I grew up reading E.K in Guns & Ammo in the 70's. I had just got paid my 2weeks vacation money and my regular weekly check from Kmart, I went into one of the LGS I would visit and as a joke I asked if they had a 4 inch Model 29. The Shop owner pointed at the counter. I gave him my 3 week's pay on the spot. I came back after the waiting period, picked up my 29-2. I was broke and spent the next 2 weeks just looking and cleaning that gun, without regrets.
Bill and Ken, you guys are so cool. As a young guy I still like all of the revolvers and classic 1911s... keep up the content, probably my favorite on RUclips
I got my Smith and Wesson 44 magnum's from Mel Rodgers who was a World Champion back in the thirty"s forty's and fifty's as a pistol shooter, got them in 1975,and 1976 by way of J&G when they were in Montana. Model's 29-2 6 1/2" nickel plated, Model 29-2 6 1/2" blued and Model 29-2 blued 4". Great guns they are...
@@larryalexander4833 im a learning reloader under very experienced teachings. I love h110 in both my smith and ruger. 357s. Seems like my teacher has a load in .44 mag thats a 200gr cast wadcutter in front of blue dot that my 10.5 in Blackhawk loves. And enjoyable to shoot.
@@derekskinner2347 Cool we are always learning if we have a open mind. I use h110 but it's not my most accurate powder load. And I too have a 200 gr 44 mag load I hunt with. Around 1800 fps out of a carbine accurate out to 200 yards + . But I keep inside 200.
I gotcha. I'm confident with my ruger out to 100yds. Anything beyond that is test n tune with my pistol. I know h110 is .44mag in all its glory. I just haven't really bought the bullets to support the powder.
I just love listening to you 2 !! I don’t know how many years well I guess at least 2 decades I have been buying products from Wilson combat. This channel is for me educational , relaxing and a true joy. Thank You
I remember a similar story, He was guiding some hunters and one of them questioned if he could shoot that big gun? I don't remember what type of bird was flying but without hesitation he shot one in flight and holstered.. LOL... Great Stuff Guys ... Stay Strong and Be Safe.... Enjoy the holiday !!!
Awesome show! Whenever I think life gets rough, I think of what Elmer Keith went through in his lifetime... If you have never read his book: Hell, I Was There, then you are missing out on a fantastic piece of history. IMHO.
While vacationing in Elmer Keith country with my family in 2003, we stopped at the little store in Shoup for a cheeseburger and chocolate milkshake, and I got my picture taken out front by the old glass-bulb gas pump. Wish I would have known that EK story then. I'm a big fan of Elmer, Ken Hackathorn, Bill Wilson, and S&W 29's. Cool story.
For those interested, there's a LOT of "Elmer Keith" stories. One of which is that while going to town one day, his dad disparaged the handgun. Elmer's response was to pull his handgun out and shoot a running rabbit at a fair distance (story varies from 30 yards to 100 yards). His dad never, according to the story, questioned Elmer's use of the handgun after that. Another one is that he actually started experimenting with the 45 Colt. After blowing a few up, he wrote to the American Rifleman asking why. Come to find out, he was using 45/70 bullets in his 45 Colt (458 diameter vs 452). Their explanation resulted in his switch to the 44. And then there's the one where, as an inspector for the Army during WW2, he was sneakily checked for accuracy of the rejected guns (his rejection rate was higher than average), by having those same guns sent through his inspection line again. The rejected guns were rejected a second time for the exact same reason - without fail. And there's the one about his promotion of the 41 magnum "for police use". That one confused me for a while. Yes, the 41 is good, but why this one, after the success of the 44? Finally found my answer in some of Elmer's very first writings. He said that the 41 Long Colt was a "much, much, better fight stopper" than the ballistics indicated. Suddenly, his promotion of the 41 for the police made sense. Unfortunately, the ammo companies ignored Elmer's plan to introduce it as a police cartridge FIRST, and then follow that with the magnum. The ammo companies went straight to the magnum cartridge first, and it failed to gain the police acceptance that Elmer visualized. Consequently, the 41 magnum is a cartridge in limbo. Yes, lots of Elmer stories.
I received an Ruger New Model Blackhawk for Christmas in 1984 from my dad. Been hunting with it since, taken white tail deer and elk with it. That gun has never let me down, I hand load my own cartridges and just LOVE it.
History of Elmer, comes down to the stories. And of course whether one could replicate. My 44 - was offered for sale as an unfired Ruger Super Blackhawk. I brought my cleaning kit with me - and swabbed the bore, because there was powder fouling. The green streaks told me it was shot enough to mark the bore with copper. I offered almost $100 off what he was asking. He wanted his full cup, so I passed. A month later - he called me - and asked if my offer stood. I drove out to pick up the gun, but wanted to recheck the bore. He had stuffed a cleanex in it so you could not see the bore. That has been 41 yrs. Still have it, and it still breathes Fire. Oh - and at 20 yds, I could punch 12 ga hulls. If someone asked again, I could run a whole cylinder and go 12 rounds for 12 hulls. Cheers
When I was a kid we had a 4th of July celebration out at Salmon’s airport. Elmer was there telling a crowd of people about the versatility of the .22 long rifle. He tossed a potato into the air and shot it into two pieces with the rifle. He tossed up another potato and shot it in two and then shot the pieces in two. Eventually some of our more athletic guys started throwing potatoes high into the air to see how many times Elmer could shoot the potato pieces before they hit the ground. The man was a very skilled marksman! Always wore an ugly “ten gallon” hat and carried a pistol at his side just like a gun slinger from a western movie. He was kind of like a living legend and yet still just one of the local guys.🤗
I had a buddy who owned a Mdl 29 once and I found out later he sold it because he was scared of himself. Breaks my heart that I didn’t get a crack at owning it.
