There are plenty of things you could try if you do this again, in terms of the arrowheads. You could try that open one, and make it hold pitch (or coal as someone else suggested). You could also try to come up with your own designs for arrowheads, maybe like some kind of cone shape that protects the material from the the wind? Hell if it's possible you can see what happens if you shoot a red hot arrowhead.
I think shooting red hot arrows has the most chance of working. You'ld need some logistics to get it hot enough (so not simple fire) without burning the wood of the arrow.
I mean, making an arrowhead with a wind protector that also has a functioning stem is a challenge for any blacksmith, and to make them on a massive scale is just... I don't see it. A red hot arrow head is much more feasible, though considering you'd need to hold it in high heat for a long time, I'm not sure if the wooden shaft would survive such heat treatment. I think the cage arrowhead has the most chance of working from a historical perspective. It's relatively easy to make, prevents the problem of the burning material just falling apart, and it could potentially prevent the fire, or at least the embers, from going out. Especially if you use the twisted cage design, since the twists would disrupt the airflow enough to keep some of the lit parts from being snuffed out. I think. I wanna see it.
@@B3RyL Yeah, I think the thing to do with the cage arrow is to take oil-soaked twine and wrap it around and through the cage. This could probably be done in such a way that it forms a wind shield that keeps a bit of pitch in the center smoldering.
I've been watching this channel since it was just Shad sitting in a chair. Now, the amount of growth and production quality is amazing. Shad and the boys have elevated this channel while keeping it's original spirit. I love the new direction and hosts. Keep up the great work!
I love the comment about giving away the location of the archers, because that's actually addressed in Ranger's Apprentice! The way John Flanagan writes it, they have the archer atop a nearby cliff shooting at a wooden boat trying to set it alight as a distraction. He expressly mentions that as soon as he starts shooting and things start going up in flames, they're going to be working on borrowed time to finish the operation. He even gets caught later in his escape because there are too many pursuers! I've always loved the attention to realism and detail in the series
@@vocassen I know! It was an awesome story with plenty of good real-world knowledge sprinkled throughout! For example, most of the stealth techniques actually work, such as just staying still even when you think you've been caught. I used the exact same tactic against my friends whenever we played hide-n-seek at night. It worked something like 80% of the time. I specifically remember when two of the seekers were scanning an area I was in with flashlights. I had nowhere else to hide, so I just dropped to the ground and stayed stock-still. They passed right on by me, and it felt amazing.
Yeah, I know the scene you’re discussing from the Royal Ranger. There are definitely some fantasy elements in that series, but many things have a real world basis.
Hot coals. All the technology you need for fire arrows. (An archer would take a coal from a brazier with a gloved hand, put it into the special arrow you showed and shoot it. And unlike open flames, coals actually benefit from the incoming air flow.)
Hey Shad and team, why not cover 30% of the arrow in a thin coat of pitch, cover that with linen and twine doused in a flammable oil, so it can reignite or stay alight. Just a suggestion. But yes, historical pitch and a custom arrow head sounds like a great idea. Please revisit this. I am a nerd of both historical and fantasy tropes. Also, try it with a historical crossbow and bolt, maybe it will work better.
If they do revisit, they might want to try making and using a slow-match to light the arrows. Something like a slow-match may also be a good bet for making a wind-resistant fire arrow, but at the very least one could be held in the bow hand such that the incendiary can be ignited by a lone archer either when the arrow reaches full-draw or prior to nocking. On the idea of using a slow-match on the arrow itself as the incendiary, another possibility is to use something similar to a trench lighter so that it merely smolders while being drawn (maybe even while still in the quiver, those things can smolder for a _long_ time) and then fully ignite just from being launched normally.
@GremlinSciences I am very much on board with this, I never even considered slow matches or long fuses, but hear me out. Perhaps a match that lights the arrow upon impact. Why worry about keeping the arrow aflame when it can ignite upon sticking into its intended target and use an arrowhead that is nearly impossible to remove.
Yeah, the custome arrowhead is a good idea. Because it only really works as a pre-planned strategy to begin with. So an army trying to do it could have spent the time and money in making arrows spefic for the purpose.
We do this every year, we have an apocalypse bow challenge. Where you have to build a working bow and arrow out of every day scrap. The secret is steel wool. Works like a charm for flame arrows love from Canada 🇨🇦!
The intro was everything. And now after almost a year... With the "I pitched the pitch arrow!!!... Get it?!" I finally can say "Oh yeah, it's obvious Shad and Jazza are brothers..." Edit: the whole video was spectacular! I loved when all three of you are during together. Just love it. Also appreciate you were not quick to share the details of how you made these. Respect.
Shad, your channel has to be one of the absolute coolest channels in all of RUclips. I've learned so much and remain entertained throughout all of your videos. You and your crew are excellent presenters as well. I wonder if an entity like The History Channel would be interested in bringing your channel to television. It's captivating stuff, really
If they produced excellent content they wouldn't show guys firing the bow in a close up shot so there's no context. They have a massive subscriber base and they can't invest in a slo mo camera and various angles? You geek will eat up any slop. This video was garbage.
I'd love to see Shadiversity revisit this. there was also one kind of fire arrows during late medieval times, saltpeter sap fire arrows, pretty much sugar rockets. and also specialized heads that would hold coal. this kind of flying while on fire is more like Hollywood accurate
It's not much, but please keep up the good work. You guys deserve more recognition for the dedication you make and the expenses on products you use. Awesome video, as always.
i feel like the three of you really found a dynamic in your videos that is very entertaining and informative. i do not longer have the idea you are fighting with each other but together for the topic to get to the bottom of a subject.
You would probably had a lot of fun if you explore pre-columbian warfare, Shad. Just for an example, the Tupi warriors were well know for this: -Flaming arrows made with cotton and manatee grease. -Shields and helms made of turtle shells. -Bombs made of wasp nests. -They were capable of using roasted pepper in order to create a toxic cloud, and force enemies to flee their hideouts inside palisade walls. -The Tupi "siege tactics" were so effective that their tradtional enemies, the Gê tribes, were forced to construct "subterranean houses", less vulnerable to fire and toxic clouds of pepper. -A french explorer who visited Brazil in 1530 described that "Even the English would be surprised after seeing the arrow clouds created by the native archers".
Turtle shells are not strong enough to be made into shields so I imagine they had a strong glue and glued 5 layers together. It would still be pretty light weight, and sufficient for stopping crossbows at that point.
I know of some historical uses of fire arrows recorded on both sides of the world. English archers at the siege of Harfleur managed to partially destroy one of the towers with fire arrows, and Shawnee archers at the siege of Boonesborough may have also used them to catch the roofs of the houses inside the fort on fire (this was mainly effective because it distracted the defenders from manning the walls to put out the fires, like Shad and the guys mentioned).
I think that the reason why it worked better in the testing before was that you had slightly stronger and stable wind while shooting downwind. You were shooting downwind in the video, but in the position with the bow drawn, aiming, you can see the flame jiggle around and even go straight up for a moment as the wind is gusting and dying out completely. Which a) makes sense b) makes use of fire arrows more interesting and dependent on weather/position of the shooter to the wind. Great video once again, I shall finally join the Patreon. (I should start working on my procrastination skills xd)
As you said, there are lots of variables to take into consideration for a fire arrow to work: air humidity, the type of target, target moisture, wind, fuel composition and mixture etc. It would be fun to see more tests with different types of arrows and fuel mixtures in the future, as long as it can be safely performed and Shad doesn't start an accidental wildfire.
