They're a solid entry-level rifle. IN terms of quality they're comparable to a S&W M&P Sport II or a PSA AR, but they cost only $500-600 CAD. They've obviously got nothing on the more expensive rifles like Colt or DD, but for a quarter of the price you can't really go wrong.
Recoil looks the same. I think because there wouldn't be any internal difference. People say the AK is simple but the reality is only the M receiver part is simple. Producing the rest of the parts take a lot of special broaching equipment. In contrast, the M16 is extremely efficient in it's use of machining. No space or cut is wasted and large parts that do multiple functions are used. While you still need modern manufacturing, if you have it, you can produce M16s very cheaply. Like a 1911, it is hard to screw up an AR-15 unless you deviate from the original design.
Drago Puskaric Well, we won't know will we? I don't care if it's better, and I don't think LAV cares either. Regardless, it would have been interesting to see the bolt and carrier, any stampings or markings up close.
During Vietnam, NATO had not adopted the 5.56 NATO cartridge. FN created the 5.56 NATO cartridge in the late 70's and it was fully adopted as a NATO cartridge in 1980. Vietnam era rifles were all chambered in .223 remington. until FN created the 5.56 cartridge M193 was a .223 Remington cartridge. Correction: The US Military created the 5.56×45mm when it adopted the m-16 family of rifles, however 5.56×45 did not become a separate cartridge from .223 Remington until FN decided to create the 5.56 NATO and change some specs.
We can get these all day long in Canada. They go for around 500 mark. Norinco has really made a leap forward in quality of their guns. Better finish, etc on the new ones coming in. Their Sig pistol copies are good starter pistols as well.
Gringo Bombero Well Americans can't buy firearms in Canada. No guns can be exported, really. If you wanna know more about our process, I can discuss that.
Gringo Bombero we have two classes of firearm non restricted and restricted class. Non restricted is most all rifles, shotguns, bolt action etc. Shotguns etc. Restricted class are pistols, certain rifles deemed scary like ar series, any gun under 18.6 inches. Pistols must be over 106mm barrel or its deemed prohibited. Restricted class must be shot at a government approved range and requires a permit attached to license to say your allowed to travel with said firearms. Non restricted is pretty free, can move anywhere with it. Our federal police service oversees the firearm program and has a firearms lab. All firearms must be given a frt number. The lab determines if the gun is deemed non restricted, restricted or prohibited. So to get the license you must attend the Canadian firearm safety course and take either license or both. It's a weekend. There is a written test and practical. Once you complete and pass the course, you file the paperwork and fill out the application form to the Royal Canadian Mountain Police and pay 85 dollars to file the application. The police than do a extensive background check, check out your references, etc. If your in a relationship your partner must sign off on the application to allow you to move on in the process. Once deemed good to go. Your license will be mailed to you. It usually takes few months to complete. Once you have the license you may now buy guns and ammo. In some provinces you must be a member of a club before you can buy restricted firearms. Restricted firearms have a registry. All firearms are registered with the government. So when you buy a restricted there a waiting period. It gets sent off to the government they review it, see if you can have it. Once completed you can pick it up. Restricted firearms must be triggered locked to and from the range. The gun case must be locked. No ammo stored with the guns. I can keep going on. A lot to discuss.
$500?!?! For some chinese knockoff? Screw that! You can find American and Canadian carbines for that price. The only chinese gun id like to have would be an SKS, and if i cant get one for $200 or less ill do without.
Interesting enough the Sichuan police department uses it along with a small batch of North Korean commandos seen in the DMZ carrying these reversed engineered AR-15s
Chen Kevin I've seen pics of them in the Middle East as well, Hezbollah, Iraqi Hez groups, Syria. Seem Iranian supplied going by who I've seen with them.
Yea because its a great idea to showcase knockoffs in front of the IDF to scare them off which often result in a complete failure. Also why would they use this gun, the remington .223 is pretty rare in the middle east
I hate to agree with a communist, but you’re right. American manufacturers simply can’t compete with the cheap yet reliable weapons from norinco. That’s the only reason they were banned.
Norinco's regular Type-56S, Type-84S, and MAK-90 sporters are pretty garden AK quality, ergo not bad, but not exquisite either, just typical. People who say this confuse this with the Poly Tech Legend line, which was a special line made in Factory (386) and intended as a much higher end product for true enthusiasts. The Poly Tech Legend line of Chinese AKs, those are very finely made and very nice quality, but they are also a minority of all Chinese AKs. A Norinco Type-56S will not be as finely made and not be as valuable as a Poly Tech Legend AK.
I've had good luck running thousands of rounds through a Norc CQ-A Ar15. I wouldn't call them crap like some people here are posting. The finish sucked but accuracy and reliability have been good.
The Daily Shooter the late 80s to early 90s had a influx of norinco stuff. .from pump action gallery gun 22s to rem 870 clones and everything in between. some of it was super crude but still kinda neat.. the ban on Chinese imports killed off that boom for the chicoms
People shoot 5.56 out of the 1/12 twist SP1's and M16A1s/XM16E1s all the time with no issues. Also many ARs are 1/9 twist, and the very early ones were 1/14.
That looks like one of the ultra-rare late 1980s imports. I think only a very small number were imported for the SHOT show and a few gun magazine articles before the bans hit in California and the import ban shortly after. That model was in a price war with the early Daewoo K1/K2 Rifles which were superior, so the Chinese officially dropped attempts to comply with the bans. The Canadian importers have the current models and a few countries have adopted Chinese M4 variants as issues rifles, I think Peru or Equador.
The 5.56 chambering comment didn't make sense to me. The original twist rate for the m16 was a 1/12 with the M193 ball cartridge which I thought was a NATO standard cartridge at that point?
Yeah, I think Larry was referring to the M855. But that reference is not chronologically correct, as these norinco's were made when M193 was standard issue.
