As a retired project manager, 8 years out, I found your extention costings extremely useful in order to bring me up to date on current material costs for 22-23. I am still asked to do work and to give advice, so costwise, your advice was first class, uncomplicated and suitably brief. I commend you sir. John Roake
Great video. I’m a builder of 20+ years running my own business and even after all that time pricing jobs is my nemesis. I hate it with a passion, each job is so different and intricate that guide line costs per m2 are sometimes very vague and I certainly wouldn’t quote based on them alone. I have always considered it as gambling really. You can so easily come a cropper by not quoting enough and nothing is more soul destroying and financially crippling like under quoting and working for free, especially as it’s a very hard job both mentally and physically. One thing I would add is that I’ve deliberately not quoted for twice as many jobs as I’ve actually quoted for. This is because the job is comprised in some way e.g poor access, lack of room to operate, awkward neighbours etc. The number 1 reason though is because I’ve not gotten good vibes from the client. Too abrupt/rude, disorganised, unprepared for the realities of having your home turned upside down temporarily. It’s very much a two way thing. You must trust me to dismantle and rebuild the most expensive asset you will likely ever own and I have to trust you’re going to pay me for my work and be able to adapt and understand when things don’t go to plan i.e unforeseen problems and changes. As a final thought, most of the very best tradesman are the best because they do what they do best and that’s create actual real 3 dimensional objects and installations. That means they usually, like myself, hate doing paperwork and quoting otherwise they would just get a cushty office job in the warm and dry without breaking their back for what seems at times like not enough money. I’ll stop whingeing now 😂
@@nickdalts Hi there, If I’ve missed something and it’s my fault I personally feel it’s my responsibility to suck it up. If it’s a huge mistake and I simply can’t afford to do it unpaid then I would have to consider talking to the customer to explain that it’s my fault but it’s too costly for me to continue. Touch wood I’ve never had to do that but I have with plenty of smaller missed things. If it’s a large unforeseen situation then I would absolutely let the customer know of a cost increase. Hope that answers your question.
I did my own extension 4 years ago and came out at £26,000 with kitchen. That was 3m x 8m with bifolds toilet and utility. Bare in mind I only had a brickie, electrician and plasterer. Everything else I done myself including making sure building standards were met. But I've done projects in the past with work. It's not easy especially working full time as well but it's definitely worth the effort.
Thanks for posting such a detailed spreadsheet breakdown of the whole process. It's very open and generous of you to share your costs and experiences of the build. Very helpful and very interesting. I do feel like I have a sense of investment having lived through your last four houses though now! All the best for 2023.
Very,very useful; I've forwarded this to my brother-in-law who is thinking of extending their 1930s semi in South Liverpool. Appreciate the time and generosity of sharing. Tony
I have recently completed an extension which included an outbuilding (no soundproofing concerns) but went through a similar process opting for it to be within permitted development too. The 2.5 M maximum height was a little open for debate when researching especially on slopped gardens. Unlike you, we had a difficult builder and although I had expected him to be here for a significant portion, he would send a couple of his guys over each day with little supervision. I ended up having to project manage making sure materials were ordered on time, sequencing deliveries and trades people so that work would progress. As I was losing confidence with him, I was forced to check and verify that everything was being done to the right standard in terms of building regs, including the checking that the correct size steel was used. I now know that this builder did not know how to price a job or made significant assumptions on costs including labour. We had a fixed sum contract in place which detailed every requirement he needed to meet and checked with him multiple times that if we was confident with what he quoted. He didn't finish the job and I had to complete a substantial amount myself as well as bringing trades (front drive, rear patio, guttering, fascias, internal doors, some tiling, fence panels, coping stones and so on). After all this and having to pay more for others to come and finish jobs, the total price per SQM (£1190) was fairly close to what you've achieved. We are in the Midlands so in terms of price could be considered somewhere in the middle. The above doesn't include the external landscaping work which came in at around £83 p/SQM. Year (s) 2019-2020 Overall building extension (including redeveloping existing rooms) size 114SQM and external hard landscaping around 300SQM. All done now and have very similar spreadsheet with every little item detailed (I thought no one else will do that, lol). Well done on keeping the kitchen costs so low too. Hopefully this may help others who are in the early stages of their journey. Cheers and GOD BLESS.
Hmmm, I would like to say from a builder and a pm's perspective that I'm not suprised that the builder left the job. People want to work without being micromanaged in that way. If you have no confidence in your builder it is best that you politely let them know so that both of you can end your relationship amicably. I'm pretty sure that their costs soared 1000% from what you described. If you don't know what you're doing, hire a professional to work with them, i.e., supervise them. As intimated here, don't try hiring a bargain basement builder and trying to rachet them down into a professional outfit for that money. It will never happen and the stress involved will take years off your life but then, from what I've seen of some clients, that could only be described as justice. I'm not talking about criminal builders here, that know the regs and disregard them, I'm talking about the rough and ready, probably untidy lot too. In short, there is no shortcut. The cheap guy probably doesn't have a body priced in to take out waste and keep the site clean. They probably don't have an engineer on tap for awkward details or areas where the plan is ambiguous. And supervision costs in SE London were anything from £300 - 1000 per day depending on the class of project back in around 2020 iirc.
So I built a 30m2 kitchen-diner extension myself (which is very similar to yours). Three new walls, built 8m out the back of the property. Brickie and his dad (who did ground working) did the foundations, brickwork, got a solid flooring contractor in, cleared about 40 tonnes of spoil (sloping site) and sorted the scaffolding for £13k. I bought the bricks, blocks and insulation. I then did pretty much everything else myself (except the Part P wiring), including the roof (pitched with hip) windows, doors, plumbing and boarding the ceiling and walls. Paid a plaster £800 for a skim, and an electrician £600 for the Part P stuff (I bought all the lights, sockets and distribution board). Plans cost a few hundred quid and the local authority forgot to charge for the building inspection. Whole thing came in at under £30k. Then I blew over £20k on a Wren kitchen sadly. Lots of quartz!
Great video and really interesting. I'm on both sides of this, having been a joiner for 28 years and lecturing and working in construction. I am now halfway through an big extension at home that started pre COVID and due to spiralling materials costs, lockdown etc is still ongoing. As a self builder I have seen prices spiral during and post COVID... I wouldn't put any stead in pre 2019 prices...it's almost like a different era... In the last 4 months I have seen Aluminium window prices go up almost 40%. In the Swindon area building is going on at a staggering rate and materials demand and prices are definitely reflected in that... Don't even get me started on how expensive timber is. Our extension is 2 storey and single storey...roughly 60m2 . My original costings in 2020 using Spons (worth the purchase price as this really will give you a very accurate pricing structure) was £90k Inc £10k pc sum for kitchen and £5k for ensuite...this is materials and labour. I think realistically now we will be lucky if we keep it under £110k and I have done all the work...( Foundations with a mate who is a ground worker) all blockwork with another friend who is a bricky...so very much mates rates. All carpentry..roofing ..floors...concreting etc all me. Most of the plumbing fit out will be me but electrical work will be contracted out. Ours is what I would describe as High end build ( anthracite aluminium windows, Canadian cedar cladding, bespoke kitchen etc) so was always going to be on the high side but at the moment if you work on £2k per M2 you will give yourself some wiggle room. If your builder quotes £1k per M2 and doesn't itemise their quote then watch the extras roll in....or watch them bail. There are no 2 ways about it building is expensive at the moment and finding reputable builders is going to cost so don't kid yourself it will be cheap. One of the biggest single expenses is skips...holy cow waste removal has gone up over the years. I should point out we had 4 quotes pre COVID.... They ranged from £68k plus vat for just a water tight shell.. No kitchen, bathroom or floors / internal walls ( I was going to do those) to .. £160k plus Vat. ( With no PC sum for kitchen or en suite) none of the quotes included plans/architects fees, site surveys etc as I did all those myself. I think realistically if we handed our build to a good builder from the start and kept the same spec we would be looking at around £150-160k plus VAT... At the moment I am still on target for a £90k Inc vat spend but that includes everything including drive, gates and landscaping....so not just the 60m2... But remember I have done nearly all the work myself so no builders/ labour costs..but the quality is there it just takes time. ... It's the eternal triangle...Time, cost, quality.... Thanks for sharing your costs....all too often you see people running into financial difficulties when building ..relying on quotes and then looking at final figures trying to work out how they are 20% over quoted... Now imagine our situation where prices have literally doubled between pre COVID and post COVID.. god knows what we would have done if I hadn't been in trade. Take heed people ..never go for the lowest quote and always get references with pictures and testimonials you can follow up.
Coming from a Engineering background and having worked on construction projects for over 18yrs now, it's good to see someone breaking down a project on a residential extension. I've done extensions and I would have at around £96k from information and sizes off your plans. And that would be making a modest 10 to 12% I reckon. We only work to specification and above. Looks a nice job, well done. Regards
Thank you so much for this. We had virtually given up on the idea of proceeding with our 15sqm garden room (even having spent £6k on planning and drawings) after being given an estimate of £110k inc VAT for an empty shell by a member of the "Federation of Master Builders". That is £7200/sqm! It is time to start searching again for a builder that we can trust. There is a public need for information like this. Thanks again.
Quotes I got from FMB builders local to me were definitely on the "high" side. I waited it out, mainly because many builders came in, and sucked through their teeth, I got my violin out and played whilst they gave the speel about rising materials costs blah blah blah. In the end, I managed to get a builder who was genuinely interested in the project, took my drawings, prepared a proper quote in writing and we settled on a cost. Looking at the tables he has come in around the £1500-sq/m and that is for a garage conversion to a home office with fitting it out with storage as well PLUS a tear down of a 5m x 4m old conservatory and do a fresh extension build all to the new building regulations and 900mm deep footings etc, solid roof, skylights the lot. Total bill £38k including VAT. The planning costs under permitted development with the council came to an additional £750 and Architect drawings etc £700. So all in I reckon we're under £40k.
Just finished a double story 5x4.5m extension and it’s cost £40k. Project managed it ourselves and sourced all the trades. Builders were quoting double and more to do the entire build, so we’ve saved a fortune.
Don’t go this route if you aren’t fully clued up and experienced. Get a bank loan as your property will increase in value anyway then pay a proper builder. You will lose a FORTUNE otherwise.
Been working in the trades my whole life and would agree with everything you said. We also much prefer working for self managed builds if the client knows what there doing. Generally less stressful lol!
I’d find it completely the opposite . I have refused to quote several jobs where the client had said they’ll project manage in the 17 years I’ve been in business. !
@@mrboyban I think the point is most customers don’t know what they’re doing with project management we have had a few and it was always really hard work and we ended up running the job because they were just overwhelmed by it. And the op did say if they know what they’re doing but in my experience they don’t.
Professional builders do not quote per SQM every job is different, access, ground conditions, materials, bi-folds, lanterns, structural work & services can vary price. For estimating & budgeting a ballpark of 2.5/3k per SQM would be quoted to a client in SE UK in early 2023, once client seems keen a full detailed quote would be done that could take several days to complete! Unfortunately, material prices at the highest ever brick are £1.20 + blocks £2.50+ plasterboard £10+ as well as other costs of running a building company fuel etc. Time a builder spends on site is not the only part of the job collection of materials, ordering, quoting, and liaising with clients many of us work 60-plus hours a week! Unfortunately, many clients don't see this & think they're getting ripped off, there are many rip-offs & cowboys around but just as many decent contractors get tarred with the same brush. Been a contractor 24 years & only working on recommendations & tell my clients I won't be the cheapest or most expensive but will do best job possible for a fair price.
