder, and move into 1-step, 2-step, full-step, etc., you will hopefully notice more revolutions on the ball. In addition to my thumb video, I'll see if I can find a link to a good video of this practice I am talking about.
I thought you did a good job in your original video about this. I spend countless hours watching PBA pro's and the fact is, they are all over the map when it comes to mechanics. Humans are not robots and there is more than 1 way to skin a cat. If we all bowled the same and looked exactly the same, guys like Jason Belmonte would not have ever existed. People get in a herd mentality and just follow the crowd. Often, the greatest come from outside the herd. I used to get paralysis by analysis when it came to mechanics. It didn't make me better, it hurt my game. I was so caught up in trying to look like this guy or that guy, and trying to have what everyone was saying is perfect mechanics, that I lost the natural athleticism that I possessed. I was overthinking at every turn. I finally stopped listening to the noise and stopped the paralysis by analysis and my game took off like never before. I told myself that I have to be me and even if it is not how so many say it is supposed to look like, at the end of the day, what matters is the scoreboard. I just shot a 768 series yesterday and nobody was being critical of my mechanics after that. Sometimes the bowling community can be absolutely toxic. Keep doing your thing.
Listen your instruction has more sense than any instructor or online video I've ever seen. Don't listen to any hater and keep doing you. Your helping us struggling
Thank you
You are doing fine. Keep teaching , you have explained things way better than most. Thank you
I appreciate that.
Praise be, your teaching video is so clear. Bowling jargon, often confusing to me, is kept to a minimum. Plenty of varied examples isolate and develop your point. The question of cupping/coiling and flattening/uncoiling the wrist seems so fundamental to bowling that it’s surprising that it’s received such short shrift on RUclips. Kudos to the Bald Brothers for devoting this and other videos to this one subject.
Thank you. I do strive to make things more understandable. Glad you found it helpful.
Love your videos. Definately one of the top 3 go to bowling sites on youtube! Your teaching is excellent. You make understanding and implementing exercises vs the “pros” videos which assume we all can do what they do! ….dont stop. Great work. We know everyones different…..your input os extremely valuable!!!
I so appreciate that. That's exactly what I am going for.
Honestly your original video is what helped me get the first step into allowing me to hook a ball with a thumb in the ball. I was struggling for a long time, not understanding the concept. It's definitely a good starting point for anyone wanting to learn how to get a hook on the ball for one hand, thumb in.
I appreciate that
I believe it's very important for new bowlers to understand that if you are "cupping" in a forced way and you notice pain in the wrist that's bad. As you analyze these pros you will see most of them are flat wrist on the back swing. The cup happens naturally because if you "hang" for a second at your apex the ball will start to fall before your arm which will cup the wrist naturally then following behind it with a slight elbow bend keeps you more naturally cupped without any force of "picking the ball up to cup it" then you collapse the elbow and your wrist at release. There should be NO PAIN. If there is you should wait longer for the ball to fall naturally from your apex. I struggled with pain for many months learning the pro release because some coaches were teaching the "cup" method and it's wrong if it hurts. The ball weight and fall from apex creates a cup. Hope this helps someone as it did me.
I just want to make sure if anyone is struggling with wrist pain from cupping, do your push away, get to the apex and pause. Now you won't be able to hold the ball up in that position. The weight of the ball will cup your wrist as it starts to fall to the ground before your arm does. At this point you just hang behind it until release. All the weight is gone coming down and you are cupped without any force. It's a fantastic moment to realize how it works. A bit of thumb squeeze will help too until you can get use to it to start to relax your thumb pressure more.
Just hold your arm up in the air and watch how your wrist will fall into a cupped position. This happens during your apex as long as you wait for the ball to fall and don't pull down. As soon as you pull down you won't get behind the ball or cup without hurting your wrist.
That is a great analysis. One thing I say is that many who feel pain are trying to "curl" the ball to make the cup. They are typically doing two things wrong with that. One is that they may not have a proper fitting thumb, so they squeeze, and create that "curl" motion. They are essentially straining their wrist using muscles to get that shape. The other is that they aren't using gravity and the "weightless" moments, which is similar to what you are talking about. I appreciate you adding your analysis as that's a great way to look at that. Thank you.
