KF41 'Lynx' & AS-21 'Redback' Infantry Fighting Vehicles - Land 400 Phase 3 | ARMORED COMPETITION! 💪
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- Опубликовано: 16 сен 2024
- The two contender vehicles for Australia’s soon-to-be-selected infantry fighting vehicle (IFV) (LAND 400 Phase 3 project) recently conducted a firepower demonstration at Puckapunyal Military Area, showcasing next-level protection, firepower and mobility.
Rheinmetall Defence Australia’s KF-41 Lynx and Hanwha Defense Australia’s Redback have been facing off in extensive user-evaluation field trials.
Both companies have delivered three prototype vehicles, which are being tested over the course of this year as part of a two-year risk mitigation activity. A decision on the preferred tenderer will be presented to government for consideration in 2022.
Given its potential to determine which contractor will benefit from Army’s costliest-ever acquisition program, the outcome of the detailed testing and evaluation now underway on the two contenders for the ADF’s Infantry Fighting Vehicle (IFV) requirement is keenly awaited.
Not that anything of substance is likely to be known until the end of this year at the earliest from the overall Risk Mitigation Activity (RMA) of Project Land 400 Phase 3. Also known as the Mounted Close Combat Capability, the project will deliver and support up to 450 IFVs and 17 maneuver support vehicles.
These complex platforms will replace the army’s expensively-upgraded but now obsolescent M113AS4 armored personal carriers at a cost estimated in the 2016 Defence White Paper at $10-15 billion - a remarkably broad variation in potential expenditure.
And that was until publication of the 2020 Force Structure Plan, in which the forecast soared by an extraordinary 80 per cent to $18-27 billion.
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#army #tanks #australia
Who do you think will win the contract!? Let me know which one and why! :-) Please share this video!
Let the Omnissiah decide. Afterall, Australia itself is a real-life desert deathworld. They are just doing the Emperor's will.
I would go with the KF 41 from rhinemetal because assuming they would use the same factory or add on to it where required and not need to build another one, the factory they already have set up to build the boxer CRVs would have larger capacity than the factory hanwha are constructing to build the selfe propelled howitzers from Land 8116 Phase 1. with the rhinemetal factory producing somewhere around 200 vehicles compared to hanwha around 50 for there respective contracts.
but hey i know almost nothing about how our military trials and selects new vehicles and equipment im just some guy that keeps up with whats going on with this kind of stuff by reading various web articles and watching videos like this
Hard call the k9 thunder is the new artillery and the boxer is the recon so they have options for factory's etc
As a Hungarian, we are "cat persons" and the Lynx is a nice kitten.
Considering how tight the competition is, and it's between German quality and local/homemade, then I think it might be the local one they would go for. Now, I don't know the costs per unit for both of them, so I couldn't include that info in there.
2023 Redback Won! so happy!
Sad 😥 I was hoping for the lynx to win but anyway Hungary has ordered over 200 of it so I am happy
Both are great ones.
Redback's special composite rubber with more of reliability n durability, less fatigue to human.
Only specific ammunition able for lynx can be weak point for logistics, familiarity will be good as with boxer.
Training, infra investment will be par.
Cooperation, alliance, logistics, ...
Overall i think redback is little better for Australia.
@Jjohnno 87 my thoughts exactly. I think the lynx is the better vehicle over all but the red back is definitely the best choice for Australia
In a Pacific war, there are only 2 regions that will be able to send weapons ammo and parts and that will be Europe and the US. So at first a cooperation with South Korea might be a great idea but when the shit hits the fan, realities will shift very quickly!
@@waldschrat6729 Yeah but at what cost? After paying off the Germans and French for the IP rights to produce the ammo in Australia, the ammo cost will be much higher than sourcing standard NATO 30mm that are available everywhere dirt cheap.
The basic weapon on the KF41 uses standard NATO ammunition size 30×173mm (STANAG 4624)
but of course if it is a 30mm ligh anti-tank APFSDS-T projectile or the 30mm ABM programmable projectile with tungsten carbide fragments, it is much more expensive than standard 30mm projectiles. But a better projectile is more expensive, it may still be worth more!
Being half-Aussie half-English, and being born in Brisbane, I have always had an interest in the ADF. The M113 was a fantastic vehicle for its time, but with the type of assault rifle rounds out there today, .50 cal sniper rifles, grenade launchers, as you said Matt, it is well past its expiry date. The ADF have used them for interesting things however, mortar carriers, and I even think at one point, they tried putting on a larger calibre weapon on it. I am stunned to say this, but I am actually becoming quite the fan of what is coming out of South Korea weapons wise in the laast decade, and think that the Red Back is a damned good choice.
We Aussies may not design our own armoured vehicles anymore, BUT, we sure know how to modify them to become even better than the original. When you have Australia as your back yard to test toys like these in, you get a super wide variety of weather conditions, from tropical wet jungle, then a day or so drive later, scorching hot desert, open plains, built up cityscapes etcetera. You are going to need a vehicle that will take all of these into account. I am still annoyed that we got the Abrams as the replacement tanks for the Leopards, because that vehicle meant a whole lot of infrastructure had to be rebuilt to support its weight and dimensions. It is one thing that I don't think the government factored in when they brought the vehicle, or at least, didn't think it would take that much to work.
But yes, I do like the AS21, especially the with how good it looks with the IR blankies on it. Thanks for a good video there Mat!
What you need to realise is that Australia does not buy hardware because of any "evaluation" or any real process of competitive evaluation. What we do, is have generals pick out what they want, and then try to justify it with the dog and pony show of a competition while twisting the rules and evaluations around to favour whatever they want. This has been particularly obvious since DSTO basically shed most of its engineering and Test and Evaluation equipment and expertise.