Andy this was a great video . I do this also for a living and Builders are absolutely ripping it these days. No question raw materials are more expensive than previously but when you breakdown the costs properly it’s pure greed . Your man that said he couldn’t buy the materials for 64k will be someone who doesn’t know how to cost a job so he just over inflated to cover his incompetence. Keep up the good videos they’re excellent .
We're planning our extension at the moment; your breakdown is excellent and has put my mind at rest that my finger in the air costs are about right. Looking forward to your guidance on trades - normally I do everything myself but for speed and sheer amount of effort I'm considering getting blockwork and the like done by someone.
I had the sales guy from Beers the building merchants in today as Im looking to build a 3mx8m second storey extension. For the blocks, concrete and cement, ive been quoted just under 1500 quid. Glazing will be well under 2k for 3 french doors and juliet glass rails. These prices are more realistic as were building it ourselves over a few months. Im seeing friends getting silly quotes of 75k for the same size. Ill be bringing mine in between 15 - 20k. Great video
I knew a guy who built a wooden boat. When we asked how much it cost he said, “I took all the receipts, organized them and put them in a binder as I went along. When I was done I sat down, opened the binder, then immediately closed it and threw it in the trash. I enjoy the boat too much to know how much I paid for it.”
Well done mate. We mainly did large commercial/corporate jobs when I was still in it but did do a few small builds and extensions too. I just dug out my last set of builders bibles from 2009. Its m2 averages are £750 for basic going up to £980 for high spec (stone, thermal etc). We had our own formula that fell in between at the time. My earliest edition (early 00's), from £350 m2! Gone a bit crazy eh? Again though, excellent video and grand job on the extension.👍
Just finished our kitchen extension (3m x 2.4m),Including upgrading kitchen units and new quartz worktop and semi solid oak floor. I had a brickie, plasterer, joiner and plumber in. I did the wiring myself and I supplied all materials. I did all groundwork myself. Including planning, building control, architect and structural engineer fees, the total cost was £14500. Our expected cost was £15k.
Great video, really informative. We have an old (Victorian) stone-built detached house, to which we've done extensive renovations that have so far taken us 21 years, but we've done everything ourselves, except for some structural steelwork which the house needed in the cellars. One of the jobs we did was a full cellar restoration after the steelwork had been installed, this was a huge task as the cellars are full height rooms which cover the entire house footprint. I reckon we completed the work for about one tenth the cost of what it would have been if we had used contractors to do the same job, plus we probably got a higher standard of finish and everything was exactly how we wanted it. It is very hared work and very time-consuming, but you can't beat doing it yourself if you have the skills and the inclination
Thanks for taking the time to do that breakdown of costs - very useful. And I'm glad you mentioned the costing of your own time. The trade off is your eye is always on the ball. As some of your earlier posters mentioned, Building Regs change all the time, adding to your costs. The great thing about being involved is that it (usually!) gets done how you want it. I'm 67 now and have got 2 projects on the go for two of my sons. I think these will be my last Particularly as they bought me the latest 1:24 scale Spitfire from Airfix for Xmas!
Great video, very helpful. Always best to get 3-5 quotes. A friend of mine saved £34,000 in total on a high quality extension just by getting different quotes. The ironic thing was, the expensive builders called back a month later asking if they've found a builder for the project. One reduced his original quote by £23,000 and another by £32,000. Shocking how much builders inflate the price.
The real worry about builders who ‘make it up as they go along’ is once the project is underway and they get to think they may not be able to bring in the job - they will start ‘nickel and diming’ you or walk away.
I know a builder and says how he prices is to think of a price, then double it. I got a small extension done and got quotes ranging from 12-36k. The architect recommended the cheapest bid, but actually got the builder to include extras he missed out on, so bid was upped to 15k. Builder did an great job, on time and on budget. A good architect is key.
Did you look at sip panels for the walls? They can be prefabricated and put up in days compared to the traditional wet trades. The thermal values are excellent and can be really cost effective.
@@mcfrosty8739 oh believe me I do. Just feel for the elderly and vulnerable being ripped off. Thankfully people are becoming more tech-savvy and can do their own research with help from few good honest people online.
Fascinating as ever. I guess my #1 question is - if you were me, and therefore totally not a DIY person or skilled in any relevant trade, what would that have done to the costs? Do you know how much time/money a builder would have charged for the hours they would have needed? I'm assuming you are well aware how long it should have taken. I once tried to "manage" a significant refurb and the disagreements at the tail end with the builder were extremely stressful and unpleasant so I appreciate the fantastic job you did here - amazing!
I think a fair price would have been £70-90k. Anything above that is steep in my view... but I don't envy the task of builders so if they can get away with charging £140k then so be it!
Nice one, man - I'm also from the North East. It is great to see a fellow Geordie on RUclips as we're in short supply. With regard to money, I don't care as long as the job is done right since 'money' is fake anyway - and I do most of the work myself in the garden. When it comes to the building work on the house it costs whatever it costs as long as it's done right.
Random number generator! LOL. Well done, Andy. I would call it a renovation with an addition. And just for folks watching, the cost per square foot or meter, think about what is included in the renovation and/or addition. If you add one bedroom, vs one bathroom or kitchen, you have the two extremes, considering what is to be included in the new space. A bedroom would be the simplest sort of addition, with the least expensive components, vs a bathroom or kitchen that would include millwork, fixtures, plumbing, and more complex electrical considerations. So many things to consider, so that is why throwing a cost per square whatever at a project is a dangerous attempt at budgeting. I proper design should be done first and then get bids or quotes from reputable contractors or subcontractors. I have been in the design business for over 30 years and built many new homes as well as done many a renovation and addition. Don't get caught without a plan folks, and be sure that you make as many notes on those plans as you can, so you don't have contractors coming back to you with their hands out.
I managed a 7 meter dee and 8 m wide wall to wall extension, bedroom on first floor and a dormer in about £140000. I think I need another £20-30000 to now fully fit it out. It has ufh and tiling on all three floors, no radiators and new wiring. I achieved it by doing the work myself with my father and hiring two day labourers who did the grunt work. The only thing I outsourced to contractors was brickwork, skimming and the hot water cylinder installation and the electric fuse board. I did pipe work and electrics myself. Tiling myself. Etc etc. it’s taken two years of my life and probably another 6 months before I can get back to other stuff. But I have thoroughly enjoyed it. I won’t ever do it again though. 😂
My wife and I bought just under an acre of land for the purpose of eventually building our own home. We appointed an architect. He asked if you could delay building this home for atleast 12 months because building materials had gone up by at least 20%
Good thing I can do the planning myself and also build it myself, all I would need to pay for would be materials and the groundwork! It is extremely beneficial to acquire construction skills in your lifetime!
If your roof plan is suitable highly recommend trussed rafters, very cheap, very rapid delivery and just send the provided calcs to building control. Cost way less than hiring a carpenter that's if you can find one who doesn't have a long waiting list. Unless you have the contacts it can be very difficult finding competent people especially in high cost busy areas.
Wow that's really useful, a great video thank you, my extension and renovation work starts next month, my costs are coming in around £70k, but that includes total renovation of the downstairs. but ya, this is so stressful, I can't tell you, not for the faint hearted, I hate stress. if you don't like stress, don't do this! It has certainly put me off doing such a large project again, and we've not even started yet.
We had a 28m^2 extension in 2019. Had quotes ranging from £35k to £120k. Ended up going with a builder friends had used and ended up spending around £45k on the shell I think, with another £15k spent on finishing, kitchen etc. Based on your numbers we overspent a little, but we had so much troubling finding a builder who would get back to me with a quote. In the end though the shell, boiler, electrics were all done within 4.5 months with the finishing taking us a month. Worst part of the experience was shelling out £3.5k to an architect when it turned out I could have spent £600 with someone else for the same work. With post covid prices I wouldn't even contemplate doing any project like this again.
@@oldboyuk I had a few other issues with the architect that I ended up choosing and when building control came round to do one of the first checks on the foundation I grumbled about the architect. He asked who it was and I said and he sighed. I wasn't the first one to complain about them to him. He said as I knew exactly what I wanted to do anyway I could have phoned building control and asked for advice and they would have directed me to someone they use a lot who would have only been £600. I think it was an architect assistant or something along those lines. Not a fully qualified architect but can do the drawings etc that were required by building control and the builders themselves. Architect gave me bad advice relating to party wall agreement, kept on leaving bifold doors on the drawing despite saying 5 times on the phone and in emails we wanted French doors; which he then tried to charge me extra to change them. They got someone around to look at the drainage and managed to draw it the wrong way round and again tried to charge me to fix it. I initially got them involved so they could deal with the whole project. They assured me what I wanted could be done well within budget. Got one of his builders around who quoted double my budget so I ended up sacking him. Drawings were complete by then and used a builder some friends had used. He dealt with everything for me, was open about the pricing and explained when issues came up and how they'd be rectified.
@@JamesTombs Thanks a lot for the advice. I've never been a fan of the idea of spending thousands on a architect for a basic extension. Good tip to speak to building control for someone they might recommend. Cheers
Andy, thanks for being so well organised as to be able to provide that info! I guess you sacrificed the opportunity of a fair amount of income to be able to work on the house yourself. Did I miss you saying how long it all took? All the best
Most insightful of all the building videos I've watched, so many about the different ways to build but no one has broken in down by doing it yourself as opposed to asking the builder. thank you
I've just had an itemised quote for something very very similar to yours, wraparound double on side single at back and I nearly fell over. 104k just for the shell. Roof and retailing existing roof came in at 30K!! Looks like I'm project managing this one
Extention” is the English language term, whiltst “addition” is a US language term. English uses addition when measuring liquid, materials, and furnitures.
One minute I'm watching your drumming videos and now one on self build. A man of many talents. I'm trying to do my self build for < 2k/m2 This video has really alleviated my fears. People have been telling me I'd be spending 2k/m2 just for the shell. I'm going to do the groundworks, cut roof, tile roof and second fix carpentry / bathrooms myself. So hoping to save a fair amount.
This is fascinating. We decided not to extend but to remove one wall between rooms, add a nice big patio door and then do some internal repairs including moving the bathroom. We thought we were being really sensible and frugal with our changes. We made detailed architects drawings and costed our materials at 43k including the floors, new kitchen, doors. We got a building company in who want cash in hand. They quoted 91k for their work. We now have to do the work ourselves. We are not paying 91k in cash for a start and we know it's not 91k of work either. I'm disgusted by the post-covid building scene.
@@onemanfran That is beyond disgusting and our government clearly does nothing to prevent this blatant profiteering. We've been renting for most of our lives, will retire in 2 years and have saved about 100k. There will be a small lump sum from our pensions to add to this and we were thinking of buying a house to save on rent. Unfortunately, with house prices as extortionate as they are, we're having second thoughts since we'd be left with almost no savings. Past years of 0% interest + uncontrolled mortgage multipliers (used to be 2.5) + much, much longer payback terms (used to be 21 years) - and, most damningly, a government that deliberately allowed this catastrophe - has destroyed the housing market. Why do governments not look after the population? !!