A few years ago I bought some old magazines at a second hand store. They were American Rifleman 1956 and 57. New Blackhawk 44 magnum had a suggested retail of $96.
Hello Ken & Bill, I made 9 hunting trips from Pa. to the Salmon River Country beginning in 1991. I hunted some of the same drainages Elmer did but never knew it till I read his book '' Hell I Was There ''. I visited the Elmer Keith museum in Salmon before they moved it to Boise. Shoup in a neat little place and had my hunting buddy take my picture in front of the gravity flow gas pumps at the General Store. From what some of the locals told me back then, Elmer was a living legend in the Salmon River Country !
The 44 magnum is the 30/06 of the handgun world. It does it all from elephant down to rabbit. Properly loaded of course. I own a Model 329PD as my 44 magnum. Changed out the titanium cylinder it came with and use a Model 629 stainless steel cylinder instead. Quad ported by Mag-na-port too. Love that revolver.
I own a 460 Smith and Wesson magnum revolver with a 5 inch muzzlebrake equipped barrel. Like the 5 inch barrel balance. And also have a 500 Smith and Wesson revolver with a 6.5 inch barrel semi-lug barrel.
I didn't want the fuss of two 44 magnums. When they first came out with Dan Wesson an 8" heavy 44 magnum was at a gun show, it came home with me. Later a 4" light and 8" light were added
My great uncle was named Arthur "Red" Thompson. He lived ihn Salmon, Idaho at the time and was one of the co-inventors of the .357 Magnum round there with Elmer Keith. As a boy I grew up listening to his stories about working and shooting with Elmer and their adventures. I am so thankful for this episode. Thank You.
Love this...it is akin to listening to two, that have been there and done that, reminisce about the glory of honor, good friends, fine arms and good stories. I LOVE being an American and our proud gun culture.
Out and out vandalism on Elmer's part, shooting guns while indulging in adult beverages, and gambling to boot. I would have loved to have been there to watch this. I myself carried an S+W M-29 while I lived and worked in Alaska. I could shoot it ok but now that I am old, I prefer more reasonable handguns. If I need a 44 mag, then I am going to want a Rifle.
When I shoot my .357 magnum revolvers, I generally use .357 magnum. I’ll be 60 years old soon, so that might change later. While I’ve shot .44 magnum, it’s not my thing.
Worked 82 till 85 at the counter of the Sporting Goods store . Back then model 29 s were marked a Hundred Dollars over Retail and on Display . They were in Demand and people would pay the extra 100 to have one . You made a wise choice with the Ruger .
@@demandred1957 I bought a super blackhawk years ago with a 10.5 inch bbl on it and couldn't stand it so I cranked in a vice and sawed 5.5 inches off of it made a real gun out of it in my opinion if you want a carbine buy a carbine if you want a handgun buy a handgun nothing over 5.5 inches long for my handguns
@@jeffreyhershey5754 good way to ruin a fine gun.. I'm sure you could have sold it to someone that would have appreciated it, and bought whatever you wanted with the proceeds.
What about the .45 single action that Elmer Keith blew up. I think it was an original first generation too. You can actually buy the blown up cylinder. The problem was Elmer Keith used a .458 diameter projectile in a .454 bore causing an explosion. His obsession was getting heavier and heavier bullets to go faster. He purchased some .45 bullets for .45-70 and loaded them in a .454 bore which caused the pressure to spike. The single action army actually has relatively thin cylinder walls. The single action army was designed for Black powder pressures. A gun smith recommend that he should use a smith and Wesson .44 special revolver to hot load. And from there a legend was born. Dick Casull would actually make the .454 Casull cartridge. It would take until 1983 to get a commercial mass produced revolver out to the market.
(1971) But being that this is a .44 Magnum, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well do ya, punk?
.44 Mag may not be the top of the muzzle energy heap, but the 250 grain LSWCs I drive to 1400 fps using H110/WW296 from my 6 1/2" M29 Classic, do anything I could want a revolver to do, all the while cutting clover leafs on targets.
It’s really a shame that the supposed successor to the .44 Mag, the .41 Magnum, never really took off, especially considering it came out before the .44 got that push in sales by the Dirty Harry franchise.
The 41mag is actually a "better fit" in the S&W N-frame. The 41 is just that little bit smaller that results in much better margins in critical places like in the cylinder notches. I shot IHMSA around 1980 and a 57 would last much longer than a 29 with "silhouette loads".
Why is .357 even in this title? There was one offhand mention. 🤔 Also, you’d think he’d at least take out the .44 and show us what appears to be a beautiful gun. 🤦🏼♂️
For people out there that shoot, but do not have a revolver, do yourself a favor and get a S&W (pre-lock) .357 Magnum Revolver. Believe me when I tell you, that you will never regret it. They are sweet shooters and can the ammo can be ramped up or down as needed.
Darn right. The first handgun i ever bought was a 4" 686, brand new, right after my 21st bday. I ourposely wanted the L frame, in order to stand up better to pmenty of magnum rounds. It is the last gun i would ever sell, and one of the most accurate guns i own. Ditto for the 6" M28 (N frame) that i bought about 22 yrs later. I have 2 K frame magnums also, mostly shot with 38 or 38+p, and some otheer S&W revolvers, but the 686 is my favorite.
Thanks for the history :) Besides firing handguns in 22LR, 38 special, 9mm. I've fired the 357 (which stings my palm a bit), 45 ACP, hot loaded 45 Colt rounds with my 7-1/2" Bisley Blackhawk, and 454 Casull in my R92 lever gun (but not in a revolver). When comparing the 44 magnum, you've mentioned the other bigger magnum calibers .454, 480, 460, 500. Where does the .480 Ruger fit in, in terms of power, felt recoil, range, energy on target, when compared to the other big bore revolvers?