"Modifying them to become even better than the original" is just farcical at this point, come the fuck on. Do you seriously believe that? After the disaster of "Australianising" the Eurocopter Tigre, after the MRH90 scandals of low availability, parts breakages, non-functioning ramps? How about the Collins Class, when our own Defense Minister said that they couldn't trust the shipyards in SA to put together a canoe? Shoehorning an American combat system onto a stretched Swedish submarine "only" about doubled the programmed price, and skyrocketed _unit_ price into 850 _million_ per sub! At that price you could buy a nuclear submarine that can circumnavigate the world underwater!
Then there was the RAAF signing onto the F-35 program, which is going so well that we've had to order more Super Hornets to fill a capability gap from lack of airframes and parts. And the expense is so ruinous that we have had to scrap a full squadron of them, effectively downsizing our air force.
Abrams is another white elephant, with its 70 ton combat weight basically breaking bridges under its tracks and shredding asphalt. There was a reason why the Leopard 1 was chosen back in the day - it was because our infrastructure could actually support it. The small size of the ADF also militated against 4 man crews, but we went for the Abrams anyway to suck up to our masters in Washington.
As a country, since the coup d'etat deposing Whitlam in a CIA driven plot, we have offshored:
- our telecoms industry
- our car industry
- our mining industry (Whitlam was going to nationalise it - the CIA couldn't have that!)
- our oil industry
- our military aircraft industry with Government Aircraft Factory
- our domestic armoured vehicle production
- our domestic railway production and rolling stock
And of course, our new masters in Washington are laughing all the way to the bank as we transfer billions of taxpayer dollars overseas, to buy capabilities we sold off due to a coup they initiated! The only thing we seem to be good at, is sending the SAS to Afghanistan to shoot pine nut farmers in the head and plant weapons on them to pretend we are "doing something" in the War on Terror.
We have reduced ourselves to selling woodchips to China and getting paper back, or soybeans to Indonesia and Vietnam and getting tofu back - and you seriously believe, that after crippling our own industry, that we can "modify things to be better than the original?" We are a Third World country pretending to be a First World military power with sovereign debt. We are basically Saudi Arabia only without the slave workers from Pakistan or the beheading of women. Although I'm not sure about the first one.
@@MonMalthias You made some good points however you most likely are one of those people who complain about everything and every decision which isn't yours lol.
I think the one with the IR blanket was the Lynx, not the Redback…..
I really like those IR-blankets on the Redback, very smart and practical.
Apparently designed by Defense Research and Development Canada, according to the manufacturer's brochure.
@@Ostsol Ive seen people make those out of emergency blankets and fabric before for personal use but it is quite a smart and relatively cheap way to hide your IR signature. BAE had some fancy high-tech surface coating and mechanical application I believe. Sure it might be impresive on a technical scale but surely less practical and costly when it comes to versatility and maintenance.
Take care and cheers!
Check out SAAB Barracuda, been around since early 90s. ruclips.net/video/wDGa9FBsUSA/видео.html
@@paddanandersson4626 Thank you! Now that I think of it, I might even have seen one of those camospheres live in one of the Försvarsmaktsdagarna at Gärdet some years ago, but not comitted it to memory. FLIR the company had them at their tent. Now I really want one of those SOTACS suits... Harebra nu!
Also helps against the heat, like 40C in February
I'm hoping we get the redback. Makes sense considering we are also getting the Hanwha K9 artillery. Either are a good choice though. Just hope we get them quickly seeing we are probably going to need them very soon against the Chinese.
How so? Australia will never be able to move them to a battlefield of China's choosing and China barely has the sealift capability to put a division onto Taiwan's most accessible beaches.
You could also make the same argument that Rheinmetall also produce the Boxer which shares many part commonalities.
@@captaron fair nuff, how about then, ammunition and tire supply problems with the German stuff. Or the overweight under defended turrets.
The redback is designed for us, our conditions and our logistics.
and made here
@@Veldtian1 No worries, pretty sure we'll get a visit soon after Taiwan. True they are going to have problems getting here. And when they do, realizing they shouldn't have picked a fight with us (because we will bloody their noses really well) they will bugger off home. Unless nukes are used, but then everyone is screwed anyway.
@@scott429 Nice propaganda ABC spew about - too bad the DoD immediately debunked it.
If Lynx is selected, RM will build an ammo plant in AUS. Might even do it just for Boxer. There are also other suppliers who can make the right ammo - they only need to pay up to do the integration work. Same with any gun - though the RM one is rather high tech as the HE round gets programmed at the end of the barrel to explore at the exact right moment, above a trench or inside a room. AUS DoD wanted that capability. Being able to do that costs extra.
Tires for a 37t vehicle moving on and off road are a complicated high tech product; you need to build a stock of them no matter whether you use French tires or Murican ones.
There are lots of ways to defend the Lance turret. Problem is the Aussie DoD, after chosing the turret "as is" years ago, later decided it wants to put on
- a heavy RWS
- the heaviest APS out there
- on top of the already planned Spike missile launcher.
Putting on 2 of them aint a problem. Having all three while still being able to fire the stabilized gun precisely on the move requires some extra work.
Hoping that the AS-21 wins. I have been following this for a little while now and I like the way Hanwha have gone about to submit their case. Pretty much have given the body as a blank canvas and asked companies who have already invested in Australian defence industries to join in and make the turret and other systems for it. The turret itself is remarkable, by changing 3 components it can change caliber quite easily (30mm, 40mm, 50mm the Bushmaster is an excellent cannon) and not to mention Hanwha sent one of these to Israel just to ensure the spike integration before trials... They have invested a lot into the development of a built for purpose Australian derivative of their own platform and I like it.
to be fair the german vehicle can do similar things, i believe they could even convert it into an ambulance vehicle by simply replacing the body, same with the gun, though perhaps not in the same sense
plus K9 thunder factory in Geelong is a big one and its long history of manufacturing will be revived for the short term if the AS-21 gets the contract.
