it’s so frustrating that this slides by because it should be just as weird. if a main character is 18-20, their love interests should not be 300+ years older but just have stopped aging at 25-30 😡
I think the biggest difference is that Miller’s girl depicts a girl in high school, so she’s undoubtedly a teenager, having a relationship with her teacher, a grown ass man. There’s an explicit power imbalance, Jenna looks super young and Martin looks super old, and there’s the whole plot line of Jenna’s characters falsely accusing him of SA. While The Idea of You has a guy in his 20s, aka an adult, having a relationship with a random older woman. We could argue that there’s a power imbalance, but it’s not as explicit and it’s debatable, and they’re both adults, played by actors who look adults. Also regarding Miller’s girl, because of the actors appearances, the semiotics can be read as a guy clearly in his 50s having sexual interests towards a girl that if you told me she was 15 I would totally believe it. And depicting Jenna’s character as an antagonist who falsely accuses man of SA while in real life victims are continuously target of disbelief, to the point of being sued for defamation by more powerful perpetrators, can be viewed as poor tasted. At least in my opinion, the movie also seems to not view Martin’s character’s actions as that bad, even though he clearly was interested in Jenna’s character and was aroused by her midterm essay, the movie views him as a victim of the circumstances, who was manipulated by a teenager because she’s just so evil and he was lonely
interesting perspective! there's another comment that points out that though the guy is younger in the idea of you he does have power and fame by being famous. his fame is why they cant be together. whereas in miller's girl, i don't think it is clear what cairo actually says happened between her and the english teacher. i think she just shares her story with the school administrator and its damning enough that the teacher let it get that far. I'm in no way defending what the teacher did. he should never have allowed her feelings to obviously grow like that, but i think its a far more complex and interesting a story than the love at first sight of the idea of you!
@alilbitmads I think that millers girl has a more intricate plot ect because it is a drama, the idea of you is a rom com. Harry styles in that is like 24, so like a full adult even with the 15 year age gap, and he arguably has more power than Anne Hathaway by being a pop star. Also casting wise Anne Hathaway is stunning and youthful looking and I don't remember his name really looks like an old man ? Tbh, while I get the point the films have clear differences and I think that millers girl wanted us to be disgusted?
I dated older when I was 16-18 and didn’t realize how whack it was until I was 23-now. I guess trope bothers me when it’s presented as no big deal or a good thing. But I think I’d find it interesting if the text explored the toxicity/dangers/immorality of it. I haven’t seen Miller’s Girl but I might now.
it was so normalized when I was younger! the trope bothers me now more in fantasy when its a 300 year old dude dating an 18 year old but its fine "because he looks young" hes still WAY TOO OLD??
I think dating a 18 year old as an old fart is disgusting and that's why I hated Miller's girl. In the idea of you the guy was at least not a teenager.
but they dont date in millers girl? the second that cairo crosses that boundary directly the teacher shuts her down. yes, there are fantasies around it in the movie, but i think the film isn't trying to paint them as a good thing, if that makes sense.
