My advice to young music fans. Go see your favorite artists live when the opportunity arises. Especially contemporary artists who are on the come up or havent really broken into a massive audience yet. I'm a Gen-Xer and in my younger days, I got to see the likes of the Siouxsie & The Banshees, The Cramps, Pixies, Nirvana, The Smiths, Radiohead and My Bloody Valentine all live and in their prime. I dont need to go pay some ridiculous price for some nostalgia tour.
Exactly! I refuse to see bands that have been around for decades, especially when tickets are overpriced. Better to see new and upcoming bands, it's more exciting too.
@@HermeticWorldsAgree . Seen Oasis 7 times over the years. Sadly, many of them Liam wasn’t in the best shape or that bothered . Absolutely no need or desire to see them again , even of the tickets were cheap. Wouldn’t go unless they brought out new material and it was good , Was too young to see The Stone Roses and they didn’t play in my country very much when they were around , though Ian Browne has in his solo days . So that reunion was needed for the fans who didn’t get to see them in concert the first time round. One imagines that Oasis would have a lot of people born from 2000 onwards who were a mere 9 years of age when they broke up. Even those born in 1994/95 were too young to witness it - many of these people had parents who were teenagers or in their mid 20s when Oasis were at their peak lol (assume they had kids by 28/29) . I definitely know people between the ages of 18-25 during the early 2000s who loved The Smiths. They missed out the first time. I’d imagine anyone born from 2000s onwards who like Oasis and The Stones would have liked The Smiths or some of their work so I could see a big demand Morrissey has never been short of a following , especially in the early 2000s when he brought out two very very good albums . The Smiths fans and Morrissey fans are …. Weird , very intense . Lads behaved like the girls behaved with Beatlemainia
Yup - magical memories of enjoying shows of the Ramones and Frank Zappa- in the late 1970s. I was also a fan of Jethro Tull at the time, but didn't attend their show until recently. Horrible, lackluster nostalgia show - luckily I didn't pay for the tickets.
I saw Bauhaus, the Bunnymen, Simple Minds, U2, Southern Death Cult, Commodores, Funkadelic before they got famous, between 1978 and 1982. Bands are best before they go mainstream
Spot on about how 'the public' are 03:58 immune to Sky News influence, or, as he said in the same breath, because Sky News 04:08 relies on the same publics' 'stupidity'? Or is it just Steven yet again talking out of his arse with his patronising and arrogant cognitively dissonant contempt for the British people?
Egg Zackly! I done heard that Oasis is reformin' for a big@ss tour and It's all for dawg-gone money!! I sure as hell hope they don't come here to Dripping Springs, Texas, souring my memory of them in the 1990s.
Andy was important no doubt. But alas , Manchester itself weren’t short of very very good bass players . Eg Manni From Stone Roses / Primal Scream or , lol, Peter Hook of Joy Division / New Order / Monaco and whatever else that he’s doing now
Nahh..bands change musicians all the time although it would be a huge void without him. It's the lead singer that counts the most. Besides, Craig Gannon could fill in as he was a real Smith.
@@mikemorrissey5467 ha! Given Gannon sued Morrisey/Marr for unpaid royalties, that would've been a conversation I would loved to been a fly on the wall for.
Say what you want about their differences,It's pretty remarkable that Marr was aged 18 to 23 in the years of the Smiths existence. Even if these two can't stand each other they made history .
Apparently Morrissey just fired his entire management team, so it kinda sounds like Marr's statement is likely true and Morrissey's former managers have either been telling him him lies or nothing at all.
@davidowle3772 Maybe? Under different circumstances, they might be a fine group of professionals, but... this is Morrissey. They might have been good at Managing things FOR Morrissey, but between his unreleased album and this trademark situation, it sounds like Morrissey's managers weren't very good at Managing Morrissey. If you're going to get into the business of working with highly contrarian weirdos, you really need to have the skills and perseverance to wrangle them and it sounds like these folks are probably better suited to more agreeable and more self-starting clients.
this is very well put together and informative....much appreciated. i respect moz and his ideological opinions. i'm at a 50/50 split when it comes to sharing those with him. at least he is vocal about it. marr keeps to himself, which could actually be viewed as less 'admirable' by some. nonetheless, their professional lives are not much of a concern for me personally. life moves on, so from this perspective, i'll go happily along with marr.
@@timhall3575 It began with personal reasons. Years later it became political reasons - is there a way back for both of them? Very unlikely, reading through the lines of Morrissey’s statements on his website (which one has to do these days) Morrissey has had to buy back the still unreleased album “Bonfire of Teenagers” - that in its self must have cost a fortune. As much as I like Morrissey, he is a whore for money like we all are - we all have to pay the bills. A Smiths reunion would solve those problems quickly. Why should Marr care about that at all? Morrissey has made it clear that Marr is not his keeper. Marr just doesn’t want to go back there because he knows what will happen. Unfortunately, Morrissey doesn’t understand that karma is a bitch and he has no one to blame for this but himself. Marr does not need Morrissey - nor does Marr care any longer. Morrissey - I have huge respect for you, but you burnt your bridges years ago, suck it up.
@@softskullbubblebrain as much as he meant to me I can't imagine Morrissey picking up a guitar or sitting down at a piano and composing those songs but at the same time I can't imagine anyone on the planet however skilled they were ever picking up a guitar writing those songs other than Marr
@@spindriftdrinker Morrissey is a genius but I could very much imagine him trying to convince Johnny to do Cilla Black covers and it makes me laugh so much 🤣🤣
Johnny is brilliant but the lead man is Morrisey. Having said that - without Johnny, Morrisey might never have come to the public's eye. Strange and wonderful things can happen when two amazingly talented people meet and work with each other. Its so odd. Lennon McCartney, Jagger Richards etc. In years to come who will be the most revered? I think it will be Morrisey. His lyrics are off the map brilliant. No matter which collaborator - Allan Whyte etc. Youve got to love em both. Its actually ridiculous making these comparisons. Too much analysis. Johnny is a true musical innovator and Morrisey has a unique way of describing our crazy world.