I bought a Mod 29 with 6 1/2 bbl while I was stationed in Gernany...in late 73 for $205.50 though the Illesheim Rod and Gun club...it was the last one in the S&W bonded warehouse inUlm...which they were closing down...unfortunately it was stolen in Feb of 82..still have the tag from the post MPs...
I'm in the same general age range as Ken and Bill and remember many tales about Elmer Keith. Ken was spot-on about there being various opinions of the man. My favorite gunsmith met him once at an industry show during the cocktail hour. He admitted to me in retrospect that he probably would not have been so frank with Elmer had he not already enjoyed a few drinks. His comments had something to do with bovine scatology. Suffice it to say Elmer was not impressed and promptly turned around and left the conversation. In fairness to Elmer, my gunsmith had far coarser things to say about Charles Askins, whom he had dealt with on numerous occasions. I freely admit these men could out-shoot me on their worst days, and since we only have their version of events to go by, I am hesitant to claim they ever embellished the truth. I do wonder though. Regarding the S&W Model 29, Ken's experience matches mine, only by the time I could afford one, they were as scarce as hen's teeth. I ended up buying one from a fellow Air Force officer, a 4" blued version which I later had tuned. I finished off a 700 pound Waterbuck with it, using a custom 255 grain load I'd worked up for my one and only African adventure. I still have this fine revolver, but it is relegated to dispensing with varmints around the house while loaded with rat shot.
Yup. It's the most powerful handgun I care to shoot. I love my 7.5" Blackhawk. Love shooting specials through it. If I need more than that imma grab my 308 winchester.
I love the 44. I knew of it from the movie but never considered it. I only went to it because the 357 was such a disappointment to me. The 44 fits me perfectly and is so pleasent to shoot.
I lived at 117 Lombard street in Salmon. I would mow the yard for Loraine Keith every week. After I finished she would have me come in and write out a check in the living room. I always told her just seeing Elmer's trophy's was enough. I spent every cent on ammo to go out to the old National Guard range by the air strip.
Hello, I made 9 elk hunting trips from Pa. to Salmon and would always go to the range out by the airport to shoot my rifle, and I would always shoot from the bench dedicated to Elmer Keith. I fell in love with the town of Salmon and wished I had been born and raised there. I am jealous of the people that call the Salmon River Country home !
Just my two cent, maybe 1.5 cent opinions but... Magnums require hearing protection otherwise you will hate them. Magnums require rubber grips or you will hate them. Practice with a magnum is indeed more comfortable with "specials" but you must run a fair amount of hunting/defense loads as they handle differently. If you hand/wrist hurts ask yourself if you are getting enough vitamin D... I machine steel for a living and trust me my hands have seen more punishment than any handgun delivers. I love my 629 .44 it shoots like a dream. I have had a Python for over 40 years now... rough with wood grips but so nice with rubber grips. Latest magnum is a post '19 King Cobra and wow that little gun barks but such a smooth trigger (Python guy saying that!). Yup, love WC and buy bits an pieces for my 1911s.
My dad gave me a Ruger Blackhawk 3 screw flat top in .44 mag made in the late 50's. It's built like a tank, hard as hell on the bare hands to shoot, and my absolute favorite gun to carry while hiking in the woods. The way I see it if the .44 is to rough on you took shoot then you should probably take up knitting or something else
I am a fan of 357 Mag with a 6inch barrel it shootw very well I shoot moe acurate with it than many others I have shot . Even at longer ranges for handguns it does well when friends were shooting at a 5 galon bucket about 150 yards wiyj there rifles I fired st it eith my 357 & nailed it 8 times out of 89 rounds that were very clos e on the edge of it in the dirt. We also shit some calys set up on the ground at 80 feeet awaywe could not hit them so well 2-4 shots at most with a glock it took most of the time but with my 6 inch barrel 357 mag I hit 1 qfter another 1 round at atme. ANOTHER TARGER AT THE INDOOR RANGE IF A MAN HOLDING A WOMEN WITH A PISTOL BARREL ON HER HEAD jUST ABOUT 1/2 OF HIS HEAD EXPOSRD BEHIND HER HEAD 3/4 OF ALLTHE WAY OUT i FIRED 12 ROUNDS AT IT i GOT ALL OF THEM THROUGH HIS HEAD WITH 1 IN IT THROUGH A BIT OF HERHAIR IN FRONT OF HIM ONLY MIGHT HAVE CUT A LITTTLE HAIR BUT ONLY HURT/KILLD HIM i DID SHOOT WELL WITH A 9MM gLOCK AT A GUN SHO AT Rauhauges PHEASANT CLUB & SHOOTING RANGE & CLAY PIGEN RANGE OUNT IN norco cORONA ca THEY HSD A SOOT 1 ROUNDS AT A T SHIRT ON A GROUND THING DIVING IT SROUND WHILE YOU SHOT ST IT & YOU KEEP THE OLD TSHIRT YOU CHOOST TO USE WHEN YOU SHOOT ST IT AT THE END OF THE DSY NOT MSNY SOING IT. tHE GUY ACTED LIKE i HAD NOT SHOT A SEMI AUTO HAND GUN BEFORE THEN SAID SA WHEN YOUR READY AN WE WILL START IT TO GO. i HAS SEEN IT MOVED AROUND AND SHOT Y OTHERS BUT WHEN i SAID ok READY IT CAME STRAIGHT AT ME AS FAST AS IT WOULD GO i SHOT AS FAST AS i COULD NO USING THE SIGHTS THAT FAST WITH RECOIL i WENT THROUGH 10 ROUNDS BEFORE MY GIRL COULD GET HER CAMERA FROM HER CHEST TO HER FACE IT SOPED RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE