USN and Retired Merchant Marine Engineer... I almost fell out of my chair laughing to hear someone suggest an engineroom or powder magazine.... I like your choice, above the waterline, well inboard, good access, and probably some of the best ventilation on the ship.
"I almost fell out of my chair laughing" Sure, whatever, just remember that there was a time when you had no clue what the safest place was either until somebody explained it to you. YOu didn't like it when they told you you where an idiot, why are you telling others this now? Did you learn nothing?
My Grandfather was a master in the Boiler Room he walked out on the deck from the library rite when the 16's went off for training in Korea and said he bled from every hole in his body. Also had a shell run rite down the deck. Traded hooch they made on the steampipes for steaks from the cooks. Loved listening to his stories. By the way he was on the Mighty Mo in Korea for 16 months.
One alternative is the steering gear compartment...while outside the citadel box, it still has pretty good armor for protecting the vital steering engines, and there are nearby trunks to get you topside quickly (only three decks above). The bad thing is ready aviation gas is stored just aft, but that might well be dumped overboard if the ship was going into action.
As a former A-Gang crew member, I always felt like aft steering was fairly well protected with the exceptions of being below the water line and only one way in/out. I remember thinking what if an armored hatch counter weight system was damaged 😬.
Retired senior chief IC here. I concur. Also, since the main gyro compass is in the space (always was on the 6 ships I served on), the space is on the exact centerline of the ship so there's the added depth protection. Another consideration is the ability to listen in on all the various phone and intercom circuits so you would have a pretty good idea of what's really going on topside. Cheers.
@@jamesstark8316 yupper. you can see the WSN-5 off to the side when they pan around. for listening in, great thing about the later ships with IVCS an/stc-II, can over ride and listen in on every net, and every single phone.
This channel is a goldmine. I toured the Iowa and the Wisconsin, but never got the info they show here. Hell, I don't know anyone who served on a battleship and living on an aircraft carrier is not the same
I liked the location of the Photo Lab on Forestall /Kityhawk class carriers. 3rd deck right underneith Medical. Easy ladder up to the 2nd deck plus a secondary egress through the Print Shop on the port side.
I’d probably go with either the bow or stern AA mounts, sure you’re nearly naked in terms of armor, but if there’s an enemy firing, they’re probably aiming amidship and not for me.
Aft Emergency steering. It is at the end of the ship, out of the general line of fire. It is well armored, plenty of splinter protection and can with all but the biggest shells. It is at or above the water line and has more than one way in and out. There are a few passageways and ladders to the main deck.
7:56 - got me thinking. Does Ryan, Libby or any of the other staff ever use some of the interior ladders as shortcuts between decks? For instance "oh I need to go to the ward room from the IC room, oh let me just pop through the floor of the ward room for this meeting." On a side note - How does the exhaust from FWD EMER DIESEL & DIST PLANT make it out of the ship? Does it just get routed over to FIRE ROOM 1 ?
It's typically piped as directly as possible out of the ship horizontally, through the hull. Depending on the distance, a fan using a venturi effect may be in place to help. Don't want products of combustion to go directly through a fan.
He sold me on this room. Air conditioning in the South Pacific. Enough said. I think the powder magazine would be good, though. You are well protected, and if an enemy shell gets through the armor and detonates the powder it will be over before you know it. This room is next to one of the turrets. I guess if the magazines explode under him I suspect getting off of the ship will NOT be an issue since you would get blown into orbit :)
I think I'd like to be just below the main deck right next to a barbette on the opposite side the battleship is being engaged from (assuming this is a ship-to-ship gun battle). You'd get double the armor protection from the far and near sides of the barbette, some overhead protection from plunging fire from the turret above, and still be in an area where you could quickly get to the main deck in the event of having to abandon ship.
Love the logic of your choice of the safest place. I’ve never thought there would actually be a place that was significantly safer than another, given 3,200 lb shells, 1,000 lb bombs, and torpedos incoming with malice. Glad your choice was never tested during wartime.
The most senior officer to survive from Bismarck said that when Hood exploded a cheer went up in the ship but I'll dare bet the older hands thought "there but for the grace of God go I". Must have been terrifying with pure luck your best friend.
I think it depends a lot on what type of engagement you are in (and especially which side you are on). In a lot of engagements the outcome was pretty much clear from the beginning. Like Bismarck vs KGV and Rodney. On Bismarck you'd want to be somewhere armoured, but still relatively high up with an easy way out. You know you can't win amd that you have to get out at some point. On KGV you'd be perfectly fine in the magazine. Even if Bismarck scores a hit, it's the best place to survive. And if Bismarck is very lucky again, it really doesn't matter.
My placement. 3rd deck aft dry cleaning shop. Deep enough in the ship to protect from most direct fire. Away from all powder or ammo rooms and gun turrets. Above the water line. Above high armored steering rooms to protect from torpedoes blasts. Right next to ladder to direct up to main deck.
I vote for the engine room below the waterline and gamble the escape trunks are not blocked. It reminds me of a friend who joined the Coast Guard to avoid being an infantryman in Vietnam and ended up on one of those river patrol boats on the Mekong.
I'd probably go with something at one of the extreme ends of the ship, something like the Nixie room. It's unarmored but it's also at the extreme end, and since most shots would probably be aimed at the center of the ship, the likelihood of getting hit all the way back at the extreme aft of the ship is probably fairly small.
I would like to point out for consideration the enemies ability to hit where they are aiming is likely very small. Most shots end up missing. Most shots come from very long ranges where minor variations of wind speed and or steering of the ship will have a huge effect on the shots. Shots coming from 20 miles away take a long time to get there (like 15 to 30 seconds) giving plenty of time for a ship to change course.