This is good news for us down-under Mat, as you know lot of our lads have been training using the old technique of “clank clank, I am a tank” and when you see blokes with a black beret and a tanky badge spending years of their service in APC’s of bygone era; it will be a pleasure in getting new toys instead of “hand me downs”! Cheers mate. Harera
As an Australian I can't help but want the redback to win :)
I think the redback is excellent.
I think it will for a number off reasons. The Lynx is good too. Excellent protection. But the redback is made for our environment. I think it's more durable. Probably cheaper to produce parts and probably a lot more upgrade options would be available for them during its service life. since the south Korean company use sheared technology with the USA systems been put into the redback. And the spike missile option is a good game changer for the IFV crew. Rather than be just stuck with just a 30mm gun.
@@Nathan-ry3yu „I think it’s more durable“ based on what? The lynx is already in service while the Redback only exists on paper plus 3 vehicles
@@lilpold9192 not to be rude but you do realize to say that it “only exists on paper PLUS 3 vehicles” is “conflicting” to say the least? 😂😂😂😉
@@stephenmyers7076 hahaha youre a smart one aren’t you 😉 three existing vehicles is virtually nothing for a military grade vehicle. Do you know how much time and testing must go into an vehicle until all it’s Problems are sorted out? Just look at cars. Every first batch of a new car has problem even though they are made by experienced professionals with a couple hundred prototypes. The red back is factually a prototype while the lynx exists since many years and has been already chosen by country’s. Also buying the Lynx means buying basically a modular classy with a custom national turret so durability of the cheesy was the number priority by Rheinmetall. So „I think the red back is more durable“ is so unbased in reality it’s actually hilarious
As a K-Pop fan I recommend the AS-21!
Me too! RedBack in your area~
I think the best IFV for the Australian army is the Redback IFVas it has more features. Also it looks super good
What feature does it have that the Lynx doesn’t?
If Australia chooses KF41 Lynx. Germany makes a profit.
If Australia chooses AS-21 Redback. Germany makes a profit.
lol
@@hikerfrantz5829 why with the Redback?
@@lilpold9192 Redback's engine is from Germany.
@@hikerfrantz5829 ah ok cool
What many are forgetting is that the Army doesn't decide which platform they get. The trials will provide a recommendation, but it is the government of the day that decides. Assuming that both platforms meet the essential requirements, most of the important and some of the desirable requirements, the decision will come down to manufacturing options and the impact on affecting voters in key electorates. Since Rheinmetall already has the Land 400 phase 2 contract (Boxer) and the Land 121 phase 3 contract (medium/heavy wheeled vehicles) ongoing maintenance, there is good argument that there is enough economic activity to shore up votes in SE QLD for the government of the day. Geelong, Victoria, where Hanwha plan to build the K9 Self-Propelled Artillery (under Land 8116) is currently in need of Defence spending to maintain economic activity since the drying up of Defence works there in Naval shipbuilding. My money is that the AS-21 will win the contract, not because it is much better than the KF-41, but simply because the Federal Government will need to have a keen eye on winning some key electoral seats in Victoria. Of course, I can be wrong!
That’s how it works in the US too on most occasions. Has a decision since been made?
Looks like I was correct in my prediction. Hanwha recently won the contract to build 129 IVFs in the State of Victoria
The Redback is designed only for Aus and will be built in Aus. Among those great features of Redback, composite rubber track and Iron-vision are revolutionary.
Both of them would be built in Aus thats no issue, Rheinmetall already manufactures the Boxer and other vehicles in Aus.
@@Atlas-zm6bn And the Boxer is already having problems and Rheinmetall is not good on after-sale service (not interested).
Hello I'm Korean. I'm really happy that South Korea is becoming one of important defense partners of Australia against our common threat (china). Even though AS21 not wins (hopefully not), I wish we keep teamed up to protect peace and liberty and democracy!
Hopefully we get the redback. Keep the money in our region, plus I think south Korea will be alot less likely to pull some political action that could jeopardise our IFV's than European contractors.
You mean like what Australia did to France?
You meant, "keep some money in our region". You lose tons of money in any military contract, the amount kept by taxes on workers is a very small fraction. It's mainly about national security rather than money. You want your weapons made in your country in case of war.
Nah the lynx will win
Kiddin?
@@lilpold9192 They went over budget not our problem
Redback win 🎉
Great Video Matt, I didn't know we still had the M113 working here. Keen to see more. Cheers Broomy Australia.
We have the M113AS4, it's been lengthened and doesn't look much like a traditional M113, but they're still kicking. If these new buckets last half as long then the billions being spent on them might be worth it. Unfortunately bleeding edge tech rarely lasts.
Damn, I really hoped for a more in depth talk, what are the differences between those two vehicles, what makes them more likely to picked or not and so on
Both come with a 30mm stabilised cannon, spike anti tank missiles, iron fist APS and very similar electronics packages in terms of what is available in the public domain. The winner will likely come down to reliability and performance during testing and of course price.
@@Weakeyedominant Knowing how Australia likes their stuff, we'll go for whichever one we can make domestically.
@@devonlord99 we really don't have a choice as good as some foreign equipment is because we would need to ship it from all over the world...and realistically we need to build our industrial base.
@@devonlord99 Who ever wins will be built in Australia.
Rheinmetall Boxers are being made in QLD now
Hanwha AS9 Huntsman being made in VIC soon
Both companies will have infrastructure in place
@@Weakeyedominant i read the Hanwha Redback is alot cheaper, but imho cheaper product always have a few drawbacks.
Glad your back Red Leg. Love your content.
Damn that drone shots while flying in the line of fire...
Your avatar and name, so very accurate! :)
@@wilburseymore5103 that's some long steadycam arm.
