I dated a girl that owned a Pontiac J2000 Sunbird hatchback. I was never a fan of General Motors products but I grew to like that Sunbird. It handled well, it was comfortable, and fairly reliable.
John Davis' brilliance is that he never says anything bad about a vehicle to the point where a manufacturer would decline sending examples over, even though the car may be a complete rolling turd on wheels.
@@MercOnethe problem was that mostly everything in that era was garbage. If he didn't have an upbeat attitude about what he was reviewing, it would have been one depressing show.
Thank you for the classic GM/ Oldsmobile review. They are appreciated. That front end styling came back years later. It was used on 1997-2004 Oldsmobiles. You can see it on the Intrigue, Aurora and Alero. The headlight design was used on 1960's Oldsmobiles and late 1970's and early 1980's Pontiac Bonneville/ Parisienne and Grand Prix. The car paved the way stylistically.
@@chadhaire1711I was referring the front end styling on the car and what it influenced years later. I said nothing about the engineering or the quality of the vehicle. You did.
Our family owned three J cars over the years. A 1983 Cavalier station wagon, a 1992 Cavalier coupe, and a 2003 Cavalier coupe. All very reliable and economical vehicles. Unlike many today.
Had 6 J-bodies in my family, from my Aunts '83, my dads '86, grandmas '97, brothers '99, my cousins '02, and my Uncles '05, all bought new, all of them saw well over 150k, and not one of them had any issues!
And 84 wagon with a four-speed manual transmission lasted 478 k mi but unfortunately the Midwest got the best of it when the rear end literally split in half, got to love rust
Reminds me so much of mom's 83 cavalier. Ah memories. She finally got rid of it in 01 in favor of a new CRV which i don't think has hit 100k miles yet.
I always found the hatchback to be the best looking of all of the gen 1 J's. 3:23..............Oldsmobile ALWAYS had the best gauge (sorry, GM, I'm spelling it the correct way) package in the industry, in my opinion!!!!
As the J cars were essentially badge engineered parts bin cars, a lot was shared across the platform. My 84 Skyhawk shared the same dash and instrument cluster, only with slightly different graphics on the gauge faces. On the other side, the Cavalier, J2000/2000/Sunbird, and Cimmaron shared the same dash and instrument clusters. At least until 85 when the Cavalier RS was introduced with a new dash, but the entry level Cavaliers retained the original dash.
I had 3 of the GM J platform vehicles, a Chevrolet Cavalier, Pontiac Sunbird and Pontiac Sunfire, the Sunfire was the only 4 door sedan I had out of the J platform vehicles, the other 2 were 2 door coupes. I liked the Buick and Oldsmobile versions, didn’t know about the Cadillac version until a few years ago.
The only Firenza I've ever seen was the hatchback model. Here I was thinking it was one of the GM X bodies... Some time later, it wound up in an area junkyard -- still running, and used to haul cutting torches around after they removed the hatch.
I had an 84 Buick Skyhawk coupe with the 2.0L OHV engine. I drove bother the 1.8L SOHC and 2.0L OHV. I preferred the 2.0L for the lower end torque and acceleration felt more linear. The engine was fault free during the time I owned the car. I felt the Buick and Oldsmobile J car had the better dashboard design and wondered why it wasn’t used in the Cadillac over the Caviler based dash. Avoided the hatchback. I could easily see that rear hatch glass getting smashed in an accident or intentional for theft attempt or vandalism. Replacing factory tires with touring tires changed the overall feel of the car.
My Aunt had a 1985 Pontiac Sunbird hatchback. It was a very handsome sporty looking car - 2 tone black/grey paint job, with rear louvers on the hatchback and a light window tint all around and it said formula on the side - 14 year old me thought it was really cool the front end had the quad headlight design like the older Firebirds. The interior was a grey and plushy with a decent factory stereo and orange backlit gauge cluster. She kept it until 1999 without any major problems.
I had a 1984 model similar to the one in the studio with an automatic transmission. I did a 360º turn in it back in '93 while driving downhill on a patch of black ice. Thankfully, I was able to straighten it out without crashing it.
I recognize that weight and horsepower have really changed over the last forty years, but can you imagine someone marketing a car in the US with 84 horsepower in 2024?