Hey boss, in the states what you did is called an "Addition" that's the common slang. I just finished a 4,000 sq ft addition to my existing 1500 sq ft home here in the states at the exact same time as you. Stated documenting it on my YT channel and got lost in the details. Phenomenal build on yours as always. Wouldnt expect anything different from you. Been with you since the beginning. Bring back "Measuring Up!!!" haha
I've only come across your channel yesterday but you are definitely one of my favourite content creators! So knowledgeable and just and all around nice guy!
What an absolutely fantastic video - can't believe I found this amount of real knowledge/experience by accident... like/subscribed and looking forward to the next one 👍👍
Hi sir imagine having the work done in London , the plumbing alone would have been 30 grand . As a retired electrical contractor , I still think most people are being ripped off . When I started work in 1968 the local builder’s would probably just live in a detached house with a bit of a garden and drove around in an old jag . Fast forward to today and may have massive properties with a couple of top of the range cars in the garage , and a property abroad . And that’s why many (not all ) are conning the public , pure greed . And they even employ cheap labour , to add insult to injury . I don’t envy anyone looking for work to be done unless you actually know them . Kind regards as always
This has been really useful, cheers! I was told that the guideline price for my area is very much at the top end. I have a couple of questions: - Whereabouts roughly are you based? - Do you have an idea of how much value it's added to your property?
It has been inspirational to follow and well done, you are an absolute gent! One question: If you were to include your own labour,, how many hours did you commit to the project and if you were to pay yourself an average hourly rate, how much would that have cost?
Really good level of detail I look forward to watching your other videos. We’ve been trying to figure out how much an extension would cost and had mixed results from speaking around.
Great video, which couldn’t have come at a more appropriate time as we start our own extension journey! We have witnessed several builder nightmares and hope we can avoid this happening to us. Would be interested to know where you got your kitchen quote from? Well done and look forward to seeing further videos.
This must have taken a lot of work. Thanks Andy. Good job you are a complete control freak, looks like it's saved you about a hundred grand! Well done to you and Mrs Mac👏🏼
Finding Decent trades is the biggest problem in the uk…. I’ve been in construction 22 years and it’s now worse than it’s ever been…. Good luck to anyone having work done 👍
At a very rough guess, and for a flat roof rather than pitched (because I don't tile!), I would charge £70,000 for that...but it would be a passive extension - I don't do ordinary U value extensions anymore. That would include everything, and I mean all plans, groundwork, walls, roof, triple glazing, whisper-quiet electric heating, finished...to a very high decorative order, with shadow line skirting and fancy LED lighting.
Very thorough Andy thank you. Getting any decent tradesmen/company to quote and do a job is a nightmare. And i can quite understand why your other building company only does commercial stuff now and there are a variety of reasons why. Im really impressed with your spreadsheet skills 😊 by the why. There is another issue thats a modern day thing, so as we are a simular age. We grew up with people who do things and we learnt from them. Sadly a large proportion of people cant put a plug on. And if it cant be bought from amazon (expecting perfection from a box) they struggle. Just different times thats all. I recently bought a new washing machine and some younger people were amazed that it was plumbed in and working within half n hour, not a difficult job at all we both know, but you get the picture. Thank Andy great vids as always.
Cheers Paul! Yes, absolutely. It was a real eye opener when I did property maintenance work, how much stuff folk just couldn't do for themselves. Changing light bulbs, basic repairs to blinds and one person even paid me to put their new lawn mower together! 😬😁
I’m in the middle of an extension build currently. We are knocking out a supporting walls to create an open plan kitchen diner with no folds. From re mortgage to now it’s taken over a year. Builders generally took at least a week to visit and another week or two to quote. Architects when I found one that was free took months to produce plans that were wrong and further weeks with constant chasing to produce correct final plans, I had the same issue with the structural engineer. The final figure was around 25k over what was quoted and the final project has been extremely compromised due to inflated costs. Having said all of that my builder and his crew are (so far) really good and hardworking and pleasant with really good comms. I’m hopeful of getting to a first fix (plaster/electrics/plumbing) at about 40k.
Excellent as always. Been looking forward to this one. Our wrap around single storey extension project is due to start in May. I am dreading our re-quote a month before. We got our price in feb 21 (edit Feb 22 sorry) and then booked our preferred builder based on reputation and then chose to wait over a year to get them. In terms of cost comparison, the 3 quotes we got were all within 10k for a circa 90k project and the average was bang on what the architect guessed prior to gaining quotations. I should add our project includes a complete ground floor rework (remove all walls and create new rooms), large bifold, large glass feature window and 2 triple velux roof windows in a pitched roof plus move of an existing window and sill adjustment plus plumbing and electrics (we just need to source flooring, kitchen and final decoration. I am also wondering what effect the new building regs will have on the re-quote: We didn't get regs done until after the change so the walls have changed for example, cavity now wider etc, so assumed more insulation. I would love to do some of the project management but just don't have etc time with work or other family commitments. Am tempted to fit the kitchen myself though and will be doing some built in cupboard work.
Good luck with yours! Unfortunately Feb '21 is just before prices really started to ramp up. Could be significantly more now, although probably not as bad as mid-2022. 👍
@@GosforthHandyman thanks. oops, just noticed the obvious mistake of which bloody year we are in. Feb 22 was the quote, so hoping the jump isn't too big.
Thanks Andy, this was very interesting & meticulous. I really don’t know how you found enough time to do it all, then I read on another comment you had a day job too!! Amazing, well done to both of you 🙌👏👏👏👏.
Labour costs are crazy. Back in 2005 I managed and helped to build a small 10m2 lean to extension and it came in at about £8000 including carpets and decoration. £2000 of that was a raft foundation and then 5 days’ labour for brickies. I’ve just build a cedar clad fully insulation garden office for £6000.
It's great reading all the DIYers comments here, 10% the cost etc. Well here's the thing! If you contract a building company in to do work you will more than likely have to pay VAT on the value of the work then there corporation tax they will have to pay, plus they will add a percentage for overheads such as liability insurance, handling paperwork etc. They will quite rightly add a profit margin so they can expand their business or use it purchase new equipment, etc. that's not including wages to subcontractors! I mean 20 years to do your renovations? it would've been cheaper contracting a professional builder! And if you've all had dodgy builders in the past, blame yourselves for taking the cheapest quote and not even doing you groundwork by checking out their qualifications!
A very good and detailed breakdown of the costs. It would be good to break down labour costs per hour or day, as this will make calculations easier. You did not mention about how much additional cost was occurred because of error and the rectifying that error. In each project errors will occur, some small whilst others jaw breaking. Another way of getting an idea of cost is to look around your local area and ask them to give a ball park on how much it cost them.
We didn't really have any error costs since everything was planned to the last detail and we knew the house intimately by that point. Will cover time spent in a bit more detail on a future vid though. 👍
@@GosforthHandyman watching a lot on homes under hammer even they dont have many errors on build. Big ones if you are not careful is the likes of asbestos in the property , and making sure supporting properly window appertures if fitting new windows, but they are not really "new build" situations. obviously one problem can be ensuring the supply of materials - which you had with the doors but even that was a time cost rather than significant money cost
Excellent breakdown and information. Provides much clarity. Subject change though, with domestic cats killing 50 million birds a year in the UK why would and cat owner encourage birds to visit their garden by providing food for them.
I live in a high cost area (thanks London) so I think my single story extension, wetroom, new bathroom, garden studio, refurb kitchen and total redecoration of the whole house as well as painting the exterior was around half what people in my neck of wood say. I did do a lot of upcycling like used one door as the back door (no bi-folds) and the other one went into the studio, and 2 second hand solid oak doors kitchens to make mine. I could have done it a lot cheaper, but I did splash out in certain areas like ceramic flooring and taps. Not sure I want to ever see a heat gun (spindles are a nightmare) or a paint roller again.
Me too. We are looking into a loft conversion and single storey extension in N. London. Any steers on who you have used, what we can do ourselves would be greatly appreciated
1950 terrace house..What's some things that you would absolutely add on? 1.Additional bedroom? 2.2nd bathroom? 3.washer/dryer on second floor? 4. Can I bin the bathtub for showers? 5. Get it insulated to EPC level C?
I like the fact that people dont expect a small building company to make a profit only a wage. We are running businesses like the ones most people work for and are there to make a profit not a charity
What I’m confused about is your judgements on what people should be earning or charging. Some trades are much more difficult than others both in terms of skill required, danger and cost of equipment. Roofers, for example. how much would someone have to pay you to carry thousands of tiles up ladders of your back for example with all the contentions that come with that. There are fewer people available to do these jobs therefore the price is higher. In terms of “profit” you’ve not considered the actual cost of running the business - 100k worth of equipment is not unusual, 12k a year on fuel, 10k a year on insurance, works unit rental cost, cost of repairs, wages and staff pension contributions, business rates, ongoing training costs, replacement of tools and equipment that can’t be repaired, time spent on “free quotes” which can take 100s of hours each year, accounting costs the list goes on. Most self employed trades I know run on about 15 to 20% real terms profit. Your roofers for example perhaps made £1500 for a week. Divide that by the number of people on site and that’s their wages. That’s why it’s rare to see builders pulling out of the driveways of huge houses in the morning. The oversimplification of everything is all too common these days.
We are getting quotes for a double story extension 50m2 x2 and a single story at the back of about 25m2 but also a total refurb of the old kitchen. I find your breakdown of cost very helpful. We are in the Wickham area. Quotes in the first instant ranged from 54k up to 120k.
it seems a little skewed to compare a total were you consider your and Ms Mac's time free versus a fully hands off quote, it'd be interesting to see a fair price put on all that work as well! Great job as always.
Cheers! Yes, too much for this vid but will be covering time / staging on a future vid. We put a lot of hours in but we had the flexibility to work around our day-jobs. 👍
While it’s interesting to know how much time they put in, I don’t think it skews anything. They worked in their spare time, so their labour was free. I get paid to do my day job, because the company I work for puts that value on my labour. I don’t get paid by anyone for my spare time though, so it makes no sense to pretend that my spare time has a monetary value. That’s not to say I don’t value my time, but it’s not a financial value.
@@BunkerMentality I think it does skew it somewhat, his time obviously has a monetary value as the skills he possesses has enabled him to get the end result at such a good price, i think the original question above was looking for a comparison of what it would have cost if he did nothing himself I think you would then see how much his time was worth.
Nice video! We were quoted £60 to £120k + VAT for a 15m2 extension (!!). This was mid-2022. The 120k + VAT worked out at the best part of £10,000 per square metre of new space. Plus kitchen, flooring, glazing, tiling, sanitaryware! I politely told that builder (who had the audacity to say that they "might" be able to visit to properly quote and in the end just did it off structural drawings) that they were living in cloud cuckoo land. I never heard from them again, strangely enough. I've noticed an interesting change in the past few months though. I have shortlisted builders calling me up now, asking if I have an update on any upcoming works. The same builders I had to beg to come round and have a look for a quote a few months ago. My theory is that the post-Lockdown boom is over, people are going back to the office more, remortgages are expensive, cost of living is up, and builders are starting to panic that the order books are drying up into 2023-24. We shall see.
