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Except, Charizard never listened even as a Charmeleon. Ash had earned 2 badges by the time Charmander evolved to Charmeleon at lvl16. 2 badges get Pokémon up to lvl30 to obey. Yet, at no point did Charmeleon ever listen to Ash.

Thing that people tend to forget is that after Pikachu defeated Onix, Ash left the Gym and said he would come back another day. When Brock tried to give him the badge, even Ash said he didn't earn it at first. With Misty, the girl played the long con. She babied Pikachu so he wouldn't battle against her and while he put up a good fight, she was probably going to lose if Team Rocket didn't show up. Also, Misty never gave Ash the Cascade Badge. Her SISTER gave Ash the Cascade Badge as a reward for saving the Gym's Pokemon from Team Rocket. Misty saying she gave it out of pity is more of a self serving memory if anything.

A couple problems with this. 1. In pokemon origins it’s confirmed that every gym leader has 8 sets of Pokémon depending on how many badges you have prior to challenging the gym. Meaning each gym leader that ash had fought was at the appropriate level. In comparison to ash’s badge count. And as such Having any number of badges is what matters hence why Gary has several badges from gyms that ash does no encounter. 2. Ash earned all of his badges and if he didn’t at the time he did by the time he got another badge anyways. He had Brock’s respect, not pity, and he was beating misty anyways during their fight. And in both instances ash has proven himself stronger than both of them REPEATEDLY throughout kanto. And in the case of Sabrina ash was able to damage and stand on even footing with Sabrina albeit yes he was weaker. But this doesn’t matter because he fought and defeated koga. For Erika ash proved himself tougher than Erika’s ace, that alone is enough reason for the badge as proven in johto with Whitney. Giovanni, I don’t care that Giovanni wasn’t there, those were still his gym registered pokemon with Jessie and James on top of that. Ash doing that well getting jumped means he would’ve slammed Giovanni harder than Gary did and since ash isn’t a trash talker Giovanni would have had no reason to bust out a Mewtwo against him. All of ash’s badges were earned, put some respect on this mans name. Seriously bro went from weaker than Gary after the 8th gym battle, trained for 1 day and surpassed him in the pokemon league only losing to Ritchie because his party wasn’t healed. Ash would’ve made it to the semi finals at the very least in the kanto league if it wasn’t for team rocket. OFF ONE DAY OF TRAINING. Quit playing with me

Whoever wrote those lines hadn't done their homework, because: 1. Brock WANTED to give his Gym Badge to Ash, and he refused. Because he won by circumstance rather than skill and he felt he didn't earn it, and so he planned to leave and try again another time. Brock chased him down and insisted that he take it. 2. Misty didn't even have a say in the matter, their battle was interrupted by Team Rocket and Ash did his part to save the Pokémon and the Gym. Misty's sisters offered the Gym Badge as thanks, and again, he refused, because again, he didn't feel as though he earned it. But they wouldn't take no for an answer and insisted he take it. Ash was more wise and humble back then than perhaps people give him credit for, so lines like these are pretty imsulting.

except that is GAME logic not anime, and unlike ash's other pokemon, like pidgeot, butterfree they listened and with all his pokemon ash did something to earn their trust and trained with them, he never did with charmeleon or charizard even professor oak said that to him. Ash also kept going on saying charmander listened but failed to realise that charmeleon and charizard had different personalities then charmander

NO YOU DIDNT MISTY! Your sisters gave him the badge because you were loosing and odds are would have lost anyway if he used Pikachu, their words. Also Brock NO! You gave it to him because you felt he earned it. Drop the pitty crap.

So I'm guessing the creatures forgot misty wasn't the one that gave ash his badge. Also from what I could remember brock felt bad for Pikachu at first after pretty much dominating it in round 1. Certainly don't remember brock gaining respect for ash yet alone pity. But definitely didn't earn them.

i caught a level 40 arcanine with 1 badge and it disobeyed me as well as my garchomp

Me: You’re right. It does.☺️ Misty & Brock: 🤨? Me: 👊! Misty: (DING!👊) Brock: (DONG!👊) Me: Anything else?☺️ Misty: No.😵‍💫🤕 Brock: We’re good.😵‍💫🤕

Levels in numerical value don't apply to the anime since the anime is very much like the real world. Second, Charizard undergo changes from since Charmander was not without challenges, as it had went through emotional turmoil since abandonment to being Ash's most used pokemon battling primate, Golem and participate in two gym battles before the battle of the Eggegutor where Charmander had to battle an entire group of those pokemon two times resulted in it's fire finally hit it's peak and with the help of Melvin, Charmander gave one last push of it's fire power to deal with the group push it's level of power to greater heights that it trigger the evolution and went through with it, so the level of power grew higher contrast to Ash's inexperience and could not handle it with Charmeleon and Charizard. Second, personality and characteristics also apply in how it was behaving after evolving as Charmeleon are known gor their bad aditude and stubborness and Charizard is highly competitive. Three, acting independent and ignoring it's trainer is due to it's obsession and lust for power, an poison trait from it's former trainer. It distance itself from it's trainer and teammates in order to seek out power alone and as it grew, it became more like Damen, obsessed with power and reputation while ignoring the values of friendship, loyalty and trust. Battling on it's own Accord is based on it's pride or bruise ego like with Aerodactyl and Magmar. Charizard had to learn to grow and develop even more through losses and life lessons from it's battles and others

Why is Misty acting like she didn’t emotionally bribe Pikachu to not participate in the gym battle. Her sisters even said it themselves that if Ash had used Pikachu he would have easily beat Misty. Which was why they gave Ash the badge not Misty

Just bringing up SVI irritates me. Transformer Pokemon. Id love to get into a modern title but its too different from what I had... and not in an enjoyable way. Im in a catch 22 i hate it 😂

Not when I draw 2 shit basics and they get all there ex and evolution lines from the start. The rng I’ve been feeling the last 3 days is fucking ridiculous. I’m taking a break it’s unreal, not one game is even close to fair. Yes I still can win here and there solely off their bad plays. It’s so unbelievable idek what to say anymore.