Marc Brown hey might be a slight Misunderstanding but the M16A1 was a 1X12 twist rate which was designed to stabilize the M193 round. When the U.S Armed forces adopted the M16A2 service rifle they changed the twist rate to 1X7 so it could stabilize the heavier M855 projectile which is the 62 Gr. Every barrel I've replaced on a M16A2 is a 1X7 twist. The indicators would be a govt. profile barrel which is considerably thicker then the m16A1 pencil barrel and the markings Just behind the muzzle which would indicate 1x7 twist rate. Both FN and Colt rifles are generally marked the same.
Marc Brown the story behind the switch from 1:14 to 1:12 is that the 1:14 twist had problems stabilizing the m193 rds in cold climates. I forgot how they got to the 1:9 though.
Darryn Brown He just has to stay super tacticool intellegent with all the late latest operator lingo so people know he's the real deal... Never mind factual history about things, COD players wont look that shit up lol!!!!
hey so awesome that you guys were able to put one through it's paces. In the Philippines, It's the most common version of the AR that you can get your hands on. I've always wanted to know how the Norincos stack up against other AR builds, especially those in the US. Can you guys publish an in-depth no-holds-barred review? I know thousands if not tens of thousands of people would want to know. Thanks in Advance!
This brings back memories from my childhood. A friend of my dad bought this rifle. That was during operation Desert Storm. Tour of Duty was on Dutch TV and me and my friends were obsessed by this rifle. The first time we could hold an 'real M16'! I remember he came straight from the gun shop and it was packed in a flimsy brown cardboard box. He had many reliability problems with this rifle. If I remember corectly was that the bold didn't run well. He sold it for a Colt AR15 a few moths later.
Larry, you gotta tear it down. .we need to see the guts man.. a "moonrock" is deserving of more than a cursory glance that's a pretty neat specimen. I'm sure a full breakdown and debrief is coming ?
Those early issues aren't on Stoner. They were the result of pencil pushers changing the powder type in the 5.56 ammo and failing to issue cleaning kits with the rifles. Rusty, fouled-up guns malfunction, no matter how well-designed they are.
he ought to be, that M16 and its shitty "direct impingement" has been a second rate rifle for the US military since 1965! FINALLY the army will adopt a 6.8 round soon (by 2020 maybe) and get rid of the M16, even an HK416 is a much better choice and so is a 6.8 round. 5.56 doesn't cut it!
I think that for this video, we can all agree that Vickers goofed up as far as chamberings. Just goes to show that not even T1 Operators are always on-point.
These are a fairly common AR here in Canada, selling for $500 to $600 CDN ($375 to $450 USD). I purchased one a few months ago but with a 1-9" twist barrel and a standard type A2 style pistol grip. With about seven hundred rounds fired so far I have had zero malfunctions. Accuracy is pretty decent for a lightweight barrel, mostly using 55 grain ammo. The trigger pull on my example is crap. Quality of the current production rifles is far better than it was on the Norincos I saw 20 years ago.
With the new administration here, it would be AWESOME if we could get sub $400 ARs and sub $600 M14/M1As. They even have a nice sig 226 clone that I would be interested in.
Sorry, Larry, you're FOS with regard to barrel twist. That does not determine if it's 5.56 or .223. The chamber dimensions for the two calibers are very slightly different as is the design pressure rating, with .223 having a higher design pressure rating. READ THE SAAMI DOCUMENTS REGARDING BOTH CHAMBERINGS IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE ME. The Wylde chamber is designed specifically to accomodate both 5.56 and .223 and is the one you would prefer if you were to be flexible and run both .223 and 5.56 in the same rifle.
The M16s and M16A1s used in Vietnam had 1/12" barrels. These were the rifles that China reverse-engineered to create this rifle. Those rifles were designed around 55gr 5.56x45, which is still 5.56x45.
actually bud twist 1x12 is better for stabilizing lighter bullets....1x7 better for stabilizing heavier bullets .....the more know bud...maybe u should know what ur talking about before ya call ppl names hahaha..but I will give u points for ur originality on your insult..
Johnsoncm65 is correct that barrel twist does not equate to being chambered in .223. I would point out that m193 Ball and m196 Tracer are about 55gr -- not 62 like the m855. I would also point out that Larry said it was not deisgned for the heavier m855....so I think he simply mis-spoke.
I had heard that Norinco imported about 500 before the 1989 ban or because of a lawsuit from Colt stopped importation. Interesting to see that they indeed did bring them to the U.S.
Very cool video, it's always interesting to see other variations of the M16/AR15 series of rifles, I heard the Chinese were selling these rifles in the European and Canadian civilian markets
I have one. Put about 5,000 rounds through. 100% reliable. All AR-15 parts fit perfectly. I added a float tube and a match trigger. The barrel is hammer forged and chromed. Very good barrel.
"Hey should we talk about differences on QA and materials used? Or maybe if that weird ass revolver grip is actually something Magpul should look into making?" "Na man let's just talk about twist ratios that no one cares about and throw in more slow motion and quick cuts than 2 back to back viewings of 300"
Ok here goes. I'm an arm chair commando and you're the real thing, but as I recall the barrel twist does not dictate if the round is "5.56 Nato" or 5.56 the case dimensions and the pressure loading do The shoulder of a 5.56 case is different than a .223 and the 5.56 is loaded to much higher pressure that's what makes it NATO spec. The twist only comes into play with the bullet weight. The original 5.56 was a 55gr bullet at 3,200 fps (M193 ball) that used a 1:12 twist. When the bullet weight changed to 62gr then the twist was changed to 1:7 (M855 ball). All still loaded to "NATO spec."
At 2015071 u mean 5 round magazine and 1 round in the chamber right? Actually I saw many people using 10 round "pistol" mag for those guns take ar mags
I don't know why he said it's not a true 5.56 rifle. Sure it may not balance the 62gr round at 1/12 twist but it's more designed for the 55gr M193 5.56 round. The reason why you don't want to shoot any 5.56 round in a .223 marked rifle is because 5.56mm is actually at a .224 inches diameter. Twist rate has everything to do with bullet weight. The 1/7 twist rate was designed for M4's particularly due to the shorter barrel and the need to balance the tracer rounds fired through them and not so much the 62gr rounds. Some of what I've read is a 1/9 twist rate which is the standard on a lot of AR-15s is better at balancing 62gr rounds than 1/7 and more able to shoot lighter rounds which is often used for hunting small animals. In an M16 configuration with the longer barrel you can get away with a longer twist rate so a 1/12 may not be that bad at balancing even 62gr rounds. I believe the original M16s started at 1/14 twist rate and the standard was 55gr rounds.