On the 2nd Deck, almost completely aft there is a tiny compartment labelled 'unassigned'. That's where I think would be best. Reasoning:- If it's unassigned, it's not named. If it doesn't have a name, it doesn't exist (everything, and I mean everything has a name in the military). If it doesn't exist, the enemy can't hit it. However, if it doesn't exist, might be tricky to find when needed!! On 2nd thoughts, I'll just stick to my submarine!
That battle damage report at 4:09 is quite interesting. Feels to me they would have been better off firing HE, or they were but their fuse/detonators were quite bad, overall a lot more damage could have been done. I've honestly no idea why a cruiser would even try to use AP on a battleship unless they didn't quite know what they were shooting at. 8 inch shells ie 203mm in real units is very heavy artillery on land easily able to collapse a house on a near hit so you can imagine what a HE 203mm would do if it didn't just fly right through both sides of the superstructure and exploded inside instead.
I don't know , how about the absolute front at the bow ? I mean think about it , how may navel gunners go out of the way to shoot off the bow ? Now running into other ships , that's another problem but the scenario here is a shooting war and I can't remember any ships that got hit in the very front part of the bow .
I'm a radio operator so, comms/radio room. I'd want to know what's going on out there and be able to communicate with the other ships in the group. Plus it is critical space and armored e.t.c.
Hiya Ryan great video thank you. Although, I agree where you suggest makes sense. I do have a couple of issues with that area.... 1. electrical / communication wires have coverings and generally when they go on fire you get lots of smoke which tends to not be good for you. and 2. Like you. I have an issue with just one door to exit. Which gets me thinking and a question for you all or for those who have served on warships in general. You can only exit somewhere if you can open the door. Sure those doors are blast proof (depending on where in the ship) and certainly watertight. If a blast is near them, Can it in fact lock or bend the door so that it cannot be opened?. I assume most doors on a warship are watertight rather than blast proof except for main critical areas. Or if a shell hits near them does it instead tend to just blow them off or pass through them if a direct hit ?. Keep safe and well everyone :)
Lessee, obviously you wouldn't want to be in any of the firerooms or engine rooms (you really don't want to be around ruptured high pressure steam pipes), same for being near the stack uptakes. 2-143-2-M, Marine Small Arms Locker. In the hull, well away from anything that has the most potential to rupture, away from the easy targets of the conning tower and dead center of the ship, works for me.
As an ICC I would also pick that space. Well protected because it has the gyro compasses that tells the CO where they are pointing and the 1MC (talk to the crew). Great space to be safe until someone comes along side you and blows up. Also happened
Truly interesting. Thanks, Ryan. Whilst I have your attention, I read your channel content. I thought the USS Wisconsin (BB 63) was the longest, after the postwar collision with a destroyer. I understand the Iowas to be 887'3" o.a. The Wisconsin in its repair had the bow of the incomplete USS Kentucky (BB 64) grafted in place of the damage the ship sustained. Is this correct? Happy Holidays to you and yours!
He's already covered that. And no, that is not true. Wisconsin's main deck is her original. Only 2nd deck down was replaced. She's within a half an inch difference of her pre-collision length.
@@Cirux321 I read that the repair had added 10". Thank you twice, one for your prompt response and next for your information. Happy Holidays to you and yours.
I would stay on the tip of the bow or the most astern region. Not much there that would cause an AP round to ignite. Most of the shells are aimed at the center and would probably straddle in around the 80% of the ships length around there. Easy to get away there. On Bismarck the most forward hit seems to have gone trough the deck near the chains. The stern section would have been a bad place due to the construction issues, however.
If the conning tower extend slightly below deck wouldn't that give you the benefits of the armored deck as well as the conning tower for projectiles coming in at an angle
Main armour deck is actually inside the Hull. Not much conning from their to be had. Most conning towers are partially covered at the front by Turret 2. KGV is one of the few classes that has its maindeck a deck higher (still hull) because the RN decided several weight savings (like the 11 + 12th 14" gun and the conning tower) where a good trade off for more volume / buoyancy in the citadel.
Is that a Univac computer ? Please tell some more about the compute equipment on board, I grew up on what I call the second generation of 8 bit home computers, and are interested in computer history and their practical usage Love your content, if I ever in get in your neighborhood I will come visit.
My suggestion for the safest place on an Iowa is either the spotters float plane or helicopter. Well out of harms way and if the ship goes down I could fly to another ship or land and in the float plane on the water. You are right about the shock Ryan. The heavy gun emplacements on the Atlantic wall were impenetrable however the shock of the artillery strikes wounded or killed the occupants.
I would be in Broadway which is in the heart of the citadel! There are multiple vertical exits out of Broadway going fore and aft and repair party crews located in Broadway means medical personnel are present.
Well statistically most of the hits if you look at multiple ships batte damage reports is in the forward half of the ship and in particular between the super firing turret and the forward superstructure thake the lion's share of the hits so you probably want to be somewhere in the aft half of the ship speaking in general terms without getting into specific compartments
Love these vids, thanks. I am close to Fall River, MA and have visited battleship Massachusetts numerous times. I am most curious how they aim and fire the 16" guns. I would think there are a huge variety of factors that come into play including pitch, roll & yaw, plus the ship (and the enemy's ship) is likely turning... and there may be some delay when firing the powder charge, etc, etc, etc. How did they coordinate all of those various factors so that the projectile traveled down the barrel at precisely the right moment?? Maybe you've done a vid already?
