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One is recent for sale, completely refitted ... available for less than 400 Grants with wing keel ... inclusive container, new sails ... thats just 1/10th of the price for a AC40 (40 foot foiling monohull one-design class) which is built for you at the price of 2.8 million. :-)

Ditto!

The 12 meter's don't make for a good spectator sport. Current AC's do since they sail close to shore. The only way to watch the old 12m boats, is to be out on a boat. Plus 12m are ultra boring in light wind.

J-Class, ‘hold our Krug’!

yes. two 12 mts upwind !!.🙂

@@Ettobike62 I was out on the water as part of the start/finish crew for the race committee for the 1987 America's Cup in Fremantle. They are a magnificent yacht and it was a wonderful time.

@@davidwild66 I was so lucky to be part of the crew of Victoty 83 when it was on Como lake in italy . great time also Italia, the othr boat from the othe syndicate was on the lake for a while, and we had seasons of amateur match racing

Likely overstatement: Challenge 12 in 1983 was a good, conventional 12. Not special. Australia 2 was breakthrough and very special. I was there. In these present day round the buoys, Challenge 12 is being sailed by some professional sailors (afterguard). Challenge 12, Freedom, Enterprise, Courageous and Defender are essentially equal speed wise. Best crew and best tactician wins. The notion that Challenge 12 was anywhere near her stablemate's speed e.g. "beat her regularly" is fanciful. Sure, they sparred and Challenge 12 on occasion could wind up on top, but your suggestion that Challenge 12 was an unheralded super boat is just silly.

@@dap777754 I was just repeating what John Bertrand said to us at the ryct. On many occasions Australia 2 would not sail to her potential and they couldn't figure out what was happening. Challenge 12 kept them on their toes well and truly and never suggested she was a super yacht. All good.

@@sailorpete136 All good. From what I saw in Newport that summer, Mr. Bertrand was largely outsailed by Dennis on the slower Liberty. So outsailing Bertrand was, as you observe, quite possible.

Well, with a winged keel and enough wind... Or have they banned those? And composites?

Hopefully never…

The ice boats are in that channel over there.

Keith, even in their day they weren’t necessarily the fastest boats certainly not downwind as they are displacement yachts- deep hulls that drive through and displace water rather than skip over the top. Mind you, they are still deceptively quick upwind, and often competitive upwind with more modern non- displacement hulls. But downwind , they’re left for dead. Having said that the 12 metre class is about boats competing that have been built to a set of specifications and which can be fastest within those rules.

@@davidclarke3450 quick-ish upwind but the loads were ridiculous (see Australia 1). There’s a reason west coast ULDBs became the basis for more and more designs as the 12s were still technically in their heyday.

Sorry I call it historic elegance.

@@keithmoorechannel Of course, quickish upwind (and equally narrow-angled downwind) is what the former AC match racers had over the trash representing the AC today. Once foils and flying and playstations were normalized the AC was doomed. NZL drove the last nail in AC's coffin. Close boat-on-boat strategy and tactical racing with crew and skippers is now dead. Next stop on the AC clownshow is probably licensing SailRocket, fitting a robot, and having one-way drags off the coast of Namibia or something. Meanwhile, in a display of supreme irony, J class boats continue to be built, and among a few other super classes, continue to represent proper, unlimited class competition. NZL basically said we can't compete there so let's lock the AC away in our backwater by permanently classifying AC as nothing more than scows with wings and a few bicycling crew hidden below-decks. The most bizarre class of anti-competition 'sailing' apparatuses yet conceived. Now we wait to see if a NYYC or SDYC bothers to recapture the Cup and restore it.

Not in this video, no. Challenge 12 (black hull, black sails) is the most recent twelve in this video, built for 1983 challenge in Newport. She had a conventional keel, however.

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