Very well said, I was about to write something similar only adding that Mozz did fire his management after claiming he had not seen the paperwork that required his signature as he said didn't want a company calling the shots. Also, the reference to Johnny touring under The Smiths name stems from Johnny joining The Killers on stage in the UK and performing a couple Smiths songs and a review and Interview with their frontman, Brendan Flowers, who said that he approached Marr with the idea to reform The Smiths with members of The Killers filing the other roles and, of course, he would be the lead singer saying, " Who needs Morrissey, anyway ?" ! Such a crashing bore, Talk about Kareoke. Anyway, the single release and especially a boxset that might have brought together both versions of the debut album, plus b-sides would have been a treat for fans and I think it's important to mark the 40th Anniversary of the incredible music that they made together. Music that's still being discovered and played around the World ! Having seen both in concert recently, Morrissey, at the end of 2023 and, Marr, just the other night with James, opening, both are artists that are still fantastic in their own right, the shows were great and frankly, the music scene is more dreadful now then when they wrote Panic, so we need them on the scene ! "There is a light that never goes out". 🎸🎤
From what I've seen of Marr in interviews he is an eclectic musician with little interest in looking back. He acknowledges he will never be in a bigger band than The Smiths and is comfortable moving forward with projects which interests him. I like Morrissey but he's definitely a drama queen lol
For better or worse both creatives are defined by The Smiths. The spat is unseemly and there's too much water under the bridge for them to play nicely together. That just leaves money to do the talking.
@@borderlands6606Only Marr is defined by the Smiths. He depends on doing Smiths numbers to sell a show. Moz does so for the sake of fanfare, but he doesn't in the slightest need to.
@@Fitzrovialitter I suppose You’ve made a mistake in your life. You know what he means. You’re being pedantic. I only correct the “to”/ “too” posts myself because it irritates me, that people can’t get that right.
Re-issue! Re-package! Re-package! Re-evaluate the songs Double-pack with a photograph Extra track (and a tacky badge) ...... urgh! Morrissey should be ashamed of himself.
The Pink Floyd comparison isn't quite accurate. Unlike The Smiths, where all 4 members split, with Floyd there was still 3 members currently in the band but then Roger Waters decided to leave. He then sought to have the band dissolved as he felt it couldn't continue without him. However, as you say the law protects the "group" and the courts ruled that the two remaining members - David Gilmour and Nick Mason - could continue on as "Pink Floyd". Former keyboard player Rick Wright came back into the fold too which reinforced the group dynamic. But David Gilmour has never performed on his own under the PF banner. Hey, just a small point for clarity, your video is excellent and very well explained!
Roger Waters is cool but god I saw him years ago and the whole concert revolved around Trump. I don’t like Trump as much as the next guy but fuck if I want to pay good money to hear about him in song for 2 hours.
@@206TheGhost The vast majority of a Roger Water's "live" show, certainly from a musical slant as opposed to political, is that its vastly pre-recorded and most (not all) of Roger is him lip-synching. Some of it is live, like the Trump rants!
Morrissey. 2 Rs. They spoke long ago about reforming. Johnny had to tour with Modest Mouse first. When he got back Moz was silent. Each has wanted to reform at different times. They both just need to get over it and do it. They would sell out everywhere and make the Oasis reunion look small.
Excellent analysis. I'm a long time fan and appreciate the way you constructed this with fact and common sense. The Smiths are dead. Long live The Smiths.
Great job. Very enlightening. Morrissey like the so many talented individuals is a massive pain in the ass. I like the comparison between Mozz and Marr with Floyd. Its the same old thing an extremely talented band and lets say its difficult but insanely talented writer. I miss both bands but was fortunate to see both before the shit hit the fan(s). Enjoyed this and feel i understand the situation better. That being said i never thought for a minute id see a Floyd reunion, which was fuckin glorious and I’ve always felt the same about the Smiths. Now Andy has gone and the dream is over but ..,,,,
Interesting stuff. I always loved about half of each Smiths LP. Never wanted to see them live as I found many of the fans really annoying in my part of the world. But it would be fun to see them nowadays and seeing the original fans as 50 or 60-somethings. Go for it Johnny and Mo!!
Not just Johnny Marr's guitar work, but his entire music composition and production. Most of the tunes were pre-written for Morrissey to add lyrics to after. Marr is one of the greatest pop composers of the last 50 years. And Marr has repeatedly demonstrated himself to be the far more level-headed one in the situation. He's a unique example of an artist who has reasonably protected what is rightfully his.
Marr is as much as part of the reason for The Smith's success, with his guitar arrangements, as Morissy was with his lyrics. I really like Marr, he respects the earlier guitar legends such as Bert Jansch, where he got a lot of influences from.
The Smith should've regrouped and toured, like 25 years ago. Now, I don't think I would go, although it would be tempting, but I doubt they would take the drummer, and the bassist is dead, so....kind of late.
Asia toured as Asia and "Asia feat. John Payne". Yes also quarreled a lot about who was entitled to use the name, leading to complete chaos and different Yes members being in different bands at the same time. Foreigner only has one original member, all the rest are later additions. That would be something like Ringo Starr going on tour as The Beatles after the passing away of Paul McCartney or vice versa. To the outsider it all looks silly, but of course big money is involved. As for Marr, if he would be looking for a new Morrisey, the singer of the American band Ocean Blue sounds quite like him, as this singer also galantly reckognizes. But not sure if he would be interested in betraying his big inspiration. I never was a big fan of Morrisey, especially not on his Rubber Man stage performance. Having to listen for more than 2 songs to his plaintive voice is quite a challenge. But well, every now and then listening to one of their better songs is OK.
