Been here since 2019, coming from 8 years in MD, but grew up in King County WA. Honestly the only real issue we've had is the friend thing. It's been hard with very young kids. But, still chipping away and making in roads. I don't think my wife or I will ever leave the area. Maybe retire a bit further out of town someday, we'll give you a call then.
I’m right there with ya. My dream is retiring just outside of Sandpoint of 5 acres backed up to public land. I’ll look forward to hearing from you when that day comes. Thanks for watching and commenting.
I thoroughly enjoy your informative videos. We have been visiting Northern Idaho four times a year since 2018/2019. I agree about the lack of transparency in local government. When the housing market finishes its free fall we will be looking at property again. Take care.
#8 Yep, a lot of retired cops moving here. We're done with people and aren't looking to be social.🤣😂 I'm OK being alone with my wife and my home gym. The good thing is lots of firemen are retiring here too. They love people. I have loved all of North Idaho and the beautiful place I live.
I lived in a tourist town for 15 years. Tourists trashing the place happened there too. They'd come up to play in the snow. They'd buy these cheap plastic sleds, tear down fences on private property go sledding, and then when the sled broke just leave it there for the owner to deal with. A friend said he knew one of the property owners that dealt with it, and after a single weekend, filled 4 dumpers full of trash they left behind. My wife and I are introverts and always had issues making friends. Most of our friends are from childhood or work. Since I'm now remote, I'm not even near my coworkers anymore. Not sure how to even make friends to be honest.
Hi Trent! Been watching your videos for a few years now. I live out in the sticks of Spirit Lake and I moved here almost 5 years ago. Each and every point you make is something that I have experienced as well. I moved here from a few miles north of the boarder in Arizona in 2019 and I experienced the same there. It is where I have chosen to live further out away from the larger cities. Prior to Arizona, my home state of Minnesota is known for something called "Minnesota Nice" (what a joke) ... Minnesota Nice is exactly as you explained in meeting someone new and you wanna hang out more cause it seems they're cool people, they say, "Ya! Lets do that"! ... then never give their contact information to you! It seems about the same in so many places! Glad I got here before the huge boom... I'm sitting pretty here on my 6 acres!
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experience on this Beautiful place Idaho.I would like to know more info on your city council and peno codes dos and dont on land and home Building. Do you have a video out on that yet?
Can you tell me good mtn bike and dirt bike spots? We are used to going to beacon, and hoping for something closer. Make an outdoor video! lol. Thank you for these videos!! ❤
I moved to Post Falls, ID over Memorial Day weekend in 2013 after having lived in downtown Seattle for almost 20 years. I loved living in Seattle and did not want to leave, but I was priced out of the rental housing market AND my mother, who lived in a federally sponsored independent senior living complex in CDA, was diagnosed w/stage 4 inoperable kidney cancer. As the eldest child in my family, I had always known and accepted that when/if the time came to care for my aging parents arrived, I would be the one to undertake that responsibility. It's a duty I fulfilled with a sense of honor, gratitude, and love, even tho it necessitated my leaving my much loved home of over 40 years. Idaho will never be my home, in the sense of what I think of as home, mostly for the reasons you have outlined in this video. I don't mind the weather issues so much, tho winters do become tedious. And, as a construction professional my entire adult life, I don't really mind the seemingly never-ending construction issues, either. A huge portion of the entire US economy is dependent on a stable construction industry, not only for the jobs provided but also for the housing and very necessary infrastructure. All one has to do (if one is old enough) is remember back to the early 80's and the huge recession that occurred when the banking industry was de-regulated and the prime rate climbed to 21% and basically all construction and related industries screeched to a halt, and then again to 2008 when the housing industry imploded, bringing not only the US economy to it's knees, but also the economies of many other nations globally. So yeah, I don't mind the construction problems...to me, they are a sign of economic health and growth, job security, even tho I work from home and have been 100% dependent of contracts I accept from Washington State firms, the network I spent over 1/2 my life building. I have never earned a single cent from any Idaho business, but I pay Idaho income taxes as well as Washington State business taxes. Why do I stay here? My mother retired here from SoCal because her younger brother, my uncle, owned a 10 acre property in Spirit Lake and offered her a share in his investment as well as a place to live. She invested the entirety of her life's savings in his property (which, granted, wasn't