I will say that me and my locals have had to make a new format to Play after and before the tourney where we play the worst of the worst decks and its been fun (Vehicroids, valkyries, ect.)
@apsamplifier the way I cope with online formats not being the most fun is build a more slow deck (bad compared to current decks) for fun and try to win. Currently I am playing a Kaiba Anime accurate deck (without Pot of Greed etc) and try to win (also I only play decks online that I have IRL to train them or chill out.
As a player trying to get back into Yu-Gi-Oh after a decade, and living in a fairly mid sized US city, it was really discouraging to see that all 7 dedicated game stores stopped carrying TCG products in the last few years. We have this really booming new shop too that carries everything else, but not Yu-Gi-Oh. You’re absolutely right, if you lose the casual gamers, the gig is over. That’s how the game actually dies.
@@DragonBallsolosyourverseit really is a plight for competitive players only. If casual players don't even care about locals anymore, it's the competitive community that needs to demand and drive change.
Is it a situation where more casual players may be getting their YGO fix in there form of products like duel links (mimic the anime) or master duel (plentiful matches available at the convenience of when the player wants). Tcgs recently have to brings something eye popping to get folks to buy in outside of legacy players or just bring the biggest game running (MtG).
I've been called an old head too many times saying that how YGO is now is way too toxic. They be like "oh you just like schoolyard YGO" I'm like no I like YGO where people can PLAY the game before you had a gimmick because the monster type your playing. Now all archetype have the same goal which is swarm, there's no real diverence in place. Whomever doesn't have a bricked hand wins be default and people KNOW this and still want to dare that "school yard YGO" was worse. The only bad opener back then was your homie had a Gemini Elf or they have a man-eater bug(s) ready. I always said competitive players that simply copy people's decks aren't good at the game. At that point you're not playing a TGC you're playing russian roulette
Play Duel Links or Master Duel. It’s not as expensive, but the older the account the more value it has accumulating cards that are one time event/life time releases.
@@Citizen_Nappa23Yea but how do u play with those cards? At home with ur friends probably unless you want people to go the locals and likely get stomped. And if u dont have friends around that also play then there's no reason at all to build a casual deck.
@@yurisei6732which is funny because OCG arguably more competitive as more players can reasonably get what they need to optimize their deck list in the OCG, leading to more; experimentation, practice, and a wider range of players.
@@otterfire4712the OCG is not more competitive at all, there’s just more competitive players because there’s a lot more players in general. There’s a giant trading card game and gambling culture in Asian countries therefore it’s just more popular over there whereas in the TCG most players are trying to play to win and wanna play the best deck no matter the price. People in the OCG don’t care about the “investment” and will buy packs no matter what and will build “bad” decks just to have fun casually compared to the TCG people want to pull the best cards for the best decks or they don’t feel fulfilled.
Thing is, when people said yugioh was dying all those other times, they were kinda right. It has been dying this whole time. Players who love the game make fun of this everytime while this game fails to grip new players and loses old ones because the game continues. They think it means like getting hit by a car or something. That it's going to be a sudden death, so therefore when that doesn't happen all the detractors are wrong. What they don't realize is that it's more like getting a terminal illness that slowly saps your strength until you're just a husk. Yugioh players are like those smoker who insist they'll never get cancer at 20 and die at 35
judging by all the people on this video's comment and paul's other video, I don't think these die-hard yugioh players will even see it that way. All they care about are their "prize support" and VaLuE cArDs!1!11!. These idiots don't get the fact that they can't cash out if no one buys their OVERPRICED cardboard. These guys would rather die on that hill than admit they were wrong.
Different take: Stagnation is worse than decline. At least with decline companies take notice quickly and are willing to take risks to reverse course. Staganation doesn't feel detrimental enough to take risks, but not exciting enough either.
exactly. Stagnation means the company saw the decline, fixed JUUUUST enough to keep the diehard playerbase and is purposely keeping it that way because they know the remaining people are just sheep who will meatride whatever they do but not get mad enough to quit
My thing is that the game isn't fun in the slightest anymore and we have a HUGE problem with getting new players bc of how damn confusing the game is sometimes. Konami just continually trips over itself.
The time it takes to set up a board is the single reason everyone I knew quit and why they quit master duel shortly after trying it when it came out. I've talked about it in way too many comment sections, but I think a lot of people really underestimate how much of a problem it is.
@@hermit3043Comp players like this sort of gameplay because it gives them "consistency." Yugitubers will, of course, shill for it because they're comp players.
I completely agree with new formats. It's kinda why I stepp3d away because I'm more personally into mid/low level decks or just much older formats. So a better more chill way to play yugioh is what I'd love to see. I feel like if Konami really tried they can get that spark rolling again
Every time the game has "died" it's lost a chunk of its playerbase. It's gotten real bad right now because LGS have no reason to stock their products and the decks themselves are imbalanced Pay2Win messes. It's definitely been on the downturn for a while. The prize support is nowhere near the biggest problem. Calling the prizing the problem is walking on eggshells that most sponsored players are saying. The ACTUAL problems are: 1.Imbalance 2.Price 3.Lack of Collectors/Value of Cards The reason why the regional and stuff have high attendance is because of sponsored players and Konami fudging things.
The reason people are even talking about prize support now is because it's only the competitive players left. You didn't hear the prize support complaints five years ago because there were way more casual players who didn't care what they weren't winning.
@@geek593 I wanted to include that but its subjective, gotta stick to the actual facts. I personally do not enjoy the game due to the speed and how sacky it is.
I stopped playing about 3-4 years ago because i hated hand traps.. i recently decided to try come back only to find we aint moved on from hand traps still 😑
@@MrSkullMerchant Because they're one of the few things holding this game together like duck tape. If we couldnt play on the opponent's turn, every deck would win based on the coin flip unless your name is Labrynth specifically.
@@four-en-tee i couldnt even get away from them though when i tried playing casualy with weaker decks, couldnt find anyone even my friends who would play without them.
@@MrSkullMerchant i have a few friends who hate handtraps, and anytime they wanna play, I just bust out something like Timelords or Magikey. That’s kinda the unfortunate thing, though; most people don’t keep a few low-tier decks in case of situations like that, or even if they do, they’ll stack em high with handtraps just assuming their opponents will also have em. in my case, i know for a fact that mine won’t. lol
I have been noticing a huge decline of product for a long time now in 90% of card shops that I have gone to. Also I feel like the whole yugioh is dying is that a huge portion of the community aren't big fans of what the game has become in the recent years and from most of the people in my play groups have all said that Konami doesn't diversify the game out side of the standard way we play the game. Either its either falls into 2 camps one Konami doesn't really support alt playstyles whether its old formats like goat, edizon, or HAT as well as any of the different playstyles that Konami listed that the player base should try out like deck master, heart of the underdog, etc. which is a shame because they make more money off of that product using reprints of older cards for a deck to play that specific playstyle or format. The second one is the way that they have 6 gens worth of yugioh going all at once or the speed & level of power creep that the game has generated has gone unchecked.
Which is ironic considering the premise of more than HALF the yugioh franchises are players competing for prize money or competing in a circuit as a way to make a living. In all honesty, the man was a hypocrite in that regard. Maybe he thought that would ruin the spirit of the game, but literally in EVERY OTHER GAME, even at the time, this was never the case. Perhaps he felt Pressured to make that assessment because he feared that playing cards for the possibility of winning money would be misconstrued as gambling, but that's a far reach to make in and of itself. At the end of the day though, he is no longer with us, and the game has long since outgrown the source material. To continue being bound by a condition set in the early 2000s, before even 30% of households had internet access, when the climate of hobbies and the abundance of TCGs has changed, is absolutely stupid. Even if they don't do cash prizing though, Lorcana and One Piece don't ans thier prizing is worth thousands. Hell, their collectors products are worth thousands, because they know how to appease both collectors AND players. Konami doesn't know how to appease either.
Fire King Snake Eyes decks, and popular style cards make me not care for Yugioh, I was a returning player, came back in 2018, now leaving again. Won't be back this time, dont care for prizing, its the card and game design that has ruined the it for me. Most people I know who care about Yugioh say the same thing. Yugioh used to be a strategic chess like game, now, its a glorified Voyuer simulater where a lot of players get off making you watch them play with themselves. It's laughable the anime spawned the garbage the TCG/OCG/MD has become.
The only people who arent saying Yugioh is dying are content creators and konami themselves. When everyone except the ones who are paid are saying its having major issues its pretty telling whats actually happening.
The part you made about the locals stopping supporting the game is pretty true in my area, 4 shops have stopped selling and holding events with Yu-Gi-Oh over the last 2 years, now they sell other games just not Yu-Gi-Oh as it's not profitable.
Rome also stagnated for a long time before eventually collapsing. Like, i dont think this is necessarily an issue for the entirety of Yugioh. Its mostly just the TCG. The OCG seems to be doing fine, and Master Duel is its own can of worms from what I understand. I will say that despite my issues with the recent "QCR Exclusive" fiasco with Magia, I at least appreciate that Konami is looking for ways to try and give sealed product more worth for vendors and collectors. Like, from a financial perspective, I think the future of this game's stability lies in the collector's market and I think that Konami further investing in it - as well as taking more risks with supplemental media like manga, anime & video games - could help to drive down the price of competitive Yugioh. Ideally, we want to be in the same position as Pokemon and have a strong multi-media presence, and unlike Magic the Gathering, Yugioh's far more capable of achieving that due to its anime aesthetic and many unique archetypes (each with their own lore and what have you). Stuff like the Sky Striker manga and the recent animation studio are huge steps in the right direction. The most that Magic the Gathering could really attempt with its IP by comparison is a TV series similar to Arcane (as well as the many novels that already exist). With the way that modern Yugioh is designed, our game is in a position where we could take bigger creative risks. Konami just has to be willing to do that. I also agree that this game desperately needs more alternative formats. Beyond Junior Journey, the closest i've seen that looks interesting at all is Domain Format. Its a singleton format like Commander, and i only really know about it because Pot of Greed is legal at 1 (go figure). I think the big problem though is that a lot of people who want an alternative format (that aren't already playing Time Wizard formats) want to still be able to play with the cards/decks that they currently own. God knows its why I spent half a year experimenting with the game's mechanics in my free time, and it was the only time where my siblings were willing to play Yugioh with me since the mechanics I was experimenting with allowed for pretty much any deck to do stupid shit and make a comback. For an alternative format to really take off, it'll need to not only encourage casual play, but also include the entire modern card pool. Like, someone should be able to take a deck like Labrynth for example and be able to make it work in that format (even if it may not be as strong as it currently is in MR5). It'd also be nice if it supported 3+ player FFA games, which admittedly is a difficult task since it begins to further complicate cards like Infinite Impermanence for example. The reason 3+ player games are important though for an alternative format is because it reduces the chances of following the meta and encourages players to do their own thing. The reason for this is due to "politicing", or the overall social aspect of the game. If you were to walk in with a meta deck, its very likely that people would just gang up on you (unless they're all playing meta) since it paints a target on your back. There's also ostracization to worry about if you want to continue playing within that friend group. In a casual 3+ player game, a strong deck also has to be perceived as fair if you don't want to get shit on for piloting it. Like, if your friends are playing pure versions of Blackwings, Dragonmaid and Plunder Patrol, and you show up with Runick Stun, everyone's gonna have a bad time unless they all just collectively gang up on you once the match begins.