Most of ship above main armor belt & deck vulnerable to all sorts of shells smaller than battle ship guns. Superstructure & weather deck open to aircraft bombs & strafing (USN strafed Yamato). That being said, superstructure not a bad place in a couple of Battleship v battleship, long range, main gun duel. There's only a few albeit large shells flying but the number of hits will be small. IMO BB NJ would have an advantage with its 16"/50 cal guns, superior fire control and its speed & maneuverability allowing NJ to dictate the range. Deep in hull, torpedoes and flooding can occur with wreckage blocking deck hatches. Your choice is a good one. Protected fairly well, reasonable escape & as comms center you'd prob have a good idea of what's happening.
Compared to a battleship you are the size of an ant on a semi. Any single large shell or torpedo has almost no chance of hitting you directly, but you have a high chance of blowing up if it strikes near explosives. So I say you are best in a spot that can stop rapid fire projectiles from penetrating and you can get out quickly if the ship starts sinking or fills up with smoke.
5:20 yeah anyone inside Hood's number 3 turbine room were already dead by the time the 15" magazine ruptured and blew the Hood sky high The explosion of the fatal 15" shell would have killed them
I pretty sure the conning tower of KMS Bismarck with a similar thickness it’s conning tower was penetrated by 16 Inch shel from HMS Rodney and those were of less velocity that the 16 inch mk 7 on Iowa class.
Probably, but if your enemy is as close to you as Rodney was to Biz, you've already lost and it's just a shooting gallery at that point. Those places wouldn't get penetrated at any realistic fighting range. The Brits were at executioner's range by then.
Is this switch room open to visitors? Are the areas shown at 3:16 open to visitors? I've been on Missouri and they only have 01, 02, and decks 1and 2 open to visitors, and only partially. And none of the turrets can be entered, you can only look at the interior of #3 thru a plexiglas covered hatch.
I'd rather be in either the turret or Powder Magazine because the armor on both means nothing is likely to penetrate and explode but given what's inside of them if around did penetrate and explode suddenly it's not a problem I have to worry about there isn't really much of an in-between that results in injury but not death
I was thinking CIC/main gunnery plot etc for much the same reasons i.e. somewhere within the armour, not too low, not in close proximity to anything that might go 'bang' violently. Not knowing the layout of the ship, however, I wasn't sure exactly how those would score on that criteria. A comment about the conning tower: I was thinking about USS South Dakota when you brought up the damage chart from the action off Guadalcanal. The reason I was thinking of it was because the report SPECIFICALLY makes mention of the observation that without the CT it was extremely likely the bridge command staff would have been wounded if not killed. I think it was the Captain himself who made that comment in light of the number of hits she suffered to the superstructure. HMS Prince of Wales makes a good contrast as everyone on the bridge other than the captain himself was killed when a 15" shell from Bismarck passed through, exploding on the water on the other side from which the hit struck the bridge i.e. it went right through. So while I agree it's entirely possible a main calibre shell may kill everyone, it also appears to be the case that anything else almost certainly WON'T. Not that I'd pick it, but I find it an interesting topic. Cheers
I was on a US cruiser that was a destroyer size and reclassified, CG-16. USS Leahy. I was in the Persian Gulf 1980s and my bunk was next to the forward missile magazines. I would sleep on the floor 4 decks up just fine in my radar equipment space with a Navy blanket and crappy pillow (like a prison, lol). Hey, at least I was on station if they needed me. No way I was sleeping there with mines in the water. The floor was a better sleep with that threat.
At typical WW2 combat ranges the dispersion of the incoming shells is much wider than the size of the ship. Even if, somehow, every salvo is perfectly aimed only 2-10% of those shells are going to connect with the target ship. So in other words you're as likely to be hit on the bow or stern as you are amidships.
sooo my safest point in ship depends on what is doing the damage..... from torps anywhere in the super structure, for heavy caliber ryans electronics room does sound nice, however something a lil further back might be better cause if that turret does get hit that space doesnt look safe from turret 2. if im getting hit by cruisers and DDs probably ryans room there. aircraft im somewhere down in the armored part cause thats gonna do damage to the deck or anything un armored.
And it would be a good guess, however, in many ships, personnel assigned to the powder magazine were locked in from the outside and could not exit unless someone from the outside unlocked the hatch. The compartment most likely to be the "safest" is rather subjective as you would want to be in a space away from critical areas that the opposing force would be aiming at. Further, that space would also have to close to the main deck but away from the hull, more interior. Perhaps 2nd, no more than the 3rd deck to allow a fast exit should it be needed. Anything 01 or greater opens you up to potential fragmentation from incoming shells. Put all of that aside with the modern era now, you are either going to take a hit from a torpedo which will most likely break the keel and sink the ship rapidly (ala' HMS Hood) or get hit by a Harpoon or similar missile. This is exactly why ships are not armored to the degree that they were, the superstructure is essentially sheet metal, and rely heavily upon defensive equipment like CIWS or a SLQ suite.
@@Grimpy970 It's an unforgiving business Derek. It wasn't always done, but sometimes shipmates were just locked in. Not always, but if the dynamics demanded it.
Only on turret #2 along with railing and a platform. That was due to that turret being superfiring and if the turret was trained out to either port or starboard, there is no deck directly underneath. Turret #1 and #3 had just the one hatch. The South Dakota class had that feature also.
You mentioned the hand crank for the conning tower door, and a question that keeps coming up is whether or not the turrets can move. I remember seeing a video on one of the other Iowa class ships in which they used a hand crank to raise and lower the 16 inch gun barrels, I believe for display purposes. Is there any such system to rotate the turrets? Granted, that is a lot of metal to move, but they would have had to use some sort of backup system to return Iowa's turret 1 to align with the ship after the explosion. Is there any such thing on New Jersey?
Can you get locked into the compartments in the ship? ie if the ship was sinking, what's stopping the men fleeing a flooding compartment and leaving the doors open?