We did those shots. Sooo close to getting shotdown a few times but no damage after 3 days of filming.
@@thomasgash689 Very cool footage, well done!
@@apathtrampledbydeer8446 Thanks! If you want to see more danger close footage, check out the Australian Army Drone Racing Team on Facebook.
i believe the ifv will outlive the tank by a long time. They are very versatile even if they don’t have the same armor as a abrams or leopard.
the Tank isn't going anywhere
The Toyota hilux will outlive us all.
Probably the main reason will be because penny pinching politicians think the IFV can do the job of tank and infantry fighting vehicle in one. Arm a couple of them with a larger gun turret, tank problem solved will be their way of thinking. That's how the Netherlands and Belgium lost their tanks.
@@chaptermasterpedrokantor1623 an infantry fighting vehicle is not supposed to do the job of a tank it is supposed to as the name implies stick with the infantry as a support vehicle
@@spartanx9293 Agreed. If anything they will get heavier. British Challenger3 is going to weigh 80 tonnes.
Also, if extra removable weapon modules & turrets are bought. Then one module can be repaired in the shop while another module can be installed on the vehicle chasis. This should increase the availability of the vehicle. Had an interesting project with production equipment that was supposed to be evaluated with this concept. Never got to see the end results on it.
would be so much fun to plan those trials and test the vehicles
As an Australian soldier, I tried that armored car for a month. In conclusion, needless to say
The AS-21 Redback outperforms the KF-41 in all performance.
니가뭔 호주 군바리냐 ㅋㅋㅋ
한국에도 댓부대 있는줄알겠네 붕슨 매국노 련
Next time you pretend to be a Australian Soldier at least try to hide the Korean video playlists on your RUclips channel lol
I think the vehicle which has a better air conditioner would win. You know that sitting in the steel box, under the hot Australia burning sun, it would be a suicide mission.
Am much as I believe that we should seek commodity of machinery etc within our armoured vehicles I feel that the Redback may be the better vehicle for the purchase. The spike missile and the rubber tracks make it, for me, a more appealing vehicle. However that being said, I rode in the back of a M113, as an Assault Trooper (2/14 LHQMI); rather than a driver/commander.
The Lynx also has the Spike missile too, it's not just something exlusive to the Redback alone, so that's not a valid argument. The Lynx also has better ballistic armor protection with the use of thick side skirts which the Redback lacks entirely. In the end both vehicles are pretty much on the same Level though. Both vehicles will have APS, giving them very good protection against missiles and RPGs. At this point it doesn't even matter which variant the Australian Army will get because both of them are very eqaul in capabilities. Either way, Australia will have one of the best IFV when it enters service.
@@xAlexTobiasxB dont only 1 have ampb capblity
@@missouripatriot6926 No, I don't think the AS21 has amphibious capabilities. Neither does the Lynx. But it's not a very important feature on the battlefield anway, so it's irrelevant. What would australia even need amphibious tanks for anyway? Is australia planning to invade europe soon ? LoL
They both are well made IFVs and worth to be chosen. I guess there will be a political dicision. I mean it will not a question between Hanwha and Rheinmetall, it will more a question between Victoria and Queensland. Because Land 400 Phase 2 project went to Queensland it can be assumed that Phase 3 project goes to Victoria. That is Hanwha will make it.
Redback fantastic!!!
korean junk
@Max _ this has nothing to do with US decision... Australia can take AS-21, and US can choose KF-41.
@Max _ not really
@Max _ lol alright
I'm leaning towards us getting the Rheinmetall Beast to compliment our recent acquisition of the Boxer CRV's (that replaced our LAVs). Rheinmetall will have a huge manufacturing footprint here in Oz and these vehicles will be built and maintained here probably alongside the Boxer up here in Queensland.
Hanwha already in the process of commencing manufacturing for AS 9 Hunstman and K10 AARV's .Hanwha Defense approved the welding samples by an Australian company K-TIG. K-TIG will support in manufacturing AS9 and AS21 Redback in Australia.
Gee this is a bloody tough battle, both on the initial stages of land400 put the others to shame, both will be built in Australia if awarded the contract. Both IFV's have been enhanced based on the Australian special requirements and conditions and really there is very little difference between them and both have proved to be outstanding IFV's who gets the contract is anyone's guess but for me, I would like Australia to increase its 450 to 1,000 and purchase 500 of each because both are great companies and both are going to be built in Australia using Australian manpower, manufacturers, and materials, but more importantly is the fact that the technical expertise will be passed on to Australian personnel and Australia may one day be able to design and build their own IFV.
Build 1 type for the regular army and the other for the reserves. Would be interesting
Logistically speaking surely that would be a mistake.
Puckapunyal pronunciation is like “pucka-pun-yell”. Good attempt though!
more like puck-apun-nyal
but yeah. I understand the confusion giving the amount of yelling.
But the last name doesn't sound like that.
Listen to the song “I was only 19” by redgum. It has the proper pronunciation
Yeah, he did massacre it a little, but it's okay. :)
close
@@edwardgilmour9013 not close enough for me it’s my home town we’ll Seymour is but I grow up on that base miss it so much
Haha you definitely said Puckapunyal wrong buddy, we just call it pucka. I personally hope they choose the red back, definitely the all round bit of kit. Upgrades to bushmaster chain gun later, spike as well.
AS21 Redback has vital amphibious capabilities if Australia has any interest in power projection, which are only going to become more and more important as Western focuses shift towards preparing for near-peer engagements across the rivers, straits and seas of Asia Pacific (Eastern Europe too, but idk how much of that action Australia is concerned with).
No one will use nuclear weapons. Conventional weapons for a brief period of skirmishes and a cease fire is highly likely, even with peer to peer wars.
