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My current cope about this is that exactly because it's a 3 part series, they decided to show the world as happy and bombastic. So in part 3 when Meteor is summoned, you can come back to these areas and they'll have that similar feeling as they were in the original. Now this is still a massive change and does not actually represent the original game whatsoever, but it's a good alternate idea for a theme never really portrayed in the original: the finite support of Shinra/Mako. In the original Midgar is really the only "city" and only place supported by Mako, but in the original even Midgar never looks hustling and bustling. Even Shinra tower has an eery atmosphere (personally I do think that is still fitting for OG FF7.) Now even if they do come around on this idea which I think is the best possible "redemption" for the Remake trilogy, it still wouldn't be as good as what FF7 OG does. But like you said I'm still on board with Part 3 and enjoy the trilogy for what it is.

OG is mid. Rebirth is the game of the decade. 🤷

Thank you for this! I've been holding discussions in some of my groups stating just this. I definitely enjoyed what I've played so far of the FF7 Remake project. But one of the greatest criticisms I have is that thematically it just feels "off". In my opinion, somehow it's far brighter and quite bit more "lighthearted" in comparison to the original 1997 release. Sure, the original game had some quirky and funny moments, but the overall emotional weight of the game was far heavier, and darker. The best way I've been able to describe it is like the "Kingdom Hearts-ification" of FFVII. -B.

I can agree with this.

This critique is real Rich coming from someone who can't even get REEVE'S name right. Morso considering that she claims to be a fan of the original, exacerbating the problem. Sorry, but I really think you just wanted to dump on rebirth while lending yourself credibility. I'm not going to say that it's perfect or that it doesn't have its flaws, but complaining that the gold saucer is a flashy place with a clownish atmosphere, i.e. that it's entirely faithful to its original incarnation, is not only an invalid critique, but a rather awkward one to make while simultaneously complaining about the lack of faithfulness to the original. Or was this video just an elaborate troll?

Without wishing to sound like a fanatical hater, I think that it's naive to still be on board at this point. If you keep giving them your money, you're incentivising them to continue in their current path.

You have quite the interesting perspective and I respect you for it. But to me, my personal problems of the game, lies with it's story and in certain moments, how it made me angry at first. For example: -I think they screwed up Dyne's death. But I would have been okay if they keep certain elements of the dialogues. Like the threat Dyne made, that he should send Marlene to her mother. Or that after he was gunned down, he tells Barret to not make Marlene cry, ever again. I would have been fine with these, if they did something like in FF7 Ever Crisis. They changed his death, but kept the dialogues. -Cloud attacking Tifa was one of the worst written scenes ever... Not just because of the Weapon swallowed Tifa and took her to a "trip", but because she saw everything in the Lifestream, she NEVER held any amount of grudge against Cloud. I get that Sephiroth made Cloud to attack her, but this just allowed Cloud to get away with this scott-free, without concequences. -To put this one in a nutshell: I don't mind the optional dates you can make. But I do mind the shipping wars, which was presumingly awakened, when the Intimate Date between Cloud and Tifa happened. We should respect each other's shipping tastes. And this is what I'm afraid of: The toxic shippers belittle me... Since I was in the RWBY Community. 😢 -And of course, the ending... In my opinion, the writers wanted the emotional payoff from Aerith's "death", but they didn't wanted her to actually begone from the story. So they cheated... My book is that, if you want to stick to the OG, then kill Aerith off. But if you want to change, you cannot kill her off. Doing both scenarios is just not an option...

Honestly, i think we're seeing just one side of the coin. In Kalm as you hear people talk they mention Kalm was rebuilt into a tourist destination after the war, and you see a bit more of its real self and see how the Mythril Mine has decayed form disused. The joy and happiness is kind of a facade Shinra tries to keep up to keep people distracted. Like how Gold Saucer is this bustling amusement park up top and then at the base of it is Corel Prison, or how Junon has the bombed out buildings and wrecked in the lands outside.

I wholeheartedly agree with you, everything is so brightfull and happier in the now...

