I remember when my daughter was teetering between a covenant life and an alternative lifestyle. Most of our active LDS friends spent their time telling her how loved she was and how she should just embrace who she was. Not one, other than her parents, encouraged her to keep her covenants. She chose the alternative. I have to believe that we will one day be held accountable for refusing to stand for Christ, even in the name of "love and tolerance."
What is Alternative Lifestyle? What is the breaking point from Covenant Life? Is there no going back now? This sounds like you’ve closed the door on your daughter and there’s no chance for redemption. You make Heavenly Father sound like an orthodox Muslim, and not a benevolent, loving deity.
Sitting in ward council, we found that our young women had been "experimenting" a bit at girls camp. I asked how we might teach them chastity more effectively. You could have heard a pin drop. The only response was from a sister who said basically, "All we can do is love them, or we risk them committing suicide." When will we realize that the most loving thing we can do is to teach them righteous living and show them the path to true happiness? It feels like we are so upside down right now.
Whoa! That's frightening! As if the only two options are being the "cause" of their suicide and standing up for teaching chastity! Do these parents not realize that sexual immorality (whether homo- or hetero- sexual behavior) is next to sinning against the Holy Ghost? I can testify that sex outside of marriage led me to unhappiness that brought me to the point of wanting to die.
We could all say that - let me do whatever I want, whatever my fallen, carnal nature desires, or else I’m going to kill myself. It’s just emotional blackmail.
I think there’s a false notion that there are more kids committing suicide because they are gay and not being accepted. They are all around, messed up and committing suicide for all sorts of reasons. And more transgender people commit suicide after they transition than before. There’s a false belief that there are a bunch of statistics to support that theory when it’s mostly a narrative.
Why am I in tears while watching this? You guys are amazing. What you went through was and is not easy. As a mother and a member of the Church, my heart goes out to you. I love and respect your decision to stay on the covenant path.
It has always been what set us apart as a restored gospel people. It 100% will be the biggest sifting doctrine in our dispensation. Scary times, BRING IT I say. 😂
I cannot say I ever experienced same-sex attraction, but I can say that I have been attracted to pornography. It was never my desire that the church endorse what I want but rather it was my wish that I learn to conform to the teachings of Jesus Christ.
You mean, you don’t walk into Sunday sacrament meeting watching porn on your smart phone full volume? What’s wrong with you? Be proud! Whip it out and be free! 😮 In all seriousness I agree 100%! I made choices early in my youth that have affected me so deeply regarding my own addictions (fueled by choices I made) but I would NEVER have made it through them if I was encouraged to embrace and increase the frequency of it (like the prominent psychologist/therapist anti LDS pastors teach their flocks to do) by my leaders and those who I thought shared my same spiritual beliefs.
In our Ward the people who try to support the Family Proclamation are shot down by the teachers. One Sunday in G D there were about 20 of us who said truth should always be taught. We were all slammed by the teacher. After a while the voices of truth just become silent because they're seen as contentious. I loved this podcast and kudos to the three guests.
I've been in Primary and Nursery for over 10 years so I'm unfamiliar with Gospel Principles and Gospel Doctrine. Ever since COVID-19, I have felt a spirit of censorship in the Church, as if we're all tip-toeing around Gospel topics that have become politically charged. My faith has been challenged and I'm so grateful for CWIC and other LDS-focused influences that aren't afraid to speak openly about these topics. It's a tremendous help to me to know that others have experienced the same things.
That is SO disheartening and frustrating! Nephi saw this in our day as it would affect and infiltrate even the Lord's church: 2 Nephi 28:12 and 14 Because of pride, and because of false teachers, and false doctrine, their churches have become corrupted, and their churches are lifted up; because of pride they are puffed up. ...they have all gone astray save it be a few, who are the humble followers of Christ; nevertheless, they are led, that in many instances they do err because they are taught by the precepts of men.
I love these 3 young men. They are the example, not the excuse. They are so powerful in their messages. I'm overflowing with pure love and delight... in the last days, God sends his strongest and these are whom He is speaking about. My son and I just watched this and we were both consumed with the great testimonies and relief there are strong men out there like these to help others. We were discussing just the other day how "so and so" didn't make it, we hope he returns back to The Savior... its hard to see our beautiful brothers and sisters leave the Gospel. It personally hurts and brings emotions we don't realize we have for those loved ones in our wards. This was just what I needed, my son gained hope and was listening closely to the advice of how to talk to one who comes out and says, "I'm gay". Seriously valuable content in this episode and I pray you'll bring these men back. This is one if my favorite episodes, even though they're all pretty much extraordinary. Lol. Thank you Bro. Matsen
This is the best video I've ever seen addressing the issue of people with same sex attraction who unashamedly walk the covenant path. Thank you for having them on your show!
Good discussion. I will never understand how homosexuality is somehow more of a burden than many other thorns in our sides. As a young man I gave into certain appetites and desires that, still to this day, are things I have to guard against. Probably always will in this life. But I choose to move forward in faith. These men show the way.
Because being gay and I'm the church, the loneliness overwhelmingly suffocating. We have been told we are broken, defective, and don't fit . I was told by members of my own church that I shouldn't exist because I don't fit into the plan of salvation. I tried mixed orientation marriage, and it ended in pain and anxiety for all involved
@@dwaynecloar7554 It’s really hard to believe people tell other’s they’re broken or defective. The term would be more honest saying a person is caught up in sin. Is one now happily sinning and life is wonderful or still struggling living their so called true self? I know those in my own family are very miserable and depressed still blaming it on others whether family, church or culture. One young man had no father, an overbearing mother, and was abused by neighbor introducing him into this life. The other young man also came from a broken home and was introduced into this as a young boy. Neither had a family upbringing. Does this matter? Yes, I would say these young men did feel broken but they made their choice and have never felt happy. So what can one do? Turn to God and his ways…that’s all I personally know can help.
@@dwaynecloar7554 everyone is broken. Some people are broken on the arm. The leg the hip bone. It's not a one Broke sin... I strongly believe that this brokenness did not come from Jesus, but from Adam and Eve. They brought weakness to the world. Imperfections to the world. But God loves us so much that he sent his son to help us. Just like someone may be born without limbs or with autism, I believe people develop an appetite with false feelings of happiness. Those people that have said those harsh words to you need to repent. Just like you're attracted to same sex, a heterosexual attracted to watching porn is not that far off from each other. But we need to strive to become like Jesus and obey all the God's commandments. So we all have a hard journey ahead. Sorry for rambling
I think it is obvious how it is more of a burden. Imagine a life without ever having any potential to have enjoyable sex. Add to that a plan that says that even in the eternities if you do the right thing and marry a women and give her ungratifying sex your whole lives-- you get to do that together forever. Woo Hoo. Sex was built to be a good thing. Powerful, but also enjoyable. People with heterosexual desires only are asked to curb those til marriage and most people really do have to fight the good fight to make it that long. Trust me- 47 and never married is not fun for me. The burden on homosexuals is definitely stronger.
We all have a cross to bare in this life and none of us are exempted from walking the covenant path regardless of our personal circumstances and trials. It does not matter if we are straight, gay, dealing with mental issues, physical problems spiritual weaknesses. I will stand with anyone attempting to walk the covenant path. God loves all his children but part of the trial of life is to deny ourselves the the natural man tendencies and submit our will to the lords. Prayers and strength to all who bare the crosses of the world.
That's why people are rejecting the gospel who have those difficult challenges because they say its 'too hard'' to endure living the gospel and they want to get off the covenant path to make it easier. But that's no excuse with the Lord as he has a different standard than the worlds standards. The Saints are expected to endure to the end, not quit and throw in the towel because its 'too hard' to continue. The Lord does not accept any excuses. He expects his standards to be kept when on the covenant path and he won't approve of same sex dating and living a double church life and those who do, they usually fall into trouble with church leaders for not conforming to gospel standards as the gospel standards dont' allow for same sex dating because the gospel standards don't support same-sex relationships...
These men are amazing and a good example to everyone who struggles with anything. Every difficultly we have can be solved by the Atonement of Jesus Christ who strengthens us. I respect their desire to live the gospel to the fullest. My thanks to you all for sharing and living your testimony.
