Don't forget the Italians! I'm not Irish,but i think it's an important,albeit little known fact that Wellington was. Nothing wrong with patriotism either.
@sandynathan I'm frequently amused by the courtesy that was often displayed in wartime. One of the examples that comes to mind was when shortly before Robert E. Lee's surrender to U.S. Grant in the American Civil War, when Grant was urging Lee to give up and Lee was as much as telling Grant to go to hell, Lee still signed his messages to Grant with "Very Respectfully, Your Obedient Servant, R.E. Lee".
I think it's you who does'nt understand. Wellington was an Irishman pure and simple,his family may be of English origin,but they had lived in Ireland for generations. That makes him Irish,are you thick or what?You can try to explain as much as you like,but you can't argue with facts,get it?
Wellington's close call reminds me of the incident during the American Revolution in which Captain Ferguson was so impressed with an American officer's bravery that he couldn't bring himself to shoot the man in the back. I would like to think he was honorable enough to have held his fire even if he had known that officer was none other than George Washington, and that one bullet could possibly have won the war for the British. Of course, we'll never know for certain.
Well to be honest in some cases such as extremists in America or any country for that matter patriotism is a bit of a problem. It leads to problems in diplomacy, anti-terrorism and immigration and is difficult to argue against because then you are branded as 'hating you country' or not respecting the sacrifices of those who died in wars etc. However yes patriotism can on important moments such as national events, sport and laughing at other nations in history then yes it is good
Most of the Anglo-Irish were either entirely Hiberno-Norse (Edmund Burke, so-called father of English Conservatism) or a combination of Welsh, English and Irish (Wilde, Shaw, Yates etc) . Wellesley -your Iron Duke- was no different. British aristocrats were a mix much, and few of the great Empire Builders were actually 'English' (most were of Scottish or Irish aristocratic heritage). Even the greatest English lawyer of the 19th century, Edward Carson, was Dubliner of Scotts-Irish heritage.
Well I would say that bigotry is a part but actually patriotism is probably more important as it is the celebrated characteristic of dividing the world. When you say 'the greatest irishman that ever lived' you are adding to division though personally i don't mind but i wanted to point out your being slightly hypocritical. Anyway we are all human and should respect each other irish and british do share common ancestry though we also share it with some french, scandinavians and germans
"Wellington was an Irishman pure and simple,his family may be of English origin,but they had lived in Ireland for generations." Again I say "you are a fool if you think citizenship in the 18th century is similar to citizenship today." No native Irishman thought of the Wellesley's or any other English land owner in Ireland as Irish, not even the Duke himself. "That makes him Irish,are you thick or what?" Oh the Irish, lacking any relevant historical figure so they pinch other countries ones.
I feel compelled to say that while the person you argued with is arrogant, offensive and not very good at making his points he is correct in stating that Wellington was English or more importantly British. It was your lineage that decides your nationality back then and he was from a pure english family, also he wanted to be english/british meaning that even by todays standards he would have applied for british citizenship. Just wanted to say though you probably won't care. Thanks.
Again I don't mean to offend but that may not be difficult to be the greatest Irishman and even if you do count him as Irish he was completely different to the people surrounding him. Protestant, aristocratic, firmly against irish independence
Ok genius,let me ask you a simple question. Where was Sir Arthur Wellesley the Duke of Wellington born,raised and married? God,i've come across some cretins in my time but you take the biscuit!
G.Britain profited immensely through the alliance made by England with Portugal because the Portuguese were/are the bravest(fact) & best warriors(debatable)in Europe at the time=I mean Portugal was the only Country who wasnt intimidated into obeying Napoleon & employing the Continental system against G.Britain & thus leaving G.Britain all alone vs Napoleon's France & G.Britain repays Portugal by abandoning Portugal & running away with tail between legs & ofc the shameful Convention of Cintra
Do you think we've go too many immigrants in this country? I can see massive problems for the future. I don't think Wellington would have allowed it to happen!
I like how you just ignored every relevant piece of information I put in my previous comment, I knew beforehand that the Duke was born in Ireland but you are a fool if you think citizenship in the 18th century is similar to citizenship today. As I explained before he is English. Born in to an English family with English lineage with English accents in an island whose ruling class were, wait for it, English. Understand now?
Wellingtons family have lived in Ireland since 1500,i think that pretty much made him Irish.Probably the greatest Irishman ever!
A very interesting series so far. Thanks for uploading.
Don't forget the Italians!
I'm not Irish,but i think it's an important,albeit little known fact that Wellington was.
Nothing wrong with patriotism either.
Nice.
