So Who Wrote the Bible? - A Conversation with Terryl Givens
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- As we have collectively turned our attention to the study of the Hebrew Bible, what is known to most Christians as the Old Testament, we at Faith Matters turn our attention to a perennial question: Who actually wrote these books?
We plan to have at least a few conversations in the coming year on how to engage the Hebrew Bible. To kick it off, we invited Terryl Givens to our studio to help us frame some of the big-picture issues, for example:
Who wrote the Bible?
How should we read it?
What theological and ethical dilemmas does it force us to confront?
How is it relevant today?
As you might expect, it was a candid and fascinating conversation. We hope you’ll leave this conversation asking better and deeper questions as you engage the books of the Hebrew Bible.
I would be interested in an interview such as this with a biblical scholar like Daniel McClellan.
I often think we do a disservice by grouping the Old Testament as a single book. Each book has its own author, purpose, and history.
That’s an interesting point. It could be true for all scripture and sometimes even stories within individual books of the New Testament.
I am wrestling with that issue (what can be discussed) myself and right now. (Like literally this morning) I teach Course 14 and long to discuss nuance and symbolism but don't want to contribute to skepticism or doubt. But these are smart kids. They likely have doubts about the literalness of the flood and tower...
@@rdtenney Every class is different. My advice is to focus on their needs more than your own. The moral and symbolic lesson doesn't change between those who believe in a more factualist history and those who believe it is a myth. Come Follow Me seems focused on what lessons we can apply to our circumstances today.
Soooo much to learn. Thank goodness we have an eternity to learn, apply, and become.
Repentance to me is illustrated by the Japanese word KAIZEN... "continuous (personal) quality improvement" ... learning of and becoming more and more like Jesus.
Great stuff Faith Matters. I’m extremely grateful for your nuanced and faithful conversations. It is a strange world we live in knowing the things about scripture that are covered here but unable to talk about them from the pulpit, in our Sunday School.
Well that varies from ward to ward. Givens is a Sunday School teacher.
@@brettmajeske3525 you’re right but I think it’s fair to say he and his ward are an exception rather than the rule in a church that really likes the rule.
@@Sayheybrother8 There may be more exceptions than you think. My ward is pretty open, and David for the Saints Unscripted channel is a Sunday School President, and he seems simular. There are many Wards and Stakes that are very conservative, but there are also many progressive ones as well. I can be difficult telling differences when visiting other wards.
Great interview as always! I hope Ben Spackman is one of the interviews you have lined up for the Hebrew Bible!
Thank you for your insight, understanding and caring deeply. You are one of my favorite scholars! We are blessed to have you to enlighten us.
This was just so thrilling and thirst quenching to me spiritually and biblically. I am excited to read some things that Teryl talked about.
So interesting. I love Faith Matters podcasts.
A truly great interview. So much good stuff here.
Shocked! So happy for this channel! Keep up the good work. Stunned why we aren’t taught this at church!
They don’t have to teach you ,is your obligation “ponder”and research the scriptures and be a thinker and the holy spirit confirm .
Great stuff! Please keep it coming!
How enlightening and liberating it is to see the Old Testament (and all scripture) in more complete context, i.e., imperfect mortal men or women doing their best to transcribe with imperfect language events and principles of significance to humankind, knowing that no account, however meticulously constructed, can directly transmit the writer's experience to the reader's heart. We, therefore, accord them grace, and allow their account to prompt us to seek enlarged understanding given by the spirit, which then brings us, perhaps, closer to the original intent prompting the author to record.
Thank you!
Terryl Givens is da man!
In conference we’ve heard so many times where they quote other versions. A very fun app is Bible Gateway. You can go to a verse abs scroll through over 50 different versions. A favorite of mine to sit next to KJV is The Message. It’s written like you and I were sitting at a table. This would not be beautiful so I’m sure you won’t hear it quoted in conference 😊. But to read it and then go to king James is so great!!! I love scrolling through lots of translations of a scripture. Bible Gateway is one of several apps out there that do this. We are so blessed to have so many wonderful resources to enhance our study!
Funny… I wrote my comment just before bro givens suggested E Sword😊. I’m adding that app right now! Bible Gateway and E Sword! Awesome!
Can you please provide me a source of where Elder Oaks and others have said that we don’t believe the Scriptures is the source of ultimate truth but the spirit is? I don’t have a problem with that but I’m just curious
Thank you. This gives me hope. What translation of the Bible did they recommend. What were the lovely verses at the end.
At 18:50 Brother Givens references a quote by Brigham Young about the authorship of the scriptures. Is there anyone out there who knows the reference for that statement?
KjV version is great. Expanded New Testament is great. The German Luther version is beautiful and expansive.