Obviously, there's no "Smiths" with out either of them. They already skint the drummer back in the 80's and the bassist is dead. Finding an English rhythm section of lads in their late 50's early 60's that could slide in wouldnt be hard at all. Mozz knows that. Who would Johnny play with is definately an issue. They both know what the money will be. Probably more than either have made to date. It's now down to simpler things and I'd give them 3 out 5 odds.
Johnny Marr f**king rules. He honestly cares about the legacy of one the greatest bands of the '80s and isn't interested in the kinds of cash grabs Morrissey would jump at. Time will tell but I sincerely doubt Marr will ever exploit the name in the future, and as for the releases and the box sets that sh*t is more cash-grab BS, and I'm glad Marr is once again prevailing. I love that band and I have everything I need from them. Like we need another hasbeen reunion.
Johnny Marr has integrity, much like Robert Plant. They look to the future, unlike their ex-bandmates who want to make a quick buck from 'cabaret' tours.
@@xwhite2020 No new material, playing the same old songs for a quick buck. That's cabaret in the UK. Much like Oasis, ripping off the fanbase. Comprende amigo!
It reminds me of peter hook always banging on about when new order ‘broke up’, but really he was kinda kicked out for bringing a knob. I would imagine he probably tried to fight the name rights but realised quickly he was 1 against 3.
Marr seems like a decent guy, have heard Noel Gallagher tell how he met him before he had even released a record, or had a record deal. As mentioned in the video, Marr has said they were total opposites, they were probably never really close even back in the day, in a way they were just work colleagues who worked well together and made some great music. Once the band split, there was nothing left to bind them together.
Astonishing that Morrissey agreed to the offer. After all the negative comments he's made over the years about reuniting, and the success of his brilliant solo-career.
brilliant band every member made it happen and all the drama was all part of it... we're still talking about them and i wouln't write off a come back just yet👍
Roger Wayers took legal action and????? David Gilmour won the case, and he and Nick Mason resumed touring and writing under the band name. Eventually they took Rick Wright RIP, back into the band! Watered recently complained publicly or online about th3 lack of access he had to the Pink Floyd website and archives.
Thanks for posting this - it was very illuminating. At least I can say I saw them live in Galway in November 1984- until I saw another Manchester band, 10cc, in Dublin two years ago it was, hands down, the best gig I'd ever been too, truly marvellous❤
For what it worth my opinion is .. the past is the past .. music is a moment in time that can’t be repeated it’s just not the same … as oasis will prove next year ..
They shouldn't do any sort of reunion. Let the band stay dead and retain some sort of dignity as an influential group that released pretty much nothing bad, then stopped. Not some ghoulish legacy act going on stage sans an important member in their 60s and pretending to be best friends when they hate each other.
Both fantastic in the smiths havent kept up with Marrs solo stuff but love morrissey solo - he seems to be a very difficult man though espeically in his older age - not surprised they are on bad terms - i hope they can make up eventually but tbh i wouldn't wanna see a smiths reunion at this point - morrissey is 65 and the smiths feel like a young band with young themes to the songs it would seem off imo. They both have good careers outside the smiths so.
Unfortunately they sound WAY better when Moz sings them, they sound great but he doesn’t do very many. Marr does do many and really tries, but the vocals just aren’t there.
This is very true! I saw Marr live for the very first time supporting Blondie in 2022 and This Charming Man in particular sounded exactly like The Smiths.
Would be fascinating to see Mike Joyce and Morissey back together playing in the same band. Could they? should they? All they need is a base player who is nearly as good as Andy Rourke was and yeah why. Peter Hook? but that's just me wishing. It won't happen cause Marr won't let it for many reasons and Morissey won't be bothered to push it. It will fizzle out, but what a beautiful thought for pure music fans.
If Marr is comfortably set... why the hell would he tie himself to Morissey again? He's very unpleasant & undependable. Leave a show barely into the set because he's feels chilly? "Jackets? WTF are those? F those fans sitting there, I've got their money" -Morissey probably. I can't believe people still pay to be abused by Morissey.
I wanted to see morrissey on his latest tour because I'd not seem him live since 2005 or thereabouts, but when I saw the price of the tickets, I thought better of it.
Bad on your Floyd feud. Gilmore toured with Nick Mason, Drummer for Floyd, and Rick Wright, Keyboards for Floyd, until his death. They also won a lawsuit to use the name. While Waters left Floyd, there were still the rest of the band to continue. Except for Syd, of course.
He did that in Swindon years ago , collapsed on stage , 2 mins into the first song this charming man , ended up in hospital over something or another .
interesting to hear politics was an issue. Most the governments of the western world have two sides to choose from, thus splitting the country in half. divide and conquer.
well, no. 10:20 from what i understand roger waters became controlling of the band, then said he wanted to end the band. he was the only one who wanted to end the band, everyone else wanted it to keep going in some form. it was pretty reasonable for them to keep going. its also important to note that in that band did this before with kicking Syd Barrett out of the group
It’s plainly obvious that Johnny is the intelligent one in all this . He’s merely protecting the insanely brilliant output of a short lived band in a world that’s unrecognisable from their being .
Waters lost, because waters LEFT the band, but the band continued to exist as an entiry without him. But HE thought that, even though he had left the band, HE should still have the right to say that the rest of the people in the band should no be able to carry on as the band, and that HE had the right to then break up the rest of the band, even if they wished to contunue, basically acting as if HE ALONE OWNED the band name. That was why he lost. It is not AT ALL the same situation. If Marr had left, and the others had wanted to continue as the smiths, then they could. But they didn't, instead the band disbanded, and Morrissey went on to have a "solo" carreer. It would have been difficult for the other two to continue as "the smiths" without Morrissey and Marr, so the band broke up.
