The section of video addressing Sonic game's tutorials are (frustratingly - at least to me) missing the point of what people mean that they don't teach you correctly. Sonic games are bad at teaching how their level design works, like: - How the top path is usually the fastest. - How you shouldn't be passive during an automated section and should predict/look out for traps in them. - Why they should be encouraged to be played multiple times to figure out the best route, memorize the level design and beat them faster. There have been some strides in the mechanics of the newer games to teach players some of stuff implicitly, such as the Ranking System or the Red Rings, but I wonder if they should do it more explicitly like with Hint Rings saying stuff like "Hey, the fastest route is usually the upper path and the slower more dangerous route is on the lower path", or something in that vein.
The top path being the fastest is a common misconception, it seems. Because it is rarely the fastest path, maybe the safest since you are further from potential bottomless pits, but rarely the fastest. And honestly, that's something a game should not explicitly teach, but allow the player to figure out on their own, makes it more rewarding and less formulaic. The same goes for "teaching players to replay the game or levels". That shouldn't be thought, but encouraged and rewarded.
Hmmmmm... I would say, at least, for the classic games, you kind of learn this stuff the hard way with the pathways. At the start, especially when you go through loops and see goodies on top of it and be like, "Oh man, how do I get there?". That's when you start gaining the interest in wanting to learn how to get to that upper path way, which sometimes tends to involve just slowing down and surveying your surroundings. Green Hill Zone and Emerald Hill Show are a good example of this. Aquatic ruins and Hydrocity also shoe a good example of this as well. So, you do get tells about what kind of goodies you can get from finding and reaching those upper paths. Which makes the replays of the stages fun, because when you do find the method. Then, you'll always be getting that top path wah for those extra rings, lives, or few seconds time saves or safety from enemies. As for the automated section, it is awkward sometimes. Sonic Adventure 1 has automated sections, but you are still in full control, and not pressing anything sometimes kills you. Or, in Adventure 2 and Heroes case, you mess with the controller during automated sections and they kill you. They've gotten a little better with that overtime, which is where the dashpads and such comes in. However, it is come with the caveats of too much automation
@@RisingSonic17 when it comes to automation in sonic games (especially the 3d ones) it was mostly used for spectacle. for example the orca chase in sa1 and 06, the truck chase in sa2 etc. they've gotten to a point where there's too much automation and dash pads around, not allowing the player to mess up. throwing away the trial and error that the classics had, and in my opinion makes the games less fun and less replayable.
@ I think people tend to be bad at Sonic games because they play them with 1 of 2 preconceived notions. 1. They think Sonic games are just "run forward and win" so when the game presents them with something slightly complex they get stumped 2. They hear how jank and clunky Sonic games can be so they assume every mistake they make must be the game, so they make the same mistake over and over because they think it's the right solution but the game is jank so it only works sometimes instead of just adapting to the situation.
Can you like not speak for everyone? Unless it's a joke of course. You always suck at a sonic game when playing it for the first time. Maybe second. But otherwise it's a you problem
@ I am half joking I will admit, I use everyone as hyperbole, (that would include me if I wasn't) I am serious about people sucking but I'm joking about everybody. And yes everyone (me included) weren't pros at Sonic when first starting, my only problem is how people refuse to get better at the games and therefore the game must be bad.
After playing Donkey Kong Country games (1, 2, returns, tropical freeze) my perspective of difficulty in video games permanently changed for the better. Heroes had become my favorite game over 1 summer
Unleashed I gave a new try a few weeks ago and been enjoying it, but the tutorials in that game don't really tell you much so I needed a guide to understand some of the mechanics, especially werehogs. The game is hard but its honestly harder than it should be thanks to the very low FPS which also brings with it some input delay, so with the games speed, its impossible to react to something first time, you need to know its coming with reattempts.
Sonic Unleashed provides so many hint bubbles in the game to help you Especially with the Werehog, they swarm you all around with hint bubbles to tell you everything you need to know. There's also a combo list for you for your combat. Also, yeah... if you don't have a Series X or an emulator... Yeah, the frame rate is rough
I feel like the main issue comes from expecting sonic games to be like other home console games instead of thinking of them for what they really are: arcade games, it becomes really aparent when you remember that most of SEGAs greatest games are arcade classics like crazy taxi, golden axe, space harrier, DAYTONA usa...
One of the most important aspects of arcade games is their availability, and pick up and play nature. If modern Sonic games were like arcade games, there would be no issues for newcomers to get into them.
@snakey888 yeah they were easy to get into, but made sure to suck all your coins, those games are notoriously difficult. Sonic deals with the same design philosophy of being hard to master, but in some games forget the part of being easy to pick up Point is, both arcade games and sonic games seek to be challenging
That was a great vid, I think Colours deserves a lot of credit for taking one of the most punishing games in the series and adapting it to be more accessible without sacrificing *too much* of Unleashed’s depth.
Hmmmm idk. I think Sonic Colors removed most of the depth due to it being more 2d focused and being riddled with the Wisps. The only time the game really starts giving you a slightly challenge is from Terminal Velocity
@ As far as the reaction-style Boost gameplay goes tho, the level design is quite accommodating. There’s lots of ways to optimise the run with good timing, but the punishment for failure is very rarely death like it was in Unleashed. The caveat is it’s a much slower game overall with way more automation and scripting. But I can totally imagine a small child mastering it’s levels with some practice while Unleashed would be a much bigger ordeal.
@Sparkys_World-0 thats one thing I can say about Colors. It's a great beginner Sonic game for people to ease into the series. Not Super punishing, easy to understand.
The best Sonic games are generally quite easy compared to other platformers, at least if you are just looking to get through it, and there are several reasons for that. The ring system is incredibly forgiving, there are barely any bottomless pits, but rather a different path if you fall. The game will not be too fast either, as usually it requires skill to go fast. All while having simple controls and straightforward mechanics. Of course, this does not apply to the not so good games, where speed is often forced upon the player through various scripts and dash pads, having more complex and less intuitive controls, several different gameplay styles and other issues.
It is very dependent. The scripts and dash pads are usually there to keep the player on the path most of the time and to give small breaks with automation. There is TOO much automation, though, to a point where it just doesn't feel engaging. Sonic 4 and Forces are definitely those games that do force it on you, but those games are so easy that you don't feel like you have to try. Unleashed felt like that just right mix with its difficulty where it was going to take a while to really get better at, but the mechanics and level design are very strong. For the 2D games in particular, it really is dependent on how well the level design compliments Sonic speed. In cases of the Advance games, the screen crunch punishes you for trying to keep your speed because you don't know what's coming up ahead. Sonic Rush, can he be egregious with its bottomless pit when trying to keep your boost going. Even if things are rather simple and straightforward, those other aspects really come into play to have everything come together.