an awful lot). He then named her his primary heir in his will and, when I moved here to care for my dying mother, he named me as co-heir. When my mom passed in the fall of 2015, he then named me his sole heir. He is not a wealthy man, by any measure by today's standards, so I don't stay because of the money I may inherit. I stay because he never married, has no children, no other family other than me to be of help to him should he need it. He's 87 years old and while still fairly hale, he's already battled and survived 2 bouts of cancer. His mother, my grandmother, lived to 94, and she actually died fairly young as the youngest of the 11 children in her family. So he has some miles on him yet, I am thinking. I won't leave him alone here with no one to care for him should things go south for him, and it has nothing to do with money. It is a sacred duty, as eldest child, to care for my mother's brother. And now, once again, I am being priced out of the local rental market. My rent has almost doubled in the 10 years I've lived in this apartment (which I love). I can't afford it on my own and so must have a roommate to help defray my housing expenses. And despite the rise in my rent over the years, when I look at the rental market with thoughts of moving, there is nothing I can afford. My lease is up for renewal this month and I dread seeing what I am offered, because the costs to move would bankrupt me. I am 70 years old, facing my own health issues, working part-time, and due to many of the points brought up in this video, feeling very isolated. Idaho will never be my home. If I survive my uncle and live to inherit, I'm outta here. I don't know yet where I'll go but I do know I won't weep bitter tears watching Idaho retreat in my rear view mirror like I did when I left Seattle.
@@KathyAlone2023 You obviously didn't read my post, else you would realize I can't abandon my uncle to living alone and isolated in his increasingly fragile old age, especially when I owe him a debt of gratitude for being generous to my mother and myself during her final years. Idaho may not want or need me, I really don't care, but my uncle does and Idaho is HIS home. I would never ask or try to force him into leaving his home...family is primary, especially as I have so few family members left. People I've met and befriended in the 10 years I've lived here have been very warm and welcoming to me. Regardless of your comment, I'm not going anywhere any time soon.
I remember people talking over 30 years ago the road and highway projects needed to start years ago for what is going on today but they are still putting off a lot of projects that need to get done.
I've been binge watching through your videos again and it's making me think about Idaho a lot more seriously. One of the things stopping my family from moving is children with some pretty substantial health problems making it hard to move away from Seattle Children's Hospital. Are there good hospitals in the North Idaho area? If not, what about Boise area?
That’s a very important concern. The good news is we have a really great hospital right here in Coeur d’Alene at Kootenai Health. There are also a lot of specialists in the area and an even great healthcare system right next door in Spokane. But knowing your situation I can’t promise it will be exactly what you need but if you can’t find it on Google shoot us an email and we’ll try and help you figure it out. (Explore@livinglifenorthidaho.com)
Thank you for your videos. I'm enjoying learning about the area. I live in Spokane but want to buy land across the Spokane River in Idaho. I will get in touch with you when I'm ready to make the big jump.
It is when you can't spell either word correctly. Just illustrates how ignorant those who believe in conspiracy theories (note the spelling) sometimes can be. Not exactly saying you are among the ignorant, just saying your lack of basic spelling skills seems to fit the profile.
My family is deciding on living in Montana or CDA. We’re stuck between Kalispell/White Fish area or Missoula & Bozeman. We have family in Missoula and that’s about it. We feel really called to pacific north west and republican from CA/Texas. Would love seeing your opinions, we’ve been watching your channel for a long time!
Hi! What elk farm is that? I’d love to drive by and see them. I used to spend my days off driving to see the eagles, but they aren’t here anymore in the quantity that they were a few months ago. Thanks!
Shoot me a text and I’ll send you the crossroads. I wouldn’t want to upset the owner by putting it out there on the interwebs. Thanks for watching and commenting!
Been her since 1997 and bisited here before in the past. Your historical explanation is same as mine. I have seem the so called progress and grown to haye it here. Always has been very discriminatory. But now it is radical and very expensive. Seniors are mostly primitive in their actions and social behavior. Wish I could move away but everwhere is expensive now. As a senior, lack of transportation is big issue if you no longer drive. And even after this many years, people tend to stay in small confined areas. Still an outsider.
I lived in Boise 25 years and I love Boise, a clean city and people were very friendly. Idaho is a beautiful state. I would not mind moving back to Boise.
