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I am very impressed and flattered by your devotion to single foot footwork, Paul. The advantage of some of these two-foot steps is you can keep your balance better even after wine. And good for you for putting it to those cocky hockey jocks!

I am sorry to have made it look so easy, Elizabeth, after decades of practice. Your description is spot on. But mastering the timing and syncopation is not child's play for the uninitiated and also not so easy to put into words. So much so that I thought I already exhausted the topic, but if some new insight occurs to me to break it down further, perhaps there will be an advanced viticulture lesson in the future. Anyways, all the best in your trying to figure this one out, and thanks for including me on the WFS page.

Hi John, There are no rules as far as which foot crosses over which. Usually it would be your left in front. Just put it down on the ice from the back spin position. But sometimes it is done the other way around as you suggest in your question.

@ that’s good to know because I cross one way much easier than the other. I will try this out today.

Thank you for your compliments, and welcome to the channel! I just recently learned of the tragedy that has befallen Roman, and do wish him all the best with his new challenges in life.

Thanks, Gary, it's done👌​@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkater

Be tenacious, John. I made it look easy because of my hundreds of hours of figures practice.

@ indeed you did. The smaller continuous 8 is much harder. I can only get one and a half times around it. But it did help me with the regular paragraph 8.

Thanks for the kudos, Paul. The best is yet to come!

Thank you very much for expressing your appreciation for this video, Elizabeth, and yes, it is of course fine to link to it on the WFS site. All the best with your progress!

I start the spin on a BI edge on one foot, and then change to a FO edge on that foot for the crossfoot spin. The other foot is on a BO edge, Frootloopy Elizabeth. Weight is evenly distributed on both feet.

@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkaterwow that is super cool, thank you for introducing me to this spin. I will now do my research, including watching your other CrossFoot video(s), and assess whether it is something I can productively work on at this point in my training; and if so, how to go about it.

Great, Stargazer, we need all the bracket conservationists we can get.

Be persistent. Review other Axel videos, and practice all the drills I recommend.

Your description is spot on, Ice Star. Practice the pivot by itself first and try to be able to do it in a lower and lower position. Then you can start trying to do it from the drag, entering at first with hardly any speed at all.

@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkater Perfect Gary, Iv always loved your skating skills. Skating in Australia now . Liza and I are doing well. Please say Hello to Royoko for us. Your mate down under. Ross

darn, Paul. I just got back from the UK last night. I plan to be in Tokyo now for a while.

...but I plan to be back in August.

Let's meet up, in August, you will find my skate style interesting I am sure,

I have no idea how to get in direct contact with you, I've tried several times on your web site to no avail, I'd like to meet you, you are an interesting guy, I'd like to skate with you and hopefully learn from you, I say this a little tongue in cheek as I do not take well to tuition, I'd like to pay for your time and expenses. To be honest Garry, I would just like to skate with you, hang out, have a bit of ice time with the best skater I've ever seen, for me it would be like a singer singing with Elvis.

Come over to our place, we have an ensuite spare room, I cook the best vegan food you might ever find, ask Sophie, have a few days enjoying Scotland, walk the beaches, grab a ferry to Arran, It is beutifull, watch the seals.

All of these types of challenges help to build sure-footedness and repertoire.

I've studied you, you very often make a mistake and smother it in style and skill to the point it looks like you intended to be where you was when the mistake happened, you surely can't deny that.

That would be interesting to see, Paul.

Yes, of course, Fred, you can transfer your weight in any lateral direction or up, or a combination thereof when you are in contact with the Earth, but when airborne, there is no transfer of weight of the body as a whole, even though you can change body shape with inviolable compliance to the laws of nature that Isaac Newton so perspicaciously described. Petkovich and Cousins indeed had beautiful and memorable single Axels. No need for high speed rotation for a huge wow factor!

@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkater but if you take center of mass as position of wt, that changes with body position. So in a way you can transfer your wieght even with no contact with earth. The reaction force of course is all within the bodies stresses and where they change within the musculature.

I finally realized the problem. From the earth's reference frame one sees the skater's(let's just follow his center of mass) trajectory as a simple arc launch to land. Ballistics 101. Now let's put the reference frame on the skater. So the reference frame is moving w.r.t. to earth. Since the skater necessarily has his center of mass over one leg at launch and necessarily has it over the the other leg at land, he has changed his posture around his center of mass without disturbing its trajectory. So the referred to transfer of weight is only a thing w.r.t. the skaters reference frame, the weight goes from over one leg to over the other. All forces exerted and absorbed are contained in the skaters musculature, totally independent of the earth which feels only the launch and the land. I think we can put it to rest now unless you see something else interesting. Thank you for the mind excursion. Skating can be so interesting.