@@CwicShow Some trials are meant to be endured, not taken away or cured. It is not always the Father's will to cure everything,as that would destroy the gospel plan if he took every trial away.So when the trial is SSA and its strong and always persistent,its not wise to enter marriage with the SSA up at its highest flaring up levels Its more wise instead to endure the trial living the church standards as a single member and wait until the Millennium to marry the opposite sex if the Lord won't remove the SSA being of no fault of their own since the SSA feelings are not chosen but SSA behavior is and that's where the Church stands on the issue.
44:16 to 45:12 minutes in THIS IS KEY!!!! I've been hollering this FOREVER hats off to you brethren I'm honored to call you my brothers!!!!! 💪💪💪you all are so very strong
I don't have anything profound to say today, but just want to say thank you Greg and all participants in this video. This came at a perfect time for me. I was asked to speak this coming Easter Sunday in my ward about the atonement, and I've felt I should talk on the atonements purpose in changing aspects of ourselves to build us up and make us better according to how God sees us, not the world. I'm also feeling it may be beneficial to share my own conversion and things I had to change to align with God and how it has blessed my life. This discussion definitely gave me a lot of insights and thoughts. God is good. Thank you, and bless you!
@Tember Harward ... we need you! You and the other 2 gentlemen here, alongside some others who are willing to teach and reach up the ladder in this church to help the brethren and sisters how to speak up without offending anyone. I wish there was a larger platform so we could help so many of our youth hang on a little longer with the help of leaders and members who can be taught... I see where each of you can help us learn to make a difference. God bless you.
We need more content like this! Please add an episode that goes through the struggles these men faced with getting married to a woman and how they got through that. I think it would be really helpful!
Ben Schilaty is one of those tares who is growing tall and strong amongst the wheat and will one day be plucked out. Thank you Greg for hosting three men of God who desire only the best for all of Gods children regardless of their own painful struggles. These men reflect their Royal Heritage and will one day walk with God our Heavenly Father. Excellent show Greg!
We just had him speak in a virtual stake fireside. I worried all month. I went to the temple and experienced clarity and peace before the event. Then the event came and I couldn't understand why I had felt peace about it when after hearing his message and my stake president's approval of his message then feel SO confused! I tried to give him a chance and trust my leader, but I felt so awful the more I pondered on his talk. But after wrestling with it and talking about with others, I've realized. His message confused me because he's not correct. The clarity in the temple trumps his "experience". He has no authority to speak on these things. He very carefully words his message to stay within the bounds, but he clearly makes opposite statements that contradicts the prophets.
@@anthonyrippa686 we can’t put anyone into the category of tare or wheat, it’s not for us to judge, how could we possibly know what Heavenly Father knows. As Stephen Covey used to say, don’t be a judge, be a light. Besides all that, I hold Ben in the highest regard, he has gone through many trials and he sets an example for gay members by serving in the temple, living a celibate lifestyle and showing love and kindness to everyone.
@@renatep.7566 The Church does not approve of the same sex dating practices of the world. That's a part of the world he has to learn to give up to the Lord if he wants to remain in good standing in the Church otherwise hes in danger of going away from the covenant path. Because the Lord is not going to accept what hes been doing when hes outside of the Church getting involved in same sex dating practices. The Lord has strict unyielding standards of conduct when it comes to the covenant pathway. Dating members of the same sex while on the covenant pathway is unbecoming conduct of a member of the Church and leaders can remove his recommend from him or other discipline until he corrects that behavior. The Church only accepts one standard, the Lord's Standard and no other.
A big thank you to all the participants on this video! You are courageous examples of staying on the covenant path despite opposition. Thank you for your testimonies!
After much praying and thinking about this subject, I am of the mind that in our preexistence we were apprised of all the things we might experience here on earth. People are born with all kinds of physical and mental problems, experience the horrors of wars, famine, draught, missing arms or legs, same sex attraction, etc. etc. Our spirit bodies were perfect but the physical laws of the universe may not be so kind to us. In my mind, that could be the reason one third of us decided not to have physical bodies. Many years ago, a friend came to me and told me he was gay but because he believed the gospel was true, married and had a son. We are the same age, 94, and six months ago said he lived the straight life because of his faith but he could never rid himself of same sex attraction, hoping that in his next life he could. He died since then. He was a great musical talent and was intelligent. Jesus Christ died for all 6 billion of us, and for those who accept His redemption, will not have to pay the penalty for sins committed. There is a lot of stuff we do not know about the next life but I am sure everyone will be happy for what is ahead. I will find out very soon.
We all come to this life with something hard that we have to overcome and these young men are dealing with theirs. I am so grateful for the love Heavenly Father has for each of us and only wants the best for us. I am very proud of these young men and their wives and hope the other young man will find the right young woman for him.
Joshua, be sure to add the beautiful description of JST Genesis 9:21-25 to your very insightful theory: “And the bow shall be in the cloud; and I will look upon it, that I may remember the everlasting covenant, which I made unto thy father Enoch; that, when men should keep all my commandments, Zion should again come on the earth, the city of Enoch which I have caught up unto myself. “And this is mine everlasting covenant, that when thy posterity shall embrace the truth, and look upward, then shall Zion look downward, and all the heavens shall shake with gladness, and the earth shall tremble with joy; “And the general assembly of the church of the firstborn shall come down out of heaven, and possess the earth, and shall have place until the end come. And this is mine everlasting covenant, which I made with thy father Enoch. “And the bow shall be in the cloud, and I will establish my covenant unto thee, which I have made between me and thee, for every living creature of all flesh that shall be upon the earth. “And God said unto Noah, This is the token of the covenant which I have established between me and thee; for all flesh that shall be upon the earth.”
I, as a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of latter-day Saints, feel so confused about this issue. When gender is central to the creators plan, how can this be a struggle anyone has to face? I'm glad these men are finding themselves on the gospel path. It makes us all better people, sharing and understanding others' difficulties. Thanks, brother Matsen, for bringing this to us!
@@EKowallis I have bipolar. My brother has Schizophrenia. Some people are born blind. 🤷♀️ We all come or become broken through our mortal experience. Jesus WILL HEAL it ALL. if we were born perfect we wouldn't learn compassion and pain and need for support beyond our own! ❤️
@@EKowallis Epilepsy doesn't bring an opposition to the creators plan. It's a foundational element to proclamation on the family and eternal exaultation. My nephew has a form of epilepsy that causes him to have up to 80 seizures a day. I pray for your peace in handling such a great, heavy load to bear.
We come here to overcome the natural man through the Spirit of Christ. This includes all sorts of physical obstacles. Homosexuality is not an exception; it just happens to be one that our society is obsessed with and desires to make the exception to the rule.
Every time my daughter who has come out as gay and now planning on getting married says God made me this way I just want to scream. It breaks my heart. She is so far from the spirit now that I have to just keep a surface relationship so I don’t upset her and drive her completely away. 😢
@@dwaynecloar7554 Perhaps. But it IS a choice whether or not to follow Christ. We all have things that draw us away. The question is are we going to put our will above God’s…or like Jesus say “thy will be done”
Very thought provoking. I appreciate the perspective of these four faithful LDS men who have shared and expressed themselves and the issues that dominate our culture today. Recognizing and identifying our relationship as children of God is critical and the personal relationship we can and should develop with the Savior will help us deflect the fiery darts 🎯 of the adversary in whatever form the attack us. 👍👏 We ALL must find a way to get and preserve that relationship with Christ and stay on the covenant path😊
This is a necessary and brilliant approach. Thank you. We do not teach that the right choice, the covenant choice, is even possible or desirable for this specific temptation. I can’t imagine what my life would be like if I were taught that I could not overcome my weaknesses, especially those that have tested me for most of my life. It is such a confusing departure from the truth that there are no commandments given that we cannot obey. 1 Nephi 3:7
The statement in 1 Nephi 3:7 was in regard to a specific commandment God gave to Lehi and his sons. How do people born in North Korea "obey" the commandment to pay tithing? They can't. They don't even know it exists. BUT as the Spirit can speak to them as much as to anyone else, when they are prompeted to do something by the Spirit they are being commanded in the same way as Lehi and his sons were and the way is made possible for them to obey. Thinking of 1 Nephi 3:7 as applicable to all general scriptural commandments and being relevant to all people regardless of the circumstance of where they live or what physical or mental issues they have is false.