@@rickjohansson4257 I fully recognize that, however, even with light weight 84 horsepower is nothing. They listed the 0 to 60 time at over fourteen seconds; that would not be acceptable to the buying public. One also has to also consider that interstate speed has gone back to 70 or 75 miles an hour in most states rather than 55.
@rickjohansson4257 They also had paper thin body panels, floor panels, and frames. There was barely a point to seatbelts if the car balled up in slow collisions.
We had a new ’85 Buick Skyhawk. The top of the dashboard above the gauges was warped from the factory. That was nice to look at every time you drove the car. The trunk lid seal leaked from day one. Timing belt and ball joint failures before 50K miles. The paint looked OK but did not offer much corrosion protection. Even with good care the car looked awful within seven years due to rust along the bottom of the doors. The only other engine we owned that made as much noise without doing anything was in an ’82 Chevette.
I grew up in the 2000s, and I saw 70s and 80s cars on a daily basis, including the Olds Delta 88, Ford Country Squire, '88 Pontiac Grand Prix, and 80's Nissan 300ZX. I can say for absolute certainty that I've never seen a Firenza in my 30 years of life.
@ The 80s cars were still really common in the 2000s and have all universally vanished in the last 10-15 years. Must be that Brazilian-sourced powertrain.
I never ever heard that "Jedsel" term. The J-body was hardly class-leading, but GM made running improvements and really got them dailed in by 1986. If you had the 2 or 2.2 liter Cavalier engine, the cars proved to be quite reliable and durable, and never expensive to repair. They ended up outlasting most of their competitors and were about the only small cars still on the road 15+ years later.
Bizarrely equipped car. Stick shift with crank windows, no cassette deck, and manual locks, but full door pockets, gauges, a/c, and a power driver's seat?
Merry Christmas, John. I've been watching you since the early 80s on PBS. The J for Jetsols😂. In hindsight the J bodies were junk, but at that time they were considered okay for the price.
Not the greatest. But better than the crossover garbage people drive today. Modern vehicles are disposable appliances. At least 80s cars were serviceable and easy to maintain
I had an ‘83 Skyhawk with the optional Brazilian 1.8 OHC and an automatic (not my choice, by the way). I appreciated the fuel injection and relatively free-revving nature but it had zero torque. It could never muster a satisfying shove from a standstill. If you gave it the boot the best you could hope for is it to s-l-o-o-o-o-w-l-y gather momentum if you were willing to wait long enough.
Buick would solve the slow acceleration with the T-Type variants a year later. A friend of mine bought an 84 Skyhawk T-Type from my ex- brother-in-law and that car had excellent acceleration; sub 8 second 0-60.
It was rapidly improving starting in 1982. Power levels started improving, handling and cornering power were rising, fuel injection was becoming more common, and aerodynamics was being considered.
A widow making 85 horsepower. No airbags, no abs. The 80’s were a dark time for the automobile industry. Emissions controls choked these beyond redemption. Industry was just trying to survive.
For me, I loved the 1984-1988 Ford Thunderbird aero coupe. I bought a new 1985 Mustang GT hatchback because you couldn’t get the 302 5spd in the T-Bird. To me, the fox body looked like a door wedge. But it was fun.
Maybe it was "OK". I am not sure how long it would have lasted. I don't think it would last like any contemporary Toyota. I do like that it had the 5 speed manual transmission and the throttle body injection. Also, having the full instrument cluster with ALL necessary gauges is nice. Not having to struggle with a carburetor in the winter is nice. I actually would have found this to be a more than acceptable first car in the late 80's (used) when I first started driving.
Good God. Driving in the 80s must have been hell. 14.5 seconds 0-60? 5.5 seconds 40-55? Thats horrific, a tractor trailer can do that. I still don't know how people accepted the fact that cars built 20 years later were SLOWER than cars built in the 60s. 70s gas crisis or not, just unacceptable. The fact that this is considered somewhat sporty and fun is legit horrifying.
i can only imagine trying to tell anyone these are "good, average performers" today. but a later turbo Olds Aerotech engine and all wheel drive would make that little tin can scoot.
The Oldsmobile Firenza and Buick Skyhawk were my choices from GM in this class. The Chevrolet Cavalier did nothing for me. There’s a difference between a Buick and a Chevrolet, or in this case, and Oldsmobile and a Chevrolet.