I think a lot of historical recipes for fire arrows used low-grade gunpowder as the main incendiary agent. Here is a recipe from 11th century China: Behind the arrow head wrap up some gunpowder with two or three layers of soft paper, and bind it to the arrow shaft in a lump shaped like a pomegranate. Cover it with a piece of hemp cloth tightly tied, and sealed fast with molten pine resin. Light the fuse and then shoot it off from a bow.
it looked like a gel/glue with some lint on it to make it start burning. probably gasoline or even kerosene mixed with gelatin to make it dry and stick to the arrow. napalm makes black smoke, so I don't think it's napalm. (you can make a proto-napalm by dissolving Styrofoam in acid, making extremely bad fumes, and leaving a black, sticky, and heavily flammable mess behind.)
JörgSprave had a very simple working fire arrow design in one of his videos. I think it was sulfur and ironwool. When lit it got hot enough to reignite after being shot at target.
If you do second try, perhaps test just blunt metal arrow head that gets heated on coals to glowing red/white. Split second flight time isn't going to do anything to the heat but burying 1000c+ pieces of metal in anything that burns is going to smolder and potentially catch fire. You'll probably need 5~10 cm length of metal for it to glow white at end without burning the arrow shaft before it's fired though.
It is important to let it burn for a few seconds longer so it can properly heat the material. You’d also want a physical support affixed to the arrow behind the pitch to keep it from sliding down the arrow. A think wood shaving cone shield stuck to the front just behind the arrow head to deflect forward air resistance temporarily. It just has to survive acceleration, once it’s flying it will stay lit if it makes it through that. Fun video.
Take that arrowhead with the small cage, try putting a hot coal in it, then quickly wrap much of the cage (not all of it necessarily, leaving some ventilation) in a strip of linen or twine like a cocoon. Could test having the linen dipped in pitch, oil, or nothing, counting on the coal igniting/reigniting the fabric once it has impacted the target, allowing for longer burn time and better spreading potential. Depending on whether the coal would cause it to burn mid flight, it could even deal with the issue of revealing the archers’ location.
This exactly. A hot coal transfers "fire" for a very long time and that has the potential to be transferred far distances. Their tests only showed lighting the surface of these materials on fire.
Coal is the answer. In flight the high speed air is similar to the blacksmith bellows. The coal becomes brittle and shatters on impact and sprays the hot coal pieces increasing chances of catching anything flammable
I'd honestly see fire arrows as a better defensive weapon than an offensive one. You're in a fixed location, so you have the same advantage as you would on the offensive side of a siege, with the added advantages of more ability to prepare defenses against your own weapons. Don't use it to attack a town or castle, use it from the castle or town walls to attack the siege camp. In addition, the issue of exposing the locations of your archers isn't really a problem, since they're going to be protected by crenellations or tower walls already.
This seems to be the most historically accurate explanation. Sieges often using large, heavy engines to breach the city (siege towers, battering rams, trebuchets, etc.), having something that could easily start a fire on those without needing to leave the city is a very reasonable strategic choice.
@Zetact Not at all. You're precluding those things were tinderboxes just waiting to be set ablaze by the nearest stray spark. An arrow with a little fire wouldn't do anything to those things, even dozens of arrows with a little fire. They literally had coatings and attendants to make sure that didn't happen as well.
The siege camp was very far away from the castle/town. The only thing to set on fire was the battering rams and siege towers, who where covered in animal hides soaked in water for this exact reason. There where sertan tactics for setting things on fire from a distance, bit it wasnt whit arrows.
@@someoneindeed There is at least the Siege of Amida where it's recorded that burning projectiles were used to frighten Shapur II's elephants and while Ammianus' language is a bit vague he says in the same statement that the siege towers were burnt. They also used scorpo to attack the joints but burning projectiles are mentioned as important in their siege defenses. He also points out that the engines were burnt in the middle of battle because Shapur II entered the fray after that. To be precise, he puts in order, "The joints of the seige weapons were shattered with the scorpio, the elephants were driven off with firebrands, and the siege engines were burnt. Shapur II, in response to this, entered into battle."
I’ve experimented in the past with this same topic. I found that leaving the arrow on fire longer before firing so that some embers can develop on the twine helps. The flame will go out but it can relight shortly after impact.
One variable may be the target. The Haybale is very soft, whereas in testing it looks like you were shooting at a tree. What about shooting at things like covered wagons or tents? It’s unlikely that those targets would snuff out the arrows. What about changing the vector of the arrows are shot at? Just some interesting things to consider. This is a very neat practical demonstration. Well done guys
Are you mindreading me? Two days ago i though "i wanna try out something with firearrows" but i cant do that where i live so shad needs to do it. And there it is....exactly what i wanted! Great content you guys are making!
A couple things. Try using Napalm(you can make it yourself). Soak the ends of the arrows in whatever fuel you are using for several days. Essential turn the arrow itself into the flammable material rather than anything you just put onto it. Use an especially porous and absorbent wood for your arrows.
You could also use some sort of white phosphorus combination to circumvent the air blowing it out but it would probably be a big safety hazard and the arrow is definitely going to be destroyed because white phosphorus doesn’t go out unless you completely suffocate it or it’s consumed.
Don't forget they are testing it to see if it was doable back in medieval times and to see if modern ways can do it but any modern way of doing it shows it was not doable back then. And i don't think they had about napalm few hundred years ago there is a theory that Greek fire might of been a special mix or kind of napalm but was not know as of today we not found any trace of it we might later on but for now it a no.
Pretty sure the key to keeping the tip alight would be any implement that protects the flaming material from the direct influence of the arrow's slipstream. First thing I thought when I've seen the censored arrow tip is that it's a plastic bottle cap, but it's probably something a bit bigger than that, and it wasn't available to an average medieval bowman. But if we're in that realm, trick candles exist, wonder if you can use that there somehow xD
Trick candles work by having magnesium shavings in the wick. When you blow out the candle the already hot magnesium is able to react with oxygen and release a ton of heat which relights the candle which stops oxygen from getting to the magnesium. A similar effect could be achieved via an oxidizer in the fire arrow such as saltpeter (KNO3) which could help keep the arrow burning for a bit while in flight.
@@LordOceanus magnesium shavings, burn hot but very quickly, used in survival for fire starting, ignites well from a ferocinium spark. Would be sparkly in flight.
@@owenbelezos8369 Thermite was not known science during the medieval period. Heck just getting enough powdered aluminum was verging on impossible much less the knowledge to combine it with Iron shavings and ignite with burning metal. Magnesium itself wasn't even discovered until 1755
Not gonna lie, that shot of all three shooting in sequence looked bloody cool XD Not quite there with practical fire arrows though, still too unreliable. Looking forward to see what else you got in store!
i always loved shad, but now i am even starting to warm up to the co hosts... good guys, love the energy of the trio.. props to shad for soldiering through the video, i believe it must be hard for someone with his illness.
i gotta say you adding in some other faces to your videos legitimately revitalized my enjoyment of your content. i love your guys chemistry as friends i can feel you guys hang out a lot and make a lot of fun together. please keep it up
I'm all in for a part 2! I think this could work if enough archers lit a single target, is it practical? No, totally agree with you guys, touches or siege engines, like a small ballista or catapult would work better, methinks. Great video guys!