I really am so happy that you all are promoting to live the commandments despite the difficulties we have faced and are facing now happiness comes from living the doctrine of Jesus Christ…I am a 72 year old gay woman who has lived that lifestyle and have done all I can do to keep the commandments … I agree with the principles that all of you have mentioned in this podcast thankyou👍🏼👍🏼🙏🏼
Fantastic conversation! There needs to be more faithful center discussions surrounding this issue in the church. Thank you Cwic for putting this together.
59:00 is something that I have been struggling to put into words for years, but Joshua said it perfectly. Thank you Greg, Joshua, Sky, and Tember for this incredible discussion. I don't know any of you personally, but have felt the Holy Spirit throughout the podcast through your words.
Thank you! The spirit spoke for me in that moment and throughout this podcast. I would’ve struggled to find words too if it weren’t for the Holy Ghost.
Thanks Greg for hosting Tember, Joshua and Skyler. Excellent, Frank and much needed open discussion on this important topic. On my mission in South Africa in ’78, we taught a deaf mute who only knew Afrikaans, so we had him read the missionary lessons in that language. After finishing the commandments lesson I asked him if he had any comments and he wrote a word down which I didn’t know in Afrikaans. I quickly looked it up and it was the Afrikaans word for he is a homosexual. I paused for a moment while saying a silent prayer for guidance and responded to him by asking him the question, and how do you feel about it? He said he knew he was always in conflict with what God desired and after a time of displaying abstinence, he was baptized. Sharing this experience with a temple endowed same sex attraction church member in Washington state, this member explains to me that what I asked that investigator was the best thing I could have said to him. This struggle is a personal one between that individual and their salvation that they work out in their relationship with Christ as their savior. I could write much more but this is the basic core. We each have our thorns in the flesh and nothing we experience is really unique but all is personal. God will not abandon anyone that honestly seeks him. Just as the rich man was called upon by Christ to give up all that he has to follow Christ but could not because he had too many riches though he adhered to all other teachings, we each need to give up what we might consider part of ourselves in order to carry our cross and follow Christ.
Thank you all for doing your best to live the gospel. I pray the Lord strengthens you all to endure your personal challenges, as I pray for myself to do the same.
We had a woman at stake conference tell her story. She said as a teenager she was bullied and told she was gay. She wasn’t gay but the power of suggestion made her have those thoughts. She prayed and the scripture as a man thinketh so is he came into her mind. She was able to control her thoughts. Today she is married and has a loving family. Not saying that is everyone’s story, but something to ponder.
I subscribed to your channel... please continue to make videos. Lol. 1 is a lonely number. 😆😉 I want to help support each if you thay were on the panel because I believe there was something very powerful and yes, so unique, with having the 3 of you on panel. I am so overjoyed to see another side to these stories that we rarely to never hear about. To know there was SO much information given to us on this panel was hopeful and exciting. God bless you brother!!
Excellent broadcast Greg. Very impressive , realistic, and faithful brothers sharing. We need to share more of this kind of discussion. Keep up the great job.
I'm thankful for this discussion. I have a family member who is living an alternative lifestyle who is not a member of the Church. This gives me hope for this familly member that someday he will join the church and have help in understanding how he can live the gospel successfully.
I am so proud of these men. They have chosen the covenant path and allowed the Lord to prevail in their lives under very difficult situations. I feel the Lord is so pleased with their choices. They will inherit all that He has. I love you, and thank you for your examples of righteousness. 💖
This should be in the Ensign or just loaded to the church website. Amen and Amen! There is no alternative to the Covenant path that provides exaltation! So inspiring and what Courage these brethren have! Way to choose the Savior! Salvation is not a cheap experience!
As A fellow member who does experience same sex attraction, this is very comforting and brings me hope that there are others in the church who experience same sex attraction yet are genuinely more happy living God’s commandments. Thank you so much for all insights and testimonies. 🙏😀
These men are like Nephite warriors, but their fight is truly Latter-day in nature. They are truly leading the charge in how to overcome and conquer. Their strength comes from keeping their Covenants. God bless them!!
These are Father's strongest spirits, saved for this day. They are dealing with an earthly experience or challenge as we would say by listening to God and his commandments for an Eternal glory. They don't need my approval. They have been witnessed of the Holy Ghost and are not denying it. I'm happy to be associated with these saints.
Thank you all. I can't pretend to understand your particular situations. I'm trying to. I'm trying to love and accept people while holding on to the doctrines as I understand them. Thank you for your voices. Please keep it up. May the Lord bless you all.
Thank you for giving these amazing guys a platform to speak on. I've only met one of them and consider them a friend and am so happy people are giving them a chance to be heard. I am also friends with Ben and have had the wonderful opportunity to attend a class of his while attending university. Both he and one of the men that were interviewed here have been positive influences in helping me investigate the Church as well as choose to stay. I didn't do this for them, but for myself, but I do have them to thank in this journey. This may be an unpopular suggestions here, and I'm not sure if this is something of interest for this show, but I think it would be nice to also hear from Bro. Schilaty to hear what he has to say in context and what might be on people's minds in an interview. Again, thank you for providing a platform for these wonderful men to speak on your channel. They are good people.
Much props to these guys, life is very complicated and they seem to be trying very hard to live their lives as faithful and authentically as they can. I wish the church would do a “gospel topics essay” type article on the church’s stance on gender and sexuality…so many questions about same sex attraction that need gospel clarification in my opinion.
I did all the right things that the church teaches, I got married in the temple to a man, lived and kept all my covenants, I was so depressed to the point of being suicidal. Living the covenant path did not work for me, I wish all of you well and pray it will for you guys. I believe in being true to yourself❤️🙏
Beautifully said!!!! So much respect for each of you! Every member of the church needs to tune in to this, this is so on point, centered on Christ + actual truth, and is just plain powerful. Thanks for sharing your experience and testimonies! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
This was so helpful. This subject affects almost every family in the church. It’s also one that causes much division in the church, including my own family. I just got through listening to 6 episodes on LatterDay Presentations on the Proclamation on the family and Gay issues and gender dysphoria. That was also very helpful. Thank you to all you for focusing true principles.
Bonnie, would you be so kind to help us find some of this information?? This is a wonderful opportunity to reach out to others. The more information, the better. Thank you for your comment dear sister.
Thank you!!!!!!! Skyler you're awesome! I'm so grateful to know you and love seeing the good you are doing. To my other two brothers on the panel, I also thank you. Thanks for sharing truth and for living the gospel through your challenges. I pray constantly about these issues which lead so many of our Father's children to choose a non-covenant path. "We all have to sacrifice something to be authentic to our eternal identity." ❤
I feel for these individuals that suffer from SSA. I am beyond grateful that I do not understand their weakness/temptations. It seems to me that enduring to the end must be next level for them.
yo at first I thought this would be a “faith matters”esque sympathy parade… this was the opposite , very empowering and faith promoting-didn’t realize how many “orthodox” Latter-day Saints there are who have these lgbt experiences …need to get these guys in front of some apostles as poster kids instead of others (cosmo, Ben,etc) hawaii is an interesting place to raise my kids: plenty conservative religious polynesians and also a small lgbt ‘zion’ gathering place among other demographics…thanks for these guys’ perspective , very valuable to me as a parent
I can always rely on this channel to help me understand all of God's children. Thank you guys for reaching into my heart with your explanations and discussion done in love. I pray the Lord's most richest blessings upon you all.💜💜💜💜
Very interesting, educational, tender, spiritual podcast. It was a great eye opener. Thanks you so much for your insight to this fine presentation/ interview. 🙏💕
I want to stand in silence of respect for your stand for truth in God's way. Any challenge is hard and when you mentioned Sacrifice you pointed my soul to The Temple. Thank you
Thanks for posting this. You guys are awesome. God bless you in your lives. I wish that my son would have stayed faithful in his challenges. He told his wife before they married that he was gay. But they were best friends and thought they would give it a go. To my knowledge they truly seemed happy for many years. That is until my DIL left the church and started doing things that devastated my son. He became unhappy and decided to leave his (temple) marriage, the church, his covenants and pursue the other lifestyle. It has broken his parents hearts.
