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The Mormon Moron
Добавлен 8 окт 2008
Hot Takes {Polygamy Lesson For Kids?}
I'm joined by a great panel of friends to discuss our thoughts and hot takes on how we feel about the Mormon church releasing lesson material to teach polygamy to children. I hope you enjoy this episode and the panel format..it was really fun!
Просмотров: 776
Видео
Kaï Vân Lëuven Interviews Me!
Просмотров 36123 часа назад
I had the opportunity to be interviewed by Kaï Vân Lëuven for his channel, Jesus For Mormons. The title of this video was what he had named it for his channel...haha. It was a great to get to know him and tell a little bit about my story and history with mormonism. This interview was right before I started my own channel and it, in fact, encouraged me to start filming. I hope you enjoy it.
MIle Marker 356- {Nathan's Mormon Story}
Просмотров 2,2 тыс.9 часов назад
In this episode , I sit down with long time friend and fellow Bishop, Nathan Finstad, to discuss his Mormon story and to find out what happened at mile marker 356, on I-40 westbound headed towards Nashville. Nathan is a very well spoken, kind and sincere guy...always has been. I think you'll enjoy this first in person interview on my channel!
Ruth and her "Wicked" Thoughts
Просмотров 53314 дней назад
In this episode, I have the opportunity to get to know Ruth Butler and learn about the role Mormonism played in her life. We discuss her blog found at: beyondthespaciousbuilding.wordpress.com including her most recent blog post titled: “You Have No Real Power”: Lessons from Wicked and Deconstructing My Faith I feel like Ruth and I have very similar stories in many ways and have both chosen to s...
Maybe Ron is Right?
Просмотров 74214 дней назад
In this episode I talk with Ron Yorgason to find out how he became known as Master Peace. Ron shares his history with Mormonism and a very touching document he wrote as he deconstructed his faith. As I've gotten to know Ron and have read some of the things that he has written I repeatedly keep saying to myself..."hmmm...maybe Ron is right?"
Meh. Holy Ghost denial. 100%.
Oh my goodness Ron one of my best friends lives in Bloomington. I wonder if you guys know each other of have common acquaintances.
Oh my goodness Ron one of my best friends lives in Bloomington. I wonder if you guys know each other of have common acquaintances. I watching these episodes out of order but just watched you guys in the discussion about Kids and polygamy. Great interviews ❤😊
Another great interview. I’m also kinda in the same situation as Ruth in that my husband is still active but I finally told him that I am never going back. Considering that I was only 18 (2 weeks from my 19th birthday) when I went through the temple just because I want too and felt right about it, to going to the temple weekly as a single mother that President Von J Featherstone stated something to the effect of like “ Awe Sister Dickson you’re as dedicated and faithful as the day is long” one day after doing temple sealing sessions. Never did I ever think that I would ever leave the church.
Who defends the worst type of criminals?
Absolutely everyone has a chance to acknowledge the Truth. Where do you think you'll be going?
Every church is about the same in videos with some being horrendous traps of mazes.
Ron is the GOAT. Congratulations on thinking for yourself and leaving the Mormon Cult Corporation
Reposted on Latter-daily DEPOT, a repository for podcasters! 688 views in 17 hours, timestamp
Make Primary Great Again!
Luv U Guys!!
Outstanding!
Can you share the link on the lds website where this is the new curriculum
I wonder if you're going to do an episode on how God commanded that all the first born of Egypt be killed. Or how about an episode on how God wiped out the world with a flood or an episode on how God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah or an episode on why God commanded the Israelites to destroy the Canaanites. You find it so shocking that God would command polygamy for a season but you are all good with God murdering his own children. LOL What a joke.
And that's why you deconstruct all religion right along with Mormonism!
Now I want to see how people who were raised under the polygamy system would look at this. Would they laugh as how ridiculous the story is being told as well? Would they recognize how much the church is leaving out and how much they are softening it?
Just found your podcast I watch Mormon Stories RFM Bill Reel and now this podcast thanks for sharing 😅❤
Master Peace is amazing! Glad to see you here, friend!
Thanks! I appreciate your support!