The original M-16 had a 1:14 twist that was later changed to 1:12 to improve stability of the 55 grain bullet to provide better penetration. That likely explains why the Chinese copy has a 1:12 twist.
Ummm.... the twist rate doesn't have anything to do with the caliber. 1 and 12 may stabilize a 55gr better then a 62gr but it can still fire 62gr just like a 1 and 7 can fire 55gr.
My country, Paraguay, uses it as an alternative where US made M16s or AR15s arent needed, like a police patrol gun, or to some military and police sentrys.
Yep. if it was dissected and reversed engineered by the Chinese. It is then a copy of the M16A1a used by American and South Vietnamese soldiers which fired the M193 round using the 55 grain FMJ. The Europeans like the Germans, Austrians and French would produce the American M193 for their new service rifles in 5.56mm. The Germans produced the HK G33 for export and chambered it for the M193. The Austrians and French adopted their Steyr AUG and FAMAS rifles in 1977-78 using the M193 round. The Belgians at FN developed the 62 grain SS109 Experimental in the late 1970s which later became the M855 in the US. When the US Government replaced the M16A1 with the A2 in around 1982 then the rest of NATO changed over using the 62 grain SS109/M855 NATO as a standard round in accordance to STANAG (Standard NATO Agreement).
D-op1 Well, I must concede the NATO argument as the standard was adopted in '77 I think. Come to think of it, the early M16s I worked with in my active duty days did have .223 markings. So yeah, I was wrong. Chalk it up to 'knee-jerk' reaction.
This particular version is very old. Up in north here we have Norinco CQA which is mil-spec expect the commercial buffer tube . I have my personal one fitted with BCM KMR13, magpul kits and EOTECH， fucking thing run through every dirty ammo I can find with no problem. The new Chinese version comes with Matt black finish and msrp around 600. I mean I have tried DDM4, Sig 516, MCX and NEA15, Norinco really did a good job this time.
I'd like to say that I'm an American and that I'm not going to abondon our best hardware manufacturers. One guy I found is Rock River. Their LAR 8 is the most logical, gorgeous, hardcore pieces of firearms I've seen in my life and it's the real America on the in and outside of that gun I can sense it. Please complete a series on firearms from American manufacturers like that if you can thank you sir. That company is completely legit and they anybody's funny business won't be successful with them so they are quite secure of a dealer. They're legit. No bullshit on their website, just nice to look at and very informational.
Norinco AR15s are very popular in Canada and have a very good reputation. not so much this 20" barrel Variant but the m4 copies are very widespread. this 20" versions is around $600CAD. and the m4 is around $650.
Anything over 20 Chinese Yuan is wayyyyy to much for a Norinco...in Canada or anywhere else. You get what you pay for, so spend the extra $ and buy something that is worth owning.
Larry, do you know anything about the special front sight base that some of these rifles had? It looks like it's kind of a bastardized Type 56-style hooded post. Google Norinco CQ 311 and it should be apparent.
I've owned a few Norinco cqa 556 ar15 rifles, they don't have the nicest finish, and they're not built 100% to a US spec rifle but with that being said they're great rifles and I never had a malfunction with any Norinco rifles I've owned. I've also owned a few Norinco sig 226 clones and a few 1911's and those guns are bulletproof and robust.
ObamaBinLaden: no it doesn't. All M16's and M16A1's had a 1/12 twist barrel. 55 grain will work well and it also stabilised the tracers which were longer. 62 grain NATO (the long once with steel penetrator) will proberly not accurate but won't tumble in flight.
Technically they adopted the Belgian SS109 62 grn bullet and that became the NATO standard not the 55 grn which was being used by US forces at the time (1977).
The make piles of copies of US made firearms. Up in Canada they are imported in by the thousands, lots of M1/M14 copies as well, they early Polytech M1A with a blued finish are excellent rifles considering they cost 300$ USD at the time, and the current Norinco M1 rifles with synthetic stocks are around 400$ USD or less, and are pretty decent too. Their AR rifles, not so much IMO, but they work, more or less, for a while. There are also piles of Norinco 1911s imported into Canada, the Commanders used to cost 300$ USD or less, and with some work and parts from Brownells/etc, you could make a great 1911 Commander for 450$ USD, or even less.
I picked up a used one for $350 a couple of years ago. Shoots fine. Functions every time. Hits what I aim at with out exception. I switched out the butt stock, forestock & grip for magpull, but other than that I've left it alone. I clean it once a year whether it needs it or not. I have no idea how much went through it before I got it, so far I've only fired 2 cases of Norinco manufactured ammo through it. No problems, no issues, no failures. Personally I find it comparable with my 1980s vintage Colt SP1. Maybe I just got lucky & found a good one. My two Norinco M14 copies, SKS copy, & three 1911 A1 copies all work just fine as well. In my experience fit, finish, functionality, & accuracy are on par with most of the other brands on the market & pricing is definitely attractive. Just my personal experience. Your experience may differ.
Moron doesn't know shit about guns and was too lazy to watch and listen to the video and its facts. Probably a tacticool 10 year old with a short attention span.
The early M16 rifles didn't have shell deflector, and the early production M16s have 1:12 twist. Educate yourself 🙄 hating on China is one thing, being plain stupid is another
Nice cool Vlog, nice intro talking.Simply a joy when you placed this video. Honestly , the chinese version M311, still lack fine quality and beauty from the Original AR-15 , or M16A1. My preference is stil the M4 carbine and the Glock 18 pistol. Wished i can still get back to timezone when i was once resided in TX , FORT HOOD , TX76543. East Rancier , Kileen. Have a good one.......