Your theory is correct. I've been expecting and waiting for this to happen since March 2022 when inflation started to take off and central banks started raising interest rates. We need a small extension but there was no way I was paying with prices at historical highs (2020-2022), it would be like buying shares right at the top of the market, throwing money away. Basically as the Fed raise interest rates to quell inflation in the US, the BoE has to follow in the UK. The result of this will be inflation dropping off, but the consequence of that will be a big recession. The higher interest rates go, the bigger the recession. Recessions mean demand drops, which in turns means prices come down, although prices can be 'sticky' and lag a bit behind.
@@garethedwards5159 Just one point, inflation isn't in the regulated money markets. It was a supply-driven rise in prices which would fall off as supply chains unblocked. Inventories in the US are still not going down. Now the opposite problem is about to occur as international freight rates fall, and China isn't really able to return output to pre-pandemic levels. And the CPI is falling for the wrong reasons, as its not being driven by increases in supply. Its being driven by a fall off in demand over and beyond 'post-pandemic normalisation. The real problem in the International Money Markets is that they are nervous, and are unwilling to provide credit without collateral that is government-backed. They're not interested in mortgage-backed securities or junk bonds, causing a shortage in credit to fuel international commerce. China is the biggest victim, but the volume of debt around is scaring lenders in the international monetary system, and they don't trust each other. If the IMS is choking off the supply of credit, that will impact the availability of financing in the regulated markets too that are controlled by central banks, like the Fed too. Base rate changes are a political decision, and have zero impact on the availability of credit to the lenders. Collateral in the IMS does that. Base rate changes are to target wage increases, and employment figures last week showed that wages aren't growing, and job numbers only grew in part-time employment. So base rate hikes are in danger of killing off consumer demand, leaving retailers high and dry, causing real job losses to accelerate above and beyond what we see now. That's why lending criteria in regulated banking are getting tougher and less mortgage products for variable and fixed rate loans are in the consumer market now. There's simply isn't enough money around, for businesses or consumers. That means deflation is more likely now. The only cure is the Fed to issue new treasury bills or notes, and they're not doing that, because they aren't paying attention to the lack of credit flowing in from the IMS. There aren't enough US Treasury bills to support the global economy. The Fed is trying to maintain confidence in their ability to "steer the economy", when in reality they're not in driving seat. The IMS is, and it's feeling nervous because they feel a global recession is coming, and everyone is overburdened with debt. And governments are worried too, because the debt is too big to repay, and they are relying on inflation to erode it away. As its unpopular and probably politically impossible to raise taxes in the US right now, the Fed, like other central banks will not be issuing new bonds to provide liquidity, so things are going to grind to a halt this year or next year in the global economy, and it will be 2008 again. We have to wait and see if that's right.
@@BigHenFor Can’t argue much with that either. We are indeed on a course towards rekindling market conditions of 2008. The scale of debt is colossal and even a small run will quickly gather momentum. Some strange folk will dismiss this as “negativity” as they’ve no clue that their ignorant emotion is already priced in. The same people are usually those who lose everything as they weren’t paying attention. Construction is already showing signs of slowing and those builders who believe they’re ‘booked all year’ are in for a rude awakening. They always think the good times will last. They are always wrong. Always. Not many people truly understand the magnitude of what is brewing. The shake out will be historical and has the potential to make 2008 appear a walk in the park. The bubble is about to poppity pop 🎈
Excellent video, I'm glad I stumbled across this (Subscribed). I've been refurbishing our home for some time now, doing all the work myself. We still have a single story kitchen diner extension that we want to build on the back and were going to leave this bit for a professional builder but with costs of things the way they are now, this has really inspired me to look into managing the build myself. I have most of the tools that I'd need already for the bits that I'd do. One question though. I'd love to get my hands on your Excel template for costs that I could customise. Have you considered sharing this? Good work on this.
I've just completed my extension I'm an electrician by trade but moved up to project management So I thought it would be a good idea to manage my own extension. I asked for a quote from a builder who had done a friend of mine extension. He came back with a 40k shell only 9mx6m no interia works except the steels and knock through just drainage and soak away and Gutterings Well, everything went to plan at the beginning except his son breaking his arm the first day, so I had to step in and help where I could to stop him pulling off for 6-8 weeks All went well, but towards the end of the job, starting getting stupid excuses about steels, etc and then he decided to pull off site without completing the soak away and few other bits and leaving a leak which was a pain in the ass to fix as he installed a Rubber membrane roof called EPDM which no roofer will repair So I'll have to take him to small claims court unfortunately to claim back some of the additional costs I have had to pay out for, which was on his original quote. But moving forward, I got over those issues and installed a wet underfloor heating system supplied from a new electric boiler designed for underfloor heating as energy costs are going through the roof Overall, I did 90% of the internal works myself electrics,plumbing,carpentry,painting,fitting kitchen,installing new shower room it roughly works out to be 80m2, everything including all building control documents £85k And I would say the finishes are towards the high-end costs Overall, I can say it was well worth it if you are able to do most of it yourself because even being in the trade, if you give some people an inch, they take a mile. And they will never do it to your standards
I was quoted £7000 to re roof my 3 bed existing semi and a new pitchedroof extension which is half the size of my existing roof. I sourced the tiles myself for £1100 and the battens, lead, dpm, nails for £600 and found an older roofer who charged £150 a day. It took him 5 days in bad weather. Go figure
Done a single story full length extension adding a front office, utility room middle and then extended kitchen with two skylights and bifold doors. All in fully finished it was £45k but that was with no bricklayer costs as me and my father in law (he's the brickie) done it together. The extension was 10x3m including a front bay. Honestly I don't know how anyone could project manage without a decent knowledge of building to sort all kinds of issues. My father in law sorted so many snags from 30+ years of building experience, without him I'd have been up shits creek relying on random trades to help me out. I think if it's straightforward you can do it at am good price but the second you run into issues you could start adding thousands onto the cost of the trades so be careful!
Was incredibly shocked at the cost versus size of the extension! What an achievement Andy! I'm going through the architect phase at the moment for a large conversion with front gable & loft conversion. Hoping to manage as much as I can, minus larger structural pieces
I used to do loads of extensions in gosforth and jesmond areas, these are the sort of areas good builders can get a good name for themselves, good video mate
Best advice I’ll give to anyone living in England, try and find some Polish or non-English tradesmen or builders, they’ll do just as a good job at two thirds of the price.
they work for less money initially, because any money is welcome and more than anything they would have earned back home. Most have families who live abroad and usually don’t have many major outgoings or mortgages to pay here, they work hard for less, send all the money home and then the plan is to one day go back to their native countries. They’re just as skilled as other countries rely on tradesmen too.
@@LogicPak Most of them aren't even tradesmen . They don't do a good finish and when you go abroad to most eastern European countries have a look at the quality of there work !
I had similar issues when planning mine, double extension with gable end, 2 bedrooms upstairs over full open plan kitchen, had quotes from 72k-160k, it’s near impossible to find good trades, and when you do they don’t want the work, luckily we found the right builder, 80k fully completed, decorated, new 40kw baxi, underfloor heating etc, kitchen on top, roughly 16k, extras 4k total 100k finished
Yup! We were very lucky to escape the new Part L changes. Even more cost! Ironically means homeowners just won't bother, leaving their older homes significantly less thermally efficient. 🙄
@@GosforthHandyman would be nice to see a calculation of the added upfront cost for the extra insulation compared to the expected savings on reduced energy usage.
Download our full plans and budget from the Member Zone: members.gosforthhandyman.com/all-member-only-downloads/ 👍
The cheapest way I’ve found to get the cost down is to talk yourself out of the idea 😊
Or better still find a good qualified builder!
We didn't talk ourselves out of it, they put a supply teacher in charge of the country and taking equity out suddenly seemed like a bad idea.
Nice one.
True. Absolutely spot on.. Save money by not buying anything.. That's my motto 😁😁😁
@@Simon-gp2zw 😆👍🏼👍🏼
As a retired project manager, 8 years out, I found your extention costings extremely useful in order to bring me up to date on current material costs for 22-23. I am still asked to do work and to give advice, so costwise, your advice was first class, uncomplicated and suitably brief. I commend you sir. John Roake
Great video. I’m a builder of 20+ years running my own business and even after all that time pricing jobs is my nemesis. I hate it with a passion, each job is so different and intricate that guide line costs per m2 are sometimes very vague and I certainly wouldn’t quote based on them alone. I have always considered it as gambling really. You can so easily come a cropper by not quoting enough and nothing is more soul destroying and financially crippling like under quoting and working for free, especially as it’s a very hard job both mentally and physically.
One thing I would add is that I’ve deliberately not quoted for twice as many jobs as I’ve actually quoted for. This is because the job is comprised in some way e.g poor access, lack of room to operate, awkward neighbours etc. The number 1 reason though is because I’ve not gotten good vibes from the client. Too abrupt/rude, disorganised, unprepared for the realities of having your home turned upside down temporarily. It’s very much a two way thing. You must trust me to dismantle and rebuild the most expensive asset you will likely ever own and I have to trust you’re going to pay me for my work and be able to adapt and understand when things don’t go to plan i.e unforeseen problems and changes.
As a final thought, most of the very best tradesman are the best because they do what they do best and that’s create actual real 3 dimensional objects and installations. That means they usually, like myself, hate doing paperwork and quoting otherwise they would just get a cushty office job in the warm and dry without breaking their back for what seems at times like not enough money. I’ll stop whingeing now 😂
Couldn't of said it better myself, I know your pain, but all worth it when the job is finished and you have a happy client.
Legend
A year later but great comment. Can I ask, if you've under-quoted for work, would builders not typically re-evaluate the quote?
@@nickdalts Hi there, If I’ve missed something and it’s my fault I personally feel it’s my responsibility to suck it up. If it’s a huge mistake and I simply can’t afford to do it unpaid then I would have to consider talking to the customer to explain that it’s my fault but it’s too costly for me to continue. Touch wood I’ve never had to do that but I have with plenty of smaller missed things. If it’s a large unforeseen situation then I would absolutely let the customer know of a cost increase. Hope that answers your question.
Sometimes the abrupt evasive customers turn out to be the best.
I did my own extension 4 years ago and came out at £26,000 with kitchen. That was 3m x 8m with bifolds toilet and utility.
Bare in mind I only had a brickie, electrician and plasterer. Everything else I done myself including making sure building standards were met. But I've done projects in the past with work. It's not easy especially working full time as well but it's definitely worth the effort.
if you done same project in 2023 this will cost you 40k+
@@Kborodo740 All those free trade Brexit benefits 🙄
Thanks for posting such a detailed spreadsheet breakdown of the whole process. It's very open and generous of you to share your costs and experiences of the build. Very helpful and very interesting. I do feel like I have a sense of investment having lived through your last four houses though now! All the best for 2023.
Cheers Ben and all the best for 2023 too!
Very,very useful; I've forwarded this to my brother-in-law who is thinking of extending their 1930s semi in South Liverpool. Appreciate the time and generosity of sharing. Tony
Total project in Liverpool will cost £30k
I have recently completed an extension which included an outbuilding (no soundproofing concerns) but went through a similar process opting for it to be within permitted development too. The 2.5 M maximum height was a little open for debate when researching especially on slopped gardens.
Unlike you, we had a difficult builder and although I had expected him to be here for a significant portion, he would send a couple of his guys over each day with little supervision. I ended up having to project manage making sure materials were ordered on time, sequencing deliveries and trades people so that work would progress.