I'm so impressed with all of these men you had on this episode! I loved hearing their individual testimonies and their desire to stay on the covenant path. These are wonderful examples who are going to strengthen so many children of God around the world 💕
Incredible podcast. I’ve had opportunities to talk with same-sex attracted Latter-day Saints and I always felt like I never had any good counsel to give them. This really was groundbreaking for me, I will be ordering those books! Thanks Gentlemen!
This was inspired and inspiring .edit: I agree with Josh on the pride flag . The rainbow in my opinion is sacred, and has nothing to do with the sin called "pride"
The current use of the rainbow is satan's typical desecration of a sacred symbol of a covenant between God and man. So sad - particularly when you consider that that symbol was a covenant that God would not destroy mankind again by flood because of their wickedness. Now the rainbow is being used to thumb the noses of the wicked toward God.
The matter of the rainbow is obviously from the Book of Moses, in Genesis after the Flood, and Joseph Smith spoke on it and that is in the Teachings of Presidents of the Church - Joseph Smith. The Joseph Smith statement telss of something future regarding the rainbow and the second coming of Christ, so it should come as no surprise that it would now be used in a way not consistent with what was spoken in the Old Testament and Moses--and its importance as a sacred symbol of covenants.
@@colormymedia6645 I never noticed. Thank you. Mary mother of Jesus was obedient. Hitlers mother and his father's mother were prostitute's according to what I heard on you tube. Opposite denoting antichrist. 💜
Thank you. Thank you brethren for your faith, candor, and testimonies. You have enlightened my mind to understanding the gospel plan in regards to those with same sex attraction.
Greg, You are doing such great work. I appreciate the guests you have on the show and what you're trying to do to help members be informed and follow Christ. Keep it up!!!
1 Corinthians 10:13 13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it. These amazing Brethren are testament that this scripture and promise from God are true!!! God is the same yesterday, today and forever. He is incapable of lying otherwise he ceases to be God. Thank you so much for the episode, for speaking up and getting us out of the spiral of silence in the Church!!! God bless you all!!! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻🤟🏼
As an SSA 40+ year-old man in the church, I worry about my younger SSA brothers and sisters. There are countless confusing voices out there, including those who are secretly (or not so secretly) rooting for doctrinal truths on marriage to change. They keep repeating the mantra that if LGBTQ individuals stay in the church they'll end up lonely and miserable. Over time they grow to believe their only choice for happiness is to leave the church. However, leaving is guilt inducing, so they need someone to tell them it's okay. There are two guys in particular (as mentioned in this video) that seem to come up a lot in the conversations I have with those struggling. Maybe these men don't outright tell you to leave the church, but they certainly seem to wink at it. It's possible that these "influencers" have some good intentions or maybe they're just trying to salve their own cognitive dissonance. I also think the accompanying fame and book sales play their part. Either way, I just know that when a young SSA individual is following them, their days in the church are numbered and it's frustrating to see Deseret Book so complicit in this. In light of the growing number of millennials identifying as LGBTQ (close to 20%), I'd like to see more people, like we see here in this video, stand up for truth. Because when I look in my wife's eyes or the eyes of children, I can't imagine any other lifestyle than the one my Savior has provided for me.
Such an awesome discussion and I LOVE these three men! Excellent topic presentation! They even addressed other members actions and the pride flag subject perfectly. Thank you!
Thank you for having these three gentlemen on your program. I'm familiar with Tember from Midnight Mormons. He is fantastic at exposing Satan's lies concerning same-sex attraction. I'm grateful that you had the other two on your program also. We do need desperately more of their voices heard in the Church! My favorite book of all time is "Born That Way" by Erin Eldredge when it comes to this subject. I've read 4 or 5 books on this subject, and this one is easily my favorite. Her story is real when it comes to the intense struggle involved in the repentance process, and her description of the reality of Christ's Atonement and its effects on sin and weaknesses is most uplifting and hopeful. Read it!
EXTREMELY EXTREMELY POWER DISCUSSION. Thank you so very much for all you each have shared. I dont think I have ever really consicered that this is a trial just as each of us have with our problems or weakness or attractions.. Some are attracted to alcohol.. and it is not super healthful to have that attraction. Some are attracted to eating to much or to sitting to much, or to porn or to gossiping or hate mongering.. It really doesn't matter what we deal with, but that we turn to Christ and follow His direction. He knows the way. Thank you so much for sharing so openly. God bless you. God bless us all.
Very helpful for my understanding. My son lives a gay lifestyle and I am grateful for these mens perspective and their faithfulness to the gospel of Christ and the plan of salvation as their goal to find eternal fulfilment.
Be your own authentic self? God doesn't want any of us to stay with our current/authentic self. He wants everyone of us to change for the better. This podcast is not my trial but I have my own which need to be left and overcome. Kudos to you three for speaking truth to us all
I remember when my daughter was teetering between a covenant life and an alternative lifestyle. Most of our active LDS friends spent their time telling her how loved she was and how she should just embrace who she was. Not one, other than her parents, encouraged her to keep her covenants. She chose the alternative. I have to believe that we will one day be held accountable for refusing to stand for Christ, even in the name of "love and tolerance."
Agreed. Caught up in the philosophies of men.
Much empathy. I will pray for your daughter.
What is Alternative Lifestyle?
What is the breaking point from Covenant Life? Is there no going back now? This sounds like you’ve closed the door on your daughter and there’s no chance for redemption.
You make Heavenly Father sound like an orthodox Muslim, and not a benevolent, loving deity.
@@markcavandish1295 There is nothing said here that makes this person sound like they've closed the door on their child.
@@cindlou7335 That’s what I’m asking.
“She chose the alternative”, sounds a whole lot like a line drawn in the sand to me.
Sitting in ward council, we found that our young women had been "experimenting" a bit at girls camp. I asked how we might teach them chastity more effectively. You could have heard a pin drop. The only response was from a sister who said basically, "All we can do is love them, or we risk them committing suicide."
When will we realize that the most loving thing we can do is to teach them righteous living and show them the path to true happiness? It feels like we are so upside down right now.
We have to fight back on these passive-aggressive threats. It is pure manipulation.
Whoa! That's frightening! As if the only two options are being the "cause" of their suicide and standing up for teaching chastity! Do these parents not realize that sexual immorality (whether homo- or hetero- sexual behavior) is next to sinning against the Holy Ghost? I can testify that sex outside of marriage led me to unhappiness that brought me to the point of wanting to die.
We could all say that - let me do whatever I want, whatever my fallen, carnal nature desires, or else I’m going to kill myself. It’s just emotional blackmail.
I think there’s a false notion that there are more kids committing suicide because they are gay and not being accepted. They are all around, messed up and committing suicide for all sorts of reasons. And more transgender people commit suicide after they transition than before. There’s a false belief that there are a bunch of statistics to support that theory when it’s mostly a narrative.
@@BenMcrea61 emotional blackmail. Good point!
Why am I in tears while watching this? You guys are amazing. What you went through was and is not easy. As a mother and a member of the Church, my heart goes out to you. I love and respect your decision to stay on the covenant path.
I felt the same, welled up with tears during the whole thing. Such holiness. ♥️
I was tearful as well. I definitely felt the Spirit here.
Thanks for watching! I’m glad you benefited from our message
The doctrine of the family is one of the biggest sifters in the Church today.
It has always been what set us apart as a restored gospel people. It 100% will be the biggest sifting doctrine in our dispensation. Scary times, BRING IT I say. 😂
I cannot say I ever experienced same-sex attraction, but I can say that I have been attracted to pornography. It was never my desire that the church endorse what I want but rather it was my wish that I learn to conform to the teachings of Jesus Christ.