Hav you heard The idea that Joseph Smith NEVER practice polygamy (it was ALL Brigham Young) is getting bigger and bigger... Its the biggiest cover up ever Here is the argument. (see youtube "Mormon Rescue" or ""Still Mormon" 1. Joseph Smith and Hyrum constantly preached denied and faught against it. (if he did then he lied.) 2. None of Joes 40 wives ever had a child from him (which is the whole point) 3. The ony official proof we have is "affidavits" written 40 years after he died ( I mary sue married joseph smitht the prophet on this day.... kinda sketchy dont you think?) 4. None of the 40 wives ever wrote anything down during the current time they were supposedly married. ( nothing in diaries) 5. HIs Wife Emma SMith denied Joseph ever practicing polygamy on her death bed. Her son specifically asked her wanting to know 6. ALl of his Children denied he ever practiced polygamy. (Emma and the children stayed in Missouri) 7. Brigham Youngs 50 Wives (some) constantly complained and were extremly miserable and always asking for help and money. As he only visitied once a month (prob for sex) There is no way being the Prophet could he take care of each wives needs. he abused it.
Yes, we're very familiar with the arguments. So far, I find the 'Joseph practiced polygamy' evidence more compelling.
@@yorgasor Whats your argument? peacfully...?? feel free to explain?
@@yorgasor please Tell us your argument. how do You know?
@@99blackbirds Probably nothing you haven't already heard and dismissed, we just attach different levels of credibility to the evidence. Polygamy accusations against Joseph started long before he died. Oliver Cowdery was excommunicated because he told about Joseph & Fanny in Kirtland. Martha Brotherton's description of being trapped in the Red Brick Store & Nancy Rigdon's happiness letter are also contemporary. Relief Society minutes record a big scandal when Clarissa Marvel was accused of spreading rumors that Joseph Smith being in a relationship to his widowed sister in law, Agnes Smith, later recorded to be one of Joseph's plural wives. The letter to the Whitneys written in Joseph's handwriting to have them come visit when Emma isn't there and to burn the letter afterwards, is particularly damning. The sequence of events in the summer of 1843, with the writing of D&C 132, Emma's insistence that all the property be deeded over to her name, Eliza R Snow's journal entry describing a big altercation with "Mrs. ...." and her flee from Nauvoo. John C Bennett's expose giving initials of women he knew Joseph to be married to, most of whom we've been able to match up with women Joseph was married to. William Law filed a lawsuit about Joseph's relation with the Lawrence sisters, whom he was joint trustee over, and was horrified when Joseph married them and took their trust money. His Nauvoo Expositor gave an excellent description of a revelation from witnesses that read it that matches D&C 132. Then you have Porter Rockwell, Joseph's most devoted friend since his treasure digging days, and staunch body guard. If Joseph were actually worried about polygamists taking over, Porter would need to know. He would also have detailed knowledge of who Joseph Smith was visiting on the sly. If Brigham was a threat to Joseph, Porter would know about it, and Brigham would know Porter would know. Brigham wouldn't have shown up in Nauvoo after Joseph's death without making sure Porter was dead first, and he certainly wouldn't have made Porter one of his own trusted bodyguards. Then we have all the journal accounts which you discount. I don't. William Clayton's journals were never published back then as proof of polygamy. Why would he go through all the effort of writing bogus journal entries if you're not going to use them. Eliza R Snow's journal was never used for proof, and her own entry describing her altercation was written discretely enough to not be tied directly to Joseph or polygamy. People continued sharing their first hand accounts of being married to Joseph or Hyrum long after Brigham was dead, after polygamy was "ended" in 1890 and well out of any kind of threat or force. Sarah Pratt became a staunch anti-polygamist and left the church. It would've been a big blow to insist it all started with Brigham, but no. She always stated it started with Joseph. Mormons are really bad at keeping secrets, but still, somehow all of them managed to keep a secret this huge? I don't buy it. As for Joseph, polygamy was illegal and incredibly secret. Of course he would deny it publicly. Emma's life was ruined because of polygamy. If her sons believed their father practiced polygamy as a commandment of God, they would be honor-bound to follow the same practice. She had a very strong motive to protect her sons from such awful beliefs to protect them from the same