As I was losing confidence with him, I was forced to check and verify that everything was being done to the right standard in terms of building regs, including the checking that the correct size steel was used.
I now know that this builder did not know how to price a job or made significant assumptions on costs including labour. We had a fixed sum contract in place which detailed every requirement he needed to meet and checked with him multiple times that if we was confident with what he quoted.
He didn't finish the job and I had to complete a substantial amount myself as well as bringing trades (front drive, rear patio, guttering, fascias, internal doors, some tiling, fence panels, coping stones and so on).
After all this and having to pay more for others to come and finish jobs, the total price per SQM (£1190) was fairly close to what you've achieved. We are in the Midlands so in terms of price could be considered somewhere in the middle. The above doesn't include the external landscaping work which came in at around £83 p/SQM.
Year (s) 2019-2020
Overall building extension (including redeveloping existing rooms) size 114SQM and external hard landscaping around 300SQM.
All done now and have very similar spreadsheet with every little item detailed (I thought no one else will do that, lol).
Well done on keeping the kitchen costs so low too.
Hopefully this may help others who are in the early stages of their journey.
Cheers and GOD BLESS.
Very interesting - we're in the Midlands and planning our build at the moment - whats the name of that builder so I know who to avoid?!
Hmmm, I would like to say from a builder and a pm's perspective that I'm not suprised that the builder left the job.
People want to work without being micromanaged in that way. If you have no confidence in your builder it is best that you politely let them know so that both of you can end your relationship amicably.
I'm pretty sure that their costs soared 1000% from what you described. If you don't know what you're doing, hire a professional to work with them, i.e., supervise them.
As intimated here, don't try hiring a bargain basement builder and trying to rachet them down into a professional outfit for that money. It will never happen and the stress involved will take years off your life but then, from what I've seen of some clients, that could only be described as justice. I'm not talking about criminal builders here, that know the regs and disregard them, I'm talking about the rough and ready, probably untidy lot too.
In short, there is no shortcut. The cheap guy probably doesn't have a body priced in to take out waste and keep the site clean. They probably don't have an engineer on tap for awkward details or areas where the plan is ambiguous.
And supervision costs in SE London were anything from £300 - 1000 per day depending on the class of project back in around 2020 iirc.
Isn't everything in the Midlands considered somewhere in the middle?
GO WITH CHRIST BROTHER AND JESUS BE WITH YOU
So I built a 30m2 kitchen-diner extension myself (which is very similar to yours). Three new walls, built 8m out the back of the property. Brickie and his dad (who did ground working) did the foundations, brickwork, got a solid flooring contractor in, cleared about 40 tonnes of spoil (sloping site) and sorted the scaffolding for £13k. I bought the bricks, blocks and insulation. I then did pretty much everything else myself (except the Part P wiring), including the roof (pitched with hip) windows, doors, plumbing and boarding the ceiling and walls. Paid a plaster £800 for a skim, and an electrician £600 for the Part P stuff (I bought all the lights, sockets and distribution board). Plans cost a few hundred quid and the local authority forgot to charge for the building inspection. Whole thing came in at under £30k. Then I blew over £20k on a Wren kitchen sadly. Lots of quartz!
More money for quartz!
20k+ is labour/profit for builders
Imagine buying a Wren kitchen lol
@@absaly not to mention the mark up they make on materials. they won't be paying full retail price.
Great video and really interesting. I'm on both sides of this, having been a joiner for 28 years and lecturing and working in construction. I am now halfway through an big extension at home that started pre COVID and due to spiralling materials costs, lockdown etc is still ongoing. As a self builder I have seen prices spiral during and post COVID... I wouldn't put any stead in pre 2019 prices...it's almost like a different era... In the last 4 months I have seen Aluminium window prices go up almost 40%. In the Swindon area building is going on at a staggering rate and materials demand and prices are definitely reflected in that... Don't even get me started on how expensive timber is. Our extension is 2 storey and single storey...roughly 60m2 . My original costings in 2020 using Spons (worth the purchase price as this really will give you a very accurate pricing structure) was £90k Inc £10k pc sum for kitchen and £5k for ensuite...this is materials and labour. I think realistically now we will be lucky if we keep it under £110k and I have done all the work...( Foundations with a mate who is a ground worker) all blockwork with another friend who is a bricky...so very much mates rates. All carpentry..roofing ..floors...concreting etc all me. Most of the plumbing fit out will be me but electrical work will be contracted out.
Ours is what I would describe as High end build ( anthracite aluminium windows, Canadian cedar cladding, bespoke kitchen etc) so was always going to be on the high side but at the moment if you work on £2k per M2 you will give yourself some wiggle room.
If your builder quotes £1k per M2 and doesn't itemise their quote then watch the extras roll in....or watch them bail. There are no 2 ways about it building is expensive at the moment and finding reputable builders is going to cost so don't kid yourself it will be cheap. One of the biggest single expenses is skips...holy cow waste removal has gone up over the years.
I should point out we had 4 quotes pre COVID.... They ranged from £68k plus vat for just a water tight shell.. No kitchen, bathroom or floors / internal walls ( I was going to do those) to .. £160k plus Vat. ( With no PC sum for kitchen or en suite) none of the quotes included plans/architects fees, site surveys etc as I did all those myself. I think realistically if we handed our build to a good builder from the start and kept the same spec we would be looking at around £150-160k plus VAT... At the moment I am still on target for a £90k Inc vat spend but that includes everything including drive, gates and landscaping....so not just the 60m2... But remember I have done nearly all the work myself so no builders/ labour costs..but the quality is there it just takes time. ... It's the eternal triangle...Time, cost, quality.... Thanks for sharing your costs....all too often you see people running into financial difficulties when building ..relying on quotes and then looking at final figures trying to work out how they are 20% over quoted... Now imagine our situation where prices have literally doubled between pre COVID and post COVID.. god knows what we would have done if I hadn't been in trade. Take heed people ..never go for the lowest quote and always get references with pictures and testimonials you can follow up.
Coming from a Engineering background and having worked on construction projects for over 18yrs now, it's good to see someone breaking down a project on a residential extension.
I've done extensions and I would have at around £96k from information and sizes off your plans.
And that would be making a modest 10 to 12% I reckon.
We only work to specification and above.
Looks a nice job, well done.
Regards
Thank you so much for this.
We had virtually given up on the idea of proceeding with our 15sqm garden room (even having spent £6k on planning and drawings) after being given an estimate of £110k inc VAT for an empty shell by a member of the "Federation of Master Builders". That is £7200/sqm!
It is time to start searching again for a builder that we can trust. There is a public need for information like this.
Thanks again.
Did they have a balaclava on when giving you a quote
Quotes I got from FMB builders local to me were definitely on the "high" side. I waited it out, mainly because many builders came in, and sucked through their teeth, I got my violin out and played whilst they gave the speel about rising materials costs blah blah blah. In the end, I managed to get a builder who was genuinely interested in the project, took my drawings, prepared a proper quote in writing and we settled on a cost. Looking at the tables he has come in around the £1500-sq/m and that is for a garage conversion to a home office with fitting it out with storage as well PLUS a tear down of a 5m x 4m old conservatory and do a fresh extension build all to the new building regulations and 900mm deep footings etc, solid roof, skylights the lot. Total bill £38k including VAT. The planning costs under permitted development with the council came to an additional £750 and Architect drawings etc £700. So all in I reckon we're under £40k.
Just finished a double story 5x4.5m extension and it’s cost £40k. Project managed it ourselves and sourced all the trades. Builders were quoting double and more to do the entire build, so we’ve saved a fortune.
Which area and contact number is the your builder contractor please?
Is that a fully fitted out project? i.e with kitchen?
Hi, can I contact you privately. I'm too looking to build a two storey extension 6x6, and have recieved crazy quotes
Please help me too! Would be keen to understand how you made this happen
Don’t go this route if you aren’t fully clued up and experienced. Get a bank loan as your property will increase in value anyway then pay a proper builder. You will lose a FORTUNE otherwise.
Been working in the trades my whole life and would agree with everything you said. We also much prefer working for self managed builds if the client knows what there doing. Generally less stressful lol!
I’d find it completely the opposite . I have refused to quote several jobs where the client had said they’ll project manage in the 17 years I’ve been in business. !
@@leer798 You couldn't get away with the rubbish workmanship in that instance, I understand that... Another plonker
@@mrboyban I think the point is most customers don’t know what they’re doing with project management we have had a few and it was always really hard work and we ended up running the job because they were just overwhelmed by it. And the op did say if they know what they’re doing but in my experience they don’t.
Eventhought I am not planning for the extension, the amount of knowledge and insight is amazing.
Professional builders do not quote per SQM every job is different, access, ground conditions, materials, bi-folds, lanterns, structural work & services can vary price. For estimating & budgeting a ballpark of 2.5/3k per SQM would be quoted to a client in SE UK in early 2023, once client seems keen a full detailed quote would be done that could take several days to complete! Unfortunately, material prices at the highest ever brick are £1.20 + blocks £2.50+ plasterboard £10+ as well as other costs of running a building company fuel etc. Time a builder spends on site is not the only part of the job collection of materials, ordering, quoting, and liaising with clients many of us work 60-plus hours a week! Unfortunately, many clients don't see this & think they're getting ripped off, there are many rip-offs & cowboys around but just as many decent contractors get tarred with the same brush. Been a contractor 24 years & only working on recommendations & tell my clients I won't be the cheapest or most expensive but will do best job possible for a fair price.
Spot on. 👌
Andy this was a great video . I do this also for a living and Builders are absolutely ripping it these days. No question raw materials are more expensive than previously but when you breakdown the costs properly it’s pure greed . Your man that said he couldn’t buy the materials for 64k will be someone who doesn’t know how to cost a job so he just over inflated to cover his incompetence.
Keep up the good videos they’re excellent .
Think you're right Jimmy! Some are so busy I doubt they get a chance to actually analyse the costs properly. 😂
We're planning our extension at the moment; your breakdown is excellent and has put my mind at rest that my finger in the air costs are about right. Looking forward to your guidance on trades - normally I do everything myself but for speed and sheer amount of effort I'm considering getting blockwork and the like done by someone.
I had the sales guy from Beers the building merchants in today as Im looking to build a 3mx8m second storey extension. For the blocks, concrete and cement, ive been quoted just under 1500 quid. Glazing will be well under 2k for 3 french doors and juliet glass rails. These prices are more realistic as were building it ourselves over a few months. Im seeing friends getting silly quotes of 75k for the same size. Ill be bringing mine in between 15 - 20k. Great video
I knew a guy who built a wooden boat. When we asked how much it cost he said, “I took all the receipts, organized them and put them in a binder as I went along. When I was done I sat down, opened the binder, then immediately closed it and threw it in the trash. I enjoy the boat too much to know how much I paid for it.”
Ha, that's probably the best approach!! 👍😂
Love it! It is the old saying isn't it, something is only worth what someone is prepared to pay. Probably threw it so his wife didn't find out 😀
Watch the rebuilding of Tally Ho (Sampson boat co) - I'm looking forward to their spreadsheet!