@Conor Hanley Wrong. Nuclear will never go nuclear as the calamity is far too great. Policymakers and defense experts states that conventional war is much more likely. I'd believe them over so nobody on YT, thank you. No offense though.
@Conor Hanley love your optimism but there's always wars going on. Pakistan and India fight often; both nuclear armed. China and India skirmished recently. China vs Taiwan would likely involve the US.
Our chances of staying out of all war is very slim. Human aggressors must have deterrence.
I would bet on the Lynx. Reasons: lance turret and other components shared with the already in service Boxer, redback is not in service or bought by anyone at this point whilest the Lynx is already under contract in Hungary for 280~ pieces and the factory for it is under construction...
Came to say this! Also a Lynx derivative is going to be one of the contenders for the US OMFV.
@@mortified776 same for the Hanwha solution.
@@CK-ur2ev Oh you're right, they're teamed with Oshkosh.
Well, Hanhwa people might be offering them better offset options etc and it seems certainly to be a very good piece of hardware so I wouldn't discount the SK option just yet! But yes, Lynx seems to be the most advanced IFV on the European market right now and I hope that Czechia chooses it too in the trials that are going on right now (if our government of post-communist thiefs doesn't fuck things up because of the elections or some shit).
Hmm, their is also the the Australian version of the k9 to be underway, very soon.
Redback already choiced and Korea's SLBM technology service to Aussie.
Australia is also soon set to get the M1A2 Sepv3, and the Himars and the AH-64E apache. Really stepping up. But whats really impressive is their navy Upgrade.
The air forces loyal wing man is pretty cool.
I do wish we update to a combo landing/aircraft carrier.
Something like the Japanese as doing with there helicopter “carriers”
Navy upgrade ? The navy has Had terrible choices , naval groups crappy Frankenstein French submarines already billions over budget and years behind schedule, and the garbage British type 26 frigates that are almost 4 billion a ship and 2 years behind schedule, the navy is getting the worst choices
You missed the K9 self propelled artillery.
Mate that is because the tiger failed, as for the Abram's, we had the chance to buy the lep 2 , the pnz 2000, Hughes offered the cobra, but they chose the tiger, the navy went with the sea hawk Romeo's. The ADF has had nothing but bad buy , after bad buy, after bad buy
@@TheMelbournelad true, the ability is still there if we convert them in the future. They were looking into the US and Japan to help fund cross decking capabilities.
Just call it "Pucka" :) Its our version of Bovington. I'm biased toward the Lynx but I'm not a big fan of rubber track. Both are Light Years in front of the M113A1 and the interim M113AS4. FYI, another part of LAND 400 is the ASLAV replacement - already decided.
The track material technology will continue to develop eventually surpassing steel its just a matter of how long it takes the scientists to create vs the time till next conflict maybe rubber tracks with bolt on steel sections counld be a mid term solution but timd will tell. Best of luck in all you endeavours.
Sincerely,
Jon
Alberta Canada.
@@FastUgly Tracks arent a decisive criterion. Both providers can and will offer steel or rubber when asked to do so.
The rubber tracks are now modular and easier to replace in field than the steel. The only thing keeping steel relevant is increasing weight of ifvs which seems to be a mistake if ajax is anything to go by
@@Weakeyedominant I'm still not persuaded that replacing track link as and when required is not better than needing a truck to carry a complete side. I know track work is a pain (I've done it for a few years) but reliance on an ARVL, a truck or forklift or whatever does seem a better option. esp. in a mine / IED environment.
@@whya2ndaccount there is company that has developed rubber tacks that come is segments. I assume its some sort of fancy reinforced polymer with steel in it somewhere. It's been trialed on the cv90. If that's available where they don't need to replace the whole band and it proves durable without stretching it would be a game changer
You got pretty close with Puckapunyal Matt! Great video!
Great redback 👍
they have also beefed up the armour package to substitute this new force. Tracked arty with himars mlrs with 500km range + precision strike missile with abrahms assault breacher ect. was all much needed and long over due!
Geezus Matt! It's "puck-a-pun-yull"? Or Pucka for short.
Had them floating around up here at the Townsville High Range Training Area as well.
Unpopular opinion: I think that hanwha will bag this one. Rumor has it that the German boxers are having some trouble with the turret system and that some items like tires are bespoken German made ones that are over priced. A growing need to get closer with Asian allies is important too, like the polish purchase of America m1 tanks as a example of geopolitical influences in weapons procurement
The tires a French made because it are special tires that you can't buy this of the shelf. And the problems with the turret are blown over the top by the news paper.
It makes long term sense I guess
Has been debunked by the DoD long ago.
My guess: Some Hanwha lobbyist panicked over the Elbit BMS disaster an decided he needed to have some BS spread to level the playingfield.
The one real "issue" is that AUS wants to put both a big remote weapons station AND the Iron Dome APS on top of the CRV Lance2 turret.
Iron Dome is one of the heaviest APS out there. Putting on all that extra weight is complicated for a 8x8. Way less of an issue for a tracked vehicle.
sounds like you are getting your technical info from ABC. Best to listen to the Supplier or the DoD.
As21 will get the contract Rhinemetal/BAE have the boxer program which is an industrial sized program and the k9 thunder is not enough of an industrial investment so AS21 will be chosen to provide the industrial investment the k9 does not provide.
I would like to see the red back with a view to leverage more of the artillery and perhaps future tanks too as there is a need for continued manufacturing base in Australia
I've seen the KF 41 Lynx in person about a week ago (International Airshow, Kecskemét, Hungary). I was impressed too.
As Australian myself and I'm proud to be I would prefer that if we had a homemade Armored vehicle to consider instead of foreign condenser because the cash and the job's go to that country and that's not a bad thing it's just more self-sufficient and independent and setup relying on a outside source....