You can smoke one of those Salems by the time it got to 60mph.
😂
@@kentmcginnis2649Lol..for real. I haven’t smoked in 13 years but just seeing that pack made my ears go up!🫠
It’s still hadn’t reached 60 😂
Oh, my sides!! This might be one of my recent favorite retro reviews. "Jedsel," Salem cig pack, "IOU," screaming tires, sludgy acceleration, wow.
I had an 84 Skyhawk and at no point would I have described its powertrain as "gutsy"
My first hand me down car when in college was a 1983 Citation. I was thankful the day someone crashed into it and totaled it. :D
I dated a girl that owned a Pontiac J2000 Sunbird hatchback. I was never a fan of General Motors products but I grew to like that Sunbird. It handled well, it was comfortable, and fairly reliable.
Incredible! It looks clapped out even when new!
3:29 John: OURS HAD THE OPTIONAL GAUGE PACKAGE THAT WAS CLEAR AND COMPLETE! LOL
The "extremely attractive" ones, nonetheless!
John was happy and no digital!
More caps lock
It do look busy though! I thought no way more than four no more than speed+tacos+coolant+fuel but there are SIX!?
I think John probably lit up one of those Salems after seeing that gauge package
John Davis' brilliance is that he never says anything bad about a vehicle to the point where a manufacturer would decline sending examples over, even though the car may be a complete rolling turd on wheels.
Which largely discredits him when it comes to American products of the era. He clearly was biased. These cars were utter shit and he knew it.
@@MercOnethe problem was that mostly everything in that era was garbage. If he didn't have an upbeat attitude about what he was reviewing, it would have been one depressing show.
@@TheAlexisReign yeah anything American was. This was when the Japanese and the Germans took hold in the USA because this trash like this olds.
@@TheAlexisReignExcept for the Germans and especially the Japanese who took hold during this time because of POS products like this junk Oldsmobile.
@@TheAlexisReignExcept for the Japanese and Germans who took hold during this time because of American junk like this.
Maps or packs! Boy, those were the days.
Look how simple a car you got back then. Now you get a rolling tablet waiting to brick itself at any hint of voltage fluctuation or static shock!
More technology needed to help technology progress into future technology.
the tires turned to dust in the panic braking. I liked these! Esp the hatch Firenza. I have an 85 Sunbird turbo hatch
Cars have come a long way in 40 years...
Thank you for the classic GM/ Oldsmobile review. They are appreciated. That front end styling came back years later. It was used on 1997-2004 Oldsmobiles. You can see it on the Intrigue, Aurora and Alero. The headlight design was used on 1960's Oldsmobiles and late 1970's and early 1980's Pontiac Bonneville/ Parisienne and Grand Prix. The car paved the way stylistically.
This car was ugly and an engineering piece of garbage....what are you smoking Homie?
@@chadhaire1711I was referring the front end styling on the car and what it influenced years later. I said nothing about the engineering or the quality of the vehicle. You did.
@@OLDS98 What is the point if the car overall was utter shit?
@@OLDS98 Yep..because you left it out and this car is but-naked UGLY.....even the car rental companies didn't want it.
One of my cousins had one and she said it was an ok car for the time she had it.
They outlawed Salem Menthol in California hahaha Ohhhh the good ole days.
Love those white walls. That 0-60 time is smokin.
Our family owned three J cars over the years. A 1983 Cavalier station wagon, a 1992 Cavalier coupe, and a 2003 Cavalier coupe. All very reliable and economical vehicles. Unlike many today.
I'd drive any new model, even a Mirage, over a J-car of any vintage.
Yeah and all junk.
Had 6 J-bodies in my family, from my Aunts '83, my dads '86, grandmas '97, brothers '99, my cousins '02, and my Uncles '05, all bought new, all of them saw well over 150k, and not one of them had any issues!
And 84 wagon with a four-speed manual transmission lasted 478 k mi but unfortunately the Midwest got the best of it when the rear end literally split in half, got to love rust
@@Suchayoutuber That was the issue with all the ones in my family, damn SW Pa. winters take their toll!
merry Xmas john. been watching you since 1984. God bless.