Jeff Newcomb You clearly don't know the difference in operating principles of whatever German weapon you had in mind (I guarantee that no matter which Nazi German weapon system you pull out of your ass, you will be wrong) and the Stoner system the M16 uses. Additionally, you're clearly unfamiliar with the billions of dollars annually lost to Chinese counterfeits and frauds.
Hey Man It would be nice if you took a few more minutes to discuss the gun and maybe certain traits it has or certain details or behaviors , like what MAC (military arms channel) does , also some more footage of just raw shooting no music and a target , would be quite nice or maybe 2 videos one short one more detailed , thought id let you know
norinco is pretty big up here in Canada,cheap too!pretty rugged,guess loser tolerances!I have a 1911 double safety extended mag release brand new under 500 can,got it 3 years to test it,no cleaning etc still runs like a champ,rough interior but made from railway steel i think!Guns are tools,no matter where they're made,it's who uses them
Would you mind making a episode about the Chinese Norinco Type 56? I sure appreciate it. I know there's a few different ones but I'm referring to the AK variant. The Type 56 Type-1 and Type-2 also. Interesting AKs as well. Thanks again
Hi Larry, if these were developed from the original a1 variant m16s, have you seen any of the flaws that were present in those in the norinco versions?
Likes a bastard child of a capture M16A1 and some kinky engineer at Norinco during Valentine date. Still Canada be like: May i imported your entire stock, pretty please?
The CQ M311-1 was my first AR. I bought it when I lived in Canada years ago. Back then they were fairly common there; not sure if that's still true though.
Norinco AR's are popular in Canada, mainly because of the cheap price tag. But I've hear pretty good things about them.
They are good, the m1a copy is awesome as well. I never tried their 1911 thought.
they are great as long that you don't change anything, great for the beginners who wants to get an AR15 but can't afford one for the time being
that would be me. What do you mean by not changing anything?
sometime the external parts don't mate well with the CQ-A, the trigger group is slightly out of spec etc
They're a solid entry-level rifle. IN terms of quality they're comparable to a S&W M&P Sport II or a PSA AR, but they cost only $500-600 CAD. They've obviously got nothing on the more expensive rifles like Colt or DD, but for a quarter of the price you can't really go wrong.
A Norc M4, technically a CQ-A1 was my first AR. I've since moved on to much nicer AR's but the Norc never malfunctioned.
WTF? I was expecting some commentary on quality or machining. Nope, just excess slow-mo shots.
Might have been because the copy had outdone the original? Seem to me to have an even lesser recoil
Recoil looks the same. I think because there wouldn't be any internal difference. People say the AK is simple but the reality is only the M receiver part is simple. Producing the rest of the parts take a lot of special broaching equipment. In contrast, the M16 is extremely efficient in it's use of machining. No space or cut is wasted and large parts that do multiple functions are used. While you still need modern manufacturing, if you have it, you can produce M16s very cheaply. Like a 1911, it is hard to screw up an AR-15 unless you deviate from the original design.
Rifle-length gas system + rifle buffer = low recoil
Drago Puskaric Well, we won't know will we? I don't care if it's better, and I don't think LAV cares either. Regardless, it would have been interesting to see the bolt and carrier, any stampings or markings up close.
We have them here in NZ, they're shit.
I have had my Norinco Cqa for 2 years now. not one failure to date. It's my favorite of all my rifles.
1-12 was designed to be used with M193, which IS 5.56. We switched from M193 to M855 after Vietnam. :D
Exactly! I shoot 5.56 in my 1/12 if it was a .223 you can't do that without problems where as with a 5.56 you can also shoot .223
I believe it was about 1986, when we went to the M16 A2.
During Vietnam, NATO had not adopted the 5.56 NATO cartridge. FN created the 5.56 NATO cartridge in the late 70's and it was fully adopted as a NATO cartridge in 1980. Vietnam era rifles were all chambered in .223 remington. until FN created the 5.56 cartridge M193 was a .223 Remington cartridge.
Correction:
The US Military created the 5.56×45mm when it adopted the m-16 family of rifles, however 5.56×45 did not become a separate cartridge from .223 Remington until FN decided to create the 5.56 NATO and change some specs.
This is the correct info… Larry we expected better outta you brother lol jk… everyone slips up at times
We can get these all day long in Canada. They go for around 500 mark. Norinco has really made a leap forward in quality of their guns. Better finish, etc on the new ones coming in. Their Sig pistol copies are good starter pistols as well.
How difficult is it to obtain firearms in Canada with all the restrictions I hear about?
Gringo Bombero Well Americans can't buy firearms in Canada. No guns can be exported, really. If you wanna know more about our process, I can discuss that.
+Instinctive Firearm Reviews I am talking about Canadian citizens It is easy in the US
Gringo Bombero we have two classes of firearm non restricted and restricted class. Non restricted is most all rifles, shotguns, bolt action etc. Shotguns etc. Restricted class are pistols, certain rifles deemed scary like ar series, any gun under 18.6 inches. Pistols must be over 106mm barrel or its deemed prohibited. Restricted class must be shot at a government approved range and requires a permit attached to license to say your allowed to travel with said firearms. Non restricted is pretty free, can move anywhere with it. Our federal police service oversees the firearm program and has a firearms lab. All firearms must be given a frt number. The lab determines if the gun is deemed non restricted, restricted or prohibited. So to get the license you must attend the Canadian firearm safety course and take either license or both. It's a weekend. There is a written test and practical. Once you complete and pass the course, you file the paperwork and fill out the application form to the Royal Canadian Mountain Police and pay 85 dollars to file the application. The police than do a extensive background check, check out your references, etc. If your in a relationship your partner must sign off on the application to allow you to move on in the process. Once deemed good to go. Your license will be mailed to you. It usually takes few months to complete. Once you have the license you may now buy guns and ammo. In some provinces you must be a member of a club before you can buy restricted firearms. Restricted firearms have a registry. All firearms are registered with the government. So when you buy a restricted there a waiting period. It gets sent off to the government they review it, see if you can have it. Once completed you can pick it up. Restricted firearms must be triggered locked to and from the range. The gun case must be locked. No ammo stored with the guns. I can keep going on. A lot to discuss.
