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I describe myself with the q one because it's radical

i love electra heart and i love love the editing&commentary of this video

personally I dont really like GSM precisely because it feels like a very sanitized neutral word. I also dont really like defining the nebulous group of people we're trying to capture in a term as a inherently minority, even if its true in some senses. You might be able to guess I tend to align most closely with group three. I can defintely empathize with what you said about not using queer as a general label though.

See, personally when I hear the word Homosexual, my brain just autocompletes it with "...women with children- short insomniacs- and a teeny tiny band" Which may be one of the most homosexual responses possible

I don’t think it’s a problem for, as you said, straights (when clearly you meant cus and straight) to use queer. It’s nuanced, I agree, but I can tell the difference between when it’s being used as a slur and when it’s not. Basically, black people don’t like others using the N-word because they turn around and say “so that’s how you think of me? I’m not an N-word!” (Honestly, that makes me question why they would want to reclaim that word in the first place.) On the other hand, I *_AM_* queer. Why would I get upset about someone using an accurate term for me in a non derogatory way? That would feel like getting upset at someone using the word autistic to describe an autistic person, because the user of the word isn’t autistic themselves, and sometimes the word gets used as a slur/insult.

I'm 66, came out in 1978. I've been using Queer for a few decades while respecting those who won't. Yes it has been thrown at me- but I know that old fashioned meaning fits me- for multiple reasons. . Also I use John Fugelsang's CIA Test- what's the Context of the word's use, what is the person's Intent, who is/ was the Audience? There are friends who call me "the F word" with love. Of course I've been called Gay with malice dripping like a loose tap.

We're here, we're queer, we're not going shopping!

Really seemed like you missed talking about the academic tradition of the word and just conflated it with the radical tradition

Block Loaf

im feeling splat bomb-bastic

didnt expent clairo to be the throughline of this video

Honestly, any term that's been used for any identity outside of cis-heteronormativity has been used as a slur. Were we to avoid any word that's been used pejoratively we couldn't use gay, lesbian, or trans either.

Did you ever hear from Mr Polumbo? I attempted to bring you to his attention. As for the Q word, I find it extremely useful and would never want it to go away; it's a useful way in which people pick a side and reveal themselves. What was omitted from this was that, in its earlier use by activist groups, the Q word was inclusive, while in its current iteration it inherently pushes compbi to the point that it makes sense for many of us to say that we are far too gay to be q****. It's really gotten to the point that it's not really possible to have a foot in both boats, though Qtopia at least for now is still accepting residents who are exclusively same-sex-attracted. But the distinction of which norms one wishes to adopt is of great value in how we organize the coming unleashing.

Really interesting video - thanks for the time, effort and thought that went into making it. I've gone from being opposed to reclaiming queer because of its history to supporting its reclamation because of its history - hopping from option 1 to option 3. I personally don't identify as queer now mostly because I don't consider myself interesting enough to be queer, I'm just a boring cis gay bloke. I think it all comes down to the right to self-identify and have that identity respected. If someone tells me they identify as queer, I should respect that - any trauma I might have from it is a 'me' problem and I have no right to force it on the unburdened. Similarly, if someone chooses not to identify as queer, any feelings I might have on how the word has been reclaimed is irrelevant. Meet people where they are and respect their identity so long as that identity isn't bigoted trash.

First vid of yours that I've come across, and it was good enough for me to subscribe. Great work.

Great vid, thank you

I'm here. I'm queer. I'm not goign anyueer.

I often identify as queer because I don’t have a preference for my identity/sexuality. So instead of making a tumblr blog with my niche single use identity I go with queer it’s vague (just like me). I personal remember gay as a socially expectable slur (at least pre 2012). As I was a late “that’s gay” “your gay” generation and it was always around the f slur for the real antsy boys. While I found queer to be used by older adults trying to not confront the issue (talking to each other then kids). My brother (younger) doesn’t like queer at all. But he had a different experience than me being a gay male. So I think he identifies with “gay” more closely and has moved beyond its use as acceptable slur. And I myself have done the same for queer. Weird and odd have been thrown at me for years why not empower myself with it. I actually came to use queer from my college experience as atleast at my school the term was queer and lgbtq studies. The books where queer and the articles queer (West coast btw) I think alot of this is regional and generational. As you said like gay doesn’t mean happy (or sexual depraved) anymore and queer doesn’t mean odd or weird (or sexually deviant) like it once did. On the internet when people make of “gay not queer” it indeed reads like lgb 😉 crowd. Like heteronormativity will let them back in if they divide and segregate. 😮‍💨