You simply can not recreate nostalgia. Nostalgia is SO powerful and will be etched in our memory forever. It's like listening to a song that reminds you of your childhood, but the song can't recreate the moment you first heard the song. The same goes for Final Fantasy VII - no matter how hard you try, it's impossible to recreate the first experience you had with that game. I think the developers have done a phenomenal job with the FF7R trilogy (so far) - I really felt like a kid playing those games, but of course it wasn't exactly the same as back in 1997 and that's totally fine. I personally think they created a masterpiece by trying to include all types of players, the old fans, newbies, younger people or JRPG lovers in general, and also trying to create something new while being faithful to the original. It's really not that easy. There's so much more to game design than people think. I'm very grateful for the FF7R Trilogy and nothing will ever take away the memories I had with FF7 OG. I think the game needs more time and it will age like a fine wine. With each playthrough I appreciate and like FF7R more and more. Honestly, I could write you an essay about what makes Final Fantasy (VII) so special, but I'd probably run out of characters and my english is not good enough :D Cheers

I don't really agree. My only complain is that pacing is a problem on open world games. Also, SE NPCs are very weird.

I love Remake and Rebirth, and I honestly love the majority of changes - my only gripe is Temple of the Ancients being WAY too long. But that said, yeah you right

It baffles me how so many people can make excuses for the constant butchering of the main themes and story beats that made this game timeless. There was definitely room for rewriting scenes and fixing plot holes/convulsions with the original story but the constant undermining of so many impactful/emotional moments is a disgrace. The one that pisses me off the most so far is changing the tense spine chlling trail of blood scene in the Shrina Tower part to purple slime goop and they are no doubt going to butcher my favorite part, the Weapon attack on Junon/Highwind escape scene. I really didn't like the Dyne scene either. I literally felt nothing in many of these scenes. Nomura and Nojima should have never been in the drivers seat for this remake. They don't know how to write and the themes they constantly push don't belong anywhere near this IP. I believe this move will hurt Square in the long run. FF7 is my favorite game/story/characters of all time. I'm 35 now and it breaks my heart that this mess may be the only version of a remake i will get in my life time. I did enjoy many parts of this game(s), but the negatives definitely cast a big shadow on this for me. Hopefully Square goes under and someone who actually knows what they're doing buys this IP and fixes this mess (just joking but also kind of not joking lol).

Yeah, I get it. I didn't like how overpopulated the game is. Way too many NPC's, way too much dialogue and noise cluttering up the incredible stages. I really hope a PC mod could potentially remove 50% of the static NPC's from the game because the world is just way too populated. The set pieces and the way things are ratcheted up though? I'm not going to nitpick too much about. I kind of love it. This is actually part of the draw for me. This type of over-the-top production is par for the course nowadays in Creative Studio 1. Advent Children changed the game entirely for them. What Final Fantasy VII was/is to you, the player, is a wholly unique concept that exists in your mind. It is not the objective, total reality of what the game really is. Tetsuya Nomura has commented on this before Remake was released. With the Remake project, it's not about just doing things the same way again to try and repeat yesteryear. In fact, it's almost about the exact opposite. It's about a new creative process that imparts a NEW experience to the player while celebrating the yesteryear in a faithful way. Your bit about Corel Prison is interesting, because for me Corel was far less "foreboding" than you were going on about. I really, really enjoyed Corel Prison in Rebirth. The characters, Gus, the way you can crawl down into a little underground fight club for some combat missions, the way Gus openly threatens you while smiling with his nasty gold teeth. It was super memorable and interesting for me. This is proof of the reality that 'FFVII' and what that means exists inside the minds of the players on a person to person basis. Your specific interpretations about what is being put forth to the player is completely different from my own. This is why they could have and never would have made the 1:1 remake that "purists" so often clamored for. This game is a companion, it's not a replacement. It's not supposed to give you the same emotions as the original. It's supposed to give you NEW ones.

Great video, it put into words my exact feeling about how the original's tone was butchered in many areas. I have no nostalgia for the OG, as I played Remake first, then the OG and Crisis Core, and finally Rebirth. But even without nostalgia glasses I deeply connected with the OG and especially loved its quiet, contemplative moments and introspection of the characters. Gus in Corel Prison was a slap to the face of any serious tone that the original once had. And making a crass comment at the girls that just felt unneeded, as it was coming from such a goofy character it felt like a weird 'joke' instead of the serious threat that it is. I also bemoan the lack of blood or dumbing down of various scenes that were just so much more impactful in the original. (Spoilers ahead) -For example, the lack of blood in Remake when Seph slaughters the Shinra building -Or not even showing the sword go through Aerith's body! It doesnt even need to be bloody, maybe just some blood seeping into her dress. Show it! Make us cry! -Cid was an asshole in the original who had a major character arc of learning to respect his female coworker. Is that gone? I'm sure there will be aspect of in in the third game but he feels way too cheery in this one and not the drunk misogynist he was in OG. I want character development! -I also feel the lack of Cloud doing any kind of physical violence against Aerith at the temple scene took away the shock of that moment. We don't need to have him wailing away at her, as I understand that could be seen as way too much. But some kind of slap? A single punch or shove to get her down and take the materia? Something more dramatic and real? It makes it even more tragic when he's unable to apologize to her about it before she dies. I did really like the other stuff surrounding that scene though. Cloud acting so unlike himself as Jenova's claws dig into his brain. -In that scene in the forgotten capitol when he's struggling not to take Aerith down with his sword, it just looks like he's struggling against the whispers pushing his body, not his own Jenova-controlled body. It took away from the moment so MUCH because in the original he was fighting against his own mind, not some stupid-looking fate ghosts. Because he knew, if that sword hit her, it was all his fault. Not ghosts. I'm so frustrated with this game not only because of the terrible unneeded multiverse shenanigans, but also because it gets so many things right that it hurts even more when it gets something so terribly wrong.