For a historical plausible material try a mixture of sap based tar, sulphur, and aquaregia. Then pit the shaft or scrape groves in, and coat the shaft in rendered tallow-tar-flour-salt mixture. The hollow shape does work well Often for fire arrows you want them to fall onto the target, not stab it. Instead of a wad of goop try making an elongated pen shape of the main fuel cluster, wider friction area, lower air drag profile, larger flame area
This is one of the coolest videos I have seen on the channel. The 100 lb War Bow firing in slow-mo legit looks straight out of a video game. A beautiful stream of flame as if blessed with magic, keep up the amazing work!
You can tell that Tyranth was a bit uncomfortable with the fire thing. Obviously, he still enjoyed shooting fire arrows, bit he was very cautious about it. Didn't want to discuss the fuel method they'd come up with, was quick to rescue the arrows and put them out. Given the fires they had in Australia in 2020, I'm not surprised he'd be concerned.
Some thoughts Grooves in the wood to give your ignition source some better grip. A lump of goo is bad. Tension will help. Wick or rope, damp with an accelerant and then pitched. Add some metal wiring or wool(out if period but wiring isn't) in the mix but not directly exposed to the wind. And leave some air gaps in your winding to keep internal heat and cinders going. Inside loose and outside tight. A washer, preferably beveled infront of the wad may be beneficial to abuse of the coanda effect as opposed to... whatever that is. Or have it flare forward at the edge to prevent the coanda. Maybe add some grooves in pitch with the fletching for stability. And remember, this isn't a game of each arrow or even a tenth igniting something. These are terror weapons to be used in battery after all. If it can potentially work in thought people will be diverted. If any actually work you've rained havoc.
IIRC there were a few instances where fire arrows of various sorts were used historically. There were very primitive ones in the Venezuelan & Guatemalan oil basin where crude tar actually bubbles up through the ground naturally so the indigenous people would occasionally dip arrow shafts in the goop (crude tar oil is thicker than syrup) and light it. I don't recall reading about this one being used for anything practical; might have just been a signal flare or party trick thing. Another historic version I've read about from Asia was a blend of honey or tree sap, saltpeter (dried carnivore/reptile/avian urine) and charcoal/pitch/tar. The salt Peter kept the oxygen supply in place while it burned. IIRC these were used in Korea, China, and Japan as naval weapons. It connects to their use of gunpowder and fireworks too. The last one I recall reading about was a mix of bat guano, dung, and Bird droppings with ash and oil/sap to make a thick paste to roll the arrow tip in and light. The big thing with all of them is: sticky, with an oxidizer, and a slow burning wet fuel.
There are great recipes for fire arrows that used a gunpowder+pitch mix from the late medieval period that Kevin Hicks from thehistorysquad RUclips channel have covered. Great video!
This was wonderful. And I'm loving the new guys! You guys are just all so much fun to watch! I wish I could support you guys financially. Maybe someday!
In addition to the cage head you show here, there is another, similar design which is split into four prongs in a half cage shape, the four ends sharpened and pointed forward, which can have a bit of coal placed in it and a wad quickly jammed over the points to hold it in, then shot with ease from full draw. It has slightly less range and only moderate accuracy, but it was intended for ship to ship use so your target is pretty easy to hit. They were dangerous, but risky to use since fire can spread between ships easily, and usually you want to capture the ship. If I recall correctly, it was used against early corsairs and other raiders by merchant vessels since the goal is escape, not prize-taking or direct victory.
Tod's Workshop - real medieval fire arrows. They burn no matter what, under water, long-distance. A flammable compound covered in resin and the arrowhead detaches from the shaft so they can't remove the barbed arrowhead. I really suggest checking out his video.
🤔 With the people talking about the hollow arrowhead, I was wondering: what about an arrowhead that is quite long and has a cage for a bit of charcoal? Get the charcoal embered, then shoot the arrow. I would think that charcoal won’t go out at high speeds, only burn faster. Then you could have something oiled or pitched further back on the arrowhead which can catch fire once the arrow hits the target.
I think they talk something about the arrow weight. Your design might be challenging in that aspect. On the other hand, creating the design in mass to arm an army might be another challenge.
they exist , there is an arrow where around the pointy end the metal splits into three and spirals around for a bit. Not sure as the effectiveness of this arrow, I believe it was historical find, but it was made of mostly metal, so yeah.
@@stommata5520 For the purposes they’d be used for, I don’t think the weight would be an issue at all. Some Japanese arrowheads are comparatively massive, but still see use. All I’m suggesting is the historical design they showed, with a thin crossbar hoop to cup the coal inside. And charcoal is almost weightless, so there’s zero issues that the design would introduce that way. Also, I’d say that regardless of the type, specialty arrows would never be mass-produced because the intent of the specialty arrows is a very specific job. An army wouldn’t even need a hundred, maybe no more than 20 or so to catch important targets on fire. Targets as in infrastructure, caches, and storehouses, not soft targets like soldiers.
That 'preburn' before a working shot has to be about getting the mass of the arrow and all the pitch/sting stuff hot enough, there is alot of mass there that has to get heat soaked sufficiently so that the more volatile elements will have the energy to ignite again, along with potentially driving out a bit of moisture too.
Great video. It's fulfilling the destiny of this channel. Fire makes things combat so much more torrid and flamey. Flaming shields aren't so popular but it would be the easiest thing to do.
Would absolutely love to see a part 2 some day. With the custom arrows idea, i feel like if the head was shaped in such a way that it could act as a bit of a wind block for the fire, that might do the trick.
What I could see and get from this video: 1) The "Wind Shield" for the flame may be able to decrease the effect of air resistance against the flame; 2) The possibility for the "wind shield" to slide along the shaft with the flaming "charge" might very well favor the ability to set things on fire (preventing the arrow from smothering itself with whatever it penetrates into); 3) Steel Wool seems to have been among the components of the more modern arrow, which leads me to a certain concept for the "fuel mixture" that may be in line with Tyranth's and Nate's concept: mixing a fuel that is easy to ignite (acting as kindling) along with a substance that stores heat (high specific heat), and possibly one that helps dissipate it. Perhaps setting them up in a manner to prevent contact until needed, and possibly multiple stages of heat transference to achieve ignition.
Fire arrows were one of the earliest forms of weaponized gunpowder, being used from the 9th century onward + , fire arrows had a special head, made of twisted wires, that acted as a basket holding pitch and rag, which would be set alight.
Would be interesting to see if using some kind of hard cover for the fire, would make it not go out. For example, a cone/dome, a tube with a cone/dome tip, or a small ball, with some air space around the fire burning part, to keep the fire going. And they could be made from bark, from thin terracotta, from thin cement, or even from tar pitch with a few long holes (made with sticks going into the mold from the back of the arrow before it hardens, in order to get some air pockets, in which fire to hopefully stay ablaze and transfer the fire to the target being hit). And low-temperature terracotta/pottery firing would be more than enough to make the wind-shields for the fire arrows.
There is so much childlike excitement for this project. You guys are truly enjoying finding ways to make all of these concepts functional. All of your videos are interesting to watch but I do like seeing how much fun you have with the functional fandom ones.
Hey Shad, I think there is a much simpler way to make fire arrows functional, and it requires two things: First, the initial source of the fire needs to be able to burn without oxygen and instead by non-combustion chemical processes, and second, there needs to be a slight delay between firing the arrow and when the main fuel source of the arrow is ignited, enough for the arrow to land. My point? Add a firework fuse along the shaft of the arrow that leads to a blob of pitch and twine. Fuses were definitely around since the 10th-12th century-ish, so I do believe this would be accurate if used properly. Light the fuse, fire the arrow, and after it lands it’ll ignite the main fuel source.