Why did you say “solo” career ? He had a solo career . He really became fashionable again in the early 2000s with two pretty damn good albums, one of which scored a number one
It’s different than Floyd, because that happened in their prime in the 70s or 80s, if one member got the name Smiths, it wouldn’t matter as they are done performing fairly soon,,,
Pink Floyd is a bit different, they were registered as a company and Waters resigned from the company surrendering under contract any rights he had. Pink Floyd never split up. The smiths did.
As far as I'm concerned, Morrissey is almost completely bereft of talent. The fact that he is such a drama queen, that he takes himself sooooo seriously, is frankly laughable. And then there's that whole feud with R. Smith: also laughable. I didn't know about his position on Brexit, but honestly I'm not surprised.
Am I the only one on here thank thinks they should bury the hatchet and get the band back together. I’d love to see the Smiths live. Been a fan from around 84’ onwards. Instead of thinking we need to pick sides how about we pick team Smiths.
Morrissey and Marr were never 100% on the same wavelength in the beginning(that's what made them a force to be reckoned with)& since then Marr slowly but surely diverged whilst Morrissey wildly went off on a tangent The Morrissey of the Smith era was exactly the Morrissey that Music needed Morrissey post Smiths is exactly what that, somewhat different, music needed Marr is a collaborator; a hired gun/Morrissey plays second fiddle to none In the highly unlikely event they should ever work again (as the Smiths or otherwise) it would not be the same because they're not the same people; it's not the same time; it's not the same industry the only thing similar is the audience
I have been a fan since the beginning but never saw them here in Australia. So I say cmon Johnny and tour, take the millions it's better than your solo
You're spot on, they had a huge Irish influence! I should have mentioned that. My bad. Speaking of Irish identity and music... check out my video on the phenomenal Fontaines D.C.! ruclips.net/video/iP4oqjSMTy4/видео.html
![Megan Thee Stallion - Roc Steady (feat. Flo Milli) [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/HozPPyqW0dY/mqdefault.jpg)
My advice to young music fans. Go see your favorite artists live when the opportunity arises. Especially contemporary artists who are on the come up or havent really broken into a massive audience yet. I'm a Gen-Xer and in my younger days, I got to see the likes of the Siouxsie & The Banshees, The Cramps, Pixies, Nirvana, The Smiths, Radiohead and My Bloody Valentine all live and in their prime. I dont need to go pay some ridiculous price for some nostalgia tour.
Exactly! I refuse to see bands that have been around for decades, especially when tickets are overpriced. Better to see new and upcoming bands, it's more exciting too.
Great advice
@@HermeticWorldsAgree . Seen Oasis 7 times over the years. Sadly, many of them Liam wasn’t in the best shape or that bothered . Absolutely no need or desire to see them again , even of the tickets were cheap. Wouldn’t go unless they brought out new material and it was good ,
Was too young to see The Stone Roses and they didn’t play in my country very much when they were around , though Ian Browne has in his solo days . So that reunion was needed for the fans who didn’t get to see them in concert the first time round.
One imagines that Oasis would have a lot of people born from 2000 onwards who were a mere 9 years of age when they broke up. Even those born in 1994/95 were too young to witness it - many of these people had parents who were teenagers or in their mid 20s when Oasis were at their peak lol (assume they had kids by 28/29) .
I definitely know people between the ages of 18-25 during the early 2000s who loved The Smiths. They missed out the first time. I’d imagine anyone born from 2000s onwards who like Oasis and The Stones would have liked The Smiths or some of their work so I could see a big demand
Morrissey has never been short of a following , especially in the early 2000s when he brought out two very very good albums .
The Smiths fans and Morrissey fans are …. Weird , very intense . Lads behaved like the girls behaved with Beatlemainia
Yup - magical memories of enjoying shows of the Ramones and Frank Zappa- in the late 1970s. I was also a fan of Jethro Tull at the time, but didn't attend their show until recently. Horrible, lackluster nostalgia show - luckily I didn't pay for the tickets.
I saw Bauhaus, the Bunnymen, Simple Minds, U2, Southern Death Cult, Commodores, Funkadelic before they got famous, between 1978 and 1982.
Bands are best before they go mainstream
Morrissey was spot on about Sky News. I used to work there...
About what?
@@LinnRooney Beebra!
@@LinnRooney MK Ultra and all that jazz. Prepare yourself for a huge rabbit hole 👀✌️
@@LinnRooney Farage n Reform being a bunch of racist tossers.
Spot on about how 'the public' are 03:58 immune to Sky News influence, or, as he said in the same breath, because Sky News 04:08 relies on the same publics' 'stupidity'?
Or is it just Steven yet again talking out of his arse with his patronising and arrogant cognitively dissonant contempt for the British people?
please don't reform. keep it as it was... that's cool.
Egg Zackly! I done heard that Oasis is reformin' for a big@ss tour and It's all for dawg-gone money!!
I sure as hell hope they don't come here to Dripping Springs, Texas, souring my memory of them in the 1990s.
NO ANDY ROURKE, NO SMITHS!!!!
Spot on! Andy's Basslines can never be replicated!
Andy was important no doubt. But alas , Manchester itself weren’t short of very very good bass players . Eg Manni From Stone Roses / Primal Scream or , lol, Peter Hook of Joy Division / New Order / Monaco and whatever else that he’s doing now
They could borrow Simon Gallup of The Cure.
Nahh..bands change musicians all the time although it would be a huge void without him. It's the lead singer that counts the most. Besides, Craig Gannon could fill in as he was a real Smith.
@@mikemorrissey5467 ha! Given Gannon sued Morrisey/Marr for unpaid royalties, that would've been a conversation I would loved to been a fly on the wall for.
Say what you want about their differences,It's pretty remarkable that Marr was aged 18 to 23 in the years of the Smiths existence. Even if these two can't stand each other they made history .
Apparently Morrissey just fired his entire management team, so it kinda sounds like Marr's statement is likely true and Morrissey's former managers have either been telling him him lies or nothing at all.