@@RisingSonic17 Sure, but the thing is that it takes away controls and agency, alienating the player as a result. Which is probably one of the reasons that the best regarded Sonic games have comparably very little automation. Unleashed has a few issues that would alienate a player. For one, the game encourages and sometimes forces you to go fast, whether it's through dash pads, boost prompts, or water segments, while at the same time punishing you for it with various traps, bottomless pits, missed collectibles which are required to progress. So, I agree with you, level design is important for 2d and 3d. It's also quite a complex game, with two very different playstyles, hubs, shops, various missions and collectibles, level up systems. Some of the aspects are not properly conveyed, like the importance of medals.
@snakey888 that I agree. I know the medals tend to get played up, but they can be real pace Breakers. Especially on first playthroughs, you're probably gonna miss a couple of medals from the daytime stages because you're moving too fast, or you're currently struggling to keep to the fast path ways. Most of your medals collections will most likely come from the Werehog because of its exploration nature. I do agree that the less a Sonic game has automation, it's probably more enjoyed. You also brought up a point about people not knowing when something is an automated section. That I can agree with. Sometimes with Sonic Adventure 2, Heroes, and 06. Some automated sections kill you if you input anything and that can get confusing. You can also unintentionally mess up scripted sections and lose a life for it. You don't start picking it up until you start playing more and more games.
I find it so weird every time someone says Sonic's main appeal is replay value. I don't really replay levels just so I can do better. I replay them because I like them. I never care at all about which route I'm on, unless I'm aiming to get collectibles. It's so weird being a fan of a franchise whose core appeal isn't even appealing to me. I mean, HD Unleashed's difficulty isn't even one of the reasons it's my favorite. I just simply like the game. ... Eggmanland can burn in Hell though.
It's the incentive part of the ranking system and such that makes you wanna keep replaying levels. Of course, if you don't really care about getting S ranks and just wanna play the game to the end, that's completely fine. You can still find games really enjoyable like that. However, at least for me, if I REALLY like a game and there's some sort of reward for being really good at it, I wanna keep replaying it til I start getting better and I start clearing stages more efficiently. That's where the fun is. Improving in things makes you feel good.
I remember getting frustrated with Mania years ago. But that was because I was playing it when I was extremely tired. It’s not really hard. The bosses in Sonic Superstars suck though. They’re not good, just super sucky. I guess this is what happens when Sega listens to the “it’s too easy” dorks. Same like it was with the Frontiers DLC.
The bosses in Superstars are so Dookie doo doo dog shit. If they aren't boring slogs, they're unfairly difficult for no reason. That's stuff that makes people not wanna continue playing the game
@ i know. I myself have stopped playing the game even with the chaos emeralds. Especially when I heard that the lizard character has an even harder campaign. Even Sonic 06 didn’t commit the sin of making me stop playing before I saw the credits.
@xamp_exclammark Frontiers Final Horizon was a combination of whiplash and poorly implemented ideas. Considering how hard in the main game wasn’t really hard at all. Going to Final Horizon felt like a massive difficulty spike when it came to the towers and challenges. The Tower Climbs are VERY punishing on hard mode. At the very least, it doesn't mean death, but falling down and having to fall from the beginning is just as bad. Then, of course, the Master King trail is the biggest ball kicker ever
The reason Sonic has a hard time attracting newcomers, especially the 3D games, is because these games usually offer no safety nets. A misplaced jump or just a poor understanding of how the level design works is often punished with death instead of just letting the player try again. No one loves bottomless pits as much as Sonic Team. This on top of the usual jank they became known for. Also, moving in a 3D space isn't as natural as it is on two dimensions, hence why even your grandma can pick up and play Sonic 2.
There's nothing particularly wrong with that. It's not like most Sonic games are hard, but by design, they can be very arcade like. A failed jump and no understanding of the level design could lead to death in a lot of platformers. Some are more punishing than Sonic (look at classic Mega Man). And even then, I would say that even 2D Sonic games aren't very kind due to some levels being vertical or certain enemy placements or what not.
Tbf sonic is more than a platformer Its highspeed 🗿 But seriously tho the momentum and speed is hard to adapt at first, I remember i was a kid i got sonic 1 ios and i was stuck in green hill, but not frustrated, more fascinated at the momentum physics as ive never seen such ever Before that point ive never played fast games, only played like mario But once i got the hang of thing, wow even to this day sonic is my favorite You need to spend time and really get it Hard to learn if new, but fun to master Like REALLY fun
It is? I first played Sonic when I was 5 years old and completed the entire thing every time (Labyrinth and Marble Zones included), it's wild to me that people consider it hard to get into. Though I agree truly mastering it is super fun.
it's funny because my first sonic game at age 5 was rush, and i was able to figure out all its mechanics including the homing attack despite no clear tutorial. a couple years later i got unleashed and was able to beat it too, i'd often replay the boost stages until i got S ranks. but after all that i wasn't able to finish heroes or sonic 1-3 🤨
It is funny sometimes. As kids, you sometimes just brute force your way in things, and you just pick up on a lot of stuff by just doing whatever. Trust me, I was questioning how I was able to beat Shadow the Hedgehog, but struggled so badly with the Genesis games as a kid.
I think it's because when you're a kid you're engaged because you're being introduced to so many Sonic concepts, as well as the specific game mechanics.
@@RisingSonic17 that's very true, as a kid you don't really know what good control or game design is so you brute force & are less likely to give up. ngl i think playing sonic games (specifically boost games) fundamentally influenced my way of thinking. now i'm 20 and work as a professional musician, and nothing gives me more satisfication than nailing a difficult piece from start to finish in a linear fashion. it's the exact same feeling i get when i nail a boost level from start to finish 🤷
When i was little, i used to hate sonic games because of his zones that had to many pathways, enemy placements and shields that are always hidden not the fact the game KEEPS reminding me to collect those 7 chaos emeralds for uknown reason or logicaly explaination... when i got a bit older i finaly understanded all sonic & friend's mechanics im looking at you shadow...