@@alilbitmadsTo me it seemed like a little love affair even if it wasn't sexual yet the teased (dream or not) kiss proves it was romantic in nature :/ that the book under the roofs of paris features sexual scenes with underage characters makes this more concerning to me and as the movie was erotic and not educational in nature it was just not my cup of tea.. 😅 If she was at least in her 20s and not in highschool I would have a different opinion though 😂
i enjoyed ezra/aria thoroughly when i was a teenager but when i went back to watch it again as an adult i was incredibly wigged out (especially knowing what ezra character knows in later seasons)
@@alilbitmads *shrug* Even as a teen I thought it was creepy. I had to drop the Vampire Academy series for the same reason once I realized Rose/Dimitri was the endgame ship. Then again, I'm ace, so most book romances make me a little uncomfortable XD
To me I think it lies in how the age gap is framed by the story, and also when in the character's life the age gap relationship is happening. To me, at least, it's very different to have a romance with an adult that's much younger than you than to have a romance with a teen that's much younger than you. Age gaps between adults might still be taboo to a certain degree, but they're still both adults and they're at least at a similar level when it comes to experiences and maturity, all that stuff. Because the difference in maturity with teenagers is just SO obvious to me! I'm pretty young, I'm 19, and last year I was in a writing workshop with other teens who were all between 14-16 years old, and talking to them I could immediately tell they were younger than me, even though when talking to me they thought I was their age! So I can't imagine someone in a romance with a teen 20 years younger than them not noticing that gap, and not feeling like it would be weird to act on those romantic feelings. Kind of a rant, but I went on it to explain my point, because even though I don’t particularly find huge age gaps appealing indistinct of if the characters are both adults, I think this difference is what probably made people like one story better than the other, even if Cairo's age was left ambiguous. However, that doesn't mean age gaps between adults and teens shouldn't be depicted! As I said, the framing is also important part of it, and if the story frames it in a way in which you can tell it's not endorsing it, then I don't see an issue. Be critical of the media you consume and all that. From what you told, I don’t think Miller's Girl is endorsing the age gap but rather using it to tell a story between two characters that are clearly troubled, and the criticism comes mostly from people who don't see that and think depicting that kind of age gap is just inherently wrong. I haven't watched either movie though, because they don't seem like something I'm interested in lol, so maybe I'd have a different opinion if I did watch it... Those are my thoughts on it, a little jumbled, and sorry if some stuff is worded weirdly, English isn't my first language :'^)
well put! i do think the piece of media has the job of showcasing how harmful an age can be and i think millers girl does just that especially bc of how much power the teacher has over the student. i think people reacted poorly to it bc of how stylized the movie is tho.
❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤ I can't get on board with Age Gap when it's with a minor. Especially Teacher/Student... it makes my skin crawl with how much trust is being betrayed. Other than that, it isn't super exciting for me but there's nothing wrong with it if it works. Though, I will point out that I find it implausible when centuries old creatures are suddenly supposed to be in love with eighteen year olds. It's an uphill climb for the writer in convincing me that it works...
my ex gf is 12 years older than me, but that wasnt a problem for me personally because we were both aware of the power dynamic and she was almost disgustingly careful and respectful about it akjhfksjhfsd which i highly appreciated. i think if that sort of detail is kept in mind and made sure that all parties involved are aware of and respect the power dynamics and work to make it equal, i think it doesnt really matter that much so long as both parties are well into adulthood anyhow. (read: not freshly 18 or whatever disgusting shit people might think of)
that’s awesome that she was very careful around that power dynamic! i do think age gaps between people above 25+ is usually perfectly fine unless the older person is like your boss or something.
I haven't seen either of these movies, but I think this is an interesting topic! In general, I don't mind an age gap as long as both people are consenting adults. But recently, I've noticed a lot of people dislike media that contains something they find problematic, regardless of how that piece of media discusses that topic. I think student teacher relationships happen, even if they shouldn't, and therefore can be worth exploring in film. Especially in a film that shows why/how these relationships develop and why/how they become harmful.
i definitely think there’s a mindset now that all age gap relationships are bad especially if there is an older male partner. it’s progress for sure but almost feels too reactionary.
Idk. I haven't seen either movie, but The Idea of You just kind of sounds vaguely like the white women's version of How Stella Got Her Groove Back. I don't recall people complaining about that film, but tbf it was a bit before my time I think, so i could have just missed it.
i totally agree. millers girl does a good job of showing the protagonists sharing a love of the written word but because of cairos naïveté and the teachers hubris they ended up getting into some murky waters very quickly.
![Megan Thee Stallion - Roc Steady (feat. Flo Milli) [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/HozPPyqW0dY/mqdefault.jpg)
I've heard this said before, 'Being attracted to maturity is normal, being attracted to immaturity is not'.
oooh that really hits! I think thats why i dont get the idea of you! it just doesn't make sense why she falls for the young guy other than he's rich?
i dont mind age gaps only if both parties have a fully developed frontal cortex
valid
It also brings up problems in mythical persons who are well over a thousand years old but looks age appropriate MC.
it’s so frustrating that this slides by because it should be just as weird. if a main character is 18-20, their love interests should not be 300+ years older but just have stopped aging at 25-30 😡
I think the biggest difference is that Miller’s girl depicts a girl in high school, so she’s undoubtedly a teenager, having a relationship with her teacher, a grown ass man. There’s an explicit power imbalance, Jenna looks super young and Martin looks super old, and there’s the whole plot line of Jenna’s characters falsely accusing him of SA. While The Idea of You has a guy in his 20s, aka an adult, having a relationship with a random older woman. We could argue that there’s a power imbalance, but it’s not as explicit and it’s debatable, and they’re both adults, played by actors who look adults.