You're welcome, Elizabeth, and thank you for adding this interesting comment! I am assuming you are referring to Newton's 3rd instead of 1st, which is the law of inertia, and yes, the twisting of the head can enhance this effect, but relatively minimally. Even though it is heavy, its mass is proximal to the axis of rotation, and of course, you rightly question whether it is worth it to seek this minor advantage while upsetting the orientation that we get from our eyeballs. But wait! The function could be a creative form! Moving the focus 180 degrees rapidly could have a dramatic effect! I don't see the head and shoulders as having any significant role to play in generating or maintaining speed in locomotion. The power pull mechanisms are always necessary: mostly bending and straightening of leg joints, and to a lesser degree, twisting the shoulders against hips, as in the Maltese Cross, or leaning in the direction of motion. Standing on one foot and doing a leg scissor action so that the blade oscillates forward and back would be limited only by stamina.

Great. So did I, but I did not make a point of using it every day.

I will take that as a huge compliment coming from frootloop Elizabeth.

You make the 3turn Mohawk look a lot easier than it actually is. Time for me to practice my WFS back twin 3's some more (or maybe start learning them for the first time).

If you are into cerebral, you will probably like this next posting as well, Jen. Thanks for acknowledging an important concept that will be the subject of a future video: Sport is a type of leisure, not a military exercise that is a matter of life or death the way many tyrannical coaches treat it.

@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkater ...once we acknowledge that, then all of us become "recreational" in our pursuit of our chosen sport (or art), there is no dichotomy between "serious" vs "recreational." I became a professional ballet dancer because I wanted to dance every day. It is so wonderful to see you enjoying and PLAYING with your body and skates and ice and physics in your videos, and it inspires me to play more as well.

Yes, indeed, CanFreeSkate, Ilia does bend the free leg. As I mentioned in my video analysis, this can help with extra upward momentum as that knee extends, but I do not recommend it for learning Axel, since it adds complexity and so can overwhelm learners if the timing is not accurate. Your "h" analysis I concur in as far as the hip orientation. The problem of making the "h" on as a more 2-D shape on a plane with no turn-out is what I often see, and is far from ideal. Also, such recommended bend is often excessive. Regarding "weight shift", changing from one foot to the other on the ground is an example of weight shift, but the weight shift that skaters refer to in jumps happens in the air. Such weight shift is impossible, at least for the centre of mass, which travels through space on a parabolic trajectory like all projectiles. You can modify the shape of your body around that centre of mass--which is always a point--so that the blade is tracing a back outside edge relative to the centre of mass, like in a proper back spin. Then you will land on that back outside edge. I am not sure what you could mean by 3-D model. Further, slippery ice cannot be compared to the hopscotch tarmac. We want to jump straight up without trying to push ourselves forward on take-offs. Our speed across the ice continues, but it is a mistake to try to add speed on a jump take-off and shift weight at that crucial moment. Thank you for taking the time to make this comment. This is the sort of feedback that I encourage, since I am not trying to win any arguments or give the final word, but rather seek better insights into optimum technique and how to achieve it.

@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkater Thank you for clarifying, Gary. About the last point (shifting weight or not): If we accept that a hopscotch jump - which lands on the other foot than the take-off foot - involves a weight shift, then, say, a waltz jump would also; and so would an Axel, Toeloop, Salchow or Lutz jump. I agree with you that the shift does not take place after the jumper leaves the ice; it has to be initiated at the take-off. The jumper uses the take-off blade's edge or its toepicks to counter the ice's slipperiness, similar to a hopscotch jumper (or high jumper) using the friction between the tarmac and his/her take-off foot/shoe. Again, thank you very much for your videos, analyses and comments. :)

Oshawa, Ontario, Canada, Ross

The sport is indeed evolving, but the ideal technique is immutable, even if inscrutable. Physics and biomechanics does not change. It is only our understanding of it that changes. I would say that our understanding of ideal technique has actually deteriorated since figures were dropped. This deficiency of understanding has been more than offset however by off-ice jump harness spinners, which have trained skaters physically and psychologically to spin in tighter positions at higher speeds. Ilia's body has taken it so far, but his harsh, wobbly landings do not frankly bode well for the longevity of his career. So many of these quad jumpers are sidelined with short careers, hip operations, back problems, and burn-out. His first quad Axel was a fitting metaphor: he can't do a proper bracket, but he can land the first quad Axel! However, to be fair, the jump itself is exemplary. It has been a monumental feat, especially considering its consistency. Bravo, Ilia!

@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkater I totally agree with you. Using or taking advantage of the law of physics is different from abusing the human body. I think most ppl who know about this sport are very concerned that Ilia is going to hold up well. It is not the fault of athletes and coaches who are using the training method to try to be competitive and go to the top. Because the organization started pushing it a while ago. The athletes and coaches had to choose to follow otherwise they were left out. I have this feeling that there is just so much excellent talent involved in this sport that ppl who are making decisions about rules are not competent enough to handle.