Growing up had the opposite problem where I felt like the tutorials were kind of just hand holding if its forced on you (especially heroes, like let me use my brain, damn). Most things outside of the carnival night barrel & riders controls just seemed obvious with context clues and a instruction booklet (riders tutorial is buried in the menus for some reason, its pretty much why i learned the tornado move after beating the game) But hey, I'm the type of person who loved reading the instructions to know what I was doing before playing so maybe I'm just an odd case. One thing I wish the series did more was actually keep mechanics instead of ditching them randomly so people ain't confused so much game to game on what they can do. -The air trick system introduced in advance 2 should have been a series staple instead of being exclusive to portable nintendo titles before 2010 & dissapearing. -Spindashing & double jumping kinda just gets removed in some games and come back years later randomly since the 90s. -Moves like ring dash & spindash get restricted to wisp powers for no real reason. Did you know you can mid air spin attack after junping off a spring?... Only in Triple trouble, no other 2D games do this. Maybe adventure games do. I could go on... Imagine newbies trying to keep track of what moves are in which games, as if button mapping issues weren't already gonna screw them over with muscle memory.
Ohhh. Yeah, the one big flaw with Sonic constantly changing and switching it up every game is that game mechanics come and go. Some things may stay like light speed dashing and stuff, but the gameplay may be completely different this time. This is why whenever a new game comes out, I always gotta test what Sonic has during the first level and such to familiarize myself with what they kept or what they removed. Then there's the thing with button mappings being changed like with Unleashed -> Sonic Gens -> Frontiers -> Shadow Gens. It can be a lot to remember and can mix you up. I would agree that a consistency in mechanics between games would also be very helpful in easing in the games
Shadow Generations, for the most part, find that good balance for just being a well designed game. It's Ranking system though, is very forgiving for being strictly based on time
I feel like SA2 is sort of an enigma when it comes to the topic of enjoying Sonic game. Cause it depends on when you play it and what version you’re playing, if you’ve played the original Dreamcast version 9 times out of ten you’ll enjoy it no matter how old you are. If you’ve played the ports (in my experience the Xbox version) you’ll probably get used to it if your younger, but the older you get the less and less likely you’ll probably enjoy it. In my experience the Xbox version of the game had its moments, but the speed stages especially with rail heavy levels and doing other moves when attempting a light speed dash I came to absolutely loathed the game, and although I eventually got used to it I can’t say I enjoy it due to my earlier experiences with the game. And it’s why I believe the best and most accessible way to play SA2 is to get it on steam and mod it if only for better button mapping and rail grinding.
its a shame SA2 is the way it is, its not supposed to control that poorly, SEGA just doesnt care about fixing the analog control for it in the slightest. It took fans over a decade to make a proper mod for it that fixed it.
The Dreamcast version is not significantly better than the ports, button mapping is just as much of a problem there as it is anywhere else. And the rail grinding is rarely, if ever, more demanding than just holding the crouch button. Rail switching is cumbersome in either version. All versions have inconsistent gameplay styles, and a whole bunch of automation that would alienate newcomers.
I haven't watched the whole video yet, so forgive me if you elaborate on this and I'm missing the point, but... I think it's no coincidence that the most popular Sonic games in typical online discourse nowdays tend to be the ones that have the most "guardrails" and least amount of bottomless pits and trap obstacles on the levels. S3&K, both versions of Colors and Generations, Mania, Unwiished, etc and the least popular are the ones that throw these at you the most (8 bit games, Advance, HD Unleashed, Heroes, Lost World, hell id argue that even if it was unintentional because the guardrails just don't WORK half the time, that 06 fits here too, and to a lesser extent, Adventure.) The Sonic games, ESPECIALLY the older ones, make people who get into the series want to instantly be able to zoom along like the namesake of the games, not helping this is that ports of the older games give you stuff like the drop and spin dash in levels that were never designed in the first place to accommodate it. This makes players that have these tools for speed that can't always be used effectively feel inadequate and impatient, when in truth they probably aren't being methodical enough, you're supposed to earn your speed by replaying the levels and getting better and faster incrementally, not by zooming through at sonic speed on your first, second, or even third try. For a player that's decent and not abusing glitches, the average Sonic level actually usually clocks in at around the same length or even a little longer than other platformer levels from games like Megaman X or Mario. In a weird way I always think this series is most replayable when you're an adult, because when you're a kid you don't necessarily have the expectations and tropes of a fast paced platformer drilled into your brain yet, to be able to predict and memorize level design as effectively as you can as an adult. When I was a kid I played like this, and usually stuck to the earlier levels that gave me that instant gratification of speed and power.
I can actually attest to this when I was a kid. I used to not like a lot of the classic games because there was always that one level that just took away the fun speed from Sonic (I used to stop at Marble Zone in Sonic 1 and Chemical Plant in Sonic 2). Tbf, I was terrible at those games, and getting a game over meant going back to the beginning. This is why I liked 3&K the most because it had a save feature. Now, as I am older, I can appreciate some of the slower levels if the platforming itself is actually good. This is something I could say for some games, but certainly not all (Advance 3 and Superstars are my immediate examples). Sonic Unleashed as a kid, I struggled so much with the day stages that I was always looking forward to the Werehog because at the time, I couldn't handle the quick reactions from that game. Colors and Generations definitely eased me in. It always had me curious why Sonic Heroes was something I got through easily as a kid when I see adults now struggling with it so much. It's probably like you said because, as kids, we don't quite register or process that expectation of what to expect out of a speedy platformer. Going back to these games as adults where you're more understanding of how things work definitely helps with replayability, and you can see when the games do something right and where they fail in certain aspects. Sometimes, things do take time to really grow on you.
Honestly a lot of people take Sonic's nature about "speed" at such a face value that they hate being met with some obstacles that break your pace a little bit, I've been playing a lot of Sonic CD lately and while i've grown accustom to that games level design and really like it, I constantly see people complain that there's too much springs and stuff in the way or that they don't care to explore and that they prefer 3 and k's speedier level design. Platformers are gonna break your pace no matter what, it's not detriment to sonic's name for a game to begin to challenge you and I think a lot of people don't understand that. The speed isn't about just "sonic runs fast" it's you as a player improving at getting through obstacles quickly without getting your pace killed. There's a speed cap in Sonic 1 but that game isn't "solved" in terms of speedrunning etc.
@@LLotad Yes, I get that feeling. You've gotta be cautious and look out for traps that would otherwise cut your speed. Can't just hold right to win (unless you're playing Unleashed, where you need to react rather than predict.)
@@LLotad I think they're expecting a minimum amount of speed. In classic sonic the minimum amount of speed you need to reach is too fast for you to be able to react to incoming obstacles leading to frustration. This is because sonic's sprite is too big, and the screen is too small. If sonic's sprite was smaller, then it would be less detailed, but you could go at his max base speed and still easily be able to react to things.