$500?!?! For some chinese knockoff? Screw that! You can find American and Canadian carbines for that price. The only chinese gun id like to have would be an SKS, and if i cant get one for $200 or less ill do without.
Interesting enough the Sichuan police department uses it along with a small batch of North Korean commandos seen in the DMZ carrying these reversed engineered AR-15s
Chen Kevin I've seen pics of them in the Middle East as well, Hezbollah, Iraqi Hez groups, Syria. Seem Iranian supplied going by who I've seen with them.
Yea because its a great idea to showcase knockoffs in front of the IDF to scare them off which often result in a complete failure. Also why would they use this gun, the remington .223 is pretty rare in the middle east
And it's not rare in North Korea? Just a simple observation on my part, and you roll back on me with some stupid shit?
en.m.wikipedia.org
There is a list there of countries that use the CQ , and a couple that make copies including IRAN.
James Bridges
America won't let you buy these because domestic manufacturers don't want to compete with Norinco.
I wouldn't purchase a Norinco even if they were available.
@@redcat9436 you would be the minority, US gov gotta regulate it else their weapons would be outperformed by the price tags
I hate to agree with a communist, but you’re right. American manufacturers simply can’t compete with the cheap yet reliable weapons from norinco. That’s the only reason they were banned.
They aren't in the USA because of a August 2003 sanction by Bush, not because of competition against American AR 15 makers.
Norinco, apparently makes some of the finest AKs among collectors. Their 1911s are sought after for a base gun as well.
I promise you nobody likes Chicom shit
@@ethananderson2327 their AKs are highly sought after
@@prylosecorsomething3194 Seriously, why? I though China only made cheap garbage
@@ethananderson2327 Speak for yourself.
Norinco's regular Type-56S, Type-84S, and MAK-90 sporters are pretty garden AK quality, ergo not bad, but not exquisite either, just typical.
People who say this confuse this with the Poly Tech Legend line, which was a special line made in Factory (386) and intended as a much higher end product for true enthusiasts. The Poly Tech Legend line of Chinese AKs, those are very finely made and very nice quality, but they are also a minority of all Chinese AKs. A Norinco Type-56S will not be as finely made and not be as valuable as a Poly Tech Legend AK.
I've had good luck running thousands of rounds through a Norc CQ-A Ar15. I wouldn't call them crap like some people here are posting. The finish sucked but accuracy and reliability have been good.
Wow I had no idea they made one. Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.
I had no clue either. Maybe they copied us because they know that their weapons suck.
The Daily Shooter the late 80s to early 90s had a influx of norinco stuff. .from pump action gallery gun 22s to rem 870 clones and everything in between. some of it was super crude but still kinda neat.. the ban on Chinese imports killed off that boom for the chicoms
When people say China makes EVERYTHING, they're not kidding.
go up to canada and you see chinese copies of everything... M14s, M4s, M16s, M1897
True. Some of them are very good, some of them are BAD. It's kinda interesting. We're going to find out about where the T 81 falls pretty soon.
People shoot 5.56 out of the 1/12 twist SP1's and M16A1s/XM16E1s all the time with no issues. Also many ARs are 1/9 twist, and the very early ones were 1/14.
Great rifle.
I had the privilege of shooting the military version with fully auto capability in Myanmar.
That looks like one of the ultra-rare late 1980s imports. I think only a very small number were imported for the SHOT show and a few gun magazine articles before the bans hit in California and the import ban shortly after. That model was in a price war with the early Daewoo K1/K2 Rifles which were superior, so the Chinese officially dropped attempts to comply with the bans. The Canadian importers have the current models and a few countries have adopted Chinese M4 variants as issues rifles, I think Peru or Equador.
The 5.56 chambering comment didn't make sense to me.
The original twist rate for the m16 was a 1/12 with the M193 ball cartridge which I thought was a NATO standard cartridge at that point?
Yeah, I think Larry was referring to the M855. But that reference is not chronologically correct, as these norinco's were made when M193 was standard issue.
Marc Brown hey might be a slight Misunderstanding but the M16A1 was a 1X12 twist rate which was designed to stabilize the M193 round. When the U.S Armed forces adopted the M16A2 service rifle they changed the twist rate to 1X7 so it could stabilize the heavier M855 projectile which is the 62 Gr. Every barrel I've replaced on a M16A2 is a 1X7 twist. The indicators would be a govt. profile barrel which is considerably thicker then the m16A1 pencil barrel and the markings Just behind the muzzle which would indicate 1x7 twist rate. Both FN and Colt rifles are generally marked the same.
Marc Brown the story behind the switch from 1:14 to 1:12 is that the 1:14 twist had problems stabilizing the m193 rds in cold climates. I forgot how they got to the 1:9 though.
exactly. caliber is not determined by twist rate but by chaber dimentions (and bore diameter)
Darryn Brown He just has to stay super tacticool intellegent with all the late latest operator lingo so people know he's the real deal...
Never mind factual history about things, COD players wont look that shit up lol!!!!
Larry: Says the 1-12 twist means no 5.56
Also Larry: shoots lake city 5.56 out of the gun
I love my Norinco SKS! People can hate on China made stuff all day but their weapons are pretty good!
American soldier spits out gum …China-“we must capture this chewed up gum and copy it “
hey so awesome that you guys were able to put one through it's paces. In the Philippines, It's the most common version of the AR that you can get your hands on. I've always wanted to know how the Norincos stack up against other AR builds, especially those in the US. Can you guys publish an in-depth no-holds-barred review? I know thousands if not tens of thousands of people would want to know. Thanks in Advance!
This brings back memories from my childhood. A friend of my dad bought this rifle. That was during operation Desert Storm. Tour of Duty was on Dutch TV and me and my friends were obsessed by this rifle. The first time we could hold an 'real M16'! I remember he came straight from the gun shop and it was packed in a flimsy brown cardboard box. He had many reliability problems with this rifle. If I remember corectly was that the bold didn't run well. He sold it for a Colt AR15 a few moths later.