You mean, you don’t walk into Sunday sacrament meeting watching porn on your smart phone full volume? What’s wrong with you? Be proud! Whip it out and be free! 😮
In all seriousness I agree 100%! I made choices early in my youth that have affected me so deeply regarding my own addictions (fueled by choices I made) but I would NEVER have made it through them if I was encouraged to embrace and increase the frequency of it (like the prominent psychologist/therapist anti LDS pastors teach their flocks to do) by my leaders and those who I thought shared my same spiritual beliefs.
Amen!
In our Ward the people who try to support the Family Proclamation are shot down by the teachers. One Sunday in G D there were about 20 of us who said truth should always be taught. We were all slammed by the teacher. After a while the voices of truth just become silent because they're seen as contentious. I loved this podcast and kudos to the three guests.
Don’t be silent! Resist the Spiral of Silence.
I've been in Primary and Nursery for over 10 years so I'm unfamiliar with Gospel Principles and Gospel Doctrine. Ever since COVID-19, I have felt a spirit of censorship in the Church, as if we're all tip-toeing around Gospel topics that have become politically charged. My faith has been challenged and I'm so grateful for CWIC and other LDS-focused influences that aren't afraid to speak openly about these topics. It's a tremendous help to me to know that others have experienced the same things.
Must be in a big city. Salt lake County?
That is SO disheartening and frustrating! Nephi saw this in our day as it would affect and infiltrate even the Lord's church:
2 Nephi 28:12 and 14
Because of pride, and because of false teachers, and false doctrine, their churches have become corrupted, and their churches are lifted up; because of pride they are puffed up.
...they have all gone astray save it be a few, who are the humble followers of Christ; nevertheless, they are led, that in many instances they do err because they are taught by the precepts of men.
We don't have G D anymore! Where are you having G D?? We have Sunday school or RS /EQ after sacrament. 😲🤔
I love these 3 young men. They are the example, not the excuse. They are so powerful in their messages. I'm overflowing with pure love and delight... in the last days, God sends his strongest and these are whom He is speaking about. My son and I just watched this and we were both consumed with the great testimonies and relief there are strong men out there like these to help others. We were discussing just the other day how "so and so" didn't make it, we hope he returns back to The Savior... its hard to see our beautiful brothers and sisters leave the Gospel. It personally hurts and brings emotions we don't realize we have for those loved ones in our wards. This was just what I needed, my son gained hope and was listening closely to the advice of how to talk to one who comes out and says, "I'm gay". Seriously valuable content in this episode and I pray you'll bring these men back. This is one if my favorite episodes, even though they're all pretty much extraordinary. Lol. Thank you Bro. Matsen
Thank you.
This is the best video I've ever seen addressing the issue of people with same sex attraction who unashamedly walk the covenant path. Thank you for having them on your show!
Good discussion.
I will never understand how homosexuality is somehow more of a burden than many other thorns in our sides.
As a young man I gave into certain appetites and desires that, still to this day, are things I have to guard against. Probably always will in this life. But I choose to move forward in faith. These men show the way.
Because being gay and I'm the church, the loneliness overwhelmingly suffocating. We have been told we are broken, defective, and don't fit . I was told by members of my own church that I shouldn't exist because I don't fit into the plan of salvation. I tried mixed orientation marriage, and it ended in pain and anxiety for all involved
@@dwaynecloar7554 It’s really hard to believe people tell other’s they’re broken or defective. The term would be more honest saying a person is caught up in sin. Is one now happily sinning and life is wonderful or still struggling living their so called true self? I know those in my own family are very miserable and depressed still blaming it on others whether family, church or culture. One young man had no father, an overbearing mother, and was abused by neighbor introducing him into this life. The other young man also came from a broken home and was introduced into this as a young boy. Neither had a family upbringing. Does this matter? Yes, I would say these young men did feel broken but they made their choice and have never felt happy. So what can one do? Turn to God and his ways…that’s all I personally know can help.
@@dwaynecloar7554 we are ALL BROKEN AND NEED CHRIST'S TRANSFORMATION.
@@dwaynecloar7554 everyone is broken. Some people are broken on the arm. The leg the hip bone. It's not a one Broke sin... I strongly believe that this brokenness did not come from Jesus, but from Adam and Eve. They brought weakness to the world. Imperfections to the world. But God loves us so much that he sent his son to help us. Just like someone may be born without limbs or with autism, I believe people develop an appetite with false feelings of happiness. Those people that have said those harsh words to you need to repent. Just like you're attracted to same sex, a heterosexual attracted to watching porn is not that far off from each other. But we need to strive to become like Jesus and obey all the God's commandments. So we all have a hard journey ahead. Sorry for rambling
I think it is obvious how it is more of a burden. Imagine a life without ever having any potential to have enjoyable sex. Add to that a plan that says that even in the eternities if you do the right thing and marry a women and give her ungratifying sex your whole lives-- you get to do that together forever. Woo Hoo. Sex was built to be a good thing. Powerful, but also enjoyable. People with heterosexual desires only are asked to curb those til marriage and most people really do have to fight the good fight to make it that long. Trust me- 47 and never married is not fun for me. The burden on homosexuals is definitely stronger.
We all have a cross to bare in this life and none of us are exempted from walking the covenant path regardless of our personal circumstances and trials. It does not matter if we are straight, gay, dealing with mental issues, physical problems spiritual weaknesses. I will stand with anyone attempting to walk the covenant path. God loves all his children but part of the trial of life is to deny ourselves the the natural man tendencies and submit our will to the lords. Prayers and strength to all who bare the crosses of the world.
That's why people are rejecting the gospel who have those difficult challenges because they say its 'too hard'' to endure living the gospel and they want to get off the covenant path to make it easier.
But that's no excuse with the Lord as he has a different standard than the worlds standards. The Saints are expected to endure to the end, not quit and throw in the towel because its 'too hard' to continue. The Lord does not accept any excuses. He expects his standards to be kept when on the covenant path and he won't approve of same sex dating and living a double church life and those who do, they usually fall into trouble with church leaders for not conforming to gospel standards as the gospel standards dont' allow for same sex dating because the gospel standards don't support same-sex relationships...
These men are amazing and a good example to everyone who struggles with anything. Every difficultly we have can be solved by the Atonement of Jesus Christ who strengthens us. I respect their desire to live the gospel to the fullest. My thanks to you all for sharing and living your testimony.
Agreed!
@@CwicShow Some trials are meant to be endured, not taken away or cured. It is not always the Father's will to cure everything,as that would destroy the gospel plan if he took every trial away.So when the trial is SSA and its strong and always persistent,its not wise to enter marriage with the SSA up at its highest flaring up levels Its more wise instead to endure the trial living the church standards as a single member and wait until the Millennium to marry the opposite sex if the Lord won't remove the SSA being of no fault of their own since the SSA feelings are not chosen but SSA behavior is and that's where the Church stands on the issue.
44:16 to 45:12 minutes in THIS IS KEY!!!! I've been hollering this FOREVER hats off to you brethren I'm honored to call you my brothers!!!!! 💪💪💪you all are so very strong
I don't have anything profound to say today, but just want to say thank you Greg and all participants in this video. This came at a perfect time for me. I was asked to speak this coming Easter Sunday in my ward about the atonement, and I've felt I should talk on the atonements purpose in changing aspects of ourselves to build us up and make us better according to how God sees us, not the world. I'm also feeling it may be beneficial to share my own conversion and things I had to change to align with God and how it has blessed my life. This discussion definitely gave me a lot of insights and thoughts. God is good. Thank you, and bless you!
Thanks for watching, Mitchell! Hope you’re doing well
@@sitdownwithsky thank you Sky! Life is going great for me. I've started dating a girl and we'll see how that goes 😅I hope you're doing well, too!
Great discussion! Loved collaborating with you fine brethren!
Thanks for your insights and example.
Thank you for your testimony and faith in Jesus Christ and His Atoning sacrifice. And, for your ministry to help those in need
@Tember Harward ... we need you! You and the other 2 gentlemen here, alongside some others who are willing to teach and reach up the ladder in this church to help the brethren and sisters how to speak up without offending anyone. I wish there was a larger platform so we could help so many of our youth hang on a little longer with the help of leaders and members who can be taught... I see where each of you can help us learn to make a difference. God bless you.
Thank you for your testimony! You’re amazing!