Also regarding Miller’s girl, because of the actors appearances, the semiotics can be read as a guy clearly in his 50s having sexual interests towards a girl that if you told me she was 15 I would totally believe it. And depicting Jenna’s character as an antagonist who falsely accuses man of SA while in real life victims are continuously target of disbelief, to the point of being sued for defamation by more powerful perpetrators, can be viewed as poor tasted. At least in my opinion, the movie also seems to not view Martin’s character’s actions as that bad, even though he clearly was interested in Jenna’s character and was aroused by her midterm essay, the movie views him as a victim of the circumstances, who was manipulated by a teenager because she’s just so evil and he was lonely
Also, with The Idea of You, the guy is a celebrity. That gives him his own kind of power in the relationship since he's in the public eye
interesting perspective! there's another comment that points out that though the guy is younger in the idea of you he does have power and fame by being famous. his fame is why they cant be together.
whereas in miller's girl, i don't think it is clear what cairo actually says happened between her and the english teacher. i think she just shares her story with the school administrator and its damning enough that the teacher let it get that far. I'm in no way defending what the teacher did. he should never have allowed her feelings to obviously grow like that, but i think its a far more complex and interesting a story than the love at first sight of the idea of you!
@alilbitmads I think that millers girl has a more intricate plot ect because it is a drama, the idea of you is a rom com. Harry styles in that is like 24, so like a full adult even with the 15 year age gap, and he arguably has more power than Anne Hathaway by being a pop star. Also casting wise Anne Hathaway is stunning and youthful looking and I don't remember his name really looks like an old man ? Tbh, while I get the point the films have clear differences and I think that millers girl wanted us to be disgusted?
I dated older when I was 16-18 and didn’t realize how whack it was until I was 23-now. I guess trope bothers me when it’s presented as no big deal or a good thing. But I think I’d find it interesting if the text explored the toxicity/dangers/immorality of it. I haven’t seen Miller’s Girl but I might now.
it was so normalized when I was younger! the trope bothers me now more in fantasy when its a 300 year old dude dating an 18 year old but its fine "because he looks young" hes still WAY TOO OLD??
I think dating a 18 year old as an old fart is disgusting and that's why I hated Miller's girl. In the idea of you the guy was at least not a teenager.
but they dont date in millers girl? the second that cairo crosses that boundary directly the teacher shuts her down. yes, there are fantasies around it in the movie, but i think the film isn't trying to paint them as a good thing, if that makes sense.
