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No Self, No Problem with Ram Dass and Joseph Goldstein - Insight Hour Ep. 151
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- Опубликовано: 24 янв 2023
- In this unique offering from the Love Serve Remember Foundation archives, Joseph Goldstein joins Ram Dass for a conversation around love, emptiness, soul, the notion of self, and much more.
NEW Meditation Series: Pause, Breathe, Be Here Now with Ram Dass, Sharon Salzberg, Jack Kornfield, Tara Brach, Joseph Goldstein, John Lockley, Ram Dev, Trudy Goodman, Lama Tsultrim Allione-FREE January 16 to 25. Sit in true peace, love, and tranquility. Join thousands of people around the world for this collective meditation experience: onecommmune.com/ramdass
“And let’s not forget joy. In you is joy. In you is compassion. Peace. Emptiness. And love. Those are all in you. In you. Now, manifest them in your behaviors. And your thoughts.” - Ram Dass
In this episode:
- Joseph and Ram Dass reminisce about the early days of their friendship and how their relationship has evolved over the years
- They respond to a question about whether there’s a relationship between love and Tao, exploring the concepts of self (and no self), emptiness, and soul
- Ram Dass asks Joseph about the concept of dharma and they discuss the way of nature
- The conversation veers into karma, free will, and whether or not everything is predetermined
- They touch the mysterious forces at work in the universe and the power of imagination
- Joseph and Ram Dass respond to a question about developing compassion amidst intense polarization
- Ram Dass ends with a brief guided meditation
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No Self, No Problem with Ram Dass and Joseph Goldstein - Insight Hour Ep. 151 - • No Self, No Problem wi...
Joseph Goldstein - Insight Hour - Ep. 151 - No Self, No Problem with Ram Dass - beherenownetwork.com/joseph-g...
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PRICELESS CONVERSATION WITH TWO LOVABLE AND VERY HELPFUL TEACHERS!
I like that from Jack "Their emptiness reflected my neurosis... it became painfully obvious"
Great to see and hear this full conversation. Much appreciated 🙏
I have been a student of these two remarkable humans. What a treasure. Thank you thank you and thank you.
ram dass really taught from the "being a student" roll in this one
So much love 🙏🏿
love how this unfolded.
2 remarkable teachers❤
thank you for sharing this🙏
Oh wow Joseph Goldstein with Ram Dass! ❤❤❤ someone from the "everything is impermanent and that is our liberation" school and someone from the "find your true self and that is liberation" school. Both responsible and ethical and important to the culture in north america
Ram dass so generous saying "oh upandita thought you were potential for me not so" hehe 😂❤
So glad I came across this
Listening to this again, so wonderful
What a beautiful conversation. I loved it all and especially loved Ram Dass's meditation and words at the end. Thank you for sharing.
Beautiful conversation. Very interesting to see how their views have either changed or loosened throughout their (spiritual) life. Somewhat related to that was joseph's story about different traditions holding different views on reincarnation. Shows you that it is probably wise to be very careful about any definitive claims about the ultimate nature of reality or truth. Thanks for sharing this video!
Truth comes only through revelation. Then you have the views that you can be sure of. For example, as revealed to me: Everything is absolutely pre-determined. "Indeed, even the hairs on your head are all numbered." (J.C.) Everything is predetermined, and this includes your eventual guaranteed release from karma and salvation from limitation. You need do nothing but this: Learn to call not upon the ego for anything. Elijah has returned as prophesied, and I've published the answers to all meaningful questions. (I communicate only through my sites.)
When one knows one doesn't know when one doesn't know then and only then one may.❤️
With the deepest appreciation and devotion for these discussions.
🙏❤️🙏
'Shunyataa' - to use the Sanskrit term rendered into English as emptiness - is always receptive, infinitely hospitable, and boundlessly open.
Which is to say, emptiness is always compassionate, always forgiving, and never judges.
This is why emptiness is always full, always overflowing, the Perfection of Wisdom, and the Great Mother.
I could see ram dass stirring inside when Joseph was talking about conditioned vs determined reality. Ram dass has made many clear statements pointing out where he is at. He’s certainly on the side of 100% determinism but acknowledges the different levels where there is a relative sense of freedom or lack of determinism.
