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@@mushy_GLX it can cope at many hoc

@@lawnassociation thanks, I have already bought barenbrugs shady one which has 40% dwarf rye and rest 3x 20% fescue mix. Now not sure to oversee now or leave it for the next season since its getting colder here. On Wednesday we have 12° 😤

@@mushy_GLX it’s a seed mix where you may have to get used to over seeding with. The rye will die and if you can get dry enough the fescue will strangle the rye out quickly. Then thatch will be the headache. These seed mixes require a lot of time , energy, feed and seed ( and mowing) to keep in check. The soil temps are possibly still warm enough as we speak. Soils will still hold warmth

@@lawnassociation thanks, so what are you suggesting? To get a bent seed? I only have 50sqm on the back, which never dries out btw soil is always moist unless we have 2 weeks sunny dry days but again thats when I chip in and water everything. I can get 1kg bent seed for 25 quid. 20 creeping and 80 brown top. Not sure if they are shade tolerant? As I gathered not all bents are shade tolerant.

@@lawnassociation btw I don't mind lawn mowing. I can do it literally every day if the weather is good. Only takes 10-15 min. I also have scarifier and verticutter so no issues there. My front which is a fescue lawn never been scarified nor overseed and it looks great. I had a dip in the middle of the lawn and to level I used 2x backers of 70/30 mix, never put the seed down. It was about food diameter and in wto months it has filled itself, simply amazing. That's why I wanted something similar on the back. Keep spending where front is self sufficient.

@@lloydhallowellelectrics8760 all work well but give slightly different results. Common works well on most lawns but creeping will give you an amazing finish. Check out @ben_tillet on Instagram

Thanks for the information. How about a mixture of common bent and creeping bent? A wise idea? Or just go with the one or the other? I recently purchased the bent of your website but I noticed it doesn't contain any creeping? Unless one of the bents in the mix is a creeping bent? Also I can't find the Ben tillet guy on instagram with the link you sent? Unless it's the Ben Tillet with the horse riding picture?

@@lloydhallowellelectrics8760 it depends on the lawn type or finish really. Creeping is for that cylinder finish, golf green type surface and the others can do that but also work at 25 mm etc

@@blaiseducdaumont1280 I know. Bentgrass works on short lawns or golf greens in certain areas but yes it’s removed for varying reasons. In the UK it’s the most natural and dominant plant and does all the work for you. Unlike rye which has you working for it( every year)

I think as well in the UK we don't use the term Kentucky Bluegrass but rather Meadow Grass. At least it clarifies it for people in the UK.

Poa pratenis if it gets enough sunlight. Much better sod, but it does take longer to establish.

there is no such thing as heavy wear grass. Seed companies want you to believe that of course, as it sells to people whose lawn wears out...when they have kids for eg. What happens when grasses wear out is the growing medium becomes inhospitable to growing grass, so if you have a wear issue you need to correct that more often and allow the easiest grass species to thrive. In the UK, its bent fescue as when it grows together it creates a protection to the soils as well as gives you increased tillering over those thinning areas. But correct what's happening, dont rely on clever marketing....

of course. We dont have the time to care for ours in the way some want but the whole point is that this is the starting template to get that. We are considering offering that link for someone else to do that next level. We just dont have the time

@@lawnassociation i have a question, when you refer to the poa seed head as having millions of little seeds, ive seen poa seed head have tiny little balls dropping from them is that seed? i thought it was pollen.... to me a poa seed head looks like it has maybe 10 seeds on it.

@@SuperChalkster He said by scarifying you spread millions, so the whole lawn with all of its seedheads. Not sure about the exact number but the point is not just 1 seedhead.

as it grows sideways it can cope far better but all grass will go yellow to some degree. Difference is this will continue to spread and thicken whilst ryes will thin and die. The one third rule is a spoken rule that no-one can and does adhere too. Even when i managed a world championship golf course, never did we ever consider the supposed rule. You mow in most lawns because rye just grows too fast. You mow bent fescue to create density for free. Its a talked about rule but its, well....daft

Because seed manufacturers don't have a re-sell. Once its been sown, you should never need to seed again. With rye, you can guarantee it will die....and there's the merry go round that people get on...cha-ching

​@@lawnassociation Does it make it similar to Clover then? Although, I know it's a different plant.