TABLE IT TRACELED 25-20 FEET AND i WAS SURPRSWD WHAT i saw with the guy runnning it fingersan inch -2 apart up & down & the same distance apart 2468 he put his fingers in the holes 7 SAID GOOD SHOOTING AND WITH HIS EYES VERY WID E OPEN AND HIS JAW DROPPED DOWN MOUTH OPENED WIDE i KNEEW IT WAS THE DRILL OF THE FUY RUNNING AT OFFICERS WITH Q KNIFE . tHE VIDEO i SAW THEY SDID NOT DO WELL AT ALL i MOTIONED TO MY GIRL NOT TO SHOW ANY EXITEMENT & NEITHER DID i WE WALKED UP THE GRADE TO THE TOP PF THE PARKING AREA WHEE A VETERAN WAS SITTING AT THE CORNER IIF THE TARP HUNG ;OKE S BOOTH . aFTERHEARING M SHOTS MADE SO FAST HE AYS AO HOW DID YOU TO i JUST HELD UP THE TSHIRT TO SHOE THE PATERN OF TWO ROWS OF FIVE 1INCH ALIIGHNED 1" APART RIGHT ON TOP OF EACH OTHER . hI JUMPED IN THE AIR KNOCKING HIS FEET TOGETHER TELLING VERY LOUD nice shooting i HOPE THET HEARD IT i KNOW IT WAS THAT DRILL THET TRIED BECAUSE WHEN i SAW THE GUYS FACE THAT HANDED ME THHE GUN TO SHOOT i TURNED AND SAW THE GUY RUNNING THE THING WTH WHEELS BELOW IT LOOKING AT HIM WITH THE SAME WIDE EYED OPEN MOUTH LOOK AT THE OTHER GUY LIKE HOW DID HE JUST DO THST SO FAST ? i even thought the same I never rewlly shot that fast with a handgun before in the desert with my dad and tou cant do it at the indoor rangeor they will kick you out I think. HAHAI passed that drill very well Not saying I could do it agaibn but maybe I dont know ? just Happy I did it then by surprise & kept the t shirt not sure where it is it was years ago if I find it I want to frame it
I grew up reading E.K in Guns & Ammo in the 70's. I had just got paid my 2weeks vacation money and my regular weekly check from Kmart, I went into one of the LGS I would visit and as a joke I asked if they had a 4 inch Model 29. The Shop owner pointed at the counter. I gave him my 3 week's pay on the spot. I came back after the waiting period, picked up my 29-2. I was broke and spent the next 2 weeks just looking and cleaning that gun, without regrets.
Must've felt like a dream when you saw what he pointed at...
Mr. Keith and Col. Askins were prolific writers in the 70s. They are greatly missed.
I understand and you were lucky ! You’ll never regret it especially the 29-2 welcome
Still have it?
I can dig that...spent my $$$ on cameras and guns and been down that road many times, my friend...
Anyone who writes a book called “Hell, I was there” is a legend.
One of the best books in my library!
👍 He certainly is.
Great book. Was a present to me from my raised in Idaho dad.
Bill and Ken, you guys are so cool. As a young guy I still like all of the revolvers and classic 1911s... keep up the content, probably my favorite on RUclips
Hit the "Like" just for the Elmer Keith story...
Wheel guns is REAL guns!! God Bless Elmer Keith and all he did for us shooters today!
Dirty Harry is an example of a film where the gun is the actual star.
Amidst all this excitement you gotta ask yourself did I fire 5 shots or 6 ? Well do you feel lucky punk ? Wait I gots to know !!! CLICK !!!!
@@jeffreyelliott622 hahaha, awesome scene. Guy in the end wasn’t as lucky as that bank robber was 💥
Like many movies where the car is the star. (Smokey and the bandit; Vanishing Point; etc.)
Winchester '73 also is one of the gun is the star of the movie.
@@MrPh30 exactly! Jimmy Stewart right? I gotta see that one. He’s a great actor.
I got my Smith and Wesson 44 magnum's from Mel Rodgers who was a World Champion back in the thirty"s forty's and fifty's as a pistol shooter, got them in 1975,and 1976 by way of J&G when they were in Montana. Model's 29-2 6 1/2" nickel plated, Model 29-2 6 1/2" blued and Model 29-2 blued 4". Great guns they are...
All the modern advances in cartridges and the .44 magnum still holds its on.
Full house load of h110 250 or 300 grain wadcutter will hold its own.
@@larryalexander4833 im a learning reloader under very experienced teachings. I love h110 in both my smith and ruger. 357s. Seems like my teacher has a load in .44 mag thats a 200gr cast wadcutter in front of blue dot that my 10.5 in Blackhawk loves. And enjoyable to shoot.
@@derekskinner2347 Cool we are always learning if we have a open mind. I use h110 but it's not my most accurate powder load. And I too have a 200 gr 44 mag load I hunt with. Around 1800 fps out of a carbine accurate out to 200 yards + . But I keep inside 200.
I gotcha. I'm confident with my ruger out to 100yds. Anything beyond that is test n tune with my pistol. I know h110 is .44mag in all its glory. I just haven't really bought the bullets to support the powder.
@@derekskinner2347 yes sir. With a pistol I agree . I have two carbines I hunt with . I need to get my revolver tuned in tho.
I just love listening to you 2 !! I don’t know how many years well I guess at least 2 decades I have been buying products from Wilson combat. This channel is for me educational , relaxing and a true joy. Thank You
Thanks for sharing!!
This is the best entertainment/information about guns I have found and just wanted to say thank you.
Loved Elmer Keith’s caliber development notes: “The top strap and cylinder departed the gun, finishing up in the bronc corral.”
I remember a similar story, He was guiding some hunters and one of them questioned if he could shoot that big gun? I don't remember what type of bird was flying but without hesitation he shot one in flight and holstered.. LOL... Great Stuff Guys ... Stay Strong and Be Safe.... Enjoy the holiday !!!