Well done mate. We mainly did large commercial/corporate jobs when I was still in it but did do a few small builds and extensions too. I just dug out my last set of builders bibles from 2009. Its m2 averages are £750 for basic going up to £980 for high spec (stone, thermal etc). We had our own formula that fell in between at the time. My earliest edition (early 00's), from £350 m2! Gone a bit crazy eh? Again though, excellent video and grand job on the extension.👍
So Pound is losing its value fast. X2 every 10 years. That makes saving money worthless.
Proper product placement with no less than three measuring tapes in the kitchen diner shots 👏
Just where we keep them! 😉👍
You also need to do an outtakes video or something like that- bouncing your noggin off the scaffolding back in February has to be in there 🤣
Just finished our kitchen extension (3m x 2.4m),Including upgrading kitchen units and new quartz worktop and semi solid oak floor.
I had a brickie, plasterer, joiner and plumber in. I did the wiring myself and I supplied all materials. I did all groundwork myself.
Including planning, building control, architect and structural engineer fees, the total cost was £14500.
Our expected cost was £15k.
Fantastic work - absolute bargain! 👍
2000 per sq m fully finished then 👍
That's incredible! Did you assemble the team yourself then? Please share your secret!!
Huge respect for that. It's also a potential massive help if your trade-competent. Being a tradesperson with connections helps. A lot!
why did you get planning for that size just give notice 48 hrs before and save loads of cash
Great video, really informative. We have an old (Victorian) stone-built detached house, to which we've done extensive renovations that have so far taken us 21 years, but we've done everything ourselves, except for some structural steelwork which the house needed in the cellars. One of the jobs we did was a full cellar restoration after the steelwork had been installed, this was a huge task as the cellars are full height rooms which cover the entire house footprint. I reckon we completed the work for about one tenth the cost of what it would have been if we had used contractors to do the same job, plus we probably got a higher standard of finish and everything was exactly how we wanted it. It is very hared work and very time-consuming, but you can't beat doing it yourself if you have the skills and the inclination
Thanks for taking the time to do that breakdown of costs - very useful.
And I'm glad you mentioned the costing of your own time. The trade off is your eye is always on the ball.
As some of your earlier posters mentioned, Building Regs change all the time, adding to your costs.
The great thing about being involved is that it (usually!) gets done how you want it.
I'm 67 now and have got 2 projects on the go for two of my sons. I think these will be my last
Particularly as they bought me the latest 1:24 scale Spitfire from Airfix for Xmas!
Great video, very helpful. Always best to get 3-5 quotes. A friend of mine saved £34,000 in total on a high quality extension just by getting different quotes. The ironic thing was, the expensive builders called back a month later asking if they've found a builder for the project. One reduced his original quote by £23,000 and another by £32,000. Shocking how much builders inflate the price.
Yup, lockdown boom! Now it will be post-lockdown bust. 😬
The real worry about builders who ‘make it up as they go along’ is once the project is underway and they get to think they may not be able to bring in the job - they will start ‘nickel and diming’ you or walk away.
I know a builder and says how he prices is to think of a price, then double it.
I got a small extension done and got quotes ranging from 12-36k. The architect recommended the cheapest bid, but actually got the builder to include extras he missed out on, so bid was upped to 15k. Builder did an great job, on time and on budget. A good architect is key.
Did you look at sip panels for the walls? They can be prefabricated and put up in days compared to the traditional wet trades. The thermal values are excellent and can be really cost effective.
Interesting
Biggest gripe I have is contractors who would rather grossly overprice a job instead of saying they’re to busy or not interested.
Simple solution is to just turn them down haha you asked them for a quote and that's how much they want for it to be attractive to them
@@mcfrosty8739 oh believe me I do. Just feel for the elderly and vulnerable being ripped off. Thankfully people are becoming more tech-savvy and can do their own research with help from few good honest people online.
A comprehensive explanation for new project managers. I give you 10 out of 10.
Fascinating as ever. I guess my #1 question is - if you were me, and therefore totally not a DIY person or skilled in any relevant trade, what would that have done to the costs? Do you know how much time/money a builder would have charged for the hours they would have needed? I'm assuming you are well aware how long it should have taken. I once tried to "manage" a significant refurb and the disagreements at the tail end with the builder were extremely stressful and unpleasant so I appreciate the fantastic job you did here - amazing!
I think a fair price would have been £70-90k. Anything above that is steep in my view... but I don't envy the task of builders so if they can get away with charging £140k then so be it!
Nice one, man - I'm also from the North East.
It is great to see a fellow Geordie on RUclips as we're in short supply.
With regard to money, I don't care as long as the job is done right since 'money' is fake anyway - and I do most of the work myself in the garden. When it comes to the building work on the house it costs whatever it costs as long as it's done right.
Fake? Where do I get this fake money from?
Random number generator! LOL. Well done, Andy. I would call it a renovation with an addition. And just for folks watching, the cost per square foot or meter, think about what is included in the renovation and/or addition. If you add one bedroom, vs one bathroom or kitchen, you have the two extremes, considering what is to be included in the new space. A bedroom would be the simplest sort of addition, with the least expensive components, vs a bathroom or kitchen that would include millwork, fixtures, plumbing, and more complex electrical considerations. So many things to consider, so that is why throwing a cost per square whatever at a project is a dangerous attempt at budgeting. I proper design should be done first and then get bids or quotes from reputable contractors or subcontractors. I have been in the design business for over 30 years and built many new homes as well as done many a renovation and addition. Don't get caught without a plan folks, and be sure that you make as many notes on those plans as you can, so you don't have contractors coming back to you with their hands out.
Cool - cheers Rob!
I managed a 7 meter dee and 8 m wide wall to wall extension, bedroom on first floor and a dormer in about £140000. I think I need another £20-30000 to now fully fit it out.
It has ufh and tiling on all three floors, no radiators and new wiring.
I achieved it by doing the work myself with my father and hiring two day labourers who did the grunt work.
The only thing I outsourced to contractors was brickwork, skimming and the hot water cylinder installation and the electric fuse board.
I did pipe work and electrics myself. Tiling myself. Etc etc. it’s taken two years of my life and probably another 6 months before I can get back to other stuff. But I have thoroughly enjoyed it. I won’t ever do it again though. 😂
My wife and I bought just under an acre of land for the purpose of eventually building our own home. We appointed an architect. He asked if you could delay building this home for atleast 12 months because building materials had gone up by at least 20%
I have been contemplating extending my house, looks like it’s achievable. Thanks for sharing
Good thing I can do the planning myself and also build it myself, all I would need to pay for would be materials and the groundwork! It is extremely beneficial to acquire construction skills in your lifetime!
If your roof plan is suitable highly recommend trussed rafters, very cheap, very rapid delivery and just send the provided calcs to building control. Cost way less than hiring a carpenter that's if you can find one who doesn't have a long waiting list. Unless you have the contacts it can be very difficult finding competent people especially in high cost busy areas.
Wow that's really useful, a great video thank you, my extension and renovation work starts next month, my costs are coming in around £70k, but that includes total renovation of the downstairs. but ya, this is so stressful, I can't tell you, not for the faint hearted, I hate stress. if you don't like stress, don't do this! It has certainly put me off doing such a large project again, and we've not even started yet.
Good luck with yours - enjoy the journey and try to have a laugh when things get really hard. 👍😁🤞
Thanks for this, we’re about to get ready for an 8x3m kitchen extension, a pretty big kitchen. I’m grateful for these costings
We had a 28m^2 extension in 2019. Had quotes ranging from £35k to £120k. Ended up going with a builder friends had used and ended up spending around £45k on the shell I think, with another £15k spent on finishing, kitchen etc. Based on your numbers we overspent a little, but we had so much troubling finding a builder who would get back to me with a quote. In the end though the shell, boiler, electrics were all done within 4.5 months with the finishing taking us a month. Worst part of the experience was shelling out £3.5k to an architect when it turned out I could have spent £600 with someone else for the same work. With post covid prices I wouldn't even contemplate doing any project like this again.
Yes, architect fees are another story. This can vary vastly depending how involved they are in the project.
Could you expand on the "spent £600 with someone else for the same work"? In hindsight you wouldn't have used an architect?
@@oldboyuk I had a few other issues with the architect that I ended up choosing and when building control came round to do one of the first checks on the foundation I grumbled about the architect. He asked who it was and I said and he sighed. I wasn't the first one to complain about them to him. He said as I knew exactly what I wanted to do anyway I could have phoned building control and asked for advice and they would have directed me to someone they use a lot who would have only been £600. I think it was an architect assistant or something along those lines. Not a fully qualified architect but can do the drawings etc that were required by building control and the builders themselves.
Architect gave me bad advice relating to party wall agreement, kept on leaving bifold doors on the drawing despite saying 5 times on the phone and in emails we wanted French doors; which he then tried to charge me extra to change them. They got someone around to look at the drainage and managed to draw it the wrong way round and again tried to charge me to fix it. I initially got them involved so they could deal with the whole project. They assured me what I wanted could be done well within budget. Got one of his builders around who quoted double my budget so I ended up sacking him. Drawings were complete by then and used a builder some friends had used. He dealt with everything for me, was open about the pricing and explained when issues came up and how they'd be rectified.
@@JamesTombs Thanks a lot for the advice. I've never been a fan of the idea of spending thousands on a architect for a basic extension. Good tip to speak to building control for someone they might recommend. Cheers
Our architect was a waste of money, we ended up doing the plans ourselves so we could have saved £1200
Andy, thanks for being so well organised as to be able to provide that info! I guess you sacrificed the opportunity of a fair amount of income to be able to work on the house yourself. Did I miss you saying how long it all took? All the best
The shell took about 7 months, the finishing took about another 3-4 months. Worked around our day-jobs. 👍
Most insightful of all the building videos I've watched, so many about the different ways to build but no one has broken in down by doing it yourself as opposed to asking the builder. thank you
I've just had an itemised quote for something very very similar to yours, wraparound double on side single at back and I nearly fell over. 104k just for the shell. Roof and retailing existing roof came in at 30K!!
Looks like I'm project managing this one
I’ve been waiting for some time for such a detailed and honest appraisal video. Absolutely fantastic. Subscribed
Welcome on board!
In the U.S. we primarily use 'addition' to describe any new added space, but extension also works.
Yeah but in the U.S you can’t even say tomato right and you drive on the wrong side of the road.
Extention” is the English language term, whiltst “addition” is a US language term. English uses addition when measuring liquid, materials, and furnitures.
Very thorough breakdown of costings but, only what I'd expect from someone so meticulous and tidy.... well done to you both. HNY.
Thank you and HNY too!
One minute I'm watching your drumming videos and now one on self build. A man of many talents. I'm trying to do my self build for < 2k/m2
This video has really alleviated my fears. People have been telling me I'd be spending 2k/m2 just for the shell. I'm going to do the groundworks, cut roof, tile roof and second fix carpentry / bathrooms myself. So hoping to save a fair amount.
This is fascinating. We decided not to extend but to remove one wall between rooms, add a nice big patio door and then do some internal repairs including moving the bathroom. We thought we were being really sensible and frugal with our changes. We made detailed architects drawings and costed our materials at 43k including the floors, new kitchen, doors. We got a building company in who want cash in hand. They quoted 91k for their work. We now have to do the work ourselves. We are not paying 91k in cash for a start and we know it's not 91k of work either. I'm disgusted by the post-covid building scene.