Yes the area has grown, Kootenai county alone has grown by over 35,000 folks from 2015 to 2022 and Bonner county by 10,000 basically adding a small city to the area. Yes this has driven up prices when folks from out of state are willing to pay 20 to 40 thousand cash over asking price pushing out the locals who cannot compete. As far as second hand news I say stop watching the local news and find other sources like the internet. Your right, there is nothing I can do about the world stage so why should I worry and fret about something I have no control over. I do believe in voting, writing your local, state and congress critters but what more do you want? I do believe in being prepared for bad times so if something does happen I am ahead of the game. I do agree most folks want to be left alone that is why they move here, its to get away from the houses on top of houses, the traffic and all the government regulations currently in blue states and really its just to be left alone. Idaho is only boring if you make it boring no different than other location. I do admit there is a lot more to do if you like the outdoors, but if your only into plays, opera and night clubs then it will be boring for you and you should stay in the big city. The weather is not an issue, if you do not like it wait 15 min it will change. Its called CLIMATE CHANGE as in constantly changing. As far as having tons of friends that sounds like a personal issue as I have never had or needed a lot of friends even as a kid, but then I grew up here. I spend my time with my family, my wife of 40 years, my kids and now my grandson what more do you want or need, someone to show off your stuff to or go drinking with. Sorry I do not drink and I live modestly.
If you are from a big city traffic is nothing besides Idaho’s worst drivers. They are so backwards up here more than 2 lanes or anything over 35 causes problems
Cost of real estate is insane in Toronto Ontario Canada, worse than in your state. I grew up in Toronto, and now want to get out. In the late 70s my dad bought the house i grew up in, supporting 3 kids and mother, cost of the house was 68 grand. Sold in the early 90s for 220 grand... now easily over 2 million. Even way up north, although not as expensive as the city but cottages are going fot 500 k. I enjoy your videos a lot. Your state looks like paradise compared to here.
My family has been here for over 100 years. I am sick of extremists (think alt right) moving here. Racism is very much still here, and since 2020, there seems to be a trend of extreme people flocking here. Yikes….
I'm sick and tired of Kansas.. They elect Democrat governors despite being a "red state".. Taxes are insane and there are a lot of woke universities all over... Reason why I don't move to Idaho is because of the wife -. -
Moving from Kansas to Idaho would be a major change.....We have mountains and the roads that have curves. We also are not in Tornado Alley. When I moved out of California I gave my wife a choice of where we moved to. The choices were Nevada, Utah, South Carolina and Idaho. We were both born and raised in Idaho so the choice was pretty much a given.
I live in 2ashington a blue state but its only because there are so many people on the west side but here in the eastern wash it's farms and we're all conservative. We don't have rain all the time and have 4 distinct seasons. Everything grows here. The mountains are close for hunting, we have good fishing people are friendly. It gets hot in summer and not real cold in winter and if it does it dosnt last. We usually have snow arround Christmas but in a week or two it's gone. I've lived here for about 60 years and I wouldn't think of moveing.
@@Sandra-hk8ks I moved from California to Washington in late 1995. I left California due to taxes, gun control, and liberal social policies. Fast forward to today, Washington has a democrat legislative that is doing everything California does plus a few extra things. The Covid fiasco and recent assault on 2nd Amendment rights were the last straw. I will be moving out of Washington as soon as practical.
@@Sandra-hk8ks Eastern Wa is OK I live right across the Snake River from it. The only problem with Washington or Oregon is the Western parts of both states.
Been here since 2019, coming from 8 years in MD, but grew up in King County WA. Honestly the only real issue we've had is the friend thing. It's been hard with very young kids. But, still chipping away and making in roads. I don't think my wife or I will ever leave the area. Maybe retire a bit further out of town someday, we'll give you a call then.
I’m right there with ya. My dream is retiring just outside of Sandpoint of 5 acres backed up to public land. I’ll look forward to hearing from you when that day comes. Thanks for watching and commenting.
I thoroughly enjoy your informative videos. We have been visiting Northern Idaho four times a year since 2018/2019. I agree about the lack of transparency in local government. When the housing market finishes its free fall we will be looking at property again. Take care.
Thanks for watching and commenting. We’re looking forward to hearing from ya.
Enjoyed this video. I appreciate that you shared your challenges. It gives a clearer look into North Idaho life.