Sounds like Morrissey threw a perfectly good management team under the bus to cover for his usual BS way of dealing with life... IMO
@davidowle3772 Maybe? Under different circumstances, they might be a fine group of professionals, but... this is Morrissey. They might have been good at Managing things FOR Morrissey, but between his unreleased album and this trademark situation, it sounds like Morrissey's managers weren't very good at Managing Morrissey. If you're going to get into the business of working with highly contrarian weirdos, you really need to have the skills and perseverance to wrangle them and it sounds like these folks are probably better suited to more agreeable and more self-starting clients.
@@GreggNowhere If he managed himself, he would end up sacking himself.
@@martin-d4h
lol
If there's a problem and Mossissey is involved, it's his fault.
this is very well put together and informative....much appreciated. i respect moz and his ideological opinions. i'm at a 50/50 split when it comes to sharing those with him. at least he is vocal about it. marr keeps to himself, which could actually be viewed as less 'admirable' by some. nonetheless, their professional lives are not much of a concern for me personally. life moves on, so from this perspective, i'll go happily along with marr.
Marr left The Smiths because in part he was tired of Morrissey’s drama. Marr will never work with Morrissey again.
and rightly so.
@@timhall3575
It began with personal reasons. Years later it became political reasons - is there a way back for both of them? Very unlikely, reading through the lines of Morrissey’s statements on his website (which one has to do these days) Morrissey has had to buy back the still unreleased album “Bonfire of Teenagers” - that in its self must have cost a fortune. As much as I like Morrissey, he is a whore for money like we all are - we all have to pay the bills. A Smiths reunion would solve those problems quickly.
Why should Marr care about that at all? Morrissey has made it clear that Marr is not his keeper.
Marr just doesn’t want to go back there because he knows what will happen. Unfortunately, Morrissey doesn’t understand that karma is a bitch and he has no one to blame for this but himself.
Marr does not need Morrissey - nor does Marr care any longer.
Morrissey - I have huge respect for you, but you burnt your bridges years ago, suck it up.
Marr has been begging for years to Morrissey to reunite with The Smiths.
@@mr.e5300
Where are your sources for that claim? I’d like to see it for myself.
@@mr.e5300 no he hasn't - at all. That's literally the opposite of the truth. What is it with you people and your fantasies!? Are you an idiot?
Marr agreed to the 40-40-10-10 split.
That was a bit shit of him.
@@andypitchlessaye BUT could he have convinced Morrissey to have done a 30-30-20-20split..?
@BeesWaxMinder I feel that this deal would have been fair for all of them.
Why? Morrissey was generous to give Marr 40
@@softskullbubblebrain as much as he meant to me I can't imagine Morrissey picking up a guitar or sitting down at a piano and composing those songs but at the same time I can't imagine anyone on the planet however skilled they were ever picking up a guitar writing those songs other than Marr
I'm American never heard of the smiths but Johnny Marr is making some damn fine records past few years
Paint a vulgar picture
Great comment. Works on a ton of levels.
Is this the same Morrissey who wrote the lyrics to Paint A Vulgar Picture? Irony overload. 😂
"I didn't form a group to perform Cilla Black songs" made me laugh out loud. 🤣😂🤣
I'm solidly on Team Morrissey, but I do agree - I didn't become a Smiths fan to hear them do ANY kind of covers.
@@spindriftdrinker Morrissey is a genius but I could very much imagine him trying to convince Johnny to do Cilla Black covers and it makes me laugh so much 🤣🤣
I liked the one about nobody has written an "open letter" since 1953.
@@alukuhito 😄😄
Johnny is brilliant but the lead man is Morrisey. Having said that - without Johnny, Morrisey might never have come to the public's eye. Strange and wonderful things can happen when two amazingly talented people meet and work with each other. Its so odd. Lennon McCartney, Jagger Richards etc. In years to come who will be the most revered? I think it will be Morrisey. His lyrics are off the map brilliant. No matter which collaborator - Allan Whyte etc. Youve got to love em both. Its actually ridiculous making these comparisons. Too much analysis. Johnny is a true musical innovator and Morrisey has a unique way of describing our crazy world.
Very well said, I was about to write something similar only adding that Mozz did fire his management after claiming he had not seen the paperwork that required his signature as he said didn't want a company calling the shots. Also, the reference to Johnny touring under The Smiths name stems from Johnny joining The Killers on stage in the UK and performing a couple Smiths songs and a review and Interview with their frontman, Brendan Flowers, who said that he approached Marr with the idea to reform The Smiths with members of The Killers filing the other roles and, of course, he would be the lead singer saying, " Who needs Morrissey, anyway ?" ! Such a crashing bore, Talk about Kareoke. Anyway, the single release and especially a boxset that might have brought together both versions of the debut album, plus b-sides would have been a treat for fans and I think it's important to mark the 40th Anniversary of the incredible music that they made together. Music that's still being discovered and played around the World ! Having seen both in concert recently, Morrissey, at the end of 2023 and, Marr, just the other night with James, opening, both are artists that are still fantastic in their own right, the shows were great and frankly, the music scene is more dreadful now then when they wrote Panic, so we need them on the scene ! "There is a light that never goes out". 🎸🎤
What difference does it make....wait for it
From what I've seen of Marr in interviews he is an eclectic musician with little interest in looking back. He acknowledges he will never be in a bigger band than The Smiths and is comfortable moving forward with projects which interests him. I like Morrissey but he's definitely a drama queen lol
For better or worse both creatives are defined by The Smiths. The spat is unseemly and there's too much water under the bridge for them to play nicely together. That just leaves money to do the talking.
@@borderlands6606Only Marr is defined by the Smiths. He depends on doing Smiths numbers to sell a show. Moz does so for the sake of fanfare, but he doesn't in the slightest need to.
"Is Morrissey being overdramatic?" is redundant.