I personally think the game is on it's last legs and has been on borrowed time for years for these few reasons 1: Crappy prize support : Other games are doing what YGO should be doing and that is is either giving out cash or exclusive good products that's worth money , like there's no reason we should be getting Nintendo switches OG models in 2024 as a part of prizes. Why can't they just give us high end tech products like they used to do back in the day? i remember upper deck giving out Alienware laptops for prizing in the early 2000s. 2: Lack of kids playing : Most of the kids that played when i was in my early 20s is now in their early 20s /late teens and my son's generation could care less about playing YGO considering things like fortnight host cash tournaments yearly.. 3: Stores not carrying YGO : Although my city has a decent competitive scene i know a lot of stores just don't deal with YGO because product rot on shelves but games like One Piece and Lorcana is selling like hotcakes with competitive circuits better than what konami is giving ygo players. I don't want the game to stop anytime soon however with everything i just listed it's just a matter of time before it flatlines , unless Konami does a complete 180 and give us better prize support and figure out a way to attract a new younger audience. I personally think they should just go the MTG route and make yugioh a 13+ cardgame and cater it to young adults with revised prize structure.
There is low support, printing is against budget, no casual formats, bad quality of products, banlist oriented for selling cards instead of fixing the problem immediately. It's not dying in Japan, but we know the game is handled differently there. I fear that the problem is like a Bell's Curve. Until they are going to raise the price and accessibility, the are gonna reach a level of dissatisfaction that will eventually be the downfall of the card game.
i get with the bois on a weekly basis to hang out drink smoke and play. we go to stores to buy shit to pull n it feels like shit goin into multiple stores and finding no products
Those players who hate the format but still play the game are the root of all problems. They are why the game sucks now and it will keep getting worse.
What needs to be limited is free effects and beneficial costs. Discarded Poplar as cost? It doesn't activate it's effect. Special summoned a boss monster? It includes a restriction/drawback. And for the love of Obelisk, they need to put a stop to free searches/draws.
@saviorselfX29 take that as a sign and don't sink your money into it. Yugioh depreciates RAPIDLY yet is super expensive to play. Sure that means yoy can play whatever you want after about a year for dirt cheap, but by that point it's no longer a viable deck to play.
@@TheCrimsonFrenzyPSNGod projecting like that on other people who are just having fun is so pathetic. Just stop playing if you are this negative and disenfranchised.
I’m lucky enough to have a playgroup of 7 and we have curated our own format. We play so many old cards as well as many of the new and it’s so much fun. Yugioh needs formats for sure .
11:09 the problem is also that every alternative format outside of modern, pioneer, legacy and vintage was community made and only later gained recognition by WotC when it was popular enough. So unless the community itself creates such format and then popularizes it I think it will flop. Konami attempts to create new formats in the past all kinda flopped.
True... Life is dynamic. But that also means yugioh never "truly existed" in the way soccer existed or exists. That there is no actually mature or smart game behind it. It's just the veil. Edit: It will never be in a good enough form by it's nature, to exist. Though I would consider GOAT and edison to be "existing" but they are not played because everything is answered. Everything gets answered on masterduelmeta every two weeks. So you have to upgrade and more cards and gimmicks because the game CANNOT stand on it's own two feel.
@@TheCrimsonFrenzyPSN I'm not sure if considering Edison solved. But the reason those formts are loved is because each hand requires a different solution. Modern games often feels to me like it runs on auto pilot. find starter, play starter do the same combo. Same line same choke points, etc. in older yugioh I feel like my plays are much more dynamic.
Yugioh is dying because it now finds itself in the unstopable power creep meta where only the strongest deck is played at a top level. If new players aren't welcomed with easy rules and fun interactions (hand traps/ 20 minute turns/ opponent playing during your turn are not fun to play against) then the community can only shrink and eventually die. They need a complete rules refresh with keywords, clearly defined interactions (no more cheating like non-targetting and ignoring conditions), limits to the amount of things that can happen per turn or even a resource system. for reference, in my opinion, the best TCG ever was WoWTCG. non-limiting resource system, keywords, amazing art, easy to understand rules, and a strong ip. Raid/Dungeon decks even allowed for PVE play with friends.
I think there's a very real threat at the moment because we're on the tail end of a TCG bubble. There were a lot of flop games but a handful have made it through the cracks. With limited time/space Yu-Gi-Oh should really buckle down and make a strong locals scene so it doesn't risk getting bumped down in favor of One Piece, Digimon, Lorcana or maybe even a dark horse like Grand Archive.
I'm conflicted lol I still want digimon to soar I'm pissed I had to sell off my cards so now Id have to start from scratch but with digimon you can still do that without coating you a million dollars to have good caught up collection
Yugioh isn't going to get bumped. One big thing it has going for it is that it's a huge and diverse game. There's an archetype for literally anyone. So if Konami ever feels like trying harder, they have loads of ways to attract people. Things like One Piece and Lorcana don't have this: the only people who will ever play the One Piece card game are people who liked the One Piece anime. The only people who will ever play Lorcana are people who like Disney animated movies (afaik they've not even added star wars or marvel yet).
@@yurisei6732 it is literally getting bumped…. Lgs bled out over RC01/RC02 reprints and the decimation of box values from the last 3 years. PS black rose is a top 3 fav card of mine I have the ghost and I love it 💕
It is absolutely dying, and has been for a long time. The player base is shrinking constantly. It might never outright "die", there will always be people playing, but it already feels dead, in real life I don't know a single person that plays it.
THANK YOU. Everyone talking about prizing like they are the next Jesse Kotton. Like calm down dude. The real issue is not that you did not get a 20 dollar Walmart gift card.
Your channel got me into Yugioh over the past two months or so, along with some kitchen table games with friends. I’m a longtime Magic player and when trying to build my first decks (Winged Dragon of Ra and Red-Eyes Burn) I’ve noticed that many of the card shops in my area don’t stock Yugioh anymore. All of them used to, from what I remember, but I’m having a genuinely difficult time finding a local store that has a good supply of singles to look through. It feels like a case of always being able to find something until you’re actually looking for it. I’ve greatly enjoyed my brief dip into the game and I hope things pick up soon. Right now I’m having to resort to online stores and haven’t found a good one for yugioh singles. Thanks for all your entertaining and informative content. It helped convince me to try the game.
My issue with Snake eyes is that they steal so many cards from other fire archetypes driving up prices for people that want to play things like salamangreat or fire king. I wish Konami would start making summon requirements more specific so this stops happening.
I hate that everyone wrote off Salamangreat Raging Phoenix when it was revealed but now it's like $50 because of Snake-Eyes. Should've bought when it was cheap.
What fire king card did they spike up? I honestly think the only cards they have "stole" are raging Phoenix and sunlight wolf, with the former being the one that was really driven up in price. Then you have princess that is generic support for fire decks in general. I recall heatsoul being used before but it is not really played now.
@@chewdoom8415 maybe they aren't "stealing" fire king cards but I've seen plenty of hybrid snake eyes fire king decks which probably bumped the prices for some stuff a bit.
I too hope konami sees the wrong of their ways and care for game over money. I'm sure their servers run on Number 38: Hope Harbinger Dragon Titanic Galaxy. I promise you, you'll always be disappointed putting your faith in a mature company like konami
@@Nominod I was really challenging what you said about snake eye impacting various fire archetypes. The impact they have on the affordability of fire staples is valid, but that really only applies to one archetype, which is Salamangreat. Princess, as I said, does boost the power of fire decks as a whole, but that is only two cards that were really inflated by being staples in the deck.
The lack of cash prizes wouldn't be an issue, if this game was affordable. Playing competitively in a game that doesn't have cash prizes, shouldn't require these absurd cash sinks. Which is part of a bigger problem. It's too expensive, which makes it harder for new people to jump in. Look at Deck Builder sets. They're just over priced, worse versions of Structure Decks.
Free time seller here: I confirm that investing in YU-Gi-OH! Cards is often a huge waste of money and time, no one buys commons. i wish there would be a format like MTGs pauper were only common prints of card are legally to play -.-
"It's just maintenance right now" At least with online games, your game is usually dead or dying if it's in "maintenance mode". Even if new blood can be brought in, they're throw into the high-power, complicated mess that is Yugioh. That's a huge barrier, which is why formats are needed.
*The last time I played Yu-Gi-Oh at Locals was February 2020, before Covid was a major virus. I agree that over those last 4 years Yu-Gi-Oh changed a lot.I can't really say , if the changes are detrimental or good since the last time I played Yu-Gi-Oh was February 2020.*
Yu-Gi-Oh is always dying until it's not. Every format or tier 0 deck everyone starts the same chant every time. As long as people buy the cardboard the game is alive.
I fully agree with the need for multiple formats in Yu-gi-oh. The single format at one point and time around the time i stopped playing competitive had expensive staple singles due to the pull rate of the staple. It was difficult if not impossible to continue in the competitive scene at a local level. I ended up turning to Magic and Pokemon TCG, both have mechanics built into the game that keeps the games from having the same issues I ended up having in Yu-gi-oh. The fast pace gameplay that Yu-gi-oh ended up having where games were basically decided in turn 2-3 of a game quite often was why I ultimately left. Pokemon uses energy on Pokemon that outside of a card allowing it ( usually on stuff that is like a stage 2 pokemon ) made it so you could only play one energy card a turn, You also couldn't outside of card effects evolve a pokemon on turn 1, which is another mechanic that kept the game from being speed ran. As for MTG that multiple formats including Commander which was fun watching yall on Team APS play Commander on tolarian community college on Shuffle up and play. And I recall with another show where yall were with the Professor you pointed out how the multiple formats MTG had made it a more accessable game and that yall wish Konami would do something similar with Yu-gi-oh. It's something yall were pointing out before and am glad yall are continuing to address the issues that Konami has. The Hobby of Yu-gi-oh is just a cash cow that disenfranchises the budget players. An issue that other card games just don't have and stuff that other card games are able to do that Konami can't. But that's just my thoughts I have based on my own experiences with alternative card games.
I live in the Bay Area and I literally can’t find nowhere to play every locals are really far yugioh has died over here I remember when I was lil yugioh shops where everywhere not anymore
Locals also tend to shoot themselves in the foot. Like my shop for example, they barely advertise Yugioh events they're having. I find out about them days before hand from friends and such asking if I was planning to sign up. Idk, card games are in a weird place.
Unfortunately, alternate yugioh formats just aren't really possible at all. That's why none of the people asking for them have actually stated what specifically they're wanting. Making a format in Yugioh is really just picking a date and banning all cards released after it, which is arbitrary.