#8 Yep, a lot of retired cops moving here. We're done with people and aren't looking to be social.🤣😂 I'm OK being alone with my wife and my home gym. The good thing is lots of firemen are retiring here too. They love people. I have loved all of North Idaho and the beautiful place I live.
Haha I saw that parking patrol at the beginning of the video. He’s nonstop with giving parking tickets downtown.
Trent do you reload (pew pew food)? If not that would be a great indoor activity. Your son could help too.
I don’t but would love to get in to it. My issue is space. I’m already looking at a storage unit to get some of my space back in my garage.
I lived in a tourist town for 15 years. Tourists trashing the place happened there too. They'd come up to play in the snow. They'd buy these cheap plastic sleds, tear down fences on private property go sledding, and then when the sled broke just leave it there for the owner to deal with. A friend said he knew one of the property owners that dealt with it, and after a single weekend, filled 4 dumpers full of trash they left behind.
My wife and I are introverts and always had issues making friends. Most of our friends are from childhood or work. Since I'm now remote, I'm not even near my coworkers anymore. Not sure how to even make friends to be honest.
Hi Trent! Been watching your videos for a few years now. I live out in the sticks of Spirit Lake and I moved here almost 5 years ago. Each and every point you make is something that I have experienced as well. I moved here from a few miles north of the boarder in Arizona in 2019 and I experienced the same there. It is where I have chosen to live further out away from the larger cities. Prior to Arizona, my home state of Minnesota is known for something called "Minnesota Nice" (what a joke) ... Minnesota Nice is exactly as you explained in meeting someone new and you wanna hang out more cause it seems they're cool people, they say, "Ya! Lets do that"! ... then never give their contact information to you! It seems about the same in so many places! Glad I got here before the huge boom... I'm sitting pretty here on my 6 acres!
I had a feeling others would relate with this list. And yeah, 6 acres in Spirit Lake is crushing it! Thanks for watching and commenting.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experience on this Beautiful place Idaho.I would like to know more info on your city council and peno codes dos and dont on land and home Building. Do you have a video out on that yet?
Oh, you know I do😁 ruclips.net/video/GVY8JWa6EBc/видео.htmlsi=1QH2J4lGz58yha9_
Can you tell me good mtn bike and dirt bike spots? We are used to going to beacon, and hoping for something closer.
Make an outdoor video! lol.
Thank you for these videos!! ❤
I moved to Post Falls, ID over Memorial Day weekend in 2013 after having lived in downtown Seattle for almost 20 years. I loved living in Seattle and did not want to leave, but I was priced out of the rental housing market AND my mother, who lived in a federally sponsored independent senior living complex in CDA, was diagnosed w/stage 4 inoperable kidney cancer. As the eldest child in my family, I had always known and accepted that when/if the time came to care for my aging parents arrived, I would be the one to undertake that responsibility. It's a duty I fulfilled with a sense of honor, gratitude, and love, even tho it necessitated my leaving my much loved home of over 40 years.
Idaho will never be my home, in the sense of what I think of as home, mostly for the reasons you have outlined in this video. I don't mind the weather issues so much, tho winters do become tedious. And, as a construction professional my entire adult life, I don't really mind the seemingly never-ending construction issues, either. A huge portion of the entire US economy is dependent on a stable construction industry, not only for the jobs provided but also for the housing and very necessary infrastructure. All one has to do (if one is old enough) is remember back to the early 80's and the huge recession that occurred when the banking industry was de-regulated and the prime rate climbed to 21% and basically all construction and related industries screeched to a halt, and then again to 2008 when the housing industry imploded, bringing not only the US economy to it's knees, but also the economies of many other nations globally. So yeah, I don't mind the construction problems...to me, they are a sign of economic health and growth, job security, even tho I work from home and have been 100% dependent of contracts I accept from Washington State firms, the network I spent over 1/2 my life building. I have never earned a single cent from any Idaho business, but I pay Idaho income taxes as well as Washington State business taxes.