@@baldbrothersbowling thank you! I love your content. And I love seeing bowling becoming more popular. Keep up the great work sir, I have learned a lot from you and I appreciate your time with your audience!
Love your videos, your previous ones on the yoyo and spiral with your over exaggerations have actually helped me. So thank you.
Quick tip if you were not aware of this on youtube, (and for future videos), when you are doing videos like this trying to. show frame by frame stuff, when the video is paused, if you press the period button . or the comma button , , it will actually move the video by frame.
I did not know that, so thank you for that tip. That will come in handy. Appreciate the comment.
Bad Bad Bowling 101 is a fun channel. I like that you gave Coach C some props.
Thanks for watching and the comments. Coaches C and Adam are good guys. I so appreciate that they reached out to me. I love talking bowling, and they know their stuff.
Thank you for all the videos of tips. I learned a lot from you. I've been trying to improve my release by watching your videos. I am fortunate to bowl in a league with many pros, and I watch them as well.
Great video breaking down how it looks for us! Thank you! The guys you pointed out are the ones i always look at when working on my form for sure!
I'm glad you showed Prather. His release is smooth like butter!
He has been one of my favs for a while now.
The thing that impresses me so much about Prather is the fact that his release is so damn smooth you don't even hear the ball hit the lane. Zero loft, zero noise, it's like butter!
@@ObjectiveEthics exactly why I like him!! He's been struggling lately. I hope he has a better year on tour.
Great explanation of the release. Can’t wait for the video using a wrist support. Thank you😃
Thanks. My buddy who has a wrist support is bringing to the first night of league so I can borrow it. Will probably record that sometime next week. Thanks for hanging in there.
Yeah youre doing good man…keep it coming.
I never really understood why people come to a channel to teach the teacher. Seems to me if they know then they would go elsewhere. Maybe thats just me. Keep the content coming man💪🏾💪🏾💪🏾
Appreciate you.
Great video and info. I'm from the old school, was yelled at don't break you wrist when you release ball. Man times have changed, now I just say yoyo release.😀
Thank you. Yes, I have such an extreme cup for that exact reason. I am almost 50 and we were taught to not break the wrist. Ideally, if you cannot do a yoyo release, maintaining a flat wrist is better than breaking it back, but if you can get the timing of rolling it off your hand with that change in the wrist, it will increase the Rev rate (if that's what you are going for).
@@baldbrothersbowling 73 years young here, still average in high 180's. Just got out of a bad slump, bowl on wood lanes destroyed my mental game. Not happening this year, still have speed for my age 12 to 14 mph.
@@marym470that is awesome
Good video and looking forward to the wrist support one. I use one, and cup my wrist, but I tend to turn the ball inwards towards my hip to prevent the ball from rolling over the thumb (high track bowler). Just recently started the yo-yo release. I've been working through a bowling injury and looks like I have radial tunnel issues and carpal tunnel. I've been using 12 lb balls, but just started buying 14 lb after a PSO forced me into a 13 lb and I realized that I can handle the weight (with the wrist support). I'm looking forward to getting them drilled and seeing what I've been missing from the fancy cores.
This type of release has been around since the 70's I believe. Don Johnson had a bowling video that taught this release. I think he referred to it as a yo yo release also, but also described it like throwing a frisbee.
Anyway, I've tried it in the past but I just can't do it. I would need practice and possibly take a bowling season off just to learn this release. I don't think I want to do that. I know I don't want to do that! I'm 61 years old and I'm quite happy with my firm wrist release.
Love this. I agree that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. I know some want to learn this so that is why I show it, but definitely be happy with what you do.
First of all, great content and explanation of technique so no need to apologize. Although there is not one way, there are definitely commonalities among the pros and HOF bowlers so these common traits have stood the test of time. You hit on many of them but there is one more which may be the key factor in "effortless" production of revs and it's the 3rd element of not only the yo yo but any pro release. So, cupped goes to uncapped and then to re-cupped. Re-cupped is the rev producer, makes the ball go longer and hook more where it should. The evidence is in the direction of the pro follow thru (which facilitates this slight counter clock wise hand motion) when measured from release to completion. If you did just this, even without cupping, uncupping, and or bent elbow, your revs have to increase due to the increased "pressure" this produces on the finger pads at release. Every bowler you used as an example had a follow thru that started lets say right ear to left ear. None follow thru down or right of the target line.