Loved this video, but I disagree completely that Sonic games give sufficient tutorials. Almost done making a very similar video, and I think the biggest thing for approachability involves making better tutorials. SA2 the goat for example doesn’t fully explain homing attacking and all its intricacies (its range, the fact that you have to point at the enemy, the fact you can hold a to bounce higher), doesn’t tell you that the third hint on the monitor gives the easiest hint, barely explains rail grinding, and a good chunk of gimmicks are all trial and error. It would be amazing if in security hall or aquatic mine if the in-game cutscene would include a mini dialogue of rogue saying “it seems I may have to open these vaults. They’re separated by color! I can only have one group of vaults open at a time.” While showing off the vault room switches but instead, you gotta lose a couple of times to figure everything out, if you even do. The biggest issue though is omochao: very hard to see or find sometimes, and because a good 1/3 are unhelpful or redundant, a lot of people ignore her because they think it’s a waste. I think if omochao automatically came and talked to you as soon as you passed them up rather than touching her would help a lot, and you could just disable the hints/omochao if you wish. For mechanics, the training room in frontiers is perfect. It would be amazing if in SA2 you could press right on the dpad and it would give you a homing attack chain to try
To be fair, there are plenty of other issues with sa2 that makes it alienating. For one, having three different playstyles that it rotates between, hinders a player from being fully engrossed, rather creating a whiplash effect with constant changing. Speaking of whiplash, all the dash pads and scripts take away agency from the player, alienating them as the player does not feel fully in control. And button mapping does not help, too many actions are mapped to the same button, making performing some actions too unreliable.
My story with boost I have already played mania, just thought it was a good game nothing fantastic then I was at a friend's party and I got to play Sonic Generations, I played sky sanctuary I was very afraid to boost when I discovered the move, but as I failed and tried again, I would feel more and more comfortable with sonic's boost then I wouldn't need to slow down anymore and that kinda made me in love with sonic gameplay in general, so if the game explains to it's players that you need to master the levels to boost proprerly through things like hard ranks and etc... players will see what I saw on that day that changed the entire course of my history when it comes to gaming
Imo sonic games are extremely easy and I physically cringe when I see people sucking at them. I’m 27 right now but I beat the vast majority of the games as a kid/teenager with no effort. I’ve seen people on reddit claim sonic generations is hard, which is like THE EASIEST SONIC GAME EVER.
This is actually why I avoid a lot of people who aren't really into games or Sonic in general because I know I'm just gonna be stressed about them. It's nothing against them, but I can't help it sometimes. 💀 Cause I'm like, "How are you struggling? I beat this as a kid who just didn't understand a damn thing."
@@RisingSonic17I’m not trying to be mean but I think people nowadays don’t even try or are too brain rotted to figure out games. When I was 13 I got every single emblem in sa1 and sa2. And now you got adults who can’t beat the simplest levels. I actually think Mario games are harder than Sonic games (especially the 2D ones) but somehow nobody complains about those. People just love bitching about sonic games.
Sonic games are bad at teaching you how to play them, not in the basics and tutorials, but in how the levels are designed. The Classic games don't really tell you that you need to watch out for Passivity Traps, or that you should try and find ways to get to the top, faster path. They don't tell you when you should just enjoy the speedy spectacle, or when you should slow down for platforming or to look for passivity traps. In Mario and similar, this isn't necessary, because the only aspect of those levels is "jump over the bad guys." Megaman seems to be the same, be patient and jump over the bad guys. I think that's why I prefered the Boost games for a while, since they're much simpler, either featuring DKCR-style platforming, or Mobile Endless Runner-style soft QTEs. Though, after playing Mania a couple times, I grew to love the Classic-style games too, especially as I began to understand what they're going for more.
Rarely is the top path the faster path at least in the regular classic games. Also, the classic games usually slow you down for platforming sections. It's more so that you need to have skill and knowledge if you want to maintain speed for a platforming challenge.
People always treating Sonic like it's some alien creature; it's still a platformer my guy, you jump over the bad guys just like the rest. You're basically asking for the game to backseat for you and tell you what to do at every moment. Sonic doesn't even punish you all that hard for getting hit; every other platformer is way more harsh with mistakes and allows far fewer. Even if you aren't sure when to expect hazards, the game is very forgiving and you can get by every level face tanking every obstacle long as you hold onto your rings. But learning when to anticipate danger is a part of playing action games in general; I know it's an extreme example, but the souls games don't exactly tell you when enemies and traps are going to come at you, they're very deliberate about ambushing you, but that's part of the game, you observe, you learn, and you recognize the patterns so you can better anticipate obstacles ahead of time. This applies even to Sonic, specifically the classic games; it's not about memorization, it's about pattern recognition
People are like, "yeah, I don't have time to learn how to get good at a game," then spend hours of their days wasting time doomscrolling or whatnot, haha
"Are Sonic Games Not Accessible Enough?" I feel like that is the case. Many Sonic games i love like Riders/Zero Gravity or Heroes are locked to either their original console releases, (so you have to be lucky to have those) or are locked behind emulation. (Wich, to someone with a potato computer like me, makes them unplayable) I'd pay for a HD Re-release of those games if i could but SEGA loves to gatekeep i guess. Note: i wrote this before watching the video, they weren't talking about this type of accessibility lol
The section of video addressing Sonic game's tutorials are (frustratingly - at least to me) missing the point of what people mean that they don't teach you correctly.
Sonic games are bad at teaching how their level design works, like:
- How the top path is usually the fastest.
- How you shouldn't be passive during an automated section and should predict/look out for traps in them.
- Why they should be encouraged to be played multiple times to figure out the best route, memorize the level design and beat them faster.
There have been some strides in the mechanics of the newer games to teach players some of stuff implicitly, such as the Ranking System or the Red Rings, but I wonder if they should do it more explicitly like with Hint Rings saying stuff like "Hey, the fastest route is usually the upper path and the slower more dangerous route is on the lower path", or something in that vein.
The top path being the fastest is a common misconception, it seems. Because it is rarely the fastest path, maybe the safest since you are further from potential bottomless pits, but rarely the fastest. And honestly, that's something a game should not explicitly teach, but allow the player to figure out on their own, makes it more rewarding and less formulaic.
The same goes for "teaching players to replay the game or levels". That shouldn't be thought, but encouraged and rewarded.
Hmmmmm...
I would say, at least, for the classic games, you kind of learn this stuff the hard way with the pathways. At the start, especially when you go through loops and see goodies on top of it and be like, "Oh man, how do I get there?". That's when you start gaining the interest in wanting to learn how to get to that upper path way, which sometimes tends to involve just slowing down and surveying your surroundings. Green Hill Zone and Emerald Hill Show are a good example of this. Aquatic ruins and Hydrocity also shoe a good example of this as well. So, you do get tells about what kind of goodies you can get from finding and reaching those upper paths. Which makes the replays of the stages fun, because when you do find the method. Then, you'll always be getting that top path wah for those extra rings, lives, or few seconds time saves or safety from enemies.