Why do I stay here? My mother retired here from SoCal because her younger brother, my uncle, owned a 10 acre property in Spirit Lake and offered her a share in his investment as well as a place to live. She invested the entirety of her life's savings in his property (which, granted, wasn't an awful lot). He then named her his primary heir in his will and, when I moved here to care for my dying mother, he named me as co-heir. When my mom passed in the fall of 2015, he then named me his sole heir. He is not a wealthy man, by any measure by today's standards, so I don't stay because of the money I may inherit. I stay because he never married, has no children, no other family other than me to be of help to him should he need it. He's 87 years old and while still fairly hale, he's already battled and survived 2 bouts of cancer. His mother, my grandmother, lived to 94, and she actually died fairly young as the youngest of the 11 children in her family. So he has some miles on him yet, I am thinking. I won't leave him alone here with no one to care for him should things go south for him, and it has nothing to do with money. It is a sacred duty, as eldest child, to care for my mother's brother.
And now, once again, I am being priced out of the local rental market. My rent has almost doubled in the 10 years I've lived in this apartment (which I love). I can't afford it on my own and so must have a roommate to help defray my housing expenses. And despite the rise in my rent over the years, when I look at the rental market with thoughts of moving, there is nothing I can afford. My lease is up for renewal this month and I dread seeing what I am offered, because the costs to move would bankrupt me. I am 70 years old, facing my own health issues, working part-time, and due to many of the points brought up in this video, feeling very isolated.
Idaho will never be my home. If I survive my uncle and live to inherit, I'm outta here. I don't know yet where I'll go but I do know I won't weep bitter tears watching Idaho retreat in my rear view mirror like I did when I left Seattle.
Go now.
@@KathyAlone2023 You obviously didn't read my post, else you would realize I can't abandon my uncle to living alone and isolated in his increasingly fragile old age, especially when I owe him a debt of gratitude for being generous to my mother and myself during her final years. Idaho may not want or need me, I really don't care, but my uncle does and Idaho is HIS home. I would never ask or try to force him into leaving his home...family is primary, especially as I have so few family members left. People I've met and befriended in the 10 years I've lived here have been very warm and welcoming to me. Regardless of your comment, I'm not going anywhere any time soon.
I remember people talking over 30 years ago the road and highway projects needed to start years ago for what is going on today but they are still putting off a lot of projects that need to get done.
I've been binge watching through your videos again and it's making me think about Idaho a lot more seriously. One of the things stopping my family from moving is children with some pretty substantial health problems making it hard to move away from Seattle Children's Hospital. Are there good hospitals in the North Idaho area? If not, what about Boise area?
That’s a very important concern. The good news is we have a really great hospital right here in Coeur d’Alene at Kootenai Health. There are also a lot of specialists in the area and an even great healthcare system right next door in Spokane. But knowing your situation I can’t promise it will be exactly what you need but if you can’t find it on Google shoot us an email and we’ll try and help you figure it out. (Explore@livinglifenorthidaho.com)
Thank you for your videos. I'm enjoying learning about the area. I live in Spokane but want to buy land across the Spokane River in Idaho. I will get in touch with you when I'm ready to make the big jump.
You’re very welcome. And please do! Thanks for watching and commenting.
Great video, thanks. One question . . . where are those cool Elk that you feed??
I can’t share that on the Internet but reach out and I can give you the crossroads.
You say "conspiricy therioust" like its a bad thing
It is when you can't spell either word correctly. Just illustrates how ignorant those who believe in conspiracy theories (note the spelling) sometimes can be. Not exactly saying you are among the ignorant, just saying your lack of basic spelling skills seems to fit the profile.
Thanks 👍🏼
My family is deciding on living in Montana or CDA. We’re stuck between Kalispell/White Fish area or Missoula & Bozeman. We have family in Missoula and that’s about it. We feel really called to pacific north west and republican from CA/Texas. Would love seeing your opinions, we’ve been watching your channel for a long time!
I would move to Bozeman in a hot minute, but it’s very expensive. I really like Bozeman
Hi! What elk farm is that? I’d love to drive by and see them. I used to spend my days off driving to see the eagles, but they aren’t here anymore in the quantity that they were a few months ago. Thanks!
Shoot me a text and I’ll send you the crossroads. I wouldn’t want to upset the owner by putting it out there on the interwebs. Thanks for watching and commenting!
Ok! Just texted you!
Been her since 1997 and bisited here before in the past. Your historical explanation is same as mine. I have seem the so called progress and grown to haye it here. Always has been very discriminatory. But now it is radical and very expensive. Seniors are mostly primitive in their actions and social behavior. Wish I could move away but everwhere is expensive now. As a senior, lack of transportation is big issue if you no longer drive. And even after this many years, people tend to stay in small confined areas. Still an outsider.