I’m not an expert but my guess would be the idea of the rest of the ship flooding and them still dying along with the rest of the crew( which they are probably close with many of them) would stop them from doing that
I had an Uncle who was a survivor on the USS Marblehead when it was mauled by the Japanese. He told of having to lock down watertight doors, and hearing men banging, trying to get out. (Note: His whole life, he told stories that we very dubious at best. So take this with a large grain of salt.)
During battle the watertight doors are locked. If a compartment floods everyone inside drowns, unless there is time to get them out before the water gets too high. It's either that or let the flooding endanger the rest of the ship and kill more sailors.
The only time I have ever seen a fitting "locked" was when we were in a foreign port and worried about people sneaking in, so we used rope (line) to tire handles closed. But otherwise no one was locked into a compartment. That's not to say that people wouldn't/couldn't get trapped in a compartment. It is possible have a fitting that can get stuck due to water or air pressure, warping from high heat, gravity acting against you, or being too wounded to manage the weight.
In World War II I'd still be in the armored conning Tower it's the planes you got to worry about not the other ships. Modern times still be in the conning Tower there isn't a weapon in anybody's Navy Arsenal that could even scratch that armor.
I want to know more about the device on the lower right of the screen that is marked UNIVAC . ( UNIVAC made computers and I'm thinking power conditioning )
try to keep this - length difference >100 feet. Displacement Iowa is 30% bigger. POwer/ horsepower 75% more- 33 versus 28 Knots. Draft/ beam not much bigger. NC had a longer range. 16/45 in NC instead of 16/50. - same quantity of 5 in guns Armor measurements - I will call it not much different. AA guns - suspect as built the NC had NO 40 mm Bofors or 20 mm Oerlikon- added during service- replace Chicago Piano 1.1 in gun. In comparison the 4 South Dakota class in between - 60 feet shorter than NC, slightly slower at 27.5 kn- near same HP - about 3-4% smaller displacement.
@@6mm250 No. It is an enlarged South Dakota. The North Carolinas were originally designed to be protected against 14" gun arms ships but the escalator clause kicked in before the design was complete. They had an unsloped external 12" belt. The Iowas' sloped internal belt plus 1"STS steel Hull playing made thier protection approximately equal to the Colorado class at 20kyds with increasing effectiveness at longer ranges where the angle of fall becomes steep.
@@johnshepherd9676 Quick note: The North Carolinas belt was not unsloped, it was sloped, but at only 15°, while the SoDaks and Iowas were sloped at 19° to increase effective thinkness. Everything else is correct however.
Isn’t the armored hatch a “Zebra”. If so it would be closed and dogged until battle orders reset the condition. In a mass evac, I can see your logic. A space on the centerline, on deck 2, nearer to an armored hatch might be my space. Or the gun house … if it is not the damaged object causing the casualty .. easy egress to the deck / water from an armored space.
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USN and Retired Merchant Marine Engineer...
I almost fell out of my chair laughing to hear someone suggest an engineroom or powder magazine....
I like your choice, above the waterline, well inboard, good access, and probably some of the best ventilation on the ship.
"I almost fell out of my chair laughing"
Sure, whatever, just remember that there was a time when you had no clue what the safest place was either until somebody explained it to you.
YOu didn't like it when they told you you where an idiot, why are you telling others this now? Did you learn nothing?
Calm down chum
@@vinny142 My apologies, no personal derision was intended. But I truly did laugh out loud.
@@vinny142 Who hurt you?
@@collinwood6573 Sounds like a disgruntled Italian sea slug...pay him no mind.
This dude has one of the coolest jobs, ever.
My Grandfather was a master in the Boiler Room he walked out on the deck from the library rite when the 16's went off for training in Korea and said he bled from every hole in his body. Also had a shell run rite down the deck. Traded hooch they made on the steampipes for steaks from the cooks. Loved listening to his stories. By the way he was on the Mighty Mo in Korea for 16 months.
this is one of the best comments ever, your grandfather was a chad !!
One alternative is the steering gear compartment...while outside the citadel box, it still has pretty good armor for protecting the vital steering engines, and there are nearby trunks to get you topside quickly (only three decks above). The bad thing is ready aviation gas is stored just aft, but that might well be dumped overboard if the ship was going into action.
As a former A-Gang crew member, I always felt like aft steering was fairly well protected with the exceptions of being below the water line and only one way in/out. I remember thinking what if an armored hatch counter weight system was damaged 😬.
Appreciate your videos .. amazing the complexity of the battleship
the IC shop is always a good place to hang out! of course i may be biased as an old IC2.
Retired senior chief IC here. I concur. Also, since the main gyro compass is in the space (always was on the 6 ships I served on), the space is on the exact centerline of the ship so there's the added depth protection. Another consideration is the ability to listen in on all the various phone and intercom circuits so you would have a pretty good idea of what's really going on topside. Cheers.
@@jamesstark8316 yupper. you can see the WSN-5 off to the side when they pan around. for listening in, great thing about the later ships with IVCS an/stc-II, can over ride and listen in on every net, and every single phone.
This channel is a goldmine. I toured the Iowa and the Wisconsin, but never got the info they show here. Hell, I don't know anyone who served on a battleship and living on an aircraft carrier is not the same
I liked the location of the Photo Lab on Forestall /Kityhawk class carriers. 3rd deck right underneith Medical. Easy ladder up to the 2nd deck plus a secondary egress through the Print Shop on the port side.
I’d probably go with either the bow or stern AA mounts, sure you’re nearly naked in terms of armor, but if there’s an enemy firing, they’re probably aiming amidship and not for me.
U wot
Anywhere on the battleship is safer than NOT being on it when you're in battle!