Appreciate that. I talk about the follow thru in my other video and wanted this one to focus on the cupping since some told me "never cup.". You are absolutely right that the follow thru is also key. I appreciate the watch and comment
Thank you thank you!
No, thank you for watching.
Thank you practiced today and your thoughts helped me
That is great to hear.
Good one. How about some lefty perspectives? like Packy, Jesper, Ryan Ciminelli, Parker Bohn III... cupping the wrist isn't necessary, but rev rate = power and power = more pin carry. Higher pin carry = higher scores and who doesn't want higher scores? 😊
Haven't you heard? The left is walled. Just throw it out there and you will strike. Lol. Just kidding. Yes, I should have included some left videos. You will see similar bend with Packy and Jesper as you do with the right handed 2-handers. I haven't watched a slow motion of Ryan Ciminelli, but pretty sure he cups and then uncups at the end. Bohn is more of a stroker and probably doesn't bend as much. I will have to watch some and maybe do a lefty only video. Thanks for the comment.
Question: In order to cup the wrist, does it in turn cause to squeeze the ball? I'm trying to have as free an arm swing as possible while still getting my fingers under the ball. I assume as the ball is at the top of the swing, the ball is weightless and that is when the ball is starting to be cupped at that slight delay on your down swing.
It will cause some people to squeeze, but it is important to not do that. Squeezing and cupping can cause wrist pain. You need to have a snug thumb, hinge at the base of the thumb, and pull back with the thumb to get that cup. Check out our video on the importance of the thumb, part 1. It highlights it here. Let me know if that helps.
Excellent
Thanks
Great analysis. They cup the wrist in order to get their fingers under the ball more
You got it
Thanx for the info
I don't really know what I'm doing yet. Yesterday, i bowled using your "pull back with thumb" to keep my wrist from breaking to the top of the ball. But since it was my first try on the lanes, I'm not sure how well I was doing. But I did go from like zero revs to significantly more but still way too low.
I'm not ready to try any yoyo stuff yet i don't think. Too many moving parts as a beginner to try to incorporate yet.
Yesterday was just trying to focus on the thumb pull back. This Thursday I'm going to try to add some more revs and see how that feels.
Right now my leg hurts so bad that I'm just standing at the line and throwing. So I'm lacking a bit in power and don't want to muscle the ball because people say not to do that.
Great to hear you saw something improve. You are right in that it's a lot of moving parts, and we always coach that people to focus on 1 thing at a time. Starting with the thumb thing is great. I would suggest thinking about the underhand football spiral for more of a beginner move. Especially if you have a hurt leg. It's a great way you can practice the motion at home. Even if you don't have someone to throw it to, do it in the backyard, or into a wall. If you can spiral the football tightly with a slight angle to the ball (nose not pointed straight ahead, but a little to the right so you have more of a 45-degree angle of the ball), then work on spiraling it tighter. If you can get that down, then try to take that technique to the bowling ball. I know the bowling ball is much heavier, and the thumb technique helps alleviate some of that, but if you think about what you did to spiral that football and get that same feel in the bowling ball, that might help. I wish I could be there in person to help you out, but hopefully these videos and notes help you work on these on your own. Good luck.
@@baldbrothersbowling I'm all the way in Warren Michigan.
About the "football spiral"... I thought people turn their hand and lift up with their fingers? Or is that basically the same thing as the spiral with the football?
I'll be practicing Thursday, so I'll try the spiral.
Mechanically it seems achievable and without a ball in my hand it feels like I can do it. The problem is as soon as I add some load, I can’t keep my wrist cupped in the swing or before release.
Do you have any advice, guidance or recommendations on how to build up the strength?
Is it just a case of hitting the gym and working on forearm/wrist strength exercises to build up the muscle strength? I really don’t know what else I could do.