Gunwriter Jon Sundra has written a book entitled "Hell, I'm Still Here". He has some good Elmer Keith, Jack O'Connor, and Charles Askins stories.
Awesome show!
Whenever I think life gets rough, I think of what Elmer Keith went through in his lifetime...
If you have never read his book: Hell, I Was There, then you are missing out on a fantastic piece of history. IMHO.
I could listen to Hackathorn tell stories all day long!
While vacationing in Elmer Keith country with my family in 2003, we stopped at the little store in Shoup for a cheeseburger and chocolate milkshake, and I got my picture taken out front by the old glass-bulb gas pump. Wish I would have known that EK story then. I'm a big fan of Elmer, Ken Hackathorn, Bill Wilson, and S&W 29's. Cool story.
For those interested, there's a LOT of "Elmer Keith" stories. One of which is that while going to town one day, his dad disparaged the handgun. Elmer's response was to pull his handgun out and shoot a running rabbit at a fair distance (story varies from 30 yards to 100 yards). His dad never, according to the story, questioned Elmer's use of the handgun after that.
Another one is that he actually started experimenting with the 45 Colt. After blowing a few up, he wrote to the American Rifleman asking why. Come to find out, he was using 45/70 bullets in his 45 Colt (458 diameter vs 452). Their explanation resulted in his switch to the 44.
And then there's the one where, as an inspector for the Army during WW2, he was sneakily checked for accuracy of the rejected guns (his rejection rate was higher than average), by having those same guns sent through his inspection line again. The rejected guns were rejected a second time for the exact same reason - without fail.
And there's the one about his promotion of the 41 magnum "for police use". That one confused me for a while. Yes, the 41 is good, but why this one, after the success of the 44? Finally found my answer in some of Elmer's very first writings. He said that the 41 Long Colt was a "much, much, better fight stopper" than the ballistics indicated. Suddenly, his promotion of the 41 for the police made sense. Unfortunately, the ammo companies ignored Elmer's plan to introduce it as a police cartridge FIRST, and then follow that with the magnum. The ammo companies went straight to the magnum cartridge first, and it failed to gain the police acceptance that Elmer visualized. Consequently, the 41 magnum is a cartridge in limbo.
Yes, lots of Elmer stories.
I’m very grateful that you two are capturing your knowledge on video for future generations. I really appreciate the revolver content.
So that’s where the “Shoots lights out “ saying originated 😄
I received an Ruger New Model Blackhawk for Christmas in 1984 from my dad. Been hunting with it since, taken white tail deer and elk with it. That gun has never let me down, I hand load my own cartridges and just LOVE it.
I love 44mag/special as well as 357 mag/38 special.
Just a great video remember reading Elmer Kieth Articles in Guns And Ammo way way. Back ..
History of Elmer, comes down to the stories. And of course whether one could replicate. My 44 - was offered for sale as an unfired Ruger Super Blackhawk. I brought my cleaning kit with me - and swabbed the bore, because there was powder fouling. The green streaks told me it was shot enough to mark the bore with copper. I offered almost $100 off what he was asking. He wanted his full cup, so I passed. A month later - he called me - and asked if my offer stood. I drove out to pick up the gun, but wanted to recheck the bore. He had stuffed a cleanex in it so you could not see the bore. That has been 41 yrs. Still have it, and it still breathes Fire. Oh - and at 20 yds, I could punch 12 ga hulls. If someone asked again, I could run a whole cylinder and go 12 rounds for 12 hulls. Cheers
Thank you - I appreciated the story about Elmer Keith's shooting ability.
When I was a kid we had a 4th of July celebration out at Salmon’s airport. Elmer was there telling a crowd of people about the versatility of the .22 long rifle. He tossed a potato into the air and shot it into two pieces with the rifle. He tossed up another potato and shot it in two and then shot the pieces in two. Eventually some of our more athletic guys started throwing potatoes high into the air to see how many times Elmer could shoot the potato pieces before they hit the ground. The man was a very skilled marksman! Always wore an ugly “ten gallon” hat and carried a pistol at his side just like a gun slinger from a western movie. He was kind of like a living legend and yet still just one of the local guys.🤗
I had a buddy who owned a Mdl 29 once and I found out later he sold it because he was scared of himself. Breaks my heart that I didn’t get a crack at owning it.
A few years ago I bought some old magazines at a second hand store. They were American Rifleman 1956 and 57. New Blackhawk 44 magnum had a suggested retail of $96.
Worked at Sam Fowlers stockade in the 80s...met a lot of legends.....was the best job a teenage boy ever had.
Thanks for these videos. Enjoyable and informative.
Forgotten weapons actually fires Keiths first 44 mag S&W given to him by S&W. .
Thanks for teaching us millennials what is worth knowing.
Nice to know about EK didn't know he started the 44mag. I Frist saw it in Dirty Harry..now I carry it in my Desert Eagle 44 Magnum
Hello Ken & Bill, I made 9 hunting trips from Pa. to the Salmon River Country beginning in 1991. I hunted some of the same drainages Elmer did but never knew it till I read his book '' Hell I Was There ''. I visited the Elmer Keith museum in Salmon before they moved it to Boise. Shoup in a neat little place and had my hunting buddy take my picture in front of the gravity flow gas pumps at the General Store. From what some of the locals told me back then, Elmer was a living legend in the Salmon River Country !
The 44 magnum is the 30/06 of the handgun world. It does it all from elephant down to rabbit. Properly loaded of course. I own a Model 329PD as my 44 magnum. Changed out the titanium cylinder it came with and use a Model 629 stainless steel cylinder instead. Quad ported by Mag-na-port too. Love that revolver.