Prize money is not an issue. That's irrleevant for 99.999 % of players. The issues are: 1. Pricing. The game is too expensive to the point a single card is worth more than an entire deck in othr games. 2. YGO cards are the absolute worst value when it comes to collecting. Other games will have variant rarities, variant arts, full arts, special editions, etc. YGO has the same card with a bit of foil at most and that's it. Cards from the 10th anniversary are worth 10 ¢ each because each and everyone of them is identical to every single version ever printed. 3. Rarity is absurd. In other games you may get the same card in different rarities, here the default rarity for staples or important archetype cards is Secret or above. That's absurd. 4. All card games got a huge bump during/after COVID. Konami got cocky and assumed the game gained popularity organically when in reality it was a momentaneous bump and it continued due to the hype caused by quarter century collections. 5. "wait 20 minutes for your turn and maybe discard Blossom. Now it's your turn... Just wait 5 more minutes during Standby so the opponent can continue his combo. Now it's Main but the opponent will negate every single action you make and destroy every card you play. Buy more packs btw"
They're gonna appeal to comp players when players after the initial success either went onto comp play or grew outta it. When I was in highschool in the late 00s early 10s you either dropped Yu-Gi-Oh as you grew up or you stuck with it so it made sense to narrow into the niche because they're the players who consistently where keeping the lgs in business and by extension more ways to sell product.
@@GG_Nowa That's a fallacy. The comp scene of any game is always a small niche percentage, not all players will go into comp. If a game attracts tons of new players, some of which end up going into comp, that means the main appeal of the game is not the comp scene. Appealing to that just means you won't attract new players and you're betting on old players sticking to it. But as it has happened with YGO and countless games appealing to the comp scene means the game loses what attracted new players to begin with. Again, players want to play the game, not sit down watching the opponent shuffle for 20 minutes and then attempt to play. Back in the day (and by that I mean every single format until Master Rule 5) OTK/FTK decks were considered the least fun to play against. They were considered the least interactive and even unfair playstyles so they were heavily restricted. By streamlining the game and making it focused only on OTK/FTK strategies they alienated every single old player except the small minority that liked that playstyle. It doesn't make any sense. The print policy of the TCG is also awful. Konami is attempting to milk a fanbase that doesn't exist.
It definitely goes through phases. Just recently the new six sam support has got me back in because I love playing six sam & it'll cost me nothing since I have all the staples for the deck. I'm back in that easy.
Your thoughts are always great Paul. Your feeling about Yu-Gi-Oh starting to feel more and more constricted I've definitely also had. Best of luck for the future.
I use 0 hand traps in my deck I use horus with paloe traps iv reached masters in master dule snake eyes seams to have a hard time with this combination however I'm not saying I win every game but I'd say is 50 50 now
I have noticed walmart and targets cards have maybe 1 or 2 spots for yugioh and a shelf for everything else kinda annoying even locals are almost none i have one that has second hand cards but no new box contents so the if i want cards its online shopping now
This whole video has told me that I’m doing the right thing by giving folks a good and super casual match with a pure rose dragon\plant deck. I’m the breath of fresh air needed 😂
I'd be fine with T0 formats if the T0 was $50. The problem is the price point for me. I switched to pokemon because the price is just so much easier to keep up with
The people who try to say "yugioh isn't dying" I think miss what you're getting at, and it feels like even you are being optimistic by saying it's just stagnating. I said this on MBT's recent video where he talked about the cost of yugioh right now: If the game is over $100 to play a casual deck, there's no casual format, and there's less locals that are actually for casuals... then the game really is dying, at least for casuals. This phenomenon of competitive events getting higher attendance continues to surprise me, but it also makes me wonder how much of that is because it's the only time some of those people can play yugioh at all since they no longer have a locals? I wish there was a way to get real numbers on it since it seems like all we can do is give anecdotes. There are 4 card shops in my area and since the pandemic lock down only 1 supports yugioh or even carries it at all. In the past year or so, the shop stopped getting as much yugioh product because so much of it just stays on the shelf anyway. The majority of the former players stopped going, and in the last few years it went from 20ish people a week to about 8 or less who actually show up for the weekly locals. And they all play competitively and treat it as prep for tournaments (while also wanting to pull cards to sell from the OTS packs to try to make back some money). So even though I live in a city with 4 card shops, there is nowhere left to play yugioh as a casual anymore. You've been bringing up that you have to make the game work for you and not wait for Konami to fix it for you, but the only thing I do now is just play the master duel events or a master duel masochist run (while surrendering the majority of matches to save time), or I guess playing edison on dueling book. All of my friend group stopped playing yugioh entirely because the game is gone too far for them now. The same people I met 10 years ago through yugioh and became roommates with and played nearly daily with for years, quit and don't want to even try looking at it again. It's only my anecdote, but it does make me wonder how many other people are in a similar situation.
I would add how meta players don't understand casual and are out of touch, you see MBT shitting on the pre edison game talking how it was bad because x and y deck dominated tournements but that was totaly irrelevent to casual at the time, most peoples picked an archetype or a theme they enjoyed and build a deck around it, this was 90% of deck i saw back in the days. This is why i think no one should listen to these peoples, they are in some tourney echo chamber and doesn't understand that casual are the core player base of any cards games.
Personal opinion but yugioh is one player game meanwhile many tcg are two players game Does people fun see people go combo for 15 minutes and in your turn you cannot break their board so it's their auto win? Yes that's not a two players game, it's one player game all right
If my opponent is going off that much I don't have anything which is luck of the draw in a card game or I'm playing blind second and the whole point of the deck is breaking boards
Also for our locals scene, people were more than willing to play speed duel. The second we realized they release horrid packs for it too instead of just being the contained decks everyone immediately dropped it.
My son comes from a world of touch screens and icons with attention span of a gnat. Konami needs to deal with the wall of text by highlighting key options/ format the cards better, so you can instantly recognise the if then else function of the card. I’m not saying introduce keywords, but text alignment / highlighting must get better.
@@friendlyneighbourhoodsunwheel Yeah I agree. When my OTS store dropped Tournament support for Yugioh, all my friends and I saw the writing on the wall.
I think yugioh prizing matters a lot more than people give it credit for. The lack of yugioh prizing has been directly mentioned as a reason why many high level yugioh players have left the game to become pro at other TCGs. It also makes it much harder for these high level players to make yugioh a full time job like it is for many pro magic players for example. Even if not fully subsidizing their lifestyle if could put 20-40k into their pockets each year(a low amount for a high level pokemon or lorcana player to make in a year) which when combined with content creation, sponsorships, or maybe a part time job makes it much easier for them to have more freedom, play the game more, spend more time with it, and spread its message more. Also when were talking smaller events like a regional (which could have a 100k prize pool for something like pokemon tcg) you've got to remember that toping a regional really isnt that hard, tons of players do it constantly. And those players who are bubbling are going to be much more motivated to go to more of these events and put more money into buying new cards because they know if they can just make it one step further they'll get rewarded in a tangible way.(even if its only like 1k to pay for the deck, its still something) TL;DR: Good prize support retains high level players, provides them freedom and motivation to advertise the game which brings in new players, and motivates mid level players to invest more in both time and money. Better prize support helps the game at every level, these other games aren't doing it out of the kindness of their heart, they're doing it because it make the game better I hope Konami can get prize support into this game someday soon, it would help this game grow and become relevant again in such a huge way
@@GG_Nowa Did you read my comment? The whole point is that the 1% of top players bring in more players into the 99 so its important to keep them motivated and playing. (you think its a good look for the game when new players see pro players unhappy with the game and others moving to other games?) Also that if done properly it keeps the top 10%, who are the ones responsible for 90% of the spending on the game, more happy and more motivated.
I think it is a brand and marketing issue as well. Yugioh isn’t pushed towards the kids anymore. How do we expect the game to keep going is we don’t bring in any new players. My GF and I decided to try Lorcana this weekend and loved it. Game is cheap fun and easy to learn. We already plan to teach her niece the next time she comes over. The kids are interested in Yugioh’s art I’ve shown my nephew’s and nieces the cards they immediately wanted more cards however they could not learn to play the game. Somehow we have to simplify the game to attract new players and build up the local scene as well. Bottom line something has to change from Konami.
Once upperdeck lost the TCG the prize support took a massive dump. Don't use a dead man as a shield either. He had people winning prizes of real monetary value in the show and manga
Upper deck also was in charge of those exact same expensive formats that a handful of people kept winning because they had way worse print policy then current day.
Working at a retro video game store, we sell TCGs, but we barely sell yugioh cards since they just don’t sell. Singles and packs just sit. We just don’t take them now. Pokémon and Magic actually sells.
Yugioh prize support so bad that my locals started doing there own prizes for store credit so players could get packs etc there still dont have great attendance
I used to love playing Yu-Gi-Oh casually at locals back in the 2010s but drifted away when I moved cities. I was planning on getting back into the game this year, but seeing how unfriendly the TCG has become to anyone but the most dedicated players willing to fork out hundreds on a tier 0 deck that isn't even particularly challenging or fun to play has turned me right off. I might start looking into Magic...
Do you think the digital formats (master duel, duel links) are absorbing some of the casual players? Easy of access coupled with being able to build what you want without sinking huge amounts of cash in at the start, and being able to regularly find matches regardless of time/locale makes it a very comfortable path for average duelists to get what they are looking for out of the game?
Some of them, certainly, but not enough and not in useful ways. Master Duel concurrent players has stagnated just like the paper game, because you run into the problems of paper even more on digital where anyone can play the overpowered decks. The reason casual players aren't playing anymore is because casuals mostly enjoy Yugioh through the lens of their favourite decks. If those decks aren't playable, they don't go and play meta decks, they just don't play.
I'm very new to Yu-Gi-Oh (coming from MTG) and tbh I understand the powercreep situation. My stance on this is : Building decks is extremely fun and a big part of YuGioh or MTG, and for me building an underdog deck is challenging, exciting and fun ! Also, if they can release cards that brake the format and get banned, they can absolutely release cards that will, by themselves, revive and archetype and make it meta, therefore, boosting sales of older products and newer products at the same time.
yeah actually the one deciding that yugioh will be dead or not are at local-casual grassroots level(not yugioh exclusive even), that it's mostly product related, and ocg always put yugioh on top 3 selling in Japan because well, ocg rarities. Not to say the prizing complaint is non-issue and hopefully there is improvement there, but it's actually the less likely source of yugioh being truly dead.