Exactly!
I’d rather marr be head of the smiths’ trademark, he wouldn’t release unnecessary / tacky best of’s.
Can you re-write in English?
@@FitzrovialitterWhat are you struggling with ? It’s clear to me..
@@spaceengineer1452 For a start, shouldn't that be "best ofs"
@@Fitzrovialitter I suppose You’ve made a mistake in your life. You know what he means. You’re being pedantic. I only correct the “to”/ “too” posts myself because it irritates me, that people can’t get that right.
Re-issue! Re-package! Re-package!
Re-evaluate the songs
Double-pack with a photograph
Extra track (and a tacky badge) ...... urgh!
Morrissey should be ashamed of himself.
The Pink Floyd comparison isn't quite accurate. Unlike The Smiths, where all 4 members split, with Floyd there was still 3 members currently in the band but then Roger Waters decided to leave. He then sought to have the band dissolved as he felt it couldn't continue without him. However, as you say the law protects the "group" and the courts ruled that the two remaining members - David Gilmour and Nick Mason - could continue on as "Pink Floyd". Former keyboard player Rick Wright came back into the fold too which reinforced the group dynamic. But David Gilmour has never performed on his own under the PF banner. Hey, just a small point for clarity, your video is excellent and very well explained!
Roger Waters is cool but god I saw him years ago and the whole concert revolved around Trump. I don’t like Trump as much as the next guy but fuck if I want to pay good money to hear about him in song for 2 hours.
@@206TheGhost The vast majority of a Roger Water's "live" show, certainly from a musical slant as opposed to political, is that its vastly pre-recorded and most (not all) of Roger is him lip-synching. Some of it is live, like the Trump rants!
You seemed to explain it in the title, then took nearly eleven minutes of my precious life essence to reiterate that?!!!
Thanks for the watch time 💪
😆😂
Great speaking voice you have.
Morrissey. 2 Rs. They spoke long ago about reforming. Johnny had to tour with Modest Mouse first. When he got back Moz was silent. Each has wanted to reform at different times. They both just need to get over it and do it. They would sell out everywhere and make the Oasis reunion look small.
I’m new to your channel. That was excellent. 👍
Thanks!
If Morrissey told me it was raining I'd still look out of the window to check.
If traitor Marr told me I should run east to escape the Bolsheviks, I'd run west.
Thank you 🖤
We would all love it ,a lot of money obviously has been offered
Excellent analysis. I'm a long time fan and appreciate the way you constructed this with fact and common sense. The Smiths are dead. Long live The Smiths.
Great job. Very enlightening. Morrissey like the so many talented individuals is a massive pain in the ass. I like the comparison between Mozz and Marr with Floyd.
Its the same old thing an extremely talented band and lets say its difficult but insanely talented writer.
I miss both bands but was fortunate to see both before the shit hit the fan(s).
Enjoyed this and feel i understand the situation better. That being said i never thought for a minute id see a Floyd reunion, which was fuckin glorious and I’ve always felt the same about the Smiths. Now Andy has gone and the dream is over but ..,,,,
Interesting stuff. I always loved about half of each Smiths LP. Never wanted to see them live as I found many of the fans really annoying in my part of the world. But it would be fun to see them nowadays and seeing the original fans as 50 or 60-somethings. Go for it Johnny and Mo!!
Not just Johnny Marr's guitar work, but his entire music composition and production. Most of the tunes were pre-written for Morrissey to add lyrics to after. Marr is one of the greatest pop composers of the last 50 years.
And Marr has repeatedly demonstrated himself to be the far more level-headed one in the situation. He's a unique example of an artist who has reasonably protected what is rightfully his.
Marr is as much as part of the reason for The Smith's success, with his guitar arrangements, as Morissy was with his lyrics.
I really like Marr, he respects the earlier guitar legends such as Bert Jansch, where he got a lot of influences from.
Morrissey is a lying drama queen Marr is the exact opposite. That's all you need to know.
Sad but true ...
Morrissey is a damaged musical genius.
Marr is just a musical genius.
100%, Moz is the Narcissist who destroy The Smiths.
Viva Moz.
What did he lie about?
@@p0llenp0ny He is a Fascist Narcissist to lie is normal for them.
team marr
Well, as a self-proclaimed knownothing, I can think of several great tracks from Morrissey; can't think of even one from Marr.
@@arthurballs7083 Totally agree; and helping out a bunch of overated scallies like Oasis ( dullards) smacks of desperation,IMHO....
The Smith should've regrouped and toured, like 25 years ago. Now, I don't think I would go, although it would be tempting, but I doubt they would take the drummer, and the bassist is dead, so....kind of late.
Marr is as genuine as his hair colour 🤣
Wasn’t there two versions of YES working at the same time with fans labelling the version based in California as YE$$ 🤣
Bigmouth Strikes Again BUT That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore.
......It's just a thorn on they boys side
Asia toured as Asia and "Asia feat. John Payne". Yes also quarreled a lot about who was entitled to use the name, leading to complete chaos and different Yes members being in different bands at the same time. Foreigner only has one original member, all the rest are later additions. That would be something like Ringo Starr going on tour as The Beatles after the passing away of Paul McCartney or vice versa. To the outsider it all looks silly, but of course big money is involved. As for Marr, if he would be looking for a new Morrisey, the singer of the American band Ocean Blue sounds quite like him, as this singer also galantly reckognizes. But not sure if he would be interested in betraying his big inspiration. I never was a big fan of Morrisey, especially not on his Rubber Man stage performance. Having to listen for more than 2 songs to his plaintive voice is quite a challenge. But well, every now and then listening to one of their better songs is OK.
Obviously, there's no "Smiths" with out either of them.
They already skint the drummer back in the 80's and the bassist is dead.
Finding an English rhythm section of lads in their late 50's early 60's that could slide in wouldnt be hard at all.