I own a 460 Smith and Wesson magnum revolver with a 5 inch muzzlebrake equipped barrel. Like the 5 inch barrel balance. And also have a 500 Smith and Wesson revolver with a 6.5 inch barrel semi-lug barrel.
Great story,of the guy at the Bar unknowingly, calling out the inventor/Father of the .44 Magnum!
I enjoyed this video great job fellas
Thanks 👍
EK was part of a unique breed. I learned about him from another great man’s writings : John Taffin
Great video, thanks for sharing.
I didn't want the fuss of two 44 magnums. When they first came out with Dan Wesson an 8" heavy 44 magnum was at a gun show, it came home with me. Later a 4" light and 8" light were added
I love the 44 Magnum, thank you Elmer!
Elmer Keith there was a legend. So are those two.
My great uncle was named Arthur "Red" Thompson. He lived ihn Salmon, Idaho at the time and was one of the co-inventors of the .357 Magnum round there with Elmer Keith. As a boy I grew up listening to his stories about working and shooting with Elmer and their adventures. I am so thankful for this episode. Thank You.
.338-378 KT is one also to mention that later became .338-378 Wby .
Love this...it is akin to listening to two, that have been there and done that, reminisce about the glory of honor, good friends, fine arms and good stories.
I LOVE being an American and our proud gun culture.
Elmer Keith. He was big bore gun fan. the bigger the cal. the more he liked it. He did not like those speedy little cal too much..
Out and out vandalism on Elmer's part, shooting guns while indulging in adult beverages, and gambling to boot. I would have loved to have been there to watch this. I myself carried an S+W M-29 while I lived and worked in Alaska. I could shoot it ok but now that I am old, I prefer more reasonable handguns. If I need a 44 mag, then I am going to want a Rifle.
Try .41 magnum. Easier on the wrist, similar power.
Get a 44 Magnum lever action, they are a hoot to shoot. I have a JM stamped Marlin 1894 in 44 Magnum, and I love it!
That’s a good Elmer story. I also like the one about the seagull on the wing. 👍🏻🇺🇸
👍 for the story l do like my 44 ☺️
Awesome! 👍🏻😃
When I shoot my .357 magnum revolvers, I generally use .357 magnum. I’ll be 60 years old soon, so that might change later. While I’ve shot .44 magnum, it’s not my thing.
Because I couldn't find a 29 I bought a Ruger Redhawk to take into bear country. (1982) 20,000 rounds through it now.
Worked 82 till 85 at the counter of the Sporting Goods store . Back then model 29 s were marked a Hundred Dollars over Retail and on Display . They were in Demand and people would pay the extra 100 to have one . You made a wise choice with the Ruger .
I have had a 10.5 bbl Super Blackhack for a long time now, great gun. Just bought a 9.5 bbl Super Redhawk a few days ago. Can't wait to compare them.
@@demandred1957 I bought a super blackhawk years ago with a 10.5 inch bbl on it and couldn't stand it so I cranked in a vice and sawed 5.5 inches off of it made a real gun out of it in my opinion if you want a carbine buy a carbine if you want a handgun buy a handgun nothing over 5.5 inches long for my handguns
@@jeffreyhershey5754 good way to ruin a fine gun.. I'm sure you could have sold it to someone that would have appreciated it, and bought whatever you wanted with the proceeds.
@@demandred1957 they were cheap and plentiful back then
Dirty Harry in one of the movies said that he only shot .44 specials.
You 2 guy’s are true gentleman and professional, and more so legends also 🍸great videos as always SIR🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
What about the .45 single action that Elmer Keith blew up. I think it was an original first generation too. You can actually buy the blown up cylinder. The problem was Elmer Keith used a .458 diameter projectile in a .454 bore causing an explosion. His obsession was getting heavier and heavier bullets to go faster. He purchased some .45 bullets for .45-70 and loaded them in a .454 bore which caused the pressure to spike. The single action army actually has relatively thin cylinder walls. The single action army was designed for Black powder pressures. A gun smith recommend that he should use a smith and Wesson .44 special revolver to hot load. And from there a legend was born. Dick Casull would actually make the .454 Casull cartridge. It would take until 1983 to get a commercial mass produced revolver out to the market.
(1971) But being that this is a .44 Magnum, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well do ya, punk?
"you sob..."
I gotsta know...I gotsta know.....
actually at that time the 44 mag was not the " most powerful handgun in the world ".
@@Krobear 454 Casull in 1958 . Even though S.A.A.M.I. didn't list it until much later .
(1973) It’s a light special. This size gun it gives me less recoil, better control, like a .357 Magnum with Wadcutters!
A 5" model 29. My dream. The Henry Bowman special
.44 Mag may not be the top of the muzzle energy heap, but the 250 grain LSWCs I drive to 1400 fps using H110/WW296 from my 6 1/2" M29 Classic, do anything I could want a revolver to do, all the while cutting clover leafs on targets.
Just seeing that gorgeous presentation/commemorative.44 Magnum was enough. Listening to two living legends tops it off. Thanks guys.
It’s really a shame that the supposed successor to the .44 Mag, the .41 Magnum, never really took off, especially considering it came out before the .44 got that push in sales by the Dirty Harry franchise.
A 41 Magnum is an awesome gun!
The 41mag is actually a "better fit" in the S&W N-frame. The 41 is just that little bit smaller that results in much better margins in critical places like in the cylinder notches.
I shot IHMSA around 1980 and a 57 would last much longer than a 29 with "silhouette loads".
You had me at Elmer. Let us hope the Lehmi County Big Bore Revolver Shoot is a go this Fall. My 338 RCM came with 3 empty cases.
Don't put Elmer Keith in the title then not talk about him and blather on about Dirty Harry.
Guns and Geezers with guidance. Nice 👍
Nice. I have the Elmer Keith Commemorative M29. Wonderful revolver. Excellent trigger.