Thank you for sharing that, Jen. It is this sort of appreciation that helps me keep going and doing what I do.

Thanks for sending, Dave. This is undeniably an "h" position, but not as extreme as many coaches teach. It is closer to what I would refer to as a relaxed free leg. Also, at what point do you capture this still out of the video? If you watch Ilia Malinin's quad Axel, he starts with the free leg a little more bent than I would recommend, but then straightens it somewhat as it swings through and climbs. Perhaps the bend happens when he brings it back in to close the legs for rotation? Regardless, the knee bend does not increase the overall height of the limb, but rather decreases it.

@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkateri think the “h” position many people see from great axels even in yours is due to inertia . Since the free leg is swung and relaxed , it swings like a pendulum with a turn out headed in one direction , but since the upper body is passing into the rotation, the thigh and knee is going into it as well since it’s in front of you , which leaves the lower part of the leg from knee down to the boot to drag behind as it has weight and to kind of be left behind creating this bend in the knee , people may see this on TV or RUclips without looking at different camera angles or the nature in which the free leg moves which is that it swings at an obtuse angle at first but then as the torso passes through the angle becomes more acute. People may see this and have the misconception.

@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkaterI also believe that swinging it relaxed works better , since the boot itself has weight , swinging the leg as a whole with the boot being the outermost point of circle that it swings gives more upward momentum rather than just the knee

Ah, those "helicopter spins"! Ross Luxton was fascinated with these, and I tried to teach them to him with limited success. Not a bad idea for a video in the future. I prefer to live in the present with a view into the future, instead of delving on performances from the past, but the fact that you have expressed an interest in Song of Songs suggests that a video about the nature of the moves and how to execute them might be well-received. Thanks for the well-wishing and suggestions!

Thanks for your message and encouragement, Jimmy. All the best to you and your family!

My coach, Sheldon Galbraith, did advocate the turned-in position you describe, even if he did not use the same simile! Getting rid of the turn out does allow a tighter air position. The wider free leg swing without bending the knee so much does require significant adductor strength to close the legs in the air, so your point is well taken. The very same principles apply to inline technique, except that we can't use as deep edges without slipping, right? Thanks for this comment. You make a good general point that we have to tailor our technique sometimes to our strengths and weaknesses.

@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkaterThe depth of an edge you can get kind’ve depends on the hardness and profile of your wheels combined with the surface in my opinion. The only thing that’s really not possible is a skid takeoff, though I do usually rock up to my toe stop as I leave the ground. A pure edge takeoff is possible and i’m working toward it but it’s pretty finicky and easy to turn into a waxel 😅

I already covered this in the Q and A with Ryoko, but I could go into more detail in the future, Ian. It will not be the next video, because I already have a backlog, but I will add it to the list for future shootings. Thanks for the suggestion.

@GaryBeacom-FigureSkater well you don't stop what you are doing! I love how you challenge things that do not make sense! What video did you go over the uper body I might have missed that one I have really long arms and legs but I am not fat.

Will do, Celka, and thanks for bringing up Tuktamysheva's triple Axel. It is a marvellous jump.

That shoulder in front does confirm the technique I describe in this video. Some skaters enter into the jump with the arm more in front possibly with the theory that arm cranking can help initiate rotation. However, since the Axel is a one-footed take-off, this is a misguided strategy. More important about Tuktamysheva's fabulous triple Axel is that she is exhibit A for my number 1 Axel fundamental that I describe in a previous video. She steps right on a deep forward outside edge for the take-off, which entails the holding back of the rotation and the left shoulder in front. She hardly swings the arms at all on the take-off, which for me would not give as good a jump, but it does exemplify the principle of reducing unnecessary motion. And she does support my theory of taking off with the arms in a wide position rather than tucked in close to the body. Also, she uses the free leg perfectly in my opinion.

Excellent point, Jen. There is incompetence everywhere. It is part of our challenge as athletes or parents to discern incompetence.

No need to apologise, Paul. This is a free speech channel. Not sure why we did it this way. Probably because I goofed and shot in portrait rather than landscape orientation.

I feel as frustrated as poor Sisyphus trying to make sense of your comment. Please clarify for my pea brain.

@@GaryBeacom-FigureSkater I'm sure there's no sense to my comment that you're missing. I wanted to time stamp that moment in your video because of the visceral sincerity with which you asked "why...?" Your candor was in regards to skating, but it's delightfully universal. Had I known that a skater I've long admired and respected would actually read and respond to that, I would have made much better use of both our brains. No peas involved. Thanks for the videos and the insight!

Thanks very much for this, CanFreeSkate!!!!!!!!!! This is the sort of thing I should consider doing in the initial comments accompanying the video.