My first thought is using the wicks from joke/trick birthday cake candles 😆 I would try something like lacquered eggshells filled with an ignition fluid like pitch or homemade napalm affixed to the arrowhead, along with the "secret" recipe. Ninja egg bomb arrows 😂
Here's an idea for future videos. Metal shavings in the rope/pitch, and allow the fire to heat it up for a bit. The fire may go out when the arrow is launched, but maybe the residual heat of the metal shavings will light it back on after impact. As for success chance. I don't think this matters too much since with an army of archers, even just a 10% success would still result in some fire arrows working as intended.
Yeah, I think the key is to use heat instead of fire. Heat will linger much longer than a flame. If you heat the metal arrow tip to 1000°C before shooting, the temperature might have dropped to 300 when it reaches the target, but that's still enough to set a lot of materials on fire. So all you would need for fire arrows are large enough iron tips. (you'ld need iron to get them hot enough before they start melting) and something to make them very hot. (normal fire wouldn't do)
Viking burials at sea were done by shooting a volley of fire arrows from the shoreline to then burn the boat lined with flammable material. Generally the arrows were wrapped in a mix of high wicking material like hesian, cotton, wool, and ties with a lot of woven string. The fuel used was a mix of tar, and rudimentary fuel's. I know because I was part of a Viking reenactment group that did a burial at sea.
You know, channels like epicfantasy and Phoenix Forge have made fire arrowheads before. Arrowheads that look like sharpened cages, to hold the flammable material
I love your new hair shad! It's Awesome! Really on point. Hope you've been getting lots of compliments, because people often just keep their thoughts to themselves whether good or bad.
Definitely need to revisit this topic but I would highly recommend allowing the arrows to burn For about a minute to a minute and a 1/2 to allow more of the actual material to start burning and not just the liquid fuel
Very late to the topic, but the thing with "setting roofs on fire" in my opinion isn't penetrating, but rather having arrows falling onto the roof (ideally several, so that one or two that went out don't matter). That would be helped with the "caged arrowheads" you showed, because they don't go into thatch (much). There are also historical depictions of fire arrows that had a hollow tip where you could put hot metal pieces and/or other fuel. In other news, there are historical accounts of fire arrows being used, e.g. Ammianus Marcellinus. Apparently they used iron dust mixed with saltpeter to treat the arrows, then wrapped them in waxed or oiled cloth and then drenched in liquid sulfur. That does sound like it may stay lit with all the air in the world (and/or relight itself upon impact). With sulfur and saltpeter and a wooden shaft, it could also make a mixture similar to gunpowder, which should help. I've also read that the mixture both sticks to the arrow, but also makes the arrow itself very sticky, which would then help with setting targets alight. The combination with a catapult, that shoots vessels of oil or pitch, would be pretty devastating because you can cover a building or a part of an enemy army in fuel and then set it alight.
Shad: "I've been eating Hello Fresh since long before anybody paid me to do it. I didn't do it to be cool, didn't do it to make a statement, I just liked it."
Just an idea: what about just heating the arrow heads until they glow before firing? If you make them glow white hot before shooting, then maybe the cooling effect of the air wouldn't be enough to cool them down completely so as they hit the straw the residual heat of the arrowhead might be enough to set fire to the straw?
From one author to another, from a lover of History and fiction to a kindred soul, I wish you well always, dear master Shad.
Godly donator
Based donater
Good job man, angel investor.
Chad philanthropist
I'm sure Shad will be very grateful for this godly donation❤👏
I physically can't do this kind of stuff due to disability, and watching you guys do it means a lot to me. Plus, you guys are just awesome!
If you don’t mind me asking, what is your disability?
@@lalo2papi775 I have SMA type 1. Doctors have been telling to get ready to die since I was 20... I'm 44.
So happy for you! Keep going ☺️
@@hanzquejano7112 Still got a heart full of fire! They actually tried killin' me when I came down with COVID. But they missed. ;)
@@FerreusDeus man thats got to be stressful, just look to god and walk with jesus and the fear of passing away wont be a fear anymore.
There are plenty of things you could try if you do this again, in terms of the arrowheads. You could try that open one, and make it hold pitch (or coal as someone else suggested). You could also try to come up with your own designs for arrowheads, maybe like some kind of cone shape that protects the material from the the wind? Hell if it's possible you can see what happens if you shoot a red hot arrowhead.
1000° arrow challenge
I think shooting red hot arrows has the most chance of working.
You'ld need some logistics to get it hot enough (so not simple fire) without burning the wood of the arrow.
I mean, making an arrowhead with a wind protector that also has a functioning stem is a challenge for any blacksmith, and to make them on a massive scale is just... I don't see it. A red hot arrow head is much more feasible, though considering you'd need to hold it in high heat for a long time, I'm not sure if the wooden shaft would survive such heat treatment. I think the cage arrowhead has the most chance of working from a historical perspective. It's relatively easy to make, prevents the problem of the burning material just falling apart, and it could potentially prevent the fire, or at least the embers, from going out. Especially if you use the twisted cage design, since the twists would disrupt the airflow enough to keep some of the lit parts from being snuffed out. I think. I wanna see it.
@@B3RyL Yeah, I think the thing to do with the cage arrow is to take oil-soaked twine and wrap it around and through the cage. This could probably be done in such a way that it forms a wind shield that keeps a bit of pitch in the center smoldering.
What if the fuel, ie, the twine or whatever ran the whole length of the arrow.
The ‘pitched arrow’ made me laugh. Thank you, Shad.
Shad's a dad.
Same!
ITS *FUNNY* !
I've been watching this channel since it was just Shad sitting in a chair. Now, the amount of growth and production quality is amazing. Shad and the boys have elevated this channel while keeping it's original spirit. I love the new direction and hosts. Keep up the great work!
I always love it when they do real world application stuff outdoors.
All three of you stancing up and then firing the arrows was AWESOME!
I love the comment about giving away the location of the archers, because that's actually addressed in Ranger's Apprentice! The way John Flanagan writes it, they have the archer atop a nearby cliff shooting at a wooden boat trying to set it alight as a distraction. He expressly mentions that as soon as he starts shooting and things start going up in flames, they're going to be working on borrowed time to finish the operation. He even gets caught later in his escape because there are too many pursuers! I've always loved the attention to realism and detail in the series
Oh good memories, loved that series. Lots of good knowledge in there, wish I remembered more
I enjoyed that series a lot when I read it
@@vocassen I know! It was an awesome story with plenty of good real-world knowledge sprinkled throughout! For example, most of the stealth techniques actually work, such as just staying still even when you think you've been caught. I used the exact same tactic against my friends whenever we played hide-n-seek at night. It worked something like 80% of the time. I specifically remember when two of the seekers were scanning an area I was in with flashlights. I had nowhere else to hide, so I just dropped to the ground and stayed stock-still. They passed right on by me, and it felt amazing.
@@Jesse_IDG Brotherband is so damn good. All the naval terminology and the realism there, makes me wish my verse would have large scale naval battles.
Yeah, I know the scene you’re discussing from the Royal Ranger. There are definitely some fantasy elements in that series, but many things have a real world basis.
Hot coals. All the technology you need for fire arrows.
(An archer would take a coal from a brazier with a gloved hand, put it into the special arrow you showed and shoot it. And unlike open flames, coals actually benefit from the incoming air flow.)