And I should clarify that would be 91k and then we would still spend our 43 for materials
@@onemanfran That is beyond disgusting and our government clearly does nothing to prevent this blatant profiteering. We've been renting for most of our lives, will retire in 2 years and have saved about 100k. There will be a small lump sum from our pensions to add to this and we were thinking of buying a house to save on rent. Unfortunately, with house prices as extortionate as they are, we're having second thoughts since we'd be left with almost no savings. Past years of 0% interest + uncontrolled mortgage multipliers (used to be 2.5) + much, much longer payback terms (used to be 21 years) - and, most damningly, a government that deliberately allowed this catastrophe - has destroyed the housing market. Why do governments not look after the population? !!
Good work! I’ve got plans for a double on the front and single out the back, I was told to look at 2500+VAT just for the shell = over 200k ;/
Hey boss, in the states what you did is called an "Addition" that's the common slang. I just finished a 4,000 sq ft addition to my existing 1500 sq ft home here in the states at the exact same time as you. Stated documenting it on my YT channel and got lost in the details. Phenomenal build on yours as always. Wouldnt expect anything different from you. Been with you since the beginning. Bring back "Measuring Up!!!" haha
Lol that's ridiculously huge!! 😂 Will check out some of your vids! 👍
I've only come across your channel yesterday but you are definitely one of my favourite content creators! So knowledgeable and just and all around nice guy!
Excellent video and breakdown of costs involved in this particular build. Every project is different and usually throws up its own issues.
What an absolutely fantastic video - can't believe I found this amount of real knowledge/experience by accident... like/subscribed and looking forward to the next one 👍👍
Hi sir imagine having the work done in London , the plumbing alone would have been 30 grand . As a retired electrical contractor , I still think most people are being ripped off . When I started work in 1968 the local builder’s would probably just live in a detached house with a bit of a garden and drove around in an old jag . Fast forward to today and may have massive properties with a couple of top of the range cars in the garage , and a property abroad . And that’s why many (not all ) are conning the public , pure greed . And they even employ cheap labour , to add insult to injury . I don’t envy anyone looking for work to be done unless you actually know them . Kind regards as always
Sellers market and I see no signs of anything being doing to bring skills to younger people. 🙄👍
This has been really useful, cheers! I was told that the guideline price for my area is very much at the top end.
I have a couple of questions:
- Whereabouts roughly are you based?
- Do you have an idea of how much value it's added to your property?
It has been inspirational to follow and well done, you are an absolute gent! One question: If you were to include your own labour,, how many hours did you commit to the project and if you were to pay yourself an average hourly rate, how much would that have cost?
They're special people eh! 100% agree.
Too complex to go in to on here, but will cover on the time/staging vid. 👍
Really good level of detail I look forward to watching your other videos. We’ve been trying to figure out how much an extension would cost and had mixed results from speaking around.
Great video, which couldn’t have come at a more appropriate time as we start our own extension journey! We have witnessed several builder nightmares and hope we can avoid this happening to us. Would be interested to know where you got your kitchen quote from? Well done and look forward to seeing further videos.
This was such a great video, from clarity to quality of information shared. Wow, super well done , subscribed !
This must have taken a lot of work. Thanks Andy. Good job you are a complete control freak, looks like it's saved you about a hundred grand! Well done to you and Mrs Mac👏🏼
Cheers Mandy - it was quicker to fit our entire kitchen than it was to make this video!! 😂
@@GosforthHandyman I can well believe it!
Finding Decent trades is the biggest problem in the uk…. I’ve been in construction 22 years and it’s now worse than it’s ever been…. Good luck to anyone having work done 👍
That’s crazy. I thought I could do a nice diy little extension for under 20 grand! I’d be doing brickwork myself
At a very rough guess, and for a flat roof rather than pitched (because I don't tile!), I would charge £70,000 for that...but it would be a passive extension - I don't do ordinary U value extensions anymore. That would include everything, and I mean all plans, groundwork, walls, roof, triple glazing, whisper-quiet electric heating, finished...to a very high decorative order, with shadow line skirting and fancy LED lighting.
Very thorough Andy thank you. Getting any decent tradesmen/company to quote and do a job is a nightmare. And i can quite understand why your other building company only does commercial stuff now and there are a variety of reasons why. Im really impressed with your spreadsheet skills 😊 by the why. There is another issue thats a modern day thing, so as we are a simular age. We grew up with people who do things and we learnt from them. Sadly a large proportion of people cant put a plug on. And if it cant be bought from amazon (expecting perfection from a box) they struggle. Just different times thats all. I recently bought a new washing machine and some younger people were amazed that it was plumbed in and working within half n hour, not a difficult job at all we both know, but you get the picture. Thank Andy great vids as always.
Cheers Paul! Yes, absolutely. It was a real eye opener when I did property maintenance work, how much stuff folk just couldn't do for themselves. Changing light bulbs, basic repairs to blinds and one person even paid me to put their new lawn mower together! 😬😁
I’m in the middle of an extension build currently. We are knocking out a supporting walls to create an open plan kitchen diner with no folds. From re mortgage to now it’s taken over a year. Builders generally took at least a week to visit and another week or two to quote. Architects when I found one that was free took months to produce plans that were wrong and further weeks with constant chasing to produce correct final plans, I had the same issue with the structural engineer. The final figure was around 25k over what was quoted and the final project has been extremely compromised due to inflated costs. Having said all of that my builder and his crew are (so far) really good and hardworking and pleasant with really good comms. I’m hopeful of getting to a first fix (plaster/electrics/plumbing) at about 40k.
Also the steels (box steel and further large beam) are ridiculously over rated and would look at home sporting a railway bridge.
Excellent as always. Been looking forward to this one. Our wrap around single storey extension project is due to start in May. I am dreading our re-quote a month before. We got our price in feb 21 (edit Feb 22 sorry) and then booked our preferred builder based on reputation and then chose to wait over a year to get them. In terms of cost comparison, the 3 quotes we got were all within 10k for a circa 90k project and the average was bang on what the architect guessed prior to gaining quotations. I should add our project includes a complete ground floor rework (remove all walls and create new rooms), large bifold, large glass feature window and 2 triple velux roof windows in a pitched roof plus move of an existing window and sill adjustment plus plumbing and electrics (we just need to source flooring, kitchen and final decoration.
I am also wondering what effect the new building regs will have on the re-quote: We didn't get regs done until after the change so the walls have changed for example, cavity now wider etc, so assumed more insulation.
I would love to do some of the project management but just don't have etc time with work or other family commitments. Am tempted to fit the kitchen myself though and will be doing some built in cupboard work.
Good luck with yours! Unfortunately Feb '21 is just before prices really started to ramp up. Could be significantly more now, although probably not as bad as mid-2022. 👍
@@GosforthHandyman thanks. oops, just noticed the obvious mistake of which bloody year we are in. Feb 22 was the quote, so hoping the jump isn't too big.
Ah, should be OK. Feb 22 was probably peak of timber costs... I think.
What building regs changed?
Thanks Andy, this was very interesting & meticulous. I really don’t know how you found enough time to do it all, then I read on another comment you had a day job too!! Amazing, well done to both of you 🙌👏👏👏👏.
Labour costs are crazy. Back in 2005 I managed and helped to build a small 10m2 lean to extension and it came in at about £8000 including carpets and decoration. £2000 of that was a raft foundation and then 5 days’ labour for brickies. I’ve just build a cedar clad fully insulation garden office for £6000.
It's great reading all the DIYers comments here, 10% the cost etc. Well here's the thing! If you contract a building company in to do work you will more than likely have to pay VAT on the value of the work then there corporation tax they will have to pay, plus they will add a percentage for overheads such as liability insurance, handling paperwork etc. They will quite rightly add a profit margin so they can expand their business or use it purchase new equipment, etc. that's not including wages to subcontractors! I mean 20 years to do your renovations? it would've been cheaper contracting a professional builder! And if you've all had dodgy builders in the past, blame yourselves for taking the cheapest quote and not even doing you groundwork by checking out their qualifications!
Cheers Andy, very nice of you to share. Great job all around on the extension
Cheers Doug!
In the cost, have you track and calculated your hours thet you have worked on the extensions?
Thank you for taking your time and sharing this with the public, top man 👍🏻
I clicked on this with very low expectations but I am now subscribed. Good job!
A very good and detailed breakdown of the costs. It would be good to break down labour costs per hour or day, as this will make calculations easier. You did not mention about how much additional cost was occurred because of error and the rectifying that error. In each project errors will occur, some small whilst others jaw breaking. Another way of getting an idea of cost is to look around your local area and ask them to give a ball park on how much it cost them.
We didn't really have any error costs since everything was planned to the last detail and we knew the house intimately by that point. Will cover time spent in a bit more detail on a future vid though. 👍
@@GosforthHandyman watching a lot on homes under hammer even they dont have many errors on build. Big ones if you are not careful is the likes of asbestos in the property , and making sure supporting properly window appertures if fitting new windows, but they are not really "new build" situations. obviously one problem can be ensuring the supply of materials - which you had with the doors but even that was a time cost rather than significant money cost
Excellent breakdown and information. Provides much clarity.
Subject change though, with domestic cats killing 50 million birds a year in the UK why would and cat owner encourage birds to visit their garden by providing food for them.
I live in a high cost area (thanks London) so I think my single story extension, wetroom, new bathroom, garden studio, refurb kitchen and total redecoration of the whole house as well as painting the exterior was around half what people in my neck of wood say. I did do a lot of upcycling like used one door as the back door (no bi-folds) and the other one went into the studio, and 2 second hand solid oak doors kitchens to make mine. I could have done it a lot cheaper, but I did splash out in certain areas like ceramic flooring and taps. Not sure I want to ever see a heat gun (spindles are a nightmare) or a paint roller again.
Fantastic stuff Jules - yeah I dread to think what all of that would have cost! You have the satisfaction of knowing it's done properly too. 👍😊
Very interesting, did you video it, please show us.
@@user-pf5xq3lq8i Nope. Too busy dong the stuff.
Hi Jules, please could you share with me who you used and your feedback on them?
Me too. We are looking into a loft conversion and single storey extension in N. London. Any steers on who you have used, what we can do ourselves would be greatly appreciated
1950 terrace house..What's some things that you would absolutely add on?
1.Additional bedroom?
2.2nd bathroom?
3.washer/dryer on second floor?
4. Can I bin the bathtub for showers?
5. Get it insulated to EPC level C?
Great video as always. Also need to be mindful of the extra costs when using trades. They always find some issue that will inflate the quote.
I like the fact that people dont expect a small building company to make a profit only a wage. We are running businesses like the ones most people work for and are there to make a profit not a charity
Oh no no no.. You must be a con artist if you quote to include a little profit. Imagine that 😂😂
What I’m confused about is your judgements on what people should be earning or charging. Some trades are much more difficult than others both in terms of skill required, danger and cost of equipment. Roofers, for example. how much would someone have to pay you to carry thousands of tiles up ladders of your back for example with all the contentions that come with that. There are fewer people available to do these jobs therefore the price is higher.