I would imagine that being anywhere in the state of New Jersey would be safer than being on the battleship in a battle.
@@michaelsommers2356 I'll take my chances on the battleship!
@@DK-gy7ll Same here.
That doesn't make any sense..
@@michaelsommers2356 I take it you've never been to New Jersey (the state)
Aft Emergency steering. It is at the end of the ship, out of the general line of fire. It is well armored, plenty of splinter protection and can with all but the biggest shells. It is at or above the water line and has more than one way in and out. There are a few passageways and ladders to the main deck.
7:56 - got me thinking. Does Ryan, Libby or any of the other staff ever use some of the interior ladders as shortcuts between decks? For instance "oh I need to go to the ward room from the IC room, oh let me just pop through the floor of the ward room for this meeting."
On a side note -
How does the exhaust from FWD EMER DIESEL & DIST PLANT make it out of the ship? Does it just get routed over to FIRE ROOM 1 ?
It's typically piped as directly as possible out of the ship horizontally, through the hull. Depending on the distance, a fan using a venturi effect may be in place to help. Don't want products of combustion to go directly through a fan.
He sold me on this room. Air conditioning in the South Pacific. Enough said.
I think the powder magazine would be good, though. You are well protected, and if an enemy shell gets through the armor and detonates the powder it will be over before you know it. This room is next to one of the turrets. I guess if the magazines explode under him I suspect getting off of the ship will NOT be an issue since you would get blown into orbit :)
can we get more of that battle damage diagram? , maybe one of the other iowa's
Maybe even how much damage NEW JERESY has taken ?
For the most part the Iowa's didn't take any damage. I believe only one smaller shell hit an Iowa during the Korean war and that's it.
Missouri took a kamikaze, but I don't think it did too much damage
I think I'd like to be just below the main deck right next to a barbette on the opposite side the battleship is being engaged from (assuming this is a ship-to-ship gun battle). You'd get double the armor protection from the far and near sides of the barbette, some overhead protection from plunging fire from the turret above, and still be in an area where you could quickly get to the main deck in the event of having to abandon ship.
Love the logic of your choice of the safest place. I’ve never thought there would actually be a place that was significantly safer than another, given 3,200 lb shells, 1,000 lb bombs, and torpedos incoming with malice. Glad your choice was never tested during wartime.
The most senior officer to survive from Bismarck said that when Hood exploded a cheer went up in the ship but I'll dare bet the older hands thought "there but for the grace of God go I". Must have been terrifying with pure luck your best friend.
This is all honestly very interesting but how about that Univac?👀
I think it depends a lot on what type of engagement you are in (and especially which side you are on). In a lot of engagements the outcome was pretty much clear from the beginning. Like Bismarck vs KGV and Rodney. On Bismarck you'd want to be somewhere armoured, but still relatively high up with an easy way out. You know you can't win amd that you have to get out at some point. On KGV you'd be perfectly fine in the magazine. Even if Bismarck scores a hit, it's the best place to survive. And if Bismarck is very lucky again, it really doesn't matter.
My placement. 3rd deck aft dry cleaning shop. Deep enough in the ship to protect from most direct fire. Away from all powder or ammo rooms and gun turrets. Above the water line. Above high armored steering rooms to protect from torpedoes blasts. Right next to ladder to direct up to main deck.
The story told by the gentleman from HMS HOOD about the officer stepping aside is chilling.
I think he said that the officer stepped back, extended his arm and said "after you".
Ryan another great one. Sometimes the most casual of questions seem to produce the most fascinating answers.
You just have to accept your fate, whatever it may be, wherever it may be, your time is your time.
When it's my time, I plan to be late.
6:26 it appears tha that Hood's gunnery spotting top tower was hit by a 15" shell from the Bismarck
I especially appreciate this one because I was an Interior communications Electrician.
The conning tower door looked like it was maintaining a good pace, especially for manual operation.
Would love to see a video dedicated to that room.
Looks really intresting with all that electrical equipment.
I vote for the engine room below the waterline and gamble the escape trunks are not blocked. It reminds me of a friend who joined the Coast Guard to avoid being an infantryman in Vietnam and ended up on one of those river patrol boats on the Mekong.
Unlucky friend!
I'd probably go with something at one of the extreme ends of the ship, something like the Nixie room. It's unarmored but it's also at the extreme end, and since most shots would probably be aimed at the center of the ship, the likelihood of getting hit all the way back at the extreme aft of the ship is probably fairly small.
I would like to point out for consideration the enemies ability to hit where they are aiming is likely very small. Most shots end up missing. Most shots come from very long ranges where minor variations of wind speed and or steering of the ship will have a huge effect on the shots. Shots coming from 20 miles away take a long time to get there (like 15 to 30 seconds) giving plenty of time for a ship to change course.
Main plot. Aft steering wouldn't be bad either
Comms room makes sense. You are also always in the know of what's going on around you.
Can you do a video explaining the armor types like all or nothing armor scheme and turtle back armor
I think its covered somewhere in the channel.
Awesome!
On the 2nd Deck, almost completely aft there is a tiny compartment labelled 'unassigned'. That's where I think would be best.
Reasoning:- If it's unassigned, it's not named. If it doesn't have a name, it doesn't exist (everything, and I mean everything has a name in the military). If it doesn't exist, the enemy can't hit it.
However, if it doesn't exist, might be tricky to find when needed!! On 2nd thoughts, I'll just stick to my submarine!
That battle damage report at 4:09 is quite interesting.
Feels to me they would have been better off firing HE, or they were but their fuse/detonators were quite bad, overall a lot more damage could have been done. I've honestly no idea why a cruiser would even try to use AP on a battleship unless they didn't quite know what they were shooting at.