fate. As for no children, since Joseph didn't want to get caught, he had a strong incentive to not get any of his wives pregnant, so he would use methods that were absolutely available in his day. Sylvia Sessions, one of his wives, was a midwife, who's job was to know all about childbirth, including prevention and herbal abortion methods. She would be an excellent resource to prevent pregnancies. Albert Carrington, a later apostle notorious for adulterous affairs, used a silk handkerchief as a condom to prevent pregnancies. Joseph was also famous for having a red silk handkerchief, and he could have used his the same way. As for taking care of all of his wives, the Nauvoo land deeds record property given in awfully large percentages to women Joseph was married to, including very young ones who wouldn't have been able to pay the large sums written in the register. The people who are the most ardent defenders of the 'Joseph Fought Polygamy' genre insist that he was such a holy prophet, that he could never have been the author of such an awful thing. If Joseph was a such a holy prophet, with powers of discernment and a seer stone that could show him all things, he was awfully oblivious to the threats his apostles and friends posed to him. God neither warned him nor protected him. After almost 1800 years of apostasy and waiting for just the perfect person to restore God's one true church to, God just let him die and sent the world into apostasy again after only 14 years, allowing an evil apostle to hijack the church and lead it away. If Joseph Smith didn't start polygamy, and he was overcome by his enemies whom he thought were his closest friends, then he wasn't a prophet and the church is false. If Joseph did start polygamy, he used atrocious grooming methods, unethical pressure and spiritual abuse to coerce the women into marrying him, and he was definitely not a prophet. Either way, the church isn't true, and the whole religion is a fraud, founded largely on the treasure digging lore he and his family practiced in his youth. He used his charisma and creative mind to fabricate a religion to generate wealth and power, and once fully entrenched, used it to take advantage of his women followers like so many other cult leaders have done.
Wow the first example you put up avoided the most used... David and Solomon...
100% this is GROOMING.
D&C 132 did not come from God or Joseph Smith.
I’m sorry but I fail to see the value in assigning the YW clean up duty over decorating as a victory for women.
The way I see it is that making either assignment open for the YM or the YW keeps the young women from being pigeonholed into that traditional role. YW can clean up too. There are super creative YM who might like those opportunities to bake or decorate.
The So Called Church has really painted itself into a corner. They need to desperately disavow many of its teachings. But by doing so they also demonstrate that Rusty and their “prophets” can NOT be trusted to speak for God. Every unique Mormon theology has issues.
As someone pointed out, that whole angel story is absolutely ridiculous and it goes entirely against the concept of free agency.
Its because it never happened. Joseph Smith never started polygamy Brigham Young did. see youtube "Mormon Rescue" and other views on this, its getting bigger and bigger. The LDS church is trying to cover it up cuz it makes them look really bad
😢 "Indoctrinate early and often"
New to the channel and really enjoyed this show. Thought you should know!
This also inoculates the parent that read these to their children.
Deuteronomy 17:17 ESV And he shall not acquire many wives for himself, lest his heart turn away. My personal opinion is God never commanded polygamy biblically. He allowed it. There's a difference. I agree with Kai that if you look at what happened to the men that praticed it, it didnt turn out very well for them. Seems to me that those examples are in the Bible for a reason. I was a member of the church for 54 years (born into it) up until this year when I left after discovering things I never knew about the church that they hid from members or lied about.
Early leaders will make claims about the evils of monogamy.
Congratulations to each of you for leaving Mormonism. ❤ I hope you landed softly and, like Kai, I hope you find the real Jesus (vs fictional Mormon Jesus) if you haven’t already
Great job guys. You made it fun and interesting and noteworthy. Thank you. 🙏 It’s heart warming to see people with nice personalities all connecting and conversing ❤
Arg, that’s the name I couldn’t think of, Flora Ann Woodworth! I have thousands of Mormon history trivia items stored in my brain, and yet _every single time_ I have to look up this one girl’s name! It’s really weird how i can memorize so much but never her name.