We need more content like this! Please add an episode that goes through the struggles these men faced with getting married to a woman and how they got through that. I think it would be really helpful!
Such a powerful discussion! The faithfulness and strength of these brothers is awe inspiring. Thank you for bringing them together.
You’re welcome
Ben Schilaty is one of those tares who is growing tall and strong amongst the wheat and will one day be plucked out.
Thank you Greg for hosting three men of God who desire only the best for all of Gods children regardless of their own painful struggles.
These men reflect their Royal Heritage and will one day walk with God our Heavenly Father.
Excellent show Greg!
Thank you!
How dare you judge someone as sweet as Ben Schilaty???? I would be careful to judge anyone at all, this is not Christ-like!
We just had him speak in a virtual stake fireside. I worried all month. I went to the temple and experienced clarity and peace before the event. Then the event came and I couldn't understand why I had felt peace about it when after hearing his message and my stake president's approval of his message then feel SO confused! I tried to give him a chance and trust my leader, but I felt so awful the more I pondered on his talk. But after wrestling with it and talking about with others, I've realized. His message confused me because he's not correct. The clarity in the temple trumps his "experience". He has no authority to speak on these things. He very carefully words his message to stay within the bounds, but he clearly makes opposite statements that contradicts the prophets.
@@anthonyrippa686 we can’t put anyone into the category of tare or wheat, it’s not for us to judge, how could we possibly know what Heavenly Father knows. As Stephen Covey used to say, don’t be a judge, be a light. Besides all that, I hold Ben in the highest regard, he has gone through many trials and he sets an example for gay members by serving in the temple, living a celibate lifestyle and showing love and kindness to everyone.
@@renatep.7566 The Church does not approve of the same sex dating practices of the world. That's a part of the world he has to learn to give up to the Lord if he wants to remain in good standing in the Church otherwise hes in danger of going away from the covenant path. Because the Lord is not going to accept what hes been doing when hes outside of the Church getting involved in same sex dating practices. The Lord has strict unyielding standards of conduct when it comes to the covenant pathway.
Dating members of the same sex while on the covenant pathway is unbecoming conduct of a member of the Church and leaders can remove his recommend from him or other discipline until he corrects that behavior.
The Church only accepts one standard, the Lord's Standard and no other.
This discussion was just awesome! Thank you, brethren, you all, for keeping the faith and being a great example to all of us.
A big thank you to all the participants on this video! You are courageous examples of staying on the covenant path despite opposition. Thank you for your testimonies!
After much praying and thinking about this subject, I am of the mind that in our preexistence we were apprised of all the things we might experience here on earth. People are born with all kinds of physical and mental problems, experience the horrors of wars, famine, draught, missing arms or legs, same sex attraction, etc. etc. Our spirit bodies were perfect but the physical laws of the universe may not be so kind to us. In my mind, that could be the reason one third of us decided not to have physical bodies. Many years ago, a friend came to me and told me he was gay but because he believed the gospel was true, married and had a son. We are the same age, 94, and six months ago said he lived the straight life because of his faith but he could never rid himself of same sex attraction, hoping that in his next life he could. He died since then. He was a great musical talent and was intelligent. Jesus Christ died for all 6 billion of us, and for those who accept His redemption, will not have to pay the penalty for sins committed. There is a lot of stuff we do not know about the next life but I am sure everyone will be happy for what is ahead. I will find out very soon.
Oh that is beautiful. I'm sure the Savior will have a special crown for him!! And will emphatically say WELL DONE!!
Inspiring story . I am sure the Lord knew what this good brother gave up to serve Him .
I am very encouraged by this discussion. Thank you all for your strong testimonies!!
Our pleasure!
Joshua/Skyler/Tember/Greg - thank you brethren!
Welcome
Great Men. I greatly appreciate their honesty. I feel they are truly men without guile!!
We all come to this life with something hard that we have to overcome and these young men are dealing with theirs. I am so grateful for the love Heavenly Father has for each of us and only wants the best for us. I am very proud of these young men and their wives and hope the other young man will find the right young woman for him.
Thank you for having me on!
Thank you! Great interview!
Joshua, be sure to add the beautiful description of JST Genesis 9:21-25 to your very insightful theory:
“And the bow shall be in the cloud; and I will look upon it, that I may remember the everlasting covenant, which I made unto thy father Enoch; that, when men should keep all my commandments, Zion should again come on the earth, the city of Enoch which I have caught up unto myself.
“And this is mine everlasting covenant, that when thy posterity shall embrace the truth, and look upward, then shall Zion look downward, and all the heavens shall shake with gladness, and the earth shall tremble with joy;
“And the general assembly of the church of the firstborn shall come down out of heaven, and possess the earth, and shall have place until the end come. And this is mine everlasting covenant, which I made with thy father Enoch.
“And the bow shall be in the cloud, and I will establish my covenant unto thee, which I have made between me and thee, for every living creature of all flesh that shall be upon the earth.
“And God said unto Noah, This is the token of the covenant which I have established between me and thee; for all flesh that shall be upon the earth.”
What is the name of your book?
@@SandieMixa Preston’s is called “This Boy and His Mother.” I don’t currently have a book.
Such a great interview. Thank you for being an example of being a covenant keeper. It means so much to me.
Greatest video I've seen on this topic. Good for you guys. God be with you.
Appreciate that
I, as a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of latter-day Saints, feel so confused about this issue. When gender is central to the creators plan, how can this be a struggle anyone has to face? I'm glad these men are finding themselves on the gospel path. It makes us all better people, sharing and understanding others' difficulties.
Thanks, brother Matsen, for bringing this to us!
You're welcome
Quick question... my son has epilepsy. Why does anyone have to face that?
@@EKowallis I have bipolar. My brother has Schizophrenia. Some people are born blind. 🤷♀️ We all come or become broken through our mortal experience. Jesus WILL HEAL it ALL. if we were born perfect we wouldn't learn compassion and pain and need for support beyond our own! ❤️
@@EKowallis Epilepsy doesn't bring an opposition to the creators plan. It's a foundational element to proclamation on the family and eternal exaultation.
My nephew has a form of epilepsy that causes him to have up to 80 seizures a day. I pray for your peace in handling such a great, heavy load to bear.
We come here to overcome the natural man through the Spirit of Christ. This includes all sorts of physical obstacles. Homosexuality is not an exception; it just happens to be one that our society is obsessed with and desires to make the exception to the rule.
Every time my daughter who has come out as gay and now planning on getting married says God made me this way I just want to scream. It breaks my heart. She is so far from the spirit now that I have to just keep a surface relationship so I don’t upset her and drive her completely away. 😢
We are in the same exact scenario with our daughter. It’s been so sad to watch.
It's not a choice
@@dwaynecloar7554 Perhaps. But it IS a choice whether or not to follow Christ. We all have things that draw us away. The question is are we going to put our will above God’s…or like Jesus say “thy will be done”
@@dwaynecloar7554 acting on any feelings is always a choice.
@@emjames9865 But the attraction is not a choice
Very thought provoking. I appreciate the perspective of these four faithful LDS men who have shared and expressed themselves and the issues that dominate our culture today. Recognizing and identifying our relationship as children of God is critical and the personal relationship we can and should develop with the Savior will help us deflect the fiery darts 🎯 of the adversary in whatever form the attack us. 👍👏 We ALL must find a way to get and preserve that relationship with Christ and stay on the covenant path😊
This is a necessary and brilliant approach. Thank you. We do not teach that the right choice, the covenant choice, is even possible or desirable for this specific temptation. I can’t imagine what my life would be like if I were taught that I could not overcome my weaknesses, especially those that have tested me for most of my life. It is such a confusing departure from the truth that there are no commandments given that we cannot obey. 1 Nephi 3:7
The statement in 1 Nephi 3:7 was in regard to a specific commandment God gave to Lehi and his sons. How do people born in North Korea "obey" the commandment to pay tithing? They can't. They don't even know it exists. BUT as the Spirit can speak to them as much as to anyone else, when they are prompeted to do something by the Spirit they are being commanded in the same way as Lehi and his sons were and the way is made possible for them to obey. Thinking of 1 Nephi 3:7 as applicable to all general scriptural commandments and being relevant to all people regardless of the circumstance of where they live or what physical or mental issues they have is false.