@@alilbitmadsTo me it seemed like a little love affair even if it wasn't sexual yet the teased (dream or not) kiss proves it was romantic in nature :/ that the book under the roofs of paris features sexual scenes with underage characters makes this more concerning to me and as the movie was erotic and not educational in nature it was just not my cup of tea.. 😅 If she was at least in her 20s and not in highschool I would have a different opinion though 😂
To be fair, I hated the Ezra/Aria part of Pretty Little Liars right from the get-go
i enjoyed ezra/aria thoroughly when i was a teenager but when i went back to watch it again as an adult i was incredibly wigged out (especially knowing what ezra character knows in later seasons)
@@alilbitmads *shrug* Even as a teen I thought it was creepy. I had to drop the Vampire Academy series for the same reason once I realized Rose/Dimitri was the endgame ship. Then again, I'm ace, so most book romances make me a little uncomfortable XD
To me I think it lies in how the age gap is framed by the story, and also when in the character's life the age gap relationship is happening. To me, at least, it's very different to have a romance with an adult that's much younger than you than to have a romance with a teen that's much younger than you. Age gaps between adults might still be taboo to a certain degree, but they're still both adults and they're at least at a similar level when it comes to experiences and maturity, all that stuff. Because the difference in maturity with teenagers is just SO obvious to me! I'm pretty young, I'm 19, and last year I was in a writing workshop with other teens who were all between 14-16 years old, and talking to them I could immediately tell they were younger than me, even though when talking to me they thought I was their age! So I can't imagine someone in a romance with a teen 20 years younger than them not noticing that gap, and not feeling like it would be weird to act on those romantic feelings. Kind of a rant, but I went on it to explain my point, because even though I don’t particularly find huge age gaps appealing indistinct of if the characters are both adults, I think this difference is what probably made people like one story better than the other, even if Cairo's age was left ambiguous. However, that doesn't mean age gaps between adults and teens shouldn't be depicted! As I said, the framing is also important part of it, and if the story frames it in a way in which you can tell it's not endorsing it, then I don't see an issue. Be critical of the media you consume and all that. From what you told, I don’t think Miller's Girl is endorsing the age gap but rather using it to tell a story between two characters that are clearly troubled, and the criticism comes mostly from people who don't see that and think depicting that kind of age gap is just inherently wrong. I haven't watched either movie though, because they don't seem like something I'm interested in lol, so maybe I'd have a different opinion if I did watch it... Those are my thoughts on it, a little jumbled, and sorry if some stuff is worded weirdly, English isn't my first language :'^)
well put! i do think the piece of media has the job of showcasing how harmful an age can be and i think millers girl does just that especially bc of how much power the teacher has over the student. i think people reacted poorly to it bc of how stylized the movie is tho.
❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
I can't get on board with Age Gap when it's with a minor. Especially Teacher/Student... it makes my skin crawl with how much trust is being betrayed. Other than that, it isn't super exciting for me but there's nothing wrong with it if it works. Though, I will point out that I find it implausible when centuries old creatures are suddenly supposed to be in love with eighteen year olds. It's an uphill climb for the writer in convincing me that it works...
yeah when they “look” young but are actually old af is just poor character development tbh
my ex gf is 12 years older than me, but that wasnt a problem for me personally because we were both aware of the power dynamic and she was almost disgustingly careful and respectful about it akjhfksjhfsd which i highly appreciated. i think if that sort of detail is kept in mind and made sure that all parties involved are aware of and respect the power dynamics and work to make it equal, i think it doesnt really matter that much so long as both parties are well into adulthood anyhow. (read: not freshly 18 or whatever disgusting shit people might think of)
that’s awesome that she was very careful around that power dynamic! i do think age gaps between people above 25+ is usually perfectly fine unless the older person is like your boss or something.
@@alilbitmads fully agree with that!
“Erotic intellectual relationship” is, truly, goals 😂
tbh it was what tantalized me about the film. is it Absolutely Ridiculous? Yes. but i don't care!
I haven't seen either of these movies, but I think this is an interesting topic! In general, I don't mind an age gap as long as both people are consenting adults. But recently, I've noticed a lot of people dislike media that contains something they find problematic, regardless of how that piece of media discusses that topic. I think student teacher relationships happen, even if they shouldn't, and therefore can be worth exploring in film. Especially in a film that shows why/how these relationships develop and why/how they become harmful.
i definitely think there’s a mindset now that all age gap relationships are bad especially if there is an older male partner. it’s progress for sure but almost feels too reactionary.
I saw that the idea of you and I thought I was cute, but I’d love to hear other peoples thoughts on it as well.
Idk. I haven't seen either movie, but The Idea of You just kind of sounds vaguely like the white women's version of How Stella Got Her Groove Back. I don't recall people complaining about that film, but tbf it was a bit before my time I think, so i could have just missed it.
I just don’t get what an 18 year old would have in common with a 46 year old 🤷🏼♀️
i totally agree. millers girl does a good job of showing the protagonists sharing a love of the written word but because of cairos naïveté and the teachers hubris they ended up getting into some murky waters very quickly.
👍✌️🙏❤