I prefer the conditioned argument. When they were speaking of "free will" as being an oxymoron, I could see that point. Will implies an impetus generated by choice or by the judging mind or ego. Once free of ego, there is no will because there is no choice being made. One becomes pushed through the various situations by the flow of life or the Tao. But meanwhile, for us mere mortals, our will is conditioned from moment to moment. Yet the circumstances that we find ourselves in also have an element of karma or determination. That's easier to see by just looking at the circumstances one is born into. So, to me, it is a combination because if there were no will at all, why go through this? What is the lesson? I think the lesson has to do with the use of will to surrender the will to the Tao. But then again, I don't really know. And the day I do know, I won't be watching videos like this! ;)
@@juang4618 well like ram dass says, it certainly feels like we have “free will” but there is undoubtedly a more foundational level where you just don’t. So it just depends on if you are wanting to feel in more control than you are, hence the conditioned argument. And I didn’t say there was no will, I’m just implying it isn’t free(being 100% baseless of anything). We have a will but it is determined in the way that a director of a movie plans all of the characters roles so as to be fulfilling at the end moment and it makes sense. It’s kind of like Terence McKenna says, we are being pulled rather than pushed, we have a determined destiny as far as all human kind and even all life, so in that way all of the moments leading up to it are planned(by our soul(and god higher up) preparations. To me the best argument against free will, that which comes essentially out of nowhere, is that if we had free will, some souls might never come to god or to the awakened state, they could infinitely be stuck thinking material existence is all that exists. But I think we can all see an inevitable propensity towards god or the spiritual path, thus making it determined. It really just depends on what level you want to stand on. But I don’t think it’s true fundamentally that some of reality is conditioned and some is determined, it’s just the ignorance of the ego that makes it impossible to see everything as unavoidable. But certainly when you flow with the Tao it’s easy to see life as determined but I think it’s a matter of ignorance to think that we can escape from the Tao at all and live a half conditioned half free will life. The Tao is always and everywhere and there is no escaping it, not even when we think we are lost or not on a spiritual path at all. If you are familiar with psychs, you are familiar with seeing your life in the past just as meaningful as the awakened now, even tho you were “lost” in the path. Also I do not think choice is synonymous with the judging mind or ego like you implied, that is the flattering way(to the ego) to think about it, our minds judge because of the way the environment is that we grow up in, so when we act out of childhood conditioning/habit, why is that now a choice in the sense of free will?
@@juang4618 fundamentally, free will is the idea that our “choices” are void of any control of any force, they are essentially not a reflection of your physical and social environment in anyway, which if one is paying attention, it doesn’t make at all. Even if we were given a legitimate choice between good and evil, it’s still not free will because we are only given too possible choices. But as far as the question about what are the lessons about if we don’t have free will. It’s a good question and it’s definitely something to think about. This is how i see it, I think the question answers itself, if there is a lesson, it can be sure that the lesson is planned as any lesson is, we all have certain lessons to learn when we are ready to, I don’t know if I know of any lessons learned by people who weren’t really ready for them. So I think reality is a perfectly interconnected realm, our choices don’t need to be “free” for us to have the effect of learning, we just have to have the sense of believing that we are each truly independent entities. I can see the karmic explanation of lessons where as once I wrote “the hardship itself is the lesson” implying in a sense that we are learning because we made an initial mistake. But I think it fits perfectly too well to say it isn’t all planned out from someone outside this physical realm. Just think, would god let one of his children wander around infinitely lost for all of eternity because he has free will and doesn’t want to learn or see deeper things or to have the union with god himself? I think we’d all know deep down that we are connected to god or the spiritual realm like magnets are connected. We only go away for so long, and death is certainly a reminder of that. I mean all of this is good fun and convo, I know I may have a confrontational method but that’s my own attachments, even tho I may disagree, I still respect your opinion and prefer a sort of union between everything as a priority.
🙏😊
i see you maharaji hiding behind the flowers, come out and play :)
How do we all recognise a piece of music or a song? Can one note or lyric take us straight to it? Do we notice its structure, tempo and its mood? What does it makes us feel? Why can't we see it doesn't acrtually exist in it self?
When was the original date of this please? Thanks.
🙏🙏🙏♥️
Joseph should read Sam Harris his book on the fact that everything is determined.
He probably read it. They’re actually close friends and Joseph was Sam’s meditation teacher. They also have many conversations about meditation many of which are found in Sam’s waking up app
Everything is absolutely pre-determined. "Indeed, even the hairs on your head are all numbered." (J.C.) Everything is predetermined, and this includes your eventual guaranteed release from karma and salvation from limitation. You need do nothing but this: Learn to call not upon the ego for anything. Elijah has returned as prophesied, and I've published the answers to all meaningful questions. (I communicate only through my sites.)
How does your ego know any more than other egos. Just more flag (jc) waving. Point missed.