In terms of “profit” you’ve not considered the actual cost of running the business - 100k worth of equipment is not unusual, 12k a year on fuel, 10k a year on insurance, works unit rental cost, cost of repairs, wages and staff pension contributions, business rates, ongoing training costs, replacement of tools and equipment that can’t be repaired, time spent on “free quotes” which can take 100s of hours each year, accounting costs the list goes on. Most self employed trades I know run on about 15 to 20% real terms profit. Your roofers for example perhaps made £1500 for a week. Divide that by the number of people on site and that’s their wages. That’s why it’s rare to see builders pulling out of the driveways of huge houses in the morning.
The oversimplification of everything is all too common these days.
We are getting quotes for a double story extension 50m2 x2 and a single story at the back of about 25m2 but also a total refurb of the old kitchen. I find your breakdown of cost very helpful. We are in the Wickham area. Quotes in the first instant ranged from 54k up to 120k.
it seems a little skewed to compare a total were you consider your and Ms Mac's time free versus a fully hands off quote, it'd be interesting to see a fair price put on all that work as well! Great job as always.
Cheers! Yes, too much for this vid but will be covering time / staging on a future vid. We put a lot of hours in but we had the flexibility to work around our day-jobs. 👍
@@GosforthHandyman You were still working? With everything you were doing I assumed you were full time renovation.
While it’s interesting to know how much time they put in, I don’t think it skews anything. They worked in their spare time, so their labour was free. I get paid to do my day job, because the company I work for puts that value on my labour. I don’t get paid by anyone for my spare time though, so it makes no sense to pretend that my spare time has a monetary value. That’s not to say I don’t value my time, but it’s not a financial value.
@@BunkerMentality a protracted explanation of the blindingly obvious, I should have thought ........!?
@@BunkerMentality I think it does skew it somewhat, his time obviously has a monetary value as the skills he possesses has enabled him to get the end result at such a good price, i think the original question above was looking for a comparison of what it would have cost if he did nothing himself I think you would then see how much his time was worth.
Excellent!!! Yep roof and the windows doors were slightly over.
Really useful, and many thanks for all your other videos. I'm about to start an extension, and this information is really valuable.
Nice video! We were quoted £60 to £120k + VAT for a 15m2 extension (!!). This was mid-2022. The 120k + VAT worked out at the best part of £10,000 per square metre of new space. Plus kitchen, flooring, glazing, tiling, sanitaryware! I politely told that builder (who had the audacity to say that they "might" be able to visit to properly quote and in the end just did it off structural drawings) that they were living in cloud cuckoo land. I never heard from them again, strangely enough. I've noticed an interesting change in the past few months though. I have shortlisted builders calling me up now, asking if I have an update on any upcoming works. The same builders I had to beg to come round and have a look for a quote a few months ago. My theory is that the post-Lockdown boom is over, people are going back to the office more, remortgages are expensive, cost of living is up, and builders are starting to panic that the order books are drying up into 2023-24. We shall see.
Yup, totally agree. Lockdown boom had a lot to answer for. As folk tighten their belts builders are really going to struggle in 2023 I think. 👍
Your theory is correct. I've been expecting and waiting for this to happen since March 2022 when inflation started to take off and central banks started raising interest rates. We need a small extension but there was no way I was paying with prices at historical highs (2020-2022), it would be like buying shares right at the top of the market, throwing money away. Basically as the Fed raise interest rates to quell inflation in the US, the BoE has to follow in the UK. The result of this will be inflation dropping off, but the consequence of that will be a big recession. The higher interest rates go, the bigger the recession. Recessions mean demand drops, which in turns means prices come down, although prices can be 'sticky' and lag a bit behind.
@@garethedwards5159 Finally, someone who understands how economics works 👍 Everything you’ve said is absolutely 100% spot on.
@@garethedwards5159 Just one point, inflation isn't in the regulated money markets. It was a supply-driven rise in prices which would fall off as supply chains unblocked. Inventories in the US are still not going down. Now the opposite problem is about to occur as international freight rates fall, and China isn't really able to return output to pre-pandemic levels. And the CPI is falling for the wrong reasons, as its not being driven by increases in supply. Its being driven by a fall off in demand over and beyond 'post-pandemic normalisation.
The real problem in the International Money Markets is that they are nervous, and are unwilling to provide credit without collateral that is government-backed. They're not interested in mortgage-backed securities or junk bonds, causing a shortage in credit to fuel international commerce. China is the biggest victim, but the volume of debt around is scaring lenders in the international monetary system, and they don't trust each other. If the IMS is choking off the supply of credit, that will impact the availability of financing in the regulated markets too that are controlled by central banks, like the Fed too.
Base rate changes are a political decision, and have zero impact on the availability of credit to the lenders. Collateral in the IMS does that. Base rate changes are to target wage increases, and employment figures last week showed that wages aren't growing, and job numbers only grew in part-time employment. So base rate hikes are in danger of killing off consumer demand, leaving retailers high and dry, causing real job losses to accelerate above and beyond what we see now. That's why lending criteria in regulated banking are getting tougher and less mortgage products for variable and fixed rate loans are in the consumer market now. There's simply isn't enough money around, for businesses or consumers. That means deflation is more likely now. The only cure is the Fed to issue new treasury bills or notes, and they're not doing that, because they aren't paying attention to the lack of credit flowing in from the IMS. There aren't enough US Treasury bills to support the global economy. The Fed is trying to maintain confidence in their ability to "steer the economy", when in reality they're not in driving seat. The IMS is, and it's feeling nervous because they feel a global recession is coming, and everyone is overburdened with debt. And governments are worried too, because the debt is too big to repay, and they are relying on inflation to erode it away. As its unpopular and probably politically impossible to raise taxes in the US right now, the Fed, like other central banks will not be issuing new bonds to provide liquidity, so things are going to grind to a halt this year or next year in the global economy, and it will be 2008 again. We have to wait and see if that's right.
@@BigHenFor Can’t argue much with that either. We are indeed on a course towards rekindling market conditions of 2008. The scale of debt is colossal and even a small run will quickly gather momentum.
Some strange folk will dismiss this as “negativity” as they’ve no clue that their ignorant emotion is already priced in. The same people are usually those who lose everything as they weren’t paying attention.
Construction is already showing signs of slowing and those builders who believe they’re ‘booked all year’ are in for a rude awakening. They always think the good times will last. They are always wrong. Always.
Not many people truly understand the magnitude of what is brewing. The shake out will be historical and has the potential to make 2008 appear a walk in the park. The bubble is about to poppity pop 🎈
Very helpful to understand what cost could be, and I think you have done it for a very good price!
Excellent video, I'm glad I stumbled across this (Subscribed). I've been refurbishing our home for some time now, doing all the work myself. We still have a single story kitchen diner extension that we want to build on the back and were going to leave this bit for a professional builder but with costs of things the way they are now, this has really inspired me to look into managing the build myself. I have most of the tools that I'd need already for the bits that I'd do. One question though. I'd love to get my hands on your Excel template for costs that I could customise. Have you considered sharing this? Good work on this.
I've just completed my extension
I'm an electrician by trade but moved up to project management
So I thought it would be a good idea to manage my own extension. I asked for a quote from a builder who had done a friend of mine extension. He came back with a 40k shell only 9mx6m no interia works except the steels and knock through just drainage and soak away and Gutterings
Well, everything went to plan at the beginning except his son breaking his arm the first day, so I had to step in and help where I could to stop him pulling off for 6-8 weeks
All went well, but towards the end of the job, starting getting stupid excuses about steels, etc and then he decided to pull off site without completing the soak away and few other bits and leaving a leak which was a pain in the ass to fix as he installed a Rubber membrane roof called EPDM which no roofer will repair
So I'll have to take him to small claims court unfortunately to claim back some of the additional costs I have had to pay out for, which was on his original quote.
But moving forward, I got over those issues and installed a wet underfloor heating system supplied from a new electric boiler designed for underfloor heating as energy costs are going through the roof
Overall, I did 90% of the internal works myself electrics,plumbing,carpentry,painting,fitting kitchen,installing new shower room it roughly works out to be 80m2, everything including all building control documents £85k
And I would say the finishes are towards the high-end costs
Overall, I can say it was well worth it if you are able to do most of it yourself because even being in the trade, if you give some people an inch, they take a mile. And they will never do it to your standards
I was quoted £7000 to re roof my 3 bed existing semi and a new pitchedroof extension which is half the size of my existing roof. I sourced the tiles myself for £1100 and the battens, lead, dpm, nails for £600 and found an older roofer who charged £150 a day. It took him 5 days in bad weather. Go figure
Nice saving. 🇬🇧 👍
Done a single story full length extension adding a front office, utility room middle and then extended kitchen with two skylights and bifold doors. All in fully finished it was £45k but that was with no bricklayer costs as me and my father in law (he's the brickie) done it together. The extension was 10x3m including a front bay. Honestly I don't know how anyone could project manage without a decent knowledge of building to sort all kinds of issues. My father in law sorted so many snags from 30+ years of building experience, without him I'd have been up shits creek relying on random trades to help me out. I think if it's straightforward you can do it at am good price but the second you run into issues you could start adding thousands onto the cost of the trades so be careful!
Love the product placement! Reminds me I could do with a tape measure!😂
👍👍😎
I was wondering how many people saw the placement of the tape measures
Best break down ever on you tube. Very much appreciated ❤ thanks a lot.
Was incredibly shocked at the cost versus size of the extension! What an achievement Andy! I'm going through the architect phase at the moment for a large conversion with front gable & loft conversion. Hoping to manage as much as I can, minus larger structural pieces
I used to do loads of extensions in gosforth and jesmond areas, these are the sort of areas good builders can get a good name for themselves, good video mate
Best advice I’ll give to anyone living in England, try and find some Polish or non-English tradesmen or builders, they’ll do just as a good job at two thirds of the price.
@dooby6400 I’ve not had any issues with foreign builders, nor have my parents, been living here (In England) all my life.
@@LogicPak If they are a lot cheaper they are probably cutting corners. They don't work for less money if they are well skilled. That's just not true
they work for less money initially, because any money is welcome and more than anything they would have earned back home. Most have families who live abroad and usually don’t have many major outgoings or mortgages to pay here, they work hard for less, send all the money home and then the plan is to one day go back to their native countries. They’re just as skilled as other countries rely on tradesmen too.
@@LogicPak Most of them aren't even tradesmen . They don't do a good finish and when you go abroad to most eastern European countries have a look at the quality of there work !
I had similar issues when planning mine, double extension with gable end, 2 bedrooms upstairs over full open plan kitchen, had quotes from 72k-160k, it’s near impossible to find good trades, and when you do they don’t want the work, luckily we found the right builder, 80k fully completed, decorated, new 40kw baxi, underfloor heating etc, kitchen on top, roughly 16k, extras 4k total 100k finished
Just bear in mind the building regs have changed with regards to thermal insulation, adding considerable costs to a build getting done now.
Yup! We were very lucky to escape the new Part L changes. Even more cost! Ironically means homeowners just won't bother, leaving their older homes significantly less thermally efficient. 🙄
@@GosforthHandyman would be nice to see a calculation of the added upfront cost for the extra insulation compared to the expected savings on reduced energy usage.
@@GosforthHandyman Our climate is probably getting warmer anyway. Most newer UK homes will be to warm
I wonder with current cost of materials and labour if it's cheaper to move house to something bigger rather than extend?
Builders using random number generators... absolutely f***ing priceless...you have the internet for the day... Regards
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Excellent video on pricing a build and what it would deliver…really important way to break it down! Thank you for sharing!!