I think the addition of new formats, coupled with a couple waves of proper "on boarding" products would help a lot. I feel like A LOT of the issues center around the local level, and online play, especially when talking about not only increasing, but also maintaining player numbers. If you're new to the game or even a player returning after several years it's really hard to get in to "the scene". The only real way to do it is if you already have friends that play. If you're a lone person trying to get in to the game or back in to the game you're pretty much s.o.l.. This is because of the competitive side of the game. Granted I understand everything to do with that aspect of Yu-Gi-Oh, whether it's testing for a regional event or what have you, people are going to be playing meta decks no matter what level of the game you're playing at. Imagine getting your first deck together and being excited to go to your local card shop for the weekly tournament only to find out that 6 of the 10 people there are playing tier 0 or tier 1 decks, and here you are with Fire Fist (I'll use my favorite archtype as the example here). You're just a beginner and solely wanting to play casually and have fun, and just at your locals half of the people have advanced tourney winning decks. Like I said I understand people playing good decks for tourneys like regionals or YCS, but I honestly think if you show up to your locals with one of these decks you're one of the things that's wrong with the game these days. Locals don't even count towards getting a YCS invite or anything like that, but people roll up like they're at worlds with tier 0 decks like its life or death and they have to win. To me a locals should be a relaxed, casual game night with what most people would call "mid" decks, or rogue decks. Decks that can play a 10 turn game and develop a back and forth with the opponent, with interactions besides negate, negate, negate. It should be an environment that's welcoming and mindful of new or casual players, instead it's kind of like a nightmare for some people even thinking about going to their LGS to play a few games because of not wanting to just be basically trolled every game. Unless Konami introduces new formats that limit the cards allowed or the decks allowed it would be up to the card shops to implement game nights that didn't allow certain things like tier 0 decks. I definitely feel like a lot of issues surrounding this unfortunate situation could be avoided if more people had a discussion about DECK POWER LEVEL before they start a game. In MTG (especially commander) if you're sitting down to a game you talk with the opponent about the power level of the decks you're both comfortable with using/playing against. This way the game is more even and fair, and it gives both players not only the chance, but the ability and time to actually use their deck and play out the combos and strategies that they have. That's to ensure the game is not only fair, but fun for both players. I realize that couldn't be done in a tourney or locals setting, but I feel like a lot of the people having issues like this with the game don't even play competitively, and are having these issues in "unrecorded" games. If the person you're going to play against doesn't want to discuss power level or doesn't have a different deck with them to use besides tier 0 they're honestly probably not the kind of person you want to be hanging out with anyway. If you're the guy that shows up to locals every Thursday or goes over to a friend's to play with only Snake-Eyes in your bag you're the people I'm talking about. There's a difference in trying to be ready competitively with stuff like "testing for regs" and just being a try-hard that doesn't want to lose. Nobody likes people like that, and nobody wants to play with or around people like that. Hence you have the issue of not gaining new players and not maintaining old players or having returning players. You can sit at home all by yourself and not have fun, you don't need to spend $ on cards and sleeves and a mat, and entry fee to sit across from someone else and not have fun, and people these days aren't going for it. Sorry I know that was long. Just a lot that can be discussed in this topic. I definitely think you're right about the formats and products for new players. Events might be doing good as far as numbers, but any and every game survives or dies by the casual players. If you lose them then the game is done. So they definitely need to be doing more on both ends, but they need to focus on making the causal players happy when it comes down to it. Like you said, competitive players are going to play and attend events no matter what, but casual players will drop the game without a second thought if they think they aren't going to have any fun with it.
It's initial release was dogwater that's why. If it started as the box pre con sets it is now more people would have played it because that appeals to both draft enjoyers but people who also want to play the format properly. The secret rare variants keep the commons down in price so the buy in is now vastly cheaper compared to launch as there's less ways for the secondary market to try screw money
I think Paul hit the nail on the head when it came to Yu-Gi-Oh products, and how lackluster they have been not just last year but even going back all the way into Covid era. Dawn of majesty, lightning overdrive, and a plethora of side sets that’s did nothing except waste cardboard and the tree it came from.
It's alive among friends. That hasnt changed. To me, it's dead in terms of the competitive scene. My locals recently all started dedicating shelf space and cases to yugioh for Lorcana. That's just me, but i imagine I am not the only one. So it's down to YCS, Master Duel, or nothing. To be honest, I really don't care anymore. As long as I have my friends to play, the competitive scene and whatever they complain about doesnt matter to me anymore. New products, new events, all of it. The competitive scene relies more on the business side of Konami to do well so as far as I am concerned, they made this mess so they can deal with it. It seems like everyone just laughs at the meme, but actions speak louder than words. If stores start pulling the product off the shelf, then maybe people will treat it like an existential threat.
Here’s my idea for a alt format: It just needs to be a casual format that bars the most recent top decks from being used. Here’s my idea: 1) If a deck has topped or dominated a major event for the last few years, it’s is not allowed to compete in this casual format. This would include any card made for that archetype if it explicitly names that archetype in anyway way or shared in its name (like even if a card is named after or even mentions Snake-Eyes in its effect text, it’s gone). 2) If a brand new deck comes out, it cannot compete for at least its first year as people use it and see if it shows up (or even dominates) in a major event. it also allows newer cards to still be used so long as the new archetype isn’t directly mentioned or in its card name. And allows for new support to be injected into this format. This allows for decks that fell out of favor to come back, and you wouldn’t necessarily have to really change the limited/forbidden list except for cards related to the deck in question. 3) If any new support allows an older deck to start being highly used in major events, then it would simply join the decks banned from use in the casual format. What all this does is it lets many other decks have some time, creating both variety in the decks used as well as a way for new players to join in and compete in something without fear of being overwhelmed by top decks. it also has decks possibly being added later if they fall out of favor because key cards to the original strategy get limited or banned, bring those decks down a few pegs.
@@GG_Nowa which isn’t unified and is up to individual stores, which does nobody any good. so no, it solves nothing. Konami needs to bite the damn bullet and recognize that they made some decks just too powerful to the point it shuts others off any competitive scene. There needs to be an official UNIFIED Konami-lead effort, not one put onto OTSs to come up with it on their own.
The problem with competitive players is when you get that good at a card game you start branching out for a new challenge. People who top these YCS and Worlds events are also playing games like Magic, Lorcana, One Piece, they're playing SOMETHING else that also has a competitive scene with better incentives that are worth their time and effort of being good at the game. People talk about this game "dying" all the time, but THIS time there's more to it than "the meta sucks". Some of the most competitive cards are STAYING at 40-50+ PER COPY because Konami doesn't want to reprint them. Bonfire, Quem, Cartesia, Thrust, all of these cards are stupid expensive entirely because Konami's treating the TCG like a cash cow to be squeezed instead of reprinting cards like in the OCG. People don't want to play a card game where being even KIND OF good is pay-walled. It doesn't help that even the more popular decks like Blue-eyes and Dark Magician or even something like Heroes has cards that are 15-20 or even sometimes 30 bucks a copy. Yugioh is not an appealing game for new OR casual players because it's complicated, difficult, and very expensive to even attempt to build a "good" deck. But it's also becoming less desirable to play competitively because other card games with equal or greater challenge at the top tables have MONUMENTALLY better prize systems from special cards to entire CASES of booster boxes for the latest set. the only solutions that I can honestly see working long term is introducing and properly supporting set rotation, and alternate formats. My pitch for alt formats to be pushed by Konami is Edison, maybe a specific banlist from 2014-16, and TOSS (I personally am not a big fan of GOAT hence its omission).
Lately at locals me and 4 others usually just play goat format in battle royale style and it’s a lot fun, goat is surprisingly diverse and I can make a lot of fun and unique decks for all of us to use
Most stores in the Netherlands stopped selling yugioh, lots of stores don’t do yugioh locals anymore. And its pretty hard to find people to play with. Even the ^%#$* Capitol city Amsterdam does not have 1 shop that does ygo locals.
My local stores quit carrying YGO i noticed the last time i was there. Soon it will either be walmart or tcgplayer only for me. Finding sleeves is hard asf in my area too.
Игры
_To live doesn't mean you're alive._
Alex, will u do a video regarding ur beef with tyrel
I will say that me and my locals have had to make a new format to Play after and before the tourney where we play the worst of the worst decks and its been fun
(Vehicroids, valkyries, ect.)
Like Shirou said once, people die when they are killed 😂
Don't worry 'bout me and who I fire
@apsamplifier the way I cope with online formats not being the most fun is build a more slow deck (bad compared to current decks) for fun and try to win.
Currently I am playing a Kaiba Anime accurate deck (without Pot of Greed etc) and try to win (also I only play decks online that I have IRL to train them or chill out.
“Yugioh has a PROBLEM staying alive”
It’s in a vegetative state lol
Yeah, it feels like a terminal patient being kept on life support. The state of the game right now is the roughest it's ever been.
As a player trying to get back into Yu-Gi-Oh after a decade, and living in a fairly mid sized US city, it was really discouraging to see that all 7 dedicated game stores stopped carrying TCG products in the last few years. We have this really booming new shop too that carries everything else, but not Yu-Gi-Oh.
You’re absolutely right, if you lose the casual gamers, the gig is over. That’s how the game actually dies.
The competive players keep the game running at this point.
There's no real causual yugioh anymore
@@DragonBallsolosyourverseit really is a plight for competitive players only. If casual players don't even care about locals anymore, it's the competitive community that needs to demand and drive change.
Locals are mostly using the same meta decks that run rampant in competive
Is it a situation where more casual players may be getting their YGO fix in there form of products like duel links (mimic the anime) or master duel (plentiful matches available at the convenience of when the player wants). Tcgs recently have to brings something eye popping to get folks to buy in outside of legacy players or just bring the biggest game running (MtG).
I've been called an old head too many times saying that how YGO is now is way too toxic. They be like "oh you just like schoolyard YGO" I'm like no I like YGO where people can PLAY the game before you had a gimmick because the monster type your playing. Now all archetype have the same goal which is swarm, there's no real diverence in place. Whomever doesn't have a bricked hand wins be default and people KNOW this and still want to dare that "school yard YGO" was worse. The only bad opener back then was your homie had a Gemini Elf or they have a man-eater bug(s) ready. I always said competitive players that simply copy people's decks aren't good at the game. At that point you're not playing a TGC you're playing russian roulette
Pricing is definitely why I stopped buying Yu-Gi-Oh cards. Not spending hundreds of dollars just for a handful of cards.
Play Duel Links or Master Duel. It’s not as expensive, but the older the account the more value it has accumulating cards that are one time event/life time releases.
Cards aren't expensive if your not buying cards heavily used within the Meta. Most cards I buy for deck building costs $1-3 a copy.
@@Citizen_Nappa23Yea but how do u play with those cards? At home with ur friends probably unless you want people to go the locals and likely get stomped.
And if u dont have friends around that also play then there's no reason at all to build a casual deck.
Me when I:P dove under 5$: Hell yeah, i can buy one now
Cards are cheaper than ever? What do you want another Biden Stimmy for the $400 deck 💀
It's not dying, It's turning into a zombie type
Not bad. I choked on my coffee. Not bad at all...
And even zombies are largely forgotten as a type.
🥁
All they gotta do is print cards how they do in the OCG. They won't because they legitimately hate their playerbase.
They won't because the only playerbase they have left is the competitive players who will pay whatever Konami asks.
@@yurisei6732which is funny because OCG arguably more competitive as more players can reasonably get what they need to optimize their deck list in the OCG, leading to more; experimentation, practice, and a wider range of players.
Simple solution, Konami controls the entire distribution to ensure uniformity of cards released.
Better support for European players would be nice. They get jipped the most.
@@otterfire4712the OCG is not more competitive at all, there’s just more competitive players because there’s a lot more players in general. There’s a giant trading card game and gambling culture in Asian countries therefore it’s just more popular over there whereas in the TCG most players are trying to play to win and wanna play the best deck no matter the price. People in the OCG don’t care about the “investment” and will buy packs no matter what and will build “bad” decks just to have fun casually compared to the TCG people want to pull the best cards for the best decks or they don’t feel fulfilled.