Larry, you gotta tear it down. .we need to see the guts man.. a "moonrock" is deserving of more than a cursory glance that's a pretty neat specimen. I'm sure a full breakdown and debrief is coming ?
This ain't forgotten weapons...
Love that pistol grip design!
Looks like a Revolver pistol design
Glad to finally see a high quality vid on the M311-1, Shame it isnt more well know. Thanks Larry
Eugene Stoner is rolling in his grave.
Those early issues aren't on Stoner. They were the result of pencil pushers changing the powder type in the 5.56 ammo and failing to issue cleaning kits with the rifles. Rusty, fouled-up guns malfunction, no matter how well-designed they are.
webster7710 actually it was because they forgot to chrome line the barrels but that too
webster7710 Actually true. The history of AR, Stoner, and the military is kinda interesting.
KAYWEN LI, m16s were shit back then because the military told soldiers that they didn’t need to clean it
he ought to be, that M16 and its shitty "direct impingement" has been a second rate rifle for the US military since 1965! FINALLY the army will adopt a 6.8 round soon (by 2020 maybe) and get rid of the M16, even an HK416 is a much better choice and so is a 6.8 round. 5.56 doesn't cut it!
"CHinA" - Trump 2016
We've got sooo many Norc ARs up here in Canada.
Suaga I beat China all the time
Suaga wish we could get any norinco here in the usa
chinese import ban......
China all the time
I love that forward assist housing acts as a brass deflector.
Very cool and unique AR! I would have loved more info on it though! The slow mo shots didn't make up for a lack of content. lol
I think that for this video, we can all agree that Vickers goofed up as far as chamberings.
Just goes to show that not even T1 Operators are always on-point.
Ribbed for pleasure? Sorry, I had to.
now thats funny!!!
These are a fairly common AR here in Canada, selling for $500 to $600 CDN ($375 to $450 USD). I purchased one a few months ago but with a 1-9" twist barrel and a standard type A2 style pistol grip. With about seven hundred rounds fired so far I have had zero malfunctions. Accuracy is pretty decent for a lightweight barrel, mostly using 55 grain ammo. The trigger pull on my example is crap. Quality of the current production rifles is far better than it was on the Norincos I saw 20 years ago.
With the new administration here, it would be AWESOME if we could get sub $400 ARs and sub $600 M14/M1As. They even have a nice sig 226 clone that I would be interested in.
Sorry, Larry, you're FOS with regard to barrel twist. That does not determine if it's 5.56 or .223. The chamber dimensions for the two calibers are very slightly different as is the design pressure rating, with .223 having a higher design pressure rating.
READ THE SAAMI DOCUMENTS REGARDING BOTH CHAMBERINGS IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE ME.
The Wylde chamber is designed specifically to accomodate both 5.56 and .223 and is the one you would prefer if you were to be flexible and run both .223 and 5.56 in the same rifle.
johnsoncm65 The 5.56 x 45mm has, by a large margin, the higher pressure when compared to SAAMI .223
The M16s and M16A1s used in Vietnam had 1/12" barrels. These were the rifles that China reverse-engineered to create this rifle. Those rifles were designed around 55gr 5.56x45, which is still 5.56x45.
actually bud twist 1x12 is better for stabilizing lighter bullets....1x7 better for stabilizing heavier bullets .....the more know bud...maybe u should know what ur talking about before ya call ppl names hahaha..but I will give u points for ur originality on your insult..
Johnsoncm65 is correct that barrel twist does not equate to being chambered in .223. I would point out that m193 Ball and m196 Tracer are about 55gr -- not 62 like the m855. I would also point out that Larry said it was not deisgned for the heavier m855....so I think he simply mis-spoke.
he is saying the twist rate is wrong for it being chambered in 556. i guess he did word it funny i just re watched it.
I had heard that Norinco imported about 500 before the 1989 ban or because of a lawsuit from Colt stopped importation. Interesting to see that they indeed did bring them to the U.S.
Whoah, the finish makes it look so plasticky like a toy XD
Didn't the US issue rifles in Vietnam say Mattel inside the handguards?
@@cs-rj8ru Not really, that's a myth based on hearsay and jokes among soldiers.
Love the new range Larry, great video and information as always sir.
People are raging about a gun that was made in China lol
Very cool video, it's always interesting to see other variations of the M16/AR15 series of rifles, I heard the Chinese were selling these rifles in the European and Canadian civilian markets
I have one. Put about 5,000 rounds through. 100% reliable. All AR-15 parts fit perfectly. I added a float tube and a match trigger.
The barrel is hammer forged and chromed. Very good barrel.
"Hey should we talk about differences on QA and materials used? Or maybe if that weird ass revolver grip is actually something Magpul should look into making?"
"Na man let's just talk about twist ratios that no one cares about and throw in more slow motion and quick cuts than 2 back to back viewings of 300"
The pistol grip looks like it was ripped off a S&W K-Frame revolver.
Another great video - Only wish you could have taken it apart and done a comparison of parts, etc.
You would think it would be lefty friendly coming from lefties.
ba dum tss
He'll be here all week folks!
Gerald West lol
Chinese are hardcore 19th century capitalists.
Gerald West hahaha
Ok here goes. I'm an arm chair commando and you're the real thing, but as I recall the barrel twist does not dictate if the round is "5.56 Nato" or 5.56 the case dimensions and the pressure loading do The shoulder of a 5.56 case is different than a .223 and the 5.56 is loaded to much higher pressure that's what makes it NATO spec. The twist only comes into play with the bullet weight. The original 5.56 was a 55gr bullet at 3,200 fps (M193 ball) that used a 1:12 twist. When the bullet weight changed to 62gr then the twist was changed to 1:7 (M855 ball). All still loaded to "NATO spec."
These are literally everywhere up here in Canada..
Just like the Chinese Immigrants!
Corinthian You need to get a licence and gun registration in order to own it.
Corinthian Only 6 bullets magazines are allowed.
Well at least we got fewer school shootings...