Anxiously waiting for love + fear and ADIAMD

Just my two cents on "Should trans women be allowed to reclaim anti-gay slurs", speaking as a trans woman. Even though I haven't personally felt the need or desire to do so, I think it should be allowed. I've certainly been called all of the anti-gay slurs. They're targeted at me because I'm perceived as a man in the eyes of those who want to hurt me. It seems to me that the power of reclamation comes from being able to essentially go "Yeah, and? So what?" And so if something like the f slur is only reclaimed by gay men, then in the case where I'm called it my only recourse without misgendering myself is to go "I'm not a *f slur*, I'm a woman" which is not only defensive but also divisive, a losing battle on two fronts. The only way not to be put into that situation is for the word to lose its current meaning, which means that it needs to lose its inherent attachment to gay men.

It's so weird to me (a Xennial) to hear you say that young people are the ones reclaiming it, because what I always I see is an older person (elder millennial or genX or higher) saying they're queer, and then a young person popping up to tell them it's a slur, and the older person explaining that it's been reclaimed already. It was used so commonly as a shared positive label when I was younger, back when "gay" was the slur. I wonder if it's less about a generational divide and maybe it's more location based. In the 90s, when I was still closeted and going to the queer bookshop with my older queer friends "just to hang out in solidarity", the word was all over and it was surrounded by rainbow decorations and groups of happy people chatting at the register while they paid for their queer books and stickers and birthday cards. But I can't imagine a place like that existing in some other parts of the country.

When this video popped up in my recommended I thought it was a comeback channel from James Somerton for a second and then you immediately joke about it at the start lmao

This video really got me thinking. My two cents on this is that this is a very complex debate that is also made richer when you take into account other languages and their use of reclamation mechanisms. I'm Argentinian, native spanish speaker, and for us, using the word queer is kind of a novelty. We've even stylised it as "Cuir", for it to resemble our way of pronouncing it. For many people, this works because it's a term that can be used as a good representation, because no school bully will have called you "Queer" ever (they probably would call you "put0" or "maric0n", these words have also been reclaimed by many people, including myself). But I do feel like using queer/cuir to speak about the spanish speaking LGBT+ community at large can have certain "colonialist" undertones. Why are we using an English word? What happens with our words for representation? My random fact about this is that queer is kind of similar to a Spanish word, which is "rarito/rarita/rarite", which is also very similar to "odd" . But I dont really think anybody will seek out using that word as representation any time soon, as it's not very specific to "queer" or "homosexual" behaviour.

To be fair, as someone who’s a part of the alphabet mafia, I often call myself queer. But I do get how for older people in the community, that could be a source of discomfort. Like at least in my generation, for some reason Gay is used pretty weirdly by straight people to make “ew jokes” or “omg surprise jokes,” that are just plain bad. Then again though, I used to not want to identify as a lesbian because I would be called it in a mocking manner, in the same way I’m sure older lgbtq folks were called queers. Then again, I’ve also been called f*g as well. I think a lot of the word usage comes down to intent and context of the situation. I’m always significantly less on edge when a person who’s a part of the community uses the language, because they get it, and to me there’s a sense of community with that. Then again though, there’s a lot of situations where context can make any of the words sound like an insult. And I think an earlier comment mentioned the entomology for the word gay itself, and I think that lines up, if you consider at least how U.S’s “moral dilemma” against queer people in general stems from the puritan values of “if you do x sexual act, you need to be shamed,” or “you aren’t sleeping with someone of your opposite sex? You’re wrong!” Personally, I think the sort of “right or wrong” morality that queer people get judged with, it gets kinda tiring to hear. Like… the “is it wrong to have education about same sex/gender couples the same time kids learn about opposite sex/gender couples?” If you see a man and a woman kissing and find it fine, you shouldn’t have much of an issue with people of the same sex or gender doing the same. And it’s often some weird ass perversion that makes these people say “they can’t be learned x at this time,” because they associate queer people with sex when that’s first of all, a stereotype, and second of all, a societal construct that’s been conditioned into a shit ton of people. Either way, I apologize for the tangents and rants, I personally feel like there’s so many things that bar me from getting access to the healthcare I need for my own health.

My take is that this is not relevant or important discourse right now and is mostly used as a distraction from conversations that are more important. I’m not saying that’s what this video is, but in general semantics is not an important topic. It’s is however a topic liberals love to focus on because changing language is easier than changing systems.

I think I like GSM! I think I will be using gender and sexual minorities. Hm. Though I feel now it might be erasing people with non-normative romantic attraction... I don't know. I'm on the aro spectrum but I don't really know what opinion I have on it. I guess Gender and Attraction Minorities is what I personally like better, I guess? I think I'll be sticking to LGBTQIA+ for now...