We tried that with Project Whaler and we just don't have the infrastructure and knowledge. Much better to buy "off the shelf" and require the winner to build X % here. That's why Rheinmetall have a huge complex in SE QLD making trucks, Boxer and maybe Lynx. Similarly part of the Korean bid is to set up a plan in VIC.
Can those machines stop the invasion of illegals into Australia ?
You know rhienmetall is building the CRV in redbank Queensland which they have sub contractored manufacturers within Queensland to supply components for the builds as well. Yes they parent company isn't Australian but atleast they are building them here with aussie workers
@@gg.youlubeatube6249 no those machines are meant to stop an advancing force in a force on force combat scenario
How's that submarine project working out?
For future reference, Puckapunyal is pronounced puh
kuh puh nyl, another way I can think of describing it is puk (like hockey puk) a pun (dad joke pun) yal (kinda like saying yall but with a far less hard a). Apart from that amazing video as always.
Canada should buy some too….. but our government will buy surplus m113s from Turkey. Then they’ll re fit them at a total cost of 50 billion. I’m being sarcastic. But sometimes our government does crazy things.
After Rheinmetall got the Boxer Deal and production line in Australia up and running I belive the Lynx will be the safe choice. Also Boxer and Lynx Turret share the same technology and operation system. Not to mention they have the same gun / same 30mm ammunition.
Technical there is not too much of a diffrence between those high tech killing maschines. Both vehicle will get the job done for Australia
Except Boxer CRV now developed a problem and Rheinmetall is not really good at providing after-sale service to Australia. Also, one of the Lynx unit blew out a gear box during testing. Not a good idea to put all eggs in one basket.
I'm Korean, but I'll be objective. Considering the modern battlefield, speed and low noise are important for infantry vehicles. Because the key is to move without being detected. Redback's rubber caterpillars outperform Lynx in speed and low noise.
As if the Lynx can't be equipped with rubbers...
@@SuperGeronimo999 they can but they won't
lots of big upgrades for the ADF lately, good news all around
How's the submarines going?
As-21 red back would be better in technological and diplomatically. Australia must think of threat from China in the region. Then it would be the best choice for Aussies.
My preference is the AS21 Redback - cheaper, lighter, and more adaptable for the future
I think the Lynx turret shares a lot of parts with the Boxer IFV variant turret. So from a logistical standpoint it might be beneficial to pick that one.
Redback turret is from a local Aus company.
Tough choices.
Puckapunyal in Victoria, I ran that course as part of the NSW to nationals cross country championships, prior to me joining the army. I served from 1998 to 2012, and ‘yes’, I’ve worked along side the M113 as well as the ASLAVS. Love your work mate.
The Redback won over the Lynx.
Go Red back 🎉🎉🎉🎉
Wish the new CV-90 was received more respect. I believe it is overlook because of its time in service but the new west version is really phenomenal
Overlooked? Are you kidding me denmark, estonia, finnland, netherland, norway, sweden and switzerland uses them plus they won slovakia and czek trials.
Australia has a land area that is larger than Europe (if you take away European part of Russia) so operating range is crucial and both AS21 and KF41 meet the range requirement.
lynx's very extensive .. redback wins
Small correction: both the Lynx and the Redback have a crew of 3 + 8 infantry. Not 6. Carry on.
Both can carry 8 dismounts, but from what I've read and heard, the future mechanised/motorised infantry squad will be 3 crewman and 6 dismounts (squad total of 9). The question for Army has always been are the crewmen RAAC or RAINF. From what I've heard, (although it is older information) the Army decided upon RAINF vehicle crewmen and 6 dismounts to balance out personnel requirements.
I know that Lynx can be made in both 8 and 6 dismount variants, no idea about Redback and I don't remember anymore which variant is actually the one that Ausies want :D
@@BallisticSollution I could be wrong, I’m not serving, but I’m pretty sure they want to stick with the 8 man sections of two fire teams. It wouldn’t make sense to pull the crew of 3 from the infantry and keep as crew when they can stick with the current method of crewing tracked vehicles with RAAC members. But that’s just me spit balling. Will be interesting to see what they end up doing.
@@TheoEvian The 6 dismount variant is the KF-31, which is just a re-manufactured Marder and limited in terms of growth upgrades. Australia is trialing the KF-41 variant.
How much space is provided for troops and gear? What seems reasonable on the drawing board might be too cramped (even unsafe) in the field.
The 113 they built will be used for other roles mostly non combat support.
The 113 is a versatile vehicle which been adopted into different versions for recover , radio and satellite, anti aircraft missile armed, medical, and base defense roles.
Base defence role as unmanned ground combat vehicle. Mortar carrier, supply or ammo carrier (ammo needs protection too), other possibilities are possible.
You know it's going to be a good video when it's about IFVs.
Two brilliant units, tough decision ahead for us Aussies!
Pucka Pun Yul is how you say it (AKA Pucka).
Either way, both of these systems are very competent and the Australian Army will end up buying a good IFV, at this point it will come down to cost. What i love about these new IFV is how flexible they are, really encapsulating the old "jack of all trades, master of none", because they can actually engage every type of threat a land vheicle might face in order to keep the crew alive.
IFVs are supposed to be jack of all, thats what infantry does.
at any rate, when it comes to bang for your buck, south korea usually has the advantage VS germany casue we use so much weapons ourselves. the AS-21 is basically a SUPER souped up version of our own top of the line K-21 IFVs, and the tech used in the AS-21 will probably be considerd for a K-21A1 down the line. more vehicles means more spare parts manufactured and lowers the costs.
it ALSO helps that hanhwa also makes the K-9 sparts, meaning that they can be fixed and maintained in the same depots.
Great presentation thank you
Redback incorporates much parts from australia and will be made here. It also contains tech from usa and israel. Korea is also closer than germany.