I appreciate most of what the Givens do but when we start referring to the Holy Ghost in female pronouns when in scripture it is clearly male pronouns I think that's a problem. Could it be a misinterpretation and "he" should be a "she"? Maybe, but then you open up everything in scripture to a wide variety of interpretation and it all becomes much less impactful as a document of truth. The Holy Ghost being referred to in male pronouns is consistent through the BoM and the New Testament and D&C. I just think we should be careful and not change important things to suite the flavor of the present time.
I wrote it
On the question about Leviticus, may I humbly suggest the masterful book by Rabbi Jonathan Sacks - Leviticus: The Book of Holiness in his Cevenant and Conversation series?
It is important you should understand that the pressure of public opinion weighed with Jesus' followers. While they truly believed Jesus had brought a "soul-saving" message to the Jews and was the Messiah, the "Son of God", they were also of the world, trying to relate to the world as best they could. Therefore, although they knew Jesus' reactive feelings towards Jewish beliefs, they were not happy to dispense with the Old Testament altogether, since the Old Testament had supported and kept the Jews together throughout their history. In the interests of preserving what they thought to be valuable in the old dispensation, they suppressed any description of the "person" Jesus was.
Jesus' disciples and Paul built their own complex system of "sacred beliefs" on what they wanted to preserve from Jesus' life and teachings. They only taught and consolidated what they deemed to be valuable to people - Jews and Gentiles alike - at that time and in the future.
Consequently, they distilled what they could use and they "let go" most of what Jesus termed the "secrets of the Kingdom of God" for they never understood them. Nor found them desirable in the creation of a new perception of the Divine - the Father.
So to preserve the Jewish belief in "salvation from punishment for sins" by means of sacrifice in the Temple - the "person of Jesus" was adopted as the "supreme" sacrifice who had paid for men’s sins by his crucifixion. This belief served many purposes at that time.
It gave Jesus' death on the cross a valid and heroic reason. It proved to the people that Jesus was the "Son of God" who had carried out a specific mission to the very end of his life.
This belief also proved to be of great comfort to Jews when their Temple was destroyed by the Romans - and led to many converts taking place.
Many sects of Jews and Gentiles - also did not believe in life after death. Consequently, it was greatly comforting to hear that "Jesus Christ" had overcome death and retained his body. Too much human thought, life was not possible without a body. Therefore, life after death could only mean the resurrection of the body.
It also kept Jesus' name constantly alive in the minds of people. Jesus was the "historic figure" who had valiantly died to ensure that men should be freed of all fear of hell and damnation. Providing they believed in "Jesus", they could walk as "freed men".
CHRIST'S LETTERS from CHRIST'S WAY
www.thechristletters.weebly.com
There are times in our lives when we seek to interpret scripture to fit our own genre', trying to shape God into our liking but the truth of the matter is we need to conform to our Creator not to characterize or design our God according to our infallibilities or personal definitions. After all, without Him there is no hope or prospect of advancement, especially if we have our own judgments to make upon Him and condemn Him because He does not agree with our terms. The problem with translations is not the translator or the translation but the reader not having the Spirit to identify and qualify the purpose and meaning of scripture for personal worth. Language, culture, genre, chronology and customs are external to divine inspiration albeit informative. Whether one has the Peshitta, TANAKH or the Septuagint or KJV, the real interpretation comes from the Spirit otherwise we are doomed to our own ignorance and scholarly interpretations that are subject to inherent discrepancies.
Or Ben spmackman...
His he approach more philosophical approach? His asking the bigger questions in life which only mature and old souls will be able to answer those questions however most establishment faiths tend to be attached to immature dogma and fundamentalism I don't believe God is a biological being I see God with the big G energy and lives in every cell and atom to planets and stars and so much more understanding and unconditional love ❤️ the negative events are there for our growth and challenges for us to over come them with wisdom I've learnt wisdom are three ingredients knowledge., experience and compassion is the keys for wisdom or the other recipe I'd intelligence, experience and experience and third ingredients are prophecy , compassion and compassion again these three way are the trinity of experience to the path of wisdom and the path of ignorance is the path that challenges those three paths I've got to say the philosopher Alan watts makes me laugh and surprises me our biological form is the template and temporary figures to go through these events...we have to over come three emotional lessons 1 fear 2 addiction 3 power these are the 3 main problems we all having problems with and we have to ascend these 2 material problems it gets easier if we can deal with fear first these are the lessons for me to Master we are masters and mystics not master and slaves at all .
Ps also mastering universal laws and soul ages will help with understanding and clarity.
NABRE is a good Bible with simple, scholarly notes 🗒️