I think Charizard is just a reflection of what it's like to have kids when they are growing up into adults

Absolute bullshit! Ash was kicking Misty's ass. He would've won fair & square of TR didn't intervene & she didn't even give him the badge! He sisters did, even hitting her with logical "Well if he could beat you without pikachu you'd just be MORE fucked if he did use it so..."

Because Charmander had an original trainer. This is also true of Bulbasaur, but he never evolved.

Tupid logic

Ash saved Charmander and he turned into a disobedient little brat what a sad character change

Technically it wasn’t even Misty who gave him the badge, it was one of her sisters.😂

Pokemon up to lvl 30 listen to you with 2 badges. Not lvl 20. And this wasn't gen 7, so it was tied to specific badges. Not the number. So if ash didn't earn the cascade badge, the limit would still be 10. If charmander came after the cascade badge, maybe it assumed he earned that badge honestly.

I saw this comment a long time ago but it relate to charizard being disobedience. Supposedly Ash other pokemons like squirtle and bulbasaur saw how charizard was disobedience to ash so they didn't want to evolve out of fear of being like charizard. I know bulbasaur had an episode dedicated to it not evolving but I like this fun theory. I just wish I remember the video I saw with that original comment about this theory

Bulbasaur does not listen ash. ?

Technically Charmander over levelled against that hoard of exeggutors in that one episode in the first season of the anime in Kanto.

This would make sense....until you find out as long as you catch the pokemon, your pokemon have no obedience level cap, even as late as Gen 9 even without a single badge to your name.

That goes for Legends Arceus as well.

I only lose because 50% of the time my Stage 1 and 2's are ALWAYS at the bottom of the deck😅

Ash still earned these badges even if he didn’t win them And Brock and Misty are such liars, Ash was winning until he got stopped by outside forces, but then he proved himself to be a good person and subsequently a good trainer worthy of these badges even if

I'm not top tier player but question , at 9:40 why didn't you budding expeditioner to bring back mew , put your powered up mew in , genome hack 150 KO Mewtwo and play from there ?

Ok but ash in that same episode beat misty so he kinda won 5ish badges now

it all depends on what hands you get if you get a good hand you win if not you lose

To be fair, 90% of people playing aren't as gifted with foresight as you are

Yeah Misty's is a lie. Her sisters were WILLING to give Ash the badge because their Goldeen wasn't a Seeking. Secondly, if Team Rocket never barged in then Ash would have won. Either way, Misty was defeated by then. Ash against Brock was because of a technicality due to the sprinklers. Though Brock DID give Ash the badge.

But fr tho, the original series was so FUCKING bogus with the gym battles, every single one after brock , it was either team rocket would disrupt it or ash would help with an issue and the gym leader would feel inclined to give a vadge to him There were very few gym battles during that series where Ash ACTUALLY fought a fair battle

Yeeaaahh but Ash saved Charmander

Chrizard is basically a BW

Yep. Exactly. But I see it as winning 3 badges legitimately. Thunder, Soul, Volcano. In a way. Ash cheated to get into the kantoian league. Would be funny if Ash tried to enter the league, only to be stopped by Charizard. Charizard: "Don't let him into the tournament he only has 3 legitimately earned badges."

First of. Those two fuckers are being petty liars, Ash was about to beat your shit Misty but Rocket came in and interruoted the match and then your sisters gave him the badge for the good deeds and you Brock, you gave him that badge bwcause he refused to roast your rock snake.

Charizard doesn't know about Brock's or Misty's battle so those badges don't matter But it definitely knows about the Sabrina battle, it must of kept it in mind, that 1 Sabrina battle is the key culprit as to why Charizard didn't respect ash

Now explain the thunder armour.

Misty keeps talking like she would have beat Ash when he had her pinned the entire time. That's why her sisters gave him the badge...since they knew she would have lost. Also, Erika was losing too. The only grace I would give him is Brock, but he beat Brock technically too.

Poke flute might be the only bad take, just thought of a deck that can work with it. Volcano backrow bully

After a while Charizard does listen because not through game logic but through anime logic of talk no jutsu. After that he started respecting ash more and more and more since he started getting badges throughout generations

Technically Ash was winning against both Brock, Misty, and Erica before their matches were interupted. Outside of Sabrina, Ash technically won the other matches.

Charmeleon stopped obeying ash when he told charmeleon to go easy on the gloom or whatever mid season 1, charmeleon was mad that he wasn't allowed to use his full newfound power and didn't let go of that grudge until ash showed how much he cared for him in season 2, It all started from that episode when he was just a charmeleon, and when he became charizard he would only fight when ash was in danger like the aerodactyl episode or when charizard felt the opponent was a strong match for him to test his strength

Or it's like a phase Your mom gave birth to you and raised you well and as you age, you don't obey her anymore like a phase And maybe charizard is going through such phase

Misty never gave ash a Cascade Badge. It was her sister's.

I mean they say that but Misty's battle was inconclusive because of interference and Brook was similar because he only won out of pity LMAO

far in future, sceptile when evolved after a broken heart was shaken up by it and couldnt do any attacks right so by cartoon s logic, charmander being abandoned left a big impact in it that gave him an attitude problem at being strong by himself for that

by the games (and what an official event would be) Ash not getting in the intended way so it doesnt count lol

Well what about surge, he won against surge