Coals don't last long and even when still hot may not ignite something due to all the ash.
@@bigguy7353 which is why a group of archers fire the arrows at a target, probably with several volleys
Literally though that as I saw that arrow
get this comment to the top so we can have Shad shoot arrows with coals tied to them
Imagine this but switch the bow with a trebuchet and the arrow with a ball of flaming straw, coals, tar and porkskin
Hey Shad and team, why not cover 30% of the arrow in a thin coat of pitch, cover that with linen and twine doused in a flammable oil, so it can reignite or stay alight. Just a suggestion. But yes, historical pitch and a custom arrow head sounds like a great idea. Please revisit this. I am a nerd of both historical and fantasy tropes. Also, try it with a historical crossbow and bolt, maybe it will work better.
If they do revisit, they might want to try making and using a slow-match to light the arrows. Something like a slow-match may also be a good bet for making a wind-resistant fire arrow, but at the very least one could be held in the bow hand such that the incendiary can be ignited by a lone archer either when the arrow reaches full-draw or prior to nocking.
On the idea of using a slow-match on the arrow itself as the incendiary, another possibility is to use something similar to a trench lighter so that it merely smolders while being drawn (maybe even while still in the quiver, those things can smolder for a _long_ time) and then fully ignite just from being launched normally.
@GremlinSciences I am very much on board with this, I never even considered slow matches or long fuses, but hear me out. Perhaps a match that lights the arrow upon impact. Why worry about keeping the arrow aflame when it can ignite upon sticking into its intended target and use an arrowhead that is nearly impossible to remove.
Modern version homemade napalm using petrol and styrofoam that has thickened into gel and cut up and stuck on top
Custom cone shaped arrowhead that shelters the fuel from the wind + the layers mention above (maybe wax to slow the burn?) sounds plausible
Yeah, the custome arrowhead is a good idea. Because it only really works as a pre-planned strategy to begin with. So an army trying to do it could have spent the time and money in making arrows spefic for the purpose.
Shadiversity + fire= good times for all!
We do this every year, we have an apocalypse bow challenge. Where you have to build a working bow and arrow out of every day scrap. The secret is steel wool. Works like a charm for flame arrows love from Canada 🇨🇦!
The slow-mo fire lingering in the air after the arrow was shot looks awesome
The arrow leaves the bow and the fire decides to just stay.
Arrow: Bye:D
Fire: Where the hell did you go? Don't leave me!:(
The intro was everything.
And now after almost a year... With the "I pitched the pitch arrow!!!... Get it?!" I finally can say "Oh yeah, it's obvious Shad and Jazza are brothers..."
Edit: the whole video was spectacular! I loved when all three of you are during together. Just love it. Also appreciate you were not quick to share the details of how you made these. Respect.
If you needed something to help you figure that out, then it's not obvious, it would be the antithesis of obvious.
The problem with the pitch arrows is these guys are not using dried crickets as the fuel.
The "not sharing the details of how the arrows are made" is almost certainly for the best, yes.
@@bodyrumuae2914 they look pretty different, it was a big revelation for me realising they're related
I think a big factor is volley firing, which they’re most commonly depicted doing
Tod at Tod’s workshop isn’t a coward, so he gave ingredients and directions for making his fire arrows :-)
It’s not about cowardice, he’s just got experience with pyrotechnics and did better historical research to recreate a more authentic recreation
Shad, your channel has to be one of the absolute coolest channels in all of RUclips. I've learned so much and remain entertained throughout all of your videos. You and your crew are excellent presenters as well. I wonder if an entity like The History Channel would be interested in bringing your channel to television. It's captivating stuff, really
The Shadiversity crew continues to produce excellent content.
If they produced excellent content they wouldn't show guys firing the bow in a close up shot so there's no context.
They have a massive subscriber base and they can't invest in a slo mo camera and various angles?
You geek will eat up any slop. This video was garbage.
For the future flame arrow video. Keep up the great work Knights!
I'd love to see Shadiversity revisit this. there was also one kind of fire arrows during late medieval times, saltpeter sap fire arrows, pretty much sugar rockets. and also specialized heads that would hold coal. this kind of flying while on fire is more like Hollywood accurate
This video is incorrect you actually just enchant the bow with flame 🙄
or if your playing Minecraft shoot the arrow through lava or just enchant the bow with fire aspect
😂
@Reece Emms uhu, acckhually, itsch called flame. Like, know your minecwlaft entschantmetsch a littwle better.
@@kommaripangari oh sorry, got them confused, Fire Aspect is for the sword
And wear oven gloves.
It's nice to see you all so excited, keep doing what you love!
It's not much, but please keep up the good work. You guys deserve more recognition for the dedication you make and the expenses on products you use. Awesome video, as always.
Bom trabalho
Based
"Pitched arrow" lol obviously this kind of humor runs in the family because i know Jazza would love this kind of joke... good one lmao
i feel like the three of you really found a dynamic in your videos that is very entertaining and informative. i do not longer have the idea you are fighting with each other but together for the topic to get to the bottom of a subject.
You would probably had a lot of fun if you explore pre-columbian warfare, Shad. Just for an example, the Tupi warriors were well know for this:
-Flaming arrows made with cotton and manatee grease.
-Shields and helms made of turtle shells.
-Bombs made of wasp nests.
-They were capable of using roasted pepper in order to create a toxic cloud, and force enemies to flee their hideouts inside palisade walls.
-The Tupi "siege tactics" were so effective that their tradtional enemies, the Gê tribes, were forced to construct "subterranean houses", less vulnerable to fire and toxic clouds of pepper.
-A french explorer who visited Brazil in 1530 described that "Even the English would be surprised after seeing the arrow clouds created by the native archers".
If they talked more about these things, i bet more people in Brazil would be more interested in learning our own History.
I think it is a clay pot filled with hot pepper grenade
@@malucoblz588 “be the change you want to see in the world”
Brasil tem muito a ser explorado pelos canais de história, infelizmente geralmente ficam presos nas culturas japonesas e européias
Turtle shells are not strong enough to be made into shields so I imagine they had a strong glue and glued 5 layers together. It would still be pretty light weight, and sufficient for stopping crossbows at that point.
I know of some historical uses of fire arrows recorded on both sides of the world. English archers at the siege of Harfleur managed to partially destroy one of the towers with fire arrows, and Shawnee archers at the siege of Boonesborough may have also used them to catch the roofs of the houses inside the fort on fire (this was mainly effective because it distracted the defenders from manning the walls to put out the fires, like Shad and the guys mentioned).
Can you name the exact source for the siege of Harfleur, please? I can't find them online.
By the time of the siege of Harfleur gunpowder was in use in Europe, which was a vital ingredient in fire arrows.
I think that the reason why it worked better in the testing before was that you had slightly stronger and stable wind while shooting downwind. You were shooting downwind in the video, but in the position with the bow drawn, aiming, you can see the flame jiggle around and even go straight up for a moment as the wind is gusting and dying out completely. Which a) makes sense b) makes use of fire arrows more interesting and dependent on weather/position of the shooter to the wind. Great video once again, I shall finally join the Patreon. (I should start working on my procrastination skills xd)
As you said, there are lots of variables to take into consideration for a fire arrow to work: air humidity, the type of target, target moisture, wind, fuel composition and mixture etc. It would be fun to see more tests with different types of arrows and fuel mixtures in the future, as long as it can be safely performed and Shad doesn't start an accidental wildfire.