If yugioh makes it to the half century anniversary, I will start a RUclips channel where I only eat hats
Sure jan
Ward
@@nickolaslillogodoy3496+4 defense
I completely agree lol
Thing is, when people said yugioh was dying all those other times, they were kinda right. It has been dying this whole time. Players who love the game make fun of this everytime while this game fails to grip new players and loses old ones because the game continues.
They think it means like getting hit by a car or something. That it's going to be a sudden death, so therefore when that doesn't happen all the detractors are wrong. What they don't realize is that it's more like getting a terminal illness that slowly saps your strength until you're just a husk.
Yugioh players are like those smoker who insist they'll never get cancer at 20 and die at 35
That's exactly what I was thinking
Death by a thousand cuts, if you will. That, or a frog in a pot. By the time you realize that change is needed, you're already too late...
judging by all the people on this video's comment and paul's other video, I don't think these die-hard yugioh players will even see it that way. All they care about are their "prize support" and VaLuE cArDs!1!11!. These idiots don't get the fact that they can't cash out if no one buys their OVERPRICED cardboard. These guys would rather die on that hill than admit they were wrong.
Different take: Stagnation is worse than decline. At least with decline companies take notice quickly and are willing to take risks to reverse course. Staganation doesn't feel detrimental enough to take risks, but not exciting enough either.
exactly. Stagnation means the company saw the decline, fixed JUUUUST enough to keep the diehard playerbase and is purposely keeping it that way because they know the remaining people are just sheep who will meatride whatever they do but not get mad enough to quit
My thing is that the game isn't fun in the slightest anymore and we have a HUGE problem with getting new players bc of how damn confusing the game is sometimes. Konami just continually trips over itself.
people just don't want to wait 20 minutes so they can attempt to play
The time it takes to set up a board is the single reason everyone I knew quit and why they quit master duel shortly after trying it when it came out. I've talked about it in way too many comment sections, but I think a lot of people really underestimate how much of a problem it is.
@@hermit3043 It's because those people are winning that's why they're like "c'mon it's not a big deal" when they know it sucks
@@hermit3043Comp players like this sort of gameplay because it gives them "consistency." Yugitubers will, of course, shill for it because they're comp players.
I completely agree with new formats. It's kinda why I stepp3d away because I'm more personally into mid/low level decks or just much older formats. So a better more chill way to play yugioh is what I'd love to see. I feel like if Konami really tried they can get that spark rolling again
Same and agree
Every time the game has "died" it's lost a chunk of its playerbase.
It's gotten real bad right now because LGS have no reason to stock their products and the decks themselves are imbalanced Pay2Win messes. It's definitely been on the downturn for a while.
The prize support is nowhere near the biggest problem. Calling the prizing the problem is walking on eggshells that most sponsored players are saying.
The ACTUAL problems are:
1.Imbalance
2.Price
3.Lack of Collectors/Value of Cards
The reason why the regional and stuff have high attendance is because of sponsored players and Konami fudging things.
The reason people are even talking about prize support now is because it's only the competitive players left. You didn't hear the prize support complaints five years ago because there were way more casual players who didn't care what they weren't winning.
Lol
The game simply not being fun should be problem number 0.
@@geek593 I wanted to include that but its subjective, gotta stick to the actual facts. I personally do not enjoy the game due to the speed and how sacky it is.
no one care about prize, it's a game to have fun, not a side job
"This Yu-Gi-Oh is dead...it just hasn't realized it yet..."
cue 30-second YT short of Ash Blossom's feet and Poplar.
I stopped playing about 3-4 years ago because i hated hand traps.. i recently decided to try come back only to find we aint moved on from hand traps still 😑
@@MrSkullMerchant Because they're one of the few things holding this game together like duck tape. If we couldnt play on the opponent's turn, every deck would win based on the coin flip unless your name is Labrynth specifically.
@@four-en-tee i couldnt even get away from them though when i tried playing casualy with weaker decks, couldnt find anyone even my friends who would play without them.
@@MrSkullMerchant i have a few friends who hate handtraps, and anytime they wanna play, I just bust out something like Timelords or Magikey. That’s kinda the unfortunate thing, though; most people don’t keep a few low-tier decks in case of situations like that, or even if they do, they’ll stack em high with handtraps just assuming their opponents will also have em. in my case, i know for a fact that mine won’t. lol
@@SageTigerStar i might just try out the speed duel format lol
I have been noticing a huge decline of product for a long time now in 90% of card shops that I have gone to. Also I feel like the whole yugioh is dying is that a huge portion of the community aren't big fans of what the game has become in the recent years and from most of the people in my play groups have all said that Konami doesn't diversify the game out side of the standard way we play the game. Either its either falls into 2 camps one Konami doesn't really support alt playstyles whether its old formats like goat, edizon, or HAT as well as any of the different playstyles that Konami listed that the player base should try out like deck master, heart of the underdog, etc. which is a shame because they make more money off of that product using reprints of older cards for a deck to play that specific playstyle or format. The second one is the way that they have 6 gens worth of yugioh going all at once or the speed & level of power creep that the game has generated has gone unchecked.
The prizing thing came from Takahashi himself. He didn’t want monetary based prizes. I’m not sure how this would affect serialized stuff though
Even with the pricing deal, the cards cost too much to be given bad rewards for winning expensive tournaments
Which is ironic considering the premise of more than HALF the yugioh franchises are players competing for prize money or competing in a circuit as a way to make a living. In all honesty, the man was a hypocrite in that regard. Maybe he thought that would ruin the spirit of the game, but literally in EVERY OTHER GAME, even at the time, this was never the case. Perhaps he felt Pressured to make that assessment because he feared that playing cards for the possibility of winning money would be misconstrued as gambling, but that's a far reach to make in and of itself. At the end of the day though, he is no longer with us, and the game has long since outgrown the source material. To continue being bound by a condition set in the early 2000s, before even 30% of households had internet access, when the climate of hobbies and the abundance of TCGs has changed, is absolutely stupid. Even if they don't do cash prizing though, Lorcana and One Piece don't ans thier prizing is worth thousands. Hell, their collectors products are worth thousands, because they know how to appease both collectors AND players. Konami doesn't know how to appease either.
He was murdered for a reason. Let the cash flow in.
(And ppl you know he was murdered).
That's true. There's also an archived Pojo thread where Julia Hedberg does also add that it's part of Konami's license agreement from Shueisha as well
@@JuanGonzalezZzZzZz...Let me guess, you think that Takahashi saving another man's life while in the ocean is reason to assume he was assassinated???
Fire King Snake Eyes decks, and popular style cards make me not care for Yugioh, I was a returning player, came back in 2018, now leaving again. Won't be back this time, dont care for prizing, its the card and game design that has ruined the it for me. Most people I know who care about Yugioh say the same thing. Yugioh used to be a strategic chess like game, now, its a glorified Voyuer simulater where a lot of players get off making you watch them play with themselves. It's laughable the anime spawned the garbage the TCG/OCG/MD has become.
Game isn't dying, its dead at every near by game store i live at.
Same
The only people who arent saying Yugioh is dying are content creators and konami themselves.
When everyone except the ones who are paid are saying its having major issues its pretty telling whats actually happening.
The part you made about the locals stopping supporting the game is pretty true in my area, 4 shops have stopped selling and holding events with Yu-Gi-Oh over the last 2 years, now they sell other games just not Yu-Gi-Oh as it's not profitable.
Rome also stagnated for a long time before eventually collapsing.
Like, i dont think this is necessarily an issue for the entirety of Yugioh. Its mostly just the TCG. The OCG seems to be doing fine, and Master Duel is its own can of worms from what I understand.
I will say that despite my issues with the recent "QCR Exclusive" fiasco with Magia, I at least appreciate that Konami is looking for ways to try and give sealed product more worth for vendors and collectors. Like, from a financial perspective, I think the future of this game's stability lies in the collector's market and I think that Konami further investing in it - as well as taking more risks with supplemental media like manga, anime & video games - could help to drive down the price of competitive Yugioh. Ideally, we want to be in the same position as Pokemon and have a strong multi-media presence, and unlike Magic the Gathering, Yugioh's far more capable of achieving that due to its anime aesthetic and many unique archetypes (each with their own lore and what have you). Stuff like the Sky Striker manga and the recent animation studio are huge steps in the right direction. The most that Magic the Gathering could really attempt with its IP by comparison is a TV series similar to Arcane (as well as the many novels that already exist). With the way that modern Yugioh is designed, our game is in a position where we could take bigger creative risks. Konami just has to be willing to do that.
I also agree that this game desperately needs more alternative formats. Beyond Junior Journey, the closest i've seen that looks interesting at all is Domain Format. Its a singleton format like Commander, and i only really know about it because Pot of Greed is legal at 1 (go figure). I think the big problem though is that a lot of people who want an alternative format (that aren't already playing Time Wizard formats) want to still be able to play with the cards/decks that they currently own. God knows its why I spent half a year experimenting with the game's mechanics in my free time, and it was the only time where my siblings were willing to play Yugioh with me since the mechanics I was experimenting with allowed for pretty much any deck to do stupid shit and make a comback. For an alternative format to really take off, it'll need to not only encourage casual play, but also include the entire modern card pool. Like, someone should be able to take a deck like Labrynth for example and be able to make it work in that format (even if it may not be as strong as it currently is in MR5). It'd also be nice if it supported 3+ player FFA games, which admittedly is a difficult task since it begins to further complicate cards like Infinite Impermanence for example. The reason 3+ player games are important though for an alternative format is because it reduces the chances of following the meta and encourages players to do their own thing. The reason for this is due to "politicing", or the overall social aspect of the game. If you were to walk in with a meta deck, its very likely that people would just gang up on you (unless they're all playing meta) since it paints a target on your back. There's also ostracization to worry about if you want to continue playing within that friend group. In a casual 3+ player game, a strong deck also has to be perceived as fair if you don't want to get shit on for piloting it. Like, if your friends are playing pure versions of Blackwings, Dragonmaid and Plunder Patrol, and you show up with Runick Stun, everyone's gonna have a bad time unless they all just collectively gang up on you once the match begins.
I personally think the game is on it's last legs and has been on borrowed time for years for these few reasons
1: Crappy prize support : Other games are doing what YGO should be doing and that is is either giving out cash or exclusive good products that's worth money , like there's no reason we should be getting Nintendo switches OG models in 2024 as a part of prizes. Why can't they just give us high end tech products like they used to do back in the day? i remember upper deck giving out Alienware laptops for prizing in the early 2000s.
2: Lack of kids playing : Most of the kids that played when i was in my early 20s is now in their early 20s /late teens and my son's generation could care less about playing YGO considering things like fortnight host cash tournaments yearly..
3: Stores not carrying YGO : Although my city has a decent competitive scene i know a lot of stores just don't deal with YGO because product rot on shelves but games like One Piece and Lorcana is selling like hotcakes with competitive circuits better than what konami is giving ygo players.
I don't want the game to stop anytime soon however with everything i just listed it's just a matter of time before it flatlines , unless Konami does a complete 180 and give us better prize support and figure out a way to attract a new younger audience. I personally think they should just go the MTG route and make yugioh a 13+ cardgame and cater it to young adults with revised prize structure.