Really interesting discussion, with a lot of hope and faith coming from these three men. Thank you for moderating and sharing it with us.
Thanks for listening
These are the men we need in the church! Truly modern-day Captain Moronis!
I really am so happy that you all are promoting to live the commandments despite the difficulties we have faced and are facing now happiness comes from living the doctrine of Jesus Christ…I am a 72 year old gay woman who has lived that lifestyle and have done all I can do to keep the commandments … I agree with the principles that all of you have mentioned in this podcast thankyou👍🏼👍🏼🙏🏼
Thank you for sharing this!
@Kathleen Taylor That’s so amazing!!❤️❤️❤️
Fantastic conversation! There needs to be more faithful center discussions surrounding this issue in the church. Thank you Cwic for putting this together.
Thank you so much for doing this! Members need to know these men and their lives. We need their voices heard!!!
59:00 is something that I have been struggling to put into words for years, but Joshua said it perfectly. Thank you Greg, Joshua, Sky, and Tember for this incredible discussion. I don't know any of you personally, but have felt the Holy Spirit throughout the podcast through your words.
Thank you! The spirit spoke for me in that moment and throughout this podcast. I would’ve struggled to find words too if it weren’t for the Holy Ghost.
Thanks Greg for hosting Tember, Joshua and Skyler. Excellent, Frank and much needed open discussion on this important topic.
On my mission in South Africa in ’78, we taught a deaf mute who only knew Afrikaans, so we had him read the missionary lessons in that language. After finishing the commandments lesson I asked him if he had any comments and he wrote a word down which I didn’t know in Afrikaans. I quickly looked it up and it was the Afrikaans word for he is a homosexual. I paused for a moment while saying a silent prayer for guidance and responded to him by asking him the question, and how do you feel about it? He said he knew he was always in conflict with what God desired and after a time of displaying abstinence, he was baptized.
Sharing this experience with a temple endowed same sex attraction church member in Washington state, this member explains to me that what I asked that investigator was the best thing I could have said to him. This struggle is a personal one between that individual and their salvation that they work out in their relationship with Christ as their savior. I could write much more but this is the basic core. We each have our thorns in the flesh and nothing we experience is really unique but all is personal. God will not abandon anyone that honestly seeks him. Just as the rich man was called upon by Christ to give up all that he has to follow Christ but could not because he had too many riches though he adhered to all other teachings, we each need to give up what we might consider part of ourselves in order to carry our cross and follow Christ.
Thank you all for doing your best to live the gospel. I pray the Lord strengthens you all to endure your personal challenges, as I pray for myself to do the same.
We had a woman at stake conference tell her story. She said as a teenager she was bullied and told she was gay. She wasn’t gay but the power of suggestion made her have those thoughts. She prayed and the scripture as a man thinketh so is he came into her mind. She was able to control her thoughts. Today she is married and has a loving family. Not saying that is everyone’s story, but something to ponder.
Thank you for having us!
What is the name of your book?
I subscribed to your channel... please continue to make videos. Lol. 1 is a lonely number. 😆😉 I want to help support each if you thay were on the panel because I believe there was something very powerful and yes, so unique, with having the 3 of you on panel. I am so overjoyed to see another side to these stories that we rarely to never hear about. To know there was SO much information given to us on this panel was hopeful and exciting. God bless you brother!!
Excellent broadcast Greg. Very impressive , realistic, and faithful brothers sharing. We need to share more of this kind of discussion. Keep up the great job.
thanks John!
I'm thankful for this discussion. I have a family member who is living an alternative lifestyle who is not a member of the Church. This gives me hope for this familly member that someday he will join the church and have help in understanding how he can live the gospel successfully.
That is a great panel! I'm excited for this
I honor and respect each of these men. Love their testimonies ❤️
How difficult it must be for these Children of God. I appreciate their struggle and pray for them.
This is the best post. No hate, no condemnation, nothing but compassion - pure love of Christ.
I am so proud of these men. They have chosen the covenant path and allowed the Lord to prevail in their lives under very difficult situations. I feel the Lord is so pleased with their choices. They will inherit all that He has. I love you, and thank you for your examples of righteousness. 💖
They all continue to offer a positive influence. Thank you for your support!
Thank you for having these guests on. Their voices need to be amplified for sure.
This should be in the Ensign or just loaded to the church website. Amen and Amen! There is no alternative to the Covenant path that provides exaltation! So inspiring and what Courage these brethren have! Way to choose the Savior! Salvation is not a cheap experience!
Brilliant podcast. Straight down the line Thank you and God bless you all.
As A fellow member who does experience same sex attraction, this is very comforting and brings me hope that there are others in the church who experience same sex attraction yet are genuinely more happy living God’s commandments. Thank you so much for all insights and testimonies. 🙏😀
Amazing discussion! Perfect timing and sorely needed. Thank you all!
Glad you enjoyed it!
These men are like Nephite warriors, but their fight is truly Latter-day in nature. They are truly leading the charge in how to overcome and conquer. Their strength comes from keeping their Covenants. God bless them!!
These are Father's strongest spirits, saved for this day. They are dealing with an earthly experience or challenge as we would say by listening to God and his commandments for an Eternal glory. They don't need my approval. They have been witnessed of the Holy Ghost and are not denying it. I'm happy to be associated with these saints.
44:30 Great insight, Tember. Our model is not Adam and Eve, like most Christians. It's our heavenly parents. ❤️
Thank you all. I can't pretend to understand your particular situations. I'm trying to. I'm trying to love and accept people while holding on to the doctrines as I understand them. Thank you for your voices. Please keep it up. May the Lord bless you all.
Thank you for giving these amazing guys a platform to speak on. I've only met one of them and consider them a friend and am so happy people are giving them a chance to be heard.
I am also friends with Ben and have had the wonderful opportunity to attend a class of his while attending university. Both he and one of the men that were interviewed here have been positive influences in helping me investigate the Church as well as choose to stay. I didn't do this for them, but for myself, but I do have them to thank in this journey. This may be an unpopular suggestions here, and I'm not sure if this is something of interest for this show, but I think it would be nice to also hear from Bro. Schilaty to hear what he has to say in context and what might be on people's minds in an interview.
Again, thank you for providing a platform for these wonderful men to speak on your channel. They are good people.
Much props to these guys, life is very complicated and they seem to be trying very hard to live their lives as faithful and authentically as they can. I wish the church would do a “gospel topics essay” type article on the church’s stance on gender and sexuality…so many questions about same sex attraction that need gospel clarification in my opinion.
I did all the right things that the church teaches, I got married in the temple to a man, lived and kept all my covenants, I was so depressed to the point of being suicidal. Living the covenant path did not work for me, I wish all of you well and pray it will for you guys. I believe in being true to yourself❤️🙏
Beautifully said!!!! So much respect for each of you! Every member of the church needs to tune in to this, this is so on point, centered on Christ + actual truth, and is just plain powerful. Thanks for sharing your experience and testimonies! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
This was so helpful. This subject affects almost every family in the church. It’s also one that causes much division in the church, including my own family. I just got through listening to 6 episodes on LatterDay Presentations on the Proclamation on the family and Gay issues and gender dysphoria. That was also very helpful. Thank you to all you for focusing true principles.
Bonnie. Can you share access to the 6 episodes and gay issues you referred to. I’m interested. Thanks
Bonnie, would you be so kind to help us find some of this information?? This is a wonderful opportunity to reach out to others. The more information, the better. Thank you for your comment dear sister.
Thank you!!!!!!! Skyler you're awesome! I'm so grateful to know you and love seeing the good you are doing. To my other two brothers on the panel, I also thank you. Thanks for sharing truth and for living the gospel through your challenges. I pray constantly about these issues which lead so many of our Father's children to choose a non-covenant path. "We all have to sacrifice something to be authentic to our eternal identity." ❤
Thanks for this. Very helpful to understand others and what they are going through
Glad it was helpful!
Joshua Nelson… you nailed it in your analysis of the Pride Flag !!
Agreed
Thank you!