One thing I truly miss about the original ff7 is its almost eerie, mysterious atmosphere. Places like the Shinra Building and Nibelheim feel as though they belong in a survival horror game, with their unsettling vibe and moments of tension. There are strange, cryptic events that leave you questioning what’s really going on, adding a layer of intrigue that’s hard to replicate. It’s the kind of experience that keeps you on edge. OG FF7 did give me that happy and depressing vibe while the rem and reb doesnt have much of that anymore.

I'm happy in a way that I never played FFVII OG (I don't plan to) So I can enjoy this remake trilogy 100%

I can tell they poured so much love, time and energy into the game, but it didnt feel as meaningful as the original or remake

Ff7 og was my first game i ever played on a playstation. I was scared to even play remake. But when i eventually did and when i eventually platinumed rebirth as well, i fell in love with this franchise even more. I think everything the developers have done with the story and this retrilogy "sequel" is exactly the way it was intended. I dont think the devs feel they have any sort of shortcomings when it comes to the story they are trying to tell. That being said i understand where people feel deprived of what they "want" when it comes to a preexisting ip, but it is what it is and i appreciate that we can get something lile this in our lifetime - what these devs are doing is incredible and im here for whatever they have in store - remember you can always go back and play the old ones and tell yourself the retrilogy doesnt exist 😅

I've never heard ANYONE mention that in the first FF7 Remake game.... 95% of the indoor areas across ALL of the Midgar Slums have been removed. It was a massive let down to me.

NO ONE IS TALKING ABOUT THIS!! AAHAHHHHHHH

Same problem of movies, series, musics... Need to create a pre made script. Producers dont search for a good story, not even when they bring a old one. They are always trying to bring what they think nom fans want. To sell then. Not to the real fans.

I really hope they go darker in the final game, you know, the imminent threat to the planet with meteor visible in the sky, the weapons showing up etc. And I hope they don’t start the first chapter off with snowboarding 😂😭

I disagree with so much of this. The developers not only completely nailed the feel of how the original felt and in many ways wanted it to feel but couldn't due to hardware restrictions. The remake series isn't just a fantastic remake, but an amazing sequel to the original.

It would be easier to forgive the glamour if they didn't shamelessly skip over the Nibehlheim Mansion with a quick boss fight

You know what's crazy? Romancing SaGa 2 revenge of the seven came out several months after rebirth.... And yet ROTS is by far one of if not THE best JRPG remake ever made. ROTS does everything the FF7R trilogy fails to do and does it so much better. Not to mention the remake of RS2 was faithful to the original story while adding new story content that fills in the missing gaps all the while not ruining the pacing. As much as I enjoyed persona 3 reload ROTS is definitely the better remake between P3R and FF7R... But P3R is still a better remake than FF7R lol

what they did to Corel and Seto scenes... is kinda unforgivable... i love Rebirth... but taking away the besr emotions scenes from the original by straight up interrupting the most important character building scenes... like when that Gi interrupts Red13 while he is accepting his Father... like come on, give us 2 more minutes of feels before taking it away... i was actually mad at those scenes.