I think a lot of historical recipes for fire arrows used low-grade gunpowder as the main incendiary agent. Here is a recipe from 11th century China: Behind the arrow head wrap up some gunpowder with two or three layers of soft paper, and bind it to the arrow shaft in a lump shaped like a pomegranate. Cover it with a piece of hemp cloth tightly tied, and sealed fast with molten pine resin. Light the fuse and then shoot it off from a bow.
It did look like alot of fun. Cool video guys. Thank you for the fun and showing the practicality of the concept.
I love how shad’s fake angry yell is the exact same as jazza’s. The brotherly similarities don’t come out often, but when they do it’s hilarious😂
The more they say "We're not telling you how" makes me want to know even more.
Gasoline
Hmm, a gel that stays lit and burns anything it touches. I wonder if the modern military explored this idea...napalm
Probably gasoline and styrofoam.
it looked like a gel/glue with some lint on it to make it start burning.
probably gasoline or even kerosene mixed with gelatin to make it dry and stick to the arrow.
napalm makes black smoke, so I don't think it's napalm. (you can make a proto-napalm by dissolving Styrofoam in acid, making extremely bad fumes, and leaving a black, sticky, and heavily flammable mess behind.)
JörgSprave had a very simple working fire arrow design in one of his videos.
I think it was sulfur and ironwool. When lit it got hot enough to reignite after being shot at target.
The shots of the flaming arrows leaving the bows look so cool
No one
Shadiversity: TO THE SHADLANDS! batman transition
Had me dieing
If you do second try, perhaps test just blunt metal arrow head that gets heated on coals to glowing red/white. Split second flight time isn't going to do anything to the heat but burying 1000c+ pieces of metal in anything that burns is going to smolder and potentially catch fire. You'll probably need 5~10 cm length of metal for it to glow white at end without burning the arrow shaft before it's fired though.
It is important to let it burn for a few seconds longer so it can properly heat the material. You’d also want a physical support affixed to the arrow behind the pitch to keep it from sliding down the arrow. A think wood shaving cone shield stuck to the front just behind the arrow head to deflect forward air resistance temporarily. It just has to survive acceleration, once it’s flying it will stay lit if it makes it through that. Fun video.
Take that arrowhead with the small cage, try putting a hot coal in it, then quickly wrap much of the cage (not all of it necessarily, leaving some ventilation) in a strip of linen or twine like a cocoon. Could test having the linen dipped in pitch, oil, or nothing, counting on the coal igniting/reigniting the fabric once it has impacted the target, allowing for longer burn time and better spreading potential. Depending on whether the coal would cause it to burn mid flight, it could even deal with the issue of revealing the archers’ location.
The cage wrapped in linen and filled with black powder and using a fuse might work as well
This exactly. A hot coal transfers "fire" for a very long time and that has the potential to be transferred far distances. Their tests only showed lighting the surface of these materials on fire.
Coal is the answer. In flight the high speed air is similar to the blacksmith bellows. The coal becomes brittle and shatters on impact and sprays the hot coal pieces increasing chances of catching anything flammable
I'd honestly see fire arrows as a better defensive weapon than an offensive one. You're in a fixed location, so you have the same advantage as you would on the offensive side of a siege, with the added advantages of more ability to prepare defenses against your own weapons. Don't use it to attack a town or castle, use it from the castle or town walls to attack the siege camp. In addition, the issue of exposing the locations of your archers isn't really a problem, since they're going to be protected by crenellations or tower walls already.
This seems to be the most historically accurate explanation. Sieges often using large, heavy engines to breach the city (siege towers, battering rams, trebuchets, etc.), having something that could easily start a fire on those without needing to leave the city is a very reasonable strategic choice.
@Zetact Not at all. You're precluding those things were tinderboxes just waiting to be set ablaze by the nearest stray spark. An arrow with a little fire wouldn't do anything to those things, even dozens of arrows with a little fire. They literally had coatings and attendants to make sure that didn't happen as well.
@@Zetact_well it's very unlikely you could set fire to the siege equipment and I don't think it was historically done
The siege camp was very far away from the castle/town.
The only thing to set on fire was the battering rams and siege towers, who where covered in animal hides soaked in water for this exact reason.
There where sertan tactics for setting things on fire from a distance, bit it wasnt whit arrows.
@@someoneindeed There is at least the Siege of Amida where it's recorded that burning projectiles were used to frighten Shapur II's elephants and while Ammianus' language is a bit vague he says in the same statement that the siege towers were burnt. They also used scorpo to attack the joints but burning projectiles are mentioned as important in their siege defenses. He also points out that the engines were burnt in the middle of battle because Shapur II entered the fray after that. To be precise, he puts in order, "The joints of the seige weapons were shattered with the scorpio, the elephants were driven off with firebrands, and the siege engines were burnt. Shapur II, in response to this, entered into battle."
It’s a simple recipe honestly. Add fire to anything for instant awesomeness.
Keep up the great work! Love the energy y’all have!
I’ve experimented in the past with this same topic. I found that leaving the arrow on fire longer before firing so that some embers can develop on the twine helps. The flame will go out but it can relight shortly after impact.
Id love a revist of this. You guys are my favorite historical/educational RUclips channel.
Shad, satisfying the inner pyro in us all
Thank you
One variable may be the target. The Haybale is very soft, whereas in testing it looks like you were shooting at a tree. What about shooting at things like covered wagons or tents? It’s unlikely that those targets would snuff out the arrows. What about changing the vector of the arrows are shot at? Just some interesting things to consider. This is a very neat practical demonstration. Well done guys
Are you mindreading me? Two days ago i though "i wanna try out something with firearrows" but i cant do that where i live so shad needs to do it.
And there it is....exactly what i wanted! Great content you guys are making!
A couple things. Try using Napalm(you can make it yourself). Soak the ends of the arrows in whatever fuel you are using for several days. Essential turn the arrow itself into the flammable material rather than anything you just put onto it. Use an especially porous and absorbent wood for your arrows.
I'm curious as to whether the nondescript mixture was napalm or not
You could also use some sort of white phosphorus combination to circumvent the air blowing it out but it would probably be a big safety hazard and the arrow is definitely going to be destroyed because white phosphorus doesn’t go out unless you completely suffocate it or it’s consumed.
@@focusedabyss8164it would’ve been very cheap since it is allegedly just styrofoam and gasoline or so I’ve heard
Don't forget they are testing it to see if it was doable back in medieval times and to see if modern ways can do it but any modern way of doing it shows it was not doable back then. And i don't think they had about napalm few hundred years ago there is a theory that Greek fire might of been a special mix or kind of napalm but was not know as of today we not found any trace of it we might later on but for now it a no.
8:45 those are really beautiful forks, spoons, and knives!
Certified Lindybeige moment...
*FIRE ARROWS!!!!!*
Lindy is dumb,there are several videos of people lighting bon fires with flaming arrows.
Shocked I needed to actually scroll to find someone say this!
@@churchboy4609 Had a pin but lost it when I edited the comments :(
Pretty sure the key to keeping the tip alight would be any implement that protects the flaming material from the direct influence of the arrow's slipstream. First thing I thought when I've seen the censored arrow tip is that it's a plastic bottle cap, but it's probably something a bit bigger than that, and it wasn't available to an average medieval bowman.