As for the automated section, it is awkward sometimes. Sonic Adventure 1 has automated sections, but you are still in full control, and not pressing anything sometimes kills you. Or, in Adventure 2 and Heroes case, you mess with the controller during automated sections and they kill you.
They've gotten a little better with that overtime, which is where the dashpads and such comes in. However, it is come with the caveats of too much automation
@@RisingSonic17 when it comes to automation in sonic games (especially the 3d ones) it was mostly used for spectacle. for example the orca chase in sa1 and 06, the truck chase in sa2 etc. they've gotten to a point where there's too much automation and dash pads around, not allowing the player to mess up. throwing away the trial and error that the classics had, and in my opinion makes the games less fun and less replayable.
I'm only 10 seconds in and I already agree with this entire video, EVERYONE sucks at these games.
And that probably won't change in the far future
@ I think people tend to be bad at Sonic games because they play them with 1 of 2 preconceived notions.
1. They think Sonic games are just "run forward and win" so when the game presents them with something slightly complex they get stumped
2. They hear how jank and clunky Sonic games can be so they assume every mistake they make must be the game, so they make the same mistake over and over because they think it's the right solution but the game is jank so it only works sometimes instead of just adapting to the situation.
@@Neo-Metal17 ADAPT IMPROVISE OVERCOME
Can you like not speak for everyone? Unless it's a joke of course. You always suck at a sonic game when playing it for the first time. Maybe second. But otherwise it's a you problem
@ I am half joking I will admit, I use everyone as hyperbole, (that would include me if I wasn't) I am serious about people sucking but I'm joking about everybody. And yes everyone (me included) weren't pros at Sonic when first starting, my only problem is how people refuse to get better at the games and therefore the game must be bad.
when you finally understand a sonic game it feels so rewarding and makes you feel so cool. it makes you feel like sonic
So true.
After playing Donkey Kong Country games (1, 2, returns, tropical freeze) my perspective of difficulty in video games permanently changed for the better. Heroes had become my favorite game over 1 summer
7:38 Soo... you basically, lived and learned?
Yes 💀
I Sonic Adventure 2'd
Hanging on the edge of tomorrow?
Unleashed I gave a new try a few weeks ago and been enjoying it, but the tutorials in that game don't really tell you much so I needed a guide to understand some of the mechanics, especially werehogs. The game is hard but its honestly harder than it should be thanks to the very low FPS which also brings with it some input delay, so with the games speed, its impossible to react to something first time, you need to know its coming with reattempts.
Sonic Unleashed provides so many hint bubbles in the game to help you
Especially with the Werehog, they swarm you all around with hint bubbles to tell you everything you need to know. There's also a combo list for you for your combat.
Also, yeah... if you don't have a Series X or an emulator... Yeah, the frame rate is rough
I feel like the main issue comes from expecting sonic games to be like other home console games instead of thinking of them for what they really are: arcade games, it becomes really aparent when you remember that most of SEGAs greatest games are arcade classics like crazy taxi, golden axe, space harrier, DAYTONA usa...
One of the most important aspects of arcade games is their availability, and pick up and play nature. If modern Sonic games were like arcade games, there would be no issues for newcomers to get into them.
@snakey888 yeah they were easy to get into, but made sure to suck all your coins, those games are notoriously difficult. Sonic deals with the same design philosophy of being hard to master, but in some games forget the part of being easy to pick up
Point is, both arcade games and sonic games seek to be challenging
@@ritabelli5825 completely agree, but forgetting the "easy to pick up" is too important of an aspect for those kinds of games.
Damn your statement is so... Correct. I never knew the way to describe Sonic's design philosophy as one word but "Arcadey" is kinda perfect
''holding forward in 2D Sonic is like button mashing in DMC5''
-ALtheboi
That was a great vid, I think Colours deserves a lot of credit for taking one of the most punishing games in the series and adapting it to be more accessible without sacrificing *too much* of Unleashed’s depth.
Hmmmm idk. I think Sonic Colors removed most of the depth due to it being more 2d focused and being riddled with the Wisps. The only time the game really starts giving you a slightly challenge is from Terminal Velocity
@ As far as the reaction-style Boost gameplay goes tho, the level design is quite accommodating. There’s lots of ways to optimise the run with good timing, but the punishment for failure is very rarely death like it was in Unleashed. The caveat is it’s a much slower game overall with way more automation and scripting. But I can totally imagine a small child mastering it’s levels with some practice while Unleashed would be a much bigger ordeal.
@Sparkys_World-0 thats one thing I can say about Colors. It's a great beginner Sonic game for people to ease into the series.
Not Super punishing, easy to understand.
The best Sonic games are generally quite easy compared to other platformers, at least if you are just looking to get through it, and there are several reasons for that. The ring system is incredibly forgiving, there are barely any bottomless pits, but rather a different path if you fall. The game will not be too fast either, as usually it requires skill to go fast. All while having simple controls and straightforward mechanics.
Of course, this does not apply to the not so good games, where speed is often forced upon the player through various scripts and dash pads, having more complex and less intuitive controls, several different gameplay styles and other issues.
It is very dependent.
The scripts and dash pads are usually there to keep the player on the path most of the time and to give small breaks with automation. There is TOO much automation, though, to a point where it just doesn't feel engaging. Sonic 4 and Forces are definitely those games that do force it on you, but those games are so easy that you don't feel like you have to try.
Unleashed felt like that just right mix with its difficulty where it was going to take a while to really get better at, but the mechanics and level design are very strong.
For the 2D games in particular, it really is dependent on how well the level design compliments Sonic speed. In cases of the Advance games, the screen crunch punishes you for trying to keep your speed because you don't know what's coming up ahead. Sonic Rush, can he be egregious with its bottomless pit when trying to keep your boost going.
Even if things are rather simple and straightforward, those other aspects really come into play to have everything come together.
@@RisingSonic17
Sure, but the thing is that it takes away controls and agency, alienating the player as a result. Which is probably one of the reasons that the best regarded Sonic games have comparably very little automation.
Unleashed has a few issues that would alienate a player. For one, the game encourages and sometimes forces you to go fast, whether it's through dash pads, boost prompts, or water segments, while at the same time punishing you for it with various traps, bottomless pits, missed collectibles which are required to progress. So, I agree with you, level design is important for 2d and 3d.
It's also quite a complex game, with two very different playstyles, hubs, shops, various missions and collectibles, level up systems. Some of the aspects are not properly conveyed, like the importance of medals.
@snakey888 that I agree. I know the medals tend to get played up, but they can be real pace Breakers. Especially on first playthroughs, you're probably gonna miss a couple of medals from the daytime stages because you're moving too fast, or you're currently struggling to keep to the fast path ways.