Game was trash. Gonna skip the last one and just RUclips the ending when it drops

I agree 100% with your take. A lot of the mood-setting in Rebirth was....questionable. Corel prison was definitely suppose to feel...worse, and Nibelheim was suppose to be a very mysterious and jarring place that leaves both Tifa and Cloud confused at what's going on. I don't think it does the critics service to label this game as 'woke' but it does trend in a direction where the writing this generation has been moving away from the inability to set a proper tone for discomfort of...alienating people. Gongaga does a better job because the player now knows who Zack is, compared to the past where the player had no idea what was going on, similar to Cloud, and the character reactions was believable right up to the plot reveal that pieces all the oddities together. The developers was then able to take a different direction in Gongaga that played up the anxiety between the players and take Cloud in a different direction that I did does service to the new subplot they wanted to play up. I really do hope the 3rd game takes the story in a dark direction next. Like really play up Cloud's mental state and crank it to 11. Then that would be a big payoff from the 2nd game where we saw it was a bit 'too happy'. The 3rd game is just all business that will have us recalling the good-times of the 2nd game. I wonder will Square-Enix have the stones to really get into darker side of our characters such as Cid, Vincent, Yuffie. They wussed out with Dyne. Big Dan Gaming had a similar critique that ended with the writers getting 95% of it right, then just failing at the last 5% that should have mattered the most!

Your criticism is one of the minorities, rebirth is a masterpiece, your opinion is complete garbage I hope square keeps up the great work

Also, let's not forget the return of people from remake. Some I can understand, but most didn't make any sense. The under city Midgar was supposed to be like a trap for most of the people living there. Almost like a prison, they couldn't afford to leave. Then, when you started seeing a lot of familiar face from remake, it felt off. Made the world seem smaller, too. I think it would've been better not to be able to see most of them until the third game when you return to Midgar. But to your point, they couldn't help themselves. A lot of fluff and dangling keys is mostly what rebirth is.

Not faithful? Missing the mood? The original FFVII is all tonal whiplash. They nailed this perfectly. Low lows sandwiched tightly between high highs. That's the whole game from beginning to end.

Because there's too many other games out, and the fact that it is not original and a remake. Remakes are begging to burn people out because there's only so much you can do with the same story.

Excellent video. You've articulated the nuances of storytelling and artistry so well. I liked Rebirth but didn't love it due to its tone and pacing issues. The core characters were done very well though.

Very well said. I recall having basically these exact complaints as I went through it. I just couldn't articulate them properly at the time, using mostly emotive language to describe it. But very much yes. Not a single emotional moment in the story is allowed to sit. Tension is never built. The player is not allowed to feel sad or worried or angry. Every major point in the story is undercut by something zany, absurd or high-octane. And what was with the Black Materia scene with Cloud and Sephiroth? The incredibly awkward "pick it up, Cloud" thing and the way the English voice actor performs... Such an odd stylistic choice for what really should be a pretty desperate scene. My friend and I rewatch it now and then just to laugh at how corny and 'implied sexual' it comes off as.

I haven't played either Remake or Rebirth (waiting for the trilogy to finish and come to PC), but even without being able to confirm your assessment this is a really good review and makes more sense than many of the critiques I've heard of the game. Great job.

Even with the original FF7, I felt the story went off the rails once you left Midgar. Now with the pacing, loss of atmosphere from the original, I'm just going to watch a playthrough of Rebirth instead of sinking another 200 hours as I like to get platinum trophies. Also, the amount of sidequests and minigames is absurb in my opinion. I'm a firm believer you can do more with less. I wouldn't mind a pocket edition of this game like they did with FF15. Nonetheless, it's an incredible feat in gaming. But I would be overwhelmed with the sheer scale and scope of FF7 Rebirth. Mind you, I'm saying this as someone who played and platinumed all the Legend of Heroes Trails series so far.

100th sub🎉

I’m gonna withhold judgment on that scene until after Part 3 (probably called Reclaim, or Returns). What I didn’t like at all was how they changed Dyne’s death. His original death was much more impactful to Barrett’s arc and narrative theme of the game as a whole.

For me, its not Corel that takes the cake, its Nibelheim. OG Nibelheim had me on the edge of my seat. It gave thoughts like this is creepy, this town should be ash, why are there all these people here? They LITERALLY explain the mystery in 2 minutes of being in the town---why not at least wait until the end of the chapter. Corel/Wall Market, no choice with a T rating. I WISH it had some of the grit, but they literally couldn't. Even the dudes following you around and attacking you in Corel, isn't as intimidating. There is no piece of media where the scene of Cloud in the honey bee inn could ever be duplicated. The issue is they probably NEEDED this game rated T to get as many sales as possible, but the OG fans, the dudes who would've spread the hype due to word of mouth are who they really needed to satisfy with this and the changes messed it up.