But if we're in that realm, trick candles exist, wonder if you can use that there somehow xD
Trick candles work by having magnesium shavings in the wick. When you blow out the candle the already hot magnesium is able to react with oxygen and release a ton of heat which relights the candle which stops oxygen from getting to the magnesium. A similar effect could be achieved via an oxidizer in the fire arrow such as saltpeter (KNO3) which could help keep the arrow burning for a bit while in flight.
@@LordOceanus or mixing thermite with the fuel [thermite can keep burning underwater]
Trick candles, that potassium nitrate I think, used in fuses?
@@LordOceanus magnesium shavings, burn hot but very quickly, used in survival for fire starting, ignites well from a ferocinium spark. Would be sparkly in flight.
@@owenbelezos8369 Thermite was not known science during the medieval period. Heck just getting enough powdered aluminum was verging on impossible much less the knowledge to combine it with Iron shavings and ignite with burning metal. Magnesium itself wasn't even discovered until 1755
Not gonna lie, that shot of all three shooting in sequence looked bloody cool XD
Not quite there with practical fire arrows though, still too unreliable. Looking forward to see what else you got in store!
i always loved shad, but now i am even starting to warm up to the co hosts... good guys, love the energy of the trio..
props to shad for soldiering through the video, i believe it must be hard for someone with his illness.
i gotta say you adding in some other faces to your videos legitimately revitalized my enjoyment of your content. i love your guys chemistry as friends i can feel you guys hang out a lot and make a lot of fun together. please keep it up
This definitely is feeling like a new age of the channel and I'm loving the direction it's going in
Honestly at first I wasn’t sure, but I’m starting to appreciate the shad&friends format
I'm all in for a part 2! I think this could work if enough archers lit a single target, is it practical? No, totally agree with you guys, touches or siege engines, like a small ballista or catapult would work better, methinks. Great video guys!
For a historical plausible material try a mixture of sap based tar, sulphur, and aquaregia. Then pit the shaft or scrape groves in, and coat the shaft in rendered tallow-tar-flour-salt mixture.
The hollow shape does work well
Often for fire arrows you want them to fall onto the target, not stab it.
Instead of a wad of goop try making an elongated pen shape of the main fuel cluster, wider friction area, lower air drag profile, larger flame area
Thanks! Love the content y’all. End of the month is tight for me, I’ll join the channel the beginning of May!
This is one of the coolest videos I have seen on the channel. The 100 lb War Bow firing in slow-mo legit looks straight out of a video game. A beautiful stream of flame as if blessed with magic, keep up the amazing work!
Interesting to see Australian square bales. American small square bakes typically have two strings.
It's fun to see Shad being goofy and Tyranth being the parent.
You can tell that Tyranth was a bit uncomfortable with the fire thing. Obviously, he still enjoyed shooting fire arrows, bit he was very cautious about it. Didn't want to discuss the fuel method they'd come up with, was quick to rescue the arrows and put them out. Given the fires they had in Australia in 2020, I'm not surprised he'd be concerned.
Some thoughts
Grooves in the wood to give your ignition source some better grip.
A lump of goo is bad. Tension will help. Wick or rope, damp with an accelerant and then pitched. Add some metal wiring or wool(out if period but wiring isn't) in the mix but not directly exposed to the wind. And leave some air gaps in your winding to keep internal heat and cinders going. Inside loose and outside tight.
A washer, preferably beveled infront of the wad may be beneficial to abuse of the coanda effect as opposed to... whatever that is. Or have it flare forward at the edge to prevent the coanda. Maybe add some grooves in pitch with the fletching for stability.
And remember, this isn't a game of each arrow or even a tenth igniting something. These are terror weapons to be used in battery after all. If it can potentially work in thought people will be diverted. If any actually work you've rained havoc.
IIRC there were a few instances where fire arrows of various sorts were used historically.
There were very primitive ones in the Venezuelan & Guatemalan oil basin where crude tar actually bubbles up through the ground naturally so the indigenous people would occasionally dip arrow shafts in the goop (crude tar oil is thicker than syrup) and light it. I don't recall reading about this one being used for anything practical; might have just been a signal flare or party trick thing.
Another historic version I've read about from Asia was a blend of honey or tree sap, saltpeter (dried carnivore/reptile/avian urine) and charcoal/pitch/tar. The salt Peter kept the oxygen supply in place while it burned. IIRC these were used in Korea, China, and Japan as naval weapons. It connects to their use of gunpowder and fireworks too.
The last one I recall reading about was a mix of bat guano, dung, and Bird droppings with ash and oil/sap to make a thick paste to roll the arrow tip in and light.
The big thing with all of them is: sticky, with an oxidizer, and a slow burning wet fuel.
There are great recipes for fire arrows that used a gunpowder+pitch mix from the late medieval period that Kevin Hicks from thehistorysquad RUclips channel have covered.
Great video!
This was wonderful. And I'm loving the new guys! You guys are just all so much fun to watch! I wish I could support you guys financially. Maybe someday!
The archery videos are always fun. Good job guys!
Indeed - though I must profess I'm actually curious as to where he gets his longbow from. I'd love a historical longbow.
In addition to the cage head you show here, there is another, similar design which is split into four prongs in a half cage shape, the four ends sharpened and pointed forward, which can have a bit of coal placed in it and a wad quickly jammed over the points to hold it in, then shot with ease from full draw. It has slightly less range and only moderate accuracy, but it was intended for ship to ship use so your target is pretty easy to hit. They were dangerous, but risky to use since fire can spread between ships easily, and usually you want to capture the ship. If I recall correctly, it was used against early corsairs and other raiders by merchant vessels since the goal is escape, not prize-taking or direct victory.
Tod's Workshop - real medieval fire arrows. They burn no matter what, under water, long-distance. A flammable compound covered in resin and the arrowhead detaches from the shaft so they can't remove the barbed arrowhead. I really suggest checking out his video.
I'm glad you got a sponsor for the video. Hello Fresh standing strong 😆
I'd love to see you guys revisit the topic. Custom arrowheads 😍
🤔 With the people talking about the hollow arrowhead, I was wondering: what about an arrowhead that is quite long and has a cage for a bit of charcoal? Get the charcoal embered, then shoot the arrow. I would think that charcoal won’t go out at high speeds, only burn faster. Then you could have something oiled or pitched further back on the arrowhead which can catch fire once the arrow hits the target.
I think they talk something about the arrow weight. Your design might be challenging in that aspect. On the other hand, creating the design in mass to arm an army might be another challenge.
@@stommata5520
doesn't matter if fireing down from a castle wall though
they exist , there is an arrow where around the pointy end the metal splits into three and spirals around for a bit. Not sure as the effectiveness of this arrow, I believe it was historical find, but it was made of mostly metal, so yeah.
@@stommata5520
For the purposes they’d be used for, I don’t think the weight would be an issue at all.
Some Japanese arrowheads are comparatively massive, but still see use. All I’m suggesting is the historical design they showed, with a thin crossbar hoop to cup the coal inside. And charcoal is almost weightless, so there’s zero issues that the design would introduce that way.
Also, I’d say that regardless of the type, specialty arrows would never be mass-produced because the intent of the specialty arrows is a very specific job. An army wouldn’t even need a hundred, maybe no more than 20 or so to catch important targets on fire. Targets as in infrastructure, caches, and storehouses, not soft targets like soldiers.
Shad, I hope you take a BOW after that incredible and ARROWising performance!
😔😮💨😅
The play with "bow" makes total sense...... what you did with "arrow" makes no f'ing sense on Bizarro World.