Most of your medals collections will most likely come from the Werehog because of its exploration nature.
I do agree that the less a Sonic game has automation, it's probably more enjoyed. You also brought up a point about people not knowing when something is an automated section. That I can agree with. Sometimes with Sonic Adventure 2, Heroes, and 06. Some automated sections kill you if you input anything and that can get confusing. You can also unintentionally mess up scripted sections and lose a life for it.
You don't start picking it up until you start playing more and more games.
I find it so weird every time someone says Sonic's main appeal is replay value. I don't really replay levels just so I can do better. I replay them because I like them. I never care at all about which route I'm on, unless I'm aiming to get collectibles. It's so weird being a fan of a franchise whose core appeal isn't even appealing to me. I mean, HD Unleashed's difficulty isn't even one of the reasons it's my favorite. I just simply like the game. ... Eggmanland can burn in Hell though.
It's the incentive part of the ranking system and such that makes you wanna keep replaying levels. Of course, if you don't really care about getting S ranks and just wanna play the game to the end, that's completely fine. You can still find games really enjoyable like that.
However, at least for me, if I REALLY like a game and there's some sort of reward for being really good at it, I wanna keep replaying it til I start getting better and I start clearing stages more efficiently.
That's where the fun is. Improving in things makes you feel good.
You still replay them though right? Simply being fun to replay is still replay value.
Oh shit that’s me!
Sorry my mic isn’t the greatest everyone
Nice pfp
I remember getting frustrated with Mania years ago. But that was because I was playing it when I was extremely tired. It’s not really hard. The bosses in Sonic Superstars suck though. They’re not good, just super sucky. I guess this is what happens when Sega listens to the “it’s too easy” dorks. Same like it was with the Frontiers DLC.
The bosses in Superstars are so Dookie doo doo dog shit.
If they aren't boring slogs, they're unfairly difficult for no reason.
That's stuff that makes people not wanna continue playing the game
@ i know. I myself have stopped playing the game even with the chaos emeralds. Especially when I heard that the lizard character has an even harder campaign. Even Sonic 06 didn’t commit the sin of making me stop playing before I saw the credits.
@Hynotama yeah. Trip's campaign is even harder. It's not worth the 2nd playthrough honestly
The frontiers DLC was mostly pretty good and better than the Superstars bosses. I just wish they had kept the Boss Rush BS out
@xamp_exclammark Frontiers Final Horizon was a combination of whiplash and poorly implemented ideas. Considering how hard in the main game wasn’t really hard at all. Going to Final Horizon felt like a massive difficulty spike when it came to the towers and challenges.
The Tower Climbs are VERY punishing on hard mode. At the very least, it doesn't mean death, but falling down and having to fall from the beginning is just as bad.
Then, of course, the Master King trail is the biggest ball kicker ever
The reason Sonic has a hard time attracting newcomers, especially the 3D games, is because these games usually offer no safety nets. A misplaced jump or just a poor understanding of how the level design works is often punished with death instead of just letting the player try again. No one loves bottomless pits as much as Sonic Team.
This on top of the usual jank they became known for. Also, moving in a 3D space isn't as natural as it is on two dimensions, hence why even your grandma can pick up and play Sonic 2.
There's nothing particularly wrong with that.
It's not like most Sonic games are hard, but by design, they can be very arcade like. A failed jump and no understanding of the level design could lead to death in a lot of platformers. Some are more punishing than Sonic (look at classic Mega Man).
And even then, I would say that even 2D Sonic games aren't very kind due to some levels being vertical or certain enemy placements or what not.
Tbf sonic is more than a platformer
Its highspeed 🗿
But seriously tho the momentum and speed is hard to adapt at first, I remember i was a kid i got sonic 1 ios and i was stuck in green hill, but not frustrated, more fascinated at the momentum physics as ive never seen such ever
Before that point ive never played fast games, only played like mario
But once i got the hang of thing, wow even to this day sonic is my favorite
You need to spend time and really get it
Hard to learn if new, but fun to master
Like REALLY fun
It is?
I first played Sonic when I was 5 years old and completed the entire thing every time (Labyrinth and Marble Zones included), it's wild to me that people consider it hard to get into.
Though I agree truly mastering it is super fun.
@ like when i was a beginner kid it was hard
Today its easy muscle memory
@SonicTheHedgehogX15 Compared to other platformers of that time, Sonic 1 is pretty easy.
@@snakey888 I didnt grow up back then
I was born in 2008, it a miracle i didnt grow following the fortnite and other types of games trend
@SonicTheHedgehogX15 Sure, but that does not necessarily mean that you have no experience with games from that time.
it's funny because my first sonic game at age 5 was rush, and i was able to figure out all its mechanics including the homing attack despite no clear tutorial. a couple years later i got unleashed and was able to beat it too, i'd often replay the boost stages until i got S ranks. but after all that i wasn't able to finish heroes or sonic 1-3 🤨
It is funny sometimes. As kids, you sometimes just brute force your way in things, and you just pick up on a lot of stuff by just doing whatever.
Trust me, I was questioning how I was able to beat Shadow the Hedgehog, but struggled so badly with the Genesis games as a kid.
I think it's because when you're a kid you're engaged because you're being introduced to so many Sonic concepts, as well as the specific game mechanics.
@LuigiMario-o7o this was definitely the case for me
@@RisingSonic17 that's very true, as a kid you don't really know what good control or game design is so you brute force & are less likely to give up.
ngl i think playing sonic games (specifically boost games) fundamentally influenced my way of thinking. now i'm 20 and work as a professional musician, and nothing gives me more satisfication than nailing a difficult piece from start to finish in a linear fashion. it's the exact same feeling i get when i nail a boost level from start to finish 🤷
When i was little, i used to hate sonic games because of his zones that had to many pathways, enemy placements and shields that are always hidden not the fact the game KEEPS reminding me to collect those 7 chaos emeralds for uknown reason or logicaly explaination... when i got a bit older i finaly understanded all sonic & friend's mechanics im looking at you shadow...
Growing up had the opposite problem where I felt like the tutorials were kind of just hand holding if its forced on you (especially heroes, like let me use my brain, damn). Most things outside of the carnival night barrel & riders controls just seemed obvious with context clues and a instruction booklet (riders tutorial is buried in the menus for some reason, its pretty much why i learned the tornado move after beating the game)
But hey, I'm the type of person who loved reading the instructions to know what I was doing before playing so maybe I'm just an odd case. One thing I wish the series did more was actually keep mechanics instead of ditching them randomly so people ain't confused so much game to game on what they can do.