Happy to see lots of people like AS21 as a korean but I like the "modular system" of the Lynx. Both of the names are cool tho
And the winner is Redback, hopefully it comes with Hyundai warranty, 7 yrs and unlimited kilometres
Hyundai makes the K-2 tank, and Hanwha makes the K-9 self-propelled howitzer and Redback.
The most surprising thing is they kept the tracked coffins in employment for as long as we did.
That’s because of Rudd and Gillard.
but they didn't deploy them
@@craigbeatty8565 yep definitely rudd and Gillard's fault that we have 113's in 2021 after 56 years. Nothing to do with the libs before and after them.
@@jasoar1563 sorry Mate but they did deploy them to Vietnam, Somalia and Timor combat zones and other peace keeping deployments. Ex Bucket driver🙂🇦🇺
@@mylesdobinson1534 yes in the 60s and in low intensity combat. They didn't dare sent them to Iraq or afgahn
Redback is better than German one in terms of its maintain and function,high tech and price. And it will devort Aussy economy. I prefer Redback as Australian.
Lynx has the armor of an MBT, can be alterer to Orlikon, excellent Rheinmetal tech.
Armor of an MBT from about 1935. Protection from 30mm autocannon rounds on the front and 14.5mm machine gun rounds on the sides and back.
@@mistersmacky Even fanboying the Redback, the Lynx has 40-50 tons. Thats over a T-72 with 44t, (the Redback has 25-30tons a Bradley below 30). I would say weight correlates with armor and size. That should be rather 300-400mm equivalence. And IFVs are companions of the MBTs so there is no surprise.
Lynx does not have an armor of MBT... Which MBT are you speaking of and from what era??? From WW2 or current? If current, which MBT has that weak of armor level??? Leopard 2 has 800+mm armor. Are you saying Lynx has that thick of an armor? You are mistaken. Check your numbers again and report back to this comment thread please. BTW, the Redback battle weight is 42 tons, not 25-30 tons. Not sure where you are getting your figures from but you should check that again.
Additionally, the Lynx (one of the test units) developed a gear box problem during testing in Australia. So did the Boxer CRV from Land 400 Phase 2. Too top heavy and cannot accommodate APS and Rheinmetall is not too keen on helping to fix the problem. That is bad post-sale service.
loved that one matsimus. hope they go with the ifv with the atgm. always nice to have that extra punch when possibly dealing with mbt. love your content keep up the good work .
I'll say the redback, only because we are soon to build the AU version of the k9.
So they like to keep some commonality , I just hope the barsteds don't modified them .
Much more commonality to be had with Boxer APCs (esp CRV) than with a howitzer ...
As an outsider, I think it will come down to the question of capability (where I think the Lynx leads) vs money (where Redback leads), unless regional politics throw a spanner into the works ...
@@positroll7870 thanks for the reply, why I feel about the red back is. Some years ago, maybe 5 or 6, the government pulled out of a deal with South Korea, after the amount of effort the Koreans placed into the deal for the K9. I think the government ows a little debt over the k9 s, as there was a lot of embarrassment at the time. And now the Koreans have placed alot of work into this one in setting up the plant to build the k9, and if the red back is chosen, they will do the same. So the Koreans, have done a lot of work on the red back to suit the Australian conditions and to be flexible for what ever is needed.
So the political side may come in to play over the red back.
The boxer I am not sure if it will be chosen, it is a very good armoured vehicle, and I think many know it is . We have had the leopard 1 before, so using German equipment is not a problem here however, their maybe a some supply issue's on some parts.
The government wants to build them here, and I mean every thing so they can be indepndant , given what may take place in the region.
So it might just come down to regional influences in the end. if the boxer is chosen, then I think they will have to reassure the government, like the SK have offed so far. It's not going to be easy so we will have to weight and see.
@@paulbaker9277 The Boxer 8x8 has already been bought. The APC variant is already in service with the Aussie army.
As for Lynx vs Redback, AUS needs to chose the best IFV for its purposes, not being nice to Korea.
@@positroll7870 Being nice too Korea, no the bottom line is, to have the best choice for our country, that is the main part. The reason I placed some back ground with other deals, in my view , is what may come into play with some weight behind it. And including two resupply ships that fell through, as you have said, being an outsider.
I wrote this down to show what has taken place and why that may come into play over this deal.
Like your self, I only hope the best vehicle is chosen in the end, even if we may differ on what that choice that maybe, may it be the best. it will be a close race in the end for both.
But as I mentioned, the Australian government wants it all built here , with all parts included.
The reality is, that it will be what some numb nutted bloody Polly who's been stuffed like a pork pig that never really never knew the bloody difference between bush honey and bullshit!..on a lighter side...we will not have a say....best to the both of them 👍.
@@paulbaker9277 But you brought up the howitzer - which AUS actually bought. How do they owe Korea for that?
Germany also put a lot of effort into the submarine offer - and that was for a much bigger contract. Instead AUS chose the French offer - and how is that going? So I could just as well claim that AUS owes Germany something. Or even Japan. But that's just not how these things work.
The Redback was designed and supplied to specifically for the land 400 requirements, even the turret system. Whereas the Rheinmetall contender had to add additional units to the turret and vehicle itself for the missile system etc. Also the Rheinmetall unit uses specific 30mm ammunition, not a generic round and it can only be sourced from Germany, it also has apparently caused jams during testing. Only saying what I have heard so far.
I’m skeptical of claims that the Rheinmetall cannon is unreliable. German designed guns are are class leading. Have been forever.
@@wattlebough he said ammunition, not the gun. Ammo is critical to the performance of a weapon
Though it shares ammo with the boxer at least, which Australia also fields. That could bolster the supply problem a bit
The missile system was part of it from the beginning
As for the ammo
1) Same gun on the Boxer.