This was so wonderful to watch. I really appreciate hearing their perspectives. Thank you.
You're welcome!
I feel for these individuals that suffer from SSA. I am beyond grateful that I do not understand their weakness/temptations. It seems to me that enduring to the end must be next level for them.
yo
at first I thought this would be a “faith matters”esque sympathy parade…
this was the opposite , very empowering and faith promoting-didn’t realize how many “orthodox” Latter-day Saints there are who have these lgbt experiences …need to get these guys in front of some apostles as poster kids instead of others (cosmo, Ben,etc)
hawaii is an interesting place to raise my kids: plenty conservative religious polynesians and also a small lgbt ‘zion’ gathering place among other demographics…thanks for these guys’ perspective , very valuable to me as a parent
we all have trials some more painful/difficult than others, God bless you brothers, you are a role model to all of us and never give up.
I can always rely on this channel to help me understand all of God's children. Thank you guys for reaching into my heart with your explanations and discussion done in love. I pray the Lord's most richest blessings upon you all.💜💜💜💜
Thanks for having me! I enjoyed our conversation
Any time! Great interview!
Very interesting, educational, tender, spiritual podcast. It was a great eye opener. Thanks you so much for your insight to this fine presentation/ interview. 🙏💕
I want to stand in silence of respect for your stand for truth in God's way. Any challenge is hard and when you mentioned Sacrifice you pointed my soul to The Temple. Thank you
Thanks for the courage to share these ideas.
What great examples. Thanks for sharing
Very valuable conversation. I respect them immensely. Thank you guys for sharing your experiences. Your voices are soo appreciated
This was so great. I’m so encouraged. We do all have our crosses to bear. God bless you for your faith. Can’t wait to read your books.
Thank you so, so much for this interview. It is full of hope. I will be sharing this.❤
Thanks for posting this. You guys are awesome. God bless you in your lives. I wish that my son would have stayed faithful in his challenges. He told his wife before they married that he was gay. But they were best friends and thought they would give it a go. To my knowledge they truly seemed happy for many years. That is until my DIL left the church and started doing things that devastated my son. He became unhappy and decided to leave his (temple) marriage, the church, his covenants and pursue the other lifestyle. It has broken his parents hearts.
Great video!
Thank you for the truthful and realistic approach to the issue!
I'm so impressed with all of these men you had on this episode! I loved hearing their individual testimonies and their desire to stay on the covenant path. These are wonderful examples who are going to strengthen so many children of God around the world 💕
this is really needed, man thank you soooo much!!!!
Agreed. And no problem!!
This was very insightful and meaningful and hopeful. Very impressed by these men and their testimonies. Great interview!
I love this. Thank you for sharing your experiences!
Incredible podcast. I’ve had opportunities to talk with same-sex attracted Latter-day Saints and I always felt like I never had any good counsel to give them. This really was groundbreaking for me, I will be ordering those books! Thanks Gentlemen!
Love that!
This was inspired and inspiring .edit: I agree with Josh on the pride flag . The rainbow in my opinion is sacred, and has nothing to do with the sin called "pride"
The current use of the rainbow is satan's typical desecration of a sacred symbol of a covenant between God and man. So sad - particularly when you consider that that symbol was a covenant that God would not destroy mankind again by flood because of their wickedness. Now the rainbow is being used to thumb the noses of the wicked toward God.
The matter of the rainbow is obviously from the Book of Moses, in Genesis after the Flood, and Joseph Smith spoke on it and that is in the Teachings of Presidents of the Church - Joseph Smith. The Joseph Smith statement telss of something future regarding the rainbow and the second coming of Christ, so it should come as no surprise that it would now be used in a way not consistent with what was spoken in the Old Testament and Moses--and its importance as a sacred symbol of covenants.
Satan always copies symbols twisting for his design leading man away from God true purposes.
Have any of you noticed that the “Gay” flag has 6 colors, but God’s Rainbow 🌈 is 7 colors of the full spectrum. 7 is a number of completion. 🎉
@@colormymedia6645 I never noticed. Thank you. Mary mother of Jesus was obedient. Hitlers mother and his father's mother were prostitute's according to what I heard on you tube. Opposite denoting antichrist. 💜
Thank you. Thank you brethren for your faith, candor, and testimonies. You have enlightened my mind to understanding the gospel plan in regards to those with same sex attraction.
I love this channel, awesome to see people who hold strong to the gospel and it's truth and don't get side tracked by popular earthly trends
This is a great discussion: great perspectives by them. Praying we all continue to follow the covenant path.
Greg,
You are doing such great work. I appreciate the guests you have on the show and what you're trying to do to help members be informed and follow Christ. Keep it up!!!
I appreciate that!
So thankful for Tember, Joshua and Skyler!!! God bless you all🌿Love you!!!
1 Corinthians 10:13
13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.
These amazing Brethren are testament that this scripture and promise from God are true!!! God is the same yesterday, today and forever. He is incapable of lying otherwise he ceases to be God.
Thank you so much for the episode, for speaking up and getting us out of the spiral of silence in the Church!!!
God bless you all!!! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻🤟🏼
As an SSA 40+ year-old man in the church, I worry about my younger SSA brothers and sisters. There are countless confusing voices out there, including those who are secretly (or not so secretly) rooting for doctrinal truths on marriage to change. They keep repeating the mantra that if LGBTQ individuals stay in the church they'll end up lonely and miserable. Over time they grow to believe their only choice for happiness is to leave the church. However, leaving is guilt inducing, so they need someone to tell them it's okay. There are two guys in particular (as mentioned in this video) that seem to come up a lot in the conversations I have with those struggling. Maybe these men don't outright tell you to leave the church, but they certainly seem to wink at it. It's possible that these "influencers" have some good intentions or maybe they're just trying to salve their own cognitive dissonance. I also think the accompanying fame and book sales play their part. Either way, I just know that when a young SSA individual is following them, their days in the church are numbered and it's frustrating to see Deseret Book so complicit in this. In light of the growing number of millennials identifying as LGBTQ (close to 20%), I'd like to see more people, like we see here in this video, stand up for truth. Because when I look in my wife's eyes or the eyes of children, I can't imagine any other lifestyle than the one my Savior has provided for me.
thank you for sharing this!
Such an awesome discussion and I LOVE these three men! Excellent topic presentation! They even addressed other members actions and the pride flag subject perfectly. Thank you!
Thank you for having these three gentlemen on your program. I'm familiar with Tember from Midnight Mormons. He is fantastic at exposing Satan's lies concerning same-sex attraction. I'm grateful that you had the other two on your program also. We do need desperately more of their voices heard in the Church! My favorite book of all time is "Born That Way" by Erin Eldredge when it comes to this subject. I've read 4 or 5 books on this subject, and this one is easily my favorite. Her story is real when it comes to the intense struggle involved in the repentance process, and her description of the reality of Christ's Atonement and its effects on sin and weaknesses is most uplifting and hopeful. Read it!
This was wonderful. Thank you!
I'm grateful for these 3 young men. Following gospel path! Strong testimony! You are being your own self when u follow the plan of salvation!
Excellent! Thanks to all 4 of you.
You’re welcome
Great discussion …. Fear of man keeps us from having this discussion and amplifying faithful members like this.
Well said!
EXTREMELY EXTREMELY POWER DISCUSSION. Thank you so very much for all you each have shared. I dont think I have ever really consicered that this is a trial just as each of us have with our problems or weakness or attractions.. Some are attracted to alcohol.. and it is not super healthful to have that attraction. Some are attracted to eating to much or to sitting to much, or to porn or to gossiping or hate mongering.. It really doesn't matter what we deal with, but that we turn to Christ and follow His direction. He knows the way. Thank you so much for sharing so openly. God bless you. God bless us all.
Thanks!
Thank you!
Very helpful for my understanding. My son lives a gay lifestyle and I am grateful for these mens perspective and their faithfulness to the gospel of Christ and the plan of salvation as their goal to find eternal fulfilment.
Be your own authentic self? God doesn't want any of us to stay with our current/authentic self. He wants everyone of us to change for the better. This podcast is not my trial but I have my own which need to be left and overcome. Kudos to you three for speaking truth to us all
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