Mozz knows that.
Who would Johnny play with is definately an issue.
They both know what the money will be. Probably more than either have made to date.
It's now down to simpler things and I'd give them 3 out 5 odds.
A Smiths reunion at this point is as empty and silly a concept as a Beatles reunion.
I didn’t think I could love Jonny Marr even more. What a class act. I worshipped The Smiths and it was a moment that just can’t be replicated.
Johnny Marr f**king rules. He honestly cares about the legacy of one the greatest bands of the '80s and isn't interested in the kinds of cash grabs Morrissey would jump at. Time will tell but I sincerely doubt Marr will ever exploit the name in the future, and as for the releases and the box sets that sh*t is more cash-grab BS, and I'm glad Marr is once again prevailing. I love that band and I have everything I need from them. Like we need another hasbeen reunion.
Johnny Marr has integrity, much like Robert Plant. They look to the future, unlike their ex-bandmates who want to make a quick buck from 'cabaret' tours.
TF has Led Zeppelin got to do with cabaret tours?
@@xwhite2020 No new material, playing the same old songs for a quick buck. That's cabaret in the UK. Much like Oasis, ripping off the fanbase. Comprende amigo!
Yea it wouldn’t be so bad if they just legit wanted to play but when most of them are charging like 500 bucks a ticket it’s clearly just price gouging
Plant's a pretentious antediluvian geezer that kept Zep's catalog off the streaming services about a decade longer than anyone else.
It reminds me of peter hook always banging on about when new order ‘broke up’, but really he was kinda kicked out for bringing a knob. I would imagine he probably tried to fight the name rights but realised quickly he was 1 against 3.
Marr might not own the rights, but he certainly owns plenty of hair dye.
I was kind of surprised they only had four studio albums. I thought they had a lot more.
Marr seems like a decent guy, have heard Noel Gallagher tell how he met him before he had even released a record, or had a record deal. As mentioned in the video, Marr has said they were total opposites, they were probably never really close even back in the day, in a way they were just work colleagues who worked well together and made some great music. Once the band split, there was nothing left to bind them together.
Astonishing that Morrissey agreed to the offer. After all the negative comments he's made over the years about reuniting, and the success of his brilliant solo-career.
What a shame. Much prefer Morrisey's post Smiths work to Marr's, but Marr does appear more grounded than Morrisey.
that isn't Marr at 2.07, it's James Eller!!!
They all looked the same anyways 😂😂😂
brilliant band every member made it happen and all the drama was all part of it... we're still talking about them and i wouln't write off a come back just yet👍
Roger Wayers took legal action and????? David Gilmour won the case, and he and Nick Mason resumed touring and writing under the band name. Eventually they took Rick Wright RIP, back into the band! Watered recently complained publicly or online about th3 lack of access he had to the Pink Floyd website and archives.
Waters! Apologies Roger Waters
A reformation and tour is inevitable. Money is involved. Maybe next year. Maybe after.
The Eagles. Oasis. Tears for Fears. Kiss. Etc. Etc. Etc.
Thanks for posting this - it was very illuminating. At least I can say I saw them live in Galway in November 1984- until I saw another Manchester band, 10cc, in Dublin two years ago it was, hands down, the best gig I'd ever been too, truly marvellous❤
Could they reform?
For what it worth my opinion is .. the past is the past .. music is a moment in time that can’t be repeated it’s just not the same … as oasis will prove next year ..
Ooh… Supported Brexit? How terrible! 😮
🙄
Don’t really give a damn about Morissey’s hissy fits. I know whose solo output stands head and shoulders above the others.
The Queen Is Dead is a great album but I think I like The The Mind Bomb even better.
Johnny's wig should go solo and make statements ideologically divergent from both Johnny and Moz to further deepen the imbroglio.
They shouldn't do any sort of reunion. Let the band stay dead and retain some sort of dignity as an influential group that released pretty much nothing bad, then stopped. Not some ghoulish legacy act going on stage sans an important member in their 60s and pretending to be best friends when they hate each other.
A lot of BS comment. Morrissey was the Smiths.
Both fantastic in the smiths havent kept up with Marrs solo stuff but love morrissey solo - he seems to be a very difficult man though espeically in his older age - not surprised they are on bad terms - i hope they can make up eventually but tbh i wouldn't wanna see a smiths reunion at this point - morrissey is 65 and the smiths feel like a young band with young themes to the songs it would seem off imo. They both have good careers outside the smiths so.
Didn't they get robbed or something from Geoff Travis ( Rough trade)
If you've ever watched Morriseys solo band, the Smiths songs sound like a wedding band without Marr and Rourke especially
Unfortunately they sound WAY better when Moz sings them, they sound great but he doesn’t do very many. Marr does do many and really tries, but the vocals just aren’t there.
I think Morrisey is a bit of a douche but he and his band do a great job with the Smiths material
@@Endlesssummer1 maybe some enjoy the shirtless show, to each their own, lol 😂
@@bh-zj4yt I heard “that joke isn’t funny anymore” in 2019, sounded exactly like off the Smiths album.
This is very true! I saw Marr live for the very first time supporting Blondie in 2022 and This Charming Man in particular sounded exactly like The Smiths.
Would be fascinating to see Mike Joyce and Morissey back together playing in the same band. Could they? should they? All they need is a base player who is nearly as good as Andy Rourke was and yeah why. Peter Hook? but that's just me wishing. It won't happen cause Marr won't let it for many reasons and Morissey won't be bothered to push it. It will fizzle out, but what a beautiful thought for pure music fans.
If Marr is comfortably set... why the hell would he tie himself to Morissey again? He's very unpleasant & undependable. Leave a show barely into the set because he's feels chilly? "Jackets? WTF are those? F those fans sitting there, I've got their money" -Morissey probably. I can't believe people still pay to be abused by Morissey.