-The air trick system introduced in advance 2 should have been a series staple instead of being exclusive to portable nintendo titles before 2010 & dissapearing.
-Spindashing & double jumping kinda just gets removed in some games and come back years later randomly since the 90s.
-Moves like ring dash & spindash get restricted to wisp powers for no real reason.
Did you know you can mid air spin attack after junping off a spring?... Only in Triple trouble, no other 2D games do this. Maybe adventure games do.
I could go on... Imagine newbies trying to keep track of what moves are in which games, as if button mapping issues weren't already gonna screw them over with muscle memory.
Ohhh. Yeah, the one big flaw with Sonic constantly changing and switching it up every game is that game mechanics come and go.
Some things may stay like light speed dashing and stuff, but the gameplay may be completely different this time.
This is why whenever a new game comes out, I always gotta test what Sonic has during the first level and such to familiarize myself with what they kept or what they removed.
Then there's the thing with button mappings being changed like with Unleashed -> Sonic Gens -> Frontiers -> Shadow Gens. It can be a lot to remember and can mix you up.
I would agree that a consistency in mechanics between games would also be very helpful in easing in the games
Sonic fans when accessible sonic 🤬
Casual players when punishing sonic 🤬
Shadow generations (good ending):
Casual players 🤝 Sonic fans
Shadow Generations, for the most part, find that good balance for just being a well designed game.
It's Ranking system though, is very forgiving for being strictly based on time
I feel like SA2 is sort of an enigma when it comes to the topic of enjoying Sonic game. Cause it depends on when you play it and what version you’re playing, if you’ve played the original Dreamcast version 9 times out of ten you’ll enjoy it no matter how old you are. If you’ve played the ports (in my experience the Xbox version) you’ll probably get used to it if your younger, but the older you get the less and less likely you’ll probably enjoy it. In my experience the Xbox version of the game had its moments, but the speed stages especially with rail heavy levels and doing other moves when attempting a light speed dash I came to absolutely loathed the game, and although I eventually got used to it I can’t say I enjoy it due to my earlier experiences with the game. And it’s why I believe the best and most accessible way to play SA2 is to get it on steam and mod it if only for better button mapping and rail grinding.
its a shame SA2 is the way it is, its not supposed to control that poorly, SEGA just doesnt care about fixing the analog control for it in the slightest. It took fans over a decade to make a proper mod for it that fixed it.
The Dreamcast version is not significantly better than the ports, button mapping is just as much of a problem there as it is anywhere else. And the rail grinding is rarely, if ever, more demanding than just holding the crouch button. Rail switching is cumbersome in either version.
All versions have inconsistent gameplay styles, and a whole bunch of automation that would alienate newcomers.
I haven't watched the whole video yet, so forgive me if you elaborate on this and I'm missing the point, but...
I think it's no coincidence that the most popular Sonic games in typical online discourse nowdays tend to be the ones that have the most "guardrails" and least amount of bottomless pits and trap obstacles on the levels. S3&K, both versions of Colors and Generations, Mania, Unwiished, etc and the least popular are the ones that throw these at you the most (8 bit games, Advance, HD Unleashed, Heroes, Lost World, hell id argue that even if it was unintentional because the guardrails just don't WORK half the time, that 06 fits here too, and to a lesser extent, Adventure.)
The Sonic games, ESPECIALLY the older ones, make people who get into the series want to instantly be able to zoom along like the namesake of the games, not helping this is that ports of the older games give you stuff like the drop and spin dash in levels that were never designed in the first place to accommodate it.
This makes players that have these tools for speed that can't always be used effectively feel inadequate and impatient, when in truth they probably aren't being methodical enough, you're supposed to earn your speed by replaying the levels and getting better and faster incrementally, not by zooming through at sonic speed on your first, second, or even third try. For a player that's decent and not abusing glitches, the average Sonic level actually usually clocks in at around the same length or even a little longer than other platformer levels from games like Megaman X or Mario.
In a weird way I always think this series is most replayable when you're an adult, because when you're a kid you don't necessarily have the expectations and tropes of a fast paced platformer drilled into your brain yet, to be able to predict and memorize level design as effectively as you can as an adult. When I was a kid I played like this, and usually stuck to the earlier levels that gave me that instant gratification of speed and power.
I can actually attest to this when I was a kid. I used to not like a lot of the classic games because there was always that one level that just took away the fun speed from Sonic (I used to stop at Marble Zone in Sonic 1 and Chemical Plant in Sonic 2). Tbf, I was terrible at those games, and getting a game over meant going back to the beginning. This is why I liked 3&K the most because it had a save feature.
Now, as I am older, I can appreciate some of the slower levels if the platforming itself is actually good. This is something I could say for some games, but certainly not all (Advance 3 and Superstars are my immediate examples).
Sonic Unleashed as a kid, I struggled so much with the day stages that I was always looking forward to the Werehog because at the time, I couldn't handle the quick reactions from that game. Colors and Generations definitely eased me in.
It always had me curious why Sonic Heroes was something I got through easily as a kid when I see adults now struggling with it so much. It's probably like you said because, as kids, we don't quite register or process that expectation of what to expect out of a speedy platformer. Going back to these games as adults where you're more understanding of how things work definitely helps with replayability, and you can see when the games do something right and where they fail in certain aspects.
Sometimes, things do take time to really grow on you.
Honestly a lot of people take Sonic's nature about "speed" at such a face value that they hate being met with some obstacles that break your pace a little bit, I've been playing a lot of Sonic CD lately and while i've grown accustom to that games level design and really like it, I constantly see people complain that there's too much springs and stuff in the way or that they don't care to explore and that they prefer 3 and k's speedier level design. Platformers are gonna break your pace no matter what, it's not detriment to sonic's name for a game to begin to challenge you and I think a lot of people don't understand that. The speed isn't about just "sonic runs fast" it's you as a player improving at getting through obstacles quickly without getting your pace killed. There's a speed cap in Sonic 1 but that game isn't "solved" in terms of speedrunning etc.
@@LLotad Yes, I get that feeling. You've gotta be cautious and look out for traps that would otherwise cut your speed. Can't just hold right to win (unless you're playing Unleashed, where you need to react rather than predict.)
@@LLotad I think they're expecting a minimum amount of speed. In classic sonic the minimum amount of speed you need to reach is too fast for you to be able to react to incoming obstacles leading to frustration. This is because sonic's sprite is too big, and the screen is too small. If sonic's sprite was smaller, then it would be less detailed, but you could go at his max base speed and still easily be able to react to things.