Thank you for your question. While a stronger person does have an easier time with it (which is also why there are different weight balls), it's not really that much about strength. It COULD be an issue with your thumb fit (assuming you use your thumb). I have another video on my channel for "The Importance of the Thumb; Part 1." In this video, I talk about how you can tell if you have a proper fitting thumb, and how you hinge at the base knuckle of your thumb. This keeps you from grabbing the ball. Additionally, instead of "curling" your wrist as if your doing wrist curls in a gym, when the thumb is fit proper and you hinge proper, you actually pull back with the thumb to create the cup. This technique makes it feel like the ball is much less heavy. This is the reason you can find many smaller women and skinny guys still be able to do this. They aren't really using muscle, they are using technique. It's harder to explain here, but if you watch THAT video, it might give you some tips to try that will make it easier. If you STILL struggle with it, it COULD be that the ball is to heavy, but in all likelihood, it's more a thumb fit/hinge technique that is the culprit. Let me know how that goes.
Thoughts on keeping the ball up against the forearm though out the whole swing?
Are you a 1 or 2-hander? If 2-handed, I'm all for it. You will see a mix, even among the pros, where some are resting on the forearm the whole way, some are not on the forearm at all, and some start NOT on the forearm, but they move to the forearm during the swing. I believe that getting it onto your forearm is a great way to get further under the ball, as long as you are properly releasing the wrist and rolling the ball off the hand vs. coming all the way around and over the top of the ball. If you are 1-handed without a thumb, you pretty much have to rest it on your forearm (a-la Tom Daugherty). If you are 1-handed WITH your thumb, it is much more difficult to get the ball onto your forearm unless you rotate your wrist into an extremely loaded position (kind of like Butturf). If you do this, you have to be very careful to make sure you uncoil the wrist at release, otherwise being in THAT loaded of a position, you do run the risk of spinning the ball. So bottom line is, I think without the thumb, it's a good idea, but if you use the thumb, I would try to accomplish the release without going quite to the extreme of getting the ball to the forearm. I hope that helps.
@ This helps a ton thank you so much!!!! I’m 2 handed and have been back in forth on doing it and not doing it. I just need to learn the proper uncoil position
There is a distinction (IMO) between cupped and cocked that is subtle but enough to make the two releases different. BJ Moore and Wes Malott's releases gravitate more toward the cocked to uncocked whereas a Mitch Hupe is pure cupped to uncupped. One is a frizzbee release (cocked to uncocked) and the other the YoYo (cupped to uncupped. Of course, in between the above mentioned examples, there are as many combinations of cocked/cupped as there are pro bowlers.
(You cannot throw a fizzbee by cupping and uncupping further illustrating the difference nor work a yo yo by cocking uncocking)
So, is there 3 releases?
Cocked
Cupped
Hybrid of both?
You are 100% correct. In some of the other videos I have done, I discuss that distinction. Cupping helps you get below the equator or under the ball, while cocking helps get your fingers on the inside portion of the ball. Ideally, you will have a hybrid of both to some degree as that can maximize the rev rate and get you in good tilt and angle of rotation. When someone does both well, I like to consider that a "coiled" release. So instead of just cocking and uncocking or cupping and uncupping, I like motion that is coiled to uncoiled. As you said, there are degrees of how much someone will do each, thus creating the differences we see in many styles. It is also good for those that can control each to make minor hand position adjustments. For example, if you cup, but your cocking is minimal, and you stay behind the ball, you will be more forward in your roll and/or have less tilt. If you cock it more, you will come around it more and increase your angle of rotation, and possibly increase tilt. These changes can change how your ball reacts which in tournament situations on sport shots is sometimes better than moving or switching balls. All that said, I like a release that incorporates both to some degree, if done properly without creating strain. One of my favorite 2-handers to watch is the young Ryan Barnes. Most 2-handers cup their wrist and actually lay the ball on their forearm a little. He also cocks his wrist better than most I have seen, and I think it helps him create such a powerful roll. His dad is also a king of the cocked wrist to get inside the ball. I like that cocking motion to get inside the ball because I see too many people who try to get inside the ball with their entire hand. While some pros are good at this, many amateurs who do this end up wrapping all the way around the ball and spinning it, where cocking the wrist and then uncoiling it I feel is easier to control. That is a great observation on your part. Thank you for the comment.