Why is .357 even in this title? There was one offhand mention. 🤔
Also, you’d think he’d at least take out the .44 and show us what appears to be a beautiful gun. 🤦🏼♂️
Yeah, I am a bit disappointed with this episode. But for the price of the ticket, not a bad show.
Maybe because Elmer had a hand in the .357 as well.
Elmer was a 44special n frame Smith and Wesson man
Model 24
For people out there that shoot, but do not have a revolver, do yourself a favor and get a S&W (pre-lock) .357 Magnum Revolver. Believe me when I tell you, that you will never regret it.
They are sweet shooters and can the ammo can be ramped up or down as needed.
Darn right. The first handgun i ever bought was a 4" 686, brand new, right after my 21st bday. I ourposely wanted the L frame, in order to stand up better to pmenty of magnum rounds. It is the last gun i would ever sell, and one of the most accurate guns i own. Ditto for the 6" M28 (N frame) that i bought about 22 yrs later. I have 2 K frame magnums also, mostly shot with 38 or 38+p, and some otheer S&W revolvers, but the 686 is my favorite.
Elmer Kieth and Colonel Cooper my two biggest heroes
after dirty harry the pawn shops were full of 44s,people didn,t know how much gun they had ...lol
and then Clint Eastwood came along in "Dirty Harry" and then they flew off the shelves. Love my 29'.
Yep still have my minty 1991 model 629-3 44 mag with the 8 3/8 in barrel !!!!
I have the original Dirty harry box set model 29
Elmer Keith could shoot alright. He killed deer at 500 yds. with that gun.
I grew up reading Elmer Keith
Yep, Andy, me too.
Always enjoy gun guys videos. Often wondered if Bill ever thought about tweeking revolvers as he has with 92's and the polymer guns.
They need to show the pistol better but maybe they don’t want to touch it but come on man!!
San Francisco police inspector Dave Toschi carried 44 Mag 29 and the Dirty Harry charactor is based after him.
Thanks for the history :) Besides firing handguns in 22LR, 38 special, 9mm. I've fired the 357 (which stings my palm a bit), 45 ACP, hot loaded 45 Colt rounds with my 7-1/2" Bisley Blackhawk, and 454 Casull in my R92 lever gun (but not in a revolver). When comparing the 44 magnum, you've mentioned the other bigger magnum calibers .454, 480, 460, 500. Where does the .480 Ruger fit in, in terms of power, felt recoil, range, energy on target, when compared to the other big bore revolvers?
I bought a Mod 29 with 6 1/2 bbl while I was stationed in Gernany...in late 73 for $205.50 though the Illesheim Rod and Gun club...it was the last one in the S&W bonded warehouse inUlm...which they were closing down...unfortunately it was stolen in Feb of 82..still have the tag from the post MPs...
I'm in the same general age range as Ken and Bill and remember many tales about Elmer Keith. Ken was spot-on about there being various opinions of the man. My favorite gunsmith met him once at an industry show during the cocktail hour. He admitted to me in retrospect that he probably would not have been so frank with Elmer had he not already enjoyed a few drinks. His comments had something to do with bovine scatology. Suffice it to say Elmer was not impressed and promptly turned around and left the conversation. In fairness to Elmer, my gunsmith had far coarser things to say about Charles Askins, whom he had dealt with on numerous occasions. I freely admit these men could out-shoot me on their worst days, and since we only have their version of events to go by, I am hesitant to claim they ever embellished the truth. I do wonder though.
Regarding the S&W Model 29, Ken's experience matches mine, only by the time I could afford one, they were as scarce as hen's teeth. I ended up buying one from a fellow Air Force officer, a 4" blued version which I later had tuned. I finished off a 700 pound Waterbuck with it, using a custom 255 grain load I'd worked up for my one and only African adventure. I still have this fine revolver, but it is relegated to dispensing with varmints around the house while loaded with rat shot.
.44 mag is all the power you need in a handgun, if you need more, get a rifle.
Yup. It's the most powerful handgun I care to shoot. I love my 7.5" Blackhawk. Love shooting specials through it. If I need more than that imma grab my 308 winchester.
44 mag 340 gr +p+ has more energy from a 7.5 barrel than a 5.56 from a 20 inch barrel
I love the 44. I knew of it from the movie but never considered it. I only went to it because the 357 was such a disappointment to me. The 44 fits me perfectly and is so pleasent to shoot.
I lived at 117 Lombard street in Salmon. I would mow the yard for Loraine Keith every week. After I finished she would have me come in and write out a check in the living room. I always told her just seeing Elmer's trophy's was enough. I spent every cent on ammo to go out to the old National Guard range by the air strip.
Hello, I made 9 elk hunting trips from Pa. to Salmon and would always go to the range out by the airport to shoot my rifle, and I would always shoot from the bench dedicated to Elmer Keith. I fell in love with the town of Salmon and wished I had been born and raised there. I am jealous of the people that call the Salmon River Country home !
Ken says, I always tell people. Ken is the i always tell people expert.
according to taticool experts nowdays there is no diference in performance between a 44 mag/357 mag full house and 9mm ball ammo....
Haha yeah suuuure
A record polar bear at that.
Dirty Harry used a 41 in the movie
Just my two cent, maybe 1.5 cent opinions but... Magnums require hearing protection otherwise you will hate them. Magnums require rubber grips or you will hate them. Practice with a magnum is indeed more comfortable with "specials" but you must run a fair amount of hunting/defense loads as they handle differently. If you hand/wrist hurts ask yourself if you are getting enough vitamin D... I machine steel for a living and trust me my hands have seen more punishment than any handgun delivers. I love my 629 .44 it shoots like a dream. I have had a Python for over 40 years now... rough with wood grips but so nice with rubber grips. Latest magnum is a post '19 King Cobra and wow that little gun barks but such a smooth trigger (Python guy saying that!). Yup, love WC and buy bits an pieces for my 1911s.