At 2015071 u mean 5 round magazine and 1 round in the chamber right? Actually I saw many people using 10 round "pistol" mag for those guns take ar mags
I don't know why he said it's not a true 5.56 rifle. Sure it may not balance the 62gr round at 1/12 twist but it's more designed for the 55gr M193 5.56 round.
The reason why you don't want to shoot any 5.56 round in a .223 marked rifle is because 5.56mm is actually at a .224 inches diameter.
Twist rate has everything to do with bullet weight. The 1/7 twist rate was designed for M4's particularly due to the shorter barrel and the need to balance the tracer rounds fired through them and not so much the 62gr rounds.
Some of what I've read is a 1/9 twist rate which is the standard on a lot of AR-15s is better at balancing 62gr rounds than 1/7 and more able to shoot lighter rounds which is often used for hunting small animals. In an M16 configuration with the longer barrel you can get away with a longer twist rate so a 1/12 may not be that bad at balancing even 62gr rounds. I believe the original M16s started at 1/14 twist rate and the standard was 55gr rounds.
a lot of Canadians buy these norincos for their first AR.
You shoot a lot of guns where I'm thinking I would never hold that and pull the trigger. Haha
I wished there was commentary on how the gun shoots
The original M-16 had a 1:14 twist that was later changed to 1:12 to improve stability of the 55 grain bullet to provide better penetration. That likely explains why the Chinese copy has a 1:12 twist.
They also have that model in a 1-9 twist up here in Canada with brand name Dominion Arms but they are norincos.
Ummm.... the twist rate doesn't have anything to do with the caliber. 1 and 12 may stabilize a 55gr better then a 62gr but it can still fire 62gr just like a 1 and 7 can fire 55gr.
Pennsylvania State Militia yes it can but nato stipulates 855 62gr rds.
My country, Paraguay, uses it as an alternative where US made M16s or AR15s arent needed, like a police patrol gun, or to some military and police sentrys.
Larry correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure all of our A2 rifles were 1x12 twist rate.
Marc Brown Definitely 1 in 7 twist
Marc Brown m16 and a1 were 1/12 they switched to 1/7 with the a2
But either way, 5.56 chamber vs 223 Rem chamber has nothing to do with the twist rate. Not saying the twist isn't important to note as well, however.
Yep. if it was dissected and reversed engineered by the Chinese. It is then a copy of the M16A1a used by American and South Vietnamese soldiers which fired the M193 round using the 55 grain FMJ. The Europeans like the Germans, Austrians and French would produce the American M193 for their new service rifles in 5.56mm. The Germans produced the HK G33 for export and chambered it for the M193. The Austrians and French adopted their Steyr AUG and FAMAS rifles in 1977-78 using the M193 round. The Belgians at FN developed the 62 grain SS109 Experimental in the late 1970s which later became the M855 in the US. When the US Government replaced the M16A1 with the A2 in around 1982 then the rest of NATO changed over using the 62 grain SS109/M855 NATO as a standard round in accordance to STANAG (Standard NATO Agreement).
Who gave the camera man too much sugar?
Is anything sacred 😂
C'mon Larry! Twist rate/ratio is independent from the chamber dimensions.
jlscjwtwich no its not. to be mil/nato spec it has to meet std requirements 1/12 twist is not nato std.
D-op1 Well, I must concede the NATO argument as the standard was adopted in '77 I think. Come to think of it, the early M16s I worked with in my active duty days did have .223 markings. So yeah, I was wrong. Chalk it up to 'knee-jerk' reaction.
This particular version is very old. Up in north here we have Norinco CQA which is mil-spec expect the commercial buffer tube . I have my personal one fitted with BCM KMR13, magpul kits and EOTECH， fucking thing run through every dirty ammo I can find with no problem. The new Chinese version comes with Matt black finish and msrp around 600. I mean I have tried DDM4, Sig 516, MCX and NEA15, Norinco really did a good job this time.
Why does this remind me of the service rifle in fallout new vegas lol
What's funny is I bet the plastic says "Mattel" just like the originals.
It's interesting that these are a collectors item in the US and readily available in Canada. The import bans have really screwed you folks in the US.
I have one, it runs well.
I'd like to say that I'm an American and that I'm not going to abondon our best hardware manufacturers. One guy I found is Rock River. Their LAR 8 is the most logical, gorgeous, hardcore pieces of firearms I've seen in my life and it's the real America on the in and outside of that gun I can sense it. Please complete a series on firearms from American manufacturers like that if you can thank you sir. That company is completely legit and they anybody's funny business won't be successful with them so they are quite secure of a dealer. They're legit. No bullshit on their website, just nice to look at and very informational.
It even sounds like a Chinese AK
for $100 extra you can get it with a custom sound
The chinese make an old school m16 like you said. Captures from vietnam. Last i checked they had 1in12 twist on m16A1.
looks like a toy gun lol
The CQ was first introduced in the early 1980s
Norinco AR15s are very popular in Canada and have a very good reputation. not so much this 20" barrel Variant but the m4 copies are very widespread.
this 20" versions is around $600CAD. and the m4 is around $650.
you can get those in Canada for $500.
Alex Povolotski 500 bucks too much.
***** +++1 on that.
Anything over 20 Chinese Yuan is wayyyyy to much for a Norinco...in Canada or anywhere else. You get what you pay for, so spend the extra $ and buy something that is worth owning.
Gunpro28 So true.
Unless any of you losers own one you're speaking from your ass there.. its an awesome firearm, specially for the price.. ;P
Larry, do you know anything about the special front sight base that some of these rifles had? It looks like it's kind of a bastardized Type 56-style hooded post. Google Norinco CQ 311 and it should be apparent.
Ribbed hand guard for no one's pleasure.
I've owned a few Norinco cqa 556 ar15 rifles, they don't have the nicest finish, and they're not built 100% to a US spec rifle but with that being said they're great rifles and I never had a malfunction with any Norinco rifles I've owned. I've also owned a few Norinco sig 226 clones and a few 1911's and those guns are bulletproof and robust.