@@bitTorrenter yes and no. Clover wont give you much going on below the ground in terms of roots and does depend of full clover or as part of a lawn

We had to get them especially made up to sell here on LA website, but didn't want at the time. People make yearly sales from ryegrass and that's why they don't sell bent/fescue

There are only grasses called 'hard wearing' but as they add no benefit to the 'rhizosphere' and fail so regularly, its the growing medium that has the damage done to it. Wimbledon fails after two weeks play and is grown straight after. Lawns all across the UK fail but there is an acceptance to this failure as being somewhat successful. It costs a lot to maintain ryegrass in so many ways.... Bent fescue is as hard wearing as any grass when healthy and would improve every new build as it will improve the soils dramatically

They are seemingly only available on our website. We tried to get companies to sell (as they once did) but were not interested, so we had to sell ourselves....

@@lawnassociation I dont see where to buy the seed on your site though? Just fertilizer and Bundles

@@photoeducationbydaniel lawnassociationstore.co.uk/collections/grass-seed That should take you there...

Success of germination depends on competition so starting again is always better. However, as rye always thins and disappears it can be transitioned by normal practices although it can take longer

@@lawnassociation Thanks for the advice. It's very much appreciated. I've ordered pure bent seed and as I have a dog I'm not sure killing off the lawn is the best idea. I'm hoping if it scarify and over seed a few times it will eventually take over

I don't have a scarifier or verticutter yet and was wondering if I can only buy one, which would be best if I want to start overseeing with bent grass and hopefully see it thrive and take over the lawn? Thanks in advance

@@andrewb12000 essentially Andrew, they are the same thing. They are both verticall cutters. Some machine suppliers claim this and that but from a turf experts perspective who was around when they were invented, the only difference between them is the width of blade used and depth taken . And they’re adaptable in both machines. So any thing machine manufacturers say take with a pinch of salt. It depends on budget but most things bladed scarifiers can be used lightly to verti cut

It does depend on how dense you get it. In general, it’s a tricky seed to get good take and density on. AMG is an opportunist and when we open the sward we allow it to take hold,

All lawns in the UK pre mid 90’s are bent fescue, as is the whole country. All lawns will be brown if too dry or unmanaged. We don’t have the countryside covered in disease as the benefits of bent fescue is the improvement in the rhizosphere which in turn helps fight disease. And you only see diseases due to poor management or turf being maintained where it doesn’t like it. It has the one of the deepest root systems too. Have you ever grown bent fescue successfully or at all?

@@lawnassociation no i run a lawn care company in northeastern US. I have one client of mine you has patches of bent in her yard. Nobody else has it in their yard. Most have bluegrass and fescue. Im just intrigued why its so common over there and not over here.

@@evangoshert5817 it’s our most native grass and grows very naturally and easily here. Where a grass grows easily and tells you that ( in that it covers the whole country) you have to adapt to that. We are able to manage that species along with bent very easily especially when you get the soils digesting the thatch too. Where we started to use ryegrass in the UK, it’s a species that fails and requires yearly over seeding. Bent fescue should never need seed ever…. Our most common is common bent 😛and isn’t as vigorous as say creeping bent. What do you have??

@@lawnassociation my yard is a mix of bluegrass and tttf. I have the gci blue heat and ryzomatous (butchered the spelling) tall fescue. Not sure how well the tall fescue spreads but i know the bluegrass can fill in a small dog pee spot in about 2 months. I still overseed yarly with the rtf just because i like to do it but dont put much seed down when i do.

People will tell you anything these days. Sadly never heard of them being a problem and once the rain stops they’ll disappear for free….

@@lawnassociation I wouldn’t mind them myself but it’s my dog I’m worried about she always tries to eat them, That was my only concern really. This year has been particularly bad for slugs on my lawn.

We did that on late September video and of course, no old ryegrass has come through due to the density. But better suggestion would be to remove the ryegrass first. It will come through where there are gaps, etc and will drive you mad with...'i wish i had....'

@@lawnassociation Thanks for the advice.

I get your point but as an educational platform and someone who is too busy, and the fact that what we teach is to show enough for people to have the platform to do that next step. Plus I dont want or have the time for manicured lawns to what you may be thinking. Everybody's perfect lawn is different. We may look to help someone on their own lawn who wants to get the foundation, then take it further but it wont ever happen at LA HQ Im afraid...