Loved this video, but I disagree completely that Sonic games give sufficient tutorials. Almost done making a very similar video, and I think the biggest thing for approachability involves making better tutorials. SA2 the goat for example doesn’t fully explain homing attacking and all its intricacies (its range, the fact that you have to point at the enemy, the fact you can hold a to bounce higher), doesn’t tell you that the third hint on the monitor gives the easiest hint, barely explains rail grinding, and a good chunk of gimmicks are all trial and error.
It would be amazing if in security hall or aquatic mine if the in-game cutscene would include a mini dialogue of rogue saying “it seems I may have to open these vaults. They’re separated by color! I can only have one group of vaults open at a time.” While showing off the vault room switches but instead, you gotta lose a couple of times to figure everything out, if you even do.
The biggest issue though is omochao: very hard to see or find sometimes, and because a good 1/3 are unhelpful or redundant, a lot of people ignore her because they think it’s a waste.
I think if omochao automatically came and talked to you as soon as you passed them up rather than touching her would help a lot, and you could just disable the hints/omochao if you wish. For mechanics, the training room in frontiers is perfect. It would be amazing if in SA2 you could press right on the dpad and it would give you a homing attack chain to try
To be fair, there are plenty of other issues with sa2 that makes it alienating. For one, having three different playstyles that it rotates between, hinders a player from being fully engrossed, rather creating a whiplash effect with constant changing.
Speaking of whiplash, all the dash pads and scripts take away agency from the player, alienating them as the player does not feel fully in control.
And button mapping does not help, too many actions are mapped to the same button, making performing some actions too unreliable.
My story with boost I have already played mania, just thought it was a good game nothing fantastic then I was at a friend's party and I got to play Sonic Generations, I played sky sanctuary I was very afraid to boost when I discovered the move, but as I failed and tried again, I would feel more and more comfortable with sonic's boost then I wouldn't need to slow down anymore and that kinda made me in love with sonic gameplay in general,
so if the game explains to it's players that you need to master the levels to boost proprerly through things like hard ranks and etc... players will see what I saw on that day that changed the entire course of my history when it comes to gaming
And that's the appeal of replayability and good gameplay.
You'll definitely get cooked a couple of times, but once you get it, then you got it
hehe, i am the only person in the world who likes lost world.
Not a badge I'd wear probably, personally. However, you see something in the game I guess
SA2 mod showcase when?
You didn’t need to call me out this hard LOLLL
Hey, I ain't say nothing ✋️
@ i said everything LMAO
Imo sonic games are extremely easy and I physically cringe when I see people sucking at them. I’m 27 right now but I beat the vast majority of the games as a kid/teenager with no effort. I’ve seen people on reddit claim sonic generations is hard, which is like THE EASIEST SONIC GAME EVER.
This is actually why I avoid a lot of people who aren't really into games or Sonic in general because I know I'm just gonna be stressed about them.
It's nothing against them, but I can't help it sometimes. 💀
Cause I'm like, "How are you struggling? I beat this as a kid who just didn't understand a damn thing."
@@RisingSonic17I’m not trying to be mean but I think people nowadays don’t even try or are too brain rotted to figure out games. When I was 13 I got every single emblem in sa1 and sa2. And now you got adults who can’t beat the simplest levels.
I actually think Mario games are harder than Sonic games (especially the 2D ones) but somehow nobody complains about those. People just love bitching about sonic games.
Sonic games are bad at teaching you how to play them, not in the basics and tutorials, but in how the levels are designed. The Classic games don't really tell you that you need to watch out for Passivity Traps, or that you should try and find ways to get to the top, faster path.
They don't tell you when you should just enjoy the speedy spectacle, or when you should slow down for platforming or to look for passivity traps.
In Mario and similar, this isn't necessary, because the only aspect of those levels is "jump over the bad guys." Megaman seems to be the same, be patient and jump over the bad guys.
I think that's why I prefered the Boost games for a while, since they're much simpler, either featuring DKCR-style platforming, or Mobile Endless Runner-style soft QTEs. Though, after playing Mania a couple times, I grew to love the Classic-style games too, especially as I began to understand what they're going for more.
Rarely is the top path the faster path at least in the regular classic games. Also, the classic games usually slow you down for platforming sections. It's more so that you need to have skill and knowledge if you want to maintain speed for a platforming challenge.
People always treating Sonic like it's some alien creature; it's still a platformer my guy, you jump over the bad guys just like the rest. You're basically asking for the game to backseat for you and tell you what to do at every moment. Sonic doesn't even punish you all that hard for getting hit; every other platformer is way more harsh with mistakes and allows far fewer.
Even if you aren't sure when to expect hazards, the game is very forgiving and you can get by every level face tanking every obstacle long as you hold onto your rings. But learning when to anticipate danger is a part of playing action games in general; I know it's an extreme example, but the souls games don't exactly tell you when enemies and traps are going to come at you, they're very deliberate about ambushing you, but that's part of the game, you observe, you learn, and you recognize the patterns so you can better anticipate obstacles ahead of time. This applies even to Sonic, specifically the classic games; it's not about memorization, it's about pattern recognition
honestly, i love that this is a massive skill issue callout, people have no time to learn and are ASS lmao
It's a easy insult to make, but not great at changing minds.
@ it’s not, but it’s funny to laugh at ppl unable to adapt
@@IkeOkerekeNewsDoesn't change minds but it doesn't mean those minds are right.
People are like, "yeah, I don't have time to learn how to get good at a game," then spend hours of their days wasting time doomscrolling or whatnot, haha
@@Neo-Metal17 the dude coping so hard lmfao
Gamers are not accessible enough for Sonic games
This is also true.
Sonic boost games is like geometry dash 3d
That's one way to certainly look at it, lol
You're right but geometry dash is better.
A very ironic answer for me considering the stigma of sonic fans having autism but i lowkey think my autism allows me to play these games so well 😂
Autism🤝
I miss zoomzike
Same😔
I like sonic but yes it’s too fast for me and sometimes I try not to go too fast cuz I know imma lose but I’m gonna try to learn better
It's all good👍
21:14 Forces hate detected. Opinion discarded. Video disliked.
Being a shooter for Sonic Forces is certainly something, But I respect ya💀
"Are Sonic Games Not Accessible Enough?" I feel like that is the case.
Many Sonic games i love like Riders/Zero Gravity or Heroes are locked to either their original console releases, (so you have to be lucky to have those) or are locked behind emulation. (Wich, to someone with a potato computer like me, makes them unplayable)
I'd pay for a HD Re-release of those games if i could but SEGA loves to gatekeep i guess.
Note: i wrote this before watching the video, they weren't talking about this type of accessibility lol
I'll do a video on the other accessibility next time💀
Next video, but you are right. A lot of Sonic games can't be played on Modern platforms