Also queer doesn't mean gay. There is A LOT of baggage with that word. You have straight people calling themselves queer....... yah its a word so broad it has no meaning. Also I dont do identities. I am. The only parts of me you need to understand are I like D and I have D aka gay. Everything else about me? Well needing a label shows I NEED you for some aspect of my existence and frankly that is not the case I don't need your consent, approval, acknowledgement, or participation. It's not even that I do/don't want those things, those things are immaterial like a fish needing a space suit. The only thing I need another individual for is physical stuff and that's why I have the label gay. Im not particularly attached to that label either. Id hook up with a woman if the situation was right. 10:30 Also I disagree with that take. It's not that the N word is worse, it's simply society realizes racism is wrong and they don't feel that way about homophobia. Look at you, supporting "the boycott". Islam is homophobic. Practicing that faith would be like practicing the values of the KKK. It is the same thing you just don't see it that way because homophobia is culturally okay. If two groups are in opposition, gays will always take second place. The reason it's okay for straight people to use queer is because 24 years ago it was still illegal to be gay in most of the US. Im guessing the N word was just fine 24 years after slavery too

speaking on this as a young bi trans person: my biggest issue with the q slur (i consider it a slur) is the fact that if you're lgbt you're going to be called it no matter what. the queer community, my queer friend, queer consumers etc. straight people use it all the time now and think its more inclusive somehow, but actual lgbt ppl cant seem to decide what queer actually en-capsules; is it queer as in only gay (wo)men? queer as in people who experience opposite gender attraction? queer as in gay and trans? queer as in every single person under the lgbt community? queer as in still in the process of figuring out your sexuality? i just wish it was something more tangible like the other labels, even the people who use the f or d slur to describe their sexuality to others make it clear who they are attracted to. just something i noticed. i stopped id'ing with it the moment i realize that people (lgbt or not) will call me that no matter what i say, against my will. lgbt people can definitely reclaim it, i see nothing wrong with that, most of my friends use it interchangeably with other labels (lesbian, trans etc.), but i really dislike it when cishets refer to anyone by it. lgbt(q/+) is a perfectly fine abbreviation,. since queer was used (i think) mostly in the southern usa as a definitive slur against anyone even gender conforming, i think telling people to 'just get over it' or to 'toughen up' and still continuing to call them is horrible. but again this entire comment is just my opinion, thanks for the video, person who i thought was james somerton's alt account and got curious enough to watch the video <3

"my evil twin brother" NOOOOOOO 😭😭😭😭😭

i know of its history and the baggage it carries but i never really "felt" it i guess you could say? mostly bc english is my second language and people yknow. dont speak english in everyday conversations where i live. the most english in a conversation about queer people here would just use the word "gay" or LGBT itself. when conversing with locals, these words make me flinch (with the addition local slur for trans women) but otherwise, i dont find them inherently offensive, just like how i feel about "queer", the f slur and even the t slur. the way i see it, i agree with klee. as long as it's not used to harm or offend, i dont see an immediate problem but again, thats my biased perspective as someone who is not a native english speaker and lives in a country where english isnt the main language so most of the time when i say queer, people dont know im technically reclaiming a slur lol. love your content <3

This is such a complex topic and it's totally tied up in each person's individual lived experience. It's interesting to hear your perspective on this, it's really got me thinking about my associations with "queer" and its various connotations. I experienced queer used as a vitriol-powered slur a lot as a child, especially in my own household. Yet I support the use of queer as an umbrella term and refer to myself as queer. For me though, "queer" fits more broadly into my life and lived experience as a gender-questioning pansexual, rather than just "gay", which to me feels more specific to those who identify as homosexual. I'm loving reading everyone's perspectives on this, we all live such different lives and make our own meanings out of what we experience!

9:50 unless you're Lady Gaga and Bruno Mars, then you're safe

Thank goodness there’s someone who agree with me! I feel the same way- I don’t ID with the word queer and I don’t want people to use it for me. And it’s not because I want to distance myself from trans people, I just don’t think my orientation makes me “weird” or “odd”, and I certainly don’t want to be defined by a word that is inherently about othering and that has been used as a slur, toward me, in my own lifetime (and in my early 30s, I’m not even that old)! Also I find it ironic that people talk about self-designation as an argument for reclaiming queer, but don’t see the irony in not only choosing a word that was chosen for us by straight homophobes as our “self-label”, but are also forcing said label on people like me who don’t ID with it. Anyway thank you for the much needed pov!