8 inch shells ie 203mm in real units is very heavy artillery on land easily able to collapse a house on a near hit so you can imagine what a HE 203mm would do if it didn't just fly right through both sides of the superstructure and exploded inside instead.
I don't know , how about the absolute front at the bow ?
I mean think about it , how may navel gunners go out of the way to shoot off the bow ?
Now running into other ships , that's another problem but the scenario here is a shooting war and I can't remember any ships that got hit in the very front part of the bow .
What if the battle is taking place in heavy seas?
Torpedoes, as in certain cruisers at Guadalcanal.
@@johnlee1297 I'll bring a snorkel !
I don't think there's a bulletproof vest heavy enough to stop the stuff that battleships throw around 😄 !
I'm a radio operator so, comms/radio room. I'd want to know what's going on out there and be able to communicate with the other ships in the group. Plus it is critical space and armored e.t.c.
Thank you.
From general plans, workshops on 2nd deck around the uptakes, you are close to the exits and have the super structure protecting you from incoming.
I think that you are going to be at your duty station where ever that is, and that is that.
Tough choice !! Interesting video, thanks for sharing !!!!
Hiya Ryan great video thank you. Although, I agree where you suggest makes sense. I do have a couple of issues with that area.... 1. electrical / communication wires have coverings and generally when they go on fire you get lots of smoke which tends to not be good for you. and 2. Like you. I have an issue with just one door to exit. Which gets me thinking and a question for you all or for those who have served on warships in general. You can only exit somewhere if you can open the door. Sure those doors are blast proof (depending on where in the ship) and certainly watertight. If a blast is near them, Can it in fact lock or bend the door so that it cannot be opened?. I assume most doors on a warship are watertight rather than blast proof except for main critical areas. Or if a shell hits near them does it instead tend to just blow them off or pass through them if a direct hit ?. Keep safe and well everyone :)
If Ryan ever used a regular belt, I wouldn’t recognize him. Is his current floppy belt a safety/evacuation device?
Lessee, obviously you wouldn't want to be in any of the firerooms or engine rooms (you really don't want to be around ruptured high pressure steam pipes), same for being near the stack uptakes. 2-143-2-M, Marine Small Arms Locker. In the hull, well away from anything that has the most potential to rupture, away from the easy targets of the conning tower and dead center of the ship, works for me.
As an ICC I would also pick that space. Well protected because it has the gyro compasses that tells the CO where they are pointing and the 1MC (talk to the crew). Great space to be safe until someone comes along side you and blows up. Also happened
Is there a video describing the equipment in the space? I worked with UNIVAC computers long ago.
Truly interesting. Thanks, Ryan.
Whilst I have your attention, I read your channel content. I thought the USS Wisconsin (BB 63) was the longest, after the postwar collision with a destroyer. I understand the Iowas to be 887'3" o.a. The Wisconsin in its repair had the bow of the incomplete USS Kentucky (BB 64) grafted in place of the damage the ship sustained. Is this correct?
Happy Holidays to you and yours!
He's already covered that. And no, that is not true. Wisconsin's main deck is her original. Only 2nd deck down was replaced. She's within a half an inch difference of her pre-collision length.
@@Cirux321 I read that the repair had added 10".
Thank you twice, one for your prompt response and next for your information.
Happy Holidays to you and yours.
BB62 was the USS New Jersey.
@@flick22601 , thanks. I corrected it.
David, BB 63 is the Missouri not the Wisconsin. The Kentucky would have been BB 66 but was scrapped before being fully built.
Well it's not the shelter deck that's for sure as the Battle of Denmark Strait in WW2 proved
it has to be deep inside the ship
Given yesterday's video, it certainly isn't in a car on liberty.
😂
I would stay on the tip of the bow or the most astern region. Not much there that would cause an AP round to ignite. Most of the shells are aimed at the center and would probably straddle in around the 80% of the ships length around there. Easy to get away there. On Bismarck the most forward hit seems to have gone trough the deck near the chains. The stern section would have been a bad place due to the construction issues, however.
If the conning tower extend slightly below deck wouldn't that give you the benefits of the armored deck as well as the conning tower for projectiles coming in at an angle
Main armour deck is actually inside the Hull. Not much conning from their to be had. Most conning towers are partially covered at the front by Turret 2.
KGV is one of the few classes that has its maindeck a deck higher (still hull) because the RN decided several weight savings (like the 11 + 12th 14" gun and the conning tower) where a good trade off for more volume / buoyancy in the citadel.
One of the aft steering compartments!
Another great video from the battleship. Thanks
Is that a Univac computer ?
Please tell some more about the compute equipment on board, I grew up on what I call the second generation of 8 bit home computers, and are interested in computer history and their practical usage
Love your content, if I ever in get in your neighborhood I will come visit.
8:54 "2. Do not violate material conditions." So is it true that every watertight door is marked with an "X" or a "Y?"
Yes. Or a "Z".
My suggestion for the safest place on an Iowa is either the spotters float plane or helicopter. Well out of harms way and if the ship goes down I could fly to another ship or land and in the float plane on the water.
You are right about the shock Ryan. The heavy gun emplacements on the Atlantic wall were impenetrable however the shock of the artillery strikes wounded or killed the occupants.
I would be in Broadway which is in the heart of the citadel! There are multiple vertical exits out of Broadway going fore and aft and repair party crews located in Broadway means medical personnel are present.
Well statistically most of the hits if you look at multiple ships batte damage reports is in the forward half of the ship and in particular between the super firing turret and the forward superstructure thake the lion's share of the hits so you probably want to be somewhere in the aft half of the ship speaking in general terms without getting into specific compartments
Nice peace.
Should show us the escape route pov style, for this room, maybe the others also.