This is gold! I just don't understand how folks could give this a thumbs down......
Elmer was the reason I got my .44mag. in the mid 60's.
When are we going to convert to metric?
Your talks are very interesting-almost like being a fly on the wall during a private conversation. Thank you again. I enjoy your talks!
wilson should have locked up the manurhin import rights the way nighthawk has korth
Great video - thank you both very much!
John Lachuck must be remembered as a .44 father & not in Keith's shadow either.
Great video, thanks for posting!!
Eilmer was an inspiration.
Of all the guns I own my 357mag is the best most accurate shooting caliber I own.
My dad gave me a Ruger Blackhawk 3 screw flat top in .44 mag made in the late 50's. It's built like a tank, hard as hell on the bare hands to shoot, and my absolute favorite gun to carry while hiking in the woods. The way I see it if the .44 is to rough on you took shoot then you should probably take up knitting or something else
Best show on the net!
Lol that dude missed shaving half his mustache
I am a fan of 357 Mag with a 6inch barrel it shootw very well I shoot moe acurate with it than many others I have shot . Even at longer ranges for handguns it does well when friends were shooting at a 5 galon bucket about 150 yards wiyj there rifles I fired st it eith my 357 & nailed it 8 times out of 89 rounds that were very clos e on the edge of it in the dirt. We also shit some calys set up on the ground at 80 feeet awaywe could not hit them so well 2-4 shots at most with a glock it took most of the time but with my 6 inch barrel 357 mag I hit 1 qfter another 1 round at atme. ANOTHER TARGER AT THE INDOOR RANGE IF A MAN HOLDING A WOMEN WITH A PISTOL BARREL ON HER HEAD jUST ABOUT 1/2 OF HIS HEAD EXPOSRD BEHIND HER HEAD 3/4 OF ALLTHE WAY OUT i FIRED 12 ROUNDS AT IT i GOT ALL OF THEM THROUGH HIS HEAD WITH 1 IN IT THROUGH A BIT OF HERHAIR IN FRONT OF HIM ONLY MIGHT HAVE CUT A LITTTLE HAIR BUT ONLY HURT/KILLD HIM i DID SHOOT WELL WITH A 9MM gLOCK AT A GUN SHO AT Rauhauges PHEASANT CLUB & SHOOTING RANGE & CLAY PIGEN RANGE OUNT IN norco cORONA ca THEY HSD A SOOT 1 ROUNDS AT A T SHIRT ON A GROUND THING DIVING IT SROUND WHILE YOU SHOT ST IT & YOU KEEP THE OLD TSHIRT YOU CHOOST TO USE WHEN YOU SHOOT ST IT AT THE END OF THE DSY NOT MSNY SOING IT. tHE GUY ACTED LIKE i HAD NOT SHOT A SEMI AUTO HAND GUN BEFORE THEN SAID SA WHEN YOUR READY AN WE WILL START IT TO GO. i HAS SEEN IT MOVED AROUND AND SHOT Y OTHERS BUT WHEN i SAID ok READY IT CAME STRAIGHT AT ME AS FAST AS IT WOULD GO i SHOT AS FAST AS i COULD NO USING THE SIGHTS THAT FAST WITH RECOIL i WENT THROUGH 10 ROUNDS BEFORE MY GIRL COULD GET HER CAMERA FROM HER CHEST TO HER FACE IT SOPED RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE TABLE IT TRACELED 25-20 FEET AND i WAS SURPRSWD WHAT i saw with the guy runnning it fingersan inch -2 apart up & down & the same distance apart 2468 he put his fingers in the holes 7 SAID GOOD SHOOTING AND WITH HIS EYES VERY WID E OPEN AND HIS JAW DROPPED DOWN MOUTH OPENED WIDE i KNEEW IT WAS THE DRILL OF THE FUY RUNNING AT OFFICERS WITH Q KNIFE . tHE VIDEO i SAW THEY SDID NOT DO WELL AT ALL i MOTIONED TO MY GIRL NOT TO SHOW ANY EXITEMENT & NEITHER DID i WE WALKED UP THE GRADE TO THE TOP PF THE PARKING AREA WHEE A VETERAN WAS SITTING AT THE CORNER IIF THE TARP HUNG ;OKE S BOOTH . aFTERHEARING M SHOTS MADE SO FAST HE AYS AO HOW DID YOU TO i JUST HELD UP THE TSHIRT TO SHOE THE PATERN OF TWO ROWS OF FIVE 1INCH ALIIGHNED 1" APART RIGHT ON TOP OF EACH OTHER . hI JUMPED IN THE AIR KNOCKING HIS FEET TOGETHER TELLING VERY LOUD nice shooting i HOPE THET HEARD IT i KNOW IT WAS THAT DRILL THET TRIED BECAUSE WHEN i SAW THE GUYS FACE THAT HANDED ME THHE GUN TO SHOOT i TURNED AND SAW THE GUY RUNNING THE THING WTH WHEELS BELOW IT LOOKING AT HIM WITH THE SAME WIDE EYED OPEN MOUTH LOOK AT THE OTHER GUY LIKE HOW DID HE JUST DO THST SO FAST ? i even thought the same I never rewlly shot that fast with a handgun before in the desert with my dad and tou cant do it at the indoor rangeor they will kick you out I think. HAHAI passed that drill very well Not saying I could do it agaibn but maybe I dont know ? just Happy I did it then by surprise & kept the t shirt not sure where it is it was years ago if I find it I want to frame it
am I the only one who wishes he could zoom in and see what the books are on the shelf in the background?
Dirty Harry used 44 special rounds cuz that was more than enough energy to punch through a car window. Most people think it was full Magnum loads.