"Crappy prize support" lol no one care about that, Yu-gi-oh need more casual and those doesn't play game to earn money like a second job
There is low support, printing is against budget, no casual formats, bad quality of products, banlist oriented for selling cards instead of fixing the problem immediately. It's not dying in Japan, but we know the game is handled differently there. I fear that the problem is like a Bell's Curve. Until they are going to raise the price and accessibility, the are gonna reach a level of dissatisfaction that will eventually be the downfall of the card game.
Not "dying". But its not worth competing in compared to other games.
The outrageous prices is definitely a big deal also soulburning volcanio wasn’t underwhelming it gave us better support for volcanics
They're about to get bigger as players leave and costs have to be mitigated or quality decreased.
Cards are cheaper than ever
@@jkurtzz they’re really not
@@bluelightning118 examples por favor 🙏🏽 besides a few meta staples for snake eye decks
@@jkurtzz bonfire,ground xeno
MTG It's like a gust of fresh air, Commander really makes you deck build and Pioneer can also be relaxing
Magic is facing the same power creep problems though. Turn 2 wins are the norm and it's way more pay to win than Yu-Gi-Oh.
The biggest thing about this format is that most people aren't having fun.
And if you're not having fun, it's harder to ignore problems.
i get with the bois on a weekly basis to hang out drink smoke and play. we go to stores to buy shit to pull n it feels like shit goin into multiple stores and finding no products
Those players who hate the format but still play the game are the root of all problems. They are why the game sucks now and it will keep getting worse.
Seems like it based on the comments on this video asking for cheaper cards 🤦🏽♂️ 💀
Can we please just start limiting special summons already?
No because that creates kash esque monsters where the 1 body is a boss monster.
What needs to be limited is free effects and beneficial costs. Discarded Poplar as cost? It doesn't activate it's effect. Special summoned a boss monster? It includes a restriction/drawback.
And for the love of Obelisk, they need to put a stop to free searches/draws.
In my case I would limit special summon, removal effects, Add effects, and then "maybe" the game would be "balanced".
Better not be! Falling in love with the game again after 16 years!
This is not something you should love. It will pain you. You too will slowly die with it in time.
Same with me. I got back into it just in time for my local game shops to stop selling it or holding tournaments.
@saviorselfX29 take that as a sign and don't sink your money into it. Yugioh depreciates RAPIDLY yet is super expensive to play. Sure that means yoy can play whatever you want after about a year for dirt cheap, but by that point it's no longer a viable deck to play.
Ah yes. The game where opp takes 30 minutes to do Turn 1 then wins on their next turn.
@@TheCrimsonFrenzyPSNGod projecting like that on other people who are just having fun is so pathetic. Just stop playing if you are this negative and disenfranchised.
Short answer no but I would love it if they made an yugioh anime for master rule
Issue for me is my “rogue” deck has to navigate the same landscape as the best deck but doesn’t have to resources to do so.
I’m lucky enough to have a playgroup of 7 and we have curated our own format. We play so many old cards as well as many of the new and it’s so much fun. Yugioh needs formats for sure .
11:09 the problem is also that every alternative format outside of modern, pioneer, legacy and vintage was community made and only later gained recognition by WotC when it was popular enough. So unless the community itself creates such format and then popularizes it I think it will flop. Konami attempts to create new formats in the past all kinda flopped.
I think the yugioh you currently know is always dying.
True... Life is dynamic. But that also means yugioh never "truly existed" in the way soccer existed or exists. That there is no actually mature or smart game behind it. It's just the veil. Edit: It will never be in a good enough form by it's nature, to exist. Though I would consider GOAT and edison to be "existing" but they are not played because everything is answered. Everything gets answered on masterduelmeta every two weeks. So you have to upgrade and more cards and gimmicks because the game CANNOT stand on it's own two feel.
@@TheCrimsonFrenzyPSN I'm not sure if considering Edison solved. But the reason those formts are loved is because each hand requires a different solution. Modern games often feels to me like it runs on auto pilot. find starter, play starter do the same combo. Same line same choke points, etc. in older yugioh I feel like my plays are much more dynamic.
Yugioh is dying because it now finds itself in the unstopable power creep meta where only the strongest deck is played at a top level. If new players aren't welcomed with easy rules and fun interactions (hand traps/ 20 minute turns/ opponent playing during your turn are not fun to play against) then the community can only shrink and eventually die. They need a complete rules refresh with keywords, clearly defined interactions (no more cheating like non-targetting and ignoring conditions), limits to the amount of things that can happen per turn or even a resource system.
for reference, in my opinion, the best TCG ever was WoWTCG. non-limiting resource system, keywords, amazing art, easy to understand rules, and a strong ip. Raid/Dungeon decks even allowed for PVE play with friends.
played vs a friend and he was very interactive, he even declared battle phase... during my turn... even he forgot it was my turn
I think there's a very real threat at the moment because we're on the tail end of a TCG bubble. There were a lot of flop games but a handful have made it through the cracks. With limited time/space Yu-Gi-Oh should really buckle down and make a strong locals scene so it doesn't risk getting bumped down in favor of One Piece, Digimon, Lorcana or maybe even a dark horse like Grand Archive.
I'm conflicted lol I still want digimon to soar I'm pissed I had to sell off my cards so now Id have to start from scratch but with digimon you can still do that without coating you a million dollars to have good caught up collection
Finally not a braindead comment 🎉
Yugioh isn't going to get bumped. One big thing it has going for it is that it's a huge and diverse game. There's an archetype for literally anyone. So if Konami ever feels like trying harder, they have loads of ways to attract people. Things like One Piece and Lorcana don't have this: the only people who will ever play the One Piece card game are people who liked the One Piece anime. The only people who will ever play Lorcana are people who like Disney animated movies (afaik they've not even added star wars or marvel yet).
@@yurisei6732 it is literally getting bumped…. Lgs bled out over RC01/RC02 reprints and the decimation of box values from the last 3 years. PS black rose is a top 3 fav card of mine I have the ghost and I love it 💕
It is absolutely dying, and has been for a long time. The player base is shrinking constantly. It might never outright "die", there will always be people playing, but it already feels dead, in real life I don't know a single person that plays it.
Even worse here in France, can't find anyone to play with unless i drive hours to a big city
It is dying. Don't pretend. I cant even go to card shops for this shit.
Exact opposite here. For once stores that dropped it in the 2010 exodus times is stocking it again.
@@GG_Nowa I am so jealous, lol. Good shit to hear, actually.
THANK YOU. Everyone talking about prizing like they are the next Jesse Kotton. Like calm down dude. The real issue is not that you did not get a 20 dollar Walmart gift card.
I want to buy cards but i'd rather buy a house first.
nah... its dying. and its ok to admit it. Its better for the game to have a graceful sendoff than to see it milked to oblivion at this point.
Real take
It has been milked to oblivion at this point though.
@@Pocket-Calculator nah this could get much worse brother
Your channel got me into Yugioh over the past two months or so, along with some kitchen table games with friends.
I’m a longtime Magic player and when trying to build my first decks (Winged Dragon of Ra and Red-Eyes Burn) I’ve noticed that many of the card shops in my area don’t stock Yugioh anymore.
All of them used to, from what I remember, but I’m having a genuinely difficult time finding a local store that has a good supply of singles to look through. It feels like a case of always being able to find something until you’re actually looking for it.
I’ve greatly enjoyed my brief dip into the game and I hope things pick up soon. Right now I’m having to resort to online stores and haven’t found a good one for yugioh singles. Thanks for all your entertaining and informative content. It helped convince me to try the game.
cardmarket if you're in the EU or UK, and I believe TCGplayer for US?
My issue with Snake eyes is that they steal so many cards from other fire archetypes driving up prices for people that want to play things like salamangreat or fire king. I wish Konami would start making summon requirements more specific so this stops happening.
I hate that everyone wrote off Salamangreat Raging Phoenix when it was revealed but now it's like $50 because of Snake-Eyes. Should've bought when it was cheap.
What fire king card did they spike up? I honestly think the only cards they have "stole" are raging Phoenix and sunlight wolf, with the former being the one that was really driven up in price. Then you have princess that is generic support for fire decks in general.
I recall heatsoul being used before but it is not really played now.
@@chewdoom8415 maybe they aren't "stealing" fire king cards but I've seen plenty of hybrid snake eyes fire king decks which probably bumped the prices for some stuff a bit.
I too hope konami sees the wrong of their ways and care for game over money. I'm sure their servers run on
Number 38: Hope Harbinger Dragon Titanic Galaxy. I promise you, you'll always be disappointed putting your faith in a mature company like konami
@@Nominod I was really challenging what you said about snake eye impacting various fire archetypes. The impact they have on the affordability of fire staples is valid, but that really only applies to one archetype, which is Salamangreat. Princess, as I said, does boost the power of fire decks as a whole, but that is only two cards that were really inflated by being staples in the deck.
The lack of cash prizes wouldn't be an issue, if this game was affordable.
Playing competitively in a game that doesn't have cash prizes, shouldn't require these absurd cash sinks.
Which is part of a bigger problem. It's too expensive, which makes it harder for new people to jump in.
Look at Deck Builder sets. They're just over priced, worse versions of Structure Decks.
Deck build sets are only called that in the ocg because they're 30 bucks a box and each box is always able to make 1 of the 3 themes introduced.
@@GG_Nowa If that's true, I've got to hand it to Konami for ruining the entire product in the West.
Free time seller here: I confirm that investing in YU-Gi-OH! Cards is often a huge waste of money and time, no one buys commons.
i wish there would be a format like MTGs pauper were only common prints of card are legally to play -.-
"It's just maintenance right now"
At least with online games, your game is usually dead or dying if it's in "maintenance mode".
Even if new blood can be brought in, they're throw into the high-power, complicated mess that is Yugioh. That's a huge barrier, which is why formats are needed.
Been dead to me for a while, sadly
This game is on life support lol
"it's not dead" doesn't mean it's not dying.
guess what, the game didn't start dying when stores dropped it. it started way before.
*The last time I played Yu-Gi-Oh at Locals was February 2020, before Covid was a major virus. I agree that over those last 4 years Yu-Gi-Oh changed a lot.I can't really say , if the changes are detrimental or good since the last time I played Yu-Gi-Oh was February 2020.*
Both of the local stores in my town have given up on Yu-Gi-Oh just this year. One’s been selling YGO since it opened in 2003.
Yu-Gi-Oh is always dying until it's not. Every format or tier 0 deck everyone starts the same chant every time. As long as people buy the cardboard the game is alive.
I fully agree with the need for multiple formats in Yu-gi-oh. The single format at one point and time around the time i stopped playing competitive had expensive staple singles due to the pull rate of the staple. It was difficult if not impossible to continue in the competitive scene at a local level. I ended up turning to Magic and Pokemon TCG, both have mechanics built into the game that keeps the games from having the same issues I ended up having in Yu-gi-oh. The fast pace gameplay that Yu-gi-oh ended up having where games were basically decided in turn 2-3 of a game quite often was why I ultimately left. Pokemon uses energy on Pokemon that outside of a card allowing it ( usually on stuff that is like a stage 2 pokemon ) made it so you could only play one energy card a turn, You also couldn't outside of card effects evolve a pokemon on turn 1, which is another mechanic that kept the game from being speed ran.