@Arbeedubya a very nice thought there mate, your right we will never know however it just shows that there was true honour in war then.
Look who's starting to back track.
@sandynathan I'm frequently amused by the courtesy that was often displayed in wartime. One of the examples that comes to mind was when shortly before Robert E. Lee's surrender to U.S. Grant in the American Civil War, when Grant was urging Lee to give up and Lee was as much as telling Grant to go to hell, Lee still signed his messages to Grant with "Very Respectfully, Your Obedient Servant, R.E. Lee".
I think it's you who does'nt understand.
Wellington was an Irishman pure and simple,his family may be of English origin,but they had lived in Ireland for generations.
That makes him Irish,are you thick or what?You can try to explain as much as you like,but you can't argue with facts,get it?
Wellington's close call reminds me of the incident during the American Revolution in which Captain Ferguson was so impressed with an American officer's bravery that he couldn't bring himself to shoot the man in the back. I would like to think he was honorable enough to have held his fire even if he had known that officer was none other than George Washington, and that one bullet could possibly have won the war for the British. Of course, we'll never know for certain.
He was born and raised there,how can that be a vague connection?
There's no shame in being wrong you know and you're completly wrong here.
er...you might want to check that
Well to be honest in some cases such as extremists in America or any country for that matter patriotism is a bit of a problem. It leads to problems in diplomacy, anti-terrorism and immigration and is difficult to argue against because then you are branded as 'hating you country' or not respecting the sacrifices of those who died in wars etc. However yes patriotism can on important moments such as national events, sport and laughing at other nations in history then yes it is good
Most of the Anglo-Irish were either entirely Hiberno-Norse (Edmund Burke, so-called father of English Conservatism) or a combination of Welsh, English and Irish (Wilde, Shaw, Yates etc) . Wellesley -your Iron Duke- was no different. British aristocrats were a mix much, and few of the great Empire Builders were actually 'English' (most were of Scottish or Irish aristocratic heritage). Even the greatest English lawyer of the 19th century, Edward Carson, was Dubliner of Scotts-Irish heritage.
wot? no sir john moore?
Well I would say that bigotry is a part but actually patriotism is probably more important as it is the celebrated characteristic of dividing the world. When you say 'the greatest irishman that ever lived' you are adding to division though personally i don't mind but i wanted to point out your being slightly hypocritical. Anyway we are all human and should respect each other irish and british do share common ancestry though we also share it with some french, scandinavians and germans
"Wellington was an Irishman pure and simple,his family may be of English origin,but they had lived in Ireland for generations."
Again I say "you are a fool if you think citizenship in the 18th century is similar to citizenship today."
No native Irishman thought of the Wellesley's or any other English land owner in Ireland as Irish, not even the Duke himself.
"That makes him Irish,are you thick or what?"
Oh the Irish, lacking any relevant historical figure so they pinch other countries ones.
He was'nt that different,the British and the Irish all come from the same gene pool,its just bigatroy that causes division.
I feel compelled to say that while the person you argued with is arrogant, offensive and not very good at making his points he is correct in stating that Wellington was English or more importantly British. It was your lineage that decides your nationality back then and he was from a pure english family, also he wanted to be english/british meaning that even by todays standards he would have applied for british citizenship. Just wanted to say though you probably won't care. Thanks.
Again I don't mean to offend but that may not be difficult to be the greatest Irishman and even if you do count him as Irish he was completely different to the people surrounding him. Protestant, aristocratic, firmly against irish independence
Ok genius,let me ask you a simple question.
Where was Sir Arthur Wellesley the Duke of Wellington born,raised and married?
God,i've come across some cretins in my time but you take the biscuit!
not his decision, he was dead against it
G.Britain profited immensely through the alliance made by England with Portugal because the Portuguese were/are the bravest(fact) & best warriors(debatable)in Europe at the time=I mean Portugal was the only Country who wasnt intimidated into obeying Napoleon & employing the Continental system against G.Britain & thus leaving G.Britain all alone vs Napoleon's France & G.Britain repays Portugal by abandoning Portugal & running away with tail between legs & ofc the shameful Convention of Cintra
Do you think we've go too many immigrants in this country?
I can see massive problems for the future.
I don't think Wellington would have allowed it to happen!
I like how you just ignored every relevant piece of information I put in my previous comment, I knew beforehand that the Duke was born in Ireland but you are a fool if you think citizenship in the 18th century is similar to citizenship today.
As I explained before he is English. Born in to an English family with English lineage with English accents in an island whose ruling class were, wait for it, English.
Understand now?
Wasn't Irish.