Rail looks like the condom I used last week stretched over a gun.
Colin Patterson Lmao wtf
You use condoms? I feel bad for you.
+ghostcell030 condoms protect a gun from litteraly anything
That grip is legit!
damn a 1/12 twist? thats gotta be really unstable w/ 55-62 grain
ObamaBinLaden: no it doesn't. All M16's and M16A1's had a 1/12 twist barrel. 55 grain will work well and it also stabilised the tracers which were longer. 62 grain NATO (the long once with steel penetrator) will proberly not accurate but won't tumble in flight.
Technically they adopted the Belgian SS109 62 grn bullet and that became the NATO standard not the 55 grn which was being used by US forces at the time (1977).
Chinese making an American gun, lol.
I thought these were on the market ages ago?
The make piles of copies of US made firearms. Up in Canada they are imported in by the thousands, lots of M1/M14 copies as well, they early Polytech M1A with a blued finish are excellent rifles considering they cost 300$ USD at the time, and the current Norinco M1 rifles with synthetic stocks are around 400$ USD or less, and are pretty decent too. Their AR rifles, not so much IMO, but they work, more or less, for a while. There are also piles of Norinco 1911s imported into Canada, the Commanders used to cost 300$ USD or less, and with some work and parts from Brownells/etc, you could make a great 1911 Commander for 450$ USD, or even less.
SerHaHa a
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I picked up a used one for $350 a couple of years ago. Shoots fine. Functions every time. Hits what I aim at with out exception. I switched out the butt stock, forestock & grip for magpull, but other than that I've left it alone. I clean it once a year whether it needs it or not. I have no idea how much went through it before I got it, so far I've only fired 2 cases of Norinco manufactured ammo through it. No problems, no issues, no failures. Personally I find it comparable with my 1980s vintage Colt SP1. Maybe I just got lucky & found a good one.
My two Norinco M14 copies, SKS copy, & three 1911 A1 copies all work just fine as well. In my experience fit, finish, functionality, & accuracy are on par with most of the other brands on the market & pricing is definitely attractive.
Just my personal experience. Your experience may differ.
Damn thing even looks like a piece of shit.
Sgt C4 took the words right outta my mouth. Looks like a piece a shit.
Sgt C4 still better than a highpoint
Ole Larry's got it made!!!
That's is a piece of garbage. No shell defector on the right side of the upper receiver. What about the barrel specs. I would not trust it.
kc5hgv Is based on the *early* M16's, those had no brass deflectors, you dumb fuck.
no need for shell deflectors as this video showed...
Moron doesn't know shit about guns and was too lazy to watch and listen to the video and its facts. Probably a tacticool 10 year old with a short attention span.
The early M16 rifles didn't have shell deflector, and the early production M16s have 1:12 twist. Educate yourself 🙄 hating on China is one thing, being plain stupid is another
Nice cool Vlog, nice intro talking.Simply a joy when you placed this video. Honestly , the chinese version M311, still lack fine quality and beauty from the Original AR-15 , or M16A1. My preference is stil the M4 carbine and the Glock 18 pistol. Wished i can still get back to timezone when i was once resided in TX , FORT HOOD , TX76543. East Rancier , Kileen. Have a good one.......
Chinese been copying American design since forever ;/
Rocky Dang except compass, gunpowder and your existence. DANG!!
Jeff Newcomb You clearly don't know the difference in operating principles of whatever German weapon you had in mind (I guarantee that no matter which Nazi German weapon system you pull out of your ass, you will be wrong) and the Stoner system the M16 uses. Additionally, you're clearly unfamiliar with the billions of dollars annually lost to Chinese counterfeits and frauds.
***** you guys taking this so fucken literally, it was a joke and exaggeration
dear lord
The AR is well out of patent. Everybody's copying them now.
Almost every country have their own ar or ak. Will u say HK416 is a German copy ar?
Hey Man It would be nice if you took a few more minutes to discuss the gun and maybe certain traits it has or certain details or behaviors , like what MAC (military arms channel) does , also some more footage of just raw shooting no music and a target , would be quite nice or maybe 2 videos one short one more detailed , thought id let you know
norinco is pretty big up here in Canada,cheap too!pretty rugged,guess loser tolerances!I have a 1911 double safety extended mag release brand new under 500 can,got it 3 years to test it,no cleaning etc still runs like a champ,rough interior but made from railway steel i think!Guns are tools,no matter where they're made,it's who uses them
Love the videos and the channel, just wanna ask is there any chance that maybe you can make a video of chinese Type 81? Thanks!
Very glad to see an American get his hands on a chinese copy to see how it compares.
please do more norinco videos, like QBZ - 95 -1 if you can get your hands on it!
Would you mind making a episode about the Chinese Norinco Type 56? I sure appreciate it. I know there's a few different ones but I'm referring to the AK variant. The Type 56 Type-1 and Type-2 also. Interesting AKs as well. Thanks again
This legit look like those toy guns that you get when you buy some cheap GI Joe knock-offs.
One word BRASSDEFLECTOR
Hi Larry, if these were developed from the original a1 variant m16s, have you seen any of the flaws that were present in those in the norinco versions?
What’s the purpose for the bump on the stock ?
Likes a bastard child of a capture M16A1 and some kinky engineer at Norinco during Valentine date.
Still Canada be like: May i imported your entire stock, pretty please?
information assurance went beyond the marine corps
Good review and like to see more pre-ban Chinese knock out copy fire arm.
Quick question....you mentioned that the rifle is .223 and not 5.56, so I'm assuming it would be dangerous to fire 5.56 from that rifle?
For a country where gun ownership is illegal, Norinco does make some pretty cool pieces.
The CQ M311-1 was my first AR. I bought it when I lived in Canada years ago. Back then they were fairly common there; not sure if that's still true though.
damn Larry didn't realize you brought your film crew to Canada, i wonder what else is coming down the pipe from your Canadian film session.
Awesome.. Thanks Larry
Larry you are the best. Please run for president . The country needs you sir
Very interesting design honestly. I usually don’t like Chinese made stuff but they do make good weapons.