As for MTG that multiple formats including Commander which was fun watching yall on Team APS play Commander on tolarian community college on Shuffle up and play. And I recall with another show where yall were with the Professor you pointed out how the multiple formats MTG had made it a more accessable game and that yall wish Konami would do something similar with Yu-gi-oh. It's something yall were pointing out before and am glad yall are continuing to address the issues that Konami has. The Hobby of Yu-gi-oh is just a cash cow that disenfranchises the budget players. An issue that other card games just don't have and stuff that other card games are able to do that Konami can't. But that's just my thoughts I have based on my own experiences with alternative card games.
I feel like it is more about bragging rights to do well in yu gi oh.
I live in the Bay Area and I literally can’t find nowhere to play every locals are really far yugioh has died over here I remember when I was lil yugioh shops where everywhere not anymore
Locals also tend to shoot themselves in the foot. Like my shop for example, they barely advertise Yugioh events they're having. I find out about them days before hand from friends and such asking if I was planning to sign up.
Idk, card games are in a weird place.
If a commander type format for yugioh could be possible that’d be an interesting thing to try but idk how they’d do it
They did it in Master Duel. It didn't have the boss monster Commander had but they did do an event that was limited to one of each card.
It's a thing already. Look into Domain Format.
I feel like yugioh doesn't lend itself to multiplayer nearly as well as magic does.
Unfortunately, alternate yugioh formats just aren't really possible at all. That's why none of the people asking for them have actually stated what specifically they're wanting. Making a format in Yugioh is really just picking a date and banning all cards released after it, which is arbitrary.
@@yurisei6732 As someone with a massive draft cube, that's just not true.
Prize money is not an issue. That's irrleevant for 99.999 % of players.
The issues are:
1. Pricing. The game is too expensive to the point a single card is worth more than an entire deck in othr games.
2. YGO cards are the absolute worst value when it comes to collecting. Other games will have variant rarities, variant arts, full arts, special editions, etc. YGO has the same card with a bit of foil at most and that's it. Cards from the 10th anniversary are worth 10 ¢ each because each and everyone of them is identical to every single version ever printed.
3. Rarity is absurd. In other games you may get the same card in different rarities, here the default rarity for staples or important archetype cards is Secret or above. That's absurd.
4. All card games got a huge bump during/after COVID. Konami got cocky and assumed the game gained popularity organically when in reality it was a momentaneous bump and it continued due to the hype caused by quarter century collections.
5. "wait 20 minutes for your turn and maybe discard Blossom. Now it's your turn... Just wait 5 more minutes during Standby so the opponent can continue his combo. Now it's Main but the opponent will negate every single action you make and destroy every card you play. Buy more packs btw"
They're gonna appeal to comp players when players after the initial success either went onto comp play or grew outta it.
When I was in highschool in the late 00s early 10s you either dropped Yu-Gi-Oh as you grew up or you stuck with it so it made sense to narrow into the niche because they're the players who consistently where keeping the lgs in business and by extension more ways to sell product.
@@GG_Nowa That's a fallacy. The comp scene of any game is always a small niche percentage, not all players will go into comp.
If a game attracts tons of new players, some of which end up going into comp, that means the main appeal of the game is not the comp scene. Appealing to that just means you won't attract new players and you're betting on old players sticking to it.
But as it has happened with YGO and countless games appealing to the comp scene means the game loses what attracted new players to begin with. Again, players want to play the game, not sit down watching the opponent shuffle for 20 minutes and then attempt to play.
Back in the day (and by that I mean every single format until Master Rule 5) OTK/FTK decks were considered the least fun to play against. They were considered the least interactive and even unfair playstyles so they were heavily restricted. By streamlining the game and making it focused only on OTK/FTK strategies they alienated every single old player except the small minority that liked that playstyle. It doesn't make any sense.
The print policy of the TCG is also awful. Konami is attempting to milk a fanbase that doesn't exist.
Definitely need more formats! Something like Anthology mode on master duel , so us boomers would actually play again
Absolutely!
Because it is nothing like it was 15-20 years ago, ridiculously complicated, how do you even start?
People saying YuGiOh is dying is losing its effect. For the past 25 years it is still flourishing.
It definitely goes through phases. Just recently the new six sam support has got me back in because I love playing six sam & it'll cost me nothing since I have all the staples for the deck. I'm back in that easy.
Your thoughts are always great Paul. Your feeling about Yu-Gi-Oh starting to feel more and more constricted I've definitely also had. Best of luck for the future.
I just surrender on master duel when I see snake-eyes; I cannot counter it unless i have all hand traps
I just play the deck when it's a tier 0 format. It's just too much effort to play anything else
I use 0 hand traps in my deck I use horus with paloe traps iv reached masters in master dule snake eyes seams to have a hard time with this combination however I'm not saying I win every game but I'd say is 50 50 now
I have noticed walmart and targets cards have maybe 1 or 2 spots for yugioh and a shelf for everything else kinda annoying even locals are almost none i have one that has second hand cards but no new box contents so the if i want cards its online shopping now
This whole video has told me that I’m doing the right thing by giving folks a good and super casual match with a pure rose dragon\plant deck. I’m the breath of fresh air needed 😂
I'd be fine with T0 formats if the T0 was $50. The problem is the price point for me. I switched to pokemon because the price is just so much easier to keep up with
The people who try to say "yugioh isn't dying" I think miss what you're getting at, and it feels like even you are being optimistic by saying it's just stagnating. I said this on MBT's recent video where he talked about the cost of yugioh right now: If the game is over $100 to play a casual deck, there's no casual format, and there's less locals that are actually for casuals... then the game really is dying, at least for casuals.
This phenomenon of competitive events getting higher attendance continues to surprise me, but it also makes me wonder how much of that is because it's the only time some of those people can play yugioh at all since they no longer have a locals? I wish there was a way to get real numbers on it since it seems like all we can do is give anecdotes. There are 4 card shops in my area and since the pandemic lock down only 1 supports yugioh or even carries it at all. In the past year or so, the shop stopped getting as much yugioh product because so much of it just stays on the shelf anyway. The majority of the former players stopped going, and in the last few years it went from 20ish people a week to about 8 or less who actually show up for the weekly locals. And they all play competitively and treat it as prep for tournaments (while also wanting to pull cards to sell from the OTS packs to try to make back some money).
So even though I live in a city with 4 card shops, there is nowhere left to play yugioh as a casual anymore. You've been bringing up that you have to make the game work for you and not wait for Konami to fix it for you, but the only thing I do now is just play the master duel events or a master duel masochist run (while surrendering the majority of matches to save time), or I guess playing edison on dueling book. All of my friend group stopped playing yugioh entirely because the game is gone too far for them now. The same people I met 10 years ago through yugioh and became roommates with and played nearly daily with for years, quit and don't want to even try looking at it again. It's only my anecdote, but it does make me wonder how many other people are in a similar situation.
I would add how meta players don't understand casual and are out of touch, you see MBT shitting on the pre edison game talking how it was bad because x and y deck dominated tournements but that was totaly irrelevent to casual at the time, most peoples picked an archetype or a theme they enjoyed and build a deck around it, this was 90% of deck i saw back in the days.
This is why i think no one should listen to these peoples, they are in some tourney echo chamber and doesn't understand that casual are the core player base of any cards games.
Personal opinion but yugioh is one player game meanwhile many tcg are two players game
Does people fun see people go combo for 15 minutes and in your turn you cannot break their board so it's their auto win? Yes that's not a two players game, it's one player game all right
If my opponent is going off that much I don't have anything which is luck of the draw in a card game or I'm playing blind second and the whole point of the deck is breaking boards
Also for our locals scene, people were more than willing to play speed duel. The second we realized they release horrid packs for it too instead of just being the contained decks everyone immediately dropped it.
My son comes from a world of touch screens and icons with attention span of a gnat. Konami needs to deal with the wall of text by highlighting key options/ format the cards better, so you can instantly recognise the if then else function of the card. I’m not saying introduce keywords, but text alignment / highlighting must get better.
Or ya know..not have decks that take 15 minute turns
@@apertureb2247 correct!
A new week a new yugioh is dying discussion
I'd believe you if a bunch of my locals didn't just stop holding events and selling product
Good.
@@friendlyneighbourhoodsunwheel Yeah I agree. When my OTS store dropped Tournament support for Yugioh, all my friends and I saw the writing on the wall.
I think yugioh prizing matters a lot more than people give it credit for. The lack of yugioh prizing has been directly mentioned as a reason why many high level yugioh players have left the game to become pro at other TCGs. It also makes it much harder for these high level players to make yugioh a full time job like it is for many pro magic players for example. Even if not fully subsidizing their lifestyle if could put 20-40k into their pockets each year(a low amount for a high level pokemon or lorcana player to make in a year) which when combined with content creation, sponsorships, or maybe a part time job makes it much easier for them to have more freedom, play the game more, spend more time with it, and spread its message more. Also when were talking smaller events like a regional (which could have a 100k prize pool for something like pokemon tcg) you've got to remember that toping a regional really isnt that hard, tons of players do it constantly. And those players who are bubbling are going to be much more motivated to go to more of these events and put more money into buying new cards because they know if they can just make it one step further they'll get rewarded in a tangible way.(even if its only like 1k to pay for the deck, its still something)
TL;DR: Good prize support retains high level players, provides them freedom and motivation to advertise the game which brings in new players, and motivates mid level players to invest more in both time and money. Better prize support helps the game at every level, these other games aren't doing it out of the kindness of their heart, they're doing it because it make the game better
I hope Konami can get prize support into this game someday soon, it would help this game grow and become relevant again in such a huge way
That's crazy how that affects the 1% not the 99% of the base who holds up everything else
@@GG_Nowa Did you read my comment? The whole point is that the 1% of top players bring in more players into the 99 so its important to keep them motivated and playing. (you think its a good look for the game when new players see pro players unhappy with the game and others moving to other games?) Also that if done properly it keeps the top 10%, who are the ones responsible for 90% of the spending on the game, more happy and more motivated.
"YCS' have record attendance numbers"
*sad european noises*
I think it is a brand and marketing issue as well. Yugioh isn’t pushed towards the kids anymore. How do we expect the game to keep going is we don’t bring in any new players.
My GF and I decided to try Lorcana this weekend and loved it. Game is cheap fun and easy to learn. We already plan to teach her niece the next time she comes over.
The kids are interested in Yugioh’s art I’ve shown my nephew’s and nieces the cards they immediately wanted more cards however they could not learn to play the game. Somehow we have to simplify the game to attract new players and build up the local scene as well. Bottom line something has to change from Konami.
Once upperdeck lost the TCG the prize support took a massive dump. Don't use a dead man as a shield either. He had people winning prizes of real monetary value in the show and manga
Upper deck also was in charge of those exact same expensive formats that a handful of people kept winning because they had way worse print policy then current day.