What an incredible new car! What will they think of next in 1984!?
Reminds me so much of mom's 83 cavalier. Ah memories. She finally got rid of it in 01 in favor of a new CRV which i don't think has hit 100k miles yet.
RIP Pat Goss! So glad we still have John, though
More early 80s reviews please 🙏
The original j-body car, the Opel Ascona C, was a really good, good looking and robust car. ❤️
Did the ever get that dollar back?
The cars of the 80s ugh looks nice for what it was in the 80s
I always found the hatchback to be the best looking of all of the gen 1 J's. 3:23..............Oldsmobile ALWAYS had the best gauge (sorry, GM, I'm spelling it the correct way) package in the industry, in my opinion!!!!
As the J cars were essentially badge engineered parts bin cars, a lot was shared across the platform. My 84 Skyhawk shared the same dash and instrument cluster, only with slightly different graphics on the gauge faces. On the other side, the Cavalier, J2000/2000/Sunbird, and Cimmaron shared the same dash and instrument clusters. At least until 85 when the Cavalier RS was introduced with a new dash, but the entry level Cavaliers retained the original dash.
I had 3 of the GM J platform vehicles, a Chevrolet Cavalier, Pontiac Sunbird and Pontiac Sunfire, the Sunfire was the only 4 door sedan I had out of the J platform vehicles, the other 2 were 2 door coupes. I liked the Buick and Oldsmobile versions, didn’t know about the Cadillac version until a few years ago.
We had 2 Chevrolet Cavalier Type 10 Hatchbacks and my friend had a Pontiac Sunbird Turbo Hatchback.
Now that takes me back, to a time when nooks were for maps and packs.
Aahh the 80s 😊
The only Firenza I've ever seen was the hatchback model. Here I was thinking it was one of the GM X bodies...
Some time later, it wound up in an area junkyard -- still running, and used to haul cutting torches around after they removed the hatch.
I had an 84 Buick Skyhawk coupe with the 2.0L OHV engine. I drove bother the 1.8L SOHC and 2.0L OHV. I preferred the 2.0L for the lower end torque and acceleration felt more linear. The engine was fault free during the time I owned the car. I felt the Buick and Oldsmobile J car had the better dashboard design and wondered why it wasn’t used in the Cadillac over the Caviler based dash. Avoided the hatchback. I could easily see that rear hatch glass getting smashed in an accident or intentional for theft attempt or vandalism. Replacing factory tires with touring tires changed the overall feel of the car.
had a Cavalier version of this hatch, loved it...wish they made it now with a modern engine and interior...dont want a truck or ugly boxy suv...
Good taste doesn't apply to you we see. Wonder what your girls look like....LOL...
@@chadhaire1711That’s mean! 😀
@@cobracharmer6178 But true
Some of the most attractive front sheet metal....😂
I had a firenza wagon as a teenager. Set the ebrake it would smoke the tires
1.8, those seemed to go through head gaskets.
Got a 130,000 miles out of mine before the head gasket blew. Fixed it and drove it another 25k before selling it.
My Aunt had a 1985 Pontiac Sunbird hatchback. It was a very handsome sporty looking car - 2 tone black/grey paint job, with rear louvers on the hatchback and a light window tint all around and it said formula on the side - 14 year old me thought it was really cool the front end had the quad headlight design like the older Firebirds. The interior was a grey and plushy with a decent factory stereo and orange backlit gauge cluster. She kept it until 1999 without any major problems.
As a kid, it looked like a DeLorean from the side view. LoL
Oh, the roaring Eighties! Still missing my Firenza Extenza Formal Limousette. Lost it to GMAC during the S&L Crisis.
"A short 134ft" That wasn´t a good number even back then😅
Sondra Locke thrashed one (almost) in Sudden Impact in ‘84.
Funny. I owned a 1985 two-door, 5-speed manual, coupe (no hatchback), so it was kind-of sporty.
I had a 1984 model similar to the one in the studio with an automatic transmission. I did a 360º turn in it back in '93 while driving downhill on a patch of black ice. Thankfully, I was able to straighten it out without crashing it.
3:53 is that IOU for the mechanic 🤣🤣🤣
I recognize that weight and horsepower have really changed over the last forty years, but can you imagine someone marketing a car in the US with 84 horsepower in 2024?