I wanted to see morrissey on his latest tour because I'd not seem him live since 2005 or thereabouts, but when I saw the price of the tickets, I thought better of it.
Bad on your Floyd feud. Gilmore toured with Nick Mason, Drummer for Floyd, and Rick Wright, Keyboards for Floyd, until his death. They also won a lawsuit to use the name. While Waters left Floyd, there were still the rest of the band to continue. Except for Syd, of course.
Morrissey: Canceling a show at the last minute at a venue near you.
Like last year on his UK tour which was sold out?
😂 been there
He did that in Swindon years ago , collapsed on stage , 2 mins into the first song this charming man , ended up in hospital over something or another .
I think Morrissey was in love with Jonny hence, "I won't share you"
I had thought about this myself.
'If you and him we're lovers' hmmm
Just call your band " The Smiffs " and be done with it 🙂
Reminds of who owned the Bucks Fuzz name
interesting to hear politics was an issue. Most the governments of the western world have two sides to choose from, thus splitting the country in half. divide and conquer.
well, no.
10:20
from what i understand
roger waters became controlling of the band, then said he wanted to end the band.
he was the only one who wanted to end the band, everyone else wanted it to keep going in some form. it was pretty reasonable for them to keep going.
its also important to note that in that band did this before with kicking Syd Barrett out of the group
It’s plainly obvious that Johnny is the intelligent one in all this . He’s merely protecting the insanely brilliant output of a short lived band in a world that’s unrecognisable from their being .
Then why is he on board with stabbing his country in the back?
If it wasn’t for Morrissey, no one would know who Johnny marr is. conversely, Morrissey’s career got bigger after he left the Smiths
Johnnys got bigger ..and bigger and well u get it
Other way around.
Seen Marr live earlier this year. He played a good few Smiths songs and to be honest it was fantastic. Didn’t miss Mozza.
@@Endlesssummer1 Seems you didn't understand the comment.
Way to rewrite history.
Morrissey claims over the 2024 records, tour offer ,Smiths brand and record releases... were all correct
M & M playing a few shows together might be "nice", I suppose. But it wouldn't be "The Smiths".
How's that heavy immigration working out for Britain buddy?
But in Tradition, the vocalist usually has the burden of carrying the name and the one who writes most of the songs.
Waters lost, because waters LEFT the band, but the band continued to exist as an entiry without him. But HE thought that, even though he had left the band, HE should still have the right to say that the rest of the people in the band should no be able to carry on as the band, and that HE had the right to then break up the rest of the band, even if they wished to contunue, basically acting as if HE ALONE OWNED the band name. That was why he lost. It is not AT ALL the same situation. If Marr had left, and the others had wanted to continue as the smiths, then they could. But they didn't, instead the band disbanded, and Morrissey went on to have a "solo" carreer. It would have been difficult for the other two to continue as "the smiths" without Morrissey and Marr, so the band broke up.
Why did you say “solo” career ? He had a solo career . He really became fashionable again in the early 2000s with two pretty damn good albums, one of which scored a number one
Yes, exactly.
Musicians are ten-a-penny, Morrissey is unique and yes a genius.
How come Mare fans NEVER post his original work? Only post him covering Smiths songs. Does his solo work suck?
its just an ex-lovers spat
I don't think they were lovers.
There is no Smiths without Morrissey. Period.
It’s different than Floyd, because that happened in their prime in the 70s or 80s, if one member got the name Smiths, it wouldn’t matter as they are done performing fairly soon,,,
Pink Floyd is a bit different, they were registered as a company and Waters resigned from the company surrendering under contract any rights he had. Pink Floyd never split up. The smiths did.
If you knew the Smiths in the 1980s, then you will know that time has gone and should be left. a memory trace
As far as I'm concerned, Morrissey is almost completely bereft of talent. The fact that he is such a drama queen, that he takes himself sooooo seriously, is frankly laughable.
And then there's that whole feud with R. Smith: also laughable.
I didn't know about his position on Brexit, but honestly I'm not surprised.
If you judge some one just because they voted brexit then you need a lie down
why doesnt marr just post "give it a rest stephen"! (morrisey hates being called stephen).
JFC they must've been offered a hundred million to tour. Johnny Marr is the purest artist on Earth
Am I the only one on here thank thinks they should bury the hatchet and get the band back together. I’d love to see the Smiths live. Been a fan from around 84’ onwards. Instead of thinking we need to pick sides how about we pick team Smiths.
Rough Trademark
Marr is the active ingredient in the Smiths. Morrissey still owes me money for Alsatian Cousin. Terrible crooner
As far as a new back band goes, they just need a bassist who can play Jean Genie.
Morrissey and Marr were never 100% on the same wavelength in the beginning(that's what made them a force to be reckoned with)& since then Marr slowly but surely diverged whilst Morrissey wildly went off on a tangent
The Morrissey of the Smith era was exactly the Morrissey that Music needed
Morrissey post Smiths is exactly what that, somewhat different, music needed
Marr is a collaborator; a hired gun/Morrissey plays second fiddle to none
In the highly unlikely event they should ever work again (as the Smiths or otherwise) it would not be the same because they're not the same people; it's not the same time; it's not the same industry the only thing similar is the audience
Cilla f*ckin' Black?? haha Morissey is a madman!
I have been a fan since the beginning but never saw them here in Australia. So I say cmon Johnny and tour, take the millions it's better than your solo
Would have loved to see a reunion but it's 15 years too late. Plus no Andy, no The Smiths.
Totally agree. Would have been awesome around 2008ish. Plus, as you said, with Andy gone there can be no Smiths reunion.
You keep referring to the bands “Britishness” you forget to mention the Irish influence of the band.
You're spot on, they had a huge Irish influence! I should have mentioned that. My bad. Speaking of Irish identity and music... check out my video on the phenomenal Fontaines D.C.! ruclips.net/video/iP4oqjSMTy4/видео.html