The start of the yo yo release starts after the push away....
When using a yo yo, remember the yo yo will always return to you with the same speed you released it with, your back swing is like releasing the yo yo to the floor, your down swing and release are pulling the yo yo back to your hand, and as with a yo yo, you can't force the yo yo or yank the yo yo, you have to relax your fingers and follow thru all the way...
People are confused when you say yo yo release, with a real yo yo you start by releasing the yo yo by flexing your wrist towards the floor to start, the yo yo release taught for bowling only shows the down swing and in yo yo terms "bringing the yo yo back to you"
I broke my arm swing down and this is the simplest way I can explain it...
Hope this helps someone understand 🙏🏿💪🏾🙏🏿
The push away is important, but the yo yo release in bowling is really referring to what your hand and wrist do right at the release only. When you release the yo yo, you straighten your arm and uncoil the wrist. Same with the downswing and release in bowling. The push away is really irrelevant to accomplishing a bowling yo yo release.
Great vid bro
Thank you
@Baldbrothers: What would be great is if a bowler, as much as they try, cannot get their elbow to bend or wrist to cup at the release point, then how can they create a release with more power?
I will be putting out a video using a wrist brace to prevent the wrist chip and will address that there. Hopefully will record that in the next week or two.
@@baldbrothersbowling that's great what about a bowler like myself who's pretty good but can't get into the bent elbow position and I don't need to use a wrist brace how can I get more power with a better release.
@@JSBowling2011 Without seeing a video of you, it will be hard to pinpoint, but if you are a pretty good bowler as is, my guess is your timing is probably pretty decent. Even if you don't need to use a wrist brace, if you have some issues cupping at least a little bit at the wrist, it MIGHT be a trick with your thumb. If you watch my "The importance of the thumb, part 1" video, I talk about how to ensure you have a proper fitting thumb, and how to hinge at the base of the thumb. You may already do this, but what you can do with that is by hinging at the base and pulling back (late in the video), you can create some cup without using any real muscle to do so. What I would then do is practice at the line with no-step or 1-step, short back swing, just focus on cupping by pulling with the thumb, and at the release point, release the thumb and roll it off your hand, thumb first, fingers second. It may not rev a lot with a short swing, but by feeling that roll off the hand, as you swing harder, and move into 1-step, 2-step, full-step, etc., you will hopefully notice more revolutions on the ball. In addition to my thumb video, I'll see if I can find a link to a good video of this practice I am talking about.
@@baldbrothersbowling Did you happen to see the video link I sent you? Jim
ruclips.net/user/shorts7PHOWi-eb8U?si=ZdDSHv0VwY7MiKjJ
I hurt my wrist and had to stop throwing it that way. I’m 65 ball is 15 lbs
Sorry to hear that. Wrist issues are no fun. I have arthritis in my wrist, and I feel like that day may come for me.
@@baldbrothersbowling I have it in my fingers and knuckles. My bowling days may be numbered. I will probably get a 12 lb ball see if it helps
Good luck to you.
I thought you did a good job in your original video about this.
I spend countless hours watching PBA pro's and the fact is, they are all over the map when it comes to mechanics. Humans are not robots and there is more than 1 way to skin a cat.
If we all bowled the same and looked exactly the same, guys like Jason Belmonte would not have ever existed.
People get in a herd mentality and just follow the crowd. Often, the greatest come from outside the herd.
I used to get paralysis by analysis when it came to mechanics. It didn't make me better, it hurt my game. I was so caught up in trying to look like this guy or that guy, and trying to have what everyone was saying is perfect mechanics, that I lost the natural athleticism that I possessed. I was overthinking at every turn.
I finally stopped listening to the noise and stopped the paralysis by analysis and my game took off like never before. I told myself that I have to be me and even if it is not how so many say it is supposed to look like, at the end of the day, what matters is the scoreboard.
I just shot a 768 series yesterday and nobody was being critical of my mechanics after that.
Sometimes the bowling community can be absolutely toxic. Keep doing your thing.
I appreciate all of that. Thank you. Great shooting.
Mom meatloaf
Love it.
THANK YOU B BROTHER