Fair enough understand completely. Would just make your image much more respectable if you stop referring to other RUclipsrs and saying what they do is unnecessary. Really like what you’re trying to teach and hope it becomes more popular. Good luck with it all 👍🏻

Very tricky to see, but what was on here was bent, just 'purpling' a little. We would suggest lightly scarifying but better to see pictures to be 110% as both poa and rye and fescue can also be red and purpling.

@@lawnassociation I did some more research and I guess I have Lots of Poa trivialis in my lawn! I did a complete kill off of the big spots, and hand-harvested what was doable. we Will see How this go by mid summer, if it is not okay, I Will Redo my complete 2yr old lawn… 😩🙄

It very much depends on what you want from a lawn, how you hope to maintain it, what you want to mow with and much more. Together, they make a good blend as has been the most popular seed blend for decades. That said, all bent can be beautiful too. But other species will still encroach, albeit very slowly. The fescue also can help stabilise better in some cases

For a standard lawn, the 80:20 is best. If you plan to cylinder you could choose the 60:40 but both are suitable

It was a test really to see how quickly we could germinate it. The la n are as always going to be reconstructed and will be later so it had no maintenance on the lawn once it germinated. Was good success considering but since it was done, all it’s had is a couple of mows

Thanks David, good to know. Still new to all this and was unsure how the competition between grasses would play out, didn’t want to be chucking time and money away

Just out of interest, if you had decided to maintain the lawn, what steps would you have taken? Is there anything that you would strongly recommend?

@@funkdoc2001 rye hangs around in small ways like that annoying friend, but eventually goes, so with a transition, sometimes it takes a few goes but key is to stress the existing rye as much as possible, keep feeds away until after seed germination and water small amounts, but regularly when the sun comes out

@@funkdoc2001 maintain the rye fescue bent transition?

its not a case of not liking rye (here in the UK) but we talk facts about how they grow. Agrostis grows over most of the UK and isn't manged by anyone as the soils manage them (along with sheep, cattle, horses etc) so if people find bents difficult to manage, its normally down to their lack of understanding of soil biology. They're not difficult at all....

As lawn care has to become more sustainable ( and it already is heading there) we need species that are used to thriving in Europe especially. Watering lawns for seed or otherwise means that a failed lawn species will be very unsustainable and unsuitable. It relies on failure for it to be successful. Herbicides and fungicides too. And the carbon footprint goes a long way back down the line if that makes sense?

@@lawnassociation most of herbicide and fungicide are banned for home users anyway? And there are creeping ryegrass showing up on the market which supposed to spread with rhizomes like Barenbrug rpr. I like the idea of bent but bent grass do not stripe as well as rye.

@@mietekwojciechowski6067 creeping ryes have been around for many years and they’re not great. Bents can colour it depends on the colourant tbh

we were hoping to try to speak to a building company and advise them with simple drainage solutions, better turf or seed and a lawn that will be simple to maintain. To a degree, we've designed a lawn spec for garden designers who also are involved in new build designs. Most of the time with not enough knowledge on lawns....

Probably not. Plenty more light vertical cutting at alternating angles...

I’d suggest using common as in our mix as browntop and highland are more for golf greens. I’d add the 60% or 80% fescue as well

@@lawnassociation thank you i will give it a try.

Absolutely. It’s the same species that grows all over the United Kingdom and many parts thrive with bent fescue. It’s also the species that will improve your soil structure

I’m about to rip out the rest of my dying rye grass lawn in same soil conditions as yours and plant bent/fescue mix

Do you sell the bent /fescue seed?

@@tinheadtinhead6505 we do. Strangely no-one else does but once you've got coverage, you'll never need to seed again.

I have looked at your shop and cannot find seed. Am I looking in the right place? I have just done a rye overseed but can I also overseed with your mix?

There's plenty more on the course too...

It helps block all weeds but won’t get rid of it if there already

Yes of course. It was around many years ago and is as popular as… if it was good, it would be popular. It isn’t….🤷🏻‍♂️

@@lawnassociation thanks for the feedback, I've just ordered some of your bent/fescue mix, so will sow that once the temps are more consistent