@@bigguy7353 Yeah, I'm still trying to figure out what "ARROWising" is supposed to mean.
@@Eidolon1andOnly arouse my friends. Arousing
@@Eidolon1andOnly arousing performance
23:53 The cool cinematic slow mo with epic music just for the second arrow to miss completely was hilarious
Had to figure this out 10 years ago for a crossbow. Ended on grinding sparklers and applying it
No joking; my favorite part of shadiversity videos is seeing all the period garb, with Nike or converse shoes. 😂 I love it
That 'preburn' before a working shot has to be about getting the mass of the arrow and all the pitch/sting stuff hot enough, there is alot of mass there that has to get heat soaked sufficiently so that the more volatile elements will have the energy to ignite again, along with potentially driving out a bit of moisture too.
You could see the mix was wrapped in steel wool. Im guessing they needed that to get hot enough
Great video. It's fulfilling the destiny of this channel.
Fire makes things combat so much more torrid and flamey. Flaming shields aren't so popular but it would be the easiest thing to do.
Great video concept. Fire arrows are far too prevalent in movies for the impracticality of it. Glad you took on the subject. Great job.
This video went exactly how I expected it would, and I loved every moment of it!
Would absolutely love to see a part 2 some day. With the custom arrows idea, i feel like if the head was shaped in such a way that it could act as a bit of a wind block for the fire, that might do the trick.
I like these archery videos more than I expected. I wish your videos would get more love from RUclips.
Can Shadiveristy review the practicality of Bionicle weapons?
Yes, I need to know the combat effectiveness of giant plastic ball launchers
Okay, this was amazing! Loved that slowmo shot with the one that stayed lit. I wish I could do this stuff! 😍😍
What I could see and get from this video:
1) The "Wind Shield" for the flame may be able to decrease the effect of air resistance against the flame;
2) The possibility for the "wind shield" to slide along the shaft with the flaming "charge" might very well favor the ability to set things on fire (preventing the arrow from smothering itself with whatever it penetrates into);
3) Steel Wool seems to have been among the components of the more modern arrow, which leads me to a certain concept for the "fuel mixture" that may be in line with Tyranth's and Nate's concept: mixing a fuel that is easy to ignite (acting as kindling) along with a substance that stores heat (high specific heat), and possibly one that helps dissipate it. Perhaps setting them up in a manner to prevent contact until needed, and possibly multiple stages of heat transference to achieve ignition.
Fire arrows were one of the earliest forms of weaponized gunpowder, being used from the 9th century onward + , fire arrows had a special head, made of twisted wires, that acted as a basket holding pitch and rag, which would be set alight.
Loving the vid, Shad and crew! Keep up the good work!
Would be interesting to see if using some kind of hard cover for the fire, would make it not go out. For example, a cone/dome, a tube with a cone/dome tip, or a small ball, with some air space around the fire burning part, to keep the fire going. And they could be made from bark, from thin terracotta, from thin cement, or even from tar pitch with a few long holes (made with sticks going into the mold from the back of the arrow before it hardens, in order to get some air pockets, in which fire to hopefully stay ablaze and transfer the fire to the target being hit). And low-temperature terracotta/pottery firing would be more than enough to make the wind-shields for the fire arrows.
There is so much childlike excitement for this project. You guys are truly enjoying finding ways to make all of these concepts functional. All of your videos are interesting to watch but I do like seeing how much fun you have with the functional fandom ones.
Hey Shad, I think there is a much simpler way to make fire arrows functional, and it requires two things:
First, the initial source of the fire needs to be able to burn without oxygen and instead by non-combustion chemical processes, and second, there needs to be a slight delay between firing the arrow and when the main fuel source of the arrow is ignited, enough for the arrow to land.
My point? Add a firework fuse along the shaft of the arrow that leads to a blob of pitch and twine. Fuses were definitely around since the 10th-12th century-ish, so I do believe this would be accurate if used properly. Light the fuse, fire the arrow, and after it lands it’ll ignite the main fuel source.
My first thought is using the wicks from joke/trick birthday cake candles 😆
I would try something like lacquered eggshells filled with an ignition fluid like pitch or homemade napalm affixed to the arrowhead, along with the "secret" recipe. Ninja egg bomb arrows 😂
With the river in background I waited for the corpse in the boat to appear.
Here's an idea for future videos. Metal shavings in the rope/pitch, and allow the fire to heat it up for a bit. The fire may go out when the arrow is launched, but maybe the residual heat of the metal shavings will light it back on after impact.
As for success chance. I don't think this matters too much since with an army of archers, even just a 10% success would still result in some fire arrows working as intended.
Yeah, I think the key is to use heat instead of fire.
Heat will linger much longer than a flame.
If you heat the metal arrow tip to 1000°C before shooting, the temperature might have dropped to 300 when it reaches the target, but that's still enough to set a lot of materials on fire.
So all you would need for fire arrows are large enough iron tips. (you'ld need iron to get them hot enough before they start melting) and something to make them very hot. (normal fire wouldn't do)
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Viking burials at sea were done by shooting a volley of fire arrows from the shoreline to then burn the boat lined with flammable material. Generally the arrows were wrapped in a mix of high wicking material like hesian, cotton, wool, and ties with a lot of woven string. The fuel used was a mix of tar, and rudimentary fuel's. I know because I was part of a Viking reenactment group that did a burial at sea.
You know, channels like epicfantasy and Phoenix Forge have made fire arrowheads before. Arrowheads that look like sharpened cages, to hold the flammable material
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Definitely need to revisit this topic but I would highly recommend allowing the arrows to burn For about a minute to a minute and a 1/2 to allow more of the actual material to start burning and not just the liquid fuel
Very late to the topic, but the thing with "setting roofs on fire" in my opinion isn't penetrating, but rather having arrows falling onto the roof (ideally several, so that one or two that went out don't matter). That would be helped with the "caged arrowheads" you showed, because they don't go into thatch (much). There are also historical depictions of fire arrows that had a hollow tip where you could put hot metal pieces and/or other fuel.
In other news, there are historical accounts of fire arrows being used, e.g. Ammianus Marcellinus. Apparently they used iron dust mixed with saltpeter to treat the arrows, then wrapped them in waxed or oiled cloth and then drenched in liquid sulfur.
That does sound like it may stay lit with all the air in the world (and/or relight itself upon impact). With sulfur and saltpeter and a wooden shaft, it could also make a mixture similar to gunpowder, which should help.
I've also read that the mixture both sticks to the arrow, but also makes the arrow itself very sticky, which would then help with setting targets alight.
The combination with a catapult, that shoots vessels of oil or pitch, would be pretty devastating because you can cover a building or a part of an enemy army in fuel and then set it alight.
Fire arrows now added to Shads' machicolation based defensive strategies.
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Just an idea: what about just heating the arrow heads until they glow before firing?
If you make them glow white hot before shooting, then maybe the cooling effect of the air wouldn't be enough to cool them down completely so as they hit the straw the residual heat of the arrowhead might be enough to set fire to the straw?
The arrowheads may be hot but they’re not going to burst into flame midair or after being buried inside straw or flesh.
@@abcdefghij337 No, but if they retain enough heat after striking the target, they might set fire to the target.
This is such a cool video, and YES, revisit this with specially-made stuff!
Depends on what you immersed the rope in. Greek fire, tar and pitch might stay lit during flight.
If you try charcloth type material and you essentially shoot a smoldering coal, that would probably work.