2) Factory for making it in AUS if Lynx wins
3) There are other producers for similar ammo. They (or AUS) just need to be ready to spend the money to certify it.
everything you wrote is hot garbage. don' you feel ashamed for your stupid propaganda attempt?
It is way past time for the ole M113 to go away. I used to drive them in the 90s and 00s and their firsrt problem was that they were so slow when we still had loepard1s the leo would do close on 100 km on the roads but the poor ole 113 was maxed out at 80 KM so as a scout force for the tanks they were useless add tyo that the 113s would stop a 30 cal but not a 50 cal round it was no longer an armoured taxi but a butter box.
Problem was that till now the only way to have sped was to have wheels and Australia is notoriously a death trap for any sort of tyres on any vehicle.
The bigger problem was that the powers that be couldnt decide on how to employ one tank regiment nd 4 or so IFV or apc regiments effectivly. Once they finally decided on this role and how to split things between the 3 ARA and 1 Reserve GRES Brigades with the second Gres Brigade being mainly for training. It ment they could look for suitable vehicles which is why they updated to the Abrams to keep the NATO/US compatibility going but the big problem was the IFV/APC area and for years and especially after the procurement of ABRAMS it was thought most likely we would get a deal on ex US BRADLEYs but with the RAAF getting state of the art planes and the RAN getting their new toys to replace the relative new older toys it is great to see they are going for the more cutting edge type IFV/APC.
By the way Matt your friend sheldrake is obviously to most ex army here a dropshort(Gunner)
Boxer and Lynx/Redback are nice.
I still think there is a role for a cheap, capable tracked APC like this one
ruclips.net/video/fW-Ck46GAdI/видео.html
away from the immediate frontline.
Heh, the USA likes a Lynx variant and is looking at the Korean IFV as well. A common "Pacific powrs IFV" would be massive thing. Production in Australia, Korea and the USA would make for a secure supply of vehicles for Korea if their cease fire fdails.
Australia chose the Redback, US rejected it... might go for the Lynx.
Hi Matsimus, you are absolutely right about the way the Australian military goes about procuring new vehicle platforms, they accept where their own defence industry doesn't have the technical skills, knowledge or capacity to design and build a certain capability, therefore they just get on with it and buy the best foreign made platforms that they can afford and so aim to get the maximum capability for the money. I do wish our MOD and the British Army took this approach more often, and stopped trying to just create jobs at home for the sake of political votes, despite it often being the most costly and inefficient route of procurement and compromising on capability.
Seriously??
Australian defence procurement is a disaster and has been for years.
@@richardm7004 Yes, I completely see your point, and no doubt that the Australian procurement system may be quite flawed, but I do believe ours in the UK, has reached an all new low with corruption between the politicians and industry and Red Tape being endemic. Cheers.
Hanwha AS-21 Redback for the win along with the build of the AS-9 Huntsman, diversifies our supply lines and build and maintenance capabilities in country, if we went with Rheinmetall we would be beholden to them across the vast majority of our vehicle fleet, already having the Boxer and HX trucks.
From all reports so far they are pretty evenly matched, some pro's and con's as you would expect of course, not long now !
Well Matt, please tell us your feelings regarding the winner of this competition, seeing it all came down to crew ergonomics.
I like the swedish CV90 Mk.4
Lynx or Redback? Nah a Kangoroo with a few armored plates and armed with 30 mm autocanon and spike or tow missiles will do.
nope, we have harnessed and armoured up the emu, they already could take many rounds before falling, but now, well......
@@phinix250 Altough Emu's have a good reputation due to the Emu war, they lack the advanced movement of the kangoroo. The Kangoroo can jump quiet high and with that the Kangoroo can pass obstacles which the Emu can't.
Buy 10 Lynx and you get one Leo II for free ;-)🇩🇪
Go 👊RedBack👍
liked and subbed and G'day from Queensland Australia
I hope the Ajax vehicles for British Army will get the problems worked out.
I believe they should of stood with the standard 40mm cannon turret. The noise issue with the vibration problem needs to be quickly fixed.
Maybe the British Army should of went with one of these two vehicles to build and deployed instead of Ajax
129 units AS-21 to be ordered for the Australian Army
The Redbacks 30mm cannon can apparently be very easily and quickly be replaced by a 40mm super 40 cannon according to another RUclips video site.
I don't think Australia is a big fan of the 30mm Mauser gun. Ammunition is a bitch to handle.
If it’s Australian go for the Australian vehicle supporting local manufacturing and jobs etc wish Britain did this. 👍🏻
'stralia is a unique battlefield: keep them out or keep them in / let them drown or let them fry..
This is a very close contest. The KF41 is better in some aspects, the AS21 is better in others and the differences are not great in any of those differences. I like the Lynx but would be happy with either vehicle.
I like the Redback, largely cause the support network is physically closer. Hanwha as a chaebol seems like they're all about explosions (imagine Torgue from Borderlands 2).
Redback won.
2 great rigs !! 💥
Of the two, the Lynx is the more capable of the two with the programable fuze munitions, but the Redback is the better long-term solution both for the region as a whole and Australia in particular. The ability for the South Koreans to support the program will be far superior to the Germans.
You really tink ze souf Koreas far superior to uz? YOU UNDERESTIMATE OUR POWAH! 😝
@@stephenmyers7076 yeah we are
@@user-qn7dy4sp4k until you can unify your country without outside help you really shouldn’t brag. 😂
@@stephenmyers7076 ? We don't want unification at all what u sayin idiot?
@@stephenmyers7076 that's not fair. Germany got help from Reagan and Gorbachev in reuniting.
Hell yea another matsimus video
Puckapunyal is pronounced 'puck-ah-pun-yool'. Great video!
I totally respect your opinion.
here's me thumbs up for the korean team :D
Really waiting for this !!