Polygamy lessons for kids? Ugh! This disgusts me too, but for reasons beyond the ones discussed. Please consider the latest research and evidence that has come forward, showing that it is very likely that that it was Brigham Young who started polygamy, not Joseph Smith. There’s massive amounts of source evidence coming forward. It’s a huge scandal. The expert on the subject is Jeremy Hoop of the “Still Mormon” podcast. He’s exposing the role that Brigham Young played. He got ahold of Agusta Cobb’s letters to her husband, Brigham Young and it’s looking pretty ugly. No one has ever exposed this stuff until now. Nathan, you should interview him. I agree with you guys that D&C 132 is disgusting and truly awful towards Emma. Brigham most likely wrote it, not JS. The Lord would never speak about Emma that way, but Brigham would. It’s full of errors about Moses, Isaac, King Solomon and David and contradicts the Bible and Jacob 2&3, which Joseph translated. He would not have made those errors. Literally, D&C 132 says the opposite of Jacob 2&3, regarding King Solomon and David and the practice of polygamy. Joseph knew the Bible inside and out and would not have made those obvious errors. 50 years after JS’ murder, BY replaced JS’ Law on Marriage (original D&C 101) with 132. Hmm…pretty fishy! Please check out the latest research to stay abreast on the polygamy debates. But I agree that the church needs to repent of this horrid “doctrine” and move forward.
I love Jeremy’s “Still Mormon” podcast! He’s incredible! The stuff he’s exposing is truly shocking-especially the Agusta Cobbs stuff that you mentioned. He’s also done the most extensive and comprehensive research on Fanny Alger and proved that Joseph did NOT sleep with her and never married her. He has totally stumped the church’s historians. Kind of fun to watch it play out.
@@unfeigned4997I agree with both of you. “Still Mormon” is fascinating! I don’t believe Joseph started polygamy either. How could he practice polygamy and have all those supposed fights with his wife about it when he said early on that he’d lose the gift of translating if they argued? He totally adored Emma. The Lord wouldn’t have picked a completely dysfunctional couple to restore His church, nor a man who supposedly treats his daughters the way everyone says he treated them, which is a lie. It was definitely Brigham who started the whole scandal. Totally agree!
@@unfeigned4997what is Jeremy Hoop saying about Agusta Cobbs and who was she?
You just have to watch his episodes on it. Agusta was Brigham’s second plural wife. Her letters to Brigham have been kept at the Wisconsin Historical Society and they gave them to Jeremy! No one has ever publicly shared these letters before, not even the historians and he has them! They reveal some pretty upsetting things about Brigham’s and her marriage and what was going on with polygamy. Turns out that Joseph Smith never taught the doctrine of polygamy. Brigham totally blamed it all on Joseph. Truth is coming out! Grab your popcorn folks.
Isn’t one marriage hard enough? I mean difficult of course 😂!
You're right nathan, I'm sure the church leaders had it very hard for a very long time 🙄
Great analysis from all of your panel on this absurd effort to portray evil as good. I especially appreciated Aimee's female perspective. Even if there were clear scriptures to support plural wives, which there aren't, it is not an appropriate topic for primary. If parents want to teach their young children to embrace this lifestyle, they are free to do so. But no one should be allowed to teach these concepts to the children of others, especially without parental consent.
Why does the guy in the red lounging robe costume with a pipe call himself “Master Peace”? It seems sac religious when we believe that Jesus Christ is the true Master of Peace. It’s really distasteful. 🥺
We are all related. I am a convert and I discovered that I have pioneer Mormon ancestors Maria Heaps and Sam Oldham who had about 8 or so children who practiced polygamy. When I see the last names of people who were or are church members I see the names of my ancestors: Taylor, Butler, Worsley, Evans, Dixon, Hansen, Kimball, Wilcox……. Interesting
My husband shares ancestry with Joseph Smith and tells people. I tell him that’s EMBARRASSING 😅 😂. I share ancestry with Emma Hale Smith and that makes for some great arguments that I always win! 😂
Love your content being folks from the country telling the truth. Truth is much harder to find in these places. People are like the three monkeys with one having his hands over his ears and the other having his hands over his eyes. Much harder to reach people. Keep on keeping on because you are helping people.