Thanks again for the content
Love these vids, thanks. I am close to Fall River, MA and have visited battleship Massachusetts numerous times. I am most curious how they aim and fire the 16" guns. I would think there are a huge variety of factors that come into play including pitch, roll & yaw, plus the ship (and the enemy's ship) is likely turning... and there may be some delay when firing the powder charge, etc, etc, etc. How did they coordinate all of those various factors so that the projectile traveled down the barrel at precisely the right moment?? Maybe you've done a vid already?
Most of ship above main armor belt & deck vulnerable to all sorts of shells smaller than battle ship guns. Superstructure & weather deck open to aircraft bombs & strafing (USN strafed Yamato). That being said, superstructure not a bad place in a couple of Battleship v battleship, long range, main gun duel. There's only a few albeit large shells flying but the number of hits will be small. IMO BB NJ would have an advantage with its 16"/50 cal guns, superior fire control and its speed & maneuverability allowing NJ to dictate the range. Deep in hull, torpedoes and flooding can occur with wreckage blocking deck hatches.
Your choice is a good one. Protected fairly well, reasonable escape & as comms center you'd prob have a good idea of what's happening.
Compared to a battleship you are the size of an ant on a semi. Any single large shell or torpedo has almost no chance of hitting you directly, but you have a high chance of blowing up if it strikes near explosives. So I say you are best in a spot that can stop rapid fire projectiles from penetrating and you can get out quickly if the ship starts sinking or fills up with smoke.
Spotting top it is.
5:20 yeah anyone inside Hood's number 3 turbine room were already dead by the time the 15" magazine ruptured and blew the Hood sky high
The explosion of the fatal 15" shell would have killed them
I pretty sure the conning tower of KMS Bismarck with a similar thickness it’s conning tower was penetrated by 16 Inch shel from HMS Rodney and those were of less velocity that the 16 inch mk 7 on Iowa class.
Probably, but if your enemy is as close to you as Rodney was to Biz, you've already lost and it's just a shooting gallery at that point. Those places wouldn't get penetrated at any realistic fighting range. The Brits were at executioner's range by then.
That was interesting Ryan. Thankyou
Is this switch room open to visitors? Are the areas shown at 3:16 open to visitors? I've been on Missouri and they only have 01, 02, and decks 1and 2 open to visitors, and only partially. And none of the turrets can be entered, you can only look at the interior of #3 thru a plexiglas covered hatch.
I'd rather be in either the turret or Powder Magazine because the armor on both means nothing is likely to penetrate and explode but given what's inside of them if around did penetrate and explode suddenly it's not a problem I have to worry about there isn't really much of an in-between that results in injury but not death
4:59 yeah but again as the Battle of the Denmark Strait proved the engine room or powder magazine were not the best place to be
I was thinking CIC/main gunnery plot etc for much the same reasons i.e. somewhere within the armour, not too low, not in close proximity to anything that might go 'bang' violently. Not knowing the layout of the ship, however, I wasn't sure exactly how those would score on that criteria.
A comment about the conning tower:
I was thinking about USS South Dakota when you brought up the damage chart from the action off Guadalcanal. The reason I was thinking of it was because the report SPECIFICALLY makes mention of the observation that without the CT it was extremely likely the bridge command staff would have been wounded if not killed. I think it was the Captain himself who made that comment in light of the number of hits she suffered to the superstructure.
HMS Prince of Wales makes a good contrast as everyone on the bridge other than the captain himself was killed when a 15" shell from Bismarck passed through, exploding on the water on the other side from which the hit struck the bridge i.e. it went right through.
So while I agree it's entirely possible a main calibre shell may kill everyone, it also appears to be the case that anything else almost certainly WON'T.
Not that I'd pick it, but I find it an interesting topic.
Cheers
I was on a US cruiser that was a destroyer size and reclassified, CG-16. USS Leahy. I was in the Persian Gulf 1980s and my bunk was next to the forward missile magazines. I would sleep on the floor 4 decks up just fine in my radar equipment space with a Navy blanket and crappy pillow (like a prison, lol). Hey, at least I was on station if they needed me. No way I was sleeping there with mines in the water. The floor was a better sleep with that threat.
Try the bow or the stern. A good place to jump. How many shells are focused on these two ship parts?
At typical WW2 combat ranges the dispersion of the incoming shells is much wider than the size of the ship. Even if, somehow, every salvo is perfectly aimed only 2-10% of those shells are going to connect with the target ship. So in other words you're as likely to be hit on the bow or stern as you are amidships.
sooo my safest point in ship depends on what is doing the damage..... from torps anywhere in the super structure, for heavy caliber ryans electronics room does sound nice, however something a lil further back might be better cause if that turret does get hit that space doesnt look safe from turret 2. if im getting hit by cruisers and DDs probably ryans room there. aircraft im somewhere down in the armored part cause thats gonna do damage to the deck or anything un armored.
Knowing me, I’d be in an engine room. High risk, but it’s where I’d love to be.
Can you do a video on the Hvac systems on the ship?
I'm guessing the safest place would ironically be in the powder rooms or the lower levels of the turret.
And it would be a good guess, however, in many ships, personnel assigned to the powder magazine were locked in from the outside and could not exit unless someone from the outside unlocked the hatch. The compartment most likely to be the "safest" is rather subjective as you would want to be in a space away from critical areas that the opposing force would be aiming at. Further, that space would also have to close to the main deck but away from the hull, more interior. Perhaps 2nd, no more than the 3rd deck to allow a fast exit should it be needed. Anything 01 or greater opens you up to potential fragmentation from incoming shells. Put all of that aside with the modern era now, you are either going to take a hit from a torpedo which will most likely break the keel and sink the ship rapidly (ala' HMS Hood) or get hit by a Harpoon or similar missile. This is exactly why ships are not armored to the degree that they were, the superstructure is essentially sheet metal, and rely heavily upon defensive equipment like CIWS or a SLQ suite.