The thing I always point to with this discourse is the history of the word "gay." Like, people know it used to mean happy, but that doesn't cover *how* it became synonymous with homosexual. Basically, it wasn't *just* happiness. It ended up picking up some licentious connotations about not just joy, but *pleasure* . So you start seeing sex workers referred to as gay in the adjective form, or brothels referred to as gayhouses in the Victorian era. From there, it became synonymous with promiscuous or easy, general connotations of *sexual immortality* . And *that's* the point where it starts to shift to referring to homosexuality, and it only really picks up in the 40s and 50s. To be gay meant to be so perverted that you fell into the sins of homosexuality and lust. So, not exactly a clean and family friendly origin story. And that's the context that the Gay Liberation Front was born out of. I think a lot of the discourse, to me, is rendered moot when you consider that there *is* no historically neutral or positive terms for the queer community. Queer was, and often still is, a slur. So is the F one that might get my comment nuked. But gay started the exact same way, and it's been so successfully reclaimed that nobody really talks about that unless they're a historian. It's not a question of if it's possible to separate the history from its current usage, it's the specific question of if it's practical and beneficial to do that with specifically the word queer.

this dichotomy is really interesting cause i can't remember off the top of my head the last time i heard "queer" as a pejorative, i'd even say "gay" has been used more wildly as a slur in my experience. but that's probably just my age and the spaces i'm in. in my brain "queer"/"gay" is categorized similarly to "african american"/"black", the former word being more so sanitized i guess? and this video (16:20) also prompted me to think about how "gay" used to be what "twink" is today, like a covert way to offend someone. we really went from hilary duff's iconic commercial to tweets about "🚬" and troye sivan addressing that recent blind item lmao. but at the same time all of that is predated by "queer" *actually* being one of the two slurs...

I don't mind the q word but I identify more with gay because it more succinctly describes who I am and generally lacks the additional ambiguity that just doesn't exist in my personal identity. Especially as someone who doesn't really enjoy they/them pronouns applied to him *personally*. I am, though, really over current f-slur discourse. If you're not mlm you have no right to that word. Period.

I feel like it rarely gets brought up, but 'gay' also gets used as a slur. It really wasnt until the lexicon started integrating things like 'im so gay' that it started to chill. But i spent years having the same reaction to gay that some older folks feel about queer. That being said, im a trans woman who uses the t words to describe myself in a very queer nation capacity, so like. We're kinda boned on the semantic juggle. Especially as we get into the final stretch. Lgbtqiiaaaa+++++ turns into jockeying for who is and isnt a real gay, GSM and mogai are frequently turned into a cover for predators of varying description against our will. I guess im firmly in camp 3, but largely because I've seen all of our nice words get used to hurt us as much or more than queer in recent history. Language is a bitch, and this is a secondary problem that comes off the fact that were osteacized and pathologized. We need a different word entirely, but i promise that will also be made a slur by the decades end.

This was a great video to watch during my break of transing people ❤️❤️❤️

Speaking as someone from non-English speaking country, this was very educational. I can imagine how weird would it be if someone started using one of the slurs that exist in my language in this way...

This is so stupid, but I'm glad you made that throwaway "Evil Twin Brother James Somerton" joke because I deadass was second-guessing myself when I stumbled upon your channel wondering if he had just made a new youtube account. I was pretty sure you were different people, but the doubt was still gnawing at me -w-;

D ANGLO VIDEOS ARE BORING WE NEED YOUR VIDEOS MORE

This video is violent and I love it.

@ 21:58 Yes of course

Lmao I was not expecting to be hearing Ojibwa of all things in this video 💀💀💀

My god, that opener. You have my full attention. Brave, bold, brilliant. 😅

I was literally about to comment GSM when you said it. Felt like mind-reading.

I am okay with the reclamation of slurs but so many times I see people using the more explicit slurs getting extremely pissed off when you ask them to so simple things like content warning their posts/videos/etc. - so much so that it's kinda to the point that you're just being a bigot yourself. To reclaim a slur you actually still need to protect those in your community from those who are hurt by said slur.

oh wow

I have never (knowingly?) experienced queer as a slur. I also don’t live in an anglophone country and thus the only place I’ve been exposed to English speaking discourse outside of schooling environments is the internet. I actually like queer as an umbrella term for anything and everything un-straight.

Yeah, interesting. Q was definitely the slur most used to police me and the people around me coming up, but when I hit college, and LGBTQ was really catching on, and I came out as trans, I felt the word queer, with all of its baggage, and it's history, is the best word for me. When I say it, I mean something specific, to do with leaning in to a socially assigned 'deviance' and celebrating that which is othering about us. Love hearing other people's notion and story of the word as always