They did not have all the safety stuff weighing them down they were lighter
Cue Mitsubishi MIrage.
@@rickjohansson4257 I fully recognize that, however, even with light weight 84 horsepower is nothing. They listed the 0 to 60 time at over fourteen seconds;
that would not be acceptable to the buying public. One also has to also consider that interstate speed has gone back to 70 or 75 miles an hour in most states rather than 55.
@rickjohansson4257 They also had paper thin body panels, floor panels, and frames. There was barely a point to seatbelts if the car balled up in slow collisions.
@ It has 78 horsepower and cannot be considered a high volume seller in the US. Also, it will not be sold as 2025 model here.
lasted 5 years maximum then headed for junk heap. 14 seconds to 60😂 Plush interior 🍻
Most J-cars were not that bad. Some had head gasket problems, but the Chevy Cavalier was pretty durable.
And the retro review cycle winds back to the start once again 🔥
14.5? Talk about not being able to get out of your own way. Wow how the times have changed
We had a new ’85 Buick Skyhawk. The top of the dashboard above the gauges was warped from the factory. That was nice to look at every time you drove the car. The trunk lid seal leaked from day one. Timing belt and ball joint failures before 50K miles. The paint looked OK but did not offer much corrosion protection. Even with good care the car looked awful within seven years due to rust along the bottom of the doors. The only other engine we owned that made as much noise without doing anything was in an ’82 Chevette.
There are zero of these surviving.
I grew up in the 2000s, and I saw 70s and 80s cars on a daily basis, including the Olds Delta 88, Ford Country Squire, '88 Pontiac Grand Prix, and 80's Nissan 300ZX. I can say for absolute certainty that I've never seen a Firenza in my 30 years of life.
@ The 80s cars were still really common in the 2000s and have all universally vanished in the last 10-15 years. Must be that Brazilian-sourced powertrain.
84 horsepower...wow..
People in their 20's watching this and saying "wtf" lol
Yup. Honda Civic Hybrid has 252 hp and gets 45 mpg.
I had a 1980 Datsun 200SX. Looks like GM took some styling cues from that.
Yep.But it ended there.200SX was a better car by far.
They also borrowed from their own Opel Monza, which was a larger, rear-drive 3-door fastback.
We had the Chevy version of this car, it was really nice. GM designed these well.
Currently working on a rare 77 Olds Starfire GT.
"Attractive" and "Sporty" are not the first things that come to mind with this thing...at least to me.
Probably would be if you were in 1983
@@MyHumanWreckage I'm mid 70's baby, didn't think they were attractive or sporty then either, :)
my parents had a buick skyhawk back then. that car, is why i have always bought a toyota.
Such an amazing improvement the storied name is still used today. Oh wait . . .
Sweet Baja dude.
my mom bought a brand new 83 Firenza sedan when I was 10 years old...
Pack of smokes in the center console
"Jedsels", huh? Joke is on them since the J-body platform stuck around till 2005, and GM sold plenty of J cars throughout its history.
I never ever heard that "Jedsel" term. The J-body was hardly class-leading, but GM made running improvements and really got them dailed in by 1986. If you had the 2 or 2.2 liter Cavalier engine, the cars proved to be quite reliable and durable, and never expensive to repair. They ended up outlasting most of their competitors and were about the only small cars still on the road 15+ years later.
@@snowrocket Fortunately, Pontiac and Oldsmobile didn’t outlast anything.
Great car for drunk driving in the 80s
At least it gave time for pedestrians to get out of the way.
Smokem if you got ‘em 😮
Motor week should be brought to us by Rock Auto!
Bizarrely equipped car. Stick shift with crank windows, no cassette deck, and manual locks, but full door pockets, gauges, a/c, and a power driver's seat?
Love the big rear window. Good styling. Corolla doppelgänger?
Paying close attention to the Corolla yet failed miserably
Merry Christmas, John. I've been watching you since the early 80s on PBS.
The J for Jetsols😂. In hindsight the J bodies were junk, but at that time they were considered okay for the price.