corel prison on rebirth is my biggest gripe on it. let me get this straight. are you telling me that the cast of main characters that has been fighting a big corporation with trained soldiers, fended off a legendary warrior, fended off world threatening monsters so on and so forth wouldnt be able to fend off against some rug tag of down town prison tugs that has comparatibly low budget motorcycles and just a couple of bats? i can turn a blind eye for cath sith and aerith, but red? tifa? yuffie? all of them capable of handling themselves or at the least escape to hide. but on top of all that, a top of the line SOLDIER dragged sleep by a normal person with a single strike using a normal bat? all of them without resistance at all???? yap, sure.... and all of that for what? a chummy chummy "kidnap" situation? which the cast just 'walked in' inside without even trying to do anything at all.. sure....... its so ridiculous that in my head its all a big joke by the whole team to play around with cloud and make him do all of the chores while they watch with popcorn in hand

I've seen these points raised in other videos, but not as focally as you've done here. However, I think holding up the specific decisions of the remake to those of the original do this argument a disservice, the original is a goofy game. Corel prison is a goofy place in the original. It doesn't feel dangerous, it feels like a Saturday morning cartoon depiction of danger. The way I would frame the argument is that the narrative of Rebirth is discordant with the environmental and atmospheric storytelling within its own game. Corel Prison looks like yet another undercity, underfoot of Shinra, a place people can't climb the ladder out of. But most of your time isn't spent engaging with this as you haven't been condemned there, now you're an outside investigator being exploited to win a Chocobo race. To the original's credit, the Chocobo race after Dyne was a fitting moment, that ultimately Barret's personal tragedy is completely ignored and even though the party established Barret's innocence, they still needed to barter in commercial entertainment value in order to rightfully be freed. In Rebirth, the chocobo race has no such contrast or framing, never mind that of the original. If they replaced it with some other message or narrative, it would be fine, but instead its presence feels entirely mechanical, just to introduce chocobo racing and because it was there in the original. It's there because it's fun, not because it serves an important narrative role. I think Rebirth prioritizes fun too much. Sometimes the mood of the story or the environment shouldn't be fun. If there's any comparison to be made in the original, it's not with its specific choices but that it understood how to balance its various moods and emotional beats. Rebirth is obsessed with squeezing as much fun out of every moment and place, and that's what undermines it in my opinion.

She died in the end, and the future refused to change -chrono trigger

Couldn't agree more. I didn't hate the game, but I've never went back for a second play through either. I also feel alot of the music remixes aren't great either. Some are don't get me wrong, but more often than not they kinda shit the bed. The weapon theme. However the wall market theme from remake, whoever came up with that needs shot

I couldn't agree more with you. I know most aren't gonna like my take on the game, but I couldn't finish rebirth, all the dark tones and grit were gone, and added cringey dialog from npc's i care nothing about. I feel the game doesn't understand the original story tones. So i put it down, I may complete it later but i honestly didn't enjoy this title, and a side note I don't believe it should be a multi part game, it felt so disconnected to me, I lost interest in this project, I don't care about part 3.

The game is trash.

"The time in between my clapping is Ma. If you just have non-stop action with no breathing space at all, it's just busyness, But if you take a moment, then the tension building in the film can grow into a wider dimension. If you just have constant tension at 80 degrees all the time you just get numb." - Hayao Miyazaki

The aerith death was the biggest flaws. A half dozen Goodbyes it stole the finality of the moment by keep having her pop up

Rebirth conflicts me. You can tell which moments were done by DEI loving idiots and which parts where done by corporate idiots and which part were done by the actual creatives. From nerfing Tifa and Aerith's body types. Aerith's hips were WAY wider in the original game, along with being one of the girls that made the world go round according to Queen if you know what I mean. They straight up RUINED Cid! No Rocket Town, no interesting story, no Shera... Just... Nothing. Side lined, even made into a piloting dolt for no reason other than they could. Vincent should have been playable there was no way they couldn't have made that work. Plus some things that really don't add much or anything at all. Spoilers from here I guess. The Gi created the Black Materia... Okay, Their story didn't add much to the game at all. No screaming planet, the Seto scene was weak, Dyne was no longer an interesting character, Sephiroth is in here too often-and I HATE his voice! I like Tyler Hoechlin but MAN does he not work in the role! Same with Caleb Pierce as Zack, just not their characters. And the ending....... I have no idea what's going on. But then... The stuff that's good is pretty good indeed. Cloud struggling to keep a grip on reality, Barret is still an awesome character despite some parts of his side stories being butchered, Cait Sith somehow is the show stealer, good gameplay and the majority of the musical score is INCREDIBLE! I do look forward to a proper remake of the original game one day, but this... alternate timeline is just whack. I think the more fitting name for this series is "Final Fantasy XIII: The Good Version."

L take, fucking loved gus. The juxtaposition between the grime and those on top is a major theme of the setting.