@@peterpoertner7042 holy crap! I never knew they were locked into their compartments
With explosive powder
@@Grimpy970 It's an unforgiving business Derek. It wasn't always done, but sometimes shipmates were just locked in. Not always, but if the dynamics demanded it.
There are two hatches under the turret overhang, not one. But they are right next to each other.
Only on turret #2 along with railing and a platform. That was due to that turret being superfiring and if the turret was trained out to either port or starboard, there is no deck directly underneath. Turret #1 and #3 had just the one hatch. The South Dakota class had that feature also.
On the pier, as it steams out of port. Just kidding, old navy salt having a poke. Haze gray and under way does have it's moments.
For me it would be Sickbay right next to IC but also allows me to assist the surgeons in patching up my wounded shipmates
You mentioned the hand crank for the conning tower door, and a question that keeps coming up is whether or not the turrets can move. I remember seeing a video on one of the other Iowa class ships in which they used a hand crank to raise and lower the 16 inch gun barrels, I believe for display purposes. Is there any such system to rotate the turrets? Granted, that is a lot of metal to move, but they would have had to use some sort of backup system to return Iowa's turret 1 to align with the ship after the explosion. Is there any such thing on New Jersey?
Can you get locked into the compartments in the ship? ie if the ship was sinking, what's stopping the men fleeing a flooding compartment and leaving the doors open?
I’m not an expert but my guess would be the idea of the rest of the ship flooding and them still dying along with the rest of the crew( which they are probably close with many of them) would stop them from doing that
I had an Uncle who was a survivor on the USS Marblehead when it was mauled by the Japanese. He told of having to lock down watertight doors, and hearing men banging, trying to get out. (Note: His whole life, he told stories that we very dubious at best. So take this with a large grain of salt.)
During battle the watertight doors are locked. If a compartment floods everyone inside drowns, unless there is time to get them out before the water gets too high. It's either that or let the flooding endanger the rest of the ship and kill more sailors.
They might be damaged and jammed, as happened with Bismarck
The only time I have ever seen a fitting "locked" was when we were in a foreign port and worried about people sneaking in, so we used rope (line) to tire handles closed. But otherwise no one was locked into a compartment.
That's not to say that people wouldn't/couldn't get trapped in a compartment. It is possible have a fitting that can get stuck due to water or air pressure, warping from high heat, gravity acting against you, or being too wounded to manage the weight.
If you have any records about this: What is the safest / unsafest room on the ship in regards to work-accidents?
The Battery plotting room for me it has great access, well protected and not too deep
Just wondering if 16” shells are as destructive as modern day missiles?
What about the crew mess area multiple ways in amd out.
What model Univac was that and what was it used for? Encryption? Sorry I am also a software engineer so that old Univac really caught my intention.
I like your choice, but I’d suggest your assigned work space during general quarters. Ha
I love the upside down Dell CRT monitor, any reason for that or?
Sick Bay would be my bet
In World War II I'd still be in the armored conning Tower it's the planes you got to worry about not the other ships.
Modern times still be in the conning Tower there isn't a weapon in anybody's Navy Arsenal that could even scratch that armor.
How does a ship keep water out from where the propeller shaft exits the Hull ?
I want to know more about the device on the lower right of the screen that is marked UNIVAC . ( UNIVAC made computers and I'm thinking power conditioning )
That of course would be the Yeoman's shack at the shipyard.
Steering compartment. Very heavy armor and away from most magazines.
Hey what's the difference between the Iowa class ships compared to the USS North Carolina?
Iowa class is North Carolina class on steroids
Iowa was longer, faster, a bit slower in a turn with newer, higher caliber main guns and more AA. Armor layout was similar.
try to keep this - length difference >100 feet. Displacement Iowa is 30% bigger. POwer/ horsepower 75% more- 33 versus 28 Knots. Draft/ beam not much bigger. NC had a longer range. 16/45 in NC instead of 16/50. - same quantity of 5 in guns Armor measurements - I will call it not much different. AA guns - suspect as built the NC had NO 40 mm Bofors or 20 mm Oerlikon- added during service- replace Chicago Piano 1.1 in gun. In comparison the 4 South Dakota class in between - 60 feet shorter than NC, slightly slower at 27.5 kn- near same HP - about 3-4% smaller displacement.
@@6mm250 No. It is an enlarged South Dakota. The North Carolinas were originally designed to be protected against 14" gun arms ships but the escalator clause kicked in before the design was complete. They had an unsloped external 12" belt. The Iowas' sloped internal belt plus 1"STS steel Hull playing made thier protection approximately equal to the Colorado class at 20kyds with increasing effectiveness at longer ranges where the angle of fall becomes steep.
@@johnshepherd9676 Quick note: The North Carolinas belt was not unsloped, it was sloped, but at only 15°, while the SoDaks and Iowas were sloped at 19° to increase effective thinkness. Everything else is correct however.
Isn’t the armored hatch a “Zebra”. If so it would be closed and dogged until battle orders reset the condition. In a mass evac, I can see your logic.
A space on the centerline, on deck 2, nearer to an armored hatch might be my space. Or the gun house … if it is not the damaged object causing the casualty .. easy egress to the deck / water from an armored space.
What about the spaces over the rudder?
Curious: What's that Univac equipment on the right side of the frame?
What happens to the place you are in when B turret or its magazine blows up?
My last battle station on the Destroyer I served on was the helm in the bridge. Protection?
Speed, smoke, luck and prayer.