Those old 1.8s have always bothered me that shape of the valve cover only covers 3 of the 4 cylinders 😂
Not the greatest. But better than the crossover garbage people drive today. Modern vehicles are disposable appliances. At least 80s cars were serviceable and easy to maintain
I had an ‘83 Skyhawk with the optional Brazilian 1.8 OHC and an automatic (not my choice, by the way). I appreciated the fuel injection and relatively free-revving nature but it had zero torque. It could never muster a satisfying shove from a standstill. If you gave it the boot the best you could hope for is it to s-l-o-o-o-o-w-l-y gather momentum if you were willing to wait long enough.
Nice, I like those.
Aah, yet another Junk car from 80's GM🤷🏻♂️ They should've left J-car interior desing to Opel styling department.
Not junk, these were actually nice.
@Gr8thxAlot compared to the Chevette or Nova? Of course
Buick would solve the slow acceleration with the T-Type variants a year later. A friend of mine bought an 84 Skyhawk T-Type from my ex- brother-in-law and that car had excellent acceleration; sub 8 second 0-60.
I remember those years. Just sad for the automotive industry. Everything sucked.
It was rapidly improving starting in 1982. Power levels started improving, handling and cornering power were rising, fuel injection was becoming more common, and aerodynamics was being considered.
"Attractive front sheet metal?!" 🤣🤣
A widow making 85 horsepower. No airbags, no abs. The 80’s were a dark time for the automobile industry. Emissions controls choked these beyond redemption. Industry was just trying to survive.
For me, I loved the 1984-1988 Ford Thunderbird aero coupe.
I bought a new 1985 Mustang GT hatchback because you couldn’t get the 302 5spd in the T-Bird.
To me, the fox body looked like a door wedge. But it was fun.
Doesn't look like sway bars were invented yet
American cars went to crap after 72 and never recovered.
my favorite car forever
Maybe it was "OK". I am not sure how long it would have lasted. I don't think it would last like any contemporary Toyota. I do like that it had the 5 speed manual transmission and the throttle body injection. Also, having the full instrument cluster with ALL necessary gauges is nice. Not having to struggle with a carburetor in the winter is nice. I actually would have found this to be a more than acceptable first car in the late 80's (used) when I first started driving.
I liked the look of this car
Did it come with the cb and optional rally fun pack?
No, you have to get the rally wagon, not the truckster.
Yeahhhhh back to the 80's!!
Good God. Driving in the 80s must have been hell. 14.5 seconds 0-60? 5.5 seconds 40-55? Thats horrific, a tractor trailer can do that. I still don't know how people accepted the fact that cars built 20 years later were SLOWER than cars built in the 60s. 70s gas crisis or not, just unacceptable. The fact that this is considered somewhat sporty and fun is legit horrifying.
What a dismal time for performance 😢
Jesus christ! That's horrible, 0-60 in only 14.5 seconds. The 1980's was a terrible car decade.
My mom had the Pontiac J2000.
Many years ago my mom had an 84 Firenza sedan. It ran great until the head gasket blew at 41k miles. 🙄
Man I wish cars still had pizzazz like this again. ARE YOU LISTENING GM? START MAKING THESE AGAIN (unchanged)!
S-coupe....the inspiration for the later hyundai SCoupe?
Oldsmobile Firenza S Coupé Modelo 1983 Es Orígen De Estados Unidos 🚗🇺🇲 No Se Comercializa Aquí En México
i can only imagine trying to tell anyone these are "good, average performers" today.
but a later turbo Olds Aerotech engine and all wheel drive would make that little tin can scoot.
84 bhp from that 1.8 injection, the euro j car 1.8 injection was 115bhp, dire really.
I came here just to see how bad we used to have it and not realize it
The Oldsmobile Firenza and Buick Skyhawk were my choices from GM in this class. The Chevrolet Cavalier did nothing for me. There’s a difference between a Buick and a Chevrolet, or in this case, and Oldsmobile and a Chevrolet.
general motors will never learn
I know people who had this model of Chevette and they loved them.
Okay after watching the video, this does not appear to be a clone of the Holden Clone the chevette was.
Chevy Citation was the same as this right? We had one back in the day. Wasn't a terrible car.
Citation was an X car
The Citation was a little bigger. Think Cavalier is their smaller car, and the Celebrity and Citation were one step bigger.
I wanna put a small block chevy in it.
J is for Junk.