What's with the boredom? Do you not have a decent library? Music collection? Workshop?
I lived in Boise 25 years and I love Boise, a clean city and people were very friendly. Idaho is a beautiful state. I would not mind moving back to Boise.
Cool Elk! Lots of meat for the freezer!
When will Idaho be getting indoor plumbing?
Probably not soon enough for you, professor.
Starting to sound like Colorado up there.
Yes the area has grown, Kootenai county alone has grown by over 35,000 folks from 2015 to 2022 and Bonner county by 10,000 basically adding a small city to the area. Yes this has driven up prices when folks from out of state are willing to pay 20 to 40 thousand cash over asking price pushing out the locals who cannot compete.
As far as second hand news I say stop watching the local news and find other sources like the internet. Your right, there is nothing I can do about the world stage so why should I worry and fret about something I have no control over. I do believe in voting, writing your local, state and congress critters but what more do you want? I do believe in being prepared for bad times so if something does happen I am ahead of the game.
I do agree most folks want to be left alone that is why they move here, its to get away from the houses on top of houses, the traffic and all the government regulations currently in blue states and really its just to be left alone.
Idaho is only boring if you make it boring no different than other location. I do admit there is a lot more to do if you like the outdoors, but if your only into plays, opera and night clubs then it will be boring for you and you should stay in the big city.
The weather is not an issue, if you do not like it wait 15 min it will change. Its called CLIMATE CHANGE as in constantly changing.
As far as having tons of friends that sounds like a personal issue as I have never had or needed a lot of friends even as a kid, but then I grew up here. I spend my time with my family, my wife of 40 years, my kids and now my grandson what more do you want or need, someone to show off your stuff to or go drinking with. Sorry I do not drink and I live modestly.
If you are from a big city traffic is nothing besides Idaho’s worst drivers. They are so backwards up here more than 2 lanes or anything over 35 causes problems
Cost of real estate is insane in Toronto Ontario Canada, worse than in your state. I grew up in Toronto, and now want to get out.
In the late 70s my dad bought the house i grew up in, supporting 3 kids and mother, cost of the house was 68 grand. Sold in the early 90s for 220 grand... now easily over 2 million. Even way up north, although not as expensive as the city but cottages are going fot 500 k.
I enjoy your videos a lot. Your state looks like paradise compared to here.
You don’t go to North Idaho for events even though there are but events shouldn’t be on your list if you visit North Idaho.
I’m in a small town in BC Canada you be just below us.
My family has been here for over 100 years. I am sick of extremists (think alt right) moving here. Racism is very much still here, and since 2020, there seems to be a trend of extreme people flocking here. Yikes….
LOLHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHALOLLOLHAHAHAHA
I'm sick and tired of Kansas.. They elect Democrat governors despite being a "red state".. Taxes are insane and there are a lot of woke universities all over... Reason why I don't move to Idaho is because of the wife -. -
Moving from Kansas to Idaho would be a major change.....We have mountains and the roads that have curves. We also are not in Tornado Alley. When I moved out of California I gave my wife a choice of where we moved to. The choices were Nevada, Utah, South Carolina and Idaho. We were both born and raised in Idaho so the choice was pretty much a given.
I live in 2ashington a blue state but its only because there are so many people on the west side but here in the eastern wash it's farms and we're all conservative. We don't have rain all the time and have 4 distinct seasons. Everything grows here. The mountains are close for hunting, we have good fishing people are friendly. It gets hot in summer and not real cold in winter and if it does it dosnt last. We usually have snow arround Christmas but in a week or two it's gone. I've lived here for about 60 years and I wouldn't think of moveing.
@@Sandra-hk8ks I moved from California to Washington in late 1995. I left California due to taxes, gun control, and liberal social policies. Fast forward to today, Washington has a democrat legislative that is doing everything California does plus a few extra things. The Covid fiasco and recent assault on 2nd Amendment rights were the last straw. I will be moving out of Washington as soon as practical.
@@DelRBowlby lucky lucky
@@Sandra-hk8ks Eastern Wa is OK I live right across the Snake River from it. The only problem with Washington or Oregon is the Western parts of both states.