They’ve resorted to grooming the children😢
No-one defending Joseph? You should do another one of these, Nathan from the other perspective! I would come on.
This is geared towards the churches stance, which is that he did it. We could have a debate about whether Joseph did it but that’s separate topic all together
That’s the crux of the matter. Either the Church is guilty of teaching a doctored (twisted, actually) history of their founder OR they are guilty of praising a man who married other men’s wives (and other men’s children really) as someone worthy to be a mouthpiece for God. They can’t possibly win.
That’s the crux of the matter. Either the Church is guilty of teaching a doctored (twisted, actually) history of their founder OR they are guilty of praising a man who married other men’s wives (and other men’s children really) as someone worthy to be a mouthpiece for God. They can’t possibly win.
@@Themormonmoron if you do a debate, you really need to have Jeremy Hoop of the Still Mormon podcast on that panel. He knows this topic better than anyone.
Read the William law journals and the local newspaper contemporary to d&c 132. Verbatim language. 132 authored by JS.
"One man and more than one woman" is such a half truth because Joseph married women who were already married to another man.
That was Brigham who did that, not Joseph.
@unfeigned4997 Joseph did it too. He married about 14 women who were married to other men. You can google it.
he did not. no real proof other than what was written decades after his death.
Wrong. @@unfeigned4997
Hey Now
Fantastic
Great episode, I really love these personal stories ❤ exmormoms LIVE the gospel, they don't need to serve the church anymore ❤
As a mormon deconstructing myself, we can give up mormonism, but please don't give up on god. Although we have been abused by the system, he is out there for all of us. This is my new favorite podcast, I really like the format. Keep doing what you do, Nathan.
I watched this whole interview. Nathan Finstad went through a lot of the things my wife and I went through when we were studying our way out of that church around 1996-98. Nathan's remarks about how he would come across more and more questionable/sketchy things about church history as time passed reminded me of my favorite analogy to describe "deprogramming" one's self from Mormonism or any other mind-controlling group: it's the movie "The Truman Show." If you've seen the movie, you'll remember that Truman began noticing strange, unexplainable things happening around him. One was when he was getting into his car in his driveway, and a huge stage light fell out of the "sky" and landed right next to him. Truman wondered where in the heck it came from. In another scene, he was getting onto an elevator at his workplace. When the door opened, there were several strange people in the car whom he didn't know, and they were startled to see him. The elevator car wasn't real, and the walls were unfinished wood like a backstage. Whichever TV crew member was supposed to manage that scene had opened the wrong door fot Truman. Those incidents started Truman questioning whether his whole environment was a facade. And so it is when we begin studying the true history of Mormonism as opposed to the version that the church teaches us in classes. Near the end of the movie, the director of the show, played by Ed Harris, was asked about the ethics of creating a false world for an infant to live his entire life in, solely to make a TV show of it. Harris replied "People accept the reality that is presented to them." The LDS church does the same thing: they have created this entire fake origin story and dogma over the last 194 years, and they present it to their members as though it's real. The problem the church faces is how to hold onto their members when they realize that the whole world is fake.
I love the Truman show. I was still Mormon when I first saw it so it had a different meaning then but now, after leaving the church because of all the deceit I see a whole different perspective. Watching now means something completely different. 😊
You are basing your existence on different comments not even written by prophets. There is more to this than is seen here. The things you felt as a. Missionary are real. How sad will it be that one day you find out that what you have read against the church is not right. My exact experiences living the covenant far outweigh any ant- Mormon literature regardless f where you found this.
Amazing interview!!!
Thank you for sharing this. My husband doesn’t watch as much of the ex Mormon content as I do, but I started watching this with him nearby and he stayed for the whole thing. He kept commenting on it as he related so much to so many of the things said. I also really enjoyed listening to your story. We have been out a few years now. It was funny when he said they had a desire to move to Utah for community. We are in Utah and have found community so hard. We have felt drawn to Tennessee😊 We are still Christian and have found it hard to find what we are looking for here.