Working at a retro video game store, we sell TCGs, but we barely sell yugioh cards since they just don’t sell. Singles and packs just sit. We just don’t take them now. Pokémon and Magic actually sells.
Yugioh prize support so bad that my locals started doing there own prizes for store credit so players could get packs etc there still dont have great attendance
At my locals, yugioh prizing is MTG product lmao.
I used to love playing Yu-Gi-Oh casually at locals back in the 2010s but drifted away when I moved cities.
I was planning on getting back into the game this year, but seeing how unfriendly the TCG has become to anyone but the most dedicated players willing to fork out hundreds on a tier 0 deck that isn't even particularly challenging or fun to play has turned me right off.
I might start looking into Magic...
Do you think the digital formats (master duel, duel links) are absorbing some of the casual players? Easy of access coupled with being able to build what you want without sinking huge amounts of cash in at the start, and being able to regularly find matches regardless of time/locale makes it a very comfortable path for average duelists to get what they are looking for out of the game?
Some of them, certainly, but not enough and not in useful ways. Master Duel concurrent players has stagnated just like the paper game, because you run into the problems of paper even more on digital where anyone can play the overpowered decks. The reason casual players aren't playing anymore is because casuals mostly enjoy Yugioh through the lens of their favourite decks. If those decks aren't playable, they don't go and play meta decks, they just don't play.
I must ask, and if anyone knows, please, how does one obtain a big card like the one in the background he has?
I'm very new to Yu-Gi-Oh (coming from MTG) and tbh I understand the powercreep situation.
My stance on this is : Building decks is extremely fun and a big part of YuGioh or MTG, and for me building an underdog deck is challenging, exciting and fun !
Also, if they can release cards that brake the format and get banned, they can absolutely release cards that will, by themselves, revive and archetype and make it meta, therefore, boosting sales of older products and newer products at the same time.
nostalgia binge got me buying decks at walmart with no one to play lmao
yeah actually the one deciding that yugioh will be dead or not are at local-casual grassroots level(not yugioh exclusive even), that it's mostly product related, and ocg always put yugioh on top 3 selling in Japan because well, ocg rarities. Not to say the prizing complaint is non-issue and hopefully there is improvement there, but it's actually the less likely source of yugioh being truly dead.
I think the addition of new formats, coupled with a couple waves of proper "on boarding" products would help a lot. I feel like A LOT of the issues center around the local level, and online play, especially when talking about not only increasing, but also maintaining player numbers. If you're new to the game or even a player returning after several years it's really hard to get in to "the scene". The only real way to do it is if you already have friends that play. If you're a lone person trying to get in to the game or back in to the game you're pretty much s.o.l.. This is because of the competitive side of the game. Granted I understand everything to do with that aspect of Yu-Gi-Oh, whether it's testing for a regional event or what have you, people are going to be playing meta decks no matter what level of the game you're playing at. Imagine getting your first deck together and being excited to go to your local card shop for the weekly tournament only to find out that 6 of the 10 people there are playing tier 0 or tier 1 decks, and here you are with Fire Fist (I'll use my favorite archtype as the example here). You're just a beginner and solely wanting to play casually and have fun, and just at your locals half of the people have advanced tourney winning decks. Like I said I understand people playing good decks for tourneys like regionals or YCS, but I honestly think if you show up to your locals with one of these decks you're one of the things that's wrong with the game these days. Locals don't even count towards getting a YCS invite or anything like that, but people roll up like they're at worlds with tier 0 decks like its life or death and they have to win. To me a locals should be a relaxed, casual game night with what most people would call "mid" decks, or rogue decks. Decks that can play a 10 turn game and develop a back and forth with the opponent, with interactions besides negate, negate, negate. It should be an environment that's welcoming and mindful of new or casual players, instead it's kind of like a nightmare for some people even thinking about going to their LGS to play a few games because of not wanting to just be basically trolled every game. Unless Konami introduces new formats that limit the cards allowed or the decks allowed it would be up to the card shops to implement game nights that didn't allow certain things like tier 0 decks. I definitely feel like a lot of issues surrounding this unfortunate situation could be avoided if more people had a discussion about DECK POWER LEVEL before they start a game. In MTG (especially commander) if you're sitting down to a game you talk with the opponent about the power level of the decks you're both comfortable with using/playing against. This way the game is more even and fair, and it gives both players not only the chance, but the ability and time to actually use their deck and play out the combos and strategies that they have. That's to ensure the game is not only fair, but fun for both players. I realize that couldn't be done in a tourney or locals setting, but I feel like a lot of the people having issues like this with the game don't even play competitively, and are having these issues in "unrecorded" games. If the person you're going to play against doesn't want to discuss power level or doesn't have a different deck with them to use besides tier 0 they're honestly probably not the kind of person you want to be hanging out with anyway. If you're the guy that shows up to locals every Thursday or goes over to a friend's to play with only Snake-Eyes in your bag you're the people I'm talking about. There's a difference in trying to be ready competitively with stuff like "testing for regs" and just being a try-hard that doesn't want to lose. Nobody likes people like that, and nobody wants to play with or around people like that. Hence you have the issue of not gaining new players and not maintaining old players or having returning players. You can sit at home all by yourself and not have fun, you don't need to spend $ on cards and sleeves and a mat, and entry fee to sit across from someone else and not have fun, and people these days aren't going for it.
Sorry I know that was long. Just a lot that can be discussed in this topic. I definitely think you're right about the formats and products for new players. Events might be doing good as far as numbers, but any and every game survives or dies by the casual players. If you lose them then the game is done. So they definitely need to be doing more on both ends, but they need to focus on making the causal players happy when it comes down to it. Like you said, competitive players are going to play and attend events no matter what, but casual players will drop the game without a second thought if they think they aren't going to have any fun with it.
I feel like Speed Duels is such a fun format but people didn't even try it before they set it aside
It's initial release was dogwater that's why.
If it started as the box pre con sets it is now more people would have played it because that appeals to both draft enjoyers but people who also want to play the format properly.
The secret rare variants keep the commons down in price so the buy in is now vastly cheaper compared to launch as there's less ways for the secondary market to try screw money
Honestly hearing about how some of yall don't have cards shops or locals around really makes me feel spoiled with how many are around me. Crazy
I think Paul hit the nail on the head when it came to Yu-Gi-Oh products, and how lackluster they have been not just last year but even going back all the way into Covid era. Dawn of majesty, lightning overdrive, and a plethora of side sets that’s did nothing except waste cardboard and the tree it came from.
I'd like to start playing one piece tcg. I wouldnt be surprised if it surpasses ygo someday.
It's alive among friends. That hasnt changed. To me, it's dead in terms of the competitive scene. My locals recently all started dedicating shelf space and cases to yugioh for Lorcana. That's just me, but i imagine I am not the only one. So it's down to YCS, Master Duel, or nothing. To be honest, I really don't care anymore. As long as I have my friends to play, the competitive scene and whatever they complain about doesnt matter to me anymore. New products, new events, all of it. The competitive scene relies more on the business side of Konami to do well so as far as I am concerned, they made this mess so they can deal with it. It seems like everyone just laughs at the meme, but actions speak louder than words. If stores start pulling the product off the shelf, then maybe people will treat it like an existential threat.
I like your comments about the local environment. That’s definitely the biggest issue. Snake-eyes doesn’t affect locals like people think it does
Here’s my idea for a alt format:
It just needs to be a casual format that bars the most recent top decks from being used. Here’s my idea:
1) If a deck has topped or dominated a major event for the last few years, it’s is not allowed to compete in this casual format.
This would include any card made for that archetype if it explicitly names that archetype in anyway way or shared in its name (like even if a card is named after or even mentions Snake-Eyes in its effect text, it’s gone).
2) If a brand new deck comes out, it cannot compete for at least its first year as people use it and see if it shows up (or even dominates) in a major event. it also allows newer cards to still be used so long as the new archetype isn’t directly mentioned or in its card name. And allows for new support to be injected into this format.
This allows for decks that fell out of favor to come back, and you wouldn’t necessarily have to really change the limited/forbidden list except for cards related to the deck in question.
3) If any new support allows an older deck to start being highly used in major events, then it would simply join the decks banned from use in the casual format.
What all this does is it lets many other decks have some time, creating both variety in the decks used as well as a way for new players to join in and compete in something without fear of being overwhelmed by top decks. it also has decks possibly being added later if they fall out of favor because key cards to the original strategy get limited or banned, bring those decks down a few pegs.
Heart of the underdog.
You have described heart of the underdog.
Plenty of people are down for that be it online or in person.
@@GG_Nowa which isn’t unified and is up to individual stores, which does nobody any good. so no, it solves nothing. Konami needs to bite the damn bullet and recognize that they made some decks just too powerful to the point it shuts others off any competitive scene.
There needs to be an official UNIFIED Konami-lead effort, not one put onto OTSs to come up with it on their own.
If the local scene dies, the regionals will follow.
The problem with competitive players is when you get that good at a card game you start branching out for a new challenge. People who top these YCS and Worlds events are also playing games like Magic, Lorcana, One Piece, they're playing SOMETHING else that also has a competitive scene with better incentives that are worth their time and effort of being good at the game.
People talk about this game "dying" all the time, but THIS time there's more to it than "the meta sucks". Some of the most competitive cards are STAYING at 40-50+ PER COPY because Konami doesn't want to reprint them. Bonfire, Quem, Cartesia, Thrust, all of these cards are stupid expensive entirely because Konami's treating the TCG like a cash cow to be squeezed instead of reprinting cards like in the OCG. People don't want to play a card game where being even KIND OF good is pay-walled. It doesn't help that even the more popular decks like Blue-eyes and Dark Magician or even something like Heroes has cards that are 15-20 or even sometimes 30 bucks a copy.
Yugioh is not an appealing game for new OR casual players because it's complicated, difficult, and very expensive to even attempt to build a "good" deck. But it's also becoming less desirable to play competitively because other card games with equal or greater challenge at the top tables have MONUMENTALLY better prize systems from special cards to entire CASES of booster boxes for the latest set.
the only solutions that I can honestly see working long term is introducing and properly supporting set rotation, and alternate formats. My pitch for alt formats to be pushed by Konami is Edison, maybe a specific banlist from 2014-16, and TOSS (I personally am not a big fan of GOAT hence its omission).
A wise man once said "It's dead bury it." Rip mother Teresa.
Lately at locals me and 4 others usually just play goat format in battle royale style and it’s a lot fun, goat is surprisingly diverse and I can make a lot of fun and unique decks for all of us to use
Most stores in the Netherlands stopped selling yugioh, lots of stores don’t do yugioh locals anymore. And its pretty hard to find people to play with. Even the ^%#$* Capitol city Amsterdam does not have 1 shop that does ygo locals.
Same in France i need to drive hours to Paris or Reims if im lucky to get anyone to play with, this game is almost dead with everyone smilling
My local stores quit carrying YGO i noticed the last time i was there. Soon it will either be walmart or tcgplayer only for me. Finding sleeves is hard asf in my area too.
Many players have fallen off at my locals